Tesla Semi: How much does it actually weigh? Pt.1
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- Опубликовано: 18 дек 2022
- #AllThingsEV #ElectricVehicles #tesla #ev
1:12 What we do know about the Tesla Semi
1:58 Two methodologies for estimating Tesla Semi weight
2:19 What is the Tesla Semi's range
3:18 How big is the Tesla Semi battery pack
4:05 How much does a Tesla Semi battery weigh
4:32 How much does the Tesla Semi weigh in total
5:24 What is the upper bounds of the Tesla Semi weight
6:36 How does the Tesla Semi weight compare to a diesel semi
7:28 What is the cost to go from point a to b
8:34 The cost of cargo in the Semi trailer matters
Engineering Explained video: • Does The Tesla Semi Ma...
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Weight of barriers: www.accentbarriers.com/2020/1...
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All Things EV 
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1:12 What we do know about the Tesla Semi
1:58 Two methodologies for estimating Tesla Semi weight
2:19 What is the Tesla Semi's range
3:18 How big is the Tesla Semi battery pack
4:05 How much does a Tesla Semi battery weigh
4:32 How much does the Tesla Semi weigh in total
5:24 What is the upper bounds of the Tesla Semi weight
6:36 How does the Tesla Semi weight compare to a diesel semi
7:28 What is the cost to go from point a to b
8:34 The cost of cargo in the Semi trailer matters
I hope you considered the weight of the diesel SEMI with all the fluids ..
They predicted the weight of the Tesla semi by the load it took on the 500 mile trip from Fremont to San Diego and Tesla said the total weight was 82k they had 6 concrete barriers on a flatbed they added that up with the weight of a flatbed and came up with about the same as a average semi now somewhere between 21k and 23k with the extra 2000 pound limit they gave all EV trucks I think it could carry the same as any semi on the road today.
They predicted the battery is about the same as the engine transmission rear end x 2 plus all the fluids.
Saw a video on this I'll try to find it. ruclips.net/video/OCVIU5lJCog/видео.html
this video will give you all the answers... ruclips.net/video/OCVIU5lJCog/видео.html
I sold semi trailers for over 30 years and can offer a couple of comments.
1. Although the GVW (Gross Vehicle Weight) is limited to 82k for EV rigs, there are sublimits for the axles. A diesel powered rig is limited to 80k GVW with axle sublimits of 12k steer axle, 17k for each drive axle, and 17k for each trailer axle. Since the extra 2k GVW allowed for EV rigs is due to the anticipated extra weight of the tractor, I would hypothesize that the additional 2k GVW allowance would be split between the steer axle and drive axles of the truck. Probably 12.5k for the steer axle and 17.75k for each drive axle, but I am just guessing at those.
2. The axle sublimits are important to be aware of because it is normal for a rig to reach the axle sublimit on one of the axles (usually the trailer axles or the drive axles) *before* the max 80k GVW is reached. Some rigs can get close to the 80k limit with a near perfectly loaded trailer for their rig, but usually they fall short by 1k to 2k due to an axle reaching its limit.
3. The empty weight of the rig doesn't necessarily matter so much to most shippers unless the truck has a condo cab sleeper, a big engine, and two 150gallon tanks with a long wheelbase. Until the last 5-10 years, it was the owner-operators that owned rigs like that while the trucking companies with hundreds of trucks stuck with more spartan sleeper cabs, moderate fuel capacities, and lighter weight trailers. However, since the driver shortage has become more acute, the trucking companies have become more liberal with their truck specs to make them more attractive to drivers. As a result, most of them have gained weight to some degree based upon each trucking company's decisions. In general, a fairly lightweight tandem sleeper cab truck would weigh in at around 18-19k or so. Adding a bigger sleeper, APU, longer wheelbase, bigger fuel tanks etc. and the truck could get up to 21k-22k. For reference, diesel fuel weighs 7lbs./gallon. Typically, there is an allocation of around 250 lbs. for a driver and his belongings.
4. There are plenty of loads that weigh far less than the rig could carry legally. In other words, they 'cube out' before they weigh out. We are talking about enclosed dry freight van trailers here. These shippers wouldn't really care how much the rig weighs since their load will fill up a 53' long trailer with as little as 20k of product. Think potato chips, empty can haulers, snack food, etc. Shippers that would be extremely sensitive to available payload capacity would be beverage haulers, battery haulers, canned goods, auto parts haulers, etc. A dry van trailer can be spec'd to maximize payload capacity in various ways, but you can expect a typical dry van to weigh in around 15k.
5. Flatbed trailers like the all aluminum one used in the Tesla promo video will typically weigh around 10k (as noted by Sean). There are lots of flatbed loads that are weight sensitive such as lumber, steel bar and rebar, coiled steel, etc.
6. I agree with the 6.5miles/gallon used as a general guide for diesel truck mileage. But, the terrain also makes a difference. It takes more fuel to cross the mountains than the plains and there is no 'regeneration' of fuel going down the other side as would be accomplished by the Tesla EV.
7. Diesel trucks require a lot of maintenance. The biggest costs are tires and brakes. There are no special G-rated (full size 18-wheelers use G-Rated tires) tires for EVs that have lower rolling resistance. However, about 10-12 years ago, all tire manufacturers had to begin offering lower rolling resistance tires to meet the California CARB rules in order to operate there. Now, low rolling resistance tires are pretty much ubiquitous on all fleets. I would expect an EV semi to save operators a lot of money on brakes, especially those that operate in mountainous areas. Normally, a set of brakes on a truck lasts around 100k or so depending on where it is operated.
8. I predict the ideal use for a EV truck is for food delivery to restaurants. These runs are generally multi-stop runs with shorter mileage that are primarily done at night while we are all asleep. As a result, restaurants that are in metropolitan areas require diesel rigs to shut down while they are unloading near residences due to the noise of an idling truck. These trailers usually have a lift gate on the rear of the trailer that is electrically powered by 2-4 batteries. I presume there would be a way to recharge those batteries or completely eliminate them by using the truck's drive batteries. The lift gate motor is a 12-volt motor, so some sort of electronic device would be needed to step the truck battery voltage down to a compatible current for the liftgate.
Just my 2 cents...
Super insightful. Thank you!
@@AllThingsEVyou should do a video just interviewing this guy. 👍
Another ideal use for a EV truck is for loading or unloading at container ports, where trucks usually sit, or move a little at a time. Electric propulsion would be much more efficient than diesel, the latter of which need to keep running to prevent clogging DPF’s. Air quality around ports would also improve even more than around other places diesel trucks usually congregate.
Thank you for putting the time and effort to write this up.
Thank you Greg. I love reading comprehensive material on topics the average person know little about. My initial prediction was similar to #8 multi stop shorter mileage. Also, for long hauls, after 8 hours there is a mandatory 30 minute break (which can charge the truck 70 percent or 350 miles). At 75 mph, 8 hours will be 600 miles. Charging during a 10 minute bathroom break should add 115 miles bringing the total to 615 miles before the 8 hour mark! This may not be so bad for long haulers. Curious to hear thoughts on the matter
150 gallons does not equal one full charge. You have to compare miles, so 6.5mpg is more accurate, also most large companies that would be using this should have pretty cheap electric rates, I would say closer to 10 cents a kwh. Its something like 25% the cost or maybe less, with only losing about 13.5% of the payload capacity. Over 100,000 miles its about 20,000 for the Tesla Semi and about 80,000 for everything else.
We used to run 10kw of power for months. It was probably 10 gallon per 30 hour ish. It generated 225kw every 10 gallon. If you scale it up the efficiency is even greater.
Imagine a big 200kw. 50 gallon per 3-4 days. If the generator runs at less than 70% the engine develops a wet stack so. When we didn't have a load of 180kw we would run a giant heater and waste the excess energy. It could be 100°f and were pumping more heat. 150kw per hour could charge multiple trucks. In the 3 day span. 50 gallon. Over a million watts
@@rustyudder wet stack?
Should calculate COST/MILE(or KM) Tesla: (1.7kwh/Mile) * cost / (charge efficiency)=1.7* $0.15/kwh / 90% = $0.28 /mile TO COMPARE Diesel truck (6.5 mile/gal): (0.154 Gal / mile) * ($5 / gal) = $0.77 / mile That is a BIG difference.
@@pablopicaro7649 The Efficiency is even higher than that because it will be DC charging. I think it will be closer to 95-98%
Can't wait to see one of these in person
It’s a beast!!!
Didn’t get a chance to read through all the comments, so this has probably been pointed out earlier, but since you are including the battery pack weight, which is so much a part of the overall weight of the Semi, you needed to use the average weight of the same fuel amount needed to go that distance as obviously the diesel fuel gets used up as you go and lowers the weight during the journey. Also you should not have just taken a average of that range, but used the specifications for the most popular regional carrier truck in the US for comparison purposes. Good news is pretty sure you are very close on the total vehicle weight of the Semi, although I think probably a bit high as Tesla would absolutely know the total weight was one of the most important factors in the design and probably optimized better than everyone is thinking.
a 24k pound day cab.
You also have to consider every single item required for a diesel drivetrain that isn't required for an EV.
There's a *fixation* on battery weight, but *nobody* is removing that.
Sean
I had similar thoughts, but went about the calculation in a different way.
I guestimated the difference in weight of power and drive systems in the Tesla, compared to a diesel truck.
.
For the Tesla.
Battery weight.
Model 3 LR pack using 2170 cells.
(NOT Model S with 18650, which is heavier)
481kg, 1060 lb (per PACK*)
4416 cells.
+/-82kWh
Truck needs 12 packs worth.
(984kWh) (12,720 lbs)
BUT a Semi needs the cells, NOT the 12 pack casings, or control electronics, cabling.
The CELLS weight 68 grams each.
4416x 0.068 = 300 kg
x 12 sets 3,600kg.
= 7,945lb (rounded UP 8,000lb)
ONE frame (Maybe 2? One horizontal, one vertical? But I assume they will be used for structure to some extent, saving weight?)
ONE set of power control electronics.
Call it 10,000lb?
....
Compared to Diesel units not needed in the Tesla?
(Let's assume the "tiny" motors + the 3 drive units weigh about the same as the Diesel rear axles and final drive which they replace? I think that's being kind to the diesel)
.
(Below, using average weighs from the internet where easily available)
Diesel motor. 2,800lb
Transmission.780lb
Fuel (320 gall) 2,100lb
That's +/- 5,700 lb.
.
Add "peripherals"
Radiator, hoses, fluid, oils, exhaust, emissions control, electrical, fuel *tanks* etc,
Then add the chassis (front beam?) To carry everything above.
Conservatively, 3,000lb?
I make that about 8,700lb?
.
Compared to the battery at 10,000lb?
.
Suddenly, we're well within the "2,000lb EV allowance"?
.
Even if we skew diesel-500 lb, Tesla+500 lb it's still close.
.
Now, look at the presentation.
They show an overlay of a diesel and the Tesla.
Not only is the Tesla shorter, with much less metal in the body, but the wheels and tyres are smaller.
That's MORE weight saved.
Almost heading for parity?
.
Of course, the only definitive answer is a tractor unit on the scales.
Good analysis
Thank you for this excellent break down. Yes, my expectation is that the 2000lb extra allowance should cover the weight difference.
Musk has said on multiple occasions that it has no loss of payload capacity which makes be think that it is only 2000lbs heavier then the diesel equivalent. Your right that most people don't understand how much weight can be striped out of a traditional semi. They are terribly engineered. It's all just a mess of random parts from different suppliers put together in a mess of hoses, cables and extra heavy steel brackets.
But as I mentioned in the video, the weight of trucks varies so much. What is he comparing it to? A 25,000 lb sleeper tractor? It’s not the same truck.
@Sean Mitchell - All Things EV Once autonomous driving is approved, it *is* the same truck. A self-driving truck doesn’t need a sleeper cab.
It isn't just fuel but the savings from repair and maintenance and the longer lifetime of EV trucks relative to diesel. Also reduced insurance and higher residual value of EV's relative to diesel class 8 big rigs.
Did anyone actually watch the event and listen?
Elon gave the weight during the delivery event. He said, "the weight would come in at the middle of the pack at around 17000lbs."
8.5 tons = 17,000 lbs. A diesel semi can carry up to 24 tons. Just wondering about your numbers
@@Liberty2358 I am very familiar with weights. I worked on Semis and trailers for eight years. The Tesla Semi is 17,000 pounds. subtract that and the weight of the trailer from 82,000 and you have the load capacity. I listened to the guy who made it. He said with his own mouth, in the presentation, the weight of the Tesla Semi would come in around 17,000 pounds. That's the reason I am confused by all the confusion surrounding the weight of the semi. Elon gave the weight. Which takes me back to my original question, "Did anyone actually watch the event and listen?"
@@marcusalexander5251 Thanks for you info. What is your source? A day cab Diesel semi is about 15,000 lb. The battery back for a 900 -1000 kwH battery (2170) is between 10,000 to13,000 lb. If you said is true then the Tesla Semi is only 4,000 lb without the battery pack. It seems really light.
Thanks for breaking out the fuel cost differences. Napkin math says a fleet could operate two EV semis for the cost of one diesel truck, which would make the whole "less weight" issue moot.
Not if you’re carrying heavy loads and need to make multiple trips and have to pay two drivers to haul the same amount of payload 🤷🏽♂️
Other considerations to take in account: 1- Semi rarely gets fully loaded to the max capacity. 2- You have to take in account the maintenence cost as well.
Research says that 90% of semi trucks in the US weigh in at 73.000 lbs and less
Meanwhile in Canada, put it on the front of a triaxle trailer and get 100,000 lb. Or the front of a B-double and get 140,000 lb. It certainly has the power to pull that.
Hopefully the cold loss won't be bad in the semi.
I would have assumed a rather lower mass for the battery (~11,000 lbs). 21700 packs are lighter.
Total mass around 22,000 lbs, since you also have to take into account the maximum permitted steering axle load of 12,000 lbs.
But the exact details will probably be revealed soon.
For a larg part of the distribution traffic, it is not the weight that is the limit, but the loading volume.
For example, if you think of the big retailers like Amazon, Walmart, Costco,... they only have relatively few products that really have mass and can be stacked compactly/high.
That's why there is also the prototype "Walmart-Supercube-Trailer" with 30% more space: "Walmart doesn't typically weight-out on deliveries, because of the type of freight we carry." - Andy Ellis, senior vice-president of supply chain and logistics for Walmart Canada
See my post elsewhere where I estimated the pack weight at 10,000lb (cell weight *is* below 8,000lb for 980 kWh)
The short haul truck would weigh less, due to smaller or non-existent sleepers, also though, regular semis are much longer, as Tesla is more European style, and longer is more weight, so it is not clear that your estimates might not be biased heavy. Also on cost, electric trucks will have much lower maintenance costs, likely larger than the fuel savings on an annualized basis, possibly will have longer lifetimes also, so amortizing the cost over more years.
There are a lot of LTE carriers Which means less than Load, but the possibility of heavy haul is also an interesting possibility. Then the question becomes what is the max load capacity of the Tesla. I have a friend that goes from the port of Tacoma to Moses lake wa, but it’s all heavy haul. That company would be ideal based on the 3x power improvement alone.
We talk about 80,000 lbs but it’s more complicated as a rule of thumb it’s 20,000 per Axel and 12,000 for the steers. So heavy haul trailers have more axles and none of those axles can weigh more than 20k.
It should also be noted why we have this rule. Damage to roads. If I were DOT or tesla I would want to do a test on the tesla to see if they do more or less Damage to the roads due to acceleration? There is a possibility they do less damage because the motion is not as jerky. We still have a lot to learn. I wish Tesla was not being so secretive about the weight, but think this might not be their desire battery pack.
From Tesla 2021 Impact Report: " Payload equal to a diesel truck " " With both the U.S. and E.U. having approved higher weight allowances for electric heavy-duty trucks, we expect
the payload to be at least as high as it would be for a diesel truck. In the E.U., electric semi trucks are allowed to
be 2 tons (~4,400 pounds) heavier than diesel equivalents, and in the U.S. the allowance is 0.9 tons (2,000
pounds). "
From Tesla Q3 2022 Earnings about Tesla Semi:
Zachary Kirkhorn: " No sacrifice to cargo capacity."
Elon Musk: " Yeah, exactly, very important, no sacrifice to cargo capacity, 500-mile range."
It makes no sense for any company to buy semitruck, that can not carry the same cargo as the rest of the fleet. Such a truck would cause logistical nightmares. It would be much better for Tesla to offer a semi with lower range to make it light enough, so it can carry standardized loads. Tesla that owns more than 300 semis is fully aware of that.
Key question is what truck are they comparing it to? Unlikely a 10k lb truck.
@@AllThingsEV It doesn't matter how much the semi weighs as long as it can carry standardized load. Making semitruck lighter doesn't bring you any real benefits, because if you want efficient logistics, cargo must be standardized as much as possible. In the warehouse they do not know which truck will come to pick up the load. It can be Freightliner, Mack, Volvo... It can be new truck or old.
Tesla would go an extra mile ( lighter materials, smaller battery etc. ) to lighten the truck to meet the standardized cargo requirement. But it would make no sense to go an extra mile to make it any lighter.
I've watched couple of videos about Tesla Semi tractor weight, one thing is for certain. If Tesla Semi had been even 2000-3000lb heavier than its diesel counterparts Elon Musk and Tesla would have proudly announced it.
Why calculate with the specs of a 18650 cell when the semi would be using 2170 cells?
In before some long haul trucker claims that EV trucks are bad because he drives 1200 miles per day uphill in the snow against a headwind
And never comes down?
Without ever stopping to pee.
Or eat. Or rest.
It's just like comparing the cars, fuel wise. If you drive your tractor a LOT but within the tesla range daily.... you will save a LOT of money in fuel vs. the diesel. You could even make your own fuel depot if you are insane enough, cant quite do that with diesel, no matter how large the company. (drill/extract/transport/refine/transport/fill)
Perhaps one reason that Tesla decided not to include a "sleeper" in the Tesla Semi is that they are aiming at eliminating the driver through autonomous driving (no human driver). Also, with Tesla Semi's quick acceleration, and excellent hill climbing ability, it will always deliver it's load to it's destination faster than a diesel power train. Thus it will be able to deliver significantly more payload trips in a shorter amount of time and at a lower cost per mile. Therefore the Tesla Semi has the competition beat in several dimensions.🤣
I'm going to take issue with two of your assumptions in this video.
1. Assuming logistics companies pay $0.25/kWh for electricity.
There are four levels of electric service in the us: residential (homes), commercial (stores, malls, etc), industrial (factories, etc) and transportation (public transport).
The average prices per kWh* for the US are:
Residential: $0.1632
Commercial: $0.1345
Industrial: $0.934
Transportation: $0.1248
A company like PepsiCo would most likely be getting an industrial rate.
Initially, they'll be running their semis in California where prices are higher - $0.1964 for industrial.
2. Your assumption that the value of the cargo matters. I think you'll find that density matters more. For example, shipping Doritos, you'll fill the trailer lomg before you hit the weight limit. So tare weight doesn't matter. But shipping beverages is a different matter.
*source US EIA.
If I want 6" PIR insulation delivered which I had sent to me, with trailer volume of 80m3 (2825-ft2), it was filled so tightly that there was just enought room for the jointing tape. My point is why does everybody fixate on the weight because the insulation I had delivered only wighed in at only 2560 Kg (5644-lbs). Not all loads are going to be at max to near max wieght, In Europe haulage is quoted on a pallet volume as much as wieght. Am I missing something?
Apparently there is a market for tractors weighing between 10 000- 25 000 lbs. It seems to me then, that the total payload not always is the determining factor.
It's almost as if the weight of this truck made any economic sense Tesla would have happily released the numbers themselves 😆
It's almost as if you haven't looked at the data and worked it out?
I have, is very close to the same weight.
I was a power generator equipment repairer. Power plants are very efficient but even a giant diesel power generator will be more efficient. It'll run at the precise rpm to generate 3phase 60hz, or 50 if you wanted. Most of the time we can't run the most efficient options for space and logistical reasons. So we use waste banks. If instead we ran at recommend and dumped excess into batteries we'd have all of it.
NOT really, the very best diesel engine is about 55% efficient when new and perfect and generator around 98% = 53% at the very most with everything perfect. That almost never happens so 40% is more reality a 'best'
I have a question and it's a concern over our bridges and our bypasses but mainly are suspended bridges and that is with all this extra weight how will this affect these bridges ? Now normally with traffic flowing back and forth over highways and cross our bridges and our bypasses that weight might not be that significant or mean much , but what happens when traffic backs up especially on a long suspended bridge and you have multiple tractor-trailers that will be electric and electric vehicles and you start adding up all of that extra weight sitting on those overpasses and bridges for a period of time and over a period of years will this affect the structural integrity of the structures ? And also with electric powered semi trucks that are fully loaded how much of that torque is being transferred to the structure of those bridges and overpasses and does that put a load on the structure ? Where a conventional truck or a car the power in the torque comes in very very gradual , whereas the electric vehicle the torque is being applied a lot harsher to the rear wheels and being transferred to the surface and once again I'm looking at a backed up traffic scenario on these overpasses and bridges if you had all electric vehicles sitting on these structures at the same time what would be the impact ? Maybe I'm just being overcautious or over concerned but did anyone really consider what I'm trying to say or get my viewpoint across about the safety of the structures ? Because just like you would take a piece of metal and bend it back and forth over a period of time the metal become fatigue and fail and I have a concern about the same with these bridges and overpasses with all the extra weight and the torque that is going to be applied to these structures over a period of time are they going to fail collapse eventuallyn ? Hopefully understand what I'm trying to say maybe you can answer this please let me know I would be very interested to know if anyone ever took this matter and thought about it ?
One thing to note is that the $750 diesel cost will get you around 1000 mile range at least considering a 6.5mpg, while the Tesla will get you 500 at most. And prices at superchargers can be as high as $0.50 potentially making the cost per mile driven actually not that far apart.We'll not factor life cycle analysis to consider battery replacement vs. engine overhaul. The really sad part is that for all the good that could actually be done by the Tesla semi, the way they are handling the selling points is at the very least idiotic, but hey, they did manage to try 3d modeled CAD cup holders and get the driver away from those pesky toll booth operators, and definitely away from police breathalyzers! Gotta keep 'em rollin'!
Instead of hypothetical speculation, you could also get a photo of a Pepsi Tesla truck showing the legal payload limits of the truck. That will tell you all you need. Cheers.
My estimate of the weight of the Tesla semi tractor is between 23,000 and 25,000 pounds. While that is definitely heavier than an equivalent 500 mile range diesel day cab, it’s not excessively so. (The Tesla semi is currently not configured as a sleeper cab.) fuel capacity for a 3 axle day cab truck will range from as low as 50 gallons up to probably a maximum of 300 gallons. For a day cab running a 500 mile range, you can expect a fuel capacity ranging between 75 to 150 gallons. So consumable fuel weights run between 525 to 1050 pounds for a day cab. When we are talking about diesel semi truck weights, we must add the fuel weights. There is no weight change for an electric semi for its fuel (electrical charge) capacity, as no change in weight occurs from a fully charged weight to a fully discharged weight.
The example of the Tesla semi hauling 11 Jersy barriers on a flatbed trailer weighing in at 81,000 pounds allow us to work backward from the gross weight to an approximate weight for the Tesla semi. The 10 foot barriers come in at around 4,000 pounds each. There were 11 of them on the trailer. That makes for 44,000 pounds. The trailer itself weighs around 10,000 pounds empty. So the total weight of the trailer and payload adds up to approximately 54,000 pounds. Subtract that from 81,000 pounds, that leaves you with a semi tractor weight of 27,000 pounds. A bit more than my 23,000 to 25,000 weight estimate.
It was never stated that the Semi with jersy barriers had 81k pounds weight. The Semi in the video(500miles) that had total mass over 81k lbs didn't have open bed trailer.
A bit too low. Rather 27-29K lbs is my guess. A eletric Volvo FH cabover truck have been released in Europe these days, it got a weight of 27.000 lbs including a 900kwh 12.000 lbs battery giving a reach of 300 miles fully loaded at 100.000 lbs. The diesel version is at 23.000 lb
@@Rimrock300
I'll bet the electric Volvo had substantially the same (heavy) chassis as the diesel on which it's based?
Then there's the renowned Tesla system efficiency, which would reduce weight.
@@rogerstarkey5390 It has the orginal chassis. So far it's a smaller company in Switzerland that do convert these Volvos to fully eletric. Guess when Volvo comes to the point they themselves are ready to manufacture them as eletric they might get the weight of the chassis even a bit lower than the diesel version. The weight of the chassis have been gradually lowered through the years, guess there is not conciderable gains there to find compered to the weight of the batteries themselves. Naturally designing and buliding a eletric truck from bottom, as Tesla, is the optimum. Will be exiting to see where they end up weight vise
What percentage of semis on the road carry a full load ? The question should be, if the Tesla semi can only haul 75% of what a diesel semi can haul, is there a market for the Tesla semi ?
I have read that less than 20% of trucks carry full load. But it would be great if somebody could inform on: Percentage of trucking that is long-haul, lang-haul typical load, shorter haul typical load
@@pierre.a.larsen Yes, IMO these are the most important factors, rather than focusing on worst case scenarios.
It can carry a full load!
Great video, you put in a lot of work there. Biggest question I would have is why would Tesla choose to not include the most important stat when dealing with semi trucks and that is the cargo weight, they gave the total weight of the truck but not the cargo, or the semi's actual weight, will be very interesting when someone gets access to the truck and releases that information.
Precisely!
And that is why this story isn’t worthy of multiple videos. One number - the payload and end all doubt. End of story. (Well, I guess the cost/availability of charging station is worthy of a video.)
To keep everyone talking about it. They already have years of order backlog. They don't need to give away the numbers just yet. Once they ramp production up to 50k a year they will release the data showing it has no loss of payload if it hasn't been leaked by then
Great video, need to also remember they need to fully load weight of fuel
Why would Tesla disclose the information about the weight of their semi? It would not be a selling point.
6:58 - But I believe it is the sleeper trucks that weigh up towards 25,000 pounds. The Tesla semi is definitely NOT a sleeper.
8:27 - You think Tesla is going to sell the Semi electricity at $0.26 per kWh when the superchargers are gouging us at $0.46 per kWh?? That $0.46 per kWh is just about what gasoline would cost.
9:48 - If we could just bribe one of the Pepsi/Frito Lay drivers to disconnect the load and put the thing on the scale. I'm guessing it is pretty high or Tesla would have come out and said what the weight is. It is disingenuous to hide it like this. The number will come out eventually.
Most customers will have the chargers installed at their depot where they will be buying electricity at commercial rates way less then $0.26/kWh or better yet adding solar to their massive roof and paying almost nothing to charge
@@saff226 Installing Solar system costs too, it is NOT FREE. The payback compared to commercial rates is at least 20 years most places.
@@pablopicaro7649 20 years! It's like 5 in Australia. Solar is crazy cheap to install.
Did you consider the weight of the 2022 model S pack? I can’t find a weight for it anywhere but my 2022 S is almost 400 lbs lighter than the Raven S. Most of that weight has to be in the battery
It's a completely new body. I think 1 panel is the same.
Is it reported anywhere how long the 500mile demo took, average speed... or is there a full length video of the entire trip? ...telemetry for the trip..?
I think Tesla's Semi's will take over the industry.
Niche product more likely
Taking over a part of the industry. Typically use by fleet owners, running fixed routes between major warehouse hubs, and more local transports less than 4-500 miles a day. The first years
6tons ? Is it still worth to have one? I would opt for a diesel truck using biodiesel instead.
A day cab is around 15k. Single axel
With a 53 ft van trailer looking at 25k total. Empty
Total allowed gross 66k
Total ft wt is 41k
double axel cab is around 20k. With total allowed is 80k
60k ft total
4:59 your total weight of semi truck math seems incorrect:
13770 + 73% = 23822 ???
13770/23822 = .578 -> this means the battery pack would account for 57.8% of the weight of the semi truck.
I assume that this is the correct calculation you’re looking for:
13770/0.27 = 52115
Which means that if the battery pack accounted for only 27%, this means the semi truck would be super heavy…
So that would actually be a giant upper bound, not a lower bound, as it’s very likely that the battery pack will account for a much higher percentage of the weight of this vehicle
You could have tried with the plywood numbers if you can't get the concrete numbers.
🤪
Tesla Semi Truck is calculated to weigh 28,000 pounds. Watch the Tesla Semi Truck release event, they say 82000 pounds for the tesla Semi Truck with the concrete barriers. The Semi Truck that made the 500 mile trip with a single charge was described to weigh 81,000 pounds
That estimate makes sense. A eletric Volvo FH tractor truck is to be delivered to a company in Scandinava now before Christmas, as one of the first in Europe. It's a Euro cabover, quite smaler and some lighter than the ordinary US cabs. The diesel version has a net weight of 23.000 lbs. The eletric version is at 27.000 lbs which includes a 900kwh battery at 12.000 lbs, giving a reach at about 300 miles fully loaded at 100.000 lbs.
Things that you haven't touched on yet. Mountain driving vs flat land driving.. Is trailer abox or refer unit? .. Is trailer refer a diesel or electric? Does trailer use semi battery or it's own battery's? 500 mile range, how long is a recharge going to take vs range of a diesel engine 2x200 gal tanks. One of you examples you use 150 gal tanks. How far can diesel take you on full fuel and how long does it take to refuel.
I agree on the size/weight of the barrier. The Tesla semi in the uphill demo was therefore carrying ~20 Tons ( 44,000Lbs ). Thats pretty good in comparison, its the same as the minimum a diesel semi would be expected to carry. Question is, why was this load not revealed at the launch? I genuinely don't understand this reluctance on Musks part, it just makes it difficult for everybody.... Any ideas...? 🤔
I think the main problem with the Tesla semi is going to be its idling time when it's charging. Its idling time will be affected by the capacity and availability of charging stations. This will result in an increase of varied turnaround times, that leads to increased costs and an increase in the complexity of managing these Semi's. Time will tell.
Why do you assume it was "reluctance"?
Maybe he (they) simply had misplaced faith in human nature to take their word supported by video that they "did it" as he said, "without resorting to tricks"
.
As for "idling time"
If you watched the event(?) You would know that they ran the full time, requiring a stop *for the driver*
Which as Dan Priestley commented "is required anyway by law".
He also noted "we did not charge the truck at that time".
.
Now, under NORMAL circumstances if the driver was going to continue to complete an 11 hour day. The truck would charge DURING that stop, receiving 60% in 30 minutes.
It's FREE CHARGE. ZERO extra time.
As witb all EVs, it charges *while the driver does something else*
.
Since the truck adds ±300 miles during a 30 minute (mandatory) stop, there would be ample range to complete the day with absolutely no time or distance penalty.
@@rogerstarkey5390 That's complete and utter garbage. You're trying to tell me that Musk didn't reveal the load in that demo because people wouldn't believe him and it might hurt his feels....??? 🤣 I mean I've heard some defences in my time but that takes the biscuit! There only TWO scenarios Musk might not reveal:
1) His semi was carrying an embarrassingly piss poor load.
2) He withheld that information for another reason.
By calculation it doesn't appear to be 1) so it must be 2). Why? To keep people guessing? To add mystery to the whole proceedings? To what possible end..?? I have my own pet theory as to why but I wanted to see if others could come up with any other plausible reason. Apparently not.
8:30 BAD calculation. Should calculate COST/MILE(or KM) Tesla: (1.7kwh/Mile) * cost / (charge efficiency)=1.7* $0.15/kwh / 90% = $0.28 /mile TO COMPARE Diesel truck (6.5 mile/gal): (0.154 Gal / mile) * ($5 / gal) = $0.77 / mile That is a BIG difference.
I driver a tractor big day cab kw it weighs just under 13000 pounds. It carries 175 gallons of diesel. I am good for 2 1/2 days local around Boston/ most of New England . You have to calculate that t2 1/2 days of diesel about 800 miles to be fair.
Other factors not listed in the video.
- How long does it take to recharge the batteries vs filling up with diesel fuel?
- How does an electric trucks range and operation cost change during winter months? An EV can lose over 69% of its battery power and efficiency when the air temperature goes below freezing (32 deg Fahrenheit)? This will get even more noticeable at temps beliw zero.
Wouldn't you be able to get the statistics from the regulatory body that gives a manufacturer final permission to proceed with production & sales? I forget the exact American terminology for this but Tesla only got theirs about a week before the Semi delivery event to Pepsi.
Really was disappointed no numbers given at the event. If it can handle a containerchassis, it needs to have a payload of 67200 lbs. Otherwise the terminaloperator is not allowed to load the containerchassis with a container.
Tesla will have to weight less than 15,000 lbs, it is impossible when the battery pack alone is between 10,000 to 13,000 lbs. I heard that Nichola semi are doing ok at Long Beach CA, I supposed they met the Payload capacity requirement.
How about putting the tractor on a scale?
From some of the stuff I’ve been reading and seeing I’m thinking the new battery pack is likely 9500 lbs-ish because of packaging efficiency
Would be great!
@@AllThingsEVonly reason I’m estimating that weight is because packaging efficiency of having one pack versus all these separate fittings, management, and housings for 10 packs and stuff, that’s my low end, but I don’t think it’s more than 10,000 pounds IMHO
That's it. Teslas old packs have a lot of extra steel in them.
Don't forget about the structure to contain the battery pack. It is likely to be made from heavy gage steel.
@@AllThingsEV
Would be logical
It's certainly not over 12,000, and very probat below 10,000.
Cargo at 49 thousand pounds + 48 foot trailer at 12 thousand pounds therefore for an all-up weight of 82 thousand pounds, the tractor must weigh around 21 thousand pounds
The fact they aren’t saying is a bit of a red flag to be honest.
You can add a 3rd axle 3rd axle. That will get you over the 80000 pounds of weight limit.
No, it just spreads the heavier load on trailer over more axles, to get below per axle weight limit.
The other side of the weight equation is what is not in the Tesla truck - turbo charged liquid cooled diesel engine and accessories, transmission, clutch assembly, drive shafts, fuel tanks, etc....
I did a rough calculation based on that. It's in the comments.
If you assume the Tesla drive units are the same weight as the drive axles on a diesel, the rest of the diesel drivetrain, plus the metal to carry it weighs about the same as the battery (which is nowhere near as heavy as some say)
I suspect they are 10% more efficient on battery pack weight due to pack design not batteries. In addition the three motors / power train may well weigh far less than the engine gear box....
The drive shafts and standard rear diffs would weigh about the same as the Tesla E-axles. The engine, gearbox , fuel system, exhaust system, and many more systems would all be weight removed.
I estimated all this in my post elsewhere.
500 miles:
Diesel @$5/gal = $385
Electrons @$0.07/kWh = $60
Should calculate COST/MILE(or KM) Tesla: (1.7kwh/Mile) * cost / (charge efficiency)=1.7* $0.15/kwh / 90% = $0.28 /mile TO COMPARE Diesel truck (6.5 mile/gal): (0.154 Gal / mile) * ($5 / gal) = $0.77 / mile That is a BIG difference.
Trucking companies three big ticket items. Cost of the semi, how much it can haul, & cost to operate & maintain. So why so much secrecy on the specs of the semi.
Great question
Competition
It's kind of funny when youtubers are doing their calculations based on model s battery pack and saying the semi is around 13,700lbs. but what they failed to realize was that model s battery pack has cover sheets and cross bins which makes up the total weight of model s.
So, multiplying 10 of those packs together is wrong.
I was hoping with such a snarky comment you’d at least contribute your own counter-estimate. I suppose I put too much hope in a random anonymous account trolling my video. I apologize.
@@AllThingsEV Waooh! It seems you are angry. Firstly, I'm not trolling you just pointing out that a model s battery pack has cross bim and battery covers which makes up the total weight of the pack. So, multiplying 10 of that together is wrong.
Secondly, I'm not random anonymous just because I'm using my company's Gmail account.
Not angry. Just providing an equally snarky response. Your estimate is welcomed.
@@AllThingsEV Well if you think my comment was offensive to you then that shows that you don't like to be told "you are wrong"
@@AllThingsEV Well that's good to know.
It's good to have good conversation
I'm going to die laughing when the actual (WAS:price, meant WEIGHT) of the tractor comes out and it's lower than everyone has estimated because the engineers knew it was a primary concern, and made it so...
Seeing as they’ve increased prices of their entire lineup I don’t think that’s a likely scenario.
@@AllThingsEV bad write on my part - I meant WEIGHT. lol
Perhaps a more important question to ask is "What HAS Tesla told us about the Tesla semi cargo capacity"? Shortly after the Tesla semi was announced Elon told us that the cargo capacity would be "close to that of a regular diesel semi". A few years after that he told us that its cargo capacity would be "at least as much as" a regular diesel semi. Until proven otherwise I will trust Elon's word. He was after all the one that told us it would do 500 miles loaded. And, in spite of all the naysayers, was correct.
He said hyperloop is as easy as tablehockey... and FSD is just around the corner... Na he talks a lot and likes to twist or hide the truth.
“Here comes the interesting part about the use cases and range of the Tesla Semi. PepsiCo's Frito-Lay division, which sells lightweight food, will use the Semi to haul food products for around 425 miles (684 kilometers). This is roughly in line with the driving range of 500 miles (804 kilometers) Tesla said the Semi can achieve-and demonstrated it-with a Gross Combination Weight (GCW) of 82,000 pounds (37,194 kilograms).
However, for heavier loads of sodas, PepsiCo's Tesla Semis will initially do shorter trips of around 100 miles (161 kilometers), O'Connell said. Eventually, the company will also use the Semis to haul beverages in the "400 to 500 mile range as well."
Why use a semi-truck that has a claimed range of 500 miles for trips of just 100-miles initially? PepsiCo's vice president did not elaborate. However, he revealed that at the end of a 425-mile (684-kilometer) trip carrying Frito-Lay products the Semi's battery has roughly 20 percent left, with a recharge taking around 35 to 45 minutes.”
Yeah so it really doesn’t do 500 miles with a heavy trailer, it’s just good for hauling around potato chips.
Also note that they got 15.4 million state grant for their trucks, so again Tesla is just getting tax payer money to sell shit.
Number 1 questions is how much it's better than rail
What are you talking about? Where does this 150 gallon fit in? If you are talking 150 gallons full tank then the regular diesel truck can travel 150gallons x 6.5mpg = 900 miles with full tank while Tesla semi uses 1,000kwh for only 500 miles if that is true anyway. For 500 miles regular diesel uses only 500miles: 6.5mpg=77 gallons not 150 gal not to mention that there are more efficient diesels out there that get 7 to 8 mpg so your comparison is incorrect.
I’m more curious about why the hell they don’t disclose it.
Probably subject to change up or down depending on real world tests
Development of battery technology is going fast forward. Just the 2-3 year extra time they got frominitial planned release in 2019-2020, haslikelky gottenthe weight of the battery packs down quite some.
People are worrying way too much. We know these are for day trips. We know it’s saving money. Maintenance lower. No gears…
Stop over complicating things. It’s an upgrade.. leave it at that
Love watching your contents but the intro music is too hard core for me.
Appreciate the feedback. Will take it into consideration.
This wouldn’t be an issue if Tesla would just give the weight ! Seems odd they won’t say … and nobody cares about the 0 to 60 time !!! They are purposely not saying … because anyone can get a truck to go 500 miles with enough battery !!! Let’s just say that truck is real heavy !
Does it matter really? Governments all over the world are pointing at it and saying "look Tesla make them now stop buying and making diesel trucks."
The elimination of a diesel engine, transmission and fuel tanks needs to figured into the weight calculation also.
I did.
There's a post in the thread.
There's much less in it than "people" think.
Tesla SEMI truck weight 17000lbs
Show me your calculation
@@AllThingsEV Elon gave the weight during the delivery event. He said, "the weight would come in at the middle of the pack at around 17000lbs." 🧐
I’m pretty sure he didn’t.
@@marcusalexander5251 never heard that
@@pablopicaro7649 Its there. Not interested enough to go back and watch the video again but I believe someone has the timeline that gives the mark when he says it.
You do know that Elon has stated that there is no weight penalty of the semi?
If thats so, the semi cant be more than 2000pound heavier(bev bonus) than ice trucks with a day cab👍🇳🇴
How many miles are actually driven with the full legal load? You'll be hard pressed to get anywhere close if you're hauling potato chips.
I miss the man who bring him's wife to see the whole fat tesla things
His's
Its just since 5years
I'm a truck driver specializing in hazmat and or luxury goods.
Simply put all roads across America, no vehicle should be over 80klbs except weight limits on bridges.lastly you may request a weight permit for the state you travel to.
The heavier the battery in the truck, the less you can carry to meet the handicap threshold of 80k.
Secondly the weight of the loaded Tesla Semi drastically changes due power demand for pulling heavier loads..
As for the diesel counter part. You'll just be traveling slower, but the fuel won't disappear in a matter of minutes unlike an electric truck.
Tesla can haul up to 20klbs with out drastic changes to battery demand. Anything more, you'll have companies like Pepsi broadcasting on live TV concerned about how Tesla can drive perfectly fine with potatoe chips being loaded and delivered, but can not do the sames distance with a truck filled with Pepsi beverages.
thos concrete members have been worked out be another youtuber to be about 49 thousand + pounds
They’re not giving any payload figures because it wont look good against an ICE truck.
false assumption
@@pablopicaro7649 what they don’t say speaks volumes. It’s not a false assumption, if the payload equaled or bettered ICE trucks Elon would have screamed it from the rooftops. Tesla Semi will be great for lighter larger goods. Heavy loads will be done by ICE.
very poor analysis....the advantages of the tesla SEMI is NOT just the fuel economy....other issues are: 1) HIGHER downhill security; 2) HIGHER velocity up&down hills; 3) LOWER time for maintenance; 4) (in the future) diesel up trucks cannot go into cities due to pollutions concerns...
Please send me a link to your analysis. Happy to review and provide technical feedback.
12,246 (kg)
a bit portly
It ain’t got no gas in it.
Haha
Driver might be a bit 'gassy' after a big bean burrito
The fact that they did not report such an important, but EASILY obtainable figure as they weight of truck + battery that will take 82,000lbs 500miles is suspect… any reasonable person has to admit that!
It’s SUPER IMPORTANT because max. legal total weight is 82,000lbs so 82,000 - truck weight - weight of battery to take 82,000lbs 500 miles equals how much payload you can haul.. that’s an ESSENTIAL metric to determine if this this is actually viable and can actually rival diesel.. and they don’t report it.. why??
The only reason explanation is that it’s not a good number for them!
A eletric Volvo FGH cabover truck have been released in Europe these days, it got a weight of 27.000 lbs including a 900kwh 12.000 lbs battery giving a reah of 300 miles fully loaded at 100.000 lbs. The diesel version is at 23.000 lbs. There are no big secrets here anymore I would say. 28-29.000 lbs for the Tesla truck is not very far off. 82k lbs - 30K truck (just to ad some extra) - 10K trailer = 42.000 lbs payload. Then taking in concideration 90% of US semi truck gross in at 73.000 lbs or less. It will typically be a truck for the fleet owners, running back and forth between larger warehouse hubs I guess, where charing stations are set up, not a trauck one would drive all over the place
@@Rimrock300 this sounds about right.. for a 1000kWh truck on a close to PAN FLAT route.. THE PROBLEM is with the 500miles route the route the Tesla semi took in demo with a 4000ft mountain pass.. in the desert with a/c blasting.. partially at night with lights on, screen etc. That route would likely double the energy necessary to 2000kWh.. which would mean an insane 20,000-30,000lb just for the battery.. as heavy as entire diesel truck! 😳
Something VERY WEIRD about that 500mile mountain run:
a) crazy 20-30,000lb battery is standard
b) special truck or extra batteries used for that trip on that route
c) Mercedes is right and Tesla have figured out how to break physical laws of nature 😀
About electric cost. 25c/kwh is pure dream, it's going to be free!!! EM planning 100% solar powered supercharging and roughly math would be the following:
For 1MW capable charger (1,000,000 Wats) we need 2000 commercial solar panels with maximum output of 500 Wats with cost about US $400.00 each. Total price is: 2.000 x $400.00 = US $800,000 Wait that's only work if system is 100% efficient but it's not, let's see if we can rich 80% in real conditions than we need (2,000 panels / 0.8) = 2,500 panels x $400.00 = US $ 1,000,000 and that's only Solar panels without anything else!!!
In addition, 1 Mega Wat charger will need at minimum 100 minutes (1Hr and 40 minutes) to charge from 0 - 100% state 1,000 KWH battery pack. For commercial environment we need much more power from charger let's say 2,5MW (2,500,000Wats) to minimize waiting time.
I use the same extrapolation for power as Sean for battery weight, (V3 Ch, 250KW for 100KWh BP= V St 2,500KW for 1,000KWh STBP) or Semi-Truck require 10 times power of V3 DC charger.
Charger of that capacity, we will need 2,5 x 2,500 = 6,250 panels (Eff. = 80%) = US $2,500,000 , only panels for only one 2,5MW capable DC charger!!!
Also keep in mind only few hours per day this system will be capable of producing max output when Sun is at the zenith with no clouds. Otherwise, number of panels must be increased accordingly plus huge battery pack for overnight charging's.
Idealistic picture from ST delivery event, where they show charging spot roof fully covered with solar panels as 100% Sun powered doesn't keep the water in the bucket, and here is why.
The roof which covering 32 parked cars can hold 300 commercial solar panels. Their maximum el. generation is 120 KW with 80% efficiency (300 x 500W x 0.8 = 120,000 Wats) and if the same charging spot has 32 tesla V3 chargers their power output is stunning 8,000KW or 8MW, (250KW x 32) in the best-case scenario, just few hours per day, solar panels can provide 1.5% (120KW / 8,000KW = 0.015 x 100%) of demanding power! So, necessary surface for solar panels related to demanding power, would be equivalent to 67 roofs.
Voila, "viva renewables" and God help us with them.
Best for all of you, Bob
Long distance over the road heavy loads can stay Diesel. All fully loaded up to 82000 lbs will do well electric within a three hundred completed day.
My semi weigh a tonne
Would love to see such an analysis for Nikolas hydrogen FCEV. They could have the potential to not only beat BEVs in long haul but also in short haul if their weight is significantly lower.
I think BEVs will dominate the truck and train industry. Simply because the advantage of regenerative breaking. For ships and airplanes, FCEV will dominate
What makes you think this truck is overwrite?
Have you worked it out?
(Yes, I have)
A Green New Deal grid will be around 60 cents/kwh = $22.8/gal diesel. 1000 kwh x .6= $600. Super charging now is 32 cent/kwh... = $320. A Diesel gets 6.5 mpg. 500/6.5=77 gallons ... x 5/gal= $385.
Diesel should be $3.46/gal with road tax of 53 cent/gallon if it matched the cost of gasoline in terms of energy. Gasoline is now $3/gal with 45 cent/gal tax. 1.15x more energy in Diesel. So, $3.46 x 77 =$266 for the 500 miles trip.
RE fuel can be 3 cents/kwh = $1.14/gal Diesel. A new tech gets 18 mpg...500/18=27 gallons x 1.14/gal= $31.6, say $32....This is what I am working on.
EVs will be ~10 time more costs/mile for fuel at current super charge costs, and 18+x more for GND grid. Just a friendly hint...investor beware...ALL EV will be bankrupt.
RE fuels are 10 to 20 times cheaper to make than to charge a battery...just a fact. See me on twitter @seaplaneguy.
Should calculate COST/MILE(or KM) Tesla: (1.7kwh/Mile) * cost / (charge efficiency)=1.7* $0.15/kwh / 90% = $0.28 /mile TO COMPARE Diesel truck (6.5 mile/gal): (0.154 Gal / mile) * ($5 / gal) = $0.77 / mile That is a BIG difference. (it does exclude fuel tax that should be on a cargo truck ).
Potato Chips weigh nothing and are cheap. Just sayin'....
You forgot the difference in cost to pay two drivers to do two trips instead of one if transporting heavy payload.
PepsiCo is who have the trucks say they get ~500miles hauling chips/air (full truck likely weighs WAY less than 82,000lbs).. but say hauling soda it’s more like 100miles 😳
They said the route for the sodas is 100 miles. That doesn't mean the semi lacks range, only the job is doing has a shorter route.
@@Tanstaaflitis PepsiCo rep not quoted saying why trucks carrying soda only go 100miles.. the author says it’s because of weight.. then there is a REALLY WEIRDLY constructed sentence partially quoted sentence.. that seems to quote PepsiCo rep as saying “then” [some time in future] ..no indication of how long in future (this truck is arriving 3yrs late) or if new tech or if this is just wishful thinking that EV trucks will carry soda in 400-500 mile range 🤷🏽♂️
“The company's Frito-Lay division sells lightweight food products, making it a good candidate for electric trucks, which have heavy batteries that could limit cargo capacity.
The Semis will haul Frito-Lay food products for around 425 miles (684 km), but for heavier loads of sodas, the trucks will initially do shorter trips of around 100 miles (160 km), O'Connell said. PepsiCo then will also use the Semis to haul beverages in the "400 to 500 mile range as well," O'Connell said.
"Dragging a trailer full of chips around is not the most intense, tough ask," said Oliver Dixon, senior analyst at consultancy Guidehouse.
"I still believe that Tesla has an awful lot to prove to the broader commercial vehicle marketplace," Dixon said, citing Tesla's unwillingness to offer information on payload and pricing.”
It doesn’t weigh anything, it’s vapor
How articulate. 😆
Elon Musk at World Cup with Jared Kushner .. WTF?? Musk is losing his mind.
Tesla SEMI truck weight 17000lbs
Show me your formula!
A eletric Volvo FH tractor truck is to be delivered to a company in Scandinava now before Christmas, as one of the first in Europe. It's a Euro cabover, quite samler and than the ordinary US cabs. The diesel version has a net weight of 23.000 lbs. The eletric version is at 27.000 lbs which includes a 900kwh battery at 12.000 lbs, giving a reach at about 300 miles fully loaded to 100.000 lbs. Depending on range, battery size, I will estimate a Tesla truck to 27-30.000 lbs