Was The Super Saiyan God Boost RETCONNED?
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- Опубликовано: 5 окт 2024
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super is brainrot
you can't make any sense out of it without some serious cope and headcanon
I’m surprised to see the Mario 64 optimizer here
EXCELLENT WORK. LAUGHINGSTOCK MEDIA,
Well said my friend.
@@KazeN64 true
While I agree the power scaling is obviously bad that doesn't take away from the fact that its still fun and entertaining to watch IMO. (Just turn off your brain when it comes to the power scaling) lmao
The simple answer is that nothing in Dragon Ball Super makes sense
and simple don't mean smart.
Super feels like it was done at the skin of their teeth, really rushed and with barely any planning for the future.
people just need to realize power cliffing is a thing in anime. Just cause it's stupid doesn't mean it's not the case.
GREAT 👌 LAUGHINGSTOCK MEDIA DRAGON BALL SUPER SAIYAN GOD'S BOOST RETCON,
The ultimate proof that Goku isn't God power in base is Future trunks, took everything he had just to beat Daabra who's only as strong as super perfect cell and that took him 10 years of training along with training with supreme Kai in order to do. Yep he's able to force Goku to go Super Saiyan 3 in both the anime and the manga, even Goku only mentions that he's stronger than Gohan was back then not saying wow you're as strong as me when I fought beerus. A lot of people will say oh Goku being forced to go Super Saiyan by people who shouldn't be God level is bad writing is only bad writing when you keep going under the assumption that he is God level because over 90% of those problems disappear when you make him weaker lol
@ChiChiLand299 yeah no the writing is just clearly bad because that same future trunks starts swapping blows with Rose Black right after saying that same Black in base for has been wupping his ass for about a year
@@firstdegreesports5120you can't just say the writing is that bad when simply realizing Goku and Vegeta aren't that strong solves over 90% of the so-called bad writing lol
Yeah there are some points where it gets crazy like the whole black saga itself doesn't make sense in the anime since black shouldn't exist to begin with but it's not that bad since most of it's fixed by that one little thing. This is why the manga fixed all those problems lol
Black is only that powerful to begin with because he was spamming the zenkai boost ability, and trunks still had to get a transformation to get that strong he doesn't just suddenly do it with nothing changed so the writing isn't that bad lol
It's called Goku and Vegeta just aren't that strong, not to say that they're not crazy strong they're just not that strong in base
And if you're talking about how trunks was able to stop blacks attack and kick him into a wall that's called he took him off guard. Establish that all the way back during Resurrection F that characters are not just automatically Superman all the time anymore, you have to keep your focus and guard up which is why Goku got nearly killed by a laser and got hurt by a gun are we going to say guns are now God level powerful? Trunks took black off guard causing him to break his concentration giving him a moment to kick him into the wall. He didn't actually become strong enough to fight him until he got his super duper rage boost which even the animators knew they had to give him for anything to make sense and not just have him magically fight black suddenly
@ChiChiLand299 Trunks literally blocked an attack that was meant for blue goku so if anything that's even more reason he shouldn't be able to attack it. The whole vegeta and goku isn't that argument is ridiculous considering we've seen both of their base forms take on opponents who are literally stronger than all of Z or were one of the peak characters in all of Z. Like trained up Skinny Buu and ss3 gotenks plus Final Form Freiza who in Super is miles above anything we saw in original Z. Yall just need stuff to make sense because yall need your headcanon to be right to make yourselves feel better lol.
Put a sheet of white paper in front of your flood light source, it defuses the light without dimming you, it's more flattering, and it won't over-expose your face or make you look like you're overly shiny and sweaty :3
On the one hand, I like making characters like Krillin and 17 relevant in fights. On the other hand, it would be so easy to just write any character asking Whis about how God ki works, and changing their training to make it work
Well this is some character development from "I may never release this" 3 hours ago.
Life's funny that way... speaking of funny, you wanna know how I got these scars?
@@LSMMIKEsolid reference lol
@@LSMMIKERegarding android seventeen 17 He was Weaker Then SS Blue Goku During the tournaments of power.. Because we see 17 and Ultimate Gohan Could not even damage Toppo.. However.. He was able to break his limits and Able to assist SS Blue Kaio Ken x20 and SS Blue Shinka Fight Jiren And even catch a gear and off guard and Damage him..
Another example of a character breaking their limits with android eighteen Fighting Ribnriane in Her Strongest Form. She had help , but she was still able to damage and Knock out Ribbraine.
Keep In Mind Ribbraine Was Fighting on par with SS Grade 4 Vegeta Earlier.
@@LSMMIKEI respectfully disagreed that the super saiyan god a multiplier changed.. Please keep in mind in the anime.That the transformation was never supposed to return in the anime to begin Which was a dumb move on their part.. But at least Had enough sense to return in TOP.
The problem is that the super saiyan god form was under utilized And super saiyan blue was over Utilized.
It would make much more sense for goku to test his opponents and just his Is super saiyan god state In the earlier sagas.. All this.
Talked about worrying to conserve Stanima When they could have simply utilized the SS god Form To conserve stainma.
The thing about the SS god Is that it's more powerful than super saiyan four and In the terms of an efficiency it is much more efficient than the normal super saiyan forms Because the transformation is just Base Goku with God Ki The super santa got a form is not even a super saiyan transformation.. It's just Goku In his base form converting his Ki to God Ki.
When Goku absorbed the ssjgod power he didn't get the strenght of the ssjgod while in base, and with the same multiplies of ssj, ssj2, etc. That's just ridicolous. I think it just means that Goku could access to a little bit of god ki even in his base form.
Personally I always interpreted it as a temporary boost. Almost like his body understands what it’s like to be at that level of strength but then he loses it after the Beerus fight.
It’s like if you’ve driven in a Lambo at 150 miles an hour for a few days then go back to your Toyota Camry. You lost the power but you understand what it’s like to be going that fast….if that makes any sense.
It is directly stated and shown that he did cope more.
@BDT27 yea, you get used to it, but now it's like a do over, only more natural, maybe that didn't make sense, but yours absolutely did
@@genxvictor1805 Yours did too✅
@@cincyzreen4050 you are the one coping cause you can't accept the fact that Buu stomps base Goku.
I have some issues but in reality, the reason Goku keeps getting surprised by weaker opponents, it's because he is dumb... Vegeta doesn't suffer from this issue, it's always Goku.
Also, he wanted Krillin to gain confidence on himself, that's why he went blue. No other reason, Goku was surprised that Krillin had improved to this level. But that's because he was holding back, and realized that he needed a little more.
Even if Goku is at SSJ Blue, he can still bring his "power level" down to Krillin's level and lower. That's all it is.
Na vegetas issue is being to dumb to not kill his opponent right away and want to let them achieve their perfect form. I'd say it's a full blooded saiyan flow tbh since trunks had zero issue with taking out cell
@@everettjohnson9374 lol... Idk, look at Gohan... It takes a lot for him to get anything done.
I mean yeah, I understand he wants to boost his friend's confidence but he could at least go to Super Sayian to do that because going to Blue is waaayyy too much.
I hate super but you have to understand that Goku has perfect control of his ki in that scene, imagine you being killing, imagine the boost you get when you see Goku going blue to confront you, even if it's fake and Goku isn't trying, as much as i hate super i think that scene was perfect @@Absol125
@@Absol125 yeah, but at this point super Saiyan is almost irrelevant... Also with super Saiyan, he can't really hold back that much. Super Saiyan is based on rage, which is why he can't combine it with kaio-ken. But blue, blue is full control of your godly Powers. That's what he can link it to Kaio-ken. And that's why he can fire a Kamehameha, that he can hold back on a whole lot more than with just super Saiyan. But that's just a theory, an anime theory.
10:23 Super saiyan god first returned in the manga in the universal 6 tournament. Goku used it against hit. Thats when they explained that using blue over and over weakened vegeta, and thats why goku was stronger in god that vegeta was in blue.
The god form in the goku black arc was the debut of vegeta using the god form. Not the return of god after blue was introduced
Damn, I miss Dragon Ball being good. BoG is so good... and then it got replaced with the shitty anime version and everything interesting was discarded.
-A divine form of ki completely foreign to mortals, nah, just normal ki, but a lot, compressed.
-A sacred form, only achievable by the unity of pure souls... oh wait, you can just use it at will, nevermind.
-A form with a unique advantage being a healing factor, nevermind, that got cut.
-Goku achieving the power to make the most powerful god seen to that point fight seriously. Wait, he keeps getting passively stronger every arc.
Sucks tbh
It’s still good, it still makes sense, you just have to pay attention
Some fans have a hard time just saying "my show f'ed up"
It's mostly people getting on the internet, getting into fights how their show is perfect, having to eat their own words.
They need to understand that, every show does something stupid, some more often than others, and you can still like it.
Remember Transformers G1? Oh man were the errors there FAR more galore than anything Super ever had, and it's still one of my favorite shows.
It obviously wasn't out right "retconned" but I think the writers literally just forgot about it when creating Cabba and the other fighters from U6. If you take that into consideration then the rest of Super's power scaling doesn't seem nearly as bad. (yes i know this is just head cannon cope but i still think this is just what actually happened and why supers scaling is so bad)
Trying to make super make sense could be a full time job
I always assumed (And still assume) the 'god boost' was just temporary, and that Goku could access it every now and again as Saiyan Beyond God. Just like how no one states Goku/Vegeta are fighting with their DBZ power levels after the ritual, no one says that anyone (Except Hit) could rival SSG Goku from the BoG arc.
There's so much evidence suggesting the god boost was retconned, like how Goku needs SSJ3 against Trunks who was shown to struggle against Dabura just a couple of years earlier, Goku punches Krillin in the face and yet he survives, base Goku's weaker than Frost who's comparable to Piccolo (Who was shown to be below a rusty SSJ Gohan).
It isn't just that 'it doesn't make sense so people think it's not the case', there's a huge plethora of evidence to suggest they aren't fighting with god powers half the time. When you look at Super through the lens of "Goku's base form was unaffected by the ritual, and going SSJ on top of Saiyan Beyond God makes SSB. Base < SSJ < SSJ2 < SSJ3 < SBG =< SSG < SSB", the scaling becomes surprisingly consistent to the point that's what I think the creators intended.
There's also statements after fighting Beerus like Goku saying they need the ritual to access the SSG power again
Why would they reaffirm the power boost in the next arc, and even have Base Goku fighting Beerus in a monaka costume almost taking the fight seriously It isn't retconned.
@@TakeshiInazumais this a filler ???
@@TakeshiInazuma because it's by far the largest power boost in db. Because there are feats and statements making it seem like they don't have ssg power in base. Because it's inconsistent as hell otherwise. Because it's super easy to miss if you're not paying attention during a few episodes Because goku looks the exact same. That's why.
Plus he was using sbg against him, not base
@@hunterkeps9058I wouldn’t say frost is comparable to piccolo, rather than his special beam cannon, amplifies his power level to the point, he can possibly one shot him, as shown when he put a chunk in the barrier, also base goku was warming up in ep33, and was trying to get frost into his final form by using super saiyan, and frost poisoned him, in base goku got up from frosts raid form, or third form like it was just a normal day. Also what do you mean by god boost?
@@Ttyumbra Well, I mean that Frost isn't like, 100x stronger than Piccolo since he even restrained Frost with his extended arm. He (Frost) is probably 5-10x stronger than Piccolo, meaning he's nowhere near SSG levels.
Plus Goku may have been warming up, but Frost still caused some damage to him, and that was before he entered his final form. I agree he used his SSJ form to motivate Frost into transforming, but he still had to use it otherwise Frost would've won.
And by God boost I meant the ritual boost, my bad
One of my favorite transformations! Thanks For this 🔥🔥🔥🔥
I prefer to use my own headcannon for powerscaling just makes it alot more enjoyable to watch the show
Lets go Mike! It's the consistency for me 😉
And dope content of corse 💯👌🏽
I hate that the Red form is called Super Saiyan God and that the Blue form is Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan.
The Red form should've been Saiyan God and the Blue form should've been Super Saiyan God. Because it sounds stupid when the Blue form explanation is "a Super Saiyan God that goes Super Saiyan". How can you go Super Saiyan as a "Super Saiyan" God?
It's just like how SS2 was labeled as an Ascended Saiyan and not an Ascended Super Saiyan, because Super Saiyan should be Ascended Saiyan.
But then how could they call it ssj red and blue? Super is dumb
@@fulltimeslackerii8229 I've read posts that just straight up call a lot of things named in Super as dumb, so it makes sense. :P
Yep, the power scaling is very bad in Super. It's one of the things that take away the fun of watching and reading it.
Everyone in the TOP should have gotten washed against the SSG and SSGSS forms. Especially the other saiyans.
Black should have been super easy to beat when they first encountered him. Even after turning rose.
If it were like that then the show would have been far less fun if Goku and Vegeta had no one to rival them in power. Part of what makes Dragon Ball fights so fun is that they heroes are pushed to improve.
I understand your sentiment though
Yes, hence why it's a cartoon.
I disagree with Goku Black. Or at the very most, narratively they could make it work easily.
If Goku Black is Zamasu in Goku’s body, he would have all of Goku’s power technically. Although similar to Ginyu, he wouldn’t be able to use it to its full potential
Super Saiyan Rose represented Zamasu fighting less like Goku and a little bit more like Zamasu, as he started getting creative with stuff like the scythe while in base form he was literally just copying Goku. Power level wise, Goku Black should absolutely equal Goku. They have the same body.
I never felt like completely absorbed the form, mainly just got a boost. If he had absorbed it into base then he'd never need to transform into SSG again, which he does repeatedly
He didn’t absorb the form itself it’s just his end of BoG SSJ self ( and later base) adapted to the level where they’re as strong as early BoG SSG Goku had been after SSG’s time limit was up in BoG.
I have a bit of a different view on this than you.
First off, did Goku absorb the power of SSG? Yes! He did. However, he did not absorb it all into his base form. This is never stated in the movie or anime. Heck, if you use the movie it was confirmed Goku pushed Beerus to 70% by Whis, and Toriyama confirmed SSG Goku was 60% of Beerus, meaning after absorbing god Goku's base was 60% of Beerus and his ssj form was only like 10% stronger than his base at max. This doesn't make sense.
Later in Super Beerus said it was obvious Goku could beat Zamasu since he fought him in the past. This means Beerus is implying the suppressed BoG Beerus>>Zamasu, and Goku went ssj2 against Zamasu. Trunks also thought it was amazing Goku could fight Beerus implying SSG Goku>Future Trunks.
If Goku's base really did reach SSG level after absorbing god, and could stack multipliers on top of that, why didn't he rechallenge Beerus right away? Goku was about to let Beerus blow up the Earth because he lost, yet Dende was right there at Bulma's party. If Goku thought he just became 50-400x stronger at the end of the fight he would have asked Beerus to stop and let him heal because he is much stronger. Goku did not do this because the power he used on Beerus is his MAX power. Goku held nothing back despite not going ssj2 or 3 and he could not have used more power if he was healed again.
SSG is just such a big power up Goku's base still made it passed the ssj3 Gotenks mark, but not that far beyond it considering he had trouble with the trio de danger in the ToP, and we saw how an amped Basil couldn't even beat Fat Buu.
So when you look at the story holistically I think it's clear buu saga ssj3 tier
Beerus said he completely fused with his power in BoG and in RoF he has the power in base to create SSB.
Buu really is the perfect measuring stick since he never improves. I love your comment btw, nice seeing people challenge the 'Base = SSG' view, but there's something I wanna add to it.
The Buu that Basil fails to defeat isn't even Fat Buu, it's a weaker segment known as Mr Buu. This would put Basil, and likely the other 2 danger Trio's around SSJ2 Goku's level from the Buu saga or a little higher.
And Goku struggles against Bergamo before he starts getting stronger from taking hits, so ToP Goku would be between his SSJ2-3 levels from the Buu saga
FAX + W comment 🗿
People have to remember that if Goku had God ki in base then most characters wouldn't be able to sense his power, since it would be divine.
This is because the whole "Goku is a number X, Beerus is a Number Y and Whis is a number Z" powerscaling statement was retconned. Goku very clearly absorbed that power and it became his new base due to how he could beat up final form freeza in resurrection of F. BASE Freeza during the movie was considered in another dimension of power compared to characters like even Gohan. Meaning that Base Resurrection of F Goku>> Final Form Freeza>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> base Freeza>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gohan even in his ultimate form. If Goku didn't get a permanent increase to his base, Resurrection of Freeza has a whole would have made no fucking sense.
I always took the Super Saiyan God boost as after he gets ssg, he can raise any forms' power to the level of ssg.
So in theory he could raise his base form through ssj3 to the power level of ssg if he wants to.
So why doesn't he do it??
@@lilian6613 I'd say he did do it in bog and resurrection f
After that he pretty much just uses blue
Edit: Also in the Broly movie Goku in ssj seemed to be doing just as well as Vegeta in god for a bit. So i feel he just increased his power in ssj close to god
@@dreydubs4256 It's wonky scaling but I think the novel said SSJ Goku did better against Broly than SSG Vegeta because he had a different, and better fighting style that he wasn't used to
The most complicated part of DBS power scaling is learning to accept its very simple.
It was retconned in the RoF movie. If base Goku was equal to his ssjg self, then Beerus and and Whis should be a finger flick with his ssj form
It was NOT retconned.
@@TakeshiInazumagreat counter argument. I’m really convinced
@@TakeshiInazuma If Goku base = Goku SSG
This means that Goku SSJ = Goku ssjb right????
@@fulltimeslackerii8229It wasn't retconned. Base goku was stronger than final form frieza. That same frieza in his first form defeated SSJ1 Gohan and piccolo. That movie solidified the idea.
@@Alienldrhe was training with Whis in between movies and Frieza only beat up on people who were already weaker than Goku from before the ritual.
It’s the same reason why character like Batman don’t get evaporated by just being near a battle of Superman when he is a universal or planetary plus power
I love that you told the truth in this video about the scaling!!🥰
It feels more like SsjG’s healing factor was retconned
It was anime only
ngl Mike I was really excited for the video forget the super editing just do what makes you feel best will always love your content regardless
Thanks. Great video
Beerus was holding back. Playing with him.
I get that Beerus using
@@Alienldrthat’s weird because in the anime,Beerus said that Vegeta (ssj2 rage) pushed him to use 10% of his power
I honestly don't see why people thing Super's power scaling is a problem. It's literally just building on what Z (and probably OG Dragonball, I'm rewatching cause I haven't seen in a while) did, just on a grander scale.
Raditz arrives, and the Z fighers learn of a power level once though not possible. The Z fighters proceed to surpass that level after training.
A Super Sayian was a myth, but then once Goku did it, Vegeta was able to do it and reach that level with training.
The power of Cell was thought to be unrivaled, until the Z fighters trained and were able to go toe to toe with Pikkon who one shot Cell. (I'm aware it's "filler," but as far as the anime is concerned, it happened)
Even GT had this, Pan was able to fight Rildo, a character beyond Majin Buu, and she wasn't even able to be become SSJ yet.
GT Goku constantly surpasses his previous max in his Base.
The whole idea of learning a power level is possible to achieve and then training to get there yourself has been a constant in the series.
honestly, i think the issue is mainly nostalgia... people are more forgiven of Z when it comes to powerscaling because thats what they, and myself grew up on. but because this is new, people see the flaws in it much more easier... me personally, i dont have much of an issue with it because i never really cared if the power scaling made sense, as long as the story is either good or entertaining enough to distract me from it
like even in Resurection F, I can forgive the laser bringing down Goku because of the lesson it was meant to teach Goku... even though technically it is a lesson he should have learned by then, but it has always been one of his biggest weaknesses... that being letting his gaurd down
@sourlesscream1272 I don't mind the ray gun. When vegeta asked krillin to blast him in the chest as frieza was transforming to his final form on namek, krillin said he wouldn't be able to hurt him, but vegeta says it will work when he let's his guard down and let it. So it was already an established thing in the series that a weaker attack can cause damage when their guard is down. And I'm ok with it being a better laser that can pierce defenses better. Just because Frieza called it common when taunting Goku, it doesn't mean it's as weak as one that would have been used in the pilaf saga.
You’re right, the problems are on a grander scale. That’s why it’s even worse than in DB and Z.
It has nothing to do with nostalgia. Super compounds on all the problems that DB and Z had and makes them worse. Boosts, consistency, laziness of it happening. As hard as it is to maintain verisimilitude with Z at its worst moments, it’s that much harder in Super because it’s incompetently handled.
I’m far from blinded by nostalgia by DB and Z. I’ve explained the flaws in it since before Super was a thing. Almost everything is much worse in Super.
Reread the DB manga then reread Super right after. Rewatch the DB and Z anime then rewatch Super. The flaws are so much more glaring it’s impossible to say they’re the same.
Bringing up GT, which also has power scaling problems, isn’t the best way to argue against those who talk about the flaws with Super. It’s a deflection that so many DBS fans use every single time Super criticism comes out. But if you want to include it, then remember, it came out literally one week after Z ended. Super had DECADES of time to learn from it.
Which leads into the biggest problem with all of it: Time.
The creators of Super had time to improve upon and fix all of these issues. Even if they were exactly the same level(which they’re not), Toei and Shueshia had DECADES to improve on these and fix the flaws of the prior series.
Yet they didn’t, they made them even worse. The series doesn’t deserve the defense so many fans give it.
I think there is such thing as "spectacle" feats in dragonball that has been something that happens through all of the story.
King piccolo can destroy the moon effortlessly but then casual blasts from ssj level characters can hit the earth and not obliterate it.
Ssj3 goku powers up against fat buu and the whole planet shakes, every other time, the planet is fine.
The ssjgod universal punches are the same, its purely for the moment and doesn't mean anything other than spectacle. Shouldn't scale everything based on something that doesn't matter or is just a one off thing.
it just feels like the boost lingered for that fight and loat it then relearnt the transformation without healing cus no ritual
They definitely had it in resurrection of F when they fought Final form Frieza in base, when ssj1 Gohan and Piccolo couldn't handle 1st form Frieza
@@Alienldr are you stupid their base form can get stronger
Why does no one ever bring up that sparring match between base goku and beerus when in the Monaka costume. Goku was getting beersus hyped up
Good point. There's many of them like this in the series. People often disregard it as "filler", but in the anime, there is none.
I think it's just because it's forgotten is the main reason
Because it's filler, and yes, there IS filler in the anime. Toriyama wrote the whole DBS story, Toei only adapted it and still had to fill time gaps as any anime has to. Toyotaro did the same, separately from the anime.
I disagree with your take on the manga, since it is a different continuity it was never stated that he absorbed that power and the manga did come after the BOG and super and Toriyama also supervised the manga
I never thought he still had full God power in base, I thought Beerus was implying that his body learned to keep up with the speed/power of the God's so he could still fight at that speed but did not have near as much power, let's say in God he had a 1 Billion power level, his base would still be at like 50mill or whatever but he learned to move at the speed of his 1 Billion power
Thing is unlike sage mode Naruto there’s no benefit in going god mode anymore
Since his god forms give him a new type of energy, it would be so much better for headcannon if we just considered the multipliers to apply separately to Goku's power. Such as, SSJ giving Goku's base ki a 50x boost, but not effecting his god ki. Just like how we might consider his SSJ Blue to multiply his God Ki and but not effect his base ki. This would explain how Goku can be either extremely powerful in base or extremely weak, depending on if he is using his God Ki or not, since we can presume his base god ki is massively stronger than his base ki.
And that's why Base Cabba is a menace and SSJ4 Gogeta fans need to be worried😅
The power scaling in DBZ is worse than it is and super, but people don't wanna acknowledge that
Can you elaborate?
Nah..
It’s not go ahead and try
@@thanksfortrumpcnnmsnbcandh8771Frieza can just fuck right off. Everything else seemed to be fine outside of that in Z. Lol
@@thanksfortrumpcnnmsnbcandh8771 essentially the entire frieza saga and part of the saiyan saga had scaling with very little rhyme or reason. Where peoples strength was solely determined by what the plot needed it to be. It's what yall think super is but ramped up to 12
Bottom line is that the boost is simply not in the manga. It existing in other continuities is not an argument. The fact that SSJG returned at all is already a contradiction to Toriyama's original intent.
One thing I will say, ss3 gotenks was beat by vegeta in the dbz anime and goku beat gohan...weird as hell that they'd throw that into dbz at that time but apparently if you go by a guide book they were just as strong as they were outside. So If super is pulling from the anime only then beating gotenks isn't anything to go off of in super
Dbz? I don't remember that. Do you remember at what point they beat them, in case I missed it?
@@Alienldr I think he's talking about the shades inside buu, which is a very dubious feat.
Copy Vegeta beating SS3 Gotenks in base is just direct support for the amped god base form.
i think the answer to this question is with how SSB works, which is turning SSJ on top of SSG. if goku was just a regular SSJ then he is not using god ki and if he is SSB then he is.
I'm very confident the writers wanted to make it very vague to create discussion and make SSG similar to ultimate/mystic gohan in that goku still has to access to the power by "transforming" but it doesnt change how he physically looks. which makes it difficult to tell when he is using god ki in "base" until he uses SSJ or SSB.
in BOG, when beerus said that goku "made the SSG power his own", it can easily be written off as goku simply got a slightly stronger base and now that his body got a taste of SSG, he can access god ki on his own without the ritual. this kind of thing happens in DB like with frieza and broly where they use a form they just got and aren't as strong as they should be because they didnt master the form though admittingly this is coping.
But i think the writers realized that not changing how goku looks confuses everyone, even themselves. so they retconned SSG into a form that changes goku's hair back to red to make it easier for the audience to tell when he is just using god ki just like the manga.
I always assumed that Goku just had a bit of power left over from his god transformation rather than him just permanently absorbing god's power into his base form..
You know, funny thing is I never did interpret that line that he "absorbed the power" to mean he was literally as strong as he was in SSG. I rather interpreted it to mean that he absorbed that potential, the potential to unlock god form on his own without needing the ritual. For this to work, it means Beerus, recognizing that Goku had just powered down, reduced his own fighting power to avoid just exploding Goku right then and there and ending his fun too soon. I think Goku got SOME level of boost from the god ki still floating around his body, but once he lost the transformation, he lost the lion's share of it in that moment. That said, I think he got all that potential back once he learned how to enter that form again.
As for the whole "he could break the universe" thing? My interpretation of that is he didn't gain the ability to blow away the entire universe so much as the two were fighting at JUST the right energy level to hit spacetime's resonance frequency. That explains why the waves grew STRONGER over distance rather than weaker. He and Beerus were causing a chain reaction, not actually blowing away the whole universe. It's like how you don't need to be strong enough to knock over every single domino, just strong enough to knock over that very first one, and the rest will fall on their own. Don't get me wrong, a full power Beerus certainly COULD blow away the whole universe, but that's how I interpret it. It also explains why a raging berserker like Broly who certainly wasn't trying to match his power perfectly to Gogeta's didn't end up destroying the universe. By that point, they were way beyond the power for that resonance frequency, and so the universe wasn't going to chain react itself to oblivion. They still blew a hole in reality and entered CG space though.
Super saiyan god had healing factor that also gave him zenkai boost. But after the BOG, we don't see these abilities ever again. So its safe to say it was retconned to be weaker so that other villains can beat him
It only just occurred to me after rewatching the buu saga that in super, during the copy vegeta filler, it is the 2nd time we see Vegeta beating ssj3 gotenks as he also did the same thing inside Buu's brain (though to be fair, we cant really scale an illusion).
Anyone who actually believed this boost/double stacking SSG was ever real was deluded into it by insane DB powerscalers. This never made ANY sense.
Why does Goku hate the power of the god ritual and not fusion? Both allowed him to reach a strength he never could have on his own (despite Vegeta literally catching up to god in 6 months of whis training)
God is a power others gave to him that isn't his own until he eventually makes it so. Fusion is taking all of his power, someone else's power, and merging them together into a new being. He also only uses Fusion as a last resort, so for all we know, he does feel roughly the same way about it.
Goku absorbed the Power LEVEL of SSG, not the form itself. For this reason he is able to transform into it for a SSG multiplier on top of his immense base form power while still being able to use regular SSJ forms
Pretty much the same results I got when I researched it. Any character that can even remotely challenge Base Goku post BoG just gets the standard SSJG base upscaling treatment. It definitely doesn't make much sense in universe for there to be so many characters that strong but that's just how it is.
Comment before watching : I believe almost all the power ups get nerfed after they debut not just in dragon ball but most shows. Like the cabba vs SSj 4 gogeta meme doesn’t account for the god forms being nerfed and challenged and easily defeated by plenty of non god ki owners Frieza for example or any of the BDS villains
I'm assuming the whole "absorbed SSG power" was for the sake of the "I won't let you destroy my world" scene in the movie. To which I say: Don't have him lose God form, and have him go SSJ in the same scene with a double aura of gold and fiery red. That shit would've been just as if not more hype. Then explain after the fight or in RoF that, because Goku couldn't properly control his God Ki, his attempt at going SSJ while in God form resulted in that double aura'd SSJ form rather than the proper merging of the two forms: Super Saiyan Blue.
Super saiyan God is just an average transformation now
I think at the end of the day it really just comes down to the writting. Neither Toriyama nor Toyotarou nor whoever writtes stuff a Toei ever cared much about coherent storytelling. They go with what seems cool or what the story calls for at any moment. It's pretty obvious the BoG movie was never written with the intention of being the start of a whole new series, even if it layed some groundwork. But it was successfull and they wanted more, hence RoF and eventually Super. And suddenly anyone who was supposed to be a threat had to be on that level. Same reason why Beerus seems to keep getting stronger indefinitely, he's a literal moving goalpost.
Saiyan Beyond God Is simply a title and state of being Because Base Goku at Thr end of His Fight With Beerus Surpassed His original level of power When he first became a super saiyan god.
Base cabba gets clapped by vegeta,unlocks ssj, gets clapped again, shows his new ssj to caulifa and gets immediately outclassed lmao
Then he loses in base to a fat girl who's signature move is rolling over opponents 🤣
This meme is dumb af
You know whats crazy about, base Cabba vs SSJ4 GT Gogeta
And holy shit, alot people to go with that Cabba is stronger than this Gogeta ☠ not even single evidence that they have. Plus GT has already demonstrated a monstrous inconsistent power ups and growth in GT too, I mean in the earlier shadow dragon arc, rage shenron tanked x10 kamehameha SSJ4 Goku and then knocked with the same kamehameha attack depleted Goku back to base state and worse rage Shenron was getting bigger and stronger too before rain plot convenient happened. And then we got tha Nova Shenron who said he is the currently strongest dragon amongst the group of shadow dragon before appearance of Syn, and thid was proven too in dialoges by Goku. And guess what, nova shenron has his transformation and this is his like initial state and he matched base Goku too! Means this base Goku has surpassed his previous SSJ4 state when he fought rage shenron. This SSJ4 transformation was literally a monstrous in baby saga when it made its appearance and no its not 4,000 or 500 times base nor 5 million times stronger, its way WAY more than that from what I got. Call that a power creep right there, and we all know GT is the lowest number in episodes (only 64) twice than even Super's (while it has like 130 or something like that)
Let's see I'll try some head canon
Alright so, let's say Goku and Vegeta can infuse themselves with any amount of god ki that they can up to their max. And then maybe what happens is god ki only transforms you into SSG when you use enough of it. Goku still had god ki left over when he went base in BoG, but not enough to go SSG.
But nowadays, Goku and Vegeta are so strong that they just go straight to SSG when they use god ki because using so little of it that they stay base feels like nothing to them
Why Toriyama said that goku can use the power of the SSG in base form?? He didn't just say God ki in base he said "Super Saiyan God" so according to Toriyama:
Goku Base = Goku SSG(this is not my opinion)
@@lilian6613 You say that the wording was "the POWER of a Super Saiyan God"? In that case we could maybe interpret the statement as not Super Saiyan God itself, just THE POWER of it (i.e god ki). Like how I can use a small fraction of a doctor's power by bandaging a scratch, even though I am not a full on doctor.
@@overclockshock Wait, how else can you interpret that? It says "SSG" not a part or anything, when goku ssjg went into ssj 1 he didn't feel any difference
@@lilian6613goku says a fusion can't handle beerus and goku also says he couldn't attain the level of strength ssg has even if he trained his whole life yet you gonna tell me krillin>bog ssg? also just from hair colour alone you can tell when goku is using god ki and when not.
either way everything is contradictory in super unfortunately, if you look at the broly movie they still use the red form which is much greater than the regular super saiyan forms.
Y'all btw please don't take this explanation as serious lol, I was just trying to have some fun. Like Mike said the real answer is Super's bad power scaling
The way I see it. Goku can still sense God ki even in his suppressed base form, but that's it about him absorbing God ki. It really doesn't make sense otherwise. You can still claim his base form is on the 20 digits if you want but that's it. Also Krillion is legimitately in the billions now too.
The whole purpose of Blue was Ki control so any fights with Blue MUST take that into account. The fights with Krillin, Gohan and 17 for all intents and purposes have to be taken with a grain of salt.
Furthermore, the BOG movie should be looked at like all the movies as far as it’s basically a what if story. Only difference is none of the earlier movies were written as a manga. BOG and everything after so far has been written.
According to manga, Trunks has a slight edge over Goku as ss2. So when u say it’s “heavily” implied he was as strong as ss3, that’s a reach. It’s actually more heavily implied that ss3 was more than enough. Again, in the manga, Goku briefly goes ss3 but he never fights him and no statements are made until Goku briefly goes Red to one shot Trunks. The statements in the manga are Beerus saying “ that slick Goku used Red for a moment” and Vegeta saying “ show off” basically.
Every statement from the manga during the future trunks arc, tells us god Ki has to be applied to be considered used.
My headcanon is this, Toyotaro realized the god Ki in base thing was bs so while doing the manga, he corrected it. And Toriyama lost zero sleep about it lol
Retconned!!
2nd best form
Frost is Freeza saga level? WTF? Didn’t they say Frost trained? That’s why he was so strong.
Super had a lot of cooks in the kitchen, a bunch of writers who probably all had their own power scales, and they didn't all line up. the result is something far less consistent then when it was just Toriyama and his editor.
Oddly enough DBS Goku's best feat in Base has to be him fighting Final Form Frieza but the insane thing about that is its also his best Feat in the Original DBZ Anime Frieza is clearly stronger in DBS and possibily holding back because he knew he had more power in dormant as Golden Frieza
I think they just forgot about it.
Its just bc Goku doesnt try until hes about to die.
Thank you super power scale makes no damn sense sorry it's just true mainly a cash grab for bandi and toei. Doesn't mean I don't like it I enjoy it for what it is I was happy to watch super with my son it was a special thing and a special time
Poll drops.
People:
IT'S NOT RETCONNED EVERYTHING MAKES PERFECT SENSE, SETHTHEPROGRAMMER SAID SO!
SethTheProgroomer
If a form gives your body strain you will get stronger from it, we saw it in the cell saga with goku and gohan mastering super saiyan while not training.
You could say this works with super saiyan god except he absorbed only the ki.
It is stupid that characters got stronger so fast, but i agree it has to be accepted.
I don’t think ssg’s multiplier got smaller, I just think other characters were given power just to have a chance against god/blue goku.
Off topic: 2:07 Why do so many fans say "anime and movie" when both are anime?
Also you can't scale the people from other universes their ki is totally different remember when Gohan was fighting the dog guys they couldn't feel their ki and then there's the universe that uses love as power so yeah
Okay sir what I think you're getting wrong is I don't think it's that krillin was able to outmatch Goku it's that Goku had estimated what krillin's top power was going to be output it and then was surprised when krillin was able to match it and push it back so yeah
Agreed SSG Boost was Always permanent and Canon. It was Never Retconned. People should not argue just because they're confused by the power scaling .If they don't know how to power scale then they should stay queit and not argue. If you're someone not capable of providing a valid argument and simply go by feelings then you should not argue.
Well, God was implied to be stronger than fusion at its strongest form. Then the power of God was absorbed into base (he turned ssj1 but he didn't feel weaker, so is his base now 50x weaker than God???) After that, it never felt like God is another fusion boost above saiyan beyond God. It just feels like the gap between 1 and 2, or between 2 and 3.
Lemme help you out. SSG after BOG is nolonger a transformation like say Super Sayian. SSG is just his max power in god ki within his base form. When they power up in a concentrated way, the hair will turn red, hence when they stack their super sayian ontop of it, it changes color again, its honestly the final evolution of the super sayian state, his biology can longer make him any stronger, hence whhy Ultra Instict and Ultra Ego are now going to be their main focus as they now need divine training since their own sayian biology had finally reached a ceiling.
Goku absorbed the power of the Super Saiyan God, just not into his strength. He absorbed it into his potential. Goku was at 60% of Beerus's power at the time, later on he stacked Kaio-ken x 10 on to his strongest form and was still weaker than Beerus. This is because although he has the power, he hasn't learned to drawn it all out.
It wasnt a boost, just access to God ki
Goku Black Arc Debunks Weaker Base Theory in The Manga.
SS1 Goku Black after Zenkai Defeated SS Blue Vegeta.
Vegeta Trained And Defeated the Same Zenkai Boosted Goku Black That was in Super Saiyan Rose.🤣🤣🤣
That sounds like it backs it up. Not debunk it. Since that was a lot of ground to cover up go from losing to ssj1 to beating rosé. Are you saying that level of vegeta was supposed to be the weaker base version, and since he chose to train, it must mean he didn't have a stronger base to use? Because if that was his stronger base, then it doesn't really prove anything.
@@Alienldr You're not really making much of an arguement Considering that Goku and Vegeta Feats Earlier in the manga.
It doesn't change the fact that Frieza it would be just as powerful in the manga therefore , Goku and Vegeta in Base Form would already have to be on a godly level... In the manga It was mentioned that Goku and Vegeta Jumped him.. I suppose gokku training under whiss who is Angel Is not obvious for you?
Thoughts on achieving SSG in GT?? There are 5 Saiyan's available..
It would be completely possible if the form existed in that continuity
There are times when Goku seems weaker than he should, but Vegeta tends not to have this problem.
Base Copy Vegeta no diffed SSJ3 Gotenks.
Now, it is possible the gold SSJ forms are only 50x, 100x and 400x his NON god ki but that's never stated.
Also, SSGSS Goku vs Krillen isn't an issue. Krillen mortally wounded Vegeta on Namek because Vegeta held back. Goku held back in base to test his power then went SSGSS to see if Krillen would be intimidated, he even says so.
Krillen did legit beat Gohan though, what a dummy.
It's a minor detail thus, it doesn't really matter!!!
I don't think super cares about scaling that made any sense.
Super's power scaling actually makes less sense than Dragonball Heroes...let that sink it. According to Super, Krillin would be able to defeat Z Vegito. You never seen shit like that in Heroes. 🤣
I love how you state that there's no evidence to state that Goku lost GP well then doing the same thing when it comes to the manga. It just wasn't mentioned because it was rushed and other things with no statement or proof that that's actually what happened lol
The problem with the "bad power scaling" argument, is that over 90% of the bad power scaling goes away once you except that Goku and Vegeta aren't as powerful as you think they are. So you can't just dismiss something that solves the majority of your problems lol.
The fact is it took Future trunks 10 years of training and training with supreme Kai and going Super Saiyan 2 in order just to beat dabra who is only super perfect cell level, and no he didn't get that much stronger because if he did there would have been no points in waking up Majin Buu. Plus the fact that supreme Kai was able to hold Daabra in place if he was like Majin Buu or freaking God level powerful he wouldn't be able to do that.
And trunks is not going to go from being just that strong to being god-level powerful in just a year of sparring with black, if he had that much potential he would have defeated the Androids without having to go back to the future. The writing is not that bad the power scaling is not that bad Goku and Vegeta are just not as strong as people think they are at every level and they did retcon and change it throughout the story.
And finally you cannot try to use real world answers to explain in universe answers. It's like the out of universe answer is that Toriyama didn't want Tien Yamcha Chiao to learn the kaioken or he didn't think of it, that's not the end universe answer the in-universe answer is that they either didn't try or they just couldn't do it.
Goku and Vegeta also don't have to be god-level powerful to do that to Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks the fact that that's one of the few filler stuff in super. Vegito probably could have done the same thing, when it comes to krillin that's the case for both bad writing but also for Goku not being God level powerful. The fact that he's able to actually Force Goku to go Super Saiyan, like you keep saying there's nothing that blatantly states that they're not god-level powerful in base but there's also nothing that's come out in the last 10 years reaffirming it but plenty of incidences that suggests they shouldn't be based on people who shouldn't be anywhere near that powerful. And of course what's even the point of them getting the god forms if they could all just get this strong just through normal training, as shown by krillin by your example lol
17th power is easy to explain it's because his infinite energy engine pumps out way more power than he's actually able to use, this is why cell gets stronger after absorbing him because he can use more of that energy. Am I simply making his cells stronger he can absorb way more of that power he's basically been turned into a freeza equivalent of a human through artificial means
Trunks kicked Goku black into a wall because he took him by surprise, play established early on in Dragon Ball super that you don't just become more durable as you get stronger you now have to keep your guard up. Drunk suddenly appearing broke blacks concentration and gave him a window to attack, same thing with Goku getting hurt by a bullet. Did bullet suddenly become god-level powerful it's like where do you draw the line? Lol
The level of inconsistent power scaling is why I cannot appreciate DBS
At least its not as bad as a retcon as the Potaras where... ah Super fucked up so much.
Another Great Video Mike this makes me realize the DBS power scaling is even crazier than I originally thought.
The editing is kinda what makes it a…video though
So I guess most of my recent videos I edited less than this aren't videos?
@@LSMMIKE they have less to look at 🤷♂️
You mean you want to stare at my face MORE? 😊
Goku and Vegeta needed to go SSJ to beat characters weaker than Majin Buu like Zamasu who lost to SSJ2 Goku and SSJ2 Trunks as well as Vegeta going SSJ to fight Ribrianne who lost to Android 18 to me the explanation was that Goku absorbing God Ki was temporarily thanks to the ritual. If Goku's base was equal to SSJ God theres no reason he would need to transform. Toriyama had a statement about God Goku being a 7 and Beerus being a 10 with his normal power ups he would have passed Beerus a long time ago.
If all those past characters got stronger offscreen to catch up to everyone else then none of that proves that they no longer have God ki in their base. Zamasu wasn't proven to be weaker than buu. Trunks just leapfrogged above everyone during a time of peace for some bs reason after he beat dabura to explain how he kept up with goku's stronger ssj forms. 18, krillin, master roshi, they all got "stronger through secret training." 17 wasn't the same power as he was in the android saga. He fought on par with blue goku because he fought poachers on his island. I hate those explanations, but nothing actually disproves that they lost the god power in base. Everyone else around them just got stronger. No one was actually compared to a character's power in Z, or have been said to be the same power as they were back then.
@@Alienldr 17 is a given he’s clearly SSB Level the problem with DBS is we have to just guess characters are that strong because the power scaling is a mess unless we get actual statements that’s all we can do. Also Piccolo did tell Gohan he got his power back referring to the Gohan in the Buu Saga that fought Super Buu this same Gohan made Goku go SSB Toriyama stated that God Goku was a 6 Beerus was a 10 none of it adds up Powerscaling in DBS is driven on head cannon because the series doesn’t follow the original format
Frost was Fighting SS Grade 4 Goku
Trivia Cabba and Vegeta Are equal in base form they met.. But because the data books stated Grade 4 is x10 Times Stronger Then Grade 1 Explains Why SS1 Cabba Could not SS1 Vegeta Despite the fact that they do have the same level of power in their base form.
I disagree. The data books are just what fans and staff, who did not decide the power level, assume the power is. In reality, goku and Gohan were just stronger in base, and the only thing grade 4 did was let them be a super saiyan without using much power. They were just stronger as regular super saiyans than vegeta was as grade 2, because their base was stronger.
And ssj1 vegeta was being pushed back by ssj1 cabba. Probably because cabba was so angry that it gave him a little boost. Vegeta beat Cabba in his blue form
@@Alienldr The data books take priority over your head canon
Even torriyama stated that the data books were reallible and he uses them to Help Remember. Please prioritize logic and common sense over your feelings. And remember that your feelings do not take priority over Feats and Statements.
Not necessarily retconned, it’s just Goku & Vegeta used a different form of SSG, one that’s weaker and doesn’t have a healing factor.
yet they use regular super saiyan forms which means they don't use god ki
the fact that copy Vegeta beats Gotenks in base proves it wasn't retconned not to mention he had to train with Whis to catch up to Goku. GT fans tears are so salty
Is he putting a lot of qi in that attack, though?
That means Krillin could destroy Vegito in the Buu Saga.... Super is nonsense
He made the movie with toei but made the manga after with toyo and had complete veto power.
Trunks struggles with dabra. This is cope. God was never absorbed in the manga, cabba and trunks disagree. The anime retconned it too.
Sorry but I disagree with the SSJ God boost and here's why.
Goku didn't convert the ssj god ki into his regular base form ki, now I'm not saying that Goku didn't absorbed the power at all but base off of what I've seen in the anime and B.O.G film Goku didn't convert it into normal ki that mortals use but instead by absorbing the god ki Goku ended up gaining two pools of ki inside his body that being the god ki and his own ki.
This makes sense given that in the anime when Goku said he didn't felt any changes in power despite being in his ssj1 form and if Goku really had converted the god ki into his regular ki then Goku would have either been in his ssj3 form since it's implying that he is still going all out at that point or Goku would have released that he's even stronger than before since he's only outputting 12.5% of his power.
While yes the others can sense Goku's ki at that point their reaction to his ki didn't imply that Goku got exponentially more powerful then he was before and while Beerus did answer Goku's question on the matter it was more like Beerus was giving an educational guess since prior to the answer Beerus was confused as to what was going with Goku and when Goku asked Beerus what was going on Beerus said "how should I know".
Episode 53 also supports this when Goku, Beerus and Whis were heading back to U7 after a ssj2 Goku fought Zamasu, Goku commented on how Zamasu's strength reminded him of his fight with Beerus. This means that a ssj2 Goku at the beginning of the "Goku Black Arc" is comparable to a ssj god Goku from the "B.O.G Arc" in strength which would make sense given that Goku trained for three years in the "R.O.S.A.T" In the "Universe 6 Arc"
So yeah Goku's regular base form didn't surpass the ssj god power he used against Beerus in the B.O.G arc and movie.
This doesn't really make any sense when you take into account the rest of the info we know.
The failed SSJ God Ritual already made Goku way more powerful than his previous limit. Goku, even thought he had already achieved God. This meaning Goku would have jumped past Super Vegito levels as Goku believed not even that could challenge Beerus.
Then after he loses the his SSJ God state he reverts to SSJ and then his Base. He is stated to be on the same level of power. And then when he goes to Base, he is stated to have surpassed that power. If Goku strength didn't remain the same, he would have gotten wiped out and Beerus wouldn't have bothered with the fight. And then after the fight was over, Vegeta mentions that Goku is way stronger then him know and that he will have to train to get to this level. This means what ever boost Goku got wasn't temperary.
There are even instances later of Base Goku surprising his previous Blue level. For example in the T.O.P, Base Goku takes a punch from Jiren stronger then anything he has ever felt. Stronger then surpressed Beerus, who rivaled SSJ God, stronger then Merged Zamasu, who bullied SSJ Blue. This was Base Goku taking this attack.
Goku and other fighter just getting leagues stronger then there previous forms is just a thing.
@@jeremymorris345 What about the moment when Goku faces Jiren for the first time he attacks Jiren in base, SSJ, SSJ2 and SSGOD but in base he sent a Kamehameha which did nothing to Jiren. In ssj1 and 2 he gave punches to Jiren which did absolutely nothing in SSG he managed to force Jiren to use his fingers, does this mean that Goku base cannot be at the level of his SSG form???
@@lilian6613 Black Arc Blue Goku < T.O.P Base Goku < T.O.P SSJ God Goku
Makes perfect sense.
@@jeremymorris345 wtf?? How can Base Goku become stronger than himself in SSJB in the previous arc??? Does this mean Kale,Base Gohan,Base Vegeta from TOP are stronger than Merged Zamasu?????
W video
It's sad but through de years I seem to dislike DBS more and more :/
Didn't he tell beerus he was only using 70 percent of his power?
@@Fabulos1 movie only, anime is different
The way its going in the anime he's using less then 1% soon.
@@LapisAndroid17ParkRangerhe used 10% against vegeta SSJ2
@@LapisAndroid17ParkRanger You mean manga. Anime Beerus is weaker than the Manga version
@@crestofhonor2349 i mean that they keep "increasing" Beerus. 2 SSJ Blue they could give you a run for your money, SSB kaioken, ( fearfull ) he was gonne use that against me, Ultra Instinct ( the Gods bow) .. and now its like yeh that was just the beginning you still way off my level. So soon the first Battle will have Beerus use less then 1%
I don’t know if I fully agree.
They never specified how much power he actually absorbed into his base. It seems perfectly reasonable from a writing perspective that goku actually only has a fraction of it in base and berrus was just sandbagging to have a good fight.
I always believed that him absorbing the full power of SSG into his literal base form made no sense and was just wank made up by power scalers to make him scale higher in their stupid debates.
I feel like a lot of that bled into the actual show’s discourse.
Super episode 13 anime sub:
“I don’t feel like I’m weaker at all” - Goku after he realized he wasn’t in SSG anymore
“The power completely fused within your very being.” - Beerus
This is specifying how much he absorbed.
@@MajestiBrownThank you, people just want to ignore this.
@@MajestiBrowngoku was in SSJ or base when he said that ???
@@lilian6613 Number 1: It doesn’t matter what form he was in (he was in SSJ) because Beerus said the completely power fused within his “BEING”, not fused within a transformation.
Number 2: Super Saiyan Goku was able to power up even more and was stronger than Ritual SSG which goes with the idea that Goku absorbed it into his base.
@@MajestiBrownand Goku said he hasnt grown any weaker at all nor did he said he grown even stronter as SSJ, and no theres no way he actually did absorbed fully SSG into his base as at the end of fight to disperse a massive attack from Beerus, he transformed back to SSJG, and using this same argument wouldnt even close the gap noe changes in his power at all if he did absorbed SSJG into his base which is just ridiculous, and if Goku said he wasnt weaker when his god form time limit has run out, hypothetically he should be atleast strong as his previous SSJG state and SSJ is 50 times the base, so that means this base Goku is 50 times weaker than his previous SSJG state and heres why this could prove up the point