IDK, but I'll tell you this: that "Mars" at 1:00 or so gives me feelings that make me question my heterosexuality... ...Guess I'm the type to marry a digital piano with weighted and graded keys, but cheat on her with campy WWI-era tech.
I've always felt that the Webley automatics never quite got the recognition they deserved. So thanks for shedding further light on this interesting pistol!
I own one of these pistols. It was the property of Lt Col Thistlethwaite who served at Gallipoli. He contracted amoebic dysentery and spent the remainder of the war in a sanitarium, so survived. Excellent presentation, as always
The Royal Navy wanted this as only so many magazines per gun were issued (2?) so they wanted to be able to use loose rounds until magazine fire was necessary. In boarding or on service on land the idea was to reserve the magazine for a rush by defenders or assault by cavalry. Officers and Petty Officers would have the pistol in boarding but the sailors had cutlasses or rifles.
I carry revolvers nearly daily and my nephew drew a picture of me in which I was wearing a duster for some reason and his depiction of my gun looked like a Webley autoloading pistol. I keked.
I just want to thank you guys for all that you do. My whole life I’ve been obsessed with the history of small arms, particularly military small arms, and it makes me happy to see others are as well. For as long as I can remember I’ve wanted your RUclips channel to exist, I just didn’t know it.
I love the Mars. That insane magazine system. That rotating breech thingy. It's not a big handgun, it's a tiny naval artillery piece. I mean, don't get me wrong, I recognize that that is ridiculous and commercially nonsensical. I'm not saying it should have succeeded. I'm just saying I love it. :)
The Desert Eagle proves that the Mars Pistol could have been successful had Hugo Mars not been so caught up on making his gun so mechanically complicated that it requires a Swiss Watchmaker to clean it.
Fantastic job, guys. This is the best historic gun site I have come across on You Tube. Although your videos are lengthy, I really never want them to end. There's a compliment! My Father was in charge of Naval outdoor ranges at (UK) Whale Island/HMS Excellent, which you correctly quoted in the history of this Pistol. I never knew this one existed, so very interesting for me, thanks. Keep up the great work and keep away from too much shooting/penetration.
I've just come across this site. It came out of watching the Great War channel. I'm Canadian and love that period of our history, so ended up here curious about the Ross rifle and loved your historical as well as technical review of the rifle and you gave me a better insight as to what was going on with the rifle at the time. You guys do a wonderful job of reviewing these historical fire arms
Unbelievable as usual. You guys rock. Thank you for always doing a super fabulous job. I not only collect WW1 and WW2 firearms for the shooting but also the history and you guys always do a fantastic job with the history of each firearm.
Regarding Webley's ergonomics; while not the big .455, my M&P .32 model I found surprisingly to be one of the most comfortable AND accurate pistols in my collection, especially on moving targets (and I have a couple of hundred 20th century pocket pistols)! I can't explain it, it just feels GOOD! Incidentally, it's a shame you don't do a moving target test, as men didn't always stand still in WW1.
Why the heel rlease? Cause those pistols were worn in belt holsters that could take a lot of hits (the officer crawling out of the trenches, artillery craters, under the barbed wire, ecc...) before the weapon was draw. Imagine the guy finally drawing the pistol, and the magazine, that had been already unlocked by the button being pressed at some point, flying out of it.
One more reason - an old digger once told me that back then, the brass generally didn't want mags dumped onto the ground where they could get trampled and possibly destroyed, and a heel release means it pops out directly into your off-hand (which is operating the release) so you can quickly and easily pop it into a pocket for reloading later.
I notice a recurring theme with British weapons, the small arms committee was a nightmare to deal with, constantly changing it's mind on what it wants and being vague. Plus that obsession over controlling soldiers fire with only allowing one round at a time, I am almost surprised their machine guns were not required to have single shot capability.
Exbiditionary warfare makes you rather reliant on not running out of ammunition. Its not like the world beyond Europe and America was covered in railway lines at the time to deliver more when you needed it. Once you marched away from that ship or rail head you were on your own.
It’s important to remember with the Wembley Automatic is that the Admiralty wanted, so they lead the design (magazine cut off etc.) for the Admiralty’s tactical requirements in the early 1900’s, before the complete change in understanding of requirements that WW1 created. However, the Army had no tactical requirement for an automatic, pistols were really just for officers at the time, who were expected to provide their own, and certain troops who did not require / could not carry a rifle - machine gunners, drivers, MP’s etc. It’s only in the last 10 years that British doctrine has lead to pistols being issued to most troops. In terms of military weapons, the Admiralty were considered to be the experts in large calibration, longe range, big-bang making equipment, sometimes fitted into turrets etc., while the Army were considered to be the experts in weapons that could be carried by a single person. This meant small arms testing tended to be referred to the Brown Jobs.
While watching Mae's review I figured out how to fix the magazine spring that broke in half from my new (to me) Remington Model 8. I paused the video, ran to the workshop, used a half penny nail as a rivet, and ran back up to continue watching. Thanks Mae!
What is it with RLM fans and guns? Seems like antique guns and Mike Stoklasa are as hand in hand as Filthy Frank and youtube cancer. Just something I've always noticed.
The Webley fosberry I would love to have one of those what a strange idea for a semi auto pistol sounds good on paper ,the reliability of a webley with semi auto fire looks very complex though a nightmare for trench conditions
There was an interesting bit of history that helped explain my Great Uncle’s firearms collection over 20 rifles and shotguns but only 1 hand gun his service revolver. He would have bought most of them from 1901 to 1925 when he was in the Army.
I'm a Sergeant in the jail for a very large Police Department in N.E. Florida. Rough night, and I'm off work and can't sleep. I very much appreciate your late night releases of episodes. Definitely a great relaxation.
I hate you....No not really....But now I'm going to have to burn up the phone lines, so to speak, and find out which of my family friends/kin has the one and only Webley Self Loader M1 N, that I've ever seen with my own eyes up close and personal, in their gun vaults. Back around the early 1970s I had the pleasure of handling, but not shooting, an example that was brought back to the States after the end of WWI....I just can't recall, for the life of me, who owned it. I do recall that it was in pristine condition and was part of a collection of WWI and WWII pistols and rifles that had been "liberated" or purchased by a Grandfather who served in both wars....I just can't remember whose Grandfather it was! Excellent video as usual. You guys are the best! Keep 'em comin'!!!
The mag release is on the heel because soldiers weren't just dumping empty mags all over the place. You would grab, stow the empty and then insert a freshy.
Love your work, love the tshirts. Thank you. I know you are focusing on guns used in the war but I was hoping at some point you would get to other weapons of that time or other you just find interesting. If possible, I would suggest the Swedish mauser and the Schmidt Rubin.
It’s long gone, but I used to have some period trade literature talking about heel release magazine catches. I don’t remember it all, but apparently a lot of pistol companies and militaries figured that if your hand was going to be there to catch the empty mag, why not have that hand do the release work as well. Also there was a belief that thumb releases by the trigger were more prone to accidental release of the mag. I’ll contact the collector I sold all that to, and see if I can track it down.
Interestingly the glock actually does lock the barrel into the ejection port too and the tilting barrel works with an angled wedge. So who knows maybe there's some lineage.
When will we get a video about the U.S. Springfield? I heard it was basically a copy of the mauser , but didn't surpass it.(I heard it is not as good as the Mauser) I also heard there was a legal battle Mauser had with Springfield where they wanted royalties for the copy. I want to see how it fairs against a Mauser and listen to the... drama behind the U.S. company had about paying money to Germany, during Ww1 was going on. I think that would make a fascinating story to hear about it all regarding this gun. (It would be ironic if the p-17 rifle (American Lee Enfield) turns out to be better than the Springfield, according to you guys haha)
This is the Wembley fosberry for sure the cartridge couldn’t be beefed up to operate the mechanism which led to an inadequate cycle of the mechanism it was a job to cycle it by hand
Why the complaint about the number of rounds? Colt 1911 also carried 7 rounds in its magazine and its grip is not that much smaller.... Its not a small round.
In practice, "dum-dum" is simply an archaic name for hollow-point slugs, or alternatively, for soft-point slugs. There's nothing "explosive" about it, unless you mean frangible ammunition, which is virtually never used in combat scenarios because it simply doesn't offer any real advantage over either hollow/soft-points or FMJ.
We apply Rule .303 , quote from Breacker Morant, Aussie film, book is called Scapegoats of Empire, and was the reason Colonial Troops were not Court Martiled by British Authorties in either world war.
I'm well aware how the colloquialism developed. That's pretty unrelated to the argument except when you consider that the Dum Dum arsenal was only notable for the first iterations of both SJP and JHP ammunition used by the British.
I can't understand why the British wanted the ability to single load a pistol. I understand that there was a (dated) school of thought with rifles that advocated that rifles should be fired at once, loaded singularly so that the unit could fire again as a whole. (The good old musket days.). Was there some corresponding theory for pistols? I've always thought that they were self defense weapons and not anything you'd be firing on command in a group like a rifle. It's so weird, it's driving me nuts. Any theories on this?
The powers that be were paranoid about soldiers wasting ammo, it was the same with the rifles, i guess it boils down to the fact that most of the higher ranks were old single shot trained.
Is the 1895 becoming the next lee enfield/m1911 in that people will ask for it and you might tease us about it but it's not coming for a while but will be beautiful production quality?
PPK418 To be honest we end up holding off on those episodes most of the time because a lot of pieces get sent to us from viewers and those we want to get out the door, back to the owners as soon as possible.
I had a Webley ,455 sa 1913 pistol, 8000 were made but failed the mud test for the trenches and were issued to the RN instead. Mine was a mint specimen very slick and smooth in its action vulcanite grips one of the first composites Sold it after 5 years a mistake I regret See Webley story for more Info
Why a heel release,? So you don't drop the magazine by accident! Stop thinking modern Hollywood and speed shooting. An officer should be directing not fighting, so shouldn't empty the magazine that fast. When it comes to changing the magazine, you have a gaurded release, but still quickly.
Yeah. Mind that those pistols were worn in belt holsters that could take a lot of hits (the officer crawling out of the trenches, artillery craters, under the barbed wire, ecc...) before the weapon was draw. Imagine the guy finally drawing the pistol, and the magazine, that had been already unlocked by the button being pressed at some point, flying out of it.
actually putting the release close to where the mag comes out makes it clear to identify. For someone not familiar with pistols about 1915 might want to push the button to release the slide or to remove savety and boom... magazine falls out.
Another well done episode. Your project is going to be an often cited research source for years to come. It is interesting to me that the British cavalry had no interest or input considering g how influential the American cavalry was in regards to the 1911. Also I'm surprised the colonial armies did not take more of an interest. Also were there ever any experimental efforts at creating a sub machine gun in the British 45 auto cartridge? I know the Brit's officially did not like "gangster guns" but I could imagine someone working on it and trying vainly to change their mind.
(fyi, coup de grâce - mercy blow) You have to remember, Britain was a naval empire, even if they did have extensive cavalry forces; they did favour dragoons - in name, if not in practice. The saber was the main weapon when mounted, and the carbine when dismounted, shooting on the move was considered too inaccurate to be worthwhile, the handgun was more a badge of rank than a combat weapon.
Cavalry had no use for pistols except as an officer's personal weapon. The Trooper used the sabre in the attack or the carbine as mounted infantry. The horse did not need any extra weight and the trooper needed a carbine. Royal Horse Artillery was different. The Gunner needed both hands to serve his gun and a carbine was an encumbrance. A pistol would serve him as well as an officer as a sidearm to use as a last resort at close range. Otherwise his weapon was his gun.
Actualy the best cavlary weapon is the lance. Most British Mounted troops were Dragoons, that is mounted troops BUT who dismount and fight as Infantary.
My old Yeomanry Regiment was trained principally as mounted infantry and in reconnaissance as had been their role in the South African War. The Regular Regiments were trained in reconnaissance and in the cavalry assault as well as mounted infantry. When they went to France in 1914 as part of the BEF they were brigaded in the 7th Cavalry Brigade of the 3rd Cavalry Division with regular cavalry and had to be trained in the cavalry assault role to be able to act in the same way. BTW we had (and have) lances but they were ceremonial only for the regiment. The sabre was the assault weapon of all ranks.I believe that my Regiment was still using the more useful 1899 Pattern sabre and not the one shot wonder 1908 Pattern. You can see some of them at www.paoyeomanry.co.uk/PM/LYWW1.htm some of the photographs lower down show their sabres.
umm hadnt seen your mk6 episode but I do have one made by enfield! rare only about 22k made, and after conversions to 45acp who knows how many are left and in 455.
Hmmm, a thought on all of those heel magazine releases of that era; was it because the purchasing authorities and/or the manufactures did not trust the magazines to fall out of the guns by their own weight and by putting the mag release on the butt it placed the hand in a position to withdraw the magazine after the release was activated? Or was it felt that after activating the release and drawing out the empty magazine the shooter was expect to pocket the empty mag and not discard it?
Thanks to all at C&R for the show , Wonderfully informative , As ever ! . All opinions are subjective , so anyone who disagrees with Your findings is being equally subjective , ergo equally likely to be right or wrong depending on Personal opinion .Each to their own ! that's the beauty of living in democracy's We are all allowed to have opinions & express them (for now at least ) .Wars have been fought to defend such rights and Thankfully We (The Allies) Won and We Lucky viewers get to enjoy & learn history from Well informed and excellent researchers and presenters at C&R . Thanks Again to You All .
If a Glock and a Mars got drunk at senior prom, 9 months later the orphanage would find a Webley self loader in a basket on the doorstep. It really is the Australopithecus of self loader, lol.
Around twenty years ago I got to fire one. Recoil was not bad as it's so heavy, for trench warfare up close it could be a good choice as it would make a good club if all else fails.
A pity the British never took on this pistol. It was put through extensive trials by the Royal Navy and they really liked it. This pistol was ahead of its time.
I dont know why Europe seems to love the heal magazine release on pistols I think even most self loading hand guns form Europe still have heal releases.
That really shows how uncharted the territory of self-loading pistols was at the time. All these random, unnecessary mechanics and wanton complexity make this period so interesting.
We have to remember that the idea of wrapping the recoil spring around the barrel only showed itself with the Browning 1910 (and knowing Browning, he probably had a patent on the idea anyway.) Since this gun's inception would have been prior to that, it's understandable. Everything looks obvious in hindsight...but it's seeing it with foresight that made Browning's innovations so successful. PS: At least the V-spring keeps the barrel down low to minimize muzzle flip (even if they did still manage to get the balance wrong in the end) - something a lot of its contemporaries weren't too successful with. And...it certainly is interesting from the perspective of today.
It really is a shame the British Army didn’t adopt this. Coming from Webley & Scott, (The UK’s Colt, essentially,) it could’ve easily been Britain’s contender to the M1911 and P08 Luger. But nope, they stuck with the Webley revolver, EVEN into WWII... -I can understand why they kept the Webley revolver for service in the Great War since it was still relevant, I absolutely cannot understand why they still chose to keep it in their army by 1940. They technically even downgraded it to a smaller caliber thanks to Enfield. Sigh...
Churchill's love and obsession for anything automatic has to do with what he experienced in the Boer Wars. He was involved in the 2nd one and he was a journalist if I remember and he got cornered by the Boers and he only managed to escape being captured with his Mauser C96 Bolo variant and when he got back to Britain he lauded the weapon heavily in front of the press too. That's also how the Mauser C96 got so popular across the globe and most importantly China on how did they even arm and copy the pistol magnificently into what became China's most used pistol during WWI, Interwar, Second Sino-Japanese War, WWII and beyond.
Wow those new gen five glocks sure do look promising.
The .455 GAP is the future.
Underrated comment.
IDK, but I'll tell you this: that "Mars" at 1:00 or so gives me feelings that make me question my heterosexuality...
...Guess I'm the type to marry a digital piano with weighted and graded keys, but cheat on her with campy WWI-era tech.
LOL
The Bizzaro Glock
I've always felt that the Webley automatics never quite got the recognition they deserved. So thanks for shedding further light on this interesting pistol!
I own one of these pistols. It was the property of Lt Col Thistlethwaite who served at Gallipoli. He contracted amoebic dysentery and spent the remainder of the war in a sanitarium, so survived. Excellent presentation, as always
There is something confidence building in having a big bore cartridge. And the age old, "if you run out of ammo it's still a good club" adage.
Magazine cutoff.......in an automatic pistol..........*BRITISH INTENSIFIES*
The Royal Navy wanted this as only so many magazines per gun were issued (2?) so they wanted to be able to use loose rounds until magazine fire was necessary. In boarding or on service on land the idea was to reserve the magazine for a rush by defenders or assault by cavalry. Officers and Petty Officers would have the pistol in boarding but the sailors had cutlasses or rifles.
The magazine is for using loose rounds for *_NEGOTIATING_* with less than permissive soldiers.
You know the Japanese version would've had a bayonet lug...
planescaped the British did just that with their Webley revolvers.
@@johnfisk811 I can't imagine a combat situation within pistol-firing range where I don't want a full magazine, lol.
"...Because it looks like a drawing of a gun, drawn by a five year old"
This gun may be a Webley, but Mae is a Savage!
I carry revolvers nearly daily and my nephew drew a picture of me in which I was wearing a duster for some reason and his depiction of my gun looked like a Webley autoloading pistol.
I keked.
@@bushwhackedonvhs because revolvers are for cowboys. You carry a revolver, ergo you are a cowboy
@@sawyere2496 I now carry a Ruger P89 with a 17 round Mec-Gar mag
She's not wrong though and I'm British :)
I just want to thank you guys for all that you do. My whole life I’ve been obsessed with the history of small arms, particularly military small arms, and it makes me happy to see others are as well. For as long as I can remember I’ve wanted your RUclips channel to exist, I just didn’t know it.
After that fantastically brutal roast of Mae at 27:35, I was expecting the ‘War Were Declared’ thingy.
The Mars really tanks me back, some of the first forgotten weapon videos I watched were about the Mars
I love the Mars. That insane magazine system. That rotating breech thingy. It's not a big handgun, it's a tiny naval artillery piece. I mean, don't get me wrong, I recognize that that is ridiculous and commercially nonsensical. I'm not saying it should have succeeded. I'm just saying I love it. :)
The Desert Eagle proves that the Mars Pistol could have been successful had Hugo Mars not been so caught up on making his gun so mechanically complicated that it requires a Swiss Watchmaker to clean it.
Fantastic job, guys. This is the best historic gun site I have come across on You Tube.
Although your videos are lengthy, I really never want them to end. There's a compliment!
My Father was in charge of Naval outdoor ranges at (UK) Whale Island/HMS Excellent, which you correctly quoted in the history of this Pistol.
I never knew this one existed, so very interesting for me, thanks.
Keep up the great work and keep away from too much shooting/penetration.
I've just come across this site. It came out of watching the Great War channel. I'm Canadian and love that period of our history, so ended up here curious about the Ross rifle and loved your historical as well as technical review of the rifle and you gave me a better insight as to what was going on with the rifle at the time. You guys do a wonderful job of reviewing these historical fire arms
Unbelievable as usual. You guys rock. Thank you for always doing a super fabulous job. I not only collect WW1 and WW2 firearms for the shooting but also the history and you guys always do a fantastic job with the history of each firearm.
ooooooh, that "thwack" of the breech closing... that's something special.
"it's got a lot of girth to it, but it's very comfortable"
Oh my
Literally came to the comments to find the comment on this I knew had to be there. Was not disappointed.
@@larrythorn4715 Sama, haha.
@@larrythorn4715 Literally Came!
Regarding Webley's ergonomics; while not the big .455, my M&P .32 model I found surprisingly to be one of the most comfortable AND accurate pistols in my collection, especially on moving targets (and I have a couple of hundred 20th century pocket pistols)! I can't explain it, it just feels GOOD! Incidentally, it's a shame you don't do a moving target test, as men didn't always stand still in WW1.
If 4 out of 10 is passable, i want you to be my university professor, Mae.
"A 7?! I feel ripped off, I should at lest get 10!" The amount of unintentional innuendos in this show is awesome lol
You can't put off the Mosin forever, Oatboy.
Arsonmarathon Powerfuneral we need the mosin!
I was saying this for a while....and now look. ITS RIGHT THERE! I SEE IT!
Tbh what russian weapoms has he done?
Why did I read this in Idubbbz' "foreign" voice?
Da! Mosin has been there for month!
This really was a pistol that deserved more than it got.
Literally saw this uploaded as I was lying in bed and now questioning if I really need the hour of sleep I would miss to watch this.
Sera Do night shifts. Or come li e in Europe. You'll get them when waking up.
I wouldn't mind living in Europe if I had the money, I hear the Netherlands is lovely.
May: "A lot of girth......but it's not uncomfortable."
That's what we've all wanted to hear from her for a long time now...
Why the heel rlease? Cause those pistols were worn in belt holsters that could take a lot of hits (the officer crawling out of the trenches, artillery craters, under the barbed wire, ecc...) before the weapon was draw. Imagine the guy finally drawing the pistol, and the magazine, that had been already unlocked by the button being pressed at some point, flying out of it.
Yes, much better to have the release exposed to the elements
One more reason - an old digger once told me that back then, the brass generally didn't want mags dumped onto the ground where they could get trampled and possibly destroyed, and a heel release means it pops out directly into your off-hand (which is operating the release) so you can quickly and easily pop it into a pocket for reloading later.
@@aussiebloke609 now that makes more sense
At 0:40 Othais isn't joking. This one time, I was in space, and I looked down at earth and saw a Webley self loading Mk1N.
I notice a recurring theme with British weapons, the small arms committee was a nightmare to deal with, constantly changing it's mind on what it wants and being vague. Plus that obsession over controlling soldiers fire with only allowing one round at a time, I am almost surprised their machine guns were not required to have single shot capability.
EarthenDam basically to some what girlfriends are like.
Exbiditionary warfare makes you rather reliant on not running out of ammunition. Its not like the world beyond Europe and America was covered in railway lines at the time to deliver more when you needed it. Once you marched away from that ship or rail head you were on your own.
@@zoiders and even America at the time was fairly sparse on railroads once you left the east coast.
The single shot feature was for training. It wasn’t intended for battlefield use
It’s important to remember with the Wembley Automatic is that the Admiralty wanted, so they lead the design (magazine cut off etc.) for the Admiralty’s tactical requirements in the early 1900’s, before the complete change in understanding of requirements that WW1 created.
However, the Army had no tactical requirement for an automatic, pistols were really just for officers at the time, who were expected to provide their own, and certain troops who did not require / could not carry a rifle - machine gunners, drivers, MP’s etc. It’s only in the last 10 years that British doctrine has lead to pistols being issued to most troops.
In terms of military weapons, the Admiralty were considered to be the experts in large calibration, longe range, big-bang making equipment, sometimes fitted into turrets etc., while the Army were considered to be the experts in weapons that could be carried by a single person. This meant small arms testing tended to be referred to the Brown Jobs.
While watching Mae's review I figured out how to fix the magazine spring that broke in half from my new (to me) Remington Model 8. I paused the video, ran to the workshop, used a half penny nail as a rivet, and ran back up to continue watching. Thanks Mae!
Spiffing! Jolly good show old boy!
OldContemptible pip pip
What's that old bean?
This pistol looks like Hi Point attempted to make a P38 clone.
And this thirty years before invented!
It looks like Luger tried to make a Glock.
This is what they really should've called the "Box Cannon"
What is it with RLM fans and guns? Seems like antique guns and Mike Stoklasa are as hand in hand as Filthy Frank and youtube cancer. Just something I've always noticed.
RLM?
What does the _Reichsluftfahrtministerium_ have to do with anything here? Wrong war, anyway.
;)
saw/handled one
at a local pawn shop
... very cool to see such
a fairly rare item
The purpose that the heel release serves is to prevent you from dropping your mag accidentally, which is a problem if you have a grip release.
It would be interesting to see a modern interpretation of this in 9x19 with a double feed mag
I love how she was playing with the 1907 at the end !
The Webley fosberry I would love to have one of those what a strange idea for a semi auto pistol sounds good on paper ,the reliability of a webley with semi auto fire looks very complex though a nightmare for trench conditions
with both this and the Mk6 I was so so hoping Mae's verdict was going to be; "I've just bought a bigger handbag as this is now my EDC."
some awesome concepts.
The action effects the recoil. The way the gun unlocks it directs part of the recoil force down into your hand.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.....
There was an interesting bit of history that helped explain my Great Uncle’s firearms collection over 20 rifles and shotguns but only 1 hand gun his service revolver. He would have bought most of them from 1901 to 1925 when he was in the Army.
Great Informative interesting pair of Webley videos keep 'em coming. Love the channel.
Great video about one of my favoured oddballs but slightly bummed you skipped the .38 ACP models...
I'm a Sergeant in the jail for a very large Police Department in N.E. Florida. Rough night, and I'm off work and can't sleep. I very much appreciate your late night releases of episodes. Definitely a great relaxation.
The ability to single loading is very useful defensively, engaging full magazine when offender's get up very close. Especially as only two mags issued
I hate you....No not really....But now I'm going to have to burn up the phone lines, so to speak, and find out which of my family friends/kin has the one and only Webley Self Loader M1 N, that I've ever seen with my own eyes up close and personal, in their gun vaults. Back around the early 1970s I had the pleasure of handling, but not shooting, an example that was brought back to the States after the end of WWI....I just can't recall, for the life of me, who owned it. I do recall that it was in pristine condition and was part of a collection of WWI and WWII pistols and rifles that had been "liberated" or purchased by a Grandfather who served in both wars....I just can't remember whose Grandfather it was! Excellent video as usual. You guys are the best! Keep 'em comin'!!!
Love the Hair May!!!
Mae, looking good with the contact lens in!
27:30 "what a fantasticly weird thing to see on the range... also this gun is a little odd." LOL POOR MAE
Hey guys great episode thanks for adding a price tag
Great shooting pistol, Fun to shoot And very accurate!
I love Whiting's story, tale of a functional meritocracy
The mag release is on the heel because soldiers weren't just dumping empty mags all over the place. You would grab, stow the empty and then insert a freshy.
Love your work, love the tshirts. Thank you. I know you are focusing on guns used in the war but I was hoping at some point you would get to other weapons of that time or other you just find interesting. If possible, I would suggest the Swedish mauser and the Schmidt Rubin.
I need sleep..ned slep..ne se..c n..C and..C&Rsenal..new C&Rsenal....pfft who needs sleep.
Zachary Bowman
You'll get plenty of sleep when you're dead, yeah?
It’s long gone, but I used to have some period trade literature talking about heel release magazine catches. I don’t remember it all, but apparently a lot of pistol companies and militaries figured that if your hand was going to be there to catch the empty mag, why not have that hand do the release work as well. Also there was a belief that thumb releases by the trigger were more prone to accidental release of the mag. I’ll contact the collector I sold all that to, and see if I can track it down.
Interestingly the glock actually does lock the barrel into the ejection port too and the tilting barrel works with an angled wedge. So who knows maybe there's some lineage.
I would say that Mae has the manual of arms down pat. Well done
Awesome. And the ethanol in fuel can reek havick on MC carbs . Almost as bad as leaving them full of race gas .
*Thanks for informative video bro!!!*
When will we get a video about the U.S. Springfield? I heard it was basically a copy of the mauser , but didn't surpass it.(I heard it is not as good as the Mauser) I also heard there was a legal battle Mauser had with Springfield where they wanted royalties for the copy. I want to see how it fairs against a Mauser and listen to the... drama behind the U.S. company had about paying money to Germany, during Ww1 was going on. I think that would make a fascinating story to hear about it all regarding this gun. (It would be ironic if the p-17 rifle (American Lee Enfield) turns out to be better than the Springfield, according to you guys haha)
I've always thought of the Webley Self Loader as a Steampunk Walther P-38.
These pistols were issued to the Railways Police in Argentina as the Railways were owned and operated by the Brits until 1948
Can you put a bayonet on it
They did, Greene had attachment for trench raiding.
I think that was only for the webley revolver line.
do you realy need to make it more heavy.
sure we do. how do you think nails are being hammered into wood in the trenches?
I have shot one of these before, and I kind of liked it. It is a long grip for sure though, and I am with Mae on, where is my extra ammo?
ウエブリーMk1の詳しい情報がなく、この動画は大変参考になりました。いつも感謝しています。😎😎👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
My favorite gun, aesthetically.
And the long barrel makes it a handy club
Looks like Scaramanga’s gun. Also Captain Scarlett’s.
I can see that RSC in the background ( ͡o ͜ʖ ͡o)
I hope Jay recovers quickly and I hope Othais learns the consequences of disagreeing with Mae....
This is the Wembley fosberry for sure the cartridge couldn’t be beefed up to operate the mechanism which led to an inadequate cycle of the mechanism it was a job to cycle it by hand
Mausers we want more Mauser episodes
Why the complaint about the number of rounds? Colt 1911 also carried 7 rounds in its magazine and its grip is not that much smaller....
Its not a small round.
Can you please shoot homemade dum-dums into ballistic gel. I've wanted to see this since Breaker Morant
@Keith Moore: I feel like I'm missing something here. What do mercury and cyanide have to do with hollow-points?
In practice, "dum-dum" is simply an archaic name for hollow-point slugs, or alternatively, for soft-point slugs. There's nothing "explosive" about it, unless you mean frangible ammunition, which is virtually never used in combat scenarios because it simply doesn't offer any real advantage over either hollow/soft-points or FMJ.
We apply Rule .303 , quote from Breacker Morant, Aussie film, book is called Scapegoats of Empire, and was the reason Colonial Troops were not Court Martiled by British Authorties in either world war.
Actually Dum Dum is the name of the Aresenal in India.
I'm well aware how the colloquialism developed. That's pretty unrelated to the argument except when you consider that the Dum Dum arsenal was only notable for the first iterations of both SJP and JHP ammunition used by the British.
I can't understand why the British wanted the ability to single load a pistol. I understand that there was a (dated) school of thought with rifles that advocated that rifles should be fired at once, loaded singularly so that the unit could fire again as a whole. (The good old musket days.). Was there some corresponding theory for pistols? I've always thought that they were self defense weapons and not anything you'd be firing on command in a group like a rifle. It's so weird, it's driving me nuts. Any theories on this?
I suppose you can only carry so much ammo on a ship.
The powers that be were paranoid about soldiers wasting ammo, it was the same with the rifles, i guess it boils down to the fact that most of the higher ranks were old single shot trained.
The single shot feature was for training purposes
Is the 1895 becoming the next lee enfield/m1911 in that people will ask for it and you might tease us about it but it's not coming for a while but will be beautiful production quality?
PPK418 To be honest we end up holding off on those episodes most of the time because a lot of pieces get sent to us from viewers and those we want to get out the door, back to the owners as soon as possible.
I had a Webley ,455 sa 1913 pistol, 8000 were made but failed the mud test for the trenches and were issued to the RN instead. Mine was a mint specimen very slick and smooth in its action vulcanite grips one of the first composites Sold it after 5 years a mistake I regret See Webley story for more Info
The Webley-Fosbury automatic revolver was used to kill Sam Spade's partner in "The Maltese Falcon."
Just got home from work. Ooooh notification! :)
I feel most of its problems could be solved with further development and a full length slide.
Why a heel release,? So you don't drop the magazine by accident! Stop thinking modern Hollywood and speed shooting. An officer should be directing not fighting, so shouldn't empty the magazine that fast. When it comes to changing the magazine, you have a gaurded release, but still quickly.
Yeah. Mind that those pistols were worn in belt holsters that could take a lot of hits (the officer crawling out of the trenches, artillery craters, under the barbed wire, ecc...) before the weapon was draw. Imagine the guy finally drawing the pistol, and the magazine, that had been already unlocked by the button being pressed at some point, flying out of it.
actually putting the release close to where the mag comes out makes it clear to identify. For someone not familiar with pistols about 1915 might want to push the button to release the slide or to remove savety and boom... magazine falls out.
To true Neutron. Will it work in the dark, yes, hand has a tendency to find hand, when I'm wet, cold, miserable and scared witless?
2:00 JOHN CARTER OF MARS
Another well done episode. Your project is going to be an often cited research source for years to come. It is interesting to me that the British cavalry had no interest or input considering g how influential the American cavalry was in regards to the 1911. Also I'm surprised the colonial armies did not take more of an interest. Also were there ever any experimental efforts at creating a sub machine gun in the British 45 auto cartridge? I know the Brit's officially did not like "gangster guns" but I could imagine someone working on it and trying vainly to change their mind.
Oh there was a cavalry version. We just don't have one yet.
(fyi, coup de grâce - mercy blow) You have to remember, Britain was a naval empire, even if they did have extensive cavalry forces; they did favour dragoons - in name, if not in practice. The saber was the main weapon when mounted, and the carbine when dismounted, shooting on the move was considered too inaccurate to be worthwhile, the handgun was more a badge of rank than a combat weapon.
Cavalry had no use for pistols except as an officer's personal weapon. The Trooper used the sabre in the attack or the carbine as mounted infantry. The horse did not need any extra weight and the trooper needed a carbine. Royal Horse Artillery was different. The Gunner needed both hands to serve his gun and a carbine was an encumbrance. A pistol would serve him as well as an officer as a sidearm to use as a last resort at close range. Otherwise his weapon was his gun.
Actualy the best cavlary weapon is the lance. Most British Mounted troops were Dragoons, that is mounted troops BUT who dismount and fight as Infantary.
My old Yeomanry Regiment was trained principally as mounted infantry and in reconnaissance as had been their role in the South African War. The Regular Regiments were trained in reconnaissance and in the cavalry assault as well as mounted infantry.
When they went to France in 1914 as part of the BEF they were brigaded in the 7th Cavalry Brigade of the 3rd Cavalry Division with regular cavalry and had to be trained in the cavalry assault role to be able to act in the same way. BTW we had (and have) lances but they were ceremonial only for the regiment. The sabre was the assault weapon of all ranks.I believe that my Regiment was still using the more useful 1899 Pattern sabre and not the one shot wonder 1908 Pattern. You can see some of them at www.paoyeomanry.co.uk/PM/LYWW1.htm some of the photographs lower down show their sabres.
It looks like a pistol the South Park Canadians would use.
So, is Mae saying the Webley Selfloader is...T H I C C ?
who needs sleep when you got C&R to watch!
It looks like a bigger version of the golden gun used by Sir Christopher Lee in the classic Bond movie!
umm hadnt seen your mk6 episode but I do have one made by enfield! rare only about 22k made, and after conversions to 45acp who knows how many are left and in 455.
Hmmm, a thought on all of those heel magazine releases of that era; was it because the purchasing authorities and/or the manufactures did not trust the magazines to fall out of the guns by their own weight and by putting the mag release on the butt it placed the hand in a position to withdraw the magazine after the release was activated? Or was it felt that after activating the release and drawing out the empty magazine the shooter was expect to pocket the empty mag and not discard it?
I can feel the dread every time Othais mentions 1911, Browning or Colt. This is getting way too real for me.
Thanks to all at C&R for the show , Wonderfully informative , As ever ! . All opinions are subjective , so anyone who disagrees with Your findings is being equally subjective , ergo equally likely to be right or wrong depending on Personal opinion .Each to their own ! that's the beauty of living in democracy's We are all allowed to have opinions & express them (for now at least ) .Wars have been fought to defend such rights and Thankfully We (The Allies) Won and We Lucky viewers get to enjoy & learn history from Well informed and excellent researchers and presenters at C&R . Thanks Again to You All .
The half mag makes sense if the feed lip on the magazine were damaged. It would still allow you to be able to use the gun at a reduced level.
If a Glock and a Mars got drunk at senior prom, 9 months later the orphanage would find a Webley self loader in a basket on the doorstep. It really is the Australopithecus of self loader, lol.
ludditeneaderthal remind me of that story?
Around twenty years ago I got to fire one. Recoil was not bad as it's so heavy, for trench warfare up close it could be a good choice as it would make a good club if all else fails.
I used one many years ago too. Immediately inspired confidence and I would have taken it in preference to a Colt 1911.
A pity the British never took on this pistol. It was put through extensive trials by the Royal Navy and they really liked it.
This pistol was ahead of its time.
I dont know why Europe seems to love the heal magazine release on pistols I think even most self loading hand guns form Europe still have heal releases.
That shooting sound of this gun, wow like a cannon or something.
did it give you ptsd?
A real question is why he did all that v-spring lever mess when he could have just wrapped the recoil spring around the barrel.
That really shows how uncharted the territory of self-loading pistols was at the time. All these random, unnecessary mechanics and wanton complexity make this period so interesting.
We have to remember that the idea of wrapping the recoil spring around the barrel only showed itself with the Browning 1910 (and knowing Browning, he probably had a patent on the idea anyway.) Since this gun's inception would have been prior to that, it's understandable. Everything looks obvious in hindsight...but it's seeing it with foresight that made Browning's innovations so successful.
PS: At least the V-spring keeps the barrel down low to minimize muzzle flip (even if they did still manage to get the balance wrong in the end) - something a lot of its contemporaries weren't too successful with. And...it certainly is interesting from the perspective of today.
It really is a shame the British Army didn’t adopt this. Coming from Webley & Scott, (The UK’s Colt, essentially,) it could’ve easily been Britain’s contender to the M1911 and P08 Luger. But nope, they stuck with the Webley revolver, EVEN into WWII... -I can understand why they kept the Webley revolver for service in the Great War since it was still relevant, I absolutely cannot understand why they still chose to keep it in their army by 1940. They technically even downgraded it to a smaller caliber thanks to Enfield. Sigh...
Revolvers were mud proof, and thus the conservation.
@@PlymouthT20 revolvers are arguably more vulnerable to mud
Churchill's love and obsession for anything automatic has to do with what he experienced in the Boer Wars.
He was involved in the 2nd one and he was a journalist if I remember and he got cornered by the Boers and he only managed to escape being captured with his Mauser C96 Bolo variant and when he got back to Britain he lauded the weapon heavily in front of the press too. That's also how the Mauser C96 got so popular across the globe and most importantly China on how did they even arm and copy the pistol magnificently into what became China's most used pistol during WWI, Interwar, Second Sino-Japanese War, WWII and beyond.
Jun Kitami what are you doing here kitami shouldn't you be tuning cars
War is looming. Tuning cars can't help us in defending rocket man
Jun Kitami I see
The "High Point" of yesteryear. Hopefully Jay will make a full recovery.