Disunity as a feature, not a bug, reminds me of the recent comment Charlie Kirk made about him just finding a new pastor, which reminds me of 2 Tim 4:3 about accumulating teachers for oneself to suit one's likings.
Having just finished Erick Ybarra's book on papacy, I know the 1st millennium Church was NOT "peaceably undivided." The Pope was essential and instrumental in multiple reunions between East and West, driving out heresies in the East. Almost had reunion again at Lyons and Florence.
You are right. The Church has been on a wild ride from the beginning. She was almost put to death with Nero's persecution, when Peter and Paul were put to death. And she was almost led astray by heretics from within, "those fellows" who troubled the church in Antioch, and were defeated at the Council under Peter in Acts 15. She is under attack today, from the inside and out. But where Peter is, there is the Church.
@@susand3668 Apparently there was also some tension and conflict between Peter and Paul, judging by Galatians 2, and perhaps even serious schisms judging by 1 Cor 1.... Rod should be saying that there WERE schisms in almost every century, but that history can tell us how unity in truth was restored each time.
@@tonyl3762 1 Corinthians 1 was about trouble in one Church (which oddly cropped up again in Clement's time as Pope) rather than a Church wide issue. That said, I've always thought "Chloe's People" was a great name for a band.
@@BensWorkshop But was it? I'm reading Rev Dr Kappes' and William Albrecht's book on the papacy, and they seem to believe that 1 Cor 1 reflects a much larger Church-wide schism with its roots in the Antioch incident/scandal mentioned by Paul in Gal 2. Their book draws upon the book by Dr Jack Gibson named _Peter between Jerusalem and Antioch_ .
@@tonyl3762 Well, Paul did not seem to write in that vein to other churches. He was just concerned with the "Circumcision party" in those. Much less so in 1 Corinthians (as I read it) and much more concerned with people splitting into factions on the basis of whether they liked this apostle of that.
Great interview! I can tell that interviewing Rod gives you great pleasure. Watching the interview gave me great pleasure too! May God bless and guide both of you!
This is exactly what intelligent, faithful people should ask. Unfortunately, the contemporary feel-good empty -and-vapid Protestantism is so focused on “me and Jesus” or “my interpretation of the Bible” that I wonder how many Protestant Christians even think about this issue. There’s nothing to do or obey with “faith alone” (“Jesus did everything so I can do nothing”) so the idea of submitting to an authority just makes no sense to them. In Protestantism you are your own authority and if something doesn’t make you “feel good”, you can just ignore it or look down on that issue. The only way to find unity is to humble oneself and realize you are not an authority. Thank God the Catholic Church exists. Thank God, seriously. What a relief.
Sorry, but your comment is rubbish. All born again of the Spirit Christians are saved by faith alone in Christ alone. In His Mercy God pardons us for our sins and purges them. In His Grace God makes us children of God, gives Eternal Life, peace with God, makes us the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus and puts us 'In Christ' as part of a new creation in Christ Jesus. However, though we are being saved by Grace, we are also predestinated unto good works which God has foreordained that we should walk in them. If someone professing to be saved by faith alone, continues in sin and does not produce those 'good works' which God has prepared for them, then their faith is probably in vain and they are not Christians at all. (Ephesians ch. 2 v 8-10). What sort of a Christian are you if you have Eternal Life plus all the other gifts of Grace, and then you don't tell anyone else about it? There is something wrong with your faith.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384 Thank you Pastor Bob for that compelling cut-and-paste Protestant sermon. We’ve heard it all before and both the Bible and ancient Christianity contradict this “just believe and that’s it - good works will follow”. Sin and temptation are real even after believing and with our free will are to work with God’s grace -faith working through love (1 Corinthians 13:2). You realize the only place ‘faith alone’ actually occurs in the Bible is in James 2:24 , “You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.”? But hey that doesn’t fit into your view of Christianity so as a Protestant you are totally free to reject that!
Actually, everyone submits to some authority or other. Traditional protestants choose to submit to their respective denominations, non-denominational protestants often submit to an amalgamation of different authorities, catholics submit to the pope, etc.
@pianoatthirty …spot on!!🎯…Protestantism is intrinsically individualistic & relativistic, both morally & theologically. There is literally nothing that all of Protestantism agrees upon…except their rejection of Catholicism. And yes, in Protestantism there are as many popes as there are Protestants. Keep on contending for the One Holy Catholic & Apostolic Church! Viva Cristo Rey!🙏🏼
It's funny, just two days ago I was thinking.. I wonder if/when Keith will have Rod Bennett on again - just because he's so fun to listen to . This will be good!
Only heard about Francis Chan very recently in a Trent Horn video on worship. What a raw, honest, and eloquent articulator of the problem within Protestantism. Gotta boost his voice more.
ST. POPE JOHN PAUL II: “When brothers and sisters who are not in perfect communion with one another come together to pray... their prayer is the soul of the whole ecumenical movement. If Christians, despite their divisions, can grow evermore united in common prayer around Christ, they will grow in the awareness of how little divides them in comparison to what unites them.” “It is absolutely clear that ecumenism, the movement promoting Christian unity, is not just some sort of “appendix” which is added to the Church’s traditional activity. Rather, ecumenism is an organic part of her life and work, and consequently must pervade all that she is and does.” Ut Unum Sint, May 25, 1995
Unity of heart, not unity of doctrine/praxis. Reduce essentials to the Divinity of Christ, however defined, until this too collapses into a "spiritual" resurrection. Assume that the Holy Spirit is guiding you, and that your interlocutors are either too uneducated and/or too obstinate in their willful ignorance and wickedness to assent to the true doctrine. These are a few of the options. Man-made things all eventuality rust and fade, unless God builds the house, those that labor, labor in vain. A fine talk gentlemen. Much appreciated.
Because the Old and New Testament Scriptures are the divinely-revealed, written Word of God, Catholics venerate the Scriptures as they venerate the Lord’s body. But Catholics do not believe that God has given us His divine Revelation in Christ exclusively through Scripture. Catholics also believe that God’s Revelation comes to us through the Apostolic Tradition and teaching authority of the Church. What Church? Scripture reveals this Church to be the one Jesus Christ built upon the rock of Saint Peter (Matt. 16:18). By giving Peter the keys of authority (Matt. 16:19), Jesus appointed Peter as the chief steward over His earthly kingdom (cf. Isaiah. 22:19-22). Jesus also charged Peter to be the source of strength for the rest of the apostles (Luke 22:32) and the earthly shepherd of Jesus’ flock (John 21:15-17). Jesus further gave Peter, and the apostles and elders in union with him, the power to bind and loose in heaven what they bound and loosed on earth. (Matt. 16:19; 18:18). This teaching authority did not die with Peter and the apostles, but was transferred to future bishops through the laying on of hands (e.g., Acts 1:20; 6:6; 13:3; 8:18; 9:17; 1 Tim. 4:14; 5:22; 2 Tim. 1:6). By virtue of this divinely-appointed authority, the Catholic Church determined the canon of Scripture (what books belong in the Bible) at the end of the fourth century. We therefore believe in the Scriptures on the authority of the Catholic Church. After all, nothing in Scripture tells us what Scriptures are inspired, what books belong in the Bible, or that Scripture is the final authority on questions concerning the Christian faith. Instead, the Bible says that the Church, not the Scriptures, is the pinnacle and foundation of the truth (1 Tim. 3:15) and the final arbiter on questions of the Christian faith (Matt. 18:17). It is through the teaching authority and Apostolic Tradition (2 Thess. 2:15; 3:6; 1 Cor. 11:2) of this Church, who is guided by the Holy Spirit (John 14:16,26; 16:13), that we know of the divine inspiration of the Scriptures, and the manifold wisdom of God. (cf. Ephesians 3:10). scripture Catholic
Totally wrong. It was the Holy Spirit which was transferred by the laying on of hands by the apostles. They alone had that authority. It stopped with them. A lot of what you say is true, but once you added the Roman Catholic church to your assumptions, then it all collapsed. You can only be guided by the Spirit of Truth when you are indwelt by that same Holy Spirit. The Church of Rome is a man made corruption of the assembly that was in Rome at the beginning of the 'church'. They do not possess the Spirit of God. It is just a money making racket.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384 1st - iggy didnt say “Roman”. Your pejorative tone has already set a negative stage for dialogue. 2nd - given the fact that history shows the church fathers never agreed on the 27 books of the NT through the 4th century, AND that their individual would-be canons were GROWING during this era, who was it, if not the Catholic Church guided buy the Holy Spirit, that canonized the 27 books of the NT and dismissed all the others? Peace!!!
There is so much missing from the cannon of scripture, that should buttress an assertion so monumental to Christendom as the one being made here, that it boggles the mind how one could arrive at this conclusion.
Just a hunch, but, no. sectarian squabbling serves Gods greater desire to have his children focus on Him and our relationship with Him. We don't handle peace and tranquility very well. As so as times become good we ruin it.
@@iu9142 After Chalcedon, the Oriental Orthodox (monophysite) and Assyrian Orthodox (Nestorian) split from the Catholic Church. Do a basic Wiki search to get a general idea. Any basic church history text book would provide additional information and nuance.
@@robertopacheco2997 The Oriental Orthodox actually reject the Monophysite position rather, they hold to the Miaphysite Christology which posits Christ is a Divine Person with a composite of the 2 natures (Divine and human). The Assyrian Church of the East signed a Christological Declaration with Pope John Paul II on 11 November 1994 that affirmed that the Assyrian Church of the East now accepts praying that the Virgin Mary as "the Mother of Christ our God and Saviour". So this formula by the Assyrian Church of the East can no longer be said to be Nestorian. Now the other branch of the Assyrian Orthodox, the Ancient Church of the East, which split from the Assyrian in the 1960's over the Assyrian meeting with Rome during Vatican II agreeing to use the Gregorian calendar to harmonize their Liturgical calendar with Rome. Also the Assyrian Orthodox Church split from Rome and at that time the Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox at the Council of Ephesus in 431 AD.
Well I guess you have overlooked the Bible (once again) . The solution God had for the 7 churches in Revelation was "return to your first love" . Does that seem too complicated?
@TheCordialCatholic God wants it to be about knowing Christ deeper and not about the exterior things you suggest that only serve to feed your pride. Peter said to lead by example and not by being Lords over the flock. 1 Peter 5:3 [3]Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. Sorry if that doesn't serve your sense of superiority.
@TheCordialCatholic spiritual things are accomplished by prayer and fasting. By humbling ourselves before God and repentance. We have to leave behind the human baggage and look to the glory that is set before us. 1 Corinthians 14:5 [5]I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying. You will notice that Paul promoted prophesy as the best gift because I believe it reveals the intentions of God. Amos 3:7 [7]Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets. Yet most pastors are afraid of the prophetic and don't even allow it, much less promote it as Paul did. I think that's half the problem.
Oh I agree, but what IS the plan. All the Catholics don’t agree on all the things. I have a life time catholic friend born and raised in Italy who believes in birth control, divorce, forgiveness outside of confession and a priest or pope. My question is How Do We Know that the Catholic way really is what Christ wanted. Maybe the Roman Catholic way was what Christ did Not want.
Historically trace Christianity back to the very first church Christ founded. It’s the same Catholic Church. Yes, not all Catholics adhere to the teaching of the Church (even some priests!) but it doesn’t stop it from being right.
Your friend is a perfect example of the necessity of One Church with One Doctrine, which Catholicism has. Her believing these things does not make her a different sect of Catholic Christian, it simply makes her disobedient and defiant to Catholic teaching. Her opinions and claims have no authority to undermine Church teaching, and there is no possibility that she can go to the nearest strip mall and start her own version of the Catholic Church.
The church was NOT united for the first 1000 years: if you truly studied church history, you'd have learned about the Iconoclasts, the Church of East, and the Oriental orthodox churches, all of which claim apostolic succession 48:41
Because the Old and New Testament Scriptures are the divinely-revealed, written Word of God, Catholics venerate the Scriptures as they venerate the Lord’s body. But Catholics do not believe that God has given us His divine Revelation in Christ exclusively through Scripture. Catholics also believe that God’s Revelation comes to us through the Apostolic Tradition and teaching authority of the Church. What Church? Scripture reveals this Church to be the one Jesus Christ built upon the rock of Saint Peter (Matt. 16:18). By giving Peter the keys of authority (Matt. 16:19), Jesus appointed Peter as the chief steward over His earthly kingdom (cf. Isaiah. 22:19-22). Jesus also charged Peter to be the source of strength for the rest of the apostles (Luke 22:32) and the earthly shepherd of Jesus’ flock (John 21:15-17). Jesus further gave Peter, and the apostles and elders in union with him, the power to bind and loose in heaven what they bound and loosed on earth. (Matt. 16:19; 18:18). This teaching authority did not die with Peter and the apostles, but was transferred to future bishops through the laying on of hands (e.g., Acts 1:20; 6:6; 13:3; 8:18; 9:17; 1 Tim. 4:14; 5:22; 2 Tim. 1:6). By virtue of this divinely-appointed authority, the Catholic Church determined the canon of Scripture (what books belong in the Bible) at the end of the fourth century. We therefore believe in the Scriptures on the authority of the Catholic Church. After all, nothing in Scripture tells us what Scriptures are inspired, what books belong in the Bible, or that Scripture is the final authority on questions concerning the Christian faith. Instead, the Bible says that the Church, not the Scriptures, is the pinnacle and foundation of the truth (1 Tim. 3:15) and the final arbiter on questions of the Christian faith (Matt. 18:17). It is through the teaching authority and Apostolic Tradition (2 Thess. 2:15; 3:6; 1 Cor. 11:2) of this Church, who is guided by the Holy Spirit (John 14:16,26; 16:13), that we know of the divine inspiration of the Scriptures, and the manifold wisdom of God. (cf. Ephesians 3:10).
Disunity as a feature, not a bug, reminds me of the recent comment Charlie Kirk made about him just finding a new pastor, which reminds me of 2 Tim 4:3 about accumulating teachers for oneself to suit one's likings.
💯
Amen
I see Rod Bennett and immediately hit the Like Button!
Thanks! Hope you enjoy it!
Me too!
Rod Bennett is always a winner conversation. You two always have the best dialogs.
Thank you! I’m disappointed this video doesn’t have more interest because I think it’s one of the best we’ve done! 🤷♂️
Having just finished Erick Ybarra's book on papacy, I know the 1st millennium Church was NOT "peaceably undivided." The Pope was essential and instrumental in multiple reunions between East and West, driving out heresies in the East. Almost had reunion again at Lyons and Florence.
You are right. The Church has been on a wild ride from the beginning. She was almost put to death with Nero's persecution, when Peter and Paul were put to death. And she was almost led astray by heretics from within, "those fellows" who troubled the church in Antioch, and were defeated at the Council under Peter in Acts 15.
She is under attack today, from the inside and out.
But where Peter is, there is the Church.
@@susand3668 Apparently there was also some tension and conflict between Peter and Paul, judging by Galatians 2, and perhaps even serious schisms judging by 1 Cor 1.... Rod should be saying that there WERE schisms in almost every century, but that history can tell us how unity in truth was restored each time.
@@tonyl3762 1 Corinthians 1 was about trouble in one Church (which oddly cropped up again in Clement's time as Pope) rather than a Church wide issue. That said, I've always thought "Chloe's People" was a great name for a band.
@@BensWorkshop But was it? I'm reading Rev Dr Kappes' and William Albrecht's book on the papacy, and they seem to believe that 1 Cor 1 reflects a much larger Church-wide schism with its roots in the Antioch incident/scandal mentioned by Paul in Gal 2. Their book draws upon the book by Dr Jack Gibson named _Peter between Jerusalem and Antioch_ .
@@tonyl3762 Well, Paul did not seem to write in that vein to other churches. He was just concerned with the "Circumcision party" in those. Much less so in 1 Corinthians (as I read it) and much more concerned with people splitting into factions on the basis of whether they liked this apostle of that.
I've read every Church history book by Rod except _Scripture Wars_ , which is next in queue. They are all fantastic!
That’s a great one, too! Hope you enjoy it!
Great interview! I can tell that interviewing Rod gives you great pleasure. Watching the interview gave me great pleasure too! May God bless and guide both of you!
Rod is a good friend and always such a pleasure to chat with! I’m glad it comes through! God bless you too!
Your cordiality and affable chatting is delightful, definitely a feature not a bug! Great episode: thought provoking and enlightening.
Thank you kindly!
This is exactly what intelligent, faithful people should ask. Unfortunately, the contemporary feel-good empty -and-vapid Protestantism is so focused on “me and Jesus” or “my interpretation of the Bible” that I wonder how many Protestant Christians even think about this issue. There’s nothing to do or obey with “faith alone” (“Jesus did everything so I can do nothing”) so the idea of submitting to an authority just makes no sense to them. In Protestantism you are your own authority and if something doesn’t make you “feel good”, you can just ignore it or look down on that issue. The only way to find unity is to humble oneself and realize you are not an authority. Thank God the Catholic Church exists. Thank God, seriously. What a relief.
Sorry, but your comment is rubbish. All born again of the Spirit Christians are saved by faith alone in Christ alone. In His Mercy God pardons us for our sins and purges them. In His Grace God makes us children of God, gives Eternal Life, peace with God, makes us the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus and puts us 'In Christ' as part of a new creation in Christ Jesus. However, though we are being saved by Grace, we are also predestinated unto good works which God has foreordained that we should walk in them. If someone professing to be saved by faith alone, continues in sin and does not produce those 'good works' which God has prepared for them, then their faith is probably in vain and they are not Christians at all. (Ephesians ch. 2 v 8-10). What sort of a Christian are you if you have Eternal Life plus all the other gifts of Grace, and then you don't tell anyone else about it? There is something wrong with your faith.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384 Thank you Pastor Bob for that compelling cut-and-paste Protestant sermon. We’ve heard it all before and both the Bible and ancient Christianity contradict this “just believe and that’s it - good works will follow”. Sin and temptation are real even after believing and with our free will are to work with God’s grace -faith working through love (1 Corinthians 13:2). You realize the only place ‘faith alone’ actually occurs in the Bible is in James 2:24 , “You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.”? But hey that doesn’t fit into your view of Christianity so as a Protestant you are totally free to reject that!
Actually, everyone submits to some authority or other. Traditional protestants choose to submit to their respective denominations, non-denominational protestants often submit to an amalgamation of different authorities, catholics submit to the pope, etc.
@pianoatthirty …spot on!!🎯…Protestantism is intrinsically individualistic & relativistic, both morally & theologically. There is literally nothing that all of Protestantism agrees upon…except their rejection of Catholicism. And yes, in Protestantism there are as many popes as there are Protestants.
Keep on contending for the One Holy Catholic & Apostolic Church! Viva Cristo Rey!🙏🏼
It's funny, just two days ago I was thinking.. I wonder if/when Keith will have Rod Bennett on again - just because he's so fun to listen to .
This will be good!
We aim to please! 🤓
Great job, Keith. Great enthusiasm!
Thank you!!
You make a great mother duck Rod Bennett!!
Ha!
43:03 glosses over splits w church of the east and oriental orthodoxy
Only heard about Francis Chan very recently in a Trent Horn video on worship. What a raw, honest, and eloquent articulator of the problem within Protestantism. Gotta boost his voice more.
We have to pray for his conversion. He will lead many home with him.
4:03 starts here
ST. POPE JOHN PAUL II: “When brothers and sisters who are not in perfect communion with one another come together to pray... their prayer is the soul of the whole ecumenical movement. If Christians, despite their divisions, can grow evermore united in common prayer around Christ, they will grow in the awareness of how little divides them in comparison to what unites them.”
“It is absolutely clear that ecumenism, the movement promoting Christian unity, is not just some sort of “appendix” which is added to the Church’s traditional activity. Rather, ecumenism is an organic part of her life and work, and consequently must pervade all that she is and does.” Ut Unum Sint, May 25, 1995
❤❤❤
Unity of heart, not unity of doctrine/praxis.
Reduce essentials to the Divinity of Christ, however defined, until this too collapses into a "spiritual" resurrection.
Assume that the Holy Spirit is guiding you, and that your interlocutors are either too uneducated and/or too obstinate in their willful ignorance and wickedness to assent to the true doctrine.
These are a few of the options.
Man-made things all eventuality rust and fade, unless God builds the house, those that labor, labor in vain.
A fine talk gentlemen. Much appreciated.
Thank you!
Because the Old and New Testament Scriptures are the divinely-revealed, written Word of God, Catholics venerate the Scriptures as they venerate the Lord’s body. But Catholics do not believe that God has given us His divine Revelation in Christ exclusively through Scripture. Catholics also believe that God’s Revelation comes to us through the Apostolic Tradition and teaching authority of the Church.
What Church? Scripture reveals this Church to be the one Jesus Christ built upon the rock of Saint Peter (Matt. 16:18). By giving Peter the keys of authority (Matt. 16:19), Jesus appointed Peter as the chief steward over His earthly kingdom (cf. Isaiah. 22:19-22). Jesus also charged Peter to be the source of strength for the rest of the apostles (Luke 22:32) and the earthly shepherd of Jesus’ flock (John 21:15-17). Jesus further gave Peter, and the apostles and elders in union with him, the power to bind and loose in heaven what they bound and loosed on earth. (Matt. 16:19; 18:18). This teaching authority did not die with Peter and the apostles, but was transferred to future bishops through the laying on of hands (e.g., Acts 1:20; 6:6; 13:3; 8:18; 9:17; 1 Tim. 4:14; 5:22; 2 Tim. 1:6).
By virtue of this divinely-appointed authority, the Catholic Church determined the canon of Scripture (what books belong in the Bible) at the end of the fourth century. We therefore believe in the Scriptures on the authority of the Catholic Church. After all, nothing in Scripture tells us what Scriptures are inspired, what books belong in the Bible, or that Scripture is the final authority on questions concerning the Christian faith. Instead, the Bible says that the Church, not the Scriptures, is the pinnacle and foundation of the truth (1 Tim. 3:15) and the final arbiter on questions of the Christian faith (Matt. 18:17). It is through the teaching authority and Apostolic Tradition (2 Thess. 2:15; 3:6; 1 Cor. 11:2) of this Church, who is guided by the Holy Spirit (John 14:16,26; 16:13), that we know of the divine inspiration of the Scriptures, and the manifold wisdom of God. (cf. Ephesians 3:10). scripture Catholic
Totally wrong. It was the Holy Spirit which was transferred by the laying on of hands by the apostles. They alone had that authority. It stopped with them. A lot of what you say is true, but once you added the Roman Catholic church to your assumptions, then it all collapsed. You can only be guided by the Spirit of Truth when you are indwelt by that same Holy Spirit. The Church of Rome is a man made corruption of the assembly that was in Rome at the beginning of the 'church'. They do not possess the Spirit of God. It is just a money making racket.
Muslims believe their revelation came through Mohammed, and they are just as wrong as the Roman Catholic church.
@@smeatonlighthouse4384 1st - iggy didnt say “Roman”. Your pejorative tone has already set a negative stage for dialogue.
2nd - given the fact that history shows the church fathers never agreed on the 27 books of the NT through the 4th century, AND that their individual would-be canons were GROWING during this era, who was it, if not the Catholic Church guided buy the Holy Spirit, that canonized the 27 books of the NT and dismissed all the others?
Peace!!!
Too bad you and Rod didn't touch on #17 of Spes Non Confundit which is all about hope for unity as part of the Jubilee Year.
There is so much missing from the cannon of scripture, that should buttress an assertion so monumental to Christendom as the one being made here, that it boggles the mind how one could arrive at this conclusion.
❤
The Lord already seperated the sheeps from goats. Since the great schism then reformation.
seems that, like with any other manmade religion, christianity saw splinters from the very beginning
Just a hunch, but, no. sectarian squabbling serves Gods greater desire to have his children focus on Him and our relationship with Him.
We don't handle peace and tranquility very well. As so as times become good we ruin it.
Sorry, but the true first division was after Chalcedon (451 AD).
Can you send the source I would love to look at this
@@iu9142 After Chalcedon, the Oriental Orthodox (monophysite) and Assyrian Orthodox (Nestorian) split from the Catholic Church. Do a basic Wiki search to get a general idea. Any basic church history text book would provide additional information and nuance.
@@robertopacheco2997 The Oriental Orthodox actually reject the Monophysite position rather, they hold to the Miaphysite Christology which posits Christ is a Divine Person with a composite of the 2 natures (Divine and human). The Assyrian Church of the East signed a Christological Declaration with Pope John Paul II on 11 November 1994 that affirmed that the Assyrian Church of the East now accepts praying that the Virgin Mary as "the Mother of Christ our God and Saviour". So this formula by the Assyrian Church of the East can no longer be said to be Nestorian. Now the other branch of the Assyrian Orthodox, the Ancient Church of the East, which split from the Assyrian in the 1960's over the Assyrian meeting with Rome during Vatican II agreeing to use the Gregorian calendar to harmonize their Liturgical calendar with Rome.
Also the Assyrian Orthodox Church split from Rome and at that time the Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox at the Council of Ephesus in 431 AD.
th
Well I guess you have overlooked the Bible (once again) . The solution God had for the 7 churches in Revelation was "return to your first love" . Does that seem too complicated?
How is that accomplished?
@TheCordialCatholic God wants it to be about knowing Christ deeper and not about the exterior things you suggest that only serve to feed your pride. Peter said to lead by example and not by being Lords over the flock.
1 Peter 5:3
[3]Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
Sorry if that doesn't serve your sense of superiority.
@TheCordialCatholic I think Jesus expected His churches to accomplish it.
The point is: HOW?
@TheCordialCatholic spiritual things are accomplished by prayer and fasting. By humbling ourselves before God and repentance. We have to leave behind the human baggage and look to the glory that is set before us.
1 Corinthians 14:5
[5]I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.
You will notice that Paul promoted prophesy as the best gift because I believe it reveals the intentions of God.
Amos 3:7
[7]Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.
Yet most pastors are afraid of the prophetic and don't even allow it, much less promote it as Paul did. I think that's half the problem.
Oh I agree, but what IS the plan. All the Catholics don’t agree on all the things. I have a life time catholic friend born and raised in Italy who believes in birth control, divorce, forgiveness outside of confession and a priest or pope.
My question is How Do We Know that the Catholic way really is what Christ wanted. Maybe the Roman Catholic way was what
Christ did Not want.
Historically trace Christianity back to the very first church Christ founded. It’s the same Catholic Church. Yes, not all Catholics adhere to the teaching of the Church (even some priests!) but it doesn’t stop it from being right.
Truth is found in the Bible, not the tradition of men.
Your friend is a perfect example of the necessity of One Church with One Doctrine, which Catholicism has. Her believing these things does not make her a different sect of Catholic Christian, it simply makes her disobedient and defiant to Catholic teaching. Her opinions and claims have no authority to undermine Church teaching, and there is no possibility that she can go to the nearest strip mall and start her own version of the Catholic Church.
The church was NOT united for the first 1000 years: if you truly studied church history, you'd have learned about the Iconoclasts, the Church of East, and the Oriental orthodox churches, all of which claim apostolic succession 48:41
Rod has WRITTEN about Church history for the last 20 years. He is a top-notch scholar.
Because the Old and New Testament Scriptures are the divinely-revealed, written Word of God, Catholics venerate the Scriptures as they venerate the Lord’s body. But Catholics do not believe that God has given us His divine Revelation in Christ exclusively through Scripture. Catholics also believe that God’s Revelation comes to us through the Apostolic Tradition and teaching authority of the Church.
What Church? Scripture reveals this Church to be the one Jesus Christ built upon the rock of Saint Peter (Matt. 16:18). By giving Peter the keys of authority (Matt. 16:19), Jesus appointed Peter as the chief steward over His earthly kingdom (cf. Isaiah. 22:19-22). Jesus also charged Peter to be the source of strength for the rest of the apostles (Luke 22:32) and the earthly shepherd of Jesus’ flock (John 21:15-17). Jesus further gave Peter, and the apostles and elders in union with him, the power to bind and loose in heaven what they bound and loosed on earth. (Matt. 16:19; 18:18). This teaching authority did not die with Peter and the apostles, but was transferred to future bishops through the laying on of hands (e.g., Acts 1:20; 6:6; 13:3; 8:18; 9:17; 1 Tim. 4:14; 5:22; 2 Tim. 1:6).
By virtue of this divinely-appointed authority, the Catholic Church determined the canon of Scripture (what books belong in the Bible) at the end of the fourth century. We therefore believe in the Scriptures on the authority of the Catholic Church. After all, nothing in Scripture tells us what Scriptures are inspired, what books belong in the Bible, or that Scripture is the final authority on questions concerning the Christian faith. Instead, the Bible says that the Church, not the Scriptures, is the pinnacle and foundation of the truth (1 Tim. 3:15) and the final arbiter on questions of the Christian faith (Matt. 18:17). It is through the teaching authority and Apostolic Tradition (2 Thess. 2:15; 3:6; 1 Cor. 11:2) of this Church, who is guided by the Holy Spirit (John 14:16,26; 16:13), that we know of the divine inspiration of the Scriptures, and the manifold wisdom of God. (cf. Ephesians 3:10).