Adventure Bike Truth
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- Опубликовано: 2 мар 2022
- Adventure Bike Truth - Marketing V Reality
I take a look at what the marketing people tell us about adventure bikes and compare that to reality.
Video footage from:
MADtv: • Video
ADV Pulse: • 2022 Husqvarna Norden ...
Visordown Motorcycle Videos : • The 10 BEST Adventure ...
Million Dollar Bogan: • Trapped in the Austral...
Big Bike Adventures: • Africa Twin in the Des...
Finally someone that gives a true review!! YES!!! I have an Africa Twin and would trade it for nothing!! I love this bike! But it's just like this review says.. it's for touring and a little off road (gravel roads).. not heavy off road or single tracks!!!
Thanks for your honest comment Bert. I too loved my Africa Twin for off road touring, but in the end I wanted to explore further off road and needed a smaller/lighter bike.
Yup. Have had mine for 100k miles now, realized early on that she's a pig in single track. Everything else though, its the perfect bike for me. I love the platform she's goldilocks!
That is why you have two bikes....
I have an Africa Twin. It has its limitations compared to a crf 450.. but I most definitely rock this thing off road on muddy single track and on the jumps. But I’m also 26 and pretty large so I can handle it easier.
Exactly. People see the ads, IG posts and forget that even pro riders have difficulty using big bikes. Ask most of them and they will say their favorite bikes are smaller.
I used to ride KTM 690 Enduro. That was a truly capable off road bike. Rode it in every terrain possible, even rode it on a sandy motocross track once. But even that bike felt too heavy and powerful. The way that I see it, the main advantages that big adventure bikes have is that they are far more comfortable on long trips, can carry much more cargo, and have bigger fuel tanks. But smaller bikes are far better at pretty much everything else.
Yup
How dare you lay bare the truth, the big boys may cry.
yeah the KTM 690 might be too heavy already
I never felt it was about the power but about the weight. There's nothing more scary than riding a 300kg travel bike up a steep ascend knowing if you screw up you might have a broken leg.
I once owned a Husqvarna TE 610 (non E) from 1995 which only weighed 120kg wet and 180kg with luggage. It had like ~65 hp and was super controllable.
In my eyes that was the perfect adventure bike (after I fitted a 15 liter tank for ~300km range)
Since it wasn't really road legal (due to emissions you had to reduce the power to 24hp) I sold it after a year or so but I had lots of fun with it and even fitted some supermoto rims for street use. I drove it with full power all the time of course.
Nowadays I only ride street bikes (cbr 600 pc35) but I always think back to that great time when I owned this super lightweight, high performance Enduro
Exactly I ride a Husqvarna 701 Supermoto with 70/30 tyres and the only thing it is good for is twisty roads, gravel and hard terrain. It's 150 kg will prevent any Enduro type usage. For what do people buy a 300 kg bike with dishwasher? Get a car. The Porsche is faster on the road and more comfy, in a van you can sleep and with a Hilux you can carry your bike with you for the suicidal hillcllimb.
701 all day
Here in India a 100cc bike does everything at everywhere for years without fail 😊
So true. I've been lucky enough to have a riding adventure through Rajasthan. From what I saw, a 100cc is enough for Mum, Dad a five year old AND a baby. All at once 😂. I take my hat off to Indian motorcycle riders. You guys are something else. I saw one guy on the freeway between Pushkar and Jaipur who was leaning back on his bike, controlling the handlebars and throttle with his feet while he rolled a cigarette. Mad skill.
@@DmacDomage 👍
In Africa, Bajaj and TVS 100 cc bikes rule
It does here too in the US. Ask every grom/z125 rider
Same in Mexico 🇲🇽 brother
I have an 05 GS 1200 and I love it.
I'll go on gravel roads occasionally.
We see these beautiful slow motion videos but realize that the people riding in them are many times the equivalent to an Olympic athletes.
I don't watch the Olympics then go jump on the parallel bars and say, hold my beer and watch this!!
Truthful video, thanks.
When I tried off road riding over fifty years ago, I immediately concluded that any bike that weighed more than a hundred kg should stay on the pavement. I could pick up my CZ 250 when I dropped it and carry on. When people began claiming that bikes weighing more than 220 kg were suitable for off-road adventuring, I went to a Honda dealer and looked at an Africa Twin, just to see how big it really was. I decided that somebody was lying. As Itchy Boots Noraly nears the end of her solo journey from South America to the northern reaches of Alaska, her Honda CRF 300 has proven the lie. Smaller really is better.
So true, most of the heavyweight adventure bikes stay on the hard stuff, especially when they are fully loaded. I’m just back from NZ on my CRF300L and it was the perfect choice for a mix of terrains and quick enough for the A to B sections too.
I think it is slowly filtering through that the big macho bikes are no match for the lightweight dual sports when the going gets rough
@@xcaceuk A crf300 weighs in at +150kg, A 690/701 about 150kg....so don't agree with your 100kg statement
@@marcelfacd I think what he was on about was just size and weight. The lighter the better. And to tall creates problems when you need to put a foot down to help. These adventure bikes are great for road use. But would kill you off road. I have a adventure bike a gravel road is as near off road as I would take it. I have a few old enduro bikes for the harder trails.
An Africa Twin weighs almost 225lbs more than a Honda 300L. And Noraly is a light person. And she still gets stuck, and has issues getting up loose, rocky hills. Those huge displacement bikes wouldn't make it.
@@adrianrouse5148 so am I , but to say any bike that weighs more then 100kg should stay on pavement is plain bulls**t. A fully equipped dakar bikes weighs about 150-165 kg….my 690 150kg…..dare me.
You just said what I've felt for years. Downsized to a KTM 390 Adventure and couldn't be happier when the paved road ends.
İ have 250 Ktm Adventure and it is a great bike. On and off road.
Didn't someone once said that an "adventure" is to take inappropriate equipment to out of the way places?...
For long distance touring and exploring, those big bikes are kind of nice... but for exploring off-road, we'll stick to our WR250R thank you.
@@ugrdncr They dont make a KTM 250 Adventure. They make an EXC dual sport bike.
@@bradsanders6954 KTM makes a 250 Adventure in India
@@bradsanders6954 we have the 250 adventure in Greece
Dude, you are hilarious -- I laughed out loud in multiple parts of this video! Your no-hype delivery and dry humour are perfect. This is the brutally honest commentary that no one else will do. I have a Super Ténéré...so I know a thing or two about "heavy" (it even surpasses your Africa Twin weight-wise). It's a "travel bike", and a very good one; but I shan't be taking it on much more than gravel or dirt...sure as heck won't be going through mud or sand!
Haha... thanks mate, I'm glad I could make you smile. The Super Ten sounds like an awesome travel bike 👍
As a rider of a +600 Lbs 1250cc BMW GSA I concur. Now looking to add another bike for off road. Around 300CC.
Don't be a sissy. Got a scrambler 1200 as my first bike, and I'm enjoying sand and mud. I don't even have any real skills.
The Super Ten is a big heavy bike, surprisingly does better then I expected offroad, just don't drop it.
Yet another spot on video, Shonky! I’ve always been a Honda geek, and anyone who is has no doubt drooled over an ad or brochure of an Africa Twin. Picked up my 300 rally a few weeks ago, and the dealer had a used AT I looked over and sat on for a bit. BEAUTIFUL machine, but I would never even think of attempting a back country ride on that monster! Week long touring ride? Absolutely where that machine fits. Hats off to those who choose to wrestle these huge machines, for me I’ll just pack a bit lighter! Ride Red, ride on!
I could not agree with you more!!
I upgraded from Gs1200 to T700.
My next upgrade will be a CRF300👍
Well done! Yes, UPGRADE! Not Down Grade. very few realize that less could prove More, I don't understand why so many people are afraid to go down in CC like its a Sin to ride smaller CC bikes.
very sensible
KLE500 4ever
@@ripmax333 because of marketing. You need bigger bikes. IYou need 100, 200hp and you only 30 40. I bought a CB500x back in 2021 , and put it down on my first dirt road. It had 870km at that moment. Ok, I don't have experience with bikes on dirt road and don't ride it hard, but at 5km/h, the fork didn't take the bump and I was on the ground. Now I'm looking at Himalayan or a new jawa. But I don't think I would keep my cb500x for long.
ADV bikes in the 450-480 lbs range are truly the perfect all rounder bikes. Now if only we could convince one of the Japanese companies to make a Tuareg so I can have cruise control.
Choose the right tool for the job. It really is that simple. I have an Africa Twin and a KTM 350. Would I use the Africa Twin for riding technical single track or straight out rough as guts bush bashing? Of course not, it’s highly capable for what it is, but it’s too heavy. By the same token, would I load up the 350 with gear, slab it out 1000 ks to Broken Hill, camp overnight, and then spend a week riding The Flinders? Absolutely not. Two completely different bikes, two completely different purposes. It’s like comparing a shotgun to a rifle: they are both firearms, but that is about the only thing they have in common.
Finally someone with common sense, thank you!
This comment should be pinned. Exactly my thoughts. Not everything is black or white.
Nailed it!
You can understand the level of actual experience at off road riding that people have by their comments.
The best bike is the most comfortable you feel when you are on . Simple, neat and concrete truth. Kudos mate, agree with you on each point.
Thanks
Right on point. I was almost sucked in recently. What saved me was that all those big adventure bikes were all too freaking tall for me. On top of that they failed to properly address short riders. So, I was so pissed that I bought a used Sport Touring bike instead and I'm very happy with my decision since I had enough money left to buy a much smaller 300 cc dirt bike so I could go and do some real adventure. Thanks for proving I did the right thing.
I was VERY reticent about buying a Royal Enfield Himalayan because of the minimal HP - eventually the price and the fact it was the only “Adventure” type bike that I could “flat-foot” decided for me. Having been riding for over 50 years and numerous bikes from a “Postie” to Trail Bikes and big HP Suzukis / Kawasaki road bikes, the 24HP was initially a concern BUT if you forget about electronics completely controlling how you ride and actually use the gears as they were meant to be used, 24HP is sufficient even for cruising at 100kph on the highway but becomes eminently suitable and useable in the bush - especially with similar Torque figures. I can slowly chug up steep loose inclines, while my mates on big KTM’s and BMW’s are sliding hopelessly backwards with their rear wheels spinning at insane revs. Yep - a big difference between marketing dreams and reality.
I've had a Himalayan for about 4 years and it's a fantastic bike. I'm a big guy and I took it and all my gear on a 2000km backroads trip a couple summers ago. It was perfectly capable and gave me no problems.
My 1090R has Off-Road mode on Traction Control. It eats the steep gravel roads effortlessly. In any adventure ride the pavement is 80% and the dirt 20%. Yes, it's heavy to pick up but that rarely happens.
Ive rode Himalayan on some pretty long trips and the horsepower shortage was never felt. I daily ride RC390 so half the HP on touring might feel less but the bike gives plenty of torque at low RPMs so I never felt I needed the acceleration I'm used to. Ive done light offroading on it using 17 inch street tyre on back and it still held up pretty okay.
New himalayan 450 will be better
I have a himalayan, I have been told by guys on 900cc's "holy crap that thing moves better than I thought" the bike has been amazing. It takes me everywhere, no issues. When I tell people what the engine in it is they always make a face, but I know the thing rides wherever I want it to
I bought a DR650 years ago. Not even sure why I bought it, because I was very unexcited by it. Turned out to be a superb bike. Very capable in most conditions, comfortable, next to no maintenance. Guy who owned it before me rode it from the US to Brazil and back. Now I just stick to dirt. That's where I have the most fun.
Same here: got a DR650 a few years ago and can't stop riding it! Loving it so much, that I sold my "modern" adventure bike and kept the DR...
I had a 1991 Dr 650 Rs, 46hp, kick start, air cooled, 170kg..loved it so much. It's such a pity that all Japanese motorcycle manufacturers have given up on this market of simple, easy to ride and easy to maintain enduro bikes. I miss motorcycles like the XT, KLR, XL or DR.
@@massaberlin the new klr is pretty simple as far as adv bikes go.
I downsized from a KLR650 (great big guy bike) to a DR650 (I'm only 5'4") and it's better for me in every way. I consider the DR650 my large adventure bike as I have an XT225, although I like my TW200 even better on hilly trails.
Felt the same with my KLR. Quickly became my fave bike
Great points. I love my V-Strom 650; I put some Michelin 80/20 adventure tires on it and it is surprisingly capable off-road, but I have no illusions of it being a hardcore off-road bike. I spend most of my time on-road, but I like being able to turn off and explore wherever I feel like it. If I had a second bike, it would definitely be a small dual-sport.
I like the names you suggested: "Travel bike" or "Off-road Touring bike". That's pretty much how I see mine.
Hands down the best video essay I have seen on the subject. Well done, and I 100% agree with you!
While I agree mostly with this video, its about being true to yourself in what you want, what you're going to do and the compromises you are willing to make.
Are the big ADV bikes heavy? yes. The down side to it is when you gotta pick them up, or go down slippery steep trails. But the upside is I can carry all my camp gear, get where I am going without being blown all over the road from trucks, feeling more stability on gravelly roads. Do you need 100HP? Yes and no. On the trails with no luggage? No I agree, its a hinderance more than help. BUT 100HP with a bike full of luggage, on a freeway that everyone is doing minimum 85-90mph, yes. ADV bikes are geared to do everything. In this, you are going to do nothing the best. I am personally ok with it as I understand the limitations of my bike, I understand other bike are better in some situations than mine, but by the same token, those better bikes off road are way worse in other areas than my bike. Would I want to take the light and nimble 390 down to the dragon on the freeway with all my gear, hell no. Is it better on single track than my Tiger? In some circumstances, yes, in others no. One example I noticed is the 390 being so light is horrible compared to the Tiger on things like deep gravel roads. The Tiger feels like a boat cutting the water, easy to steer and maneuver on it, the 390 feels like a rowboat in high waves in it. Like anything, you got to get to know your capabilities, and also important, your bikes. (I own a 2015 too-top-heavy Triumph Tiger Explorer XC and a KTM 390 Adventure (which has been in the shop since Oct :/ ).
I carried all my camp gear etc on a Honda Varadero.... No not the 1000, I had the 125, with some 50/50 road/trail tyres, and it was awesome. Took longer to get somewhere to then be where I wanted, but it went places.
Most bikes are capable of adventure, mopeds(100/150ccs) no problem climbing in mountainous off road areas in my country and 3up, or in some occasion more than 3 people on it.
I finally had time to take my CRF300 Rally for a 3 day trip last weekend, took it from Belgium to Luxemburg and was able to pack everything I needed and more tbh.
Only carried food for one day but that's because my winter sleeping bag when compressed takes up about as much space as food for 4 days... I even carried a camping chair with me and a rather large 2 person tent so I could keep all my gear inside to keep it from freezing during the night.
The test came when I entered Luxemburg, on the windy roads where signs indicated a 15% incline and it did it quite easily...
On the way back I was on a steep incline doing about 90 km/h and only then did I have to shift back to 5th because my speed dropped a little and it got through it doing 90 easily.
I tend to avoid highways, which I have always been doing, even with my larger Diversion900 back in the day because I find it boring.
But that said, even with all my gear on the Rally, it behaved as expected, sure it was a tiny bit more work in the strong winds but not really much more than on my Diversion, my guess is that despite it's weight it also had a larger "side surface" which sorts of made it a large sail for side winds :)
Have yet to do offroad with all my luggage on it since I haven't had the time to go out to places where offroading is legal or at least tolerated.
I think the (lack of) power on smaller bikes is often times judged incorrectly as being insufficient.
The big BMW GS has always been my dream bike since I watched Long Way Round but when I finally saved up enough money to get one, I realized that I wouldn't be able to handle it offroad so I looked at smaller bikes and settled on the Rally.
Hope to get a BMW GS as well at some point, but tbh, for the kind of riding I want to do with all the luggage I need, I have found that the Rally is sufficient :)
thats pure bs we did montain pass in svaneti and trip around Georgia on 250-300cc bikes, and tell you what we passed heavy bmws on trails with our bikes...
The reality is adventure bikes sell you on something the bike can't really do. Have a tiger 800 and would not even think of taking it in anything more difficult than gravel roads. Just too heavy. Only 5% of anyone that buys a tiger 800 will use it in serious stuff and most of them would complain and find it more exhausting than fun.
I'm on my third adventure bike in 20 years. For older riders they offer the most relaxing riding position. I occasionally go up gravel roads, but have no interest in serious off-roading.
Cheers mate! The truth.
I rode my 12 year Honda SH 300 through the hills, on stock scooter tyres 😂😂😂😂 and through dirt water and mud and had awesome fun 🎉🎉🎉 Ok, that's probably insane but it was 1000% fun chalenging myself to stay up straight... And I had nothing to lose...
To me, ultimate all-round bike is Honda NC750 with offroad tyres... Low revs hi torque 54hp is perfect for offroad, and you can do 160 kmph on the highway for 3,8 lit./100km average...
Cheers.
Agreed, I’d never take a Africa twin to the dunes. But I would 100% take a AT on a RTW trip though the Himalayas and Pamir highway. When I think “adventure” that’s what comes to mind, not mud bogging or single track or dunes, that’s what dirt bikes and dual sports are for.
Thank you for bringing reality out.
Many people fall in to traps emotionally and can't handle the bike.
Thank you again
🇮🇳🙏
I actually had a deposit on an AT abs was convinced it was the be all end all ADV for me. But luckily before the 2022s came in I had a realization that I’d really have more capability and a better time on a dual sport. I’m 2 months in on my 300L Rally and loving every minute of it
Great decision Travis. The 300L Rally has opened up so many more possibilities for me.
Adventure bikes have the same problem as Mountain bikes. There is no beer, women, or good restaurants out in the wilderness.
I cannot believe what I just watched. A bloke that actually knows what he is talking about. Good Job!
Thanks mate.
I took my Multistrada with standard Pirelli 17 inch tires across Africa - South Africa, Namibia, Angola etc - over hills, mountains, deserts, sea, sand and much more - no issues except for burst backtires which I had to get guys to fly in spares. Most awesome trip - alone - but then I was at that time seriously competing in S1 Supermoto Nationals as well as Off-road races such as Roof of Africa etc. It can be done, and most enjoyable - camping in the veldt, where you want, not seeing another human for 100kms. At exactly 118km/h, the Ducati lifts out of the sand and becomes a plaything, wheelies galore... What you said is 100% accurate though as you will need experience to do it and the crappy feeling of trying not to crash an expensive bike in the middle of nowhere. The Multi itself came through with flying colours - with the last couple of 100km's home, flat-out on highways. My reason was that I still wanted a quick bike on tar with off-road abilities. That in itself is a complete and utter BS statement from marketeers as my first trip from South Africa to France through Africa was on a standard BMW RT with full fairings - NOT an off-road at all. As you mentioned - weight kills it. The problem here is also - even if you use a smaller bike, all the gear you have to take along also weighs a ton - making small bikes terrible on tar. I'm ranting more than giving my previous experiences but I would still take a larger, more powerful bike - what is now deemed "middle weight", rip off all the crap you do not need, make it as light as possible, and just go for it - add more powerful lights, try and get rid of all electronics..but this time more relaxed and not the almost 300km per hour top speeds that you used to do. My incoherent 2c worth...
Spot on, mate! I sold my CRF 250 Rally for a Ducati Desert Sled thinking it's more Adventure Ready with that big powerful L-twin engine, retro scrambler offroad ready looks but I was wrong and now I am getting a CRF 300 Rally again! It's small, lightweight, and it will go anywhere you take it. I have taken my Rally up the high mountain roads in Nepal, so much fun and confidence inspiring! That little single cylinder Honda is the perfect machine for offroad touring!
I totally appreciate your video.
This is applicable to all advertized items.
This is what i learned to be expectation management.
I can't even begin to add up all times me with a sad face when toys didn't do what I saw them doing on the commercial.
And now, my golden rules are;
-Sleep it over before purchasing
-Try before I buy
-Talk to people, ask them about their experience/tell them my plan or expectation.
You had me laughing outloud 😅
Great review. Getting older now heavy bikes are more difficult. You have perfectly demostrated the down falls of heavy bikes in slippery conditions. You have have helped reset my mind in the next choice of bike.
Be honest about your intended use and you’ll choose the right bike.
Get a small bike, but consider how you’ll get to those single tracks.
Get a big bike and learn how far you personally can take it.
I have a big, heavy Super Ténéré, that works great for where I live; more touring focused (as stated), but It does off road surprisingly well.
Exactly!
"Get a small bike, but consider how you’ll get to those single tracks." EXACTLY! The big bikes help you get to those places where you can veer off on dirt roads and trails. Once there, you might wish you had a smaller, more agile bike, but that wouldn't be the bike that got you there.
100%, I have the S Tenere too, only since I have no adventure/offroad skills or intentions.. But I need it for the road mostly so it works for that purpose. Also, since I am touching 60, I prefer the space and riding position as well as the wind protection. The one point I have to agree with fully and strongest, I believe the big bikes were always too heavy in my mind to take it on the sand or any undulations, once you start loosing it, there is no recovery or comeback. you (I) am going down.
I agree. Here in CA, any freeway travel needs 75mph+ capability just to stay in the slow lane (to get to your destination). So it's all back roads on a light bike or being honest about the smooth unpaved roads for the heavy ones.
Yep ! I owned a GS and sold it for a DR single. Did the GS turn heads? Yes, but only when I passed a cafe. Did the DR turn heads? No, but it went bloody everywhere. I rode like I was 16 again. Light, no shiny paintwork to scratch. Going to try an even lighter CRFRally next.
I learned the motto ‘less power is more’ when it comes going off the beaten track !
Great vid Shonky 😊!
The bad thing about buying a DR is that it might be the last bike you ever buy
The best and most truthful video I have watched in the last 12 months. Cheers buddy well done
Upgraded from a Versys 650 to R1250 GSA. It made travelling long distance more pleasurable, and that's what I do in 99% of my rides. I took it on unpaved roads a few times but I am not delusional enough to think I can copy those athletes in commercials.
I agree 💯!! That’s one of the reasons I sold my KLR 650. Just to big and heavy. I’m 5’6 and couldn’t Imagine riding a H-D Pan American in the same places I rode my KLR. Awesome video!! Cheers from Canada 🇨🇦
Thanks Mark, glad you like the video. The marketing guys think you are ready for that H-D Pan America and are willing to sell you one for a great price!
Same here. Sold my Klr and bought a Drz. Now I’m happy!
But klr is not big, just the right size imo.
Had big bikes for years...then realized the most fun and enjoyment I had was on the smaller ones.
I've gone from BMW R1150GS to Honda Transalp 600V to Surron Ultra Bee. Each downsize saved me about 100kg. The Ultra Bee is 85kg and I can pick it up time and time again. It's not a travel bike since it's electric but it takes me on insane terrain that I wouldn't have dared on my previous bikes.
The BMW's were a nightmare in Mongolia where I live, for Charlie and Ewan when the going to rough. Even the Honda Transalp got bogged down in the Gobi sands when I tried it. I became exhausted from picking it up and it's only a "mid-weight" adventure bike.
For petrol bikes, I think a maximum of 250cc is probably okay but I look at weight first and 100kg is about the most I want to deal with. There's precious few motorcycles with petrol engines in that range. That's one of the reasons I went electric.
Thanks for the video, I've been thinking about the smaller lighter Honda XR150L and the more I learn, the more I realize that smaller and lighter is the logical choice for off-roading.
For what it’s worth, I own a 1090 Adventure R, my dad owns an Africa twin, I know it’s not ever going to be the fastest bike on single track but I’ve put 30k miles on it (in under 3 years), ridden across the country, out of the country, ridden single track in the middle of nowhere, I truly have had many adventures on it. I decided buying a bike with that much capability would test me as a rider and improve my skills and it’s done that quite well. It has a ton of trail rash and shows proper use. I really have crossed rivers, ridden over mountains, sand, mud, etc.
You have a great point, it’s a big undertaking for a lot of riders, but so is hopping on a sportbike, 2 stroke dirt bike, or big Harley. There’s always more people encouraging you to try them then people trying to caution you. And to that I say riding a motorcycle is a dangerous endeavor, you throw caution to the wind every time you get on one, and if you’re not grinning ear to ear when you dump your 500lb $10k+ ADV bike you’re going about motorcycling the wrong way.
You give a great review of the problems with heavy adventure bikes. I have been going on somewhat long multiday group rides using a Suzuki DRZ400. The guys with the 1000cc+ bikes need to be really big and very experienced to handle those bikes where we go. The DRZ is very capable on the highway at 70-75mph, but really shines off road.
A man after my own heart...."Big - Adventure - Bike" don't go together. If it's big you can only ride highways, how is that an adventure? These electronic gimmicks are all bullshit. "Just get out and ride"...correct. I am 71 have a Vespa in Europe and tour Portugal. I have a 350 Enfield in Thailand and go everywhere I can...with the wife on the back...sometimes she has to get off..... Your report is spot-on.
Nailed it. I have a DRZ400S, been riding for 35yrs and the stock “dual sport” tires were absolutely treacherous off the road. With knobby tires it’s a true “adventure bike”.
I fully agree. These big bikes cost a fortune and includes massive tech, but most riders don't use half of their ability under normal circumstances. I was almost suck into the marketing hype, but fortunately saw through it. I bought a Honda NC750X in 2014 and spent almost half its original price in luggage and other upgrades to make it comfortable as a two-up tourer. It was still almost a third of the price of a basic large adventure bike. We have since toured our country, and a few others, over a distance of almost 100 000km and still have not spent as much as the price of a big bike. It is more than powerful enough to travel national speed limits with ease and we have had awesome adventures, even on dirt roads.
Well done mate, sounds like you have a great bike for you and your partner.
thanks for the comment. im buying an nc750x next week after a 40 year hiatus from riding. im going to use it mainly for an every day ride but would like to take my wife on it on occasional long trips. any thoughts on 2 up touring on it? thanks
@@tschoonhoven2011 Unless you love the massive power of the liter plus sport tourers and racing friends through mountain passes, the NC will fill all your needs. It will exceed the national speed limit with luggage and a pillion if you want, but runs best up to 140 km/h fully loaded. It has enough power to pass cars at national speeds, but you need to ride it like a car. The torque is very good at low revs. The seats can be hard over long distances and you will need to make it more comfortable or use e.g. Airhawk cushions. Although it is intended as a daily commuter, small improvements can turn it into an excellent tourer. I extended the pillion pegs further forward to better the leg angle for my wife, added Honda topbox and luggage, added heated grips and a touring screen, etc. We mostly tour two-up and, as mentioned above, have done many kilometers that included some dirt roads and we use about half the fuel that our friends with their big bikes use. We tested most large adventure bikes over the years, but have not yet found a bike worthy of replacing the NC.
Well said mate “ a WISE ADV traveler once said NO ONE ☝️ complains about smaller and lighter “ just bigger and heavier “
Haha... That's great. I hadn't heard that before.
100% agree with all of this. I have similar discussions with friends all the time. Those big bikes are for highways and easy gravel roads ONLY.
You have brains and can think. And that is precisely what the bike seller don't want you to have.
You must dream, instead of thinking.
Love the BEEPs lol. I work at a motorcycle shop where we work on Japanese sport, dirt and cruisers. Whenever an adventure bike comes In we can't wrap our heads around how anyone could possibly take those tall, massive things off road. Your video solidifies this in my mind. Maybe the tenere 700 could handle it as a lighter, "smaller" bike. But I agree anything sub-500cc would be great offroad. Cheers!
Tenere 700 weighs more than 200kgs! Bonkers!
It's Funny. I categorise this advice in 2 groups :-
1. You NEED the big adventure bike - From people who spend most or all of their time on road
2. You WANT a smaller bike - From Offroaders, who've had to pick up a bike 8 or 9 times a day, every day.
Adventure is what you make of it, and if you're going places to see them, why do you want 100hp to fly past at 70+ ? You're supposed to be seeing places. I've go 68hp, and I never open full throttle, I do wind up the speed a bit, but can't recall going Wide open on the grip.
It's taken be a while to understand that the journey is more enjoyable at a slower speed.
Location makes a difference 😁 herein Australia the phrase "just up the road" can mean anything from 300m to 3 days ride. Horses for courses.....
While we have some stunning scenery, three days of red dust and Spinifex is much more enjoyable at highway speeds
In contrast, Tasmania is a state where travelling on a 300 would-be my recommendation
@@tazpartridge1612 You're right Taz, "Horses for Courses".
I'm not trying to tell anyone what bike to get, just pointing out that you need to make your own choices, not just listen to the marketing hype.
The much needed reality check for every adv daydreamer 😊
(Like me) who know that they can really do with a Smaller rally bike but they "need" that big bike
Thank you
Got a CRF250 Rally and it's the best bike I've ever had. Does everything I need it to and goes everywhere I want to go. I will admit it could be lighter but it's still manageable.
Edit: One other gripe is the slipper ring in the clutch. I swapped my clutch with a CBR300 pack. The stiffer springs and lack of slipper lets you use a lot more of the low end grunt rather than top end power, which reinforces the point that you don't always need high power for off roading.
I have a CRF300l and was getting a bit obsessed about getting a new AT. Thanks for bringing me back to my senses!
Hi Dale, the AT is a great bike but just remember, it can't go everywhere you take the CRF300l as easily. 👍
Your video was great and eye-opening. I will keep my CRF300 here in Nicaragua and points south then maybe the AT for the States later on. 👍all the motos here are -150 anyway.
@@daletalaplaya5086 Great choice 👍
Yes! I couldn't understand ADV bikes until I started to think of them as touring rigs that can venture off-road without falling over.
That's a great explanation of these big adventure bikes.
@@ShonkyProductions if they were marketed more as "Dual Sport Touring" bikes, I think there would be less marketing fluff (though obviously, "adventure" bikes sells, just like "overlander" bullshit 4x4 rigs do)
I keep my Africa Twin away from mud because it's too tall/heavy, and the rear immediately breaks loose and tries to kick out from under you in the muck. BUT, for interstate cruising at 80+ miles / 130+ kilometers an hour on the highways, then hitting rock and gravel service roads to explore, it's sublime. You're never worried about dragging exhaust or cracking the engine casing from a random rock.
Depending on how Honda handles the new Trans Alp, I may be downsizing from the CRF1100 to that 750cc build, but the trade off here in Wyoming is < 500lbs bikes are very easily blown off the highways. Even the big liter bikes can find themselves on the shoulder or getting pushed into the other lane by gusts.
I rode a 125cc scooter around most of Asia and jungles off-road. Brilliant. I have big bikes back home, 1200ninja, ttr600, zzr1100 and others. They are stupidly powerful. But it turns out you don’t need a big bike when you’re hung like a horse
You said what everyone knows out loud! I have a friend who bought a T7 and sold it in less than a month because he had zero skills offroad! Now he rides a Ducati Multistrada V4 and keeps her on the tarmac. For me has an experienced enduro and motocross rider, the T7 was sweet when he let me ride it. The thing is that marketing tries to sell the bikes like they will make anyone a great offroad rider but actually you have to have the skill and experience! Great video.
Thanks mate, that's it exactly... They seel the idea that you'll be able to ride it like they show on the advertising.
Every bike I ever owned was a adventure bike, my street bikes took me on many adventures on and off road.
That's exactly it... We decide what is adventure for us.
Not wrong.. my $25 1972 Hodaka Wombat 125 is on its fifth speedometer
This exactly what I needed to see! I’m looking for a dual sport and ADV bike, tons of marketing with KTM and software upgrades . What I needed was the reality check and this video help assess the difference!
Glad to help. Just work out where and how you like to ride and choose a bike that lets you do that with ease.
Being able to leave my garage, ride interstate at 90mph fully loaded, race up and down mountains roads fast at full lean against traditional sport tourer, then ride off-road, then ride back home to my garage is why I enjoy my 1190 adventure. That is a dawn to dusk full day ride.
To really enjoy off-road might mean just using a trailer and proper dual sport or dirt bike.
Great Video. I totally agree with the offroad capability of the smaller ADV bikes. But I'm a 300-pound dude riding 600 pounds BMW GSA. Even while getting my buddy's KLR 650 unstuck from the mud, the KLR seemed like a tiny bike. I've had a 2016 Yamaha Super Tenere and recently a Pan America Special in the past. I've had several dirt bikes like the WR450 and such. The most significant advantage bigger bikes have over smaller bikes is the extended range. I live in Northern Nevada. Nevada is one of the most mountainous states in the US. The average valley between mountains is 70 miles long by 15 to 30 miles wide. These smaller single-cylinder ADV bikes can quickly deplete a gas tank just getting from one mountain range to the next. Not to mention their comfort level at 80mph speeds.
There are many scenarios that a Large ADV Bike outshines the smaller bikes except for the technical ability, of course. Most Deserts are enormous, and so are the bikes I like to ride in them. For myself, I'm going to look just as awkward riding a 300cc Rally with 5 gallons of gas strapped to the back as I do digging out my 600 pound GSA from a sand dune. LOL. Love the vid. New sub. Keep it up. On a side note, the Pan America is far from an adventure bike; it was a total POS that blew the engine at 5000 miles. If you get time, check out my vids.
Hi Adventure Glide, thanks for your detailed reply. I agree with you 100%... it's about people making their own choice about what best suits their individual needs, not what marketing tells them they need.
The 300 Rally is certainly not for everyone, especially if you are a bigger guy. I'm only small and light so it suits me fine, while I can, and have in the past, ridden big bikes, the 300 suits me. I don't want people to buy a 300, I'd just like them to make informed choices.
I have had a quick look at your videos... you have some amazing riding areas and I hope one day to get over there. I'll be watching more tonight.
👍
@@ShonkyProductions Sat on a 300 standard at a dealer and it almost turned into a hardtail. I think I had 2 1/2 inches of rear suspension left. However I only weigh about 250 lbs. These days however, it would not be safe to ride for me without spending 4k in suspension upgrades.
I've wanted a GS ever since watching them roost through the Sahara dominating the Dakar back in the day. Well I finally got mine (a beautiful red 2013) a couple years ago. I've been riding dirt bikes my whole life so I was quite confident in my ability to take it off road and headed to this big sand pit I know well from dirt biking. Ripping down the gravel entry road I was so jazzed for the epic Roosting I was about to do.
Then I hit the soft sandy stuff with my 70/30 tires and images of expensive shiny parts bouncing and scraping along the ground ran through my head as this behemoth of a bike squirmed under me. I quickly turned around and headed back to firmer terrain. The GS is not a dirt bike.
At first I was a little bummed but since then I have fallen head over heals in love with the bike for what it actually is. A comfortable, stable and powerful sport tourer that can do light off-roading and look totally badass while doing it.
Gary, A lot of us have done very similar things. With my Africa Twin, I was sold by the advertising of it blasting over sand dunes through the desert but when I took it on a beach, I couldn't wait to get mack to the formed dirt roads.
that's just how ADVs ride in sand brother. I learned to ride my first motorcycle ever offroad on 70/30 tires in sand. It was exactly as you described, squirmy and all over. 400+lbs on the same size tires as your dirtbike means it will sink more, you just need more momentum to start "floating" across the sand.
I'd suggest to try again. Find a nice deep sand pit where there is no damage to be caused. And maybe drop the tire pressure a tiny bit, 22F/26R might help you.
Well it’s just a GS they don’t look that good
Thank you for this! Exactly why I’m considering the Himalayan or CRF 300. I have a street bike for road riding but I definitely would like to do some dual sport adventures
The real truth is...... motorcyclists are individuals and ride whatever bike they want. As a modern adventure bike owner, after over 40 years and 100plus !! bikes...... the real truth....... fantastic ! Comfort, modern safety devices, tall suspension that deals with poor road surfaces easily, more power than you will need most of the time - which is occasionally a good safety feature..... modern lighting, built for carrying luggage, tyres that can do both road and poor surfaces with relative ease.... and even a bit of proper off road.... I still run old style sport tourer bikes from 30 years ago but the truth is.... they are simply not as able as a modern adv road bike and thats the reality 👍
100%. Another happy RE Himalayan owner and its exactly what I was looking for. It will go almost anywhere I can take a dedicated dirt machine (50 years riding experience, including rock gardens in Colorado at 13k ft). And the RE or similar class dual sports will still do reasonable miles on hardtop when needed or desired. Lighter and simpler is better every day of the week and twice on Saturdays.
Been on one for couple years now & it's better than my last few bikes
The Himalayan is almost 200 kg.
Since when is Himalayan light. It's a best.
Love my Himalayan! So glad to read your comment! Agree %100 the Himalayan does everything amazingly well and handling is outstanding off-road.
@@samwood82770 the Himalayan is super light feeling because of its incredibly low center of gravity. My KLR weighs probably about the same but is four times as hard to throw around
That's why Royal Enfield have hit the sweet spot with the Himalayan, sturdy, 25hp, good fuel range, and inexpensive to buy/maintain. The bike is built to go anywhere in India, so it can handle whatever I throw at it.
Sounds perfect. I haven't ridden one yet, but am looking forward to testing one in the future.
@@ShonkyProductions it's slow as for HP but the torque is what pulls it through most stuff & it's brought on at a low idle, done many trails on it, did sputter out on EXTREME inclines, & is very top heavy in sand & mud but everything else has been wonderful few other nit piks but out weigh by the good stuff
a bit more power would be nice. the 400 should put out 30-35 hp but REs are old, slow tech.
@@franmitch3589 i never gave mine the chance to sputter out. if it was an extreme incline i was hitting it at full speed, full throttle, and wheelspin haha.
@@0xsergy actually it's a new engine design
i always remember this interaction i had with a guy in a local bicycle shop after i came back from a 2 week cycling tour in Taiwan with my mates.
i was there picking up a secondhand $500 bike and this guy was servicing his 2500 bucks bicycle. i had my cycling tan at that time and we struck up a conversation.
we spoke about the trip i just took and the adventure it was. and i remember him saying that he wished he could go on such an adventure but it was too expensive.
needless to say, i can't fathom why someone who spent 2500 on a bicycle cant spend less on the bike and more on actually riding a cheaper bike to more places.
so some people just like the idea of a machine who can take them places but not really into actually going places.
I’m glad to have gotten this perspective. Thank you
Before the Adventure Bike term was invented we called them trail bikes in UK. They were usually around 125 to 650 single cylinder two or four stroke machines. Back then you just picked the tool for what you wanted to do, much as you have.
Most of mine were either 400 or 600 cc four strokes. The latter being better on the road, the former better off-road.
When it came to what I called extreme trail riding it was a cross between a trials and trail bike. In my case a 1986 Honda TLR250R. 6 speed gearbox, so it could cruise at 55 to 60 mph on road, topping out at 70, but still climb very steep rocks and slopes. Twin fuel tanks as standard with around 60 mpg imperial gallon. The second tank was where the air filter normally is, as the filter was in the headstock which allowed the bike to keep running even when the exhaust and seat were under water. Anyhow you get my point.
These days however as I approach 70 I have an ‘adventure’ bike, but one with a 19” front wheel which has 2” less suspension travel than its more off-road orientated brother which has a 21”. So, my bike is just a motorcycle that can do gravel roads with my Dunlop Mutant tyres. That’s less than 1% of the time. What’s more important is it’s very comfortable on road, having way more suspension than a sports bike, a sit up riding position helps that too. The brakes are incredible, all of the above which I need for Scotland’s poorly surfaced tarmac backroads. Is it an adventure motorcycle? Yes, if you want it to be. It would take me around the world. To me it’s just a motorcycle, my 53rd one and does exactly what I want it to do at this stage of my life. It’s a far cry from what I started out on 55 years ago. If it’s got two wheels it’s whatever you want it to be…within its design limitations.
I dropped my DR650 on single track the other day. Stood up and picked it up from the low side of the hill. 42 bhp…plenty.
Smaller bikes are fun off-road but touring can be a bit uncomfortable. Bigger bikes are good for road touring but on dirt they are a pain. Everything is a compromise.
DR650 is in the sweet spot for both. Always aim for as close to that as possible on the smaller side. 👍🏻😁
I'm thinking the DR650 might be the sweet spot for me as well.
@@ronsexton3685 find a good recent model second hand one where the owner has spent a fortune on mods…it’ll save you spending 😀
@@ronsexton3685 Can't beat the DR - simple, effective, light, versatile and 1001 aftermarket accessories.
The last bit might be a drawback! 🤣
Think my mind is set on the cf Moto 450MT - light, nimble and all the power I need as I get older.
Spot on sir. Light weight for Offroad, heavyweight Onroad
I started my "adventure" some 20+ years ago on African Twin. First I thought I will never learn to handle or ride properly, bike was constantly stuck or on it's side. After years of try and regret I finally got myself much lighter KLX dual sport, which for me was more like a dirt bike and so much nicer to ride. Big bikes are travel bikes and hp is for highways.
Love my Tenere 700 but on all the trails I take it on I usually pass someone who's got there first in the family car.
😂
Adventure is what YOU make it.
That's my experience as well lol... Riding through some Titus canyon in Death Valley... Passing a family of four doing the same route in a Rav4 :))
@@alvk3996 meanwhile your out in the sun sweating balls and getting dehydrated lol
Those Subaru drivers are pretty damn brave though.
Congratulations. Stating the obvious is just what's needed sometimes. As I've gotten older my bikes are getting smaller - I'm 64 and my next bike will be a Honda XRE300 or Yamaha XT250 in Brazil. Now there's an adventure - even getting the visa verified!
Totally agree. Had big Triumphs which I still love, but after you've struggled to pick it up a few times and constantly nervous that you could be stranded somewhere off road you realise this. I now ride a KTM 390 ADV and it really can be an adventure riding it just about anywhere.
So funny. Just watching this 2 years late, but I call my 890 a dirt touring bike! Great video!!!
Thanks. You have a great Dirt Touring bike there with your 890 👍
I generally agree with you, and definitely don't follow the hype of needing the biggest, baddest, fastest, heaviest bike out there. The middle-weight range is really where it's at for balancing off road capability and on road comfort. I have a Tenere 700 I expect to adventure on for the next several years and really like the balance they've achieved here.
Yes, I agree. The middle-weight ADV bikes are very close to being the perfect "Adventure" bikes. But, only if you can handle their size and weight. I have a mate who is 6'6" and he throws one around like an enduro bike.
Enjoy your bike, you made a good choice.
👍
The T7 is a nice looking bike but way too heavy and also top heavy for solo adventure riding.
160kg or less is my ideal wet weight which once you add luggage is still considerable in muddy and Sandy conditions
Man, I really wish Honda would produce a "rival" to the Tenere :)
@@gokulkrishm51 they are working on it, a 750. However I still think the “perfect “ size would be a crf 450 rally, just like the 300 but on a 450 base. Or the 701/690 on the 500 platform with adventure kit, in other words a 901 on a 501 platform.
@@O_Xixas My ideal motorcycle would be a blend between the Africa twin and Tenere. There's no perfect motorcycle. To each their own.
started with a GS1200, found out it isn't the bike I need, bought a Tenere 700, found out I lode it is not the bike for adventure, i am nie loving my Crf 300 Rally, 10000km with 60% Of road, and much more to come.
i totally agree. all my bikes are great, but only the CRF I am capable to really find adventure without shitting my pants.
Damn! Finally! This is the single most informative, neigh BEST, motorcycle vid I've seen in a long time! I have a V-Strom-650 XT (not that big) and I had to stop riding at my local motorcycle park because it was the "wrong kind of bike" (too heavy). Now I'm thinking about downsizing to a 250 (I'm 5'6" 150 lb). Thanks for the confirmation that I'm not crazy!
WE're not crazy!
There is good reason why the bikes competing in the annual Dakar race are 200-450cc engine capacity
You hit the nail. I have an Africa twin and love it. I grew up in a similar gravel roads in Pakistan where it was normal living. I can't imagine having a +500 lbs (or + 700 in case of a GS) bike and lifting it up lol.
But the Africa Twin IS a 500+lb bike.
Great video, I totally agree, I never understood those really big bikes going off road if you’re unable to pick them up on your own
Exactly!
Yes! I have been telling people this for years. A lot of HP and mass is a huge liability off road.
I had an Africa Twin. Too much of a bear off road. Also had a CRF 300 rally. Great bike that was much more fun than the AT. I now have a TransAlp. Fantastic compromise. The 300 was the most fun bike of all though. If only they didn't come with crap suspensions...
If you look closely at the marketing videos, you can often see those big bikes aren't using the same tires that come on them from the factory. You know they mod the suspensions too.
Absolutely true brother, cutting through all the screens and filters that are bogging our senses by too much advertisements you have given a truthful opinion which I can relate to. In my younger days I had a blast with my Yamaha RX 100 2 stroke in almost all terrain. Now to revive those years I've set sights on the KTM 390 adventure but I know deep in my heart it will never be like the RX.
I had the Yamaha Super Tenere, awesome touring bike that is capable of going on unpaved roads. I traveled a lot on it. After pushing it out of the garage a while back, I decided it was too heavy to enjoy off road. Got a KTM 690, think it’s going to do the trick!
I think the best marketing win for adventure bikes is the rider skills element. They sell you a bike that is difficult to ride, then they sell you courses that teach you how to ride it. Day one of the course? Learn and practice the special technique needed to pick up your monster bike! This is the most important skill for ADV motorcycling.
Very true Bernie. I wonder how many adventure riders know the techniques or actually practice them before they go riding.
Sold My GSA1200, waiting for the arrival of my *KTM 390 Adventure*.
I 100% agree with all that you said brother!
This is the ultimate truth for those riders who want to do some serious off-roading.
Do you really want to wrestle a superheavy GS or Africa Twin? Or do you want a small and much lighter dirtbike to do some serious heavy exploring.
I think @itchy boots proofs everyone time and again that you can get everywhere on a CRF 300 Rally.
I myself am happy with my DL650. But I have no plans to go off-road. It's just a matter of the bike is a comfortable fit to my posture.
If I were to go off-roading, I would buy myself a used dirtbike and I would smile every time I pick it up after a fall. Knowing my V-Strom is undamaged waiting for the next ride!
I agree: bike weight is overwhelmingly important on anything more 'off=road' than simple gravel. I had an ancient XR 200 and that thing would go down once a day but I could always pick it up and it never destroyed itself or me. As for the quality argument I promise everyone that a CRF 300 Rally is at least as well built and of at least the same quality as any Euro bike of any spec at all - and I am currently a happy owner of a BMW road bike.
Bro 🙌🙌🙌 You’re making me feel better about my RE Interceptor with 47 HP and knobby tires. 😂
why? you were unsure of your decision? Trust me, if you start to like going deeper into offroad you would soon buy even a smaller, lighter motorcycle. been there.
Great video, and spot on. I just traded my Africa Twin for a smaller Z900RS. For the type of riding I actually do (weekend warrior, on road), the AT just wasn't well suited to me. The AT was a great bike, but definitely more than my skill level can use.
Great review, real and useful conclusions, excellent comparison between marketing and reality. Thank you a lot.
my Transalp 600... 30 years old... won in this category... xD
I've got a transalp 650, traded down from my gs 1200. Things a donkey eh. As long as you have the fuel you can just keep trudging along for days and days on end.
Pretty spot on. For myself I am happy to stay with my 657cc XR650L which has been on a diet so it is pretty light. 149kg with a full Clarke tank and decent suspension too. There is more fun to be had with a lighter bike. I still rate the 650 class aircooled bikes as a fantastic compromise that combine decent power, suspension and the ability to do things from mild to wild.
I just watched a couple of your videos and your bike does look very well setup. Congratulations on a great build.
Wow !! Nice !! That is lighter than my old XL500 wet weight !!
@@davidnobular9220One of my first bikes was an XL250!
They do seem like a good combination. I am after about 40 years thinking of getting a DR650. (shorter seat height, 34.8")
Thanks for giving a sober evaluation of reality. Really appreciate it.
Really loved your video. It really made lof of clarifications on the concepts. Thnks for this bro n pls continue making such. I have a 310gs bmw n love it but will never go higher on CC.
Thanks mate. I have been sampling bigger bikes lately, but they only show how much easier small bikes are when you take them off road.
I have a friend like that, he lives in downtown Toronto, Canada and rides a KTM Adventure 1290 I think, anyway the big KTM bike. All he does is riding around the city calling himself a "real" adventure rider while making fun of anyone riding a smaller bike. I would love to see him go off-road riding , just once.
Yes, I see a few of those riders too. I see them in the city and at the coffee shops and small town cafes. I never see dirt on their bikes...
Yup, just like the jackass with his Pan American in the video!😂
Goodbye 1250 GSA and hello CRF300L. I totally agree with your video, I am over trying to muscle heavy adv bikes thru tough tracks, mud & sand.
That is exactly what brought me to the smaller bike... not enjoying the ride because I was struggling with the weight of the Africa Twin. I could get through everything, but it wasn't enjoyable.
I totally agree with you. In remote area of Africa they are using cheap chinses 50cc to 250cc motorcycles and they are taking them to unbelievable places with heavy loads.
Light is right 👍
So I’m looking for a street legal go everywhere bike one that all I will basically need to do is put some dot knobs and go hit the trails. What are my options because the more I research the more I’m confused as to what bike I want to end up with. My background is dirt bikes and off road is where I do almost 100% of my riding now I’m more leaning towards a duel sport. With that in mind what bikes do y’all think would fit the bill. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Great video mate, love it. Marketing is to sell people on what they could do, not what they will do! 😜 The problem for marketers is they have to sell the same dream to many people with different intentions so they instead have to be broad and just excite the potential customer with fancy images and visuals. It’s like lotto, they sell tickets based on what you will do when you win, even though you won’t.
That's a great explanation!
It's pretty much the same for Jeeps and even Land Rovers that will never see dirt. The commercials a re great though.
Totally agree. I really want a fantic caballero 500 as that seems like the perfect option for decent offroad ability but also fun on-road
Sounds like a great bike.
I get what you are saying as I rode a 110cc honda the length of Vietnam but when I rode to Tuktoyaktuk on the Arctic Ocean I was glad I was on a 1090cc KTM for the thousands of kilometers of paved road before I got to the gravel. No one bike does it all but big adventure bikes do have a legitimate place in this world.
Thank you for being honest and giving the actual riders view & not the sellers story.
I got an nc700x as my first and current bike and the previous owner piled $2k+ in of mods onto it, mostly "ADV" mods. Most of what he added is actually useful but he only rode it 1500 miles over 7 years, so I'm thinking he had some aspirations that it's just not capable of fulfilling. It's a perfect commuter and cheap touring bike, which is what I got it for.