This Graphics Card can be expanded with an SSD?
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
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/ der8auer
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Music / Credits:
Outro:
Dylan Sitts feat. HDBeenDope - For The Record (Dylan Sitts Remix)
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Paid content in this video:
- /
Samples used in this video:
- Lexar components, ASUS 4060Ti SSD
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
0:59 RTX 4060 Ti with M.2 SSD
3:07 Configuring the BIOS
3:47 Testing in performance profile
4:22 Testing in quiet profile
5:49 Testing while gaming
6:15 Lexar NM790: Cooling the controller
6:54 Testing with a Corsair MP700 PCIe 5.0 SSD
8:57 The 4060 Ti without backplate & the PCB
9:30 Summary/Conclusion
11:05 Outro 
Наука
This could be very useful for ITX or SFF buyers who has very limited M.2 availability
*cries, in asrock b660m-itx/ac*
Oh wait,. that mobo ALSO doesn't support pcie bifurcation that's required for this
@@Nalianna They just need to make one with an expensive PLX chip and it won't need bifurcation support
These cards are on the market to pimp old systems !
U don't need it, not an old system ?
@@charizard4410 All it needs is PCIe connectivity, for old DELL systems you found in the dumpster.
What system you need it for, bifurcation support ? How u setup PCIe lanes on your board ?
The graphics card should actually have 2 M.2 slots, as if the GPU uses 8, and if the M.2 SSD can only use 4, then the other 4 lanes are basically not used.
Well when you bifurcate pcie i don't think it's possible to do a 12/4 split. So you would have to have another hardware level split on the GPU itself, like a plx chip (which this card doesn' thave)
Depends on the board, if the board can do x8/x4/x4 then ASUS can make it 2 m.2 in there.
Many boards (especially Intel B and Hx10 series) don't have bifurcation feature. So yeah it really tricky to implement for average joe.
Issue is platform most intel motherboards with bifurification only allow 2x8 so you couldnt use 2 m.2's and the GPU
Now in AM5 and AM4 tho its abnormal not to see 1x8/2x4 as an option as you can actually split down to 4x4 without a performance hit and even down to 16 individual lanes with minimal hit but requires bios support for it
But if,this already would be 90-100$ more expensive a 2 slot would cost slightly more. At that point,would be better spend the same amount on a better motherboard? Like on Amazon ita,100 € is the difference between a Asus b660 and a Asus h770. With the h770 you would have 3 slot m.2 ,more pcie line and a lot more features from the chipset and mothers board, plug-in play (zero config on bios)
@@fVNzO but it's possible to do 8/4/4, no?. still need BIOS compatibility, though
The cat was the best part of the video! 😂
I absolutely love having cats make cameos in these videos. Also: for SFF builds this GPU is pretty slick, especially since the drive can run at Gen5 speeds. Thanks for the quick video!
The cat was pretty funny.
The software 'fan control' for windows is absolutely perfect for this. You can set the GPU fans to spin up depending on highest temperature of either the GPU or the SSD, that way both will always be cooled as much as you want whenever necessary.
Huh that's clever. Assigning the GPU fans to the SSD temp.
Would love to see an x8 x8 bifurcation gpu with thunderbolt / usb4 next. Would massively up expandability for mini itx systems. Especially if the gpu natively routed one of the video ports over the usb c port internally
Yea true and 100$ more for that wouldn't be too outrageous since most add on thunderbolt cards cost around 130 to 140$
That would be amazing to see, could market it as a VR card too. Would get around the awkward setup most boards that use an extra cable to just pass through to the motherboard.
That should be enough for a few 80Gbps ports running at once with gen5...
Looks like something that server stuff already did with some weird daughterboard
Yeah 2080ti's had usb c it got discontinued
You should have tested the ssd while the gpu was under load.
there can not be any difference. Its just like a split pcie slot.
It doesn't matter. It uses dedicated lanes.
3:21 It requires motherboard bifurification
So it cant be used in most systems AMD side AM4 onwards will work
but AM4 requires you to not have the SSD mounted just the GPU then go in and change the bifurification setting to 1x8/2x4, reboot shutdown then put the ssd in and it should then work
For AM5 it happens automatically but most motherboards have to many slots for the number of lanes so the GPU endsup with x8 and 1 or 2 SSD's get x4
so lets say you stuff an m.2 in all 4+ slots and 1 in the GPU... 1 or 2 of the m.2's wont showup as they are fighting for the same lanes and depends in if the bios changes to x8/x8 or 1x8/2x4
It wouldn't matter the gpu has 8 dedicated lanes and the ssd has 8 dedicated lanes. M.2 slots only use 4 lanes too so technically the slot can have 2 m.2 and the graphics card
@@RayanMADAO He's probably referring to the heat generated. Not the load on the PCIe lanes itself (I think)
Love watching your videos not only for the content but the cats.
Perrfect ending, with the real star of the show ;p
Derbaur I saw you on some news recently you bought something expensive, crazy guy haha, hope you're well, another fantastic video as to be expected/usual.
I love this. Not sure I'd ever buy it, but it's nice to see a gfx card manufacturer provide a genuinely new feature that users can use without requiring software to be updated to support it. Also, the storage is handy. With games getting larger, and AAA games sometimes being larger than 100 gig now, us gamers need all the fast storage we can afford.
"without requiring software to be updated to support it" uefi update is usily needed fro pcie bifurcation
@@CuteistFox True, the motherboard firmware may require updating,, but increasing motherboard manufacturuers seem to be allowing Windows Update to do this, which does remove the responsibility from the user.. I was talking about the card providing a new feature without the software (e.g. games) needing to be updated to support it.
Great review of an unusual product !
PSA: This card has no builtin PCIe Bifurcation or Lane Splitting feature, you cannot use the ssd on motherboards which, again, do not have PCIe Bifurcation or Lane Splitting.
I think card should have included that.
So this vga is completely useless on a Intel consumer platform
@@Cinghia117just another reason not to have an Intel platform.
@@Cinghia117It's sampled in this video from an Intel platform.
Also, 700-series boards have advertised bifurcation, so B760, H770, and Z790 have them - still dependent on the manufacturer, though.
PLX chip isn't cheap, and looking at how Nvidia priced their card I doubt people wanted it
Bro that will never happen. NVMe carrier cards with a PLX chip are like HUNDREDS of dollars just by themself.
More manufacturers should do this with x8 cards.
Thumbs for Shiek approval and also this coolstuff review! ^^)
Nice. This is mostly for small form factor PC like an ITX motherboard who only have one PCIe x16 slot and couldn't fit lots of M.2 slots in that tiny motherboard. Still, I hope that they can include to M.2 slot because it has 8 PCIe lanes, and 1 M.2 slot only use 4 lanes. My motherboard (Gigabyte X570 Aorus Pro v1.0) has a bifurcation setting of x8/x4/x4.
This would really be great for small form factor PCs, but also for ease of assembly. Instead of having to set up say, GPU, CPU, boot device, PSU, you can combine two of those into one unit.
i think it was a cool idea and a decent sku for certain scenarios
ideas are limitless! we might even have a gpu w/ thuderbolt port in the future!
Love your cats appearance !
This sounds awesome for a compact photo editing rig. One more m.2 ssd can be significant.
Only gamers need it, editing on a gaming PC, you need a better CPU for that, more PCIe lanes !
That's pretty neat. Definitely useful for MATX and SFF gang.
This time the outro was the best
Thanks nice review. I think that is quite inconvenient.
I have liked this video because your videos are good, and your orange tabby is featured front and center.
This is brilliant
I don't know how exactly would be easiest, but I absolutely would love to see either 2 nvme, or the nvme be a cache for the gpu, because the whole direct storage thing is already a thing, and if you could design the card to take advantage of that, there could be something really compelling. The other idea just sounds great if you can support the funky bifurcation profile, but maybe that could be done with an IC of some kind, preferably not a switch though.
No one would knock back more VRAM, but Nvidia would rather cut their own throat than agree to this.
The conclusion chapter is simply purrfect
Very nice idea, since budget systems or itx do not have many lanes or m.2 slots.
I wanna see, sometime in the future, using some of that ssd space turned into vram.
This looks amazing for getting those hot PCIe Gen5 NVMEs temperatures down inside size-constrained ITX builds.
Installing all my games on the graphics card.
GG's.
Hi der8auer, I'm anticipating the 4090 Matrix's second teardown of the pumphead/coldplate. I'm curious to see if they used a TIM in between. Since you own it now.
While this is really just a space-saving measure, there is also the possibility that this _kind_ of design could better utilize something like Direct Storage for the sake of tighter timings and fewer bottlenecks. I'd really like to see this kind of concept pushed further to see what kind of gains we could get from it. Maybe we could see a day where all games saved on SSDs attached to GPUs have literally zero load times. It's still a good concept on its own without this, though. With PCIe generations continuing to double in bandwidth every two years or so, it will probably become unnecessary for even flagship video cards to use the full 16 lanes. So it makes a lot of sense to split lanes and put fifth-gen SSDs or higher on a device already designed with beefy cooling. Otherwise both the GPU and SSD coolers are gonna be fighting over the same real estate on the motherboard.
Direct Access is just a buzzword for lifting a pointless arbitrary limitation in the spec (BAR size).
DMA has literally existed for 40 years.
PCIe is still controlledby the cpu, direct storage just lets the gpu do some of the pcie stuff that will then be forwarded to the cpu but with little cpu procesesing
That's a nice slot for an M.2 AI TPU like Google Coral. Frigate NVR on ITX and a Jonsbo N2 NAS case comes to mind
Some boards only have one or two NVME slots, so this is nice to add storage without upgrading the board. Also on my board if I wanted to access my 2 NVME SSDs i'd have to remove my GPU (they are below it). The only accessible one with the GPU in is the third m2 slot. Moving the card isn't a big deal, but if all 3 slots are occupied, you can't add more unless you use a SATA SSD. So the option to pop in another NVME is a nice feature: i'd rather have functionality like this than more RGB for example.
The supposed price point pretty much kills it at current SSD prices though. If you're paying a hundred bucks extra just for this feature, you can either just replace your previous SSD with one with more capacity at the cost difference, or you can get a motherboard with one more slot instead. If it's more of a protoype for future cards that don't come with such a price premium, then sure.
This is cool!
This would be ideal for the blade type NUC PC's used in portable video and sound production, where there's a need to keep the mass and packaging as small as possible.
I see this being useful for people who record gameplay.
with software like fancontrol you don't need such a bios switch.
very nice piece of software
This seems most useful to mITX scenarios. And most modern ITX boards usually have plenty of M.2 slots available for drives. I'm curious if this one is bootable. Also another interesting use case would be something like an M.2 10gbe or 2x2.5gbe NIC hanging off the video card.
Thats for bios to decide, so it should work
I thought this card would just be a gimmick. But I'm very impressed with the SSD temperatures.
Maybe we'll see a GPU with an x8 E3 2T slot eventually. That could be a lot more flexible if they catch on.
Perfect place for your games drive
8:30 I'd make contact with your thermal pet too 🤗
@3:05 what is that attached monitoring device? and where can I get one?
How are the temps when running the OS and a game from the SSD from the GPU and the GPU at full tilt might intorduce heat issues on the SSD? (as the GPU and SSD are running at once), also the price would mean you are better off with a more expensive MOBO
with HBM ram we could have space for all kinds of interesting connections and stuff on the back and end of the card
Question: So, in your one video about the GIgabyte Aorus motherboard recently, you mentioned that it was a waste to have the pcie 5.0 nvme slot that would drop the gpu slot to 8x if used, but based on what you say in this video, it doesn't really matter since only half is used anyway correct? Thanks for the help.
The difference is on a halo tier mb you would expect pairing with a 4090 which does use all 16 lanes.
@@jacobhurst7275 are you sure about that? I've read that even a 4090 actually only needs 8x if in pci-e 5.0. Any info on this? I would like to educate myself on it if so.
I could find usage in small form factor ITX builds when you need more capacity. For example something like Plex media server.
In this case personally I'd leave the card in quiet mode, but ONLY use that drive to store games. That way when your gaming and the video card heats up, and the fans kick in it also cools your game drive.
this is perfect for older office computers that have old motherboards
@Der8auer, the fact that the card runs gen4 and the ssd runs gen5 is no surprise. The slot is gen5, but the card doesnt handle that so it just runs gen4. The pcie controller doesnt know the difference as backwards compatibility is so baked in 'it just works'. I noticed this on older systems many years ago with gen2 and gen3 before being able to select the generation in bios was s more common thing, the same happens with lane distribution, using a pcie x1 wifi card in a x16 slot has no issues other than its kind of a waste of realestate, the pcie controller just automatically adjusts accordingly. I am always amazed at how seamless pcie adjusts according to the situation compared to other connectivity technologies out there that require so much hand-holding to get it to work across different generations and bandwidth
I wonder, could you hook up any other m.2 stuff, like a wireless chip like you find in laptops?
Your cat looks so much like mine when he just plops himself down on his side and rolls on his back :D
What about SSD pci cards being run as an alernative to ram for cpu or for gpu? I have heard these are things already in prototype for servers and other aplications. Cant wait for the glass substrates to get thrown into this mix as well further reducing heat.
This is actually a useful thing for a card that is limited by lanes
Insane to put the component most impacted by temps adjacent to the component that generates the most heat....
honestly a decent idea as long as it doesnt add more than a few bucks to the card. probably really useful for some smaller builds
Too bad this cost $100 more than the basic variants.
They could probably reduce the price in the future, if they enter "proper mass production".
man when your screen wobbled it freaked me out i thought it was another ground shake
is the card able to acces textures much quicker because its closer to the gpu ? not to extend the gpu memory
you can mount a second gpu to the gpu with an m.2 adapter and have even more gpu
The calmest orange cat
this would be really nice if the gpus switch over to pcie 5.0 and you can use the cooler for the 5.0 ssds
cause then most gpus wont need more than x8
And here I thought I could now expand my vram when needed lol
If mobo manufacturers and GPU manufacturers went full bore on this idea, it could be neat to see a 6090 only using 4 gen 6 lanes with 3 SSDs strapped to the back of it using the other 12 lanes.
You can never have enough storage today - a great idea and when this becomes mainstream we will probably all be buying into it
That's actually a really good idea to go with lower end cards.
Even the most high end GPU like RTX 4090 doesn't need x16 PCIE 5.0 (it can run at X8 PCIE 4.0 without any bottleneck), i think adding M.2 slot on GPU is a good idea to utilize extra bandwidth from PCIE 5.0
On my system, my 4090 takes a noticeable performance hit if I run it at PCIE 4.0 x8.
4090 is one of the cards that does have a noticeable performance dip with x8 4.0. Bad example to use, 4080 and lower should work the same however
This is for old PC. Pimp that old DELL you found in the dump, able to store on NVMe
Why ASUS gave him that card ?
wrong! Even 3060 takes 3-8% hit with pcie 4 x 8, and 4090 is many time as powerful than that shit
@@lucasrem Old PC's are less likely to have the ability to bifurcate slots so I don't know that I agree with that.
Very cool product.😮😊
Especially for ITX mobo users.
To bad its only on 4060.
Honestly, I'm more excited about the cat than the GPU. Look at how cute it is on camera!
how would you find out which motherboard would allow you too split the top pci-e slot Roman ?
Makes me want to dust off a Aquacomputer KryoM.2, be kinda neat to get the same concept as this in a waterblock, using the same contact point on a GPU block to cool the SSD.
That cat had all my attention
next test is to see if it can hold games and run games (the SSD onboard being used for said games instead of OS/game drive)
I would think that would be valuable for a small mobo NAS, you could still have a GPU in the system and then instead of using the M.2 slot for SSD, use a M.2 to 6 SATA adapter to run up to 10 hard drives... because the most I've seen on smaller mobo is 4 SATA ports usually.
It's a cool idea just sucks if the mark up is actually that high, shouldn't be more than 10$ for components, pads and board cut maybe will see use in small form factor systems with limited m.2 slots
Just image doing benchmarking on different motherboards\cpu and you just move this GPU with OS install between systems.
It might be good for people doing lot's of testing.
Where does it draw its power from the pci e bus or does it also rely on Nvidias dodgy power connectors
Ah it's like the old creative sound blasters that had ram slots
It's an interesting use of PCIe bifurcation, but some motherboards only offer a choice between x16 on one slot or x8/x8 on two slots so that a second GPU can be used (my Asus B550 for example). This card could not be used in such systems as far as I can tell.
But if you have that you can probably put an M.2 adapter in the second slot instead and have more choice of which GPU to get.
@@whyjay9959 True. I was really just pointing out that just because a motherboard supports bifurcation, it doesn't necessary mean that it's compatible with this GPU in that mode. Personally, I do use an M.2 adaptor, but in the x4 slot.
Hats of to ASUS for a grate idea and execution. And thanks for showing it of.
the PCB view of the GPU indicates a bifurcation requirement for the M.2 slot (which is barely a thing on intel boards unless certain Z boards or workstation/server boards in general), but also wasted the last 4 lanes within the PCIE connector. could have just put one more slot in as i doubt 4060 is that hot to bear another second SSD in itself
Hey why not, given how M.2 has taken over on desktop PC's (for better or worse) you might as well offer stuff like this if there is PCIe lanes going spare.
I can see it being useful to someone and costs very little to include.
I wonder what the market would be for a pcie "daughterboard" with a nice big 1 slot or 2 slot cooler for NVME drives would be. Probably wouldn't be very expensive to make.
They're around. Usually called adapters.
I think it's pretty genius. Definitely a must-have for an ITX build.
Why does every new addition to gpu features only get added to the low end releases, like premium features for premium cards
Not quite sure I see someone looking to buy an x8 card who would also pay the price premium. If you were using it on an older setup with no nvme slot it would make sense but then you also likely do not have the option to split up lanes. It does seem the best case is in itx with a GPU using x8 (orx12 of possible) that has performance bouncing off the pcie 5 limit and then sharing the extra 4 lanes to an nvme or has 2 slots on an x8 that splits x8/x4/x4
I share the cat's enthusiasm for this feature.
The question is - will it run another video card if you wire the connector into a PCI-E graphics card?
this is good for budget builds with few pcie slots. and well, still hard to find 4x slot for low-mid budget boards so this is a good addition
edit:
should also find a motherboard that support the nvme on the gpu... guess it will have hard time being a budget build
Regards to the cool cat chilling out as if nothing is happening.
That's cool. But haha, everyone wishing it was for video memory expansion.
Would a m.2 be fast enough for that, or would you need like ddr5 ram sorta deal ?
the half of the x8 is not useless. If you split the pcie lanes, you'll definitely notice performance hits when you game with an SSD plugged into your gpu. I wonder where you came up with that, der8auer.
i wonder if in combination iwth directstorage you can load in game textures much faster with this configuration
When will be a video review and overcloking of orange cat?)
Something to make the 4060 Ti useful!
Happy cat!
Advantageous for cooling
How much performance does the thermal cat add?