What do you think of Ikomikidomoe? How did Yamamoto fight it in a time before the Zanpakuto? Would you like to see this animated? Let me know your thoughts!
The Kasumiogi Clan from the Amagai Arc made blades specialized blades, note the Second Division blades can kill Hollows . Also they do have other weapons we just see at short timea
Concerning why Ichibe would rename Iko instead of leaving it nameless, I have a theory; it's the same reason why he renamed Yhwach "Black Ant" instead of leaving him nameless as well and why Ichimonji needs its Bankai form (which is supposedly stronger than the Shikai in every case) to do so. Simply put, nameless things _cannot_ exist in the World of Bleach; what I mean is that if Ichimonji erases a name, the nameless thing will inevitably rename itself. Hence why Ichibe needs his Bankai's powers and why he does so. He renames things after erasing their original name to make sure that the new name is something he can choose, thus leaving him with still some power over the victim.
it could be a bit of the flashback in CFYOW also at that time Yamamoto could use his own pure hakuda and zanjutsu to fight with Ikomikidomoe maybe with Kido too?
I wanna know why a being thats supposedly this powerful is just an Adjuchas hollow. How does that make sense? And of course I want to see this animated!! More Bleach please!!
They didn't seal Ikomikidomoe away because it was too powerful, they did so because it absorbed so many souls and had such a large amount condensed within it that getting rid of it would've harmed the balance of the 3 worlds
Yes I do. And I think the whole Vasto Lorde threat brought up was a huge let down. Because supposedly they were stronger than Captain class. And then Arrancars came. And got beat by ppl who were no where near captain class. So yeah they really messed that up.
@TacticalRick507 That's assuming any of the Arrancar were Vasto Lorde. Even if only Stark, Barragan, Harribel, and Ulquiorra were Vasto Lorde, that still wouldn't be a very good showing. Even though the top two were defeated by OP abilities.
As if, stray hollows are just opponents for foot solider Shinigami. But the current leading figures of Hueco Mundo are still forces to be reckoned with
Exactly. Any and all souls powerful enough have their inner spirit in them. Through natural or pure training of the body and spirit, the manifestation happens without an asuchi. Besides the Shinigami had Hado/Bakudo to eliminate/constrain Hollows, Hakudo as well, and Shunpo for all of the above. Shinigami were far from defenseless without zanpakuto. An argument that Ichigo did this the whole series is possible. His natural and raw talent was able to create his own zanpakuto, but without the asuchi, his inner spirit would manifest with unintended healing from his mask and outburst from Hichigo during the Soul Socitety arc and Hueco Mundo arcs. It's why he's the only character in the series to have these specific powers because of the lack of an asuchi. Heck, it could even possibly explain Final Getsuga Tensho, still arguably the biggest Dues Ex in the series. I know one fan theory is it's a family trait only, which could work, but I like to think only those who have shikai and bankai without an asuchi can deliver an "Final" attack. It's why Isshin told Ichigo about it and trained him in it because he didn't have a asuchi. The amount of fan theories to the subject is endless!
@@kevinellis8017The only problem with your FGT theory is that Isshin makes it clear that Engetsu refused to teach him because he could theoretically use it, and Isshin always had a proper asauchi.
One thing that might be worth noting for this discussion: Ichigo for the longest time was able to use his Shinigami powers and purify hollows without a properly made zanpakuto of his own. This implies that the powers of the Shinigami do exist within the soul before the use of the zanpakuto, that blade just confers extra power, which may explain what Ichibei and Oetsu had before their advent
that is a very good point, i always forget that ichigo was a "fake" shinigami for so long. i guess his case is similar to that of an arrancar, where he creates his own zanpakuto with a part of his soul rather than an asauchi
This hollow was such a great addition to Bleach lore. Having him being ancient and knowing Barragan was so cool. I wish the Espada were as strong and as big a threat as this dude. I’d love for Kubo to include new lore about hueco mundo, like revealing an undiscovered region or area where extremely powerful vasto lorde live. We need more powerful hollows.
@@AJ-kt5zoI think the Espada’s problem was that while they were narratively strong, they had little feats to back up their implied strength. I don’t think a single named Shinigami died during that arc.
@TheTurt honestly without the TYBW, bleach feels so incomplete because of the low stakes until then. Like sure we don't need many deaths, but when every single death is from the bad guy side, it gets pretty... stale
Yama had hands. And it would be werid if he didn't. He older than zanpakto, i'm sure they had some sort of weapons there, but hand to hand combat was propably more comon.
It would've been quite the battle. Undoubtedly Yamamoto got several of his distinctive scars from it. Still, it's ironic that a monster of that caliber actually respected and lamented Barragan upon learning he was dead. More so since Barragan opted to stay out of the beast's way and actually feared it. Such a monster threatening the human world and others was too close.
What's crazy about Ikomikidomoe is he is not even a vasta lorde, but the mid class of a menos, and Baraggan acknowleges him to be powerful. If he did turn into a vasta lorde, just how high would his powers be?.
It was stated that Ikomikidomoe could have evolved into a Vasto Lorde at any point but chose not to. He didn't want to become a Vasto Lorde for some reason, and he didn't need to since his ability meant he had no level cap like normal Adhujas.
If a hollow evoles into a vasto lorde they cap out Yes thier power increases dramatically but it becomes much harder to improve from there Staying a lower form gives him the ability to consume and grow further and with his infinite evolution ability he didn't need to become a vasto lorde
Hollows don't "cap out" after evolving to Vasto Lorde, they cap out on their natural limit, you can't really chose to not evolve into a Vasto lorde @@quietguyjosh4643
We need it and follow up Renji Rukia wedding novel animated to give proper context and closure to the TYBW arc. CFYOW will also give us the most unapologetically evil character with Tokinada Tsunayshiro.
@@getpape4126 Shut your mouth every comment talking about it you come in and bash them if you don't like the novels which were stated to be canon don't watch videos about them and bash people ok
@@getpape4126 already saw you say that and no that's not how this works the author of the bleach manga said it's canon weather you like it or not it's canon the bleach authors words hold more weight than some random person on RUclips bashing anyone who understands that it's canon
I think it's likely there was a way to use abilities and even realize a Zanpakuto spirit prior to imprinting on an Asauchi? Hitsugaya was channeling Hyorinmaru's powers unconsciously long before he got his sword, so it only makes sense that primordial shinigami probably had some (likely wildly) less efficient or controlled way of manifesting their zanpakuto spirit.
I imagine it's something akin to: everyone has a power, but actually bringing it out takes someone really special--like the shinigami that appeared alongside the soul king--so going forward there was a need for a more convenient method of manifesting that inherent ability. That seems to be the case since Ichigo was able to use his weird Zanpakuto without having a proper asauchi, and Toshi was unconsciously bringing out hyorinmaru's cold as a child. The Zanpakuto/Asauchi combo seems to just be placing that concept of the ability onto another being for simpler access.
Only reason I can think of why Squad 0 didn’t kill the hollow is because it would break the cycle. A hollow that powerful would be holding millions of souls and killing it would be akin to a tsunami upon the cycle. So that’s why probably why they sealed it into a zanpaktou. A form where it can’t do anything on its own.
IIRC that's exactly what Ichibe says in CFYOW. Killing Ikomikidomoe there and then would disrupt the balance. It's also the reason he gives for not killing Grimmjow, Nelliel and Harribel after Yhwach's defeat.
I really wish barragan and Yamamoto faught eachother rather than Soifon considering ikkimidomoe and barragan were rivals and both of them considering how old the both were Barragan and Yama should have known each other
Be interesting if Barragan and Yama had a similar agreement to not interfere with each other. Maybe there is a deeper reasoning for why Shinigami age so slowly
Spoilers: In CFYOW Vol.3 it is never stated that Yamamoto was defeated in that encounter and it also says Ikomikidomoe attempted to scale the skies to the soul palace so it wasnt on the ground. Quite a bit of this is in that third volume
@@MrGksarathy So I have a digital and physical copy from Viz my translations don't say what you were saying. I'll paste what it says verbatim "In that time, he devoured the multitude of spirits that entered his vision and made them into his own flesh and his own blood. However, that way of things could not go on forever. He tried to scale the skies in an attempt to consume the Reio, but as a result of the battle with Soul Reapers such as Shigekuni Yamamoto, who was still a youthful hero at the time, he was defeated at the hands of the Manako Osho and Oh-Etsu Nimaiya. “巳己巳己巴” was his name."
@@2centswanted113 Yeah, I remember reading that and thinking Yamaji was just name-dropped as an example of ancient Shinigami. He probably participated, but you're probably correct that he may not have lost.
My fan theory would be that, looking at the fight between Ichibē and Yhwach, there are some abilities or strength that can overpower, or be a counter to, Ichibē's erasing and naming abilities. Perhaps the hollow could manifest any name from the souls it's devoured to replaced it's erased name, or maybe it uses those soul's names as fodder to protect it's own from being erased, so the only way to stop it would be to give it a new name entirely, only being able to limit it's power enough for Ōetsu to create a sword to contain the remainder of it's power and being, and perhaps he only had the idea to do so from recently creating the prototype Zanpakutō for Ichibē, that was able to absorb and contain a piece of his soul and power for him to wield. And because the sword used to seal the hollow away was based off the prototype Zanpakutō, that's why it is able to be used similarly to one to draw out the power that is sealed within the sword, but no sword can use it's power of it's own volition. Only perhaps if the non-canon Muramasa ever came in contact with the sword haha
I’m glad you’re doing more vids on novel content there is so much stuff in there that’s interesting to think about. Hopefully more of it will be incorporated in future releases of the anime.
They aren’t canon. Bleach fans are absolutely pathetic acting like fanfics are real. Naruto fans know their novels aren’t canon. I like bleach but cmon
@getpape4126 Cfyow definitely has some contradictory stuff in it. And it is definitely a Kenpachi wank off novel. However, Kubo had direct inputs of lore into it as well so I think for now it's like 90% canon besides the parts that the anime is now overwriting. E.g the soul king not being betrayed but instead performing a ritual to dismember his own limbs. There is 1 big contradiction regarding the SK in the manga too tho. Haschwalth clearly states that the SK only intends to kill the shinigami in the manga and we clearly see that because the SKs reiatsu spares the quincies and only attacks the shinigami. However the cfyow novel claims that The soul king willingly let himself be used as a linchpin because he foresaw the future and saw that it was for the best. Like this just doesn't check out at all for me
Imagine if Ikomikidomoe's evolution ability is where Ōetsu got the idea where the Asauchi can evolve and enter a different state to use its power based on the soul reapers soul after sealing the hollow.
Aren't you forgetting the obvious? It seems to me that this hollow Zanpakutou was the actual precursor to the modern Zanpakutou, but until he developed the Asauchi later on, based on his observation of the interaction between sword and entity, and allowing for the Shinigami souls to imprint and name them, Ichibei had to name it forcibly while Ouetsu sealed it. I mean, the unbound Asauchi are very obviously, the way they look, derivated from Hollows.
Do you think the primordial world was like our world with Pangea? Human, hollows, soul reapers, Quincies, witches, dragons ect living on one continent together.
@@Grayson-Winchester To add to it, in Yhwach's origin story, it said that the people who grew up around him refered to him as the same name they called their god. Quote: "He knew that name was the name of the god they worshipped. He decided to make that name his own." I mean, YHWH and Yhwach are a bit too similar to be a coincidence. This does make me wonder if Jesus had some significance in the World of the Living in Bleach, but like, in a vague way like how he does in JoJo's Bizarre Adventure.
It's an interesting thought and a large space to explore new potential stories in, the untold and mostly unknown history of the three worlds before the era of the soul society. I'd enjoy it immensely to be able to learn more about the story of bleach and its characters
"How did the shinigami fight without zanpaktous?" (Forgetting about the non-sword techniques like Kido and bakudo) which raises a key question over the history of these techniques.
Considering that Soul Society seems to be most similiar to Tokugawa era Japan, with the figurehead emperor in the Soul King, a de-facto Shogun in Ichibei, a sharp class divide and a Shinigami warrior-nobility, I imagine that the pre-Gotei Soul Society most resembled the Sengoku period, with lots of only regionally powerful shinigami daimyo controlling their own little slice of Rukongai. In my headcanon, Yamamoto and the original Gotei 13 were initially powerful Ronin mercenaries, hired by the 5 great noble houses to protect the Seireitei from outside warlords. They eventually grew to rely on the Gotei for protection so much that they became the de-facto rulers. At this point, Yamamoto made a deal with Ichibei and, with his blessing, proceeded to pacify Soul Society in brutal fashion, much like Oda, Toyotomi and Tokugawa did in Japan in reality. This would be where the original Gotei 13s reputation as ruthless killers originally came from. The 5 noble houses were allowed to retain their privileged positions in exchange for submission and out of respect for their hand in creating Soul Society to begin with. Central 46 is most likely a relatively recent developement, in Soul Society terms. I can't imagine Yamamoto would allow such a body to rule over his Gotei before he mellowed out. Alternatively, perhaps creating this check on Gotei 13 power was part of the deal he worked out with Ichibei? Anyway, that's how I think it might've gone.
Don’t think it’s possible, the original Gotei is 1,000 year old, but Yamamoto was already a well respected figure 2,100 years ago when he created the academy
@@EldenRingBuildsArchive Yes, but I don't see how that makes my headcanon impossible, obviously the great noble families wouldn't hire just anyone to protect the Seireitei. It makes sense that they would either turn to an already existing group of Ronin centered around the Shin'o academy (genji school, back then), or that they would task the respected grandmaster of that school with assembling such a group. This is not unheard of. In real life, samurai companies are known to have grown out of dojos, for example the famous Shinsengumi, which was in large part formed around members of the Shieikan dojo. They would only start calling themselves the Gotei 13 after they officially became retainers of the Soul King, since that is what Gotei (Court guard) means. Maybe the Quincy were getting to be too powerful for Ichibei's liking, so he had Yamamoto organize the Gotei and pacify Soul Society to prepare for war. War between the groups did break out almost immediately afterwards in soul society terms, anyway.
I personally liked the idea of this extremely powerful extremely ancient hollow. Most of the strongest hollow we know today like stark, harribel, ulquiora, etc are relatively young with only barragan being the only relic of that time. So like how the shinigami have ancient legend like the first gotei, it make sense that the hollow would have their own ancient legend
So... - This was before the time of the zanpakutou - Yama didn't have Ryuujin Jakka in this fight because of this - Yet a zanpakutou was used to seal Ikomikidomoe - Nimaiya was part of the RG, despite the fact that his admission to the RG was in recognition of his then non-existent invention, the zanpakutou
Could you imagine Baraggan being stuck in a Zanpakuto that would be a terrifying combo. Baraggan would also turn on his user at any chance he got since he hates being controlled
11:20 Don't we already have an answer for that? The extra Toshiro chapter showed his Zanpakuto spirit talking to him and his power manifesting without him being able to control it before he ever touched a Zanpakuto. It's probably the same for Yamamoto, he could probably talk to his Zanpakuto or feel it and it could/would probably manifest in some way when he fights but nowhere near what he could do by channeling his power through one.
Maybe that's why Hitsugaya needed to leave when his powers were freezing his grandma, but now that he has a zanpakto he doesn't passively freeze people
Not really he considered Barragan a rival and close equal to himself. That's not impressive at all considering that's a pre hygoku power Barragan. A older Yama would stomp. Someone also posted the direct translation and it doesn't say he faught or defeated Yama.
Squad Two, have blades that can kill hollows, yet are not zanpakuto.... Also the Kasumioji Clan built specialized swords and maybe Oetsu's clan as his name is a title like Yamamotos full bame is his title
Okay, so as a few people had pointed it out, it _is_ possible to manifest one's zanpakuto abilities without one of Oetsu's Asauchis, as shown by Toshiro's backstory and the entire dealio with Ichigo not having one. The issue is, these powers are _incredibly_ unrefined when not contained within an Asauchi. Toshiro was freezing things around himself by just existing before he joined the Soul Reapers, and Ichigo's powers, even if manifested in the form of a zanpakuto, were ridiculously out-of-whack throughout most of the series. As such, the Soul Reapers of old likely had to learn to control these powers _in_ this raw, formless state, simply channeling the power through themselves rather than a specialized sword and controlling it through nothing but sheer force of will. It could even explain why these super old Soul Reapers are so powerful: they had to handle that power in such a wild state, that the more controlled form of a zanpakuto is _child's play_ by comparison. (Plus... ya know, kido also probably existed) As for the Ichibei debacle, remember: the control over names granted by his zanpakuto is not his only power. He also has full control over "black", and as far as we know, _that's innate._ It could possibly be that he absorbed a large amount of "black" from Ikomikidomoe into himself, and that massive surge of power allowed him to harness some prototypal form of Ichimonji. Perhaps even in this weird formless primordial state I brought up earlier. Having to paint and write with his bare fingers and hands like a child, rather than a proper brush. Or maybe he just did something similar to Ichigo and had a permanent Shikai due to Asauchis not existing, what do I know. The point is, it could be that the whole zanpakuto thing was developed on the go during their fight.
I wish kubo did more with the original hollows , they kind of became fodder after the gotei 13 came into the picture. Like imagime of a army of ayons were in fake karakura twon along with the espadas , kind of overkill bit you get my point .
You should start a podcast on Spotify or something and put your videos on that your videos are already very interesting and I would wanna listen to them while doing other stuff
I would have to say that the shinigami probably went hand to hand. Think back to wonder Weiss and Yama's twin bone technique that shattered him and turned him to dust. We also have Kido and Yama knew some powerful stuff. I'm sure by how refined Kido and hakuda are compared to Zanpakuto. The proof is there. We have not seen a a new Kido invented, but we have Zanpakuto that are surprising even Ichibei being shocked at how fast ppl acquire it in different ways some better then others. It shows the infancy between these skillsets
I remember binging this show back in 2016/2017 after watching some of it as a middle schooler back in 2005 or so… One of the best anime’s ever ran on Cartoon Network
Always wanted to see if this dude got to work with Ichigo, I mean only someone like ichigo could weild his sword state. Do it Kubo, unleash the calamity.
Mr.Tommo, I've been a fan of bleach for 20 years. My dog's name is rukia I know every bit in and out and I have to say I never thought about the fact the hollows were able to flourish so much with turning into vastso lords etc. and all that was because that was before the time of zanpaktou as always.Great videos sir.
I'd like to think that prior to the Gotei 13, Hollow purification was mostly carried out by the 5 Noble Houses' peraonal task forces And they likely just stuck to Hakuda and Kido to do so
My theory is that before a Zanpakuto people would simply use any object to channel their power. For example, Osho would use an actual calligraphy brush, Senjumaru a needle, and Oetsu would use any of the weapons that he made; he is a blacksmith after all. I suspect Zanpakuto is similar to wands in Harry Potter, it helps to channel your power much easier. Without them you could still use your power albeit much harder/inefficient. That could be one of the reasons why older captains are way stronger than younger captains, they learned to harness their power without a zanpakuto. In regards to sealing IKOMIKIDOMOE, this could be an earlier experimental method to counter the hollows, by sealing them in random objects. This ties very well with Japanese belief where every object has a spirit/soul. And as others have mentioned, probably a precursor to modern day Asauchi.
I personally love the intrigue of what "could of been" back before the Gotei. With more questions then answers and with such potential storytelling, I would love to see an "Ancient History of Souls" arc, and your asking alot of the right questions that, as of now we can only speculate on. I have theories though... Like I think your right about the pre zanpakto era shinigami having sudo zanpakto. Sort of how Ichigo gains "Zangetsu" without an Asaogi...(pardon my spelling 😂). Ichigo was able to channel all that power and even a Bankai, without it actually being his true Zanpakto or Bankai at all! The same could be said about powerful figures like Yamamoto, and I don't see why he or someone like Ichibe would be able to manifest a sudo esque Zanpakto. Ichibe even states his "Bankai" is actually an evolved release as it was called before "Bankai" was even a thing... and that makes me think possibly his Zanpakto was manifested before actual Zanpakto were created. Yamamoto seems to have a similar case... remember during the Murmasa Zanpakto Arc...all the other Zanpakto had human or animal forms, except Ryujin Jaka! It was more primal in nature and didn't take recognizable form. That Yamamoto might well have manifested it before the Asaogi Zanpakto were invented could well explain its nature and why like Ichibe's Zanpakto, are so much more powerful then others. It could be that like Ichigo, that sudo zanpakto was later forged into an modern true Zanpakto...but existed before. That's my theory on it... As for what sort of force the ancient hollows would of faced in the absence of a modern Gotei 13... it seems likely the Noble houses would of been in charge back then. They like feudal lords of the waring states era in Japan, had their own private Military forces and used them at their discretion. Since they were around for the "original sin" when the world was split it seems likely they would of been the acting military figurehead, and their personal soldiers acted as the squad members of the modern Gotei do. The difference again being a lack of Zanpakto...but they had other methods of power that have been mentioned. That forge that made the illegal spirit weapons for the Kasumiogi clan for example. The Shihoin clan with their artifacts like the one used to destroy the Soukoku in the first soul society arc...along with their knowledge of techniques like Hado, Kiddou, and Shunko. Which would of been highly secretive knowledge and kept such Clans in power for quite along time seeing as how they were the only ones to have access to such power and knowledge before the Gotei was founded. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't doubt that was one reason for it's founding in the first place...to break up such a hold over the Soul Society and as a means to distribute power among others more equally rather than it being a source of constant struggle. With the installment of Central 46...an active government, the first thing they would have to address would be the clans and their power, and rather then take it away by force, ask that it be taught to those who would be forever bound to defend the soul society and its people...or be locked away in the maggots nest. It might also explain why even to the modern era several of these Clans still have members of high rank within the Gotei...sort of like how in Naruto they made the Uchiha the police force to keep them from political power or overthrowing the government...kept close but also separate. I mean why else would the Noble Clans not control or be active members in the central 46? It makes sense....Make them defenders and elect a separate body to govern, keeping past and future internal affairs neutral. Again, sorry about my spelling...but I always enjoy the discussion. Perhaps one day we'll get to see what really happened back then...though I wonder if they did do a Ancient Shinigami arc who would the main characters be? Instead if Ichigo we get old man Yamamoto! Heh...would be kinda epic right?
Something to note is that it never said Yamamoto didn't have Ryujin Jakka. It only said that Oetsu was still in the process of perfecting the Asauchi. In other words, he couldn't mass produce them yet. He was still refining the process and working out the kinks. So, some Zanpakuto existed at the time, Ichimonji being one of them, as you mention, and one of them might have been Ryujin Jakka. The oldest fire type in existence. As for how the Soul Reapers fought, I imagine it was like JoJo's bizarre adventures and their inner spirits were manifested directly. We know from Toshiro's backstory that they existed without Zanpakuto. Toshiro sees Hyorinmaru in his dreams before becoming a Soul Reaper and getting an Asauchi, and his ice powers bleed out during that time. So, imagine the Zanpakuto rebellion arc, but the Soul Reapers cunjure them at will and fight side-by-side with them using thinks like Hakuda, Shunpo, and kido. Some of them, the more prominent members of the Noble clans likely, would probably use weapons like the Sokyoku as well
If Zanpaktou didnt exist in this period, maybe Kido did? That may also be why Kido is referred to as Demon Arts. Maybe Shinigami of the past got these powers from the Hell Demons when the worlds were all one? Or maybe they just created them to combat said Demons? Maybe the Hell Butterflies were created by Shinigami using shreds of reishi to talk to each other discretely when they were in the presence of Hell Demons? And maybe after Ikomikidomoe's assault, Ichibei created the Zero Squad specifically to tackle worst case threats? Early in the anime it was said that the Royal Special Task Force was supposed to take care of threats like Menos in the real world, but in retrospect that could have meant larger threats like Ikomikidomoe and Hooleer. Or maybe Kubo didnt think this far yet and Im deriving too much meaning from that statement? I have so many questions.
There is a flashback in the anime where young Toshiro is freezing his grandmother due to his powers. That was before he became a shinigami and got his zanpakuto. I guess it was a filler but it gives an idea of how a powerful shinigami could access his abilities before the creation of asauchis.
Ichibei sealing the hollow as a zanpakuto fits with his character, he never misses a chance to use others as weapons, he even used Yhwach's corpse as the soul king, which is also a big risk
It’s nice when monsters in shonen anime/manga are actually dangerous and not just throwaway bad guys that last one chapter. Too often it’s the opposite; every cool monster-type enemy is just fodder to make someone seem strong or to serve as filler between the fights that matter.
@@0eyes it depends , like a vast number of hollows would be a nuisance at best . And some hollows have certain abilities beyond the usual cero , like that parasite hollows that took over kaien
@@0eyes oh , well I don't see why aizen or syazel apporro couldnt make an army of those types of hollows or a hollows similar to white . That would have been a terrifying army that the shinigami definitely wouldn't be ale to fodderize.
Personal head cannon of mine is that the zanpakuto was just being developed at the time and only a select few where given out to see if they would be better tools/weapons that where being used that have been but not limited to blessed sacred weapons, weapons with sealed souls in them like Ikomikidomoe, and maybe something like bakkōtō from the New Captain filler arc. While using your own innate power was probably harder to use but not impossible.
You know it's embarrassing when Ikomikidomoe is stronger than the entire Espada if it can beat Yamamoto and repelling Ichibe's ink without needing something like the Almighty. Imagine if Aizen got his hands on that Zanpakuto and gave it to whichever Arrancar he deems the strongest. Fake Karakura town would be hella different.
Ikomikodomoe was only able to start resisting Ichibei's naming power after stealing many Soul King Fragments from Hikone. And we know Ichibei has this weird thing where his powers dont work against Soul King's power.
Not really it was a young Yamamoto pre Zanpaktu. He respected a pre hygoku Barragan and thought he was powerful lol. Yama I the modern easily negs him.
@@diamantemrobinson he was a fucking adjuchas, just imagine his vasto lorde self, in resurrection alone ikomi would annihilate bankai Yamamoto but at secunda etapa he becomes a yhwach type threat
It'd be kind of interesting if eventually we learn that one of these older fights in the world of the living caused a well known planetary disaster. Think along the lines of the mount tambora eruption in 1816, what if instead of it being a natural occurance, it turned out yamamoto caused it by going basically all out to stop Ikomikidomoe in the world of the living.
I would imagine that their powers manifested like Hitsugaya's did, but for the most part Kido, Hoho, and Hakuda were the bulk of what eveyone was doing.
11:29 Didn't Toshiro hear Hyourinmaru voice and nearly kill his grandma with his cold reatsu before even having a zanpakuto or even any training whatsoever? A zanpakuto may therefore be required to stabalize and amplify the power of your own soul or maybe it allowed for weaker souls to grow beyond what they normally could have to increase the number of soul reapers to increase stability.
One thing from the novel is there was apparently going to be Gigantic Menos of essentially almost every soul around until the Soul King appeared and turn him into sand I kinda look at this guy as like as the “mini” version of that so if this guy is this strong can you imagine a Hollow with like possibly Billions of Souls?
I'm still really confused on a lot of things about the bleach lore/primordial world: 1) When exactly did the soul king split the primordial world into 3 separate realms? I have heard that the soul king is millions of years old. Did he split the world into 3 realms a million years ago, or only a few thousand years ago? There's a HUGE difference between a million and a few thousand. What time period does CFYOW explain? 2) If the soul king split the world a million years ago, then how long after the splitting of the worlds did Oetsu create zanpakuto? From the video, it seems like Oetsu only created zanpakuto like a thousand years ago, since Yamamoto is only a couple thousand years old and he apparently fought Ikomikidomoe ~thousand years ago without a zanpakuto. This directly implies that the zanpakuto is a very very recent creation; no more than a couple thousand years old. If this is true, then what was Oetsu and Ichibei doing for like almost a million years? 3) Is Barragan older than Yamamoto? It seems to be the case that he is, since he is from the time of Ikomikidomoe, and Iko is a lot older than Yama. How is Barragan so weak? Barragan is implied to have been a rival of sorts to Iko, and we know how powerful Iko is -- he was able to beat Yama and was only taken down by the combined efforts of Ichibei and Oestu. Yet, in the modern world, Barragan is beaten rather easily.
1. We don't know how old the three world is but it's safe to say it's way older than thousands of years. This is proven by the thousand year blood war starting thousands of years ago with the quincy empire and the gotei 13. Ichibei tells shunsui that the gotei 13 is not the first organization that came to be in the soul society but it is the most successful group and he says that he has seen the rise of many groups and their fall. 2. I believe oetsu is older than Yamamoto but he is not as old as the soul society. The only being that we know is older than the soul society itself is ichibei, the soul king, and maybe ywach. There were also weapons similar to zanpakto in the past but they aren't traditional zanpaktos like the ones oetsu made. 3. Honestly I got no idea why barragan is so weak.
Barragan is not weak, he himself said that his power was absolute, he was not lying but his arrogance was his greatest weakness, he was defeated by Hachi's strategy, who used a technique seen only twice in the anime, teleportation, he teleported his infected arm due to the deterioration of Barragán's stomach, causing his own power to kill him without being able to stop him, that is precisely what Ikomoikidomoe feared, Barragan could kill him, but defeating Barragán could not be done by anything more than 3 or 4 people perhaps, Hachi himself who achieved it, Tessai who was his captain in Kido's special division and Yoruichi perhaps, for being able to teleport, said by Biakuya in the fight with Somary when using the technique. The fourth would be Aisen, since Barragán feared him although he feigned loyalty to him hoping to kill him himself. but weak...nothing, he just talked too much
It's actually kind of genius if you think about it like this. Take an all powerful monster like Ikomi and turn him into a weapon to be wielded by the thing he wanted to kill the most, the Soul King. It's a brutal form of irony.
I think Ichibei (sort of) Zanpakuto wasnt actually made by Oetsu but was probably the original version of a Zanpakuto before Oetsu made the Asauchi. What if Zanpakuto were a naturally occuring phenomena, an extension of ones soul that could be weaponised if you knew how. Then Oetsu comes along and makes the Asauchi as a way of Harnessing that phenomena, kinda like how Urahara made the Tenshintai. And then theres when a Zanpakuto becomes fully realised it sort of fuses to the Shinigami in a way like it did with Aizen and Dangai ichigo, although there is a difference in circumstance between the two. Aizen needed the Hogyoku to disolve the barriers between him and his Zanpakuto, but Ichigo never had that barrier to begin with. When Rukia awoken his shinigami powers with the transfer Ichigo more or less Generated his own Zanpakuto as evidence by Oetsu when he said he never made Zangetsu. Also why Ichigo was able to further his powers so damn quickly. SO my theory is this after all that waffling, a Zanpakuto can be summoned by a soul without an Asauchi if your a crazy powerful Kamui like Ichibei, Ichigo or Kazui. This is all Conjecture of course, I am not certain of anything.
Hitsugaya's early years could be a prime example of how pre-zanpakuto Soul Reepers used their talents, but if used with intent (that Hitsugaya lacked) and without restraint it (which Hitsugaya exercised the best he could without being aware) I'd guess it would have been a formidable but uncontrolled power.
When it comes to how the Shinigami operated in the Before Times (Before the Gotei, that is), I always pictured them as kinda Ronin Samurai. No fealty to anyone, just wandering where ever they please, and slaying any Hollows they come across in their travels.
My guess for the name and release, potentially,as part of the sealing method,a name had to be given Perhaps there was no 'zanpakuto' in the way we know them, but they could channel the power of the shikai through their weapon of choice. The naming was the first activation of 'Bankai' and Oetsu was forced to create the first zanpakuto to contain the power, and eventual refinement created what we know today
I think Kido was the weapon used by shinigami prior to zanpakto; the Kido masters always seem to be more old fashioned (literally their fashion) or of a bygone era; so I could see Kido being the true power of shinigami and zanpakto have simply taken the place of that power since it’s “easier” to unlock/harness the power of your own soul and be combatively comparable to the other beings in the other realms; as opposed to training kido, memorizing the incantations and subsequently being limited in power by your own reiatsu level
I always thought both the Seireitei and Rukongai districts long predated the Gotei, since the Central 46 and Soul Society as a whole seem to be built around defending the hegemony of the Five Great Noble Houses, who long predate the Gotei.
Now that I think about it, there's a good chance that yamamoto could still use flames without a zanpakuto. After all, Toshiro was conscious of Hyorinmaru before he even became a shinigami, and he was actively making the room he slept in freezing cold just being there. I assume that if trained and controlled, one could use some form of that power
Personally I would of like to see him and Barragan switch places in the story there power levels may be comparable but I think it would of made all the chapters line up better
Hollows are an inner spirit that's taken over the main soul. Zanpakuto draw out one's inner spirit and allow access to its abilities without letting it take control. Arrancar's Zanpakuto let them contain their powers until needed (several of them mention that Resurrecion is draining and takes a lot of energy, much like Bankai and Vollstandig). It seems reasonable that Hollows (or their powers) could be sealed into Oetsu's Zanpakuto. Considering Ikomikidomoe's infinite capacity for evolution, and the Asauchi's capacity to take any form, there may even be a deeper connection between the two. Before the Gotei 13, when Quincies could protect the human world, it's possible that Hollows tended to attack the Soul Society for its countless spirits. It's never touched on, but there must have been Hollows that attack the Rukongai - access to Hueco Mundo wasn't available to the Soul Society (to our knowledge) until the time of the series (setting aside Aizen, but he didn't share the secrets of the Garganta). It would also explain why they'd need the various military schools (Yamamoto was already training people before the Gotei was formed) - if Hollows were threatening their doorstep, the Soul Society would need the Balancers just to survive. It's possible that a particular member of the Royal Guard is responsible for the Palace floating in the sky. It may have been a response to the attack, or Ikomikidomoe's original state might've used its infinite evolution to fly, but it's within the realm of possibility that one of the great deeds accomplished by a Royal Guard included the creation of the Royal Palace itself. While unlikely, it's also possible that there have been previous Royal Guards who have been "retired" from service. As stated, it's really impossible to say at this point. As for Ichibei having a Zanpakuto before such things existed: he can rename things, and bestow them with the traits and powers of their new name. It's entirely possible he had something before that he simply turned into a Zanpakuto when the time came. Also worth noting that Zanpakuto & Asauchi aren't synonymous; Asauchi are basic blank Zanpakuto, but unless Aizen stole a bunch when he defected (or over the years), an Arrancar's is formed simply by sealing their powers (unless Oetsu sensed a whole bunch being taken & given to Hollows, since he can apparently tell where every single one is). Ichigo's original Zangetsu "wasn't a true Zanpakuto" but it functioned like one in every functional way (to our knowledge). As long as Ichibei was able to access his power on his own, it could've functioned like a Zanpakuto for most intents and purposes. EDIT: Meant to mention this but forgot; it'd presumably be a similar situation if the (non/semi-canon) Arturo Plateado was the power source for the Soukyoku. If the Soukyoku was him sealed in a Zanpakuto, and its destruction released him because it wasn't a typical Zanpakuto (thus he wasn't destroyed by it; alternatives include his powers keeping him from death or the Shihoin Shield's method destroyed the blade but not the spirit), it could work
I think in a sense, they've always had those powers.They just had no real way to Keep them under full control and harness.Them in a special way instead of just letting it leak out like super saiyan.... But either way I think they had the power but they were still able to do a hand to hand combat or have any weapons they wanted
Don’t forget bout sukoho the sealed execution blade from beginning it also contained over a thousand zanpakto it absorbed after executing soul reapers and captives of soul society.
I've always thought that Ichibei created ichimonji on his own and that others used to do the same until ooetsu created zanpakto and gave them to others. I assume this method is easier for others to use but is the same idea. It's not crazy different from hakudo or quincy creating bows except it has a personal soul.
What do you think of Ikomikidomoe? How did Yamamoto fight it in a time before the Zanpakuto? Would you like to see this animated? Let me know your thoughts!
The Kasumiogi Clan from the Amagai Arc made blades specialized blades, note the Second Division blades can kill Hollows . Also they do have other weapons we just see at short timea
Concerning why Ichibe would rename Iko instead of leaving it nameless, I have a theory; it's the same reason why he renamed Yhwach "Black Ant" instead of leaving him nameless as well and why Ichimonji needs its Bankai form (which is supposedly stronger than the Shikai in every case) to do so.
Simply put, nameless things _cannot_ exist in the World of Bleach; what I mean is that if Ichimonji erases a name, the nameless thing will inevitably rename itself. Hence why Ichibe needs his Bankai's powers and why he does so. He renames things after erasing their original name to make sure that the new name is something he can choose, thus leaving him with still some power over the victim.
it could be a bit of the flashback in CFYOW also at that time Yamamoto could use his own pure hakuda and zanjutsu to fight with Ikomikidomoe maybe with Kido too?
I wanna know why a being thats supposedly this powerful is just an Adjuchas hollow. How does that make sense?
And of course I want to see this animated!! More Bleach please!!
Maybe Aizen and Urahara weren't the first to experiment with dissolving the boundaries between Shinigami and Hollow.
Ikomikidomoe looks like a Ben10 alien.
You read me well if am not mistaken canon ball
Now that you mentioned it yea true
Yup he does remind me of canonbolt
Looks like spitter to me
@@ronak8637 and the ice spitter alien. Arctiguana I think
Shoutout to Ikomikidomoe for being so powerful he had to be sealed in a Zanpakuto by Nimaiya and having his name rewritten by Ichibe to weaken him.
They have the actual credit and not Yamamoto
Ikomikidomor isn’t that strong
@@NJ-ss5bcPoor guy
This was Yamamoto without ryujin jakka
They didn't seal Ikomikidomoe away because it was too powerful, they did so because it absorbed so many souls and had such a large amount condensed within it that getting rid of it would've harmed the balance of the 3 worlds
Man………remember back when hollows in general were actually a genuine threat?
Pepperidge farms remembers.
Yes I do. And I think the whole Vasto Lorde threat brought up was a huge let down. Because supposedly they were stronger than Captain class. And then Arrancars came. And got beat by ppl who were no where near captain class. So yeah they really messed that up.
@@TacticalRick507Vice capts & lower (ikkaku etc) were soundly beating them constantly
@TacticalRick507 That's assuming any of the Arrancar were Vasto Lorde. Even if only Stark, Barragan, Harribel, and Ulquiorra were Vasto Lorde, that still wouldn't be a very good showing. Even though the top two were defeated by OP abilities.
As if, stray hollows are just opponents for foot solider Shinigami. But the current leading figures of Hueco Mundo are still forces to be reckoned with
I think the Shinigami's power worked back then in a similar way to how we saw powers manifesting in a young Hitsugaya.
they also would've had kido and bakudo, presumably unrestrained due to the lack of the central 46 and gotei
i think we could tie mugetsu into this somehow too, insofar as becoming one with your battle spirit
Exactly. Any and all souls powerful enough have their inner spirit in them. Through natural or pure training of the body and spirit, the manifestation happens without an asuchi. Besides the Shinigami had Hado/Bakudo to eliminate/constrain Hollows, Hakudo as well, and Shunpo for all of the above. Shinigami were far from defenseless without zanpakuto.
An argument that Ichigo did this the whole series is possible. His natural and raw talent was able to create his own zanpakuto, but without the asuchi, his inner spirit would manifest with unintended healing from his mask and outburst from Hichigo during the Soul Socitety arc and Hueco Mundo arcs. It's why he's the only character in the series to have these specific powers because of the lack of an asuchi.
Heck, it could even possibly explain Final Getsuga Tensho, still arguably the biggest Dues Ex in the series. I know one fan theory is it's a family trait only, which could work, but I like to think only those who have shikai and bankai without an asuchi can deliver an "Final" attack. It's why Isshin told Ichigo about it and trained him in it because he didn't have a asuchi.
The amount of fan theories to the subject is endless!
@@kevinellis8017The only problem with your FGT theory is that Isshin makes it clear that Engetsu refused to teach him because he could theoretically use it, and Isshin always had a proper asauchi.
Exactly!! I don’t know if he forgot about that
One thing that might be worth noting for this discussion: Ichigo for the longest time was able to use his Shinigami powers and purify hollows without a properly made zanpakuto of his own. This implies that the powers of the Shinigami do exist within the soul before the use of the zanpakuto, that blade just confers extra power, which may explain what Ichibei and Oetsu had before their advent
The Zanpakuto seems to be a technology that externalizes and refines a Shinigami's spiritual power, so you're probably correct.
that is a very good point, i always forget that ichigo was a "fake" shinigami for so long. i guess his case is similar to that of an arrancar, where he creates his own zanpakuto with a part of his soul rather than an asauchi
Right... Ichigo never received an Asauchi until he entered the Soul Palace. So perhaps it isn't necessary.
It’s like wizards and wands. They still have magic, but the wand helps control it.
Well, Ichigo and Aizen became one with their zanpakuto and became one of the most powerful characters in the series.
This hollow was such a great addition to Bleach lore. Having him being ancient and knowing Barragan was so cool. I wish the Espada were as strong and as big a threat as this dude. I’d love for Kubo to include new lore about hueco mundo, like revealing an undiscovered region or area where extremely powerful vasto lorde live. We need more powerful hollows.
❤😊
@@AJ-kt5zoI think the Espada’s problem was that while they were narratively strong, they had little feats to back up their implied strength. I don’t think a single named Shinigami died during that arc.
@@TheTurtnot a single fodder shinigami died as well, even the ones that Ulquiorra killed were almost immediately rescued by Orihime
@TheTurt honestly without the TYBW, bleach feels so incomplete because of the low stakes until then. Like sure we don't need many deaths, but when every single death is from the bad guy side, it gets pretty... stale
Considering how Yama took on Wonderwiess with his bare hands I figure he was strong in hand to hand combat even back then
I like to thing this is how he took him on. Badass old man is badass young man.
@Touma134 that double fisted punch he gave Wonderwiess basically broke him in half and that was 2000 year old Yama
Yama had hands. And it would be werid if he didn't. He older than zanpakto, i'm sure they had some sort of weapons there, but hand to hand combat was propably more comon.
It would've been quite the battle. Undoubtedly Yamamoto got several of his distinctive scars from it. Still, it's ironic that a monster of that caliber actually respected and lamented Barragan upon learning he was dead. More so since Barragan opted to stay out of the beast's way and actually feared it. Such a monster threatening the human world and others was too close.
Baraggan and Ikomikidomoe came to a mutual agreement to stay out of each other's way due to being at a stalemate.
What's crazy about Ikomikidomoe is he is not even a vasta lorde, but the mid class of a menos, and Baraggan acknowleges him to be powerful. If he did turn into a vasta lorde, just how high would his powers be?.
Without the Hogyoku, Aaroniero would have been like him but weaker
It was stated that Ikomikidomoe could have evolved into a Vasto Lorde at any point but chose not to. He didn't want to become a Vasto Lorde for some reason, and he didn't need to since his ability meant he had no level cap like normal Adhujas.
He chose a different path of evolution as a menos.
If a hollow evoles into a vasto lorde they cap out
Yes thier power increases dramatically but it becomes much harder to improve from there
Staying a lower form gives him the ability to consume and grow further and with his infinite evolution ability he didn't need to become a vasto lorde
Hollows don't "cap out" after evolving to Vasto Lorde, they cap out on their natural limit, you can't really chose to not evolve into a Vasto lorde @@quietguyjosh4643
I love Can't Fear Your Own World so much. I'd love to find out about more unique monsters like him.
We need it and follow up Renji Rukia wedding novel animated to give proper context and closure to the TYBW arc. CFYOW will also give us the most unapologetically evil character with Tokinada Tsunayshiro.
It isn’t canon the fact you fanboys will eat up this glorified fanfic is absolutely hilarious. Beyond pathetic 😂
@@getpape4126 Shut your mouth every comment talking about it you come in and bash them if you don't like the novels which were stated to be canon don't watch videos about them and bash people ok
@@Nathan24634 half canon at best
@@getpape4126 already saw you say that and no that's not how this works the author of the bleach manga said it's canon weather you like it or not it's canon the bleach authors words hold more weight than some random person on RUclips bashing anyone who understands that it's canon
I think it's likely there was a way to use abilities and even realize a Zanpakuto spirit prior to imprinting on an Asauchi? Hitsugaya was channeling Hyorinmaru's powers unconsciously long before he got his sword, so it only makes sense that primordial shinigami probably had some (likely wildly) less efficient or controlled way of manifesting their zanpakuto spirit.
I imagine it's something akin to: everyone has a power, but actually bringing it out takes someone really special--like the shinigami that appeared alongside the soul king--so going forward there was a need for a more convenient method of manifesting that inherent ability. That seems to be the case since Ichigo was able to use his weird Zanpakuto without having a proper asauchi, and Toshi was unconsciously bringing out hyorinmaru's cold as a child. The Zanpakuto/Asauchi combo seems to just be placing that concept of the ability onto another being for simpler access.
Only reason I can think of why Squad 0 didn’t kill the hollow is because it would break the cycle. A hollow that powerful would be holding millions of souls and killing it would be akin to a tsunami upon the cycle. So that’s why probably why they sealed it into a zanpaktou. A form where it can’t do anything on its own.
IIRC that's exactly what Ichibe says in CFYOW. Killing Ikomikidomoe there and then would disrupt the balance.
It's also the reason he gives for not killing Grimmjow, Nelliel and Harribel after Yhwach's defeat.
Cfyow is a fanfic buddy. How many times do I have to remind bleach fans. Not canon
@@getpape4126 It’s not. Kubo said it’s canon. Am I entirely happy about it? Not really, but it’s canon regardless.
@@doginababyseat5127 half canon at best Lmao.
@getpape4126 If the creator of the series says its Canon, then it's Canon, whether we like it or not.
That monster otherworldly and terrifying. I like it.
Ofc the guy with his own personal monster would say that
I really wish barragan and Yamamoto faught eachother rather than Soifon considering ikkimidomoe and barragan were rivals and both of them considering how old the both were Barragan and Yama should have known each other
Would have been such a dope fight
Be interesting if Barragan and Yama had a similar agreement to not interfere with each other.
Maybe there is a deeper reasoning for why Shinigami age so slowly
Doubt it but that would be cool and hey you never know
❤
Barragan got weaker while Yamamoto that fought ikidome didn’t even have his sword
Spoilers:
In CFYOW Vol.3 it is never stated that Yamamoto was defeated in that encounter and it also says Ikomikidomoe attempted to scale the skies to the soul palace so it wasnt on the ground. Quite a bit of this is in that third volume
All that it says was that the power was too much for even a young Shigekuni to handle. That in no way implies the two fought.
@@MrGksarathy So I have a digital and physical copy from Viz my translations don't say what you were saying. I'll paste what it says verbatim
"In that time, he devoured the multitude of spirits that entered his
vision and made them into his own flesh and his own blood.
However, that way of things could not go on forever.
He tried to scale the skies in an attempt to consume the Reio, but as a result of the battle with Soul Reapers such as Shigekuni Yamamoto, who was still a youthful hero at the time, he was defeated at the hands of the Manako Osho and Oh-Etsu Nimaiya.
“巳己巳己巴” was his name."
@@2centswanted113 Translation mistakes are so annoying😂
@@2centswanted113 Yeah, I remember reading that and thinking Yamaji was just name-dropped as an example of ancient Shinigami. He probably participated, but you're probably correct that he may not have lost.
@@Tsukinohanax they are but I think Viz actually translated this correctly this time😂
My fan theory would be that, looking at the fight between Ichibē and Yhwach, there are some abilities or strength that can overpower, or be a counter to, Ichibē's erasing and naming abilities. Perhaps the hollow could manifest any name from the souls it's devoured to replaced it's erased name, or maybe it uses those soul's names as fodder to protect it's own from being erased, so the only way to stop it would be to give it a new name entirely, only being able to limit it's power enough for Ōetsu to create a sword to contain the remainder of it's power and being, and perhaps he only had the idea to do so from recently creating the prototype Zanpakutō for Ichibē, that was able to absorb and contain a piece of his soul and power for him to wield. And because the sword used to seal the hollow away was based off the prototype Zanpakutō, that's why it is able to be used similarly to one to draw out the power that is sealed within the sword, but no sword can use it's power of it's own volition. Only perhaps if the non-canon Muramasa ever came in contact with the sword haha
I’m glad you’re doing more vids on novel content there is so much stuff in there that’s interesting to think about. Hopefully more of it will be incorporated in future releases of the anime.
Ngl wish we would get safwy and cfyow animation in future
🤞
They aren’t canon. Bleach fans are absolutely pathetic acting like fanfics are real. Naruto fans know their novels aren’t canon. I like bleach but cmon
@getpape4126 Cfyow definitely has some contradictory stuff in it. And it is definitely a Kenpachi wank off novel. However, Kubo had direct inputs of lore into it as well so I think for now it's like 90% canon besides the parts that the anime is now overwriting. E.g the soul king not being betrayed but instead performing a ritual to dismember his own limbs.
There is 1 big contradiction regarding the SK in the manga too tho. Haschwalth clearly states that the SK only intends to kill the shinigami in the manga and we clearly see that because the SKs reiatsu spares the quincies and only attacks the shinigami. However the cfyow novel claims that The soul king willingly let himself be used as a linchpin because he foresaw the future and saw that it was for the best. Like this just doesn't check out at all for me
@@getpape4126 you must be fun at parties
Ngl TYBW ain't even over bro.. that decision will come months after TYBW is completed at the minimum
Imagine if Ikomikidomoe's evolution ability is where Ōetsu got the idea where the Asauchi can evolve and enter a different state to use its power based on the soul reapers soul after sealing the hollow.
this accident was probably starter for him
Cfyow isn’t canon. Making up theories for FANFICS is extreme touch grass behavior 😂
@@getpape4126how many times do ppl have to tell u that the author himself said it’s canon 😂
Aren't you forgetting the obvious? It seems to me that this hollow Zanpakutou was the actual precursor to the modern Zanpakutou, but until he developed the Asauchi later on, based on his observation of the interaction between sword and entity, and allowing for the Shinigami souls to imprint and name them, Ichibei had to name it forcibly while Ouetsu sealed it. I mean, the unbound Asauchi are very obviously, the way they look, derivated from Hollows.
The asauchi are derived from Pluses, not Hollows, but considering those two are counterparts, that's probably why the asauchi look like Hollows.
Do you think the primordial world was like our world with Pangea?
Human, hollows, soul reapers, Quincies, witches, dragons ect living on one continent together.
Given dragons are viewed similarly to hollows. We can at least assume dinosaurs were in the same boat.
@@wolfgod6443 Yhwach must be what people thought to be Jesus Christ. They look similar and were said to preform miracles
@@Grayson-Winchester To add to it, in Yhwach's origin story, it said that the people who grew up around him refered to him as the same name they called their god.
Quote: "He knew that name was the name of the god they worshipped. He decided to make that name his own."
I mean, YHWH and Yhwach are a bit too similar to be a coincidence.
This does make me wonder if Jesus had some significance in the World of the Living in Bleach, but like, in a vague way like how he does in JoJo's Bizarre Adventure.
It's an interesting thought and a large space to explore new potential stories in, the untold and mostly unknown history of the three worlds before the era of the soul society. I'd enjoy it immensely to be able to learn more about the story of bleach and its characters
"How did the shinigami fight without zanpaktous?" (Forgetting about the non-sword techniques like Kido and bakudo) which raises a key question over the history of these techniques.
The sealing of the soul king may have been the origin of Kido
Omg I’ve been waiting for this video FOREVER 💙
Considering that Soul Society seems to be most similiar to Tokugawa era Japan, with the figurehead emperor in the Soul King, a de-facto Shogun in Ichibei, a sharp class divide and a Shinigami warrior-nobility, I imagine that the pre-Gotei Soul Society most resembled the Sengoku period, with lots of only regionally powerful shinigami daimyo controlling their own little slice of Rukongai.
In my headcanon, Yamamoto and the original Gotei 13 were initially powerful Ronin mercenaries, hired by the 5 great noble houses to protect the Seireitei from outside warlords. They eventually grew to rely on the Gotei for protection so much that they became the de-facto rulers. At this point, Yamamoto made a deal with Ichibei and, with his blessing, proceeded to pacify Soul Society in brutal fashion, much like Oda, Toyotomi and Tokugawa did in Japan in reality. This would be where the original Gotei 13s reputation as ruthless killers originally came from. The 5 noble houses were allowed to retain their privileged positions in exchange for submission and out of respect for their hand in creating Soul Society to begin with.
Central 46 is most likely a relatively recent developement, in Soul Society terms. I can't imagine Yamamoto would allow such a body to rule over his Gotei before he mellowed out. Alternatively, perhaps creating this check on Gotei 13 power was part of the deal he worked out with Ichibei?
Anyway, that's how I think it might've gone.
Great analysis I think you maybe correct entirely.
Don’t think it’s possible, the original Gotei is 1,000 year old, but Yamamoto was already a well respected figure 2,100 years ago when he created the academy
@@EldenRingBuildsArchive Yes, but I don't see how that makes my headcanon impossible, obviously the great noble families wouldn't hire just anyone to protect the Seireitei.
It makes sense that they would either turn to an already existing group of Ronin centered around the Shin'o academy (genji school, back then), or that they would task the respected grandmaster of that school with assembling such a group.
This is not unheard of. In real life, samurai companies are known to have grown out of dojos, for example the famous Shinsengumi, which was in large part formed around members of the Shieikan dojo.
They would only start calling themselves the Gotei 13 after they officially became retainers of the Soul King, since that is what Gotei (Court guard) means.
Maybe the Quincy were getting to be too powerful for Ichibei's liking, so he had Yamamoto organize the Gotei and pacify Soul Society to prepare for war. War between the groups did break out almost immediately afterwards in soul society terms, anyway.
Iko needs to show up in the Hell arc. That would be interesting.
Think the hell hollows will be more evolved and dangerous like the 5 before the primordial world separation.
@@AJ-kt5zo Can't wait for this arc.
He can't. He's not dead.
@@kingblackwaffle I said the"Hell arc"not Hell itself.
@@kanoreese1253 true n sorry. Just assume hell arc would be just dead characters mainly villains
I personally liked the idea of this extremely powerful extremely ancient hollow. Most of the strongest hollow we know today like stark, harribel, ulquiora, etc are relatively young with only barragan being the only relic of that time. So like how the shinigami have ancient legend like the first gotei, it make sense that the hollow would have their own ancient legend
Aweosme I was just trying to find info on this character just the other day and couldn’t find shit besides wiki page. Thank you
So...
- This was before the time of the zanpakutou
- Yama didn't have Ryuujin Jakka in this fight because of this
- Yet a zanpakutou was used to seal Ikomikidomoe
- Nimaiya was part of the RG, despite the fact that his admission to the RG was in recognition of his then non-existent invention, the zanpakutou
Bro I've been waiting for this after suggesting it in the discord 😊
Could you imagine Baraggan being stuck in a Zanpakuto
that would be a terrifying combo. Baraggan would also turn on his user at any chance he got since he hates being controlled
11:20 Don't we already have an answer for that?
The extra Toshiro chapter showed his Zanpakuto spirit talking to him and his power manifesting without him being able to control it before he ever touched a Zanpakuto. It's probably the same for Yamamoto, he could probably talk to his Zanpakuto or feel it and it could/would probably manifest in some way when he fights but nowhere near what he could do by channeling his power through one.
Maybe that's why Hitsugaya needed to leave when his powers were freezing his grandma, but now that he has a zanpakto he doesn't passively freeze people
This would definitely be dope to see animated
great vid keep uo the work
this is the best channel for bleach info
The fact he defeated a yama without a zanpakuto and barragan was kinda afraid says a lot
But Yamamoto didnt have access to his zanpakuto. If he did Yamamotos shikai wouldve decimated him
@@Villainarc_Leo that’s literally what I just said bro
@@nytroshaw1862 My bad i dont pay attention to what im reading sometimes
@@Villainarc_Leo you good
Not really he considered Barragan a rival and close equal to himself. That's not impressive at all considering that's a pre hygoku power Barragan. A older Yama would stomp. Someone also posted the direct translation and it doesn't say he faught or defeated Yama.
Squad Two, have blades that can kill hollows, yet are not zanpakuto.... Also the Kasumioji Clan built specialized swords and maybe Oetsu's clan as his name is a title like Yamamotos full bame is his title
Okay, so as a few people had pointed it out, it _is_ possible to manifest one's zanpakuto abilities without one of Oetsu's Asauchis, as shown by Toshiro's backstory and the entire dealio with Ichigo not having one. The issue is, these powers are _incredibly_ unrefined when not contained within an Asauchi. Toshiro was freezing things around himself by just existing before he joined the Soul Reapers, and Ichigo's powers, even if manifested in the form of a zanpakuto, were ridiculously out-of-whack throughout most of the series. As such, the Soul Reapers of old likely had to learn to control these powers _in_ this raw, formless state, simply channeling the power through themselves rather than a specialized sword and controlling it through nothing but sheer force of will. It could even explain why these super old Soul Reapers are so powerful: they had to handle that power in such a wild state, that the more controlled form of a zanpakuto is _child's play_ by comparison.
(Plus... ya know, kido also probably existed)
As for the Ichibei debacle, remember: the control over names granted by his zanpakuto is not his only power. He also has full control over "black", and as far as we know, _that's innate._ It could possibly be that he absorbed a large amount of "black" from Ikomikidomoe into himself, and that massive surge of power allowed him to harness some prototypal form of Ichimonji. Perhaps even in this weird formless primordial state I brought up earlier. Having to paint and write with his bare fingers and hands like a child, rather than a proper brush. Or maybe he just did something similar to Ichigo and had a permanent Shikai due to Asauchis not existing, what do I know. The point is, it could be that the whole zanpakuto thing was developed on the go during their fight.
Ikomi is BADASS AF
I wish kubo did more with the original hollows , they kind of became fodder after the gotei 13 came into the picture. Like imagime of a army of ayons were in fake karakura twon along with the espadas , kind of overkill bit you get my point .
My theory is that Yamamoto fought Ikomikidomoe with a "regular" Katana without his fire. Just with his swordskills.
As well as his raw riatsu possibly I mean they are sword martial artists after all
@@delightlawal2990 probably.
You should start a podcast on Spotify or something and put your videos on that your videos are already very interesting and I would wanna listen to them while doing other stuff
I would have to say that the shinigami probably went hand to hand. Think back to wonder Weiss and Yama's twin bone technique that shattered him and turned him to dust. We also have Kido and Yama knew some powerful stuff. I'm sure by how refined Kido and hakuda are compared to Zanpakuto. The proof is there. We have not seen a a new Kido invented, but we have Zanpakuto that are surprising even Ichibei being shocked at how fast ppl acquire it in different ways some better then others. It shows the infancy between these skillsets
Urahara invented several
I remember binging this show back in 2016/2017 after watching some of it as a middle schooler back in 2005 or so… One of the best anime’s ever ran on Cartoon Network
Always wanted to see if this dude got to work with Ichigo, I mean only someone like ichigo could weild his sword state. Do it Kubo, unleash the calamity.
Buffing the already fourth strongest character with an insane monster hollow sounds like a good idea
Ichigo is currently the most powerful in the verse with juha dead this is directly stated by mayuri who monitors aizens seals
Another banger video
Mr.Tommo, I've been a fan of bleach for 20 years. My dog's name is rukia I know every bit in and out and I have to say I never thought about the fact the hollows were able to flourish so much with turning into vastso lords etc. and all that was because that was before the time of zanpaktou as always.Great videos sir.
Crazy how im just reading CFYOW and now theres a vid about the goat Ikomikidomoe
I'd like to think that prior to the Gotei 13, Hollow purification was mostly carried out by the 5 Noble Houses' peraonal task forces
And they likely just stuck to Hakuda and Kido to do so
My theory is that before a Zanpakuto people would simply use any object to channel their power. For example, Osho would use an actual calligraphy brush, Senjumaru a needle, and Oetsu would use any of the weapons that he made; he is a blacksmith after all. I suspect Zanpakuto is similar to wands in Harry Potter, it helps to channel your power much easier. Without them you could still use your power albeit much harder/inefficient. That could be one of the reasons why older captains are way stronger than younger captains, they learned to harness their power without a zanpakuto.
In regards to sealing IKOMIKIDOMOE, this could be an earlier experimental method to counter the hollows, by sealing them in random objects. This ties very well with Japanese belief where every object has a spirit/soul. And as others have mentioned, probably a precursor to modern day Asauchi.
Can't Fear Your Own World would make a great Bleach movie
The movies always had cool names. Fade to black, memories from nobody, diamond dust rebellion. Can't fear your own world would fit right in.
I personally love the intrigue of what "could of been" back before the Gotei. With more questions then answers and with such potential storytelling, I would love to see an "Ancient History of Souls" arc, and your asking alot of the right questions that, as of now we can only speculate on. I have theories though... Like I think your right about the pre zanpakto era shinigami having sudo zanpakto. Sort of how Ichigo gains "Zangetsu" without an Asaogi...(pardon my spelling 😂). Ichigo was able to channel all that power and even a Bankai, without it actually being his true Zanpakto or Bankai at all! The same could be said about powerful figures like Yamamoto, and I don't see why he or someone like Ichibe would be able to manifest a sudo esque Zanpakto. Ichibe even states his "Bankai" is actually an evolved release as it was called before "Bankai" was even a thing... and that makes me think possibly his Zanpakto was manifested before actual Zanpakto were created. Yamamoto seems to have a similar case... remember during the Murmasa Zanpakto Arc...all the other Zanpakto had human or animal forms, except Ryujin Jaka! It was more primal in nature and didn't take recognizable form. That Yamamoto might well have manifested it before the Asaogi Zanpakto were invented could well explain its nature and why like Ichibe's Zanpakto, are so much more powerful then others. It could be that like Ichigo, that sudo zanpakto was later forged into an modern true Zanpakto...but existed before. That's my theory on it...
As for what sort of force the ancient hollows would of faced in the absence of a modern Gotei 13... it seems likely the Noble houses would of been in charge back then. They like feudal lords of the waring states era in Japan, had their own private Military forces and used them at their discretion. Since they were around for the "original sin" when the world was split it seems likely they would of been the acting military figurehead, and their personal soldiers acted as the squad members of the modern Gotei do. The difference again being a lack of Zanpakto...but they had other methods of power that have been mentioned. That forge that made the illegal spirit weapons for the Kasumiogi clan for example. The Shihoin clan with their artifacts like the one used to destroy the Soukoku in the first soul society arc...along with their knowledge of techniques like Hado, Kiddou, and Shunko. Which would of been highly secretive knowledge and kept such Clans in power for quite along time seeing as how they were the only ones to have access to such power and knowledge before the Gotei was founded. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't doubt that was one reason for it's founding in the first place...to break up such a hold over the Soul Society and as a means to distribute power among others more equally rather than it being a source of constant struggle. With the installment of Central 46...an active government, the first thing they would have to address would be the clans and their power, and rather then take it away by force, ask that it be taught to those who would be forever bound to defend the soul society and its people...or be locked away in the maggots nest. It might also explain why even to the modern era several of these Clans still have members of high rank within the Gotei...sort of like how in Naruto they made the Uchiha the police force to keep them from political power or overthrowing the government...kept close but also separate. I mean why else would the Noble Clans not control or be active members in the central 46? It makes sense....Make them defenders and elect a separate body to govern, keeping past and future internal affairs neutral.
Again, sorry about my spelling...but I always enjoy the discussion. Perhaps one day we'll get to see what really happened back then...though I wonder if they did do a Ancient Shinigami arc who would the main characters be? Instead if Ichigo we get old man Yamamoto! Heh...would be kinda epic right?
Something to note is that it never said Yamamoto didn't have Ryujin Jakka. It only said that Oetsu was still in the process of perfecting the Asauchi. In other words, he couldn't mass produce them yet. He was still refining the process and working out the kinks. So, some Zanpakuto existed at the time, Ichimonji being one of them, as you mention, and one of them might have been Ryujin Jakka. The oldest fire type in existence.
As for how the Soul Reapers fought, I imagine it was like JoJo's bizarre adventures and their inner spirits were manifested directly. We know from Toshiro's backstory that they existed without Zanpakuto. Toshiro sees Hyorinmaru in his dreams before becoming a Soul Reaper and getting an Asauchi, and his ice powers bleed out during that time. So, imagine the Zanpakuto rebellion arc, but the Soul Reapers cunjure them at will and fight side-by-side with them using thinks like Hakuda, Shunpo, and kido. Some of them, the more prominent members of the Noble clans likely, would probably use weapons like the Sokyoku as well
Your videos butter My biscuits thank you
I find interesting that Ikimo has those circles on it's face like the hell creatures that are extremely strong.
If Zanpaktou didnt exist in this period, maybe Kido did? That may also be why Kido is referred to as Demon Arts. Maybe Shinigami of the past got these powers from the Hell Demons when the worlds were all one? Or maybe they just created them to combat said Demons? Maybe the Hell Butterflies were created by Shinigami using shreds of reishi to talk to each other discretely when they were in the presence of Hell Demons? And maybe after Ikomikidomoe's assault, Ichibei created the Zero Squad specifically to tackle worst case threats? Early in the anime it was said that the Royal Special Task Force was supposed to take care of threats like Menos in the real world, but in retrospect that could have meant larger threats like Ikomikidomoe and Hooleer. Or maybe Kubo didnt think this far yet and Im deriving too much meaning from that statement? I have so many questions.
There is a flashback in the anime where young Toshiro is freezing his grandmother due to his powers. That was before he became a shinigami and got his zanpakuto. I guess it was a filler but it gives an idea of how a powerful shinigami could access his abilities before the creation of asauchis.
Ichibei sealing the hollow as a zanpakuto fits with his character, he never misses a chance to use others as weapons, he even used Yhwach's corpse as the soul king, which is also a big risk
It’s nice when monsters in shonen anime/manga are actually dangerous and not just throwaway bad guys that last one chapter.
Too often it’s the opposite; every cool monster-type enemy is just fodder to make someone seem strong or to serve as filler between the fights that matter.
The original hollows did kind of become the fodder of bleach tho. Kubo could have done more with them , just look at ayon
They were a threat to Ichigo because he was weak, when have normal hollows been a threat to anyone that wasn't a vice or captain?
@@0eyes it depends , like a vast number of hollows would be a nuisance at best . And some hollows have certain abilities beyond the usual cero , like that parasite hollows that took over kaien
@@bqw2094 To be fair Metastacia was a product of Aizen.
@@0eyes oh , well I don't see why aizen or syazel apporro couldnt make an army of those types of hollows or a hollows similar to white . That would have been a terrifying army that the shinigami definitely wouldn't be ale to fodderize.
Ikomikidomoe? Is that a Type Soul refrence?
I think Mr. Tommo gave more thought to this than Taito the man, himself.
Personal head cannon of mine is that the zanpakuto was just being developed at the time and only a select few where given out to see if they would be better tools/weapons that where being used that have been but not limited to blessed sacred weapons, weapons with sealed souls in them like Ikomikidomoe, and maybe something like bakkōtō from the New Captain filler arc. While using your own innate power was probably harder to use but not impossible.
Bleach got so much more story to tell, so much lore and mysteries to uncover. Hell Arc is gonna be the greatest Bleach Arc !!
You know it's embarrassing when Ikomikidomoe is stronger than the entire Espada if it can beat Yamamoto and repelling Ichibe's ink without needing something like the Almighty. Imagine if Aizen got his hands on that Zanpakuto and gave it to whichever Arrancar he deems the strongest. Fake Karakura town would be hella different.
It only beat Yamamoto without a zanpakto and no bankai however it is still impressive🤔
Ikomikodomoe was only able to start resisting Ichibei's naming power after stealing many Soul King Fragments from Hikone.
And we know Ichibei has this weird thing where his powers dont work against Soul King's power.
Not really it was a young Yamamoto pre Zanpaktu. He respected a pre hygoku Barragan and thought he was powerful lol. Yama I the modern easily negs him.
@@diamantemrobinson he was a fucking adjuchas, just imagine his vasto lorde self, in resurrection alone ikomi would annihilate bankai Yamamoto but at secunda etapa he becomes a yhwach type threat
I really do hope that CFYOW gets animated.
Props to MrTommo for nailing the crazy Japanese names on the regular
It'd be kind of interesting if eventually we learn that one of these older fights in the world of the living caused a well known planetary disaster. Think along the lines of the mount tambora eruption in 1816, what if instead of it being a natural occurance, it turned out yamamoto caused it by going basically all out to stop Ikomikidomoe in the world of the living.
I would imagine that their powers manifested like Hitsugaya's did, but for the most part Kido, Hoho, and Hakuda were the bulk of what eveyone was doing.
If the Hollow returned to its full power...then Kenpachi would have cut it a second time to win.
I first heard about this hollow three years ago on another u two verse channel, He called him a hurricane
Another part of Yamamoto's past I hope we see animated. It even has some Barragan backstory too.
That does bring up a good question did kido exist before zanpakuto maybe that’s what they used before then
I hope one day kubo tells us ikomikidomoe real name to us
11:29 Didn't Toshiro hear Hyourinmaru voice and nearly kill his grandma with his cold reatsu before even having a zanpakuto or even any training whatsoever? A zanpakuto may therefore be required to stabalize and amplify the power of your own soul or maybe it allowed for weaker souls to grow beyond what they normally could have to increase the number of soul reapers to increase stability.
Ikomikidomoe just be doing his own thing
One thing from the novel is there was apparently going to be Gigantic Menos of essentially almost every soul around until the Soul King appeared and turn him into sand I kinda look at this guy as like as the “mini” version of that so if this guy is this strong can you imagine a Hollow with like possibly Billions of Souls?
Man I didn't even realize this thing existed. Potential another enemy for the hell arc?
I'm still really confused on a lot of things about the bleach lore/primordial world:
1) When exactly did the soul king split the primordial world into 3 separate realms? I have heard that the soul king is millions of years old. Did he split the world into 3 realms a million years ago, or only a few thousand years ago? There's a HUGE difference between a million and a few thousand. What time period does CFYOW explain?
2) If the soul king split the world a million years ago, then how long after the splitting of the worlds did Oetsu create zanpakuto? From the video, it seems like Oetsu only created zanpakuto like a thousand years ago, since Yamamoto is only a couple thousand years old and he apparently fought Ikomikidomoe ~thousand years ago without a zanpakuto. This directly implies that the zanpakuto is a very very recent creation; no more than a couple thousand years old. If this is true, then what was Oetsu and Ichibei doing for like almost a million years?
3) Is Barragan older than Yamamoto? It seems to be the case that he is, since he is from the time of Ikomikidomoe, and Iko is a lot older than Yama. How is Barragan so weak? Barragan is implied to have been a rival of sorts to Iko, and we know how powerful Iko is -- he was able to beat Yama and was only taken down by the combined efforts of Ichibei and Oestu. Yet, in the modern world, Barragan is beaten rather easily.
1. We don't know how old the three world is but it's safe to say it's way older than thousands of years. This is proven by the thousand year blood war starting thousands of years ago with the quincy empire and the gotei 13. Ichibei tells shunsui that the gotei 13 is not the first organization that came to be in the soul society but it is the most successful group and he says that he has seen the rise of many groups and their fall.
2. I believe oetsu is older than Yamamoto but he is not as old as the soul society. The only being that we know is older than the soul society itself is ichibei, the soul king, and maybe ywach. There were also weapons similar to zanpakto in the past but they aren't traditional zanpaktos like the ones oetsu made.
3. Honestly I got no idea why barragan is so weak.
Barragan is not weak, he himself said that his power was absolute, he was not lying but his arrogance was his greatest weakness, he was defeated by Hachi's strategy, who used a technique seen only twice in the anime, teleportation, he teleported his infected arm due to the deterioration of Barragán's stomach, causing his own power to kill him without being able to stop him, that is precisely what Ikomoikidomoe feared, Barragan could kill him, but defeating Barragán could not be done by anything more than 3 or 4 people perhaps, Hachi himself who achieved it, Tessai who was his captain in Kido's special division and Yoruichi perhaps, for being able to teleport, said by Biakuya in the fight with Somary when using the technique. The fourth would be Aisen, since Barragán feared him although he feigned loyalty to him hoping to kill him himself.
but weak...nothing, he just talked too much
It's actually kind of genius if you think about it like this. Take an all powerful monster like Ikomi and turn him into a weapon to be wielded by the thing he wanted to kill the most, the Soul King. It's a brutal form of irony.
I think Ichibei (sort of) Zanpakuto wasnt actually made by Oetsu but was probably the original version of a Zanpakuto before Oetsu made the Asauchi. What if Zanpakuto were a naturally occuring phenomena, an extension of ones soul that could be weaponised if you knew how. Then Oetsu comes along and makes the Asauchi as a way of Harnessing that phenomena, kinda like how Urahara made the Tenshintai.
And then theres when a Zanpakuto becomes fully realised it sort of fuses to the Shinigami in a way like it did with Aizen and Dangai ichigo, although there is a difference in circumstance between the two. Aizen needed the Hogyoku to disolve the barriers between him and his Zanpakuto, but Ichigo never had that barrier to begin with. When Rukia awoken his shinigami powers with the transfer Ichigo more or less Generated his own Zanpakuto as evidence by Oetsu when he said he never made Zangetsu. Also why Ichigo was able to further his powers so damn quickly.
SO my theory is this after all that waffling, a Zanpakuto can be summoned by a soul without an Asauchi if your a crazy powerful Kamui like Ichibei, Ichigo or Kazui.
This is all Conjecture of course, I am not certain of anything.
Hitsugaya's early years could be a prime example of how pre-zanpakuto Soul Reepers used their talents, but if used with intent (that Hitsugaya lacked) and without restraint it (which Hitsugaya exercised the best he could without being aware) I'd guess it would have been a formidable but uncontrolled power.
When it comes to how the Shinigami operated in the Before Times (Before the Gotei, that is), I always pictured them as kinda Ronin Samurai. No fealty to anyone, just wandering where ever they please, and slaying any Hollows they come across in their travels.
My guess for the name and release, potentially,as part of the sealing method,a name had to be given
Perhaps there was no 'zanpakuto' in the way we know them, but they could channel the power of the shikai through their weapon of choice. The naming was the first activation of 'Bankai' and Oetsu was forced to create the first zanpakuto to contain the power, and eventual refinement created what we know today
I think Kido was the weapon used by shinigami prior to zanpakto; the Kido masters always seem to be more old fashioned (literally their fashion) or of a bygone era; so I could see Kido being the true power of shinigami and zanpakto have simply taken the place of that power since it’s “easier” to unlock/harness the power of your own soul and be combatively comparable to the other beings in the other realms; as opposed to training kido, memorizing the incantations and subsequently being limited in power by your own reiatsu level
I always thought both the Seireitei and Rukongai districts long predated the Gotei, since the Central 46 and Soul Society as a whole seem to be built around defending the hegemony of the Five Great Noble Houses, who long predate the Gotei.
They were probably curious back then and just experimenting with the swords and powers
I think this hollow sealing act was a prototype to what we know as shinigami sword. You pour your spirit energy in the sword after all.
Now that I think about it, there's a good chance that yamamoto could still use flames without a zanpakuto. After all, Toshiro was conscious of Hyorinmaru before he even became a shinigami, and he was actively making the room he slept in freezing cold just being there. I assume that if trained and controlled, one could use some form of that power
Personally I would of like to see him and Barragan switch places in the story there power levels may be comparable but I think it would of made all the chapters line up better
Hollows are an inner spirit that's taken over the main soul. Zanpakuto draw out one's inner spirit and allow access to its abilities without letting it take control. Arrancar's Zanpakuto let them contain their powers until needed (several of them mention that Resurrecion is draining and takes a lot of energy, much like Bankai and Vollstandig). It seems reasonable that Hollows (or their powers) could be sealed into Oetsu's Zanpakuto. Considering Ikomikidomoe's infinite capacity for evolution, and the Asauchi's capacity to take any form, there may even be a deeper connection between the two.
Before the Gotei 13, when Quincies could protect the human world, it's possible that Hollows tended to attack the Soul Society for its countless spirits. It's never touched on, but there must have been Hollows that attack the Rukongai - access to Hueco Mundo wasn't available to the Soul Society (to our knowledge) until the time of the series (setting aside Aizen, but he didn't share the secrets of the Garganta). It would also explain why they'd need the various military schools (Yamamoto was already training people before the Gotei was formed) - if Hollows were threatening their doorstep, the Soul Society would need the Balancers just to survive.
It's possible that a particular member of the Royal Guard is responsible for the Palace floating in the sky. It may have been a response to the attack, or Ikomikidomoe's original state might've used its infinite evolution to fly, but it's within the realm of possibility that one of the great deeds accomplished by a Royal Guard included the creation of the Royal Palace itself. While unlikely, it's also possible that there have been previous Royal Guards who have been "retired" from service. As stated, it's really impossible to say at this point.
As for Ichibei having a Zanpakuto before such things existed: he can rename things, and bestow them with the traits and powers of their new name. It's entirely possible he had something before that he simply turned into a Zanpakuto when the time came. Also worth noting that Zanpakuto & Asauchi aren't synonymous; Asauchi are basic blank Zanpakuto, but unless Aizen stole a bunch when he defected (or over the years), an Arrancar's is formed simply by sealing their powers (unless Oetsu sensed a whole bunch being taken & given to Hollows, since he can apparently tell where every single one is). Ichigo's original Zangetsu "wasn't a true Zanpakuto" but it functioned like one in every functional way (to our knowledge). As long as Ichibei was able to access his power on his own, it could've functioned like a Zanpakuto for most intents and purposes.
EDIT: Meant to mention this but forgot; it'd presumably be a similar situation if the (non/semi-canon) Arturo Plateado was the power source for the Soukyoku. If the Soukyoku was him sealed in a Zanpakuto, and its destruction released him because it wasn't a typical Zanpakuto (thus he wasn't destroyed by it; alternatives include his powers keeping him from death or the Shihoin Shield's method destroyed the blade but not the spirit), it could work
Damn, Tousen's kid is a MONSTER.
I think in a sense, they've always had those powers.They just had no real way to Keep them under full control and harness.Them in a special way instead of just letting it leak out like super saiyan.... But either way I think they had the power but they were still able to do a hand to hand combat or have any weapons they wanted
Can’t wait for it to be revealed in canon that ikomikodomoe was what inspired the idea of Zanpakuto
Imagine running a TTRPG in the primordial world of Bleach before the split.
Would looove an Arturo Plateado video
Anyone else notice that when going bankai with a hollow or hollow esc reishi the hollow effects there clothing
Don’t forget bout sukoho the sealed execution blade from beginning it also contained over a thousand zanpakto it absorbed after executing soul reapers and captives of soul society.
I've always thought that Ichibei created ichimonji on his own and that others used to do the same until ooetsu created zanpakto and gave them to others. I assume this method is easier for others to use but is the same idea. It's not crazy different from hakudo or quincy creating bows except it has a personal soul.