WF-54: The Swiss FG-42 Scaled up to 7.5x55
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
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After World War Two the Swiss needed a new self-loading military rifle to replace their K-31 bolt actions. Two major design tracks followed; one being a roller-delayed system based on the G3 at SIG and the other being a derivative of the German FG-42 at Waffenfabrik Bern. Bern, under the direction of Adolph Furrer, had been experimenting with intermediate cartridges since the 1920s, and they used this as a basis to develop an improved FG-42 using an intermediate cartridge (7.5x38mm). The program began in 1951 and went through about a half dozen major iterations until it ultimately lost to the SIG program (which produced the Stgw-57).
Today we are looking at one of the later steps in the Bern program, the WF-54. By this point the intermediate cartridge had been discarded in favor of using the standard Swiss GP11 (7.5x55mm). The overall design was a bit simplified as well. The Bern program would continue for two more years after this rifle before ultimately losing out to the SIG 510 for Swiss military adoption.
Many thanks to the Royal Armouries for allowing me to film and disassemble this rifle! The NFC collection there - perhaps the best military small arms collection in Western Europe - is available by appointment to researchers:
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You can browse the various Armouries collections online here:
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When the FG-42 at home is the gourmet version 👌 🇨🇭
Nice.
bort bort🎉
Exquisitely refined.
*When your Mom or Dad is a Michelin star chef
Beyond exquisite*Chef's kiss*.
-Do we get FG42 scaled up or down?
-Both. Both is good!
More like back and forth.
@@XtreeM_FaiL maybe so but it was a good reference to 'The Road to El Dorado'
@@BenJamInn-q3o Well 7.92x57 but technically correct
The best kind of correct
@@DraconX3 It has many names.
They obviously had to remain neutral on that question
According to Dale (who has been featured many times at Bloke on the Range regarding the Stgw. 57), the decision to discard the idea of an intermediate calibre was based mostly on the need to rush the Stgw. 57 to production. When the Soviets ended the Hungarian revolution in 1956 with force (right in the neighbour of Switzerland), a lot of the ongoing experimental projects were dropped and they picked the things that worked and adopted them ASAP to modernize their military. But there was no doubt a lot of practical reasons to stick with the full power cartridge.
Also, I bet that "winter trigger" is not actually a winter trigger. In the Stgw. 57 it is not referenced anywhere as a winter trigger. That is used to launch the gigantic rifle grenades, because you WILL F up your fingers if you use the regular trigger inside the guard.
you realise Austria exists yeah?
@@foleymajbut if it isn’t a “winter trigger” then why does it activate the regular trigger when pulled?
@@Klob-xo9vh what he ment was that the "wintertrigger" is actually a grenade launcher trigger, because having your finger in that trigger gaurd while undergoing the hefty recoil of fireing a riflegrenade might lead to injury. functionally it is basically the same as a wintertrigger but the reason of putting it there is different.
might also be a combination thing, which is what i am enclined to believe.
@TuorTheBlessedOfUlmo do you really want post war Austria fighting anyone?
The V on the gas system might stand for "verschlossen" which would translate to "closed off"
Thanks for your comment. Do you know what the M, on the selector, stands for?
@@jackschmac most likely MItrailleuse : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitrailleuse for machine gun fire. (aka full auto)
@@ursusfloeckli9065 Thanks, Could the V be French, also? It seems funny to mix German and French.
@@jackschmac switzerland has 3 official languages, german, french and italian. for military stuff we use german and french, so it makes sense. M probably stands for "maschinenfeuer" or something like that in german
@@jackschmac I don't know about the V. I guess 'Verschluss' or a synonyme thereoff seems like a reasonable assumption. Although the word 'Verschluss' is used for the English 'Bolt' in weaponry, so I assume
it is a synonyme, though I can't think of a corresponding expression. 'Verschluss' means that whitch closses off something. Or locks something in.
The screw underneath the selector switch looks just like a mod used on a certain .22 semi automatic to covert them to full auto when and where it was legal to do so. The screw was discontinued in the 1970s by the manufacturer, but the rifle was banned in many places as it retained the unmodified action. Considering the similarity in design to that particular modern rifle, I would say yes, that is a full auto lockout switch.
What was that certain .22 semi automatic?
@@exuberance3973 if he ansewrs that youtube gets out the ban hammer
@@fwi1298 false
@@jonmeray713Dwight Schrute, is that you?
@exuberance3973 I can't mention it, I'm from Australia and I don't want the federales kicking my door in. I'm sure Ian knows which one I'm talking about
FG42 is my favorite rifle, and these Swiss versions of it are simply chef's kiss, absolutely gorgeous.
I love the FG-42 and related videos. One of my favourite guns ever. This one looks very Swiss, love it.
The WTF-54. What an awesome name for a gun.
If only it had come out in 1969
No "M"s or "A1", "Mk" whatever
Most likely the thumb screw was for adjusting the "creepage" of the dual stage trigger that has been standard on every Swiss service rifle since 1889.
The Stgw57 has such an adjustment screw (dubbed "Druckpunktreguliermutter") and also the Stgw90 (the bolt protruding behind the trigger).
It seems to me this model better reflects the tactical needs of the Swiss army, with less likelihood of street fighting and more opportunity for long, aimed shots across a clear field. The full-power cartridge and long barrel take advantage of the Swiss marksmanship training.
Agreed, the swiss have a shooting culture that is very respected,, its like golf
@@Landsersajer And like golf it has no practical real world application.
Swiss marksmen haven't been tested for several generations.
@@clothar23and yet my teenage classmates shoot better than an average american class every will
@@Andre_Thomasson Again Swiss Marksmanship is untested in practical matters , unproven in war , hell untested even in simple hunting.
Meanwhile the Yanks have more living combat veterans than Switzerland has had in the last 2 centuries put together.
With all the years i have been following gun jesus he always has more guns to show us! I never miss an episode!!! ❤
Even when they're "less fancy," Swiss guns still project a Rolls-Royce vibe.
They could have made it ambidextrous just by giving it a non-reciprocating charging handle or by giving it a more forward-positioned reciprocating charging handle.
Imagine having this beauty slung on you and a P210 in your holster; these old guns are just beautiful
I remember how the forward wooden grip felt like.. There used to be more than a dozen rifles in the inner corner of the wooden stairwell leading into the basement of my Grandparents house.
In regards to that open slot for charging handle, It looks like the butt plate would provide support at the open end of the slide.
Greetings from South Africa!
"Do you want it simplified or not?"
"Yes."
Thanks again Ian
Very interesting and definitely different MG that deserved to be shared with us.
The Stgw 90 is also lockable into semi-auto. Very likely thats what that knob does.
It is, but it's mostly used for 300m training and thus used quite often and purposefully very noticeable with a white dot showing when locked. A hidden screw under the grip panels is neither easy to use nor noticeable.
@@fuesel2 Hidden away like that also makes it more unlikely a soldier is going to fool around and switch to full auto when he's not supposed to.
Pretty sure that's the NJP knob, turn to get NJP'd.
Well it is just a visible plate to switch aside and your are ready to rock-'n'-roll. Every soldier can do that. Also with STGW57. There is a thin plate. Flip it around from white to black and your are ready to go. That is what is checked on every shooting event. STGW57 white plate outside and STGW90 white dot visible, you are good to train in semi auto. That is just to protect everybody from accidental full auto bursts.
Looks like something a bounty hunter in Star Wars would have. In other words, very cool.
Swiss with the sneaky giggle switch. Very sneaky. I like it.
The grip panel fastener is technically called a "Zeus" fastener in aviation industry. As you can tell, it tends to last a very long time before wearing out. Most often on aircraft a series of these fasteners secure frequently opened & closed maintenance panels. The captured screw is one less item to drop & become lost. Swiss typical approach to over engineer.
A wild @ss guess that hidden thumb screw the pointy end is attached directly to the sear. Loosening or tightening it should give one selection for auto or repitition. Guess my guess only.
Operates like a carbeurator screw to adjust the fuel system jet on a car or truck of older vintage.
Again. Only my assumption sir.
Assumption but a good one. Though it's a choice if true I find odd. Like we figured out selector switches well before this thing.
But as you say the Swiss like to over engineer things to a degree even the Germans would envy.
*dzus 😁
The above mentioned factors give me a suspicion at least one of the firearm designers has-had a degree in aeronautical engineering?
My dream rifle remade by the Swiss into my favorite rifle caliber?
I'm salivating.
I'd like to think the butt stock stiffens up that open channel, still a scary large slot for a gun.
Its a trigger pretravel adjustment you are correct sir 😂
reporting in from Japan, lfg early armorers
“Adjusted with (sort of) any tool, cartridge case…” Why do I feel disappointed that you didn’t use a multi function pocket knife?
Or the multi function Bic pen 😊
Ian is in England, having a pocket knife would land you in jail for several months.
@@thomashendron4356 I had not heard of the Swiss Army Bic, but now I want one, lol
Maybe an SAK flathead screwdriver ? I think British law allows carrying a knife with a non locking blade no longer than three inches .
The rifle you make when you have hordes of talented machinists and unlimited funds.
If you're going to ask us to help you figure out how it works, can you spend some more time getting good detailed video of the guts? Don't have to take it apart, but make sure the lighting and angles get as much detail as you can. That would help SO much!
The bolt carrier moving forward with the firing pin means you get the accuracy issues of an open bolt while still keeping a closed bolt. I'm actually kind of impressed. 😆
Some context: throughout the 1950s (and into the 1960s), there was a big debate in Switzerland about how the army should be structured and equipped with regards to post-WW2 realities (in particular the nuclear battlefield) and this also influenced rifle design. This debate was especially fierce inside the Swiss reservist officer corps (many senior reservist officers also holding high office in banking, industry or politics). There were 2 factions: the traditionalists and the modernists. The traditionalists wanted an infantry-centric army with the traditional Swiss emphasis on accurate long-range shooting, backed by strong fortifications including nuke-resistant bunkers. They favored a long-barreled rifle and a full-power cartridge. The modernists argued that static fortifications were nuke-magnets and wanted a mobile mechanized army with tanks, AFVs and a strong airforce. This required a shorter rifle for mainly mounted troops. In the beginning, W+F Bern, favored the modernists (WF51), but when it became likely that the traditionalists might win (mainly because the modernist army was judged too expensive), they switched to the longer full-power WF54 design, but ultimately lost to SIGs AM55 (which became the Stgw57).
Incidentally, the “conceptional battle” between the two factions wasn’t resolved until 1966, when it ended in a typical Swiss compromise solution: the majority of the army (9 divisions) would be static infantry backed by strong fortifications and fighting from prepared positions, but there would be 3 mechanized divisions for mobile operations. And Switzerland did end up buying 300 tanks and building another 400 themselves, and had an airforce of 300 fighters and fighter-bombers, until the end of the Cold War.
Babe, wake up! Ian’s new video just dropped!
Great video.
Argentina in early 50's Made a version in 7.62 x 51 Nato, I don't know how many survive, I saw one of this in Museo Nacional de Armas, in Buenos Aires
That knob under the grip is how yoy wind your swiss watch 😂
Ian, are you sure the bolt isn't locked when the sear catches the bolt carrier?
Because if the cartridge cooks and unintentionally fires, it would be really bad with an unlocked bolt.
The distances I estimated from your video could be that the bolt is locked after each shot even when the sear catches the carrier and prevents another shot.
also: with the original FG42: the bolt was locked/rotated and only the bolt carrier/firing pin would move like an inch or so when firing from a closed bolt, right? That's what it was - firing from a closed bolt. Not semi open something bolt.
holy crap, that IS long! for some reason I expected removing the buttplate would shorten it like it does a normal gun, and then the disassembled shot hit me 😂
You could fire in ranks with that thing!
It's a handful of ideas for a service rifle. It's kind of hard to imagine doing a leap from a straight pull bolt action to this thing?
They sort of didn't. Like a lot of militaries in the pre-war period with bolt action/straight pull rifles they were all looking for an effective semi-auto, it's one reason why a lot of ZH29's and Pederson's got trialled or at least looked if not officially tested, after WW2 ended the same thing applied but with more urgency hence the British EM rifles, French MAS40 and the Russian SKS etc.
Lots of people want to ride with you in the limo, but what you want is someone who will take the bus with you when the limo breaks down.
7.5x55 calms my OCD
So, they made about ten just to check how it goes… and being Swiss they’ve made them look gorgeous 😍
That knob in the grip does seem to line up with the selector as well. Ian is probably right
Life is the flower for which love is the honey.
Amazing, thank you, Ian!
Man, it really looks like a heavy blaster from Star Wars universe...
Well, considering what guns the star wars blasters are based on, you're not far off.
Heavy blasters where based/made from Lewis light machine guns or German MG34 machine guns depending on blaster model, the storm troopers where armed with modified Sterling L2a3 sub machine guns, and Han carried a modded Mauser c96.
There's more but Disney made me lose interest in S.W..
This is the bullpup that Fallout deserves.
try pronouncing it bear..n bearn (bern) instead of burn
hello there Ian, would you consider making video on Radom factory ViS 100?
Gotta be one of the most aesthetically pleasing guns I've ever seen
Where are the British Royal Armories?
In the British Royal sleeveries of course
A self loathing rifle: "I hate my muzzle velocity."
Everything about this gun makes sense... except the reciprocating charging handle.
I need to quit watching anything on Swiss firearm designs. I want a K-31, and will probably never be able to get one. 😂
Greetings from Germany
Ian, have you ever taken apart a gun and couldn't get it back together? Or lost a part when a spring throws it across the room?
Locking screw tab thing. Quite the technical description!
Fricking early gang reporting for duty
What?
When fate hands us a lemon, lets try to make lemonade.
I think you hit the nail on the head with that fire mode control knob, it sounds very Swiss, ammo is not cheap and full auto is not what these guns are good at!
Hey Ian, shouldn't the title say: The swiss FG42 scaled down to 7.5x55? Or are you refering to the smaller swiss Version?
US Ordinance Department made it to Switzerland too
Wouldn't 7.5 Swiss be scaled down from the 8mm Mauser?
Fg42 my beloved
Such a nice weapon. You can imagine a pile of Swiss troops with these, dotted about, supporting one of the pillboxes. guarding some winding road with steep sides in the Alps. Wouldn't like the be the attacking force.
Love those Swiss charging handles.
"Flip in to actual full-on invasion mode"
-every aurmor ever
This is a hot gun
I literally first heard about this gun/weapon-prototype yesterday so it's really trippy to me that you uploaded a video about it today. Didn't even know that it was the third iteration after the 51 either
I would love this one.
You and Me Both!!! 🤠👍🇨🇭
Swiss craftsmanship is second to none.
Another one?!?! cool af
Cool stuff. Thnks4share
Ian. Have you ever been to the J.M. Davis Arms & Historical Museum in Claremore, OK?
Everybody like for Ian and Johnathan to do a game spot video together!!!!! Let’s get the best cursed and legit guns together across a couple games and make them go through them!!
0:57 I want the story on the WTF51.
this man doesn't realize how much the term 'gun jesus' fits him
What do you mean?
Oh he knows exactly how fitting it is. He has cosplayed/dressed up as literal gun jesus, including crown of thorns and tunic a couple times.
Bot comments are going wild on youtube, right now.
This video was so great
Meanwhile in canada they're selling the FG in 9mm and it SUCKS
Total jam machine and only 5 rounds of ammo
EMBARASSING
Can’t wait till he covers the toggle operation version
I would be willing to bet that the knob inside the grip is a full auto lockout. I really like that rifle, but wonder how difficult it would be to get the ammo for it.
Ammo is easy they are still made from ruag s&b and ppu. Standard gp11/ 7.5x55 Swiss
Same here from Argentina...
It looks...... Naked
This is so interesting in contrast with the M60, I think. You've got one set up as a GPMG and the other as a light machinegun in a WW1 sense, but those differing roles create a difference in effectively every single detail, every single part, despite both being inspired by the FG-42 and firing full power cartridges.
Again, notta gun - guy but appreciate your knowledge / expertise ane give you word of mouthmouth mouth whenever I can. Enjoy your your presentations.
This is a scaled up version of the miniature version, right?
The function of the screw in the grip must be in the patent.
Excellent Observation!!! 🤠👍🇨🇭
He says it's in none of the documentation. Likely meaning it's an after-patent addition. Documentation likely includes some level of the technical drawings at various levels. I'd be inclined to agree it's something preventing the sear from dropping to a lower full auto setting. There's some other comments indicating it might have been a work around for the rifle to exist where full auto was banned before the royal armories got a hold of it.
Don’t you mean “scaled down”? The FG-42 was chambered in 8X57, 7.5mm is smaller than 8mm
Can't they put the fire control group of WF-54 into computer tomography (3d X-ray) machine to scan it? There are some companies that offer this.
Scaled up? Isn't the original in 7.92*57?
Edit: never mind.
Isn't 7.5x55 Still scaled down from 7.9x57?
that is an odd m60
Beautifully made. Sigh. However, that very much looks more like a medium LMG than a rifle a soldier would be happy to carry with him and a full pack on a 10 mile march across muddy fields into enemy territory. Admittedly the US M14 and the Belgian FN FAL had the same problem. Something lighter is clearly more advantageous. Noting how few excessively bulky (like this is) rifles we see being carried into Kursk this past week.
Well.. What got chosen in the end, the sig 510, is heavier than the fn fal. Over 2 kg heavier. So. The soldiers weren't happy with the weight either way
Nonmatching bipod chipped handgaurd I'll pass
Aah yes swiss guns....runs like a fine watch, looks like a school metalworking class
" The Force is strong with this one "
Rename to WTF 54
To free us from the expectations of others, to give us back to ourselves there lies the great, singular power of self-respect.
Now I want a FG
Yes Please!!! 🤠👍
I do enjoy the continuing story of the NOT StG-57.
So the bolt is going to slam into the trigger sear with every trigger pull? That can't be very good for the longevity of that poor trigger group.
Let's be honest, most of us would enjoy cleaning that thing at any opportunity - the gap is there for our enjoyment lol
Just like the Swiss, I also bind my UBGL on V.
welp we know why it wasn't adopted....that "less fancy" bolt handle