Zach - this video /drill is amazing. It should be part of every instructor's required teaching points. Not one of my instructors ever went over these simple mechanics. Pain and frustration could have been avoided !!!! Thank you !
That is a great question. Anytime you first shallow the club, especially if it is not your normal move, the tendency will be for the club to hit the ground behind the ball. There are some pieces that are important after the club shallows like more body rotation, and more trail side bend. Part of why I want this to be done very slowly at first. Keep trying you might be one swing away from putting it all together.
Thank you! I'm going to try this as soon as possible along with other videos from you. I'm definitely "upper" body dominant, and once I can put these steps together, I feel ill move the ball further and more accurately!
@@ZachAllenGolf video evidence of club path coming from under the plane versus above it which is my usual swing. But I do notice my hands moving away from my body and ending at impact higher and much farther away from me then at address. Common causes for that?
This is the first time I have seen it explained like this. Most who teach this will not admit this feels weird and almost the opposite of what you are trying to do. Thanks for explaining that it should feel awkward, and it will take time to unlearn the natural "chopping motion" us beginners feel. I will try this out tomorrow morning.
Zach, I recently watched your 3 part Magic Move series. I went to the driving range and practiced the move. Then I took it to an uncrowded golf course where I was able to play solo and hit Mullis until I started to groove the swing. It felt unlike any swing I'd ever made before, and I've been playing golf for 20 years. I truly believe this move will enable me to improve from a mid-handicapper to a low handicapper. I really can't thank you enough for your inspired teaching. Happily, I'm now one of your new subscribers. Gratefully, R.L. Wolf
As a decent golfer around a 5-6 handicap who struggles a bit with consistency, I know I have a tendency to come over the top. Can't wait to go have a range session, taking a few swings on the back porch that feeling of my right elbow coming forward a little bit helped me feel like I was getting the club in a better position. Thank you!
In my opinion this is the magic move in the golf swing. You did a great job of explaining the mechanics and then demonstrating. Not enough out there about this.
To me that short clip of Hogan says it all and the key is the right elbow leading in the downswing. Or at least the “feeling” of leading with the right elbow keeps the club square through impact then everything turns over. That entire angle of the left arm/right arm is one unit being pulled through by the hips in the downswing at a 45* angle and the club head will naturally square up through impact. I try to feel as if I’m swinging to right field in the downswing. People look amazed when I tell them that but that’s just what works for me. I enjoy your knowledge of the game. Great work.
I totally agree, I have already been working on keeping the club behind an imaginary vertical line on down swing until the club head is parallel with ground , then rotate through....shot 84 on Killeen Killarney , minus my 14 hcap, This drill definitely works!
Thank you Zach. Extremely helpful. Seems like my divots are either non-existent or much shallower with this swing thought. More solid hits but also alot of thin iron shots. Hopefully I just need to practice it more.
A few years ago you had a video where you had a tennis ball skewered on the shaft, at the balance point. Your teaching point was that the center of mass follows the hands. I’ve been looking for that video to watch again as it relates to this video.
Very good video. I hit the ball absolutely straight with irons, I never slice, I cannot slice. This would suggest that I must be getting the club to shallow correctly without thinking about it or knowing how, I just swing up and down. I need this move for driver but I find it very difficult to conciously apply a specific arm or wrist move at a particular point in the full swing.
I actually practice a similar swing " feeling " of dropping my driver behind me during my driver tee shots and it has helped me reduce my big slices.....however , whenever I try to gain some extra distance and swing my driver a bit faster, my slice comes right back...any suggestions?....thanks
So the tumbling of the shaft comes right after this. Shallow then tumble. And the cool thing is one enhances the other. For those reading that don’t know what tumble is, it’s the opposite movement of shallow.
Zach, similar feeling is to imagine at impact hitting the ball 90 degrees (perpendicular) to the target line. Of course, hands and wrists must be loose. Golf club will automatically snap into place because it's physically impossible to hit perpendicular but it feels that way.
Never thought of it that way but I see how that feel could work. It’s definitely hard to trust the correct feeling of the downswing it doesn’t feel natural at first.
Better than good! Jack Nicklaus and Peter Thomson mention the gravity move in the downswing. Does this tie in with your shallowing form? Elite ball strikers have the nerve to wait a fraction before they go with the build of centrifugal force and swing to the fences. Your excellent tuition should be mandatory for the majority of slicers and worse
Thanks for the kind words. I do believe it would help with that gravity reference. Anything that puts you in a simpler top of backswing position, should always help the downswing.
Hello Zach, I am a Ballstriking Blueprint member and have really enjoyed your instruction. However I am having difficulties marrying the concept of shallowing the club and coming under and around the ball (as you detail in your Simple Swing videos) while keeping weight foward on the front foot/heel and pivoting with the hips through the shot. I find that concentrating on the former two gives the tendency to keep my weight back and I hit behind the ball. Can you give me any pointers on marrying those concepts? Thank you!
This is a really great feel. My problem is, when I'm over the ball and shallow the club, I'm not getting my club face square. So I'm hitting it HARD right. I know I need to square up the face but it's tough.
Yes and what people really have to understand feel versus real. The feeling is alienated and if you were to video you doing it it will not look anything like you feel it
Do you have an aiming point for the butt of your club? I do. It's the bottom of the ball. Of course it doesn't go there, but I try to point the butt at the ball on the way down and let it release not push it. I try to keep the butt ahead of the clubhead well past impact. I've never tried slowing the hands but I've heard of it, Martin Hall on the golf channel says the hands should do that.
There is a fine line between shallowing and delaying the release, and allowing the club head to tumble and extend out to the ball. Sounds like you have a great way to feel this.
Doing this move whilst hitting balls is mentally hard. Best advice I can say is really be loose. Relax your grip and arms as much as possible. Just trust you'll find the ball at the bottom because it feels like it will never happen. My ball striking has never been better. I've no idea how, as it feels ridiculous...
The problem with this is it opens the face. The momentum of the move presents the heel of the lead hand to the target. How do you reverse this move in an instant to end up presenting the back of the lead hand to the target at impact?
Great great question. But you are exactly right the heel is presented, and the club can open more. But when done correctly the initial shallowing movement actually leads to the club speeding up and squaring up effortlessly. However there is a small learning curve to actually doing right, especially if someone has never experienced it. One of the coolest feelings I’ve experienced in golf once the club shallows, it effectively springs the shaft, and squares the face, without me doing anything.
This move seems to split coaches. Some teach it, others don't like it saying it's too much movement and prefer to see the hands falling vertically to get it to shallow. I learnt it by holding two clubs together, taking it to the top and letting the weight of them fall behind me as per this video. Going back to one club felt much easier to do. Certainly works better with longer clubs as they're the ones that are more affected by a steep swing.
@@pigslefats your face will open when learning this move but after hitting it a few times, your brain will instinctively start to shut that face. It helps to make sure your face is square or slightly closed during your take away
@@pigslefatsSo many of the great ball strikers did drop their hands straight down from the top, the hands and the butt end of the grip actually move out towards the ball or just inside the ball. Hogan, Snead, Knudsen, Scheffler and many more. And the club shallows because the right elbow is progressively moving so it gets in front of the right hip.
Great video! The only thing I disagree with is how does anyone discuss the “greatest ballstrikers” ever without mentioning Tiger Woods. Sure, he probably tinkered with his swing a bit more than necessary and screwed up what was arguably the greatest golfing physique of all time by bulking up with weight training, but watch a pro tracer video of him on the driving range. Absolutely pures everything and controls shot shape and trajectory at will. Watch a slow motion video of his swing, the tracer ones that track the club head path on the backswing/downswing and then follow the ball after impact. His club head comes right back down on the same line in the downswing, which is insane!
It feels me like an underhand side arm throw.i played a lot of baseball,pitcher and infield. One of the many really good things you teach is getting pressure to the trail foot too many just spin.
Will work for all clubs, even occurs slightly on partial wedge shots, but inside of about 30 yards not really much to speak of because it produces too much power.
When I do it I have to feel that the club is literally parallel with the ground and almost like the head of the club is lower than the handle in the transition and then when I video it it looks nothing like that
You are doing things that substitutes for visualization of the swing plane. Your downswing is not the repeat of the upswing, why? The maximum transfer of energy to the golf ball takes place exactly where the setup stance determined.
The thing is, you’re either connected in the swing or you’re not, simple as that. If you’re connected, the club will shallow naturally. If you physically try to drop your arms you can’t be connected; it’ll only cause confusion. It’s more of a feel than a move.
Might have to disagree slightly. The majority of the golfers out there are not able to do this, so it needs to be understood, broken down, and relearned to overcome there old pattern. But you are correct in that some are able to pick it up so naturally without ever being taught it. But it’s rare. Usually juniors, or people that played other racket or stick sports. Most that learn later in life do not intrinsically pick it up, just look at the majority of swing on the range your next time out. Probably 1 out of 10.
@@ZachAllenGolf I totally agree it’s rare but the problem with most is the separation created at the top of the swing, and not realizing there’s a difference. I believe staying connected, and understanding what it means, is the key to getting this. If you struggle staying connected, then do the no turn cast drill. It works wonders to one’s understanding. Yes, I was a hockey player, but I’m not sure it benefits me that much. lol Thanks
Yeah, but problem most find when the shallow part occurs, it opens club face up and end up shanking all over the place, so there’s a part you haven’t or won’t explain ? As in to square the face again. If forearms roll open at one stage, surely they need to re roll back to normal again.
This is a great point, think of throwing a ball, once the club or ball is transitioned, the forearms muscles are fully stretched, and that elastic stretch makes them want to snap back and square the face. Most golfers are trying to square the face without that stretch ever occurring.
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Zach, I’m a golf professional of 25 years and I want to take lessons from you. What an amazing teacher
Very honest and easy to listen to instruction. So beneficial to me. Thank you from Portugal.
Glad it was helpful!
Zach - this video /drill is amazing. It should be part of every instructor's required teaching points. Not one of my instructors ever went over these simple mechanics. Pain and frustration could have been avoided !!!! Thank you !
That is a great question. Anytime you first shallow the club, especially if it is not your normal move, the tendency will be for the club to hit the ground behind the ball. There are some pieces that are important after the club shallows like more body rotation, and more trail side bend. Part of why I want this to be done very slowly at first. Keep trying you might be one swing away from putting it all together.
Thank you! I'm going to try this as soon as possible along with other videos from you. I'm definitely "upper" body dominant, and once I can put these steps together, I feel ill move the ball further and more accurately!
Great drill. Instantly flattened my swing.
Great to hear!
@@ZachAllenGolf video evidence of club path coming from under the plane versus above it which is my usual swing. But I do notice my hands moving away from my body and ending at impact higher and much farther away from me then at address. Common causes for that?
This is the first time I have seen it explained like this. Most who teach this will not admit this feels weird and almost the opposite of what you are trying to do. Thanks for explaining that it should feel awkward, and it will take time to unlearn the natural "chopping motion" us beginners feel. I will try this out tomorrow morning.
Zach, I recently watched your 3 part Magic Move series. I went to the driving range and practiced the move. Then I took it to an uncrowded golf course where I was able to play solo and hit Mullis until I started to groove the swing. It felt unlike any swing I'd ever made before, and I've been playing golf for 20 years. I truly believe this move will enable me to improve from a mid-handicapper to a low handicapper. I really can't thank you enough for your inspired teaching. Happily, I'm now one of your new subscribers.
Gratefully,
R.L. Wolf
As a decent golfer around a 5-6 handicap who struggles a bit with consistency, I know I have a tendency to come over the top. Can't wait to go have a range session, taking a few swings on the back porch that feeling of my right elbow coming forward a little bit helped me feel like I was getting the club in a better position. Thank you!
Awesome, good luck
In my opinion this is the magic move in the golf swing. You did a great job of explaining the mechanics and then demonstrating. Not enough out there about this.
Thanks I think you are spot on. Sometimes just working here and it can fix so many other seemingly unrelated issues.
It has been a game/life changer Zack , thanks GB
You are very welcome.
To me that short clip of Hogan says it all and the key is the right elbow leading in the downswing. Or at least the “feeling” of leading with the right elbow keeps the club square through impact then everything turns over. That entire angle of the left arm/right arm is one unit being pulled through by the hips in the downswing at a 45* angle and the club head will naturally square up through impact. I try to feel as if I’m swinging to right field in the downswing. People look amazed when I tell them that but that’s just what works for me.
I enjoy your knowledge of the game. Great work.
That’s great to hear, reminds me of Ben Hogan demonstrating that position, and Moe Norman, called it “the feeling of greatness”
Great video I’m adding this to my drills
Fantastic!
Zack, i've been watching your videos for a while and just subscribed. I'm thinking Serio would fall into this group.
Welcome aboard! And yes
First time ever seeing this drill Zach nd something really good for someone whose been an over the topper.-Russ
Give it a shot, and let us know how it goes.
Another great program my friend. Be well.
Thank you kindly
I totally agree, I have already been working on keeping the club behind an imaginary vertical line on down swing until the club head is parallel with ground , then rotate through....shot 84 on Killeen Killarney , minus my 14 hcap,
This drill definitely works!
Nice that sounds like a great feel.
This move helped me a lot! Thank you Zach.
Fantastic. Thanks so much Zach!
My pleasure!
Excellent video. I agree with your top 3. Knudsen 4
Yep that’s a great one also
You hit the nail on the head Zach! Counterintuitive to move club backwards before heading to the ball.
Thanks my friend
Most tips for shallowing are so manipulative. Love this
Nice tip and drill. I've noticed Jordan Spieth does it all the time.👍
He does seem to rehearse this a lot.
Thank you Zach. Extremely helpful. Seems like my divots are either non-existent or much shallower with this swing thought. More solid hits but also alot of thin iron shots. Hopefully I just need to practice it more.
A few years ago you had a video where you had a tennis ball skewered on the shaft, at the balance point. Your teaching point was that the center of mass follows the hands. I’ve been looking for that video to watch again as it relates to this video.
Very good video. I hit the ball absolutely straight with irons, I never slice, I cannot slice. This would suggest that I must be getting the club to shallow correctly without thinking about it or knowing how, I just swing up and down. I need this move for driver but I find it very difficult to conciously apply a specific arm or wrist move at a particular point in the full swing.
At contact impact are you extending to 1o clock or not? Thanks
I actually practice a similar swing " feeling " of dropping my driver behind me during my driver tee shots and it has helped me reduce my big slices.....however , whenever I try to gain some extra distance and swing my driver a bit faster, my slice comes right back...any suggestions?....thanks
Hard to really say, but most likely that original fix was just a band aid for the slice.
Hi Zach, how does this relate to Manzella's 'tumble' or Malaska's 'tipping' which seems opposite of this?
So the tumbling of the shaft comes right after this. Shallow then tumble. And the cool thing is one enhances the other. For those reading that don’t know what tumble is, it’s the opposite movement of shallow.
@@ZachAllenGolf Thanks for the helpful reply and hello from the Philippines!
Would it be okay to focus on where the butt of the club is aiming on the down swing? Could that help? Much appreciated. Love your vids
Confused! In previous lessons you said the trial arm straighten as you turn?
Zach, similar feeling is to imagine at impact hitting the ball 90 degrees (perpendicular) to the target line. Of course, hands and wrists must be loose. Golf club will automatically snap into place because it's physically impossible to hit perpendicular but it feels that way.
Never thought of it that way but I see how that feel could work. It’s definitely hard to trust the correct feeling of the downswing it doesn’t feel natural at first.
Better than good! Jack Nicklaus and Peter Thomson mention the gravity move in the downswing. Does this tie in with your shallowing form? Elite ball strikers have the nerve to wait a fraction before they go with the build of centrifugal force and swing to the fences. Your excellent tuition should be mandatory for the majority of slicers and worse
Thanks for the kind words. I do believe it would help with that gravity reference. Anything that puts you in a simpler top of backswing position, should always help the downswing.
Hello Zach, I am a Ballstriking Blueprint member and have really enjoyed your instruction. However I am having difficulties marrying the concept of shallowing the club and coming under and around the ball (as you detail in your Simple Swing videos) while keeping weight foward on the front foot/heel and pivoting with the hips through the shot. I find that concentrating on the former two gives the tendency to keep my weight back and I hit behind the ball. Can you give me any pointers on marrying those concepts? Thank you!
"You know how many times I've had a student come in with the club path too shallow? ....Never."
Great advice. Great teacher.
Great video…thank you
For sure
This is a really great feel. My problem is, when I'm over the ball and shallow the club, I'm not getting my club face square. So I'm hitting it HARD right. I know I need to square up the face but it's tough.
thx for the lesson
Yes and what people really have to understand feel versus real. The feeling is alienated and if you were to video you doing it it will not look anything like you feel it
Great point sir
Great reminder. Thanks
My pleasure!
Do you have an aiming point for the butt of your club? I do. It's the bottom of the ball. Of course it doesn't go there, but I try to point the butt at the ball on the way down and let it release not push it. I try to keep the butt ahead of the clubhead well past impact. I've never tried slowing the hands but I've heard of it, Martin Hall on the golf channel says the hands should do that.
There is a fine line between shallowing and delaying the release, and allowing the club head to tumble and extend out to the ball. Sounds like you have a great way to feel this.
Great communicator
Thank you sir
A light bulb just went on. I would aways wonder how to get the trail arm in the tucker position in front of the rear hip. Excellent presentation!
Doing this move whilst hitting balls is mentally hard. Best advice I can say is really be loose. Relax your grip and arms as much as possible.
Just trust you'll find the ball at the bottom because it feels like it will never happen.
My ball striking has never been better. I've no idea how, as it feels ridiculous...
That is awesome totally love it, wish everyone could read this, so so true.
The problem with this is it opens the face. The momentum of the move presents the heel of the lead hand to the target. How do you reverse this move in an instant to end up presenting the back of the lead hand to the target at impact?
Great great question. But you are exactly right the heel is presented, and the club can open more. But when done correctly the initial shallowing movement actually leads to the club speeding up and squaring up effortlessly. However there is a small learning curve to actually doing right, especially if someone has never experienced it. One of the coolest feelings I’ve experienced in golf once the club shallows, it effectively springs the shaft, and squares the face, without me doing anything.
@@ZachAllenGolf Thanks for your reply. Are you saying that done correctly the shaft loads and springs back helping to square?
This move seems to split coaches. Some teach it, others don't like it saying it's too much movement and prefer to see the hands falling vertically to get it to shallow.
I learnt it by holding two clubs together, taking it to the top and letting the weight of them fall behind me as per this video. Going back to one club felt much easier to do.
Certainly works better with longer clubs as they're the ones that are more affected by a steep swing.
@@pigslefats your face will open when learning this move but after hitting it a few times, your brain will instinctively start to shut that face. It helps to make sure your face is square or slightly closed during your take away
@@pigslefatsSo many of the great ball strikers did drop their hands straight down from the top, the hands and the butt end of the grip actually move out towards the ball or just inside the ball. Hogan, Snead, Knudsen, Scheffler and many more. And the club shallows because the right elbow is progressively moving so it gets in front of the right hip.
Am I missing this in the Consistency Code?
I don’t believe this was discussed in depth for the Consistency Code.
Great video! The only thing I disagree with is how does anyone discuss the “greatest ballstrikers” ever without mentioning Tiger Woods. Sure, he probably tinkered with his swing a bit more than necessary and screwed up what was arguably the greatest golfing physique of all time by bulking up with weight training, but watch a pro tracer video of him on the driving range. Absolutely pures everything and controls shot shape and trajectory at will. Watch a slow motion video of his swing, the tracer ones that track the club head path on the backswing/downswing and then follow the ball after impact. His club head comes right back down on the same line in the downswing, which is insane!
Very true, his swing is absolutely amazing. Technically and aesthetically. Over such a long period of time.
Tigers swung with his hands he never did this move.😮
That's good stuff
It feels me like an underhand side arm throw.i played a lot of baseball,pitcher and infield. One of the many really good things you teach is getting pressure to the trail foot too many just spin.
just Irons? or Driver ? Hybrids?
Will work for all clubs, even occurs slightly on partial wedge shots, but inside of about 30 yards not really much to speak of because it produces too much power.
I just discovered that I need to feel a lot of this and my content completely changed!
When I do it I have to feel that the club is literally parallel with the ground and almost like the head of the club is lower than the handle in the transition and then when I video it it looks nothing like that
Man is that not what so much of golf is like🤣 this game can be tough to learn because it feels so exaggerated.
When I do this the face
Is always open at impact. Ideas?
So after the initial shallowing movement occurs, 2 things will help to square the face, body rotation, and also lead forearm supination.
@@ZachAllenGolf got it. Thanks for the response
Good stuff
Thanks glad it helps
IMO this is THE most challenging aspect of the swing to learn and I'm still in kindergarten. It is tough!
Like hiting like a hammer
I like that analogy but imagine the nail was in front of your chest of and pointing at the target. Might be even more golf like.
This works like nothing better in my 40 year experience.
You’re right Zach! These moves are counterintuitive because we seem to be moving away from the ball.
This is also a simple drill to shank
You are doing things that substitutes for visualization of the swing plane. Your downswing is not the repeat of the upswing, why? The maximum transfer of energy to the golf ball takes place exactly where the setup stance determined.
this would seem like a lot of perfectly timed forearm rotation …. Brings in more likelihood of push slice / smother pulls???
Club shallows when you have a correct backswing position and you weight shift correctly, all these hand/arm manipulation is ridiculous
The thing is, you’re either connected in the swing or you’re not, simple as that. If you’re connected, the club will shallow naturally. If you physically try to drop your arms you can’t be connected; it’ll only cause confusion. It’s more of a feel than a move.
So Tiger, Jack, JT and a host of other pros are doing it wrong?
@@MrBrokentowels not sure what you mean by this, wrong about what?
Might have to disagree slightly. The majority of the golfers out there are not able to do this, so it needs to be understood, broken down, and relearned to overcome there old pattern. But you are correct in that some are able to pick it up so naturally without ever being taught it. But it’s rare. Usually juniors, or people that played other racket or stick sports. Most that learn later in life do not intrinsically pick it up, just look at the majority of swing on the range your next time out. Probably 1 out of 10.
@@ZachAllenGolf I totally agree it’s rare but the problem with most is the separation created at the top of the swing, and not realizing there’s a difference. I believe staying connected, and understanding what it means, is the key to getting this. If you struggle staying connected, then do the no turn cast drill. It works wonders to one’s understanding. Yes, I was a hockey player, but I’m not sure it benefits me that much. lol
Thanks
you look soooooo tired
Try slow motion in stead of talking us under the table. Al Gaiberger did no talking when showing how to swing. That video was very informative.
Ok I’ll start not talking in my videos from now on.
Yeah, but problem most find when the shallow part occurs, it opens club face up and end up shanking all over the place, so there’s a part you haven’t or won’t explain ? As in to square the face again. If forearms roll open at one stage, surely they need to re roll back to normal again.
This is a great point, think of throwing a ball, once the club or ball is transitioned, the forearms muscles are fully stretched, and that elastic stretch makes them want to snap back and square the face. Most golfers are trying to square the face without that stretch ever occurring.
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