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In Defense of Super Mario Galaxy 2
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- Опубликовано: 17 авг 2024
- Super Mario Galaxy 2 may be a beloved game, but often times, it seems loved as just that: a video game, and nothing else. While Galaxy 1 is frequently touted as a transcendental experience for those who played it, the same can't really be said of its sequel. But surely there's more to Galaxy 2 than great level design?
My Galaxy 1 Video: • You Have Already Seen ...
SuperMarioT Miyamoto Story Video: • No, Miyamoto DOESN'T D...
You can read my original essay here:
docs.google.co...
Chapters:
00:00 -- Surprise
01:46 -- Devil's in the Details
06:16 -- Time
08:53 -- The Long Trip Home
11:33 -- Objective
11:54 -- Repeat
12:04 -- On the Road Again, Again, Again
15:21 -- Gone
17:02 -- Style is the Substance
26:22 -- Memory
27:56 -- As the Cosmos Passes By
Credits:
All footage not credited captured by myself.
@advaitmenon8669 for his help on the thumbnail and appearance!
Nintendo Week footage from: www.youtube.co...
Font Download from Captain Byte! on Twitter: / 1232025364345556994
Static Background from Josue Beauregard:
• TV Static Transition (...
BGM from GilvaSunner: Archives: • Wii Channel - Super Ma...
Endscreen taken from NoClip website:
noclip.website/
Sprites and Logos from Mario Wiki:
www.mariowiki....
Something I appreciate about Galaxy 2 over Galaxy 1 is the White Luma that provides you the spin ability is *actually* a character. He pretty much fades into the background in the first game, but he's more prominent in cutscenes and feels more involved in Galaxy 2. He even talks! In retrospect it's odd that he wasn't that prominent in the first game, considering the ending scene has a moment of him leaving Mario's hat and flying into the black hole with the other lumas. If he had more screentime like in Galaxy 2, that moment would've have way more weight.
I also had the exact same weekend rule growing up, the way I'd cheat it was Professor Layton, I used to tell my parents that it was a puzzle game which was good for my brain
Nice, I probably could've gotten away with Professor Layton as well, but I didn't play them until my early-teens, when they finally gave up on the rule altogether lol
I had that rule with my DS but not with my Wii for some reason
@@AurumAlex64You have to be kidding me,at 1:45,an ad dropped.
You know, reading this suddenly makes me consider how all these things we tried to put past our parents actually sounded coming out of a middle schoolers mouth. I think maybe our parents were happy to compromise just for the effort we put in.
i used to be only allowed to play on Fridays and weekends, but only for an hour a day.
The fact this is not on switch is a crime.
THIS EXACTLY, I want a port so fucking bad!
i been saying that man. they need to do a second 3D allstars with Galaxy 2 3D land
@@melhody46923D was so damn fun, seeing it in HD would be amazing
@@dyldog 1000% I have such fond memories of playing it as a kid. My DS went with me EVERYWHERE
Re-using part of the galaxy 1 vid whilst changing it up a little all while talking about how re-use can be used effectively is so meta and very clever.
That ending monologue really hits the nail on the head. You've thought about this much more rigourously than most people have. So many people never stop to think how their criticisms conflict with each other. I guess it's just a symptom of how we often don't understand what we actually want.
Seperate from that issue, though... I honestly would argue Galaxy 2 is better than the first solely based on level design and powerups. So many classic galaxies like Supermassive and Shiverburn. And I love every Yoshi level. It's just more refined in the way that TTYD is compared to PM64.
At the end of the day, though, you mentioned an alternative view that I wish more people would consider. Galaxy 1 and 2 are incredibly similar. Galaxy 2 originally began development as a pseudo-DLC. When we evaluate these games, couldn't it be fair to consider them two parts of one whole? If you like one, you'll like the other. You could merge them into one disc and someone who's never played them might believe they always existed like that. If people can't get over their love of nitpicking Galaxy 2, I think we should just merge the two games in our evaluations. It's tough to think of two games who fit together as well as Galaxy 1 and 2. Considering them one entity is completely fair in my reckoning.
They already told the story they wanted but they had more ideas, so they didn’t let them go to waste. That’s pretty cool. The visual and musical storytelling show how far you’ve come.
This is easily one of the most brilliant reviews/essays I've seen on Super Mario Galaxy 2, hell, any game, period. It's always been kind of frustrating how this game has gotten the short end of the stick from fans, all because it lacks the more emotional, grandly atmospheric tone of the first game. But, it's not trying to do that. It's venturing off in a new direction. The analogy of comparing the journey to a big road trip is so brilliantly inciteful. That's what it is. Just a big, fun road trip, checking out the sites and meeting fun new people along the way. Sure, Peach still needs to be rescued from Bowser, but it's honestly kind of smart that the game doesn't have a more dark, serious tone. It lets the rest of the game breathe more. Bowser serves more as a bully you have to flick on the nose, rather than a demonic conqueror you have to vanquish. Your discussion on storytelling in games was also fantastic. I feel people get all to caught up in seeing the story in games as just being the dialogue and text spoken by characters during cutscenes. But, there's so many ways in which games can communicate their stories and Super Mario Galaxy 2 is a great example of that. Sure, I wish it was something more original than "Save Peach from Bowser, again" and it's certainly not very deep, but it doesn't have to be. This game is a joyous, fun ride, bursting with creativity and charm. Your video does a fantastic job celebrating that. Thank you.
Super mario galaxy 2 will always be my favourite game of all time. I prefer it over galaxy 1 probably because I got this game first, so it’s more nostalgic to me. However, every galaxy is just pure fun and the game throws so many ideas at you that I think it's the superior game. I also reallyyy love the idea of traveling through the different atmospheres with your ship and that the atmosphere changes in the hub world depending on which world you are in.
What really pushed this game to my favorite is probably the green stars. Some people see it as lazy content, but in my eyes it's an amazing addition. Green stars are in the most ABSURD places that makes me think I'm breaking the game and that is amazing, plus it's also really fun going back to all the stages and having a trip down memory lane.
And of course, it ends with the coolest galaxy ever. Banger game, 11/10, would recommend this game again and again
Yes, I think the green stars are underrated. Not all of them are good, of course, but I vastly prefer them to replaying the game as Luigi.
Galaxy 2 is my favorite game as well. I played Galaxy 1 first and I find it to be more memorable, but I prefer Galaxy 2 because I like the levels, bosses, and power ups more. Galaxy 1 has a better story, soundtrack, and atmosphere, but Galaxy 2 has better gameplay imo. Both games are incredible though and my two favorite games of all time
I completely agree with your take on the green stars. They were easily my favorite part of the game. :)
The point you made about the story telling in Mario Galaxy 2 is so accurate. It’s still my favorite Mario game to this day. It does so much right
"Ironically, despite all the people claiming that Galaxy 2 is merely a derivative sequel, the game seems to only take criticism when it deviates from the foundation Galaxy 1 laid out." Wonderfully said! I think KingK's video will likely always be the popular narrative for Galaxy 2, even though when you actually anylize what he says, it doesn't really add up. While there are certainly problems with the game, (Battle Belt and a lot of World S isn't really very fun.) the "lack of story and atmosphere" isn't one of them. People mistake different kinds of story and atmosphere for "Doesn't exist lol". Story wise, Galaxy 2 builds off the foundation of the first game and does it's own unique thing with it. Still my favorite game. Great video!
I like World S but maybe because I just like the challenge
I think KingK is kinda shit at analyzing games in general
Ugh, as part of the theme park fandom, It's sooooo true.
@@slenderMax28KingK and Jospeh Anderson vid on Galaxy and Odyssey both have points which are 'fair', but I feel like a lot of ppl online just parrot them lol
I love the atmosphere of galaxy 1, but galaxy 2 definitely had atmosphere and awe too. I felt it so strongly as a child and would replay certain galaxies (the ice skating one) over and over just to feel that atmosphere. It's a beautiful and moving game even if it isn't going to make me cry my eyes out like 1 did. But the emphasis on how much more fun 2 is is not misplaced... Watching you play made me want to play so bad... They need to finally port this game to switch 2. Great video!
I'm going to defend Galaxy 1 having The Bedroom be the last block of the Observatory that unlocks.
The Observatory is a living place, and it doesn't try to hide that fact. It's got a Kitchen, Garden, Library, etc. Places people live, and not necessary "adventuring zones". But there's one place that's always going to be the most personal, heartfelt location of any home: Someone's bedroom. It's not a public place- it's the one room in an entire home that is solely defined by its one resident, assuming it's not shared.
Galaxy 2 certainly does bombast better than 1- I easily grant that. But 1 isn't always trying to do bombast, and especially not when you're at the Observatory. You're learning about Rosalina and the Luma's lives one room at a time. And finally being allowed into the single most personal room in Rosalina's life is much more symbolic and heartfelt than if we'd sudden been granted access to a blackhole besides the Observatory or something. Entering The Bedroom is not the "end" of your personal journey with Rosalina. It's the reward for getting to know her.
Though that doesn't excuse how weird the final few stages are for theming, or the fact that other areas could be the last unlocks. I'm not saying Galaxy is perfect lol.
I like this reading of the bedroom. And to be clear, I'm not necessarily trying to say that 2 has a "better" atmosphere than 1. I totally get why 1's is so beloved compared to 2. I just think in trying to explain why people prefer 1 over 2, the argument often seems to come down to "2 really doesn't have much atmosphere at all," which I don't think is true. I just think it's a different kind of atmosphere, with its own strengths and weaknesses.
so what about the engine and the garden?
Galaxy 2 has always had some of my favorite locations in any game and the fact that some of them are barely talked about at all always confused me. From some of the exciting highs like Melty Monster Galaxy, to the quiet atmosphere of Slimy Spring Galaxy ending off with that beautiful sunset, this games world deserves way more recognition.
I would argue that an underlying throughline would add more to the concept of the journey on Starship Mario being like Dumb and Dumber or Beavis and Butthead Do America. Lubba is a helpful character who acts as a de-stresser for Mario and Luigi in the game after they do what they do in the galaxies that they travel in and even the player to a certain extent, so it feels arbitrary to not have something beyond that for him. If he made certain comments about more characters taking a ride on the Starship, reminding him what it was like to have a family, and then by the sixth world, he reflected on his journey with Mario, reminding him of what it was like to have a son who would be popular with the other kids, then the characters coming on board Starship Mario would have had a bigger meaning than before.
I really like this idea. It fits with the game and gives Lubba some character that wouldn't feel like an equivalent to Rosalina's storybook
This reminds me of the conversations Cappy has with Mario as you travel between kingdoms and at the end of Darker Side, which I say does help with you connect with the character ans your journey.
It's weird. When Galaxy 2 was first released back in 2010, I saw nothing but unanimous love for the game all over the Internet, with people praising it for its solid gameplay, amazing level design, and fantastic music. Some even went as far as to call it the greatest Mario game ever made. However, when certain influencers on RUclips at the time came out saying they didn't like it, calling it an "overrated, overglorified expansion pack", everyone just kind of latched onto their opinions and started trashing the game all of a sudden, and just like that, all the love and praise I kept seeing for the game went away. Of course, I'm not saying that people don't have legitimate reasons for not liking this game or preferring Galaxy 1 over it, but during this time, it really did feel like people were hating on this game because it was the "cool" thing to do now apparently, and as a big fan of Galaxy 2, it was honestly pretty sad to see.
That said, it really does make me happy to see that Galaxy 2 is finally starting to get the respect and recognition it genuinely deserves all these years later. I especially appreciate the new perspectives you offered on the so-called "flaws" of this game and why they might not actually be flaws at all. It shows that you actually understand this game and look into it a little deeper rather than just taking it at face value like so many people do, and I've got nothing but respect for that.
Also, as a side note, I find it funny how people always laud Rosalina's Storybook for being this super crucial piece to Galaxy 1's story that gives the game so much more emotional weight, yet at the same time... it's completely optional and can be easily missed. Heck, I know I missed it on my first playthrough and it didn't affect my enjoyment of the game at all, so while it is most definitely a welcome addition to the game, perhaps it's not as important and necessary as people make it out to be, and why Galaxy 2 not having anything like it isn't really a huge deal in the long run.
I personally liked SMG2 more growing up, simply because I enjoyed its gameplay more :p
That said, while I think Galaxy 1 tied together its theme of sonder and cosmic loneliness more coherently than SMG2 did with its road trip; SMG2 is also interesting because it is both the same yet alternative answer to the original's question of "Home."
Super Mario Galaxy asks "Where is home?" and in the same breath, answers "Home is here; in this little space we've carved out for ourselves, in the journey it took for us to carve that answer into the constellations of the cosmos.", embodied by the way the Observatory lights up for every Grand Star, as the player pieces together a place that's lived in and full of Lumas bouncing around.
Super Mario Galaxy 2 answers "Home is here, in the people we've met along the way, in the shades of everything that reminds you of where you came from, and how you've brought it with you." as the player goes through Yoshi Star Galaxy with the titular dinosaur, Starshine Beach and obviously Throwback Galaxy. Hell, the entire journey is basically a reinterpretation of the first game.
In essence, they're the same answer, viewed at a different angle - As Rosalina said: "But the cycle never repeats itself in quite the same way..."
That was very well written my friend!
Damn, you just made me rethink everything I assumed about Galaxy 2's story. My overall opinion on it has not changed, but dang, I now feel more encouraged than ever to give the game a second shot and see if my opinion still holds up. Your point about 'what if the style IS the substance' is so good! I've thought that about Galaxy 1's story for a while- sure, it's basic, but it's so, so well presented and well done that I just don't care. Even though I vastly prefer Galaxy 1's approach to storytelling, why should 2's story not get that same consideration from me?
I really wish you'd talked more about the atmosphere shift between the games. I feel as if the Comet Observatory's expansiveness and calm vibes encouraged a slower, more reflective pace through the game. There wasn't a whole lot to do, but it served as calming white noise when traversing between the domes. This was backed up by some levels being more open sandboxes, where you spent much longer in one area. I think that's probably why people (including me) say Galaxy 1 has more atmosphere than 2- not because it necessarily does, it just emphasizes what atmosphere it does have more explicitly than 2 does.
Galaxy 2, meanwhile, is much more upbeat and fast paced. This is reflected in Starship Mario; the music is pleasant and vaguely exciting, seemingly re-energizing you for the next level after only a few moments of silence. Its small, dense design directly opposes the Comet Observatory- instead of encouraging you to slow down and reflect, it acts as a sort of pit stop, trying to get you on your way as fast as it can.
One approach is not definitively better than the other, of course, but they are fundamentally different. And since these tonal differences happen, at minimum, between every single star, I would argue that the games feel VERY different despite their similarities. But, then again, it has been a while since I've played 2, so maybe my memory is slipping there.
Final note- I disagree that Galaxy 1 lacks a notable buildup to its ending. The number of stars needed to reach the center of the universe ticking down subtly builds up the final encounter- visualizing your progress so directly makes it exciting, even if the more implicit visual progression is... minimal. You did make a good point of how effective 2's visual buildup is, though!
Real good video! Definitely the most though-provoking Galaxy 2 discussion I've seen in a while. :)
Yeah, the many years of playing Galaxy 1 has warped the way I view the game. Since I always collected every star I could while going through each galaxy, by the time the star counter appears on the Observatory, it's already ticked all the way down to 1. So that didn't even register when writing this video, because I cannot even recall the last time I've seen that number count down organically.
Agreed with your noting the differences between 1 and 2's atmosphere. I would just say that the point of this video, as you suggest, is to argue against the idea that 2 has "less" atmosphere as opposed to just having a "different" atmosphere. Of course, I understand why a lot of people would prefer 1's, but I think saying it has "less" isn't giving 2 the deference it deserves. It makes the game sound thoughtless and incidental, which I don't think is true.
@@AurumAlex64 Fair enough! I didn't even know that was possible to skip the countdown- I can definitely see why counting from 1 to 0 would make the countdown much, MUCH less effective XD
And I think your video was very effective at arguing that! Sorry if I just repeated your point back to you verbatim without realizing.
I didn't really like Galaxy 2 when it came out and saw it as lesser than 1 (which is still excellent, but yeah), and until this video nothing ever challenged me on that assumption. Like you said, even the game's biggest fans seem to share the same criticisms, effectively making an opinion echochamber that's lasted for over a decade.
So thank you for finally challenging my assumptions! I don't think this game will ever come close to Galaxy 1 for me due to personal preferences, but I am excited to see if going into the game with a fresh mindset will change my perspective at all. :)
I honestly prefer Galaxy 2's Starship Mario over the comet observatory. It's small, yes, but there's enough secrets and characters that itstill feels cozy and interesting, especially whenever a new NPC makes its home there. and of course it's less time consuming just stepping on the pedal that brings you to the map instead of jumping through the observatory all the time, which is quite empty in comparison and imo overall the worst hub world. Peach's Castle is an expansive labyrinth that is fun to explore, Delfino Plaza is comfy and lived-in, but the Observatory is none of those, which is why I think scaling it down significantly for the next game was a good move and introduced back the cozy, lively nature of Delfino Plaza, albeit in a smaller scale.
Say what you want; I enjoyed Galaxy 1’s story more, however I had WAY more fun playing Galaxy 2 🤷🏻♂️ as a Mario game, it feels more alive.
the fact that mario galaxy 2, widely considered to be the best 3d mario game at one point needs defending now is just sad
Found your channel from the Paper Jam vid and went on to watch the Bowser’s Fury video and now this. Big fan of your stuff, love this video as a whole!
If I had one nitpick though, it’s that the examples for why Galaxy 2’s story has a more satisfying progression seem a little cherry-picked. Yes, the first levels of the last two worlds in Galaxy 2 are a bit more exhilarating and climactic than Gold Leaf or Deep Dark. But the second to last level in Galaxy 2 is… Throwback Galaxy? The second level in Mario 64 with fun jazzy music and bright, welcoming colors. Doesn’t scream “homestretch” to me. Even more bizarre is Battle Belt, a totally uninspired enemy gauntlet with zero cohesive theming that the sound team didn’t even bother making original music for. It’s easily the limpest feeling final major level of any 3D Mario game, and Sunshine ended with Pianta Village, so that’s saying something.
If anything, Galaxy 1’s homestretch is far more compelling. I strongly disagree that Deep Dark isn’t a suitable first stage for the final dome just because it isn’t as bombastic an opener as something like Melty Monster. It sets a disquieting atmosphere that lends the stage the ominous presence required to justify its placement. But then Dreadnought and Melty Molten are great follow ups that progressively up the tension and deliver a suitable climax to the main level selection of Galaxy 1. Even the one-off Galaxy, Matter Splatter, has a surreal energy that perfectly suits the late-game.
And sure, Galaxy 2’s world maps are a bit better at setting the mood for the final confrontation, but I find that the Engine Room and Garden are also pretty decent final areas. The Engine Room is cold and uninviting compared to the comforting scenery of the previous domes, which all emulate traditional household rooms. And the Garden has always been one of the coolest subversive moments in a Mario game. Entering it for the first time, hearing the typical dome music queue and then promptly fade out as ambient noise sets in, taking in the openness of the area compared to the relative claustrophobia of every other dome in the game, it’s a special feeling, like the calm before the storm and a reminder of how far you’ve come. Way more impactful to me personally than the admittedly very cool looking black hole of World 6’s background.
Also, while you can end the game by the time you’ve finished the Bedroom in Galaxy 1, I really don’t think most people have done that. If you’ve put in the work to obtain close to or all of the stars in the previous four domes, you’re likely invested enough to want to get most of or all of the stars in the game. And if you haven’t done all that, then you probably don’t have enough stars to finish the game yet, meaning that you’re likely to just keep pressing on through the last few domes to scrape together the stars you need to get to Bowser. Mario 64 only requires you to collect 70 stars in order to finish the game, a feat that you could easily accomplish well before entering either of the last two courses in the top floor of the castle, but I wouldn’t make the argument that Tiny Huge Island is the final note that the main courses of the game end on.
I think this is a fair critique. To be honest, I've always felt like the Engine Room is the odd-dome-out in Galaxy. I would've figured that an engine room would be near the bottom of the Observatory rather than the top (and isn't the giant sphere in the center supposed to power the Observatory?). And I think its levels are generally the weakest in the game.
As for Deep Dark, I've always viewed that as more of an analog to the "Ghost House" stages from the NSMB series, which I've felt was a strange choice for that spot in Galaxy. I much prefer Haunty Halls from 2, which is in World 3, which matches where Ghost Houses tend to appear in the NSMB games (usually in the beach world). But I definitely agree with you on the rest of the Garden.
@@AurumAlex64 No qualms with that first paragraph, outside of Toy Time Galaxy the Engine Room brings nothing new to the table. It’s a compilation of “part 2” Galaxies and is arguably the single divot in quality in all of SMG1.
As for the second paragraph, while I get where you’re coming from, Deep Dark has always struck me as a far more interesting and foreboding take on the traditional “Ghost House” level. I mean for one, Galaxy already contains a variant on the Ghost House theme with Ghostly Galaxy. That said, the setting of Deep Dark has always resonated with me; a lone, sheltered planet in deep space, with tall rock spires and deep lakes containing land mines and a sunken ship. There’s a story being alluded to there, with the green tinted grotto area containing the single floating pirate ship illuminated by beams of light being a particularly compelling image. It always felt appropriately lonely and dangerous for a final area, a sort of 3D equivalent to the ghost ship stage that directly precedes the Valley of Bowser in Super Mario World.
"Super Mario Galaxy More" is the actual codename for Super Mario Galaxy 2 in the Wii WBFS system files.
ok? its a development title lol
Super Mario Galaxy 2 was already my favorite video game of all time. This video just made me fall in love with the game all over again. Thank you so much for offering such a wonderful perspective on this game. :)
I'm so happy ye made a defense of Mario Galaxy 2! Thank you so ever kindly for it! Mario Galaxy 2 was my childhood, and it saddens me people take offense on it. I'm so fain ye made this video! Thank you! ♥
I agree, but It was mostly just typical Twitter being mad at a video's existence without even watching it
@@superdajoka Im not on Twitter much, and my timeline is mostly cats or wholesome videos, so I cannot say much on the topic. But that is quite sad frankly ;(
wait this old house? that was a favorite of mine growing up!, though I would have rather watched saturday morning cartoons if we had been allowed to.
there's also the fact that if I remember correctly rosalina's story was never intended to be in galaxy 1
For my brother and I, we always sat through This Old House to get to the Saturday morning cartoons, haha. To be honest, I didn't pay very much attention
While I still prefer the atmosphere of 1, I do think the emergent storytelling from gameplay is better in 2, and this video is a great showcase of why. Also, I think the most fitting last star for Galaxy 1 before the final level is neither the Engine Room, nor the Garden, but the Gate. A final quiet moment between Mario, Rosalina and the Lumas, as well as a sneak peak into the post-game purple coin challenges right before the grand finale.
I've spent all my life thinking of reasons to explain why Galaxy 2 is my favorite game, even more so than 1, but you've laid out in a way that I don't think I ever could have. Absolutely hit the nail on the head. Besides Galaxy 2's excellent levels and game mechanics, there are a lot ways to take emotional value out of it that differ from its predecessor. When I was a kid, I really felt this aura of adventure around it. Games took me a while to complete, and time was way slower when I was 8 years old, so the feeling of approaching the final world as the backgrounds of the world maps became more menacing and the music more tense and the levels more difficult, felt really tangible, all while the game barely said a thing. 12 years later, I find someone who's able to properly put that into words. This video deserves a billion views
One main criticism I have for the story is that this game is acknowledged as a sequel, but there’s no in-universe acknowledgement of the previous game’s events.
On the other hand though, I can understand that they didn’t want to go down the same path as Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn, which had the exact opposite problem: it depended too much on the player knowing what happened in Path of Radiance. If they saw how Intelligent Systems struggled with sales in part due to that, it makes sense that they wanted to make Galaxy 2 accessible to newcomers, but there is a middle ground.
My reading on Galaxy 2 was always that it was an alternate version of the events of Galaxy 1, relating back to Rosalina's final speech in the first game. So Galaxy 2 is _technically_ not a sequel of 1, more of an alternate universe.
another great video. slowly going through all of your content and this one is definitely up there in my favorites. the other mario galaxy video was great, and this one is just more greatness like the games themselves. very nice and relaxing to listen to, good music choice/sound mixing, and good points. i havent played these games in years, but this video gave me a few blasts of nostalgia, despite my current gap from nintendo titles. i also like the irl section lol
Yeah, this might be my favorite one I've made so far. I originally wasn't sure if I even had anything to say about Galaxy 2 in the first place, but I clearly proved myself wrong. I also liked the irl stuff too (though if I ever rewatch a section of this video I always skip those parts haha). Something about Mario games really get my creative juices flowing, I guess.
Great video bro🎉🎉🎉
After watching both essays in a row I can safely say - well, I guess I never considered it that way before. (I do wish I had more complicated thoughts than just parroting the intro of the first essay, but hey! Reuse is just a tool, right? And most of what I wanted to say has already been said in the comments already, and that the framing device of switching between the game, your personal experience, and how these two are one and the same is self-evidently clever, so mostly I just wanna say wow, I really enjoyed both of these essays! Gave me a lot to think about, so thanks!)
While I am certainly someone who prefers the more serene and contemplative atmosphere of Galaxy 1, I absolutely agree that reducing the conversation around the games to “story vs gameplay” is unfair to both titles. I always hate when people say things like “Mario games aren’t known for their stories,” because, as you laid out, the emergent stories the games tell as one plays through them are, for many of us, the entire appeal of the series.
I would argue that Galaxy 1 does have a better sense of narrative progression than you give it credit for, with Melty Molten Galaxy feeling like a perfect pre-climax that even ends with a cleverly remixed version of the first boss, but its true that this narrative is somewhat upended if you do not choose to play new galaxies as they become available.
Ultimately I think I would argue Galaxy 1 has a “better” story simply because I prefer its gameplay, and thus, its emergent narrative beats, but you make some great points in favor of Galaxy 2. Really, it is a game whose presentation and emergent story still surpass many, many others, and that’s worth appreciating
... Galaxy 2 needed defending????
what a miserable world we live in
Super Mario Galaxy 2 is one of the games I have a close emotional connection to. It was the first Mario game I can safely say I BEAT as a child (I never got past the first star of SM64DS), and I played it long before I got the first game. I believe I even still have the tutorial disk that it came with somewhere. And despite never thinking about it that way, that section about contextualising it as a road trip adventure really gets to me emotionally. And I think in that way this game feels like far more than just “more Super Mario Galaxy”, it has its own vibe and it’s one that I resonate strongly with. And I want to talk about that. That vibe.
I never really thought about it, but I think this video made me think about how my favourite “genre” of story or adventure is that sort of ‘road trip world adventure’ style, where the journey is far more than just the destination at the end. It doesn’t matter to me how much the story is fleshed out so long as I have that good time. A lot of my favourite games have that sort of structure, even ones with compelling stories like Sonic Unleashed, the Xenoblade Chronicles games and of course Super Mario Odyssey (which in a way feels like the spiritual successor to Galaxy 2's approach now that I consider it).
To wrap up this point, I feel that while games with the illusion of less linearity like Galaxy 1 have a lot of merit, I don't think much will overcome the feeling in my mind of just appreciating a good journey, a journey I'll never forget due to the emotions attached.
when i was a child i used to play galaxy 2 everyday,but i only had 1h everyday,after a whole year i knew there existed a galaxy 1 bc it says mario galaxy 2 not just Mario galaxy.
After i knew it i immediately asked my mom to buy me the first one,she always said no but i kept asking and then 1 day she decided to buy me 1.
I was so happy but after 3 years my brother broke my wii and i cant play galaxy 2 anymore,but since i had a switch i asked my mom if she could buy me Mario 3d all stars since it had the first game,my mom said i can get it if i win the chess tournament in my school and i had to cone first,there were like 40 people in and people older than me,but i won and won and won but then
I came to the finale,i was playing against the best guy at chess in our school,no one expected me to win but everyone wanted me to win,and i Won.
My mom buyed me galaxy 1 and i still play it everyday,i wish galaxy 2 was on switch
I’ve always preferred galaxy 2 over 1 and it’s just purely based on preference not quality, I don’t think either game is better than the other and that’s thanks to the different take galaxy 2 did with its narrative and game design.
Oh my god, thank you for making this! Personally, I always loved 2 more than 1 and I always said that it depends on what you're in the mood for: a deep, melancholic, epic story-based journey through the deepest depths of the universe or a high-octane, light-hearted adventure through the cosmos. In terms of story, Super Mario Galaxy is my all time favorite Mario game (not counting the RPGs). In terms of representing everything Mario is about, the game I will always point to is Galaxy 2, a game that serves as a roadtrip through the best elements of the series.
Galaxy 1 is a game I play when I'm in the mood for an epic and dramatic adventure with grand stakes, while Galaxy 2 is the game I play when I want to have a good time.
Funny enough, Mario Odyssey - a game that shares my top spot for my favorite game in the series with Galaxy 2 - also tries to do this road trip angle. And yet, having playing Galaxy 2 a lot more than Galaxy 1 and owning a Galaxy 2 Guide for over a decade, I'd say that this is the one that managed to impact me more.
I have been aware that Super Mario Galaxy 2 was released during the 25th anniversary, technically making it an anniversary game. I've always thought that Mario should follow Sonic's example in this department, but I never realized that they technically already did this in 2010. Which is where I will drop my last point: I've always felt weird for loving Galaxy 2 more than 1 and could never find the words to express how I feel. Lucky that you were able to do it for me.
I'm so glad I stumbled across this video and channel. Here's to hoping that Super Mario Galaxy 2 gets a re-release on the Switch 2. Keep up the good work, dude!
This is the second time i randomly stumble upon your channel. Earlier last week i found your paper jam video and found myself so pleasantly surprised by your scriptwriting and voice.
You made my bus-ride home a lot more pleasant that day. And now i find this video as i'm about to go on a run. Just as well written, edited, and recorded. Thank you for making these! You have a new fan. And i'm absolutely looking forward to whatever you produce next. I hope it finds me in the middle of yet another mundane event of my life to make it just a little better!
When it comes to defending Galaxy 2, it's only when it comes to if Galaxy 2 over Galaxy. I don't think many would say that Galaxy 2 is bad. Many of these people would just say that Galaxy is better than Galaxy 2. For me, I think Galaxy 2 is better.
I’m currently going through a breakup and I found your channel and your videos made me feel a bit better so thank you
Fantastic video. Surprised you’re not getting more views (tho 11,000 people is a lot even if on RUclips it doesn’t seem it). Please keep making this stuff. One day something will catch alight and you’ll be off :)
Don’t gotta defend nothing! This is peak Mario
Starship Mario is a tour bus.
I love how bowser just flies away in galaxy 2, it looks so goofy 😂
To be fair to Galaxy 1, considering Melty Molten and Dreadnought are the final 2 galaxies before Bowser, I would say that Galaxy 1 still has story through gameplay, especially with Melty Molten's fantastically triumphant, yet stressful and intimidating, score.
I'll admit, this is a perspective I've not heard; that much of its story can be compared, in a way, to Celeste's: the story mostly IS the gameplay, the difficulty ramps, the travel. And a lot of what you say about how the vibe is intentionally different, the "road trip" vibe kind of makes sense too... but I can't help but think it's incidental, rather than intentionally masterfully crafted. EVERY Mario game has slowly increasing difficulty, nearly every Mario game has you only re-enter a single level once or twice if you can at all, and nearly every Mario game tells the vaguest hints of story through the gameplay. Even Mario 1 for NES could claim that. That doesn't make it... compelling, I guess? Going back to the Celeste comparison, the cutscenes and gameplay combined into a more real tone: the difficulty of getting past a certain room always felt like a small, emergent story in themselves. Even the reuse of themes on the Summit felt very intentional, like showing how much you've grown. I get that, by your argument, Galaxy 2 isn't TRYING to tell a serious story, and the emergent story told through gameplay is just intended as a fun romp through the universe, like Mario Sunshine's vacation vibes but on a grander scale... but it really doesn't feel like it sold that, for me. Rather, it really does feel like it's prioritizing fun OVER storytelling.
In that case, though, perhaps what we should be criticizing is how it failed on that front, not how it just is different from Galaxy 1. So what could it do to sell that vibe more? The critters hitching rides on the Starship are a start... but maybe if they were clearly having more fun on the ship? Perhaps giving it more cruise ship vibes, with pools, and beach chairs. Perhaps they could be playing games, like tennis, or swimming, or have little froufrou cocktail drinks (that are totally juice, ofc) or something like that. Lubba also likes to recommend you take a break a lot already, but perhaps changing his dialogue just a bit to reference the chill vibe could work more too: maybe something like "No use burning yourself out, why not take a break and see some sights outside?" or something like that. It's silly, but they could also, if not doing the cruise ship thing, perhaps make the little yellow map bits look more like an actual (cartoony) road, like a highway, and give the starship some cute lil wheels (but still have it float above it, to be silly). Heck, even just like an animation of a lil flap opening on the starship like a gas cap and the star going in would help! Just something to say that the sights we're seeing are actually part of the journey other than just like... arbitrary levels. Combining that with only having new stages until Bowser could really sell that; leave the reused levels as part of the extra world leading up to Grandmaster Galaxy.
The game could definitely be more committed to its road trip sensibilities, and I like a lot of your suggestions. But you're definitely correct in your second paragraph that I'm trying to nudge critique of the game into critiquing Galaxy 2's own merits, rather than just in the context of 1.
I've been replaying super Mario Galaxy 2 recently and having an absolute blast. I primarily watched my brother play Galaxy 1, and barely played it myself. But when I got Galaxy 2 a few years later, it was all mine to play. But even now, despite barely ever playing it myself, super Mario Galaxy 1 still gives me so much nostalgia. But due to it's atmosphere and my young age of experiencing it, it gives me the sort of sad nostalgia, like a longing to go back. But Galaxy 2 is the kind of nostalgia where I feel at home. Knowing every nook and cranny. the hub world isn't a break from the adventure, because the adventure is a break from real life! I don't think as of now, I could play Galaxy 1 without a lingering sadness and longingness. So for now, I'll stick to Galaxy 2.
Oh my gosh that's long
@GDRhythmic lmao sometimes I think exactly this when I type a comment and I don't realize how much I actually typed
Could have just said “C’mon it has Yoshi in it” and the video would be 31 minutes and 10 seconds shorter
Few things get me more nostalgic than thinking about my memories with Nintendo Week
The Nintendo Week mention brought back so many memories
It's crazy how without Nintendo Week I'd have no idea what games would be coming out lol
Glad your new videos are blowing up, u deserve it
A fantastic video sequel about a fantastic game sequel!
Everyone who lacks appreciation for Galaxy 2 should watch this video
Me: never played either of the Galaxy games (not my cup of tea)
Also me: AurumAlex made two videos about the Galaxy games? Better watch ‘em both!
Surprised people try to reduce what Galaxy 2 does, I always found both games about equal in quality, with that quality being the best Mario games ever made. I think I slightly prefer 2. I love how 1 feels to play, the tone and music make it this ethereal experience. But I love the levels of 2. The game somehow barrels through more ideas and at a faster rate than the first game. I find that the overall level quality is a bit higher, the main thing that helps this is I think the small galaxies were the biggest under sung improvement over the first, while the larger galaxies remain the same quality wise (hard to improve near perfection) One other thing I like about the atmosphere of 2 is how the sky in the background works. I have always liked how the sky gets darker through each world, it makes the game feel like a journey deeper into space. It goes for something a bit different than 1, but man if both these games aren’t some of the games ever made idk what is.
As an avid Galaxy 1 preferer, I'm glad to have come across this.
I would have to say though, that thematic progression ≠ story. It's a totally different concept, but if you want to compare the two considering thematic progression as story, you have to compare it to Galaxy 1's textual narrative.
Galaxy 2 doesn't have a story in a way that matters to me, and that's because we really do know Miyamoto does not care for narrative.
how do we really do know tho?
you acting like mario odyssey doesnt exist
galaxy 1's story is really ass, actually lose someone in real life and you're realize the digital mario princess losing her mother or whatever is the most basic version of that plot point ever
also its literally entirely optional
@@internetguy7319 thank you
@@internetguy7319That’s a really shitty take. How does losing anyone in real life change anything about the plot? It makes no sense in the slightest
Galaxy 1 barely has a story at all.
People need to stop mistaking that (already pretty cliche and basic) optional easter egg side plot content for "THE game's story"
Your videos are amazing
Ah hey, something that you said in the Time section resonated with me. I also wonder if certain games that I adored on my childhood were to came out in these moments of my life I would have enjoyed them as much. I think I have given thought to that concept in some way before, because certain games are fueled by nostalgia, by removing that my opinions of them would have been different.
I wonder too if the opposite may be true; if games of today were to come at my childhood and I were to play it at that age and schedule, how would I see them?
Personally, I think there every game is subject to this. You'll play every single game of your life in the context of one life event or another, and some games will speak to those life events better than others in that exact moment. The galaxy games are extremely formative for me, that's for sure.
I can appreciate how both games were so good but I can appreciate the development makes a entire new game to fit all the leftovers ideas that just didn’t fit into the first game but the brilliant take a story and make it better than the first game just a little bit I found myself that first game story was kind depressing to me given that fact Rosalina looks depressed and sad in the first game.
Awesome video I fw this heavy
i love galaxy 2. its up there next to odyssey for me as best 3D marios. Sequels just never seem to get the recognition it deserves(galaxy 2, pokemon black2 white 2, zelda tears of the kingdom) and MANY people simply put it off simply because it's recycling things...but that doesnt mean its bad, it still innovates and brings great gameplay to the table. i loved all the sequels bc they ADD more an innovate!
So I'm always going to be one of Galaxy 1's defenders for its atmosphere and just how it made me "feel" like playing. Loneliness without being alone is something special and magical, and I think it makes me like 1 more than 2.
BUT.
...Galaxy 2 did eventually get me, and I had a ton of fun with it. I easily see it as a worthy successor, and in a lot of ways the superior game.
It didn't happen at first- I didn't quite jell with the happy-go-lucky attitude 2 was going for, and frankly... I didn't like the first few galaxies. They just weren't what enraptured me with 1, and I wasn't enjoying the gimmicks. I was kind of forcing myself to play through, just to see if something would grab me.
Then I got to Cosmic Cove, and it did just that. At first I thought "Oh, great". A giant slow water level that's not going to impress me." But... the colors, the atmosphere, the pacing... it felt like something out of Galaxy 1. AND THEN THE WATERFALLS FROZE. I was floored. It's so simple, but I loved it. It's like something I'd come up with to surprise myself. I had legitimate, capital F Fun with Cosmic Cove. And from then on... the game had me. I got what it was going for. The heart and atmosphere from 1 was still there, just... tucked away more, integrated in the levels at certain points. And the levels themselves I felt markedly improved from then on, but maybe that's just my perception.
2 is a great game that I ended up having a blast with. I just had to get there.
I'm a proponent of emergent storytelling, and I wouldn't say the storytelling is why I liked Galaxy 2 less. For me, it came down to two things. First of all, the map layout, and the number of stars to get in Galaxy 2 made the game feel quite a bit denser, tiring me out more quickly. Secondly, Galaxy 2 had a very different ratio of "sky" levels to "space" levels compared to the first game. In Galaxy 1, the "sky" levels were less common so they felt more unique. With a much smaller proportion of "space" levels, it felt like Galaxy 2 lost a lot of atmospheric appeal that the title implies. Granted, it's been a long time since I've played either game, so maybe I'd view Galaxy 2 more favorably now than I did then.
We apparently live in awful times where this masterpiece... somehow needs to be defended. Yeah, I also have a ton more nostalgia for the first game, I also like its aesthetic, I also appreciate that little, basic, cheesy optional easter egg side plot (which people consistently mistake for "the game's story"), but none of that makes the second game worse, let alone BAD.
At the end of the day, everyone in the whole Galaxy 2 hate bandwagon ends up ultimately using a "style over substance" argument to defend their stance... on a Mario game, of all things. No one denies that Galaxy 1's style is top tier... but there's much more to a mascot platforming video game than "the style" (call it atmosphere, "sToRy", ambience, or whatever), and it's not like Galaxy 2 is LACKING in those areas either, it just doesn't do it the same way as 1. I swear if Galaxy 1 didn't exist to compare and we only had 2, everyone would agree that this game's a masterpiece in terms of style as well. The internet's constant need to "compare" by glorifying one thing and deeming the other one garbage has made it uncommon to do the rational thing and enjoy both.
Well, that and it seems these days people love to only TALK about these games and watch content about them to reminisce about old times, rather than actually playing them themselves, which by default will favour "the style", as there's no way the gameplay will stick in your mind unless you actually play. I'm in the middle of replaying both of these lately, and I'd be straight up dishonest if I pretended Galaxy 1's slightly superior "style" makes me actually enjoy the full package more than Galaxy 2 with its still nice style and quite superior substance.
I've probably taken the exact opposite approach to keeping records of my past, where I record and keep basically everything, this doesn't seem like a problem until you realize I have several terabytes of videos on my pc. (And constantly run out of space.)
I love Galaxy 1's story better, but I feel significantly more cozy playing Galaxy 2 tbh.
Finally someone put my 14 year old thoughts into a video. I love the "car trip" angle, it's so true. And I love that you highlight the first level of World 5 and 6, so much yes dude. And I will still say Galaxy 1 is a stronger first time experience, but I have always said Galaxy 2 is just the better game.
Crazy that we live in a time where Super Mario Galaxy 2 needs defending
This guy makes such great arguments for games he loves... I'd hate to be a game that he hates (but I would SO watch that video)
HOW DOES THIS ONLY HAVE 5K VIEWS
This game has Yoshi, that automatically makes it better than Galaxy 1
I think I always preferred Galaxy 2 over the first game. I didn't beat Galaxy 1 until after I finished the second game, despite owning the first game since it released. They're both great games, though.
Wonderful video
Why do people keep doing this? Time and time again I keep seeing people say "It's not like what came before, therefore it's worse/straight up ass" They refuse to see the game for what it is or what it's trying to do, and instead criticise it for not being what they compare it to or what it "should" be.
I really liked this video, and appreciate the way you were able to really put Galaxy 2 in it's own light, and not the Shadow of Galaxy 1. Both games are amazing, and the have the same core concept. But both use it in their own unique ways, and that's what makes each game good.
Hopefully people stop doing this for not only this duology, but many other pieces of media.
Yep, I try my best to look at games on their own merit, instead of through the specter of a previous title (which I am obviously not perfect about); I've recently covered the Layton prequel trilogy, for example, which often faces a similar genre of criticism as Galaxy 2, but never really explains why the prequel trilogy being different from the original trilogy is a bad thing.
11:28 I understood that reference!
Well it helps that mario galaxy 2 was originally meant to be a dlc but this was during a time when dlc espiecially for nintendo was uncoomon so they switched development into a full on sequel
Galaxy 2 is such a hard replay. You really notice how long it takes between collecting a star and getting back in the game
THANK YOU
i dont have as much of a substantial thing to say as i did as a comment on the first part. but i'll give it was at first reflexivly rolled my eyes at the walkup to the powerpiont presentation,but then realized whaf was happening. its a blatant showcase of the blatant and shallow seeming reuse of a joke in a direct sequel that has a more simple but still striking meaning behind it.
its a microcosm of the entire point of the video baked into a metatextual example of its very point.
its very small, and ill admit im reading into it perhaps farther than authorial intent. but incredibly well done subtle detail i found.
You're not actually overthinking it! That joke (and the two sections following it) were very intentional examples of how familiar elements can take on a whole different meaning in a new context. The speech about reuse reads differently now that it's the second time you've heard it (if you've watched my Galaxy 1 video).
People hate galaxy 2? It’s my favorite :)
Really feels like i robbed nintendo for getting both games in the nintendo selects edition for 25€ each
wierd title for one of the most beloved games in the mario series
When people say Galaxy 2 doesn't have something like Rosalina's storybook, they are not saying they want the exact same thing again. They don't mean they want to see another storybook about a mysterious character with a deep and depressing backstory.
What they mean is that they want SOMEthing that is memorable, unique and adds flavor to the world. But more importantly, something that leaves an impact. The storybook was special, not just because it added context to Rosalina's character, but also because there's nothing like it in any other Mario game.
Galaxy 2 didn't need another sad story. The game has its own identity from the first one and that's fine. But it needed something that sticks with you after playing the game.
What exactly that something is, well, there's no single answer to it.
Nintendo doesn't wanna put focus on any stories in their Mario games anymore because they think it would keep people from getting into the action. But there are ways to tell stories without hindering the player.
Something that is severely underused in Mario games is visual storytelling. Galaxy 2 does actually have a good example of this. Early on you defeat Bowser Jr.'s giant clown robot. And then later on you can see the remains of said robot littering a different level. Just by showing this detail, they are telling a hint of a story, or at least a hint of continuity, and they didn't need to stop you in your tracks, make you watch a cutscene or sit through dialog. The telltale signs of what happened can just be there for you to see and piece together.
It doesn't hurt the pacing, it doesn't get in the way of the level design, the player can appreciate it if they want or they can just ignore it and keep playing.
So why not go all out on that kind of storytelling? It may not leave the same kind of impact as a single continuous story, but at least it leaves the impression that you're not just jumping from one obstacle course to the next.
Why not have an area in the game where you see the remains of Bowser Jr's attempt to build other robots? Like a blackboard with some drawings of cool robots scribbled on it? Or some failed prototypes of a similar robot, to foreshadow an upcoming boss?
I mean the game already has planetoids that are only there to have a checkpoint flag on them, so why not put some decorative elements there, to imply there's more to this world than just "Bing Bing Wahoo"?
But the problem is that Nintendo seems to think these kinds of things are unnecessary. And sure, technically they are. The game wouldn't be broken without them or anything. Galaxy 1 wouldn't be broken without the storybook either. But aren't we glad it's there?
It adds so much flavor.
Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze is a very good example of this. The main "plot" is super simple, but there's so much visual storytelling all throughout the game that you always feel the game's world is alive. If you've never played the game, I highly recommend it. There's so much flavor everywhere.
I think when people talk about story, they often subconsciously think about the worldbuilding of a game as well. For example, Galaxy 2 has those little wooden guys as NPCs, but it never really does anything with them.
They just sort of exist in a few levels to.... stand there and say meaningless dialog, from what I recall. We don't see how they live, they don't really impact the game's world... They're just there.
They could've shown how maybe they are responsible for some of the weird wooden things in those galaxies, like the hollow log slide. Like, you just see them in the background, working on hollowing out a tree or something, I dunno.
One idea I just had is maybe they could've had a character that pops up a few times throughout the game, who has their own character arc. First they are just seen in the background, observing you. Then they do something questionable, like activating a trap to harm you. Then they straight up try to fight you in a boss battle. You defeat them of course. Then they are seen in the background somehwere, moping around, questioning their life choices. Then they show up in levels, making a deal with you. I dunno, maybe they can't get into their house, but if you find a way to open their door, they let you have the power star inside. Then later they actively help you in a stage. Maybe giving you a Life Mushroom or showing you the way to the goal.
And then, at the end, they suddenly save you from a great threat, showing they've fully redeemed themselves. And then they hang out on your Ship as a friend. That would be way more powerful than a random NPC showing up who you've maybe talked to once.
All of this could be done without being intrusive. You'd still just do the usual Mario Galaxy gameplay. But then you'd have a memorable character who adds to the game's identity. And you could give them a memorable personality and visual design as well.
It certainly would be more memorable than... I dunno, the minigame monkey.
Anyway, it's clear that Nintendo doesn't wanna focus that much on those things. And the game isn't incomplete because of it or anything. But if they're not willing to put much thought and work into this stuff, then they can't be surprised when people are like "Mario Galaxy 2? Oh yeah, I played that game. I don't remember anything about it, though..."
I've been watching your videos for the last couple of days. Though I don't always agree with what it is that you are saying, consider me a new fan.
One small thing regarding emergent stories; I'd really suggest taking a look at the Fire Emblem franchise. They often have very bad plots, but the whole premise behind their design philosophy is on emergent stories, especially the old ones. You should check them out.
loved the video!
I think instead of reusing Galaxy 1’s plot, Galaxy 2 should’ve had Tatanga from Mario Land 1 as the main villain. It would’ve made sense with him being an alien
doesnt matter this is a mario gam yall lmao
the story is a bonus
In defense of a game that’s rated 97 on Metacritic
the sad state of reality
IMO SMG1 is superior over SMG2 in due part because the story is more controlled, it's more of an open ended game. So with Starship mario and the worldmap, it personally takes me out of the experience, even if when I replay SMG1, I grind one galaxy and dont move on till it's done which is effectively the same thing as SMG2 however knowing I can pick a way different stage and the presentation of SMG1 is just superior. I enjoyed SMG2 as a kid but I will rarely boot it up today
This is the best game of all time
I didn't realize this game needed defending
imagine having to "defend" a game that has a 9/10 score on imdb
Just found your channel and am enjoying your essays. However, I largely disagree with your premise here.
Miyamoto has gone on record stating that he deliberately wanted the story to be as light and non-existent as possible. And people are generally pretty good at picking up on implicit storytelling. So the fact that most people agree that Galaxy 2 has almost nothing to tell means that either people’s impressions are correct or the game failed on that front. I’d argue the former.
As for the argument about storytelling progression, (23:20), I find the argument unconvincing. Sure, someone who is uninterested in the entire story will not feel the same tension as someone who is. But that is a moot point because in that scenario, no aspect of the story is worth measuring and the discussion ends prematurely. While I do agree that there are many forms of storytelling, it is undeniable that Galaxy 2’s plot does not change for the entirety of the game. For example, companions who join the ship have 1 line of dialogue that never changes. Compare that so Galaxy 1, where Luigi helps look for stars, the toads join you on missions and the green lumas you rescue unlock the secret levels.
I do agree that not every Mario game needs an epic plot with hidden backstories. But it really does, like you said, feel like the plot beats are more there as an obligation.
As a hardline member of the "Galaxy 1 is better" team, this video is by far the best argument for Galaxy 2's merits in story that I have ever seen. However, for me, a lot of Galaxy 2's roadtrip storyline...is just not that different from every single non-Galaxy 1 Mario game. You argue that if Galaxy 2 were to try and be more atmospheric that it would be even more derivative of Galaxy 1, but I would argue that it would make Galaxy 2 stand out more in the broader context of the series. Galaxy 1 and 2 are not two games in their own franchise. They're Mario games. As such, Galaxy 2's "the levels are the narrative" narrative applies to almost every Mario game that isn't Galaxy 1. What makes Galaxy 2's transition from grass world to black hole world any more narratively compelling than, say, New Super Mario Bros.'s progression from world 1 to world 8? There is a good argument brought up in how the game has you recruit characters from all across the game, but when most of those characters have very little to add other than being a decoration, I don't find that aspect of the game compelling. To me Odyssey does everything Galaxy 2 was trying to do much better, as it contextualizes the roadtrip in a much more concrete way while also having a narrative that has stakes and emotional points.
To me, Galaxy 1 is the closest the Mario series has ever gotten to experimental, alternative art, as pretentious as that may sound. You talk about how the fact that the last galaxy you visit before the final level could be anything as a negative, but to me that is a positive. Galaxy 1 isn't interested in the standard progression narrative that every other mainline Mario game is, it presents you with the vastness of space and asks you to get your own meaning out of it. To me, Galaxy 1 is the Majora's Mask of the Mario series, a game deeply focused on an isolating atmosphere. Galaxy 2 is the Twilight Princess. It has its own atmosphere and story, but it is fixated on the past in a way that seems more out of fear of upsetting an arbitrary idea of what a Mario game "should be" than any sort of celebration. When I play Galaxy 2, it's hard not to think of where the Mario series went directly after this. Galaxy 1 came out in the same year as Super Paper Mario, and the Paper Mario game to follow up Galaxy 2 was Sticker Star. To me, Galaxy 2 is the start of the bland era of Mario, moreso than any NSMB game. When I replay Galaxy 1, I am taken aback by how cinematic the game is, it feels like a culmination of everything the series had been buliding up to, and it still feels modern today in 2024. When I play Galaxy 2, I just want to play 3D world or any other linear 3D Mario with good level design.
I would give Galaxy 2 more credit; I think it has considerably more interesting progression than an NSMB game. Each world is essentially us zooming out in space: W1 is an earth-like atmosphere, W2 is a solar system, W3 is a nebula, W4 is a single galaxy, W5 is a galaxy cluster, and W6 is a supermassive black hole at the supposed "center of the universe". I think there's a pretty clear progression there. Whereas, in NSMB games, you could interchange many of the worlds without feeling too confused: why does a beach world usually come before a forest world? Or an ice world after the desert one? NSMBU at one point lets you choose between two worlds at the same time (not to mention the various ways in all NSMB games to skip over worlds completely).
So while you're correct that Galaxy 2 is a much more standard Mario formula, I'd say it does that formula better than most Mario games one could point to.
How does a game that came out right before Mario’s 25th anniversary fear the past (I’m guessing out of fear of not appealing to anybody) rather than celebrating it? It’s not like every level reuses or remakes assets from previous Mario games, there’s still plenty of new mixed with the old (minus reusing a boss or two from Galaxy 1 lol).
An emergent story isn't really considered a story though. Ultimately, what people mean by story in the context of Galaxy is, for one, the Rosalina story and for another the overall both homely and lonely atmosphere and epic presentation of the bigger story beats.
As opposed to this Mario Galaxy 2 is just a journey through levels. Most galaxies just aren't worlds but simply platforming challenges.
So it just ends up being a game as opposed to Galaxy 1 - a game with a story.
did you hear the last monologue?
you guys call the game derivative but your criticism of it is when its different? dont you see the great irony in that?
@@user-bb2op9he1x
My criticism is that it has no story. It's just a game and that's kinda where it ends.
@@fluffynator6222 there is a story tho?
bowser captured peach, we gotta go save her
galaxy 1: bowser captured peach, we gotta go save her
its the same story really youre just lying, now i will admit galaxy one presents that story better but the story is really the same, infact like this video pointed out galaxy 2 carries its story through some levels unlike galaxy 1 where it rarely happens, unless youre referring to the rosalina book thingy that i still dont really understand to this day like did she just leave her father? tf? anyways if youre talking about it then that has nothing to do with the story, thats a character backstory, its neat but it doesnt really further the plot, there is a reason for why its optional
@@user-bb2op9he1x
It's still part of the story, being optional doesn't change that. It's why people say that Galaxy 1 has the better story.
@@fluffynator6222 ok? but its still peach is kidnapped, go save her
Bro should have asked to play on Coolmathgames
1:44 None other than an ad.
For me, i will always have a small sour taste in my mouth with SMG2, though by no real fault of itself. The first time i played it i had no concept of developers or publishers, so at first i had thought "hey wait, this gameplay is really different from that other game, its probably just a knock-off made to ride off the popularity of the first game" (somehow i had a vaguely intuitive sense of economics before learning about the existence of nintendo, do with that info what you will) and while i no longer think that way about SMG2, and can recognize it as a piece of art i can enjoy, there are many levels that still have that residual feeling of distain, which unfortunately are usually the better made ones like the first yoshi galaxy and basically any level with the cloud mushroom
Interesting, I didn't know they had a sequel to Super Mario Galaxy. However, I have a mild suspicion that it too involved travelling between different obstacle courses but in space. There was likely also an option and reward to actually beat said obstacle courses, as you can see, I practically already know the game.
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I think on some level, what people are criticizing with this game is that the emotional journey the game takes them on with its story is just not as interesting as Galaxy 1's, and that's at the core of why, for how much they dislike the game's supposed derivativeness of 1, they wish its story had taken more cues from it. There is nothing about 2's story that you couldn't have found in any new soup Mario game, and while 1's story is presented in a way less unique to the medium itself, the places it goes are so unprecedented for a Mario game that they end up more memorable and adored. If the argument is that Galaxy 2's story does exist, it's just peppy and fun, then the counterargument is that Mario does peppy and fun every weekday already, while tragedy, trauma and awe at the scale of the universe have so far been once-in-a-lifetime experiences from the mainline Mario games.
Love the video! Your argument about Galaxy 1’s dome placements and how some could be your final dome felt a bit like a nit pick and not a real criticism. Whichever way you play through the game you still get a sense of grandiose when you reach the end. I believe the atmosphere and how the music is used in 1 lends to why people think it’s the superior game, especially when it comes to story. Galaxy 1 always feels like the universe is at stake at all points of the game.
Also with the observatory starting with such low power, it makes you feel like you are really weak at the start of the game, and you must get stronger to complete/save peach and the universe.
I just watched this video, and while I enjoyed your analysis of the game's roadtrip journey, I don't think I usually see people talking about Galay 1's story as a strong point. Galaxy 1's sense of atmosphere was just very, very different from other Mario games. It had this strange sense of sad loneliness. A lot of the game felt quiet and empty. Galaxy 2, while certainly a good game, feels like a regular Mario game to me. It's very good at what it does, but what it does feels a lot more standard to me and that's why it never stood out to me as much.
think about it tho, if galaxy 2 was the exact same in that regard one of three possibilities would occur:
1- it does worse and now its regarded as the inferior version objectively
2- it does the same or of a similar execution/quality and now the existence of both of them make them stand out less
3- it does it better and now galaxy 1 is obsolete
in this current timeline galaxy 1 was able to still stand out because galaxy 2 went in a different direction, theyre now complimenting each other as oppose to making one of them obsolete
@@user-bb2op9he1x I would have to disagree on your second possibility - if both games captured the same emotions, then that wouldn't diminish them. That's still exclusive to the Galaxy subseries which is just two games. They'd still stand out from every other Mario game.
@@GhabulousGhoti it would be split 50/50, basic math, also if they did twice why wouldnt they do it a 3rd time? why not a 4th time? if theyre ok rehashing the same tone then they will just continue, no that they already broke it in 2, 3 isnt obliged to do one specific thing
@@user-bb2op9he1x So for starters, I don't believe you can quantify something as subjective as this with math.
Secondly, your point about a potential third game isn't really a good argument because they didn't make a third game. IMO, when making a direct sequel, I think it should capture something similar to its original title. It's as simple as that. Had Nintendo made something like 10 Galaxy sequels, then sure, maybe they'd have to mix it up. But they didn't. Instead we got a very unique game and a game that marketed itself as a direct sequel but failed to capture that same magic and felt too similar to other games in the greater franchise. If that doesn't bother you, then by all means you're entitled to that opinion. That was however the reason I didn't click with Galaxy 2 the same way.
@@GhabulousGhoti i mean why would look for stuff ti not like in a game i never really understood that mentality, instead just look for whats there thats actually fun, and also i completely disagree about the game being generic, it still feels like youre in outer space, and a lot of galaxies give you that chill and lonely feeling if you just stand there and listen, it is really a galaxy sequel youre just trying your damnest to not see that which is very odd