Jack the Ripper - Case Discussion (Part 1)
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- Опубликовано: 6 окт 2024
- VOKpodcast.word... - In the first part of our Jack the Ripper discussion, Julia (NoTrueLady) and Bina007 discuss the social conditions at the time of the Whitechapel Murders and make their observations on the deaths of the victims - claimed and canonical. They then discuss the main members of the police investigation and the alleged Ripper letters.
Warning - this podcast contains discussion of violence and prostitution that some listeners may find disturbing or offensive.
CREDITS:
Edited by Bina007
This podcast is 4 years old, but I just found it. The question was raised about how people living so close could have possibly heard nothing at all. The answer to that I believe is actually quite simple. They lied. Not necessarily because they just didn’t want to be involved. But possibly because they were ashamed. Remember, the women chose the spots where they were murdered. They were places they regularly took customers. So, the people that lived right there were accustomed to hearing the sounds of moaning, whimpering, or even screeching women. Sounds of a woman being killed could have sounded very much like a woman having sex. So to the ears of people who lived within feet of the murder, the more violent it sounded the more brutal sex they thought was taking place. The next day when the body was discovered, they had realized they were actually listening to a murder. They didn’t want to explain how they could just lay there and do nothing at the time of the murder so they lied and said they heard nothing.
Lon Curtis this makes a LOT of sense
But also sometimes the idea that a murder is going to be very loud with lots of screaming etc is false. The jack the ripper victims were strangled, alot of people forget that because the throats were cut but that actually happened after they were strangled to death or possibly on the verge of death. Suddenly strangulation isn't going to make much noise other than the gargling sound, the throat is closed off so not really much sound is going to come from it. He was obviously trusted by these women, they didn't see him as a threat and didn't expect to be harmed. They likely turned their back to him or went to lift their garments up and with hands occupied he would have suddenly struck like a cobra with a rat. Probably used something to do the strangling with rather than bare hands.
Keep in mind that when your throat is cut, you aren't capable of making much noise.....
And Jack knew that, which is why he did it in the first place.
Maybe but I think not these people were not committing any crimes and so I believe would have had No Reason to lie - makes more sense .
At 6.42 she says that the British rule most of the world except for the US.
The British ruled the Indian subcontinent, Australia and New Zealand, Canada, much of Africa (South Africa, west and east especially), the West Indies, places like North Borneo, Fiji, Cyprus, Falklands, Burma, New Guinea, etc, the total area was about 25% of the whole land area of the entire world and the population under British control was also around 25% (mostly in India and modern day Pakistan and Bangladesh, etc). .
But the rest of Europe, the USA, the majority of Central America and South America, most of Africa, China, Japan, Korea, Mongolia, Nepal, Afghanistan, the majority of Asia, the Russian Empire, and the other parts of the world that make up the 75% that were not part of the British Empire.
Britain was probably the strongest nation in the late 19th century, but to claim that the British Empire covered most of the world doesn't give me much faith in the accuracy of the rest of the podcast.
I cringed when i heard that too
I think the Germans got tired of listening to that in 1914 and 1939
It wasn't just the fact that Britain's official empire was around a quarter of the world land and population, it was the fact that it controlled the oceans and trade routes. It was the sheer influence it had and also the unofficial colonies which weren't officially part of the empire but basically Britain had very much sway in those countries to make them go in the direction that was beneficial to Britain. The fact that China wasn't under any kind of British rule but it still was persuaded to do as the British wanted by having British ships sit off the Chinese coast as a show of muscle and when that didn't work they bombarded the Chinese coast until they did what was wanted and let the opium trade in. So it was an empire of influence as well as physical conquest.
@@cutekanjii I see your point but I think most people think of being ruled by the UK refers to the formal empire where the British monarch was the also the monarch of a particular colony or protectorate, dominion etc, otherwise each country's investments and assets in other countries could also be called ruled by the nation that has a lot of economic influence
@@simonyip5978 yeah well it's different today it's big corporations and billionaire elites that rule the world. An international clique or illuminati. I don't think that's not really in much dispute but whether they have an agenda or not is up for debate and that would he the new world order
If you want to listen to a legit discussion about Jack by people who have actually spent more than a week studying him, then I suggest you listen to Rippercast.
Aren t these two women ignorant of the facts
I have a feeling this will be full of inaccuracies, but who knows I may be proved wrong .
Have neither of you even superficially studied the case? Hutchinson (her "friend") was a witness who said he saw Mary with a man going to her room. He then said he waited outside for 45 minutes ...etc etc
However his evidence is so incredibly detailed that a lot of people suspect him.
You are correct.
Hutchinson was talking through his arse - looking for a few paydays until the Cops took his story apart .
Martha Tabram was almost certainly a Ripper victim, if you have a look at a contemporary map of the area, George Yard/Wentworth St were in the centre of the area where the murders took place.
In addition, the murder of Martha Tabram was just weeks before Polly Nichols (both August 1888).
The chance of a middle aged woman (who was known for casual prostitution) and who was killed in the early hours of the morning using a knife...
... just happened to take place weeks before 5 other middle aged women (who were also known as casual prostitutes), and were also killed by knife injuries, in the early hours, literally a few minutes walk from the other murder scenes, all in the very same small district...
... but was not committed by the same killer, it just doesn't seem plausible in the slightest.
If you compare the similarities between Tabram and the other 5 victims, the location, the murder weapon, the time of day, the age of the victim, the social class and lifestyle of the woman, the time period, etc are all very similar to the five later victims... the differences between stabbing type injuries and slashing and ripping wounds become insignificant.
The killer of the canonical five was very very likely, in my opinion, to have been the same person who also murdered Martha Tabram.
Edit : many people don't realize just how compact the murder locations actually are.
From George Yard/Wentworth St junction, Bucks Row is a couple of minutes walk along Old Montague Street and then across Vallance Road. Hanbury Street is a few streets northwards, Dorset Street was a few minutes to the north west and Berner Street was across Whitechapel Road, along Church Row/Lane and across Commercial Road (again a few minutes walk away).
Some one at George Yard with a loud whistle could probably be heard from the other sites.
agreed
Spot on
A lot of women, particularly prostitutes or beggars were stabbed in the area and nearby at that time.Guns were hard to come by and noisy.The signatures of ripper victims were the cut throat, the torn genitalia and removal of organs.Martha Tabram had none of them.She was just robbed and had her mouth closed by the killer.
@@juracalling2471 Unless, he was working up those things you mentioned and his violence was escalating.
@@michaelbrown7561 In that case their is a lot more women who were attacked that way that come into view..
8 years later , thank you I enjoyed this
You are welcome!
Those poor Ladies. No one deserves what they got.
Within regard to the discussion about Catholic’s and Royalty.
The Succession to the Crown Act, which went into action in March 2015 changed the rule that younger brothers would surpass their older sisters in line for the throne, but it also made it possible for a king or queen to marry someone who is Catholic and still rule.
However whomever becomes King or Queen of England in the future must be Protestant Anglican, and they absolutely cannot be baptized in the Catholic church. Should that happen, they'd immediately be disqualified from ever reigning.
The queen was suspected of being a secret Catholic.
The victims probably had their backs to Jack lifting their skirts to perform their trade. They then had the mouths covered from the murderer who was behind. Or they were chocked to silence her. Then the victims had their throats quickly cut twice. The first cut cut the blood to the brain causing immediate dizziness. The second cut cut the throat to the spine opening the throat so the blood from the first cut would pour down the larynx into to the lungs preventing the victims from screaming; with these methods no one heard them. In seconds she was dead. This is how a soldier takes out a sentry. The area had many soldiers who had seen serious combat. A letter from a military regiment was found at the side of a victim. Did it belong to the killer? Combat where men on both sides were disembowled from swords, spears, bayonet was experienced. It was discussed that Martha Putram may have been stabbed with a bayonet. The victims had social contact with theses soldiers. If a soldier was suffering from dementia from the effects of syphilis, he may hate the doxies, angry he got the illness from one of them. With each assault the victim was abused more than the previous due to the dementia increasing. After Mary Kelly he may have been too sick to continue or he was caught and it was covered up.
If someone cracks this case they will ruin an INDUSTRY. People are eaning money from the evil of this bastard. We may never know who it was, but self satisfied armchair detectives are not productive. Take a moment to consider the victims...and the social conditions that made it possible.
cracking the case will bring in more money than the industry
Fuck the victims, don't make out you care about them, you dont fool me Deryck my son.
How can I listen to this woman if she has never been to London
what difference does that make ? hardly anything of JTR era remains, most the houses and streets have gone, if they studied the details of the case what would it matter that they never been there.
@@sarahsmith-el8br yeah if only they had studied the details of the case
@@sarahsmith-el8br Cause being in a city like London the feel, atmosphere, and the physical area makes all the difference in the world. You're much mistaken my friend and I might I add a tad off on your assessment.
MJK wasn't killed actually during the Lord Mayor's Show, she was killed in the early hours of the morning.
Hey guys. Loved this discussion including part 2. Just wanted to what your views are regarding Dr Francis Tumblety as a suspect? Look forward to hearing from you.. harry
Hey Bina and Julia, I just wanted to say again how much I enjoyed listening to this.
Jack was a soldier. He had syphilis. He knew Martha Tabham and other victims. He lived in White Chapel. He had lots of combat experience. He was going insane. He probably hated his mother.
This hostess obviously had the other woman on the show to listen to the hostess talk. Neither of them are familiar with the basic facts of the cases and have to look them up. Let s just repeat the dates of the murders and i ll get the first one wrong. August 30 th. These women are mere dilettantes
Spot on 👍
A feminist discussion about JTR ? 🤣
the moral hypocrisy of the middle class...
That's what without being aware is what I'm about with my scall on the wall Wendy black.
Really enjoying this podcast, love your work!!!
They aren t knowledgeable about the facts and make mistakes and the hostess should ask a question THEN BE QUIET DURING THE ANSWER
It was Charles Lechmere
Lechmere/Cross started work at 4.30am Annie Chapman was seen alive after 5.18am
Stopped listening when she said she has studied jfk and believes it was a lone shooter...hahaa
Everyone knows it was aliens.
it was a lone gunman, sure. next, these nuts will be claiming America has put a man on the moon!
@@VassalsofKingsgrave No it was the permanent dictators who have ruled the US for decades.
I know right? Did she not see the Zapruder film?
Same.
Just because they mention the Jews. On the wall doesn't mean that jack the ripper was a Jew. I hate this computer it corrects my spelling even though I know I am spelling things right. It even tells me my name is spelled wrong. That is ludicrous cause I know how to spell my name. You can't correct it either cause it keeps spelling things wrong. I think either cross/lamer was jack the ripper or it was a cop.
Are you disobeying The Machine s choices to express your ideas for you. A thought crime. Cross lechmere. Probably The Machine
I have no idea what your talking about.
@@heathergustar638 nice , that I find this post @ Heather Gustar from you
sorry Heather, , on I think another ripper trip , did not know Cross / Leachmear• were same bloke, o v s ly I'm no expert , but maybe that's the point . Sent with joy / out of liver or kidney.
My suspects are Charles Allen Lechmere(Charles Cross) and Nathan Kaminski (David Cohen) as he is better known.
Cross started work at 4.30am Annie Chapman was seen alive after 5.15am
Mediocre.
Thanks for doing this! Really interesting and a nice change from the usual stuff.
Yeah the usual stuff full of correct information
Is the guest host Sandra Bernhardt?!
Btw: Life in whitechapel wasn't easy for poor MEN either...
Yes, but there are no victim points to be mined there, eh? Y'know. Men and our 'privilege'.
Apparently.
This is a podcast done by two ignorant far left wing morons. Littered with bullshit and mistakes about the case! From Hell was more accurate.
@@chimpboy9760 nice condemnation. From hell was more accurate
@@finnbarsnowdrop545 what are you ?
No no no ladies, you've got the timeline wrong. The Saucy Jack postcard was dated October 1st, 1888 and arrived the same day. That's less than 36 hours after Catherine Eddows murder. The postcard mentioned the double event and had a reason for it -- because Elizabeth Stride screamed and he had no time to take his trophies with him
love this podcast been using it alot when i go to bed 😴
People back in 1888 used soap and water it can go along way
Juwes is not french for Jews.
The classic Jack the Ripper print to open this video. Pretty damn creepy! But I think his face should be just a litter darker and less clear.
Get a fuckin Grip .
That bit at the beginning about respect and sympathy for the victims is why I'm drawn to this topic. I feel that naming him would vindicate them somehow.
"I feel that naming him would vindicate them somehow." Charles Allen Lechmere (also Charles Cross) at the inquest. See "JTR:The Missing Evidence" (best viewed on Daily Motion).
This podcast makes the same mistake almost of them make. They discount the Thames Torso murders. They were connected. They were committed by the same man.
But overall, I enjoyed listening. Good job
I enjoyed this greatly. I feel the discussion was of an exceptional high level from two obviously highly intellectual and well-informed people.
You are deluded
Excellent parody 🤣
My bad. I just missed the end of the second part. Thanks
If you look at the photo of Polly Nichols alive it brings a face and humanity to the victims she seemed a jovial woman RIP Polly.
There are no pictures of the victims alive except Chapman
This women and her political views ruin the podcast.
This is not a good podcast for example Emma Smith was not killed in Shoreditch.
The host is a West End 5 counties girl living in the East End of London.There is no new ideas here.
1100 what's changed there dearlys lol
rubbish! Jacko was a very bad boy.
btw…the from hell movie wasn’t horrible, it’s a movie of fine actors and actresses based on a ridiculous JTR theory. I feel like that movie could have been the greatest movie ever made, and many snobbish english would never approve of it. in addition, JFK assassination definitely wasn’t a lone shooter…everyone knows that! Charles Lechmere was the Ripper in my mind.
Try Akunin's "The Decorator", not to take it seriously, but for unusual perspective...:)
take note guys 10.00
This looks like its based on Berner street where he killed Liz Stride. The street lamp would be hiding the wagon wheel hanging on the adjacent building. Nob9dy 8n their right m8nd would be walking through a slum in the middle of the night dressed like this. Even then, draw8ng too much attention. One witness said a potential suspect he saw was wearing a deer stalker hat, more appropriate for that area.
Agreed. The Ripper didn't walk around in a top hat and cloak, but sadly that image prevails. Not sure a deer stalker hat was much more usual though. Those were generally for the countryside, not the East End hehe.
Very interesting information 🤔👍👌
Annabelle Apsion who played Polly Nicholls and Lesley Sharp who played Catherine Eddowes were both 41 when they appeared in From Hell so they would've been the right ages
These people rarely bathed, particularly during cold weather. There was no hot water since it was not required of home/building owners. Yet, those portraying the prostitutes seem a tad too clean. Even the wealthy did not bathe as often. (God, imagine the stench!) And the real-life prostitutes were certainly not attractive... yet the movies/videos always use slightly attractive women to portray the prostitutes... really, they were, for the most part, drunks, toothless and who knows how they stank! Let's face it, they were the most undesirables... they often slept out in the streets, or bug-ingested dirty beds when they could afford the 3 pence bed rental. Meanwhile, the Royals were more concerned and worried about the quality of food their pets had... and not one concern for the populace, and the poorest of the poor. EFF the social class system. Oh, for the record, the plump chump, Donald tRump dump lump, notorious cheat, crook and swindler is flatulent. Jack the Ripper was most likely Ted Cruz' wrinkled face, Cuban-born DADDY, and fellow Castro revolutionary crony.
@Kerry Thomas I did watch the film for entertainment. It was hard to accept the ladies as street walkers - they were clean and could of been cover girls. It would of been difficult to stay clean in body and clothing. Just the way things were in 1888.
Yeah but none of the actresses had a ten year history of malnutrition lack of drinking and bathing water street fights eight ounces of bad gin a day and lack of sleep
@@johnzeszut3170 could HAVE been. Would HAVE been in english
Ladies, one of you in the interview got it spot on with the fact that barbers back then in England had too have surgeon skills & Aaron Kosmisky had the skills & also after he was committed to the Insane Assylum the killings stopped & the time frame work fit perfectly & he had access to the Whitechapel district & he was said too be extremely mad, psychotic crazy by many family members & giving witnesses which is as good as evidence & proof but as far as the evidence their will never be solved; it has too come down other important key important facts & witnesses & also the lead guy of Scotland yard Anderson had Kosmisky as his main suspect
His mental health could also suggest he couldn't have done it; he was incapable of keeping himself remotely clean by all accounts.
@@Alec_Collins78 Many underestimate just because someone maybe mentally ill doesn't mean they don't have the capacity & smarts to do a crime or many crimes & be smart enough to evade police; the times were much different back then & there was no forensics & they barely had use of finger prints so witnesses accounts & means, motives, & opportunity were what they went by back then & Aaron Kosmisky had all of those things against him & not too mention he also had surgeon training as a pro hair dresser & the slaughter house skill set stuff I don't buy into it because there is a difference in knowing the human anatomy then cutting up animals
Did you write the. From hell. Letter. You have the same lack of spelling and grammar skills as jack. A relative of yours maybe. What state are y all from
@@heathergustar638 Lol😆🤣😂 or is it Heather Grammer? Nah of course I'm being sarcastic & goofy too! But Heather Graham was one of the best actresses in the movie "From Hell" but anyways that is some funny creative trolling; perhaps the best I've seen in a very long time; most of them are just rude & harbour insults but yours you was intentionally did bad grammer just to poke fun at me! I'll give you that lol; but as far as state I am in Ohio but I've lived in many states but anyways I actually had a 95% in college English so I may have an error or boo boo ever so often but there are worst than me lol but who do you think Jack the Ripper was? That is the subject & the 6 million dollar question?
007, eh? How Spooky.
That intro music....that's a computer game. But which one?
Hey, it is from age of empires.
@@VassalsofKingsgrave thank you so much! I wasn't sure, so this is much appreciated
Nobody has ever suggested any of the letters are modern forgeries. They had to make room for paperwork back then and so some of it was nicked. They merely showed up again.
been trying to finish this for few days been doing it while i lay down late at night found a bunch of these kinda obsesed with know who jack ripper was and ax man of new orleans im an actor so have a creative mind
Include some knowledge of spelling and grammar in your. Creative mind
A crazy 😵 story!
Lechmere. All day, every day.
Objective Re , ya wrong mate.
@@andrewcorlett4795 any reason why its not him ?
@@jakehammond12345 Hello, yeah if Cross had been butchering Poly I think Cross / Lechmere / or your Jack would have had little reason not to take out the witness . After all it's rude to interrupt , init .
@@andrewcorlett4795 So switch his MO , victim and transpose his mummy issues and hatred of women onto an unknown man who may be a police officer on a whim. Going against all jack the ripper evidence before and after. Creating more noise, a fight and screams of help ?
if thats the only reason why not i think you need to find something else.
@@jakehammond12345 Ìf it's him what is he switching, whose to say who really found Polly? If Cross was Jack he'd have give Aĺlan what 4, instead as the swedish cop ? says it was your jacks public duty 2 appear at the inquest ,wonder if he brought his tools . OR hope to God u never on a jury involving me.
Jack the ripper was innocent
i just found this
Great discussion, especially from the viewpoint of the fairer sex. It's a very male dominated subject. Great to get a woman's view on these historical events 😉👍
Especially two women who don t know what they re talking about
What's more annoying is so called men that applaud for it as if they are a fellow woman. Most of these women hate men and want to take over everything that was once male but men don't try to take over everything that is female like demanding to have a few men in every single hairdressers or anything where women get together to talk when there's no men present as there's still plenty of places that happens but men are not allowed to be in places thats male only , golf clubs were the last place men could get together to talk without women around but these feminist man hating assailed had to stick their noses in to get women in there. Plenty of women's nights and women only groups etc but try having a men only anything! Nowadays all u get are "womdns views" on everything under the sun as of men's voices don't count. So what if a certain thing is dominated by men or women, that's just life, men are more likely to be interested in sone things and women others. Getting in dumb bimbos to run their big mouths about something they have no idea about just because it's a "there's no women spoken in this..." "let's just get one on to balance it out" such a political correct left wing, Marxist garbage thing to do.
🤣🤣🤣
I do not believe "Jack" was a solitary killer.
He had accomplices.
Lee Donaldson interesting - who do you think he was and what was the motive?
@@VassalsofKingsgrave As to who "he" was , I think there was a group of men who somehow, somewhere met and who decided to {for whatever reason} perpetrate these acts.
I feel that there was an alpha psychopath... the ringleader. I strongly suspect that this person was Tumblety.
And maybe 2 or 3 accomplice subordinate psychopaths.
Several of the "canonical suspects" more than fit the bill for inclusion on this list.
As to the motive...
What was the purpose?.. It was the intent of the ringleaders design.
No he was lone killer it was kosminski most likely go with the odds
That's what randy Williams thinks
@@christianmonturanoii6539 No... he was a harmless imbecile. Mistaken for David Cohen.