I quite like this style of video making a rundown of a perks lifecycle, I would enjoy if you made more of these to teach newer players of what dbd’s past was like👍
Genuinely, a killer needs to know when to disengage a chase and the Wesker in the first clip made literally no attempt to stop the chase and counterplay everybody else
@@irritatingperson7882 bro fr I hate when people say killers need to learn to leave a chase that’s only a viable strat at low mmr if your high mmr or going against a swf it’s not gonna help cause everyone is going to be just as good and your gonna leave chase and then be in the same scenario with a different person and they might be in a better spot than the first one with like more pallets and whatnot and if he was talking for gen defense no killer wants to sit there and defend 3 gens while just staring at survivors for 45 minutes even if you win it ain’t fun. chases are the most fun part of the game and you can’t get better if you only chase terrible survivors.
@@irritatingperson7882that Wesker was just bad all around. Absolutely no mind game attempt lol But I agree, at that point you need to either leave chase or just throw the match to commit. You’re not going to get better by just being dicked down in loops if you’re not actually learning anything.
i think 4s stun is just in that sweet spot of effectiveness/fairness, but lieu of that, a small 7s haste effect with the current 3s stun could make it so that the survivor can make good distance without the killer contemplating suicide for 5 seconds as previous.
even reverting it back to 5 seconds wouldn't be a huge deal seeing as the biggest issue about it was that you could just get a free escape if you get unhooked late game
@@Barbieiseverything I think DS is still broken as shit even with its current balance because they never fixed the problem with DS which is that this perk gives you 100% WIGGLE BONUS instantly. In order for a killer to avoid the effectiveness of this perk, you slug the survivor for 2 whole minutes. that's insane for dbd terms. Slugging for 2 whole minutes to avoid this perk is enough time to do all 5 gens. for this reason, all killers just pick up DS in all its iterations. There is huge reason in the game why nothing gives 100% wiggle progress. DS is still 4th hook on every survivor because realistically respecting the perk is playing the survivor rulebook i.e do not tunnel when tunnelling is the strongest strategy in the entire game. Pre-nerf DS is like old sprint burst, It was hold-W perk. New DS is like dead hard for distance. It doesn't allow you to hold-w, but it allows you to get second chances.
@@twinzzlers you're already unable to do anything other than be chased with victor on your back. Let them keep victor, and chase someone else off a gen. Only use victor on the injured. Bring sloppy.
@@twinzzlers you don't reall though. Victor specialising in tracking and downing injured survivors if you really must use him to attack one that's healthy and they hold him hostage that is one survivor incapacitated. Just chase another for pressure.
@@johnlondon5516 Yeah that is one survivor out of the picture but any jungle gym or even basic loop is gonna screw you over, not to mention that the survivor holding Victor can get rid of him whenever they need to (like finishing a gen). With Viktor you can nullify many pallet loops if you're smart
Ever since the recent ds changes. I see probably 1 in 150 survivors using it. Ds had always been apart of my build ever since it’s release, but nowadays I find it too weak to use and it’s more effective using OTR for example. Solid video btw mate. Lots of nostalgia hearing about the olden day DS
Same honestly. I always loved the idea of fighting back and stabbing the killer, but after the changes, DS does almost nothing in most matches, even against heavy tunneling. It's kinda sad for my favorite perk to be basically useless
@@shemage5932 They wanted to shake up the meta but the meta that I see in killers are the same: Thanatophobia, Overcharge, Call of Brine, Sloppy Butcher... At least I see many survivors use other perks now. I play killer too so basically I know the difference between killer and survivor gameplays.
@@shemage5932 DS wasn't even that good before the nerf but people still run it to not get tunnelled. You shouldn't have to rely on a perk to avoid the most unfun experience in the game without addressing the core issue first. Now you just use OTR instead of DS because the same issue is still there.
@@UnbreakableBloke I haven't seen that build in a while when I play survivor + I run pretty much the same build prechange anyway. Pain res, BBQ, Lethal and an Any (Depends on the killer but the most notable are Floods, Sloppy and Deadlock)
Yep because in that scenario you never knew for sure if they had it. It also tended to activate right before you got them to a hook which just felt AWFUL. The perk practically played into that tormenting mentality of trolls you're playing against "you thought you got me huh? Think again lololol"
@@Justmonika6969 IDK if he mentions it in this video but the 35% would allow you to "dribble" a survivor to a hook if you thought they had Decisive. If you downed the obsession, you would pick them up, take a few steps, then put them back down. This would actually keep Decisive from proc'ing and would almost guarantee you a hook, even if they had DS, on maps like Haddonfield. God I miss those days, that was peak DBD meta, because the Killer actually had bully tactics outside of tunneling ah nvm he just said it
Remember the silent gen-grabbing spirit addon? Or the old Doctor’s king addon that gave exhaustion and constant illusions to all survivors? Or old Freddy and his addon to be invisible until the survivors are fully asleep that would always result in an early hit? I miss these things so much.
@@whysnice4768 the worst part about a game like this embracing being "competitive" is that it stops feeling creative to find new synergies. Doctor + Nurse's Calling felt so amazing when I first heard of it, and was so fun... But it just ain't what it used to be
To be fair, the second they filled up to 35%, they'd stop wiggling, if you don't want to lose pressure, then you just immediately drop them and keep them slugged. Ds was always overhyped, people were just too stupid to counterplay in the moment back then
3s stun, with a ~25% speed buff to the survivor that hit the stun. So tunneling gets even more punished, but killers can decide to switch targets to not suffer as much with the distance gained.
@@psoriasis9096 hm yes, myers power: limited for each survivor so you have to spread the stalk. Myers perks: dont hit the fking obsession. Myers addons: 99% BS 1% instakill. I mean yea myers always tunnels right? Literally every myers!!
@@gandalfthegay.tunneling is when a killer targets a survivor. Do you know how annoying it is to finally get off hook and then be instantly down again due to the killer targeting you? you then hit ds but then the killer catches right back up to you due to no haste or extra stun. The worst part is that you can only use it once so you're instantly dead no matter what
I think a good middle ground for DS could be a temporary haste effect after the stun. It would make it a bit more relevant without being too strong. Killers like blight and nurse would still be able to catch up quickly because they're just really good... or in case of nurse, op af but that's a different discussion.
@@mojolmao1752 BHVR told the community it would revert the stun duration to 3 seconds if enduring ever got changed to not affect it which now it doesn't. Therefore my proposed change still makes the stun what it initially was but also would help survivors get a bit further. I think it'd be a fair compromise.
@@Feynvel why not? Killers are op af rn, half of them can close the distance on a map like nothing. Tired of killers whining all the time y’all just wanna keep getting buffed more and more for no particular reason at all
I only ever used DS for one match, to get Adept Laurie. I always wondered why people brought a perk that they could only use if they went down. Back then, I thought it was weird that it was a perk that encouraged you to play worse to get value out of it and that thought was reinforced when seeing people baiting grabs by going into lockers.
That’s not what the locker tech is for. Locker tech is a way for survivors to effectively try to delay a killer by taking the locker and leaving when the killer goes for the grab. Or you take the locker and commit to it with head on.
@@matthewradabaugh1635 You correct him when he's right and you are wrong. I don't know if you played back then but everyone would jump into a locker to force you to grab them meaning they could DS you. The only real counter play to old DS was slugging which is why it was always paired with Unbreakable, but in the off chance you didn't have Unbreakable equipped or didn't want to use it, you could instead hop in a locker and now the killer can do literally nothing
I think when the stun was at 4 seconds, it should have stayed there, along with how it works now, 1 reason is that basically 1 second of the stun is the animation of the survivor getting off the killer's shoulder, so the survivor never has 4 seconds of distance, its 3, and how it is now, 3 seconds of stun, but only 2 seconds of distance, that is bad. The other main reason is due to killers like Nurse, Blight, Spirit , Wesker, Huntress, Deathslinger, some killers can basically instantly get you back down. Another way you could look at it, is give the survivor Haste when they use the perk, at least 5 seconds of 10% haste to actually make distance would be nice, higher killers will still probably get you down if they are really on point, but you can at least create more distance.
5 seconds of 10% seems really high compared to other haste perks, iirc, especially given killers' disdain for second chance perks. Some kind of speed boost, or even just reverting to 4 seconds, would probably work.
I've just come to accept DS as a last "Fuck You" to the Killers that decide to tunnel before they end up killing me. I still think having it be disabled when all 5 generators are done is a bit too excessive of a nerf when it should just be when the gates are open.
@@jlovedown they dont open the gates until theirs a 99% chance theyre going to escape. Your change idea would make disabling in end game entirely useless because survivors 99 the doors and dont open them until everyones safely ready to go
@@AmericanGadfly With how short the DS stun is it really doesn't matter if the gate is 99%. Killers would just have to adapt and not hook near a gate and if they don't open it it's an opportunity for a 4k
Every time I’ve used DS since the latest nerf, the killer always continue chasing me and gets me fairly quickly, or before I can get to any vault or pallet. Especially now that killers can preform actions faster now, they have no reason to chase anyone else unless someone else directly gets in there face.
If I drop all the time into chasing you, just for your ass to hit me with DS... yeah, Of course I'm fucking going after you. I ain't dealing with any other bullshit, cause if they run decisive, you know they pullin some bullshit.
Think about this for a moment, it took the devs 2 years to fix a perk that was completely busted. Everyone knew that DS was overpowered and frustrating to play against as killer, especially during a time were absolutely anything in the game worked against killer and you couldn't catch a break. But when it was shown that Enduring made DS useless they fixed it in two weeks. And people still argue that the devs are not biased.
the game now is more fair than ever, I remember being frustrated at the game Bc of the massive killer sided updates. But that’s exactly what the game needed, I have gotten used to playing with mediocre perks and making them work
I think removing the stagger after DS completely would make it worth running again. Or up the duration to 4 seconds. As it is now you basically get little to no distance and if you're against a nurse, blight or whiskas, good luck.
to be fair even with the old unnerfed DS you probably still wouldnt get away from nurse or blight theyre just built different, wesker though you'd probably escape from due to him hitting 37 trees along the way
I agree , I think 4 sec stun is a sweet spot and remove the stagger so some worthwhile distance can be made when using. Other than that I think the perk is in a great place balance wise
i dont use it anymore, it has too much conditions in its current state for almost zero gain. unless you get caught near a pallet, but you dont really get to decide where the killer catches you unless you've been matched with someone that isnt playing well enough. also, when i play killer i almost dont see it being used anymore
I gave up on DS. Most games that I really needed it I was first hooked after all the gens were done and the perk is deactivated so getting anywhere near a gate was impossible. You gain so little distance that if you are even slightly in a dead zone you’re pretty SOL and against certain killers it doesn’t really matter what you have to work with.
You're probably the one to run in front of killer every time you're unhooked with ds, get out positioned with no escape and then complain that it's useless.
@@niewiemkurde900 If I wasn’t being tunnelled I’d do a gen, heal up etc then the perk wouldn’t have to be used and I’d save it for if I was second hooked. How did you use DS?
Watching these kind of videos, make me realize how slow behaviour is on balancing stuff. Like my god, 2 years is the average number for balance changing
Bruh, BHVR basically never actually balanced anything until this last big patch. In 6 years they've made 1 genuine rebalance of perks. Everything else was only ever slightly adjusting a perk that was fully broken. DS is the most 'rebalanced' perk in the game and like you said, that was a 2 year average waiting for 'rebalances' that didn't really do much at all.
I've been sat here high asf and I realised this music is from Rayman 3, Hoodlum Havoc - the intermediate stage with the surfboard in the rainbow illusion stage between different maps. nice touch :)
Off the Record has replaced the functionality without stunning anyone, which is how it should have always worked. I would probably try to focus more on it being an anti tunnel measure but not have a stun. Idea: it gains charges while you're on the hook and the killer is within a range. The more charges, the more potent the perk. When you land a great skill check while being carried, it slows the killer, so the killer will know you have it. The more charges, the more intense the slowdown, to the point that the killer is moving at sub survivor speed. The charges are lost every few seconds you aren't in chase. So the counter would be to drop you and slug. The stun would only come from normal wiggle progress, but it would couple well with things like Boil Over. It would also be less effective if the killer actually left the area, and still not work at all if the killer avoided you. Also if the survivor gets downed right under a hook it's also not going to work. So basically, the intent is to force killers to slug and remove the stun without removing it due to the wiggle mechanic. But to give a warning.
Having originally played during peak decisive tyranny it still makes me unreasonably angry when I see it today. It may not be broken anymore but it gives ptsd to when it was.
5 seconds is fine, especially since y'know they can't do shit or they lose their DS. BHVR just has a knack for nerfing perks to oblivion such as Ruin, Iron Will etc. DS is no different and that reduction to 3 seconds just proves how dumb they are with balancing.
@Lars Liam Vilhelm but if its not 3 seconds how will killers tunnel ,they should be able to camp and tunnel, survivor main spotted , this game is dead , coming from a solo q survivor main , i will now join a sweaty swf and genrush in 4 mins and get out , thats all survivors can do now , way too much buff this patch , dbd is dead
@@ZubtigoPlaza 5 sec stun was op and not fine at all it would lead into a blind or locker Head strong etc... it was OP and not balance period. 3 sec stun is 100% fine and survivors are bad and putting themselves out in the open, you get DS when you get off a HOOK! WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU GET OFF A HOOK you get a FREE BT place your damn self near a pallet or window!. that literally gives you another loop! which can cost the killer 30secs or 60secs etc... depending on survivor player if they can play!.
@Lars Liam Vilhelm 5 sec stun was op and not fine at all it would lead into a blind or locker Head strong etc... it was OP and not balance period. 3 sec stun is 100% fine and survivors are bad and putting themselves out in the open, you get DS when you get off a HOOK! WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU GET OFF A HOOK you get a FREE BT place your damn self near a pallet or window!. that literally gives you another loop! which can cost the killer 30secs or 60secs etc... depending on survivor player if they can play!.
They could make Decisive Strike an Exhaustion perk like Adrenaline: DSing off the shoulder causes a full tilt sprint for the 3 seconds the killer is stunned for and bypasses normal Exhaustion. So if you DH before the strike, ok, you can still use it, but you can't just locker hop, DS, and have a DH next chase.
the locker 60secs wait or take the 5sec stun or into a head strong was SO op, game is extremely survivor sided you can still do that if your near a locker or come close to it, and its so much time wasted for the killer! on top of that the 5secs was so op as well, that survivor would just have a flashlight and the killer is forced into a blind it was no skill required on survivor side i can't believe survivors are crying about it cause they're extreme nubs depending on it we all know they want the OP crap back and abuse the game. i honestly think it should be 3 secs, you can still forced a locker stun and they should just get like a 3 haste affect for survivors. survivors need to be punished if they go out and get downed in the open area with no loops for playing bad!, survivors GET FREE BT they have no excuse they can drop near a pallet or window for a free escape with the 3 sec DS which can lead into another full LOOP which is insane at times! and could easily cost the killer another 30 to 1min chase and that cost the killers the game right there.
Nothing was as infuriating and awe-inspiring than eating 4 DS's in a row with the unhook requirement. You did so well you hooked all 4 survivors and downed them again, so the game punches you in the gut.
2015-2017 were some interesting years for DBD. Rank 1 Killer winrate sat at an abysmal ~40% (compare that to the 80%+ of today), infinite loops were everywhere and every update buffed survivors even more. So what did killers do to maintain their rank 1? They played Nurse. They played a LOT of Nurse because the Nurse's only counter plays are to charge into her blink hoping to good she doesn't predict it immediately OR playing hella immersed. Crouch-walk everywhere. Hide, never run. And all this really accomplished was making sure you didn't depip when she inevitably won the game. And those who didn't play Nurse, or were forced not to by survivors disconnecting en masse played Huntress instead. Rank 1 was such a shitshow back then, it wasn't fun for killers in the slightest. And it stopped being fun for survivors too because they faced the same two killers over and over and over. The game is in such a good place right now and I really hope they don't screw this up in the future.
@@oneandonly3924 They'll bitch and moan as they've always done and adapt in the end, though complaining all the while. I play a lot of survivor too, but I don't bitch and moan because I like where the game is at balance-wise. You play half-decent, you get a pip. That's a win in my book. Sometimes you get a killer who absolutely shitstomps you, and hey good for them. Sometimes you get tunnelled or facecamped, it sucks but it's not like that happens ALL the time. I really don't understand the RQs when you're on deathhook, or the insta-DC some teammates will do when they hear the Nurse's first cry.
@@oneandonly3924 adapt to what , almost every killer i face camps and tunnel , im a casual survivor who likes to play on weekends , and theres a bubba face camping me for 100 seconds , you think thats fun , killer mains ruined the game , now it will turn to swf or not play at all , i will now join a swf and play genrushing and t bagging builds , enough of this stupid killer mains face camping and tunneling me
I think it should return to 5 seconds-stun because of the following: 1) When dropping from the killer's shoulders, you spend around 0.5 - 1 second on the animation. 2) Killers like Huntress, Deathslinger, Nurse, Blight, Trickster, and Freddy can counter DS by using their unique power. 3) If you get hit by a DS from an aggressive survivor, it means that he/she/they did not touch any gens, totems, chest, gates, and so on. So, he/she/they are not contributing to the game progress unless using himself/herself/themselves as bait to distract you. 4) You can't use it at the end game, so there are no free escapes. 5) It does not severely punish killers for tunneling because 3 seconds doesn't give survivors enough distance. So, it is pretty much useless now. It is better just use a Out of Record + Unbreakable + Resilience + Deliverance (even though this one is kind of inconsistent).
I think the latest version of DS is usable vs most killers, but the nerf to the stun duration was completely unnecessary and a poor decision on BHVR's part, even if I understand why they were doing it (a desperate attempt at getting the huge number of killer mains they had alienated over the prior 7 months to come back to the game). Disabling DS for "Conspicuous Action" (basically anything that advances the survivor's win-state like doing Gens or resetting) was the key element missing for balancing it to be a real anti-tunneling perk instead of the temporary god-mode cheat it had been since its inception and easily the best change made to the perk, ever.
Survivors still abuse second chance perks as god-mode cheats though. The amonut of times Survivors with BT or Off the Record just straight walk up to me and sandbag me in order to deny a hit on another survivor is infuriating. Instead of using the Endurance Effect as it's supposed to be used (as a form of protection against being tunneled) they just abuse it as a free hit and then complain about tunneling in post-game chat.
@@StabYourBrain I know man; I know. But it's a sort of lose-lose situation because there's absolutely no way for the game to distinguish between a survivor using BT for anti-tunneling as intended or as a free body-block hit.
I liked an idea that Scott Jund covered. DS being a token perk, one that loses tokens when generators are completed. At 5 gens, the stun is 7 seconds, but at 1 gen the stun is 3 seconds. That would be the best balanced of anti tunnel I could think of. Punish the killer for tunneling at 5 gens with a hefty stun, but extended chases only very slightly when only 1 gen is left so the killer doesn't lose all pressure. It's best to watch the video to get the full picture.
oh never realised they promised to bring the 3 second stun back, doesn’t feel like a true 3 second stun since half of it is getting off the killers shoulder. If it was changed to 3 seconds after the survivor has fully regained movement I think that would be a good spot for the perk
I played DBD back when DS only occured after an unhook. To think there was outcry is hilarious; it was still an extremely overpowered perk. Survivors were invincible for a full minute, and could bully you the entire duration. If you downed them, you either waited for a long time to pick up (losing a ton of time) or slugged, meaning they'd be healed to full as soon as you left by their SWF. Current DS seems pretty good I would say. It's strong against tunnelers, but doesn't let survivors be obnoxiously in your face.
Well it has a huge reward if you succeed in the skill check. If you don't, then you just don't get a 2nd chance, which in many cases can turn the tables massively
"There was only so long BHVR could ignore it - something had to be done. So, two years later" shows exactly how BHVR felt about the experience for killers back in the day (hint: they didn't really care about it). As if to pour salt in the wound, not even a year into DS existing (five months after the 1s reduction in stun time), Dead Hard was added, which - while nowhere near as bad as DS, since it still required more than just "hit a skill check" - was widely regarded as *yet another* second chance perk. This resulted in skilled survivors having the equivalent of four health states - healthy, injured, Dead Hard, DS - that the killer had to burn through before being able to hook them *on top of* the mentioned infinite loops, insta-gens, and other shit benefiting survivors. This was so bad that at higher ranks (this was before SBMM) survivors could have to queue for half an hour (or longer) for just one match. Frankly, given just how long this "fuck killer players" mindset lasted at BHVR, I'm surprised the game is still around.
The 3 seconds of stun is definitely not enough. The killer can catch up to you very quickly and just down you again. If BHVR insists on keeping the duration at 3 seconds at least give survivors like a haste effect so they can get a bit more distance. Or just increase the stun duration to 4 seconds.
Man, imagine being the Entity in the early DBD days. You send your minions into trials with a bunch of juicy, supposedly defenseless sacrifices, only for those sacrifices to abuse your ill-thought-out object placement to stall the minion forever, run literal circles around them, abuse a physics oversight to *_literally teleport_* (something you only really wanted the Nurse to be able to do) and then stop your minion in their tracks for enough time to convince them to give up being your minion and face the inevitable consequences of failure the moment they actually caught one otf the slippery bastards. I know it's lore-accurate that Entity fucks with some of the killers (like Trapper, Hag Oni--err, Samurai, etc.) but I doubt it'd allow bully squads and their associated tactics to make the lives of itself and its minions *this* miserable intentionally.
I had a Nancy being all smart last night. She butt bumped me out of a chase, so she could hide in a locker and force me to let her use decisive on me. So she got stabbed me, took about 5 steps and I threw a hatchet into her back. Was brilliant.
They should make DS so that it stays on indefinitely until another survivor is hooked. Forces anti tunnelling and allows survivors to progress the game instead of waiting out the 60 second timer.
I still think this was a money ploy from the beginning, just like the three gen build (Call of Brine/Eruption). Paywalling good perks and characters, waiting until most of the playbase buys the character or uses the perks, then nerfing the perks into oblivion. Decisive Strike, Mettle of Man, CoB, Eruption, Reassurance (which hasn’t been nerfed but is behind a paywall). BHVR is nasty for that
DS is fair as it is now, the only reason it's not used after the 6.1.0 patch is because Off the Record is just a better anti-tunnel perk on all accounts and unless you're getting tunneled every game there is very little need to run two anti-tunnel perks. If OtR ever gets a nerf, I'd expect DS to start coming back. I agree on changing the amount of stumble a survivor gets after hitting their DS, maybe even give the survivor a little bit of a speed boost after hitting it instead? Other than that it's in a very good position right now and would still be used a lot if Off the Record wasn't better.
Rayman 3 is my favourite game of all time. Love the Rayman 3 funky board music in the background of this video. Also great video bro I hadn’t played dbd in awhile so had no idea they even changed it
It's pretty shit now, but it gives an extra dead hard, so it's decent on a looping build if the killer tunnels you. I think it's fine though, the meta needed a shake.
yeah so much for meta shake up when everyone already ends up using unbreakable, dead hard is still super common, OTR everywhere and also still gen slowdown galore on the killer side, pain res and DMS still just as relevant as ever.
@@LightBoltDash dead hard is still good imo, but no longer brain-dead easy to use, the DS nerf also nerfs unbreakeable, OTR gives you more STBFL stacks,wich is very strong right now and got nerfed on end game... And yes you can be a tryhard as killer but you dont have to as much as you used to imo, there is always gonna be a meta because people like to win, that is unavoidable.
@@ThyBigCheddar??? No it didn't??? literally every killer still runs massive gen slowdown, they just replaced ruin with overcharge, and survivors are STILL running only second chance stuff, DS just got replaced with OTR, meta didn't change if people still continue to use the same tactics just with slightly different perks, you're out of your mind lmao
i agree with the stumble buff you mentioned or like a 5% or 7% haste affect for 3 seonds after landing for a small amount of extra distance because it does very little to stop stronger killers at the moment
i would take away the stumble... but i would also add a extra deactivation effect of if someone else gets hooked after you have been unhooked.. it ends DS. ☺making it a true anti tunnel perk... if someone got hooked you were not tunneled... you lose your power.. done and done.
So what if someone trades with u in a camping bubba situation u get unhooked both of u go down at the same time and he hooks the other person before u and then hooks u would u want ur ds to be deactivated 😂😂
@@salvadornightingale8074 That's more of a Bubba problem rather than DS problem. We shouldn't balance the perk around 1 killer just because he can do some annoying Strat.
@@salvadornightingale8074 i have never run DS 😏 but that is a excellent point. i would like to see it still deactivate because it should if you were not tunneled... but killers with multi down powers are hard to balance around. we could just have it so a hooked state has to be done while you are out of the dying state for it to deactivate and that would solve the problem. 😎
I like the idea that there's a anti-tunneling tool for survivors (I think that should be something baked in instead of a perk), but throughout DS's history it was an offensive tool for survivors instead of a defensive tool, and I don't think survivors should have _any_ offensive tools to use against the killer.
Survivor perks getting nerfed: That's one perk in one slot of four, on one survivor out of four. Survivor perks have a quarter of the value of a single killer perk - four survivor perks equals one killer perk. (Hint: It should take an entire survivors perk build to counter one of the killer's slowdown perks...) Killer perks getting nerfed: That's like slamming four Survivor perks into the ground. An entire perk of four, when having to manage four people and their four perks each... That's huge.
One time I managed to use DS in the best way possible Gates were open I got put in the basement by a camper bubba Managed to get myself off hook, use DS and escape With the new update it's a shame a moment like that won't happen again
Yea but more often than not a survivor could be unhooked in front of the killers face and then be practically invincible for 60 seconds. It was a necessary change, but with basekit BT you can still do something similar
I played the most at the height of the BT/DS/DH Meta and I played primarily Killer and I do miss those days. Things were so much simpler. I never tunnelled anyone anyway, so Survivors only really ever had 2 perks to play with, since all their Borrowed Time and Decisive Strikes were useless, and Dribbling survivors was a useful tactic for getting around DS
With the first (video) chapter talking about what the Halloween chapter did for the game, it would be super interesting to see a video discussing the timeline from then till now, with perks, designs, and cosmetics
I main killer and I honestly think decisive pre 6.1.0 was fair enough with the only stipulation being that it should've been removed with endgame like what the overhaul did to it.
lol, its basically gone now with its 3 second stun and being disabled after all gens are complete. Getting hit by the off the record endurance is a much worse setback now. DS before the unsafe actions was my most hated perk to face in the game, still remember as a new killer getting hit by 3 DSes in a row as a SWF rushed hooks and bodyblocked knowing I couldn't do anything against their DS/UB
I loved the video, I never knew it was ever 3 seconds in the past I thought that was a new thing before it’s current form I always knew it as the perk that every killer fears I had no idea it used to be as useless as it is now
The one thing I hate about DS is that it's fair against almost all killers...except nurse and blight... especially good ones. IMO, deactivating when a gate is OPENED would be fair, because deactivating after gens finished plus I have No Way Out is just stupid lol. Literally a free 4k in most cases.
I'm for the idea of either increasing the stun time back to 4 or 5 seconds; and keeping the deactivation after the last gen. Or, keeping it at 3 seconds, and having it work during the endgame. I still believe the game is survivor sided, but for an anti-tunnelling perk, I don't see it helping protect against tunnelers. During the endgame is the prime time for a killer to tunnel, especially if a game has gone badly for them.
Agree to bring it back up to 5 sec but I would like to just see some ways to prevent survivors from using it aggressively, for example locker grabs don't activate ds and the killer can just slug you and move on + maybe deactivate it if the killers hooks somebody else between your hooks.
It was a bit over-nerfed. I was able to ignore the stun and tunnel someone through it as *Clown* whilst inside Dead Dawg main building. This should not be possible unless the survivor just installed the game that day.
Decisive strike still saves me from my own mistakes and has the potential to extend a chase well beyond it's limits. It's in a good place, though people who were used to DS being a god perk are liable to say it's useless because they have to put in more effort after getting the stun. Specifically for anti tunnel it is ok. I definitely think the Conspicuous Action needs more thought. Like I've accidently touched totems mid chase for a split second or self cared, and because of rules around DS it was technically "fair" that i was tunnelled. Maybe make it like 1 second of total conspicuous action time before it deactivates the perk instead of instant? That would mean survivors won't be penalized for accidental self care or totem tapping, but if they are trying to heal or do a gen they get punished? And i mean total as in you self care for .5 seconds then touch a totem for .5 seconds, and that creates 1 total second. To avoid gen tapping and heal tapping.
@Lars Liam Vilhelm if you go against the nurse, and the person playing nurse is actually competent, then yeah, but you're fucked even with 4 seconds. If you're against the rest of the top tier cast it can definitely feel like that (i don't really consider any killers s tier besides nurse) it's definitely a struggle. High mobility killers are definitely tougher to get away from in dead zones. I'm not against putting DS back at 4 seconds. But my experience is that DS is still viable in many if not most scenarios. The times I've used it have saved me from deaths and even helped win games.
Oh I remember those terrible hook days, you finally down a survivor and the nearest hook would be 50m away or there just wouldn’t be any in an area and you’d lose the survivor
He is back. Literally watched a Yerv video and he mentioned Ardetha. Then I started wondering where Ardetha went. Now he's back. What a great way to start off the weekend
the only way i can see the perk being as it is with 3 seconds stun is if the survivor literally starts sprint bursting for 2 seconds or something after the stun otherwise 0 distance can be made. (doesnt matter if u were exhausted or not)
Ds is a perfect example of what happens when a decent perk is overused and abused to the point of frustration, all ds really needed was to be turned off after all the generators were powered, however because of how abused it was by toxic swfs and just survivors in general meant it had to get biggger nerfs. Remember survivors killers didn't get DS nerfed, you did. But i do agree it needs a buff just a tiny one
I mean to be fair ds is still usable and there are other perks that deserve a buff more than ds. Ds consistently made it into my builds for so long and finally theres basekit bt, theres off the record, and new worse ds. Just because it was really good doesn’t mean it needs to stay decently good. It can be more niche and weaker. Perks like buckle up, up the ante, autodidact, guardian, leader, sole survivor, left behind, wake up, premonition, self preservation, and solidarity are all consistently weaker than current ds imo.
Depends on how you use these perks. Autodidact can be pretty solid in some healing builds. Leader is also good in some builds. Guardian is the same. Yeah, maybe these perks alone are kinda trash, but if you combine them well, they are not. DS has some problems, because yeah, it's not so good anymore, but it doesn't do what it should and that's the bad thing.
I think old DS was perfect the way it was with the 5 second stun. just not letting you use it after the End game collapse start and if you touch a gen, totem or Unhook somebody you lose it. good anti tunnel perk not that strong since no free escape after end game collapse starts.
Dear fucking lord... cant believe behavior waited 2 damm long years on a much due nerf. Not to be missed really. PoS perk not only was punishing you for playing the game as a killer, also created synergies of absolute god states with unbreakable and adrenaline. Not only that it also killed any room for survivor perk creativity, forcing a system that was thought essentially to allow custom gameplay experience into the exact opposite that it was intended to do
The fall of Decisive Strike is only a small part of a larger problem really. This can be alluded to in this video when talking about how players originally approached the game for its novelty aspect & the competitive drive wasn't so heavily focused on. Since this is game is asymmetrical, it can never be truly balanced. When this game first started it was survivor side and it has ever gone more towards killer sided but finding the balance is something that can never be completely accomplished. I believe a lot of that has to do with players being either survivor sided or killer sided. To be honest I feel both sides are pretty entitled and toxic. It varies and has its own factors as well such as generally the pool of survivors is larger, but the voice of killer mains is louder. Seriously search anything dbd related on entitled or toxic in RUclips and you'll see a killer main video regarding it 9 times out of 10. More and more I feel like the game needs to be stripped down to a more basic approach. Sometimes I think all perks and add on(s) for Killer/Survivor should be removed. Also, maps should be even out as a 50-50 chance of getting either a large or small map. Hooks should never be gone even after a survivor is sacrificed and exit doors should be as far apart from each other as possible. Still with even that the game will not be truly balanced. Just like this Decisive Strike talk doesn't consider the factor of SWF. It is the SWF group that is generally the moments I have to buckle down more as killer. In a solo cue or even in just a duo set up, meta or sweaty perks are needed in order to survivor and generally it is still a hatch search in the end. Furthermore, it is my understanding MMR for survivors is based only on surviving the match so with conditions being narrower it is going to leave a more concentrated pool of more in likely sweaty survivors for high MMR killers to deal with. So, in the end you'll see the most meta perks on survivor and the strongest killers with best perk/add on(s) for killer. Additionally, I do not worry about decisive strike as killer because it really doesn't slow me down. Even in the old days I could tunnel as survivor with classic decisive strike, but it was more discouraging then. Problem is it gets exploited to the point it is nerfed till it is worthless and that is what the perk now is. Comparing DS to Ruin other than saying it was primarily used by their respective sides is laughable. DS only advantage over Ruin was that it had some situational windows of being used but you got no bang for your buck most of the time. The factor with ruin is different in that its effect is determined on if the totem is still up (varies when paired with undying) and how well the killer applies gen pressure to keep survivors from being able to just sit on a gen. The overall impact of DS vs Ruin is not equal at all. In the end so many factors determine the outcome of the game & it is impossible to account for them all. Killers have a power that survivors do not. In this game Killers are very different whereas Survivors are the same (they just have different appearances/skins). This alone leaves the killer in the power position but depending on how the four survivors play (also are they swf or not) & considering the skill level of the killer the outcomes can vary from a 4K to all the survivors escaping. Now consider throwing in the add on(s), perks as well as factor the maps (small vs larger vs hook locations vs pallets vs exit door locations vs loop locations) and it can be a nightmare depending on which main you play. I am not saying all but let's be honest that most survivors just want to survivor and killers just want to get a 4k. Out of that group I actually believe a lot like to gloat & rub their win in the face of their opponent. As a Killer I have played what I consider normal just doing my objects as needed in gen pressure & attempting to not tunnel but I will get survivors that flashlight click, gesture & tea bag. Then on the other hand, I can be playing as survivor & trying to run the killer as long as i can for my team, finally get caught & then get either camped (also at times slugged while I am on hook), tunneled after I am off or get killers shaking their heads yes or no if I get hit to the ground. The thing is I could see that behavior given if I did an action that warranted that response but, in the end, it was that person or persons that is starting the behavior. Maybe the games objectives should be changed something to like Friday the 13th's or Evil Dead.....something other than just gens? In the end though would it really matter? Maybe in the end it isn't so much the perks on this game but just the people that if either you are killer or survivor can't enjoy the game for fun but cry because taking the L is just too much?
You have several perks that already do that, dead hard, Sprint burst, lithe, balanced landing would you also like a perk where Killers can't chase you too? Or one that killers can't hit you?
@@norouziman8748 Bruh. How often do you use Sprint Burst after a DS without being slugged? More often than not you've already used your exhaustion perk by the time DS activates. I have nearly 1k hours in each side and I have very rarely gotten hit by DS but I've seen how little it does when the killer is actually tunneling. Sure you can use OTR + DS + Dead Hard to make a little more distance but that's almost your entire build just to make sure you don't get tunneled and even then it only buys you so much time.
I don't think Decisive Strike is really even that bad now. The endgame change is good, because if you survived long enough for 5 gens to be completed then you weren't being tunneled anyways, and having Decisive Strike that late into the game could get pretty unfair very quickly. So few people are running it, that it seems like killers aren't respecting DS nearly as much. The 3 second stun is pretty not great, but if you don't die in the middle of nowhere you can still get to safety
I dont know why nobody brings this up, but to get a true anti tunnel perk, just make DS last for 30 seconds, but the timer is stopped once in chase and it disables itself after touching a gen etc. Its so obvious and fair that I have no clue how BHVR never even thought of this idea in all of the changes they made to the perk.
DS used to be a perk that punished tunneling I think the best state it was in was when doing something deactivated it but you had a 60 second timer for when you genuinely got tunneled Because agressive or toxic survivors would have to waste their time doing nothing if they wanted to use it to be toxic So that part of it's usage was discouraged But killer mains spending literal years whining and screaming about how DS is so unfair and how tunneling is necessary to have a chance to win Brought it to the state it is now I think it's a testament to how entitled and whiny the dbd community is as a whole. It was a 5 second stun that most killers could catch up to quite easily especially when the survivor wasn't that good. If the survivor was good they would get a chance to prolong the process of tunneling which honestly takes less and less time with each update now. I don't understand why Behaviour is so obsessed with making dbd competitive when it was never meant to be And the fact there aren't ranked and casual mode also adds to it. The game has become increasingly more toxic for casual players And it's sad because let's be real Playing a game as Chris Redfield against Michael Myers on The Game with Nicolas Cage, Bill Williamson and Nancy Wheeler And other matchups like this is why most people play the game
Just make it 5 seconds again. I don’t care if it feels bad for the killer, IT SHOULD. You tunneled me, you should get a long stun as a punishment. It shouldn’t feel good for you to go against and let you immediately start chasing me again and down me instantly if you’re blight or nurse.
Problem is most survivors didn't use it to prevent tunneling but aggressively. I would ok with 5 ds if locker grabs did not activate it so you can slug and move one + if you hooked somebody else DS would deactivate to prevent the killer being punished for playing to well
I think the biggest problem with DS back in the day was simply how it could be combined with other things in order to make it take FOREVER to catch just one survivor, and then if the whole team used it there would be a 80% of losing no matter what skill level. If the survivor used: -Styptic agent / Syringe -Dead Hard -Decisive Strike it could take up to 5 hits just to DOWN one survivor and have the ability to hook them, and back then body blocking and stuff like that was so much more common especially since self-care was in it's prime and people could just heal, there was also no Starstruck or Mad Grit to make it risky to block a killer. Add this to an old toxic 4-man SWF group and that is 20 hits just to down each of them for the first time, without a guaranteed hook, not to mention the time it would take to get each of those hits due to the pallet vacuum, absurd amount of pallets, and the longer action times.
9:27 Good one, m8. Dropped the game 5 years ago because of how babied killers were, and from what I've heard it's only gotten worse. The very idea the game was _ever_ stacked in the _survivors_ favor is simply _absurd._
Divisive strike aaaaaaha
they "Ruined" it
they “striked” it down
Make it work for both hook states
I quite like this style of video making a rundown of a perks lifecycle, I would enjoy if you made more of these to teach newer players of what dbd’s past was like👍
more like Defective strike ahah
Genuinely, a killer needs to know when to disengage a chase and the Wesker in the first clip made literally no attempt to stop the chase and counterplay everybody else
I do that all the time. How are you gonna learn to beat good survivors if you refuse to take chases with them?
@@irritatingperson7882 bro fr I hate when people say killers need to learn to leave a chase that’s only a viable strat at low mmr if your high mmr or going against a swf it’s not gonna help cause everyone is going to be just as good and your gonna leave chase and then be in the same scenario with a different person and they might be in a better spot than the first one with like more pallets and whatnot and if he was talking for gen defense no killer wants to sit there and defend 3 gens while just staring at survivors for 45 minutes even if you win it ain’t fun. chases are the most fun part of the game and you can’t get better if you only chase terrible survivors.
@@irritatingperson7882that Wesker was just bad all around. Absolutely no mind game attempt lol
But I agree, at that point you need to either leave chase or just throw the match to commit. You’re not going to get better by just being dicked down in loops if you’re not actually learning anything.
@@nathangothan601 Tbf there's always this one ASSHOLE we all just want to see bleeding out
Some Kilers are so braindead
i think 4s stun is just in that sweet spot of effectiveness/fairness, but lieu of that, a small 7s haste effect with the current 3s stun could make it so that the survivor can make good distance without the killer contemplating suicide for 5 seconds as previous.
even reverting it back to 5 seconds wouldn't be a huge deal seeing as the biggest issue about it was that you could just get a free escape if you get unhooked late game
Honestly, yeah, that feels right. Four seconds of stun means (roughly) one second of breaking free and three seconds of free movement.
@@Barbieiseverything I think DS is still broken as shit even with its current balance because they never fixed the problem with DS which is that this perk gives you 100% WIGGLE BONUS instantly. In order for a killer to avoid the effectiveness of this perk, you slug the survivor for 2 whole minutes. that's insane for dbd terms. Slugging for 2 whole minutes to avoid this perk is enough time to do all 5 gens. for this reason, all killers just pick up DS in all its iterations. There is huge reason in the game why nothing gives 100% wiggle progress.
DS is still 4th hook on every survivor because realistically respecting the perk is playing the survivor rulebook i.e do not tunnel when tunnelling is the strongest strategy in the entire game. Pre-nerf DS is like old sprint burst, It was hold-W perk. New DS is like dead hard for distance. It doesn't allow you to hold-w, but it allows you to get second chances.
@@dodang_9147 I'm not reading all that happy for you, or sorry that happened
5 second was fine lol it disabled if you did anything useful
The people who organized the review bomb give off the same vibes as the ones who organized mass dcing against Spirit to force a Nerf.
mass dc is base though
@@ew4525 What does that sentence even mean?
@@dirac_dydx1830 it means that mass dc is base though
@@ew4525 it's the farthest thing from based, dingus
@@ew4525 yeah, isn’t mass dcing always happening?
i wanna take the a moment and just appreciate that whole time you kept that charlotte busy and keeping victor on you is absolute gold
@@thegreatestdane8978 They should really buff Viktor so your aura is constantly revealed when he's on you and you get a huge hindered penalty
@@twinzzlers you're already unable to do anything other than be chased with victor on your back. Let them keep victor, and chase someone else off a gen. Only use victor on the injured. Bring sloppy.
@@johnlondon5516 You still only end up as a generic M1 killer
@@twinzzlers you don't reall though. Victor specialising in tracking and downing injured survivors if you really must use him to attack one that's healthy and they hold him hostage that is one survivor incapacitated. Just chase another for pressure.
@@johnlondon5516 Yeah that is one survivor out of the picture but any jungle gym or even basic loop is gonna screw you over, not to mention that the survivor holding Victor can get rid of him whenever they need to (like finishing a gen). With Viktor you can nullify many pallet loops if you're smart
Ever since the recent ds changes. I see probably 1 in 150 survivors using it. Ds had always been apart of my build ever since it’s release, but nowadays I find it too weak to use and it’s more effective using OTR for example. Solid video btw mate. Lots of nostalgia hearing about the olden day DS
Same honestly. I always loved the idea of fighting back and stabbing the killer, but after the changes, DS does almost nothing in most matches, even against heavy tunneling. It's kinda sad for my favorite perk to be basically useless
"I see probably 1 in 150 survivors using it" I'm pretty sure that was the intention of BHVR. They wanted to shake up the meta.
@@shemage5932 They wanted to shake up the meta but the meta that I see in killers are the same: Thanatophobia, Overcharge, Call of Brine, Sloppy Butcher... At least I see many survivors use other perks now. I play killer too so basically I know the difference between killer and survivor gameplays.
@@shemage5932 DS wasn't even that good before the nerf but people still run it to not get tunnelled. You shouldn't have to rely on a perk to avoid the most unfun experience in the game without addressing the core issue first. Now you just use OTR instead of DS because the same issue is still there.
@@UnbreakableBloke I haven't seen that build in a while when I play survivor + I run pretty much the same build prechange anyway. Pain res, BBQ, Lethal and an Any (Depends on the killer but the most notable are Floods, Sloppy and Deadlock)
It makes me so happy to see Ardetha's vids on the timeline again, love your stuff bro.
Meat
@@Wowiie Bun
@@TiredCoffeeMug lettuce
@@bobbybrine6547 throw some cheese on there for me rq
@@TiredCoffeeMug tomato
The 35% ds was way more frustrating than the instant ds imo
Yep because in that scenario you never knew for sure if they had it. It also tended to activate right before you got them to a hook which just felt AWFUL.
The perk practically played into that tormenting mentality of trolls you're playing against "you thought you got me huh? Think again lololol"
@@Justmonika6969 IDK if he mentions it in this video but the 35% would allow you to "dribble" a survivor to a hook if you thought they had Decisive. If you downed the obsession, you would pick them up, take a few steps, then put them back down. This would actually keep Decisive from proc'ing and would almost guarantee you a hook, even if they had DS, on maps like Haddonfield. God I miss those days, that was peak DBD meta, because the Killer actually had bully tactics outside of tunneling
ah nvm he just said it
Remember the silent gen-grabbing spirit addon? Or the old Doctor’s king addon that gave exhaustion and constant illusions to all survivors? Or old Freddy and his addon to be invisible until the survivors are fully asleep that would always result in an early hit? I miss these things so much.
@@whysnice4768 the worst part about a game like this embracing being "competitive" is that it stops feeling creative to find new synergies. Doctor + Nurse's Calling felt so amazing when I first heard of it, and was so fun... But it just ain't what it used to be
To be fair, the second they filled up to 35%, they'd stop wiggling, if you don't want to lose pressure, then you just immediately drop them and keep them slugged. Ds was always overhyped, people were just too stupid to counterplay in the moment back then
3s stun, with a ~25% speed buff to the survivor that hit the stun. So tunneling gets even more punished, but killers can decide to switch targets to not suffer as much with the distance gained.
It would be survivor sided , and only legion could do that , what about killers that are specialized in focus in one survivor?
@Lars Liam Vilhelm Exactly, Myers tunneling results in repetitive gameplay that would be boring to both sides.
@@psoriasis9096 hm yes, myers power: limited for each survivor so you have to spread the stalk. Myers perks: dont hit the fking obsession. Myers addons: 99% BS 1% instakill.
I mean yea myers always tunnels right? Literally every myers!!
Survivors when killers try to get the second hit. "tUnnELiNg"
@@gandalfthegay.tunneling is when a killer targets a survivor. Do you know how annoying it is to finally get off hook and then be instantly down again due to the killer targeting you? you then hit ds but then the killer catches right back up to you due to no haste or extra stun. The worst part is that you can only use it once so you're instantly dead no matter what
I think a good middle ground for DS could be a temporary haste effect after the stun. It would make it a bit more relevant without being too strong. Killers like blight and nurse would still be able to catch up quickly because they're just really good... or in case of nurse, op af but that's a different discussion.
Yeah or just increase the stun time
@@mojolmao1752 BHVR told the community it would revert the stun duration to 3 seconds if enduring ever got changed to not affect it which now it doesn't. Therefore my proposed change still makes the stun what it initially was but also would help survivors get a bit further. I think it'd be a fair compromise.
@Lars Liam Vilhelm I agree, just trying to find a possible middle ground.
No, survivors don't need buffed second chance perks...
@@Feynvel why not? Killers are op af rn, half of them can close the distance on a map like nothing. Tired of killers whining all the time y’all just wanna keep getting buffed more and more for no particular reason at all
Can we stop for a second to appreciate Ardetha's articulate and clear pronunciation when he's speaking?! It definitely had a documentary vibe ☺
Decisive Strike Back Then: 🏃🏻 🔪💀
Decisive Strike Now: 🏃🏻🔪💀
"Bh4 cant ignore it. Something had to change." Proceeds to follow up with a date 2 years later 😂
I only ever used DS for one match, to get Adept Laurie. I always wondered why people brought a perk that they could only use if they went down. Back then, I thought it was weird that it was a perk that encouraged you to play worse to get value out of it and that thought was reinforced when seeing people baiting grabs by going into lockers.
That’s not what the locker tech is for. Locker tech is a way for survivors to effectively try to delay a killer by taking the locker and leaving when the killer goes for the grab. Or you take the locker and commit to it with head on.
Tunneling 🤷
Prolly because you have 5 hours on the game
@@matthewradabaugh1635 You correct him when he's right and you are wrong. I don't know if you played back then but everyone would jump into a locker to force you to grab them meaning they could DS you. The only real counter play to old DS was slugging which is why it was always paired with Unbreakable, but in the off chance you didn't have Unbreakable equipped or didn't want to use it, you could instead hop in a locker and now the killer can do literally nothing
I think when the stun was at 4 seconds, it should have stayed there, along with how it works now, 1 reason is that basically 1 second of the stun is the animation of the survivor getting off the killer's shoulder, so the survivor never has 4 seconds of distance, its 3, and how it is now, 3 seconds of stun, but only 2 seconds of distance, that is bad. The other main reason is due to killers like Nurse, Blight, Spirit , Wesker, Huntress, Deathslinger, some killers can basically instantly get you back down. Another way you could look at it, is give the survivor Haste when they use the perk, at least 5 seconds of 10% haste to actually make distance would be nice, higher killers will still probably get you down if they are really on point, but you can at least create more distance.
based
5 seconds of 10% seems really high compared to other haste perks, iirc, especially given killers' disdain for second chance perks.
Some kind of speed boost, or even just reverting to 4 seconds, would probably work.
I've just come to accept DS as a last "Fuck You" to the Killers that decide to tunnel before they end up killing me. I still think having it be disabled when all 5 generators are done is a bit too excessive of a nerf when it should just be when the gates are open.
Survivors dont open the gates till their out though lmao
@@AmericanGadfly can you rephrase that? Survivors don't open the gates until it's already opened?
@@jlovedown they dont open the gates until theirs a 99% chance theyre going to escape. Your change idea would make disabling in end game entirely useless because survivors 99 the doors and dont open them until everyones safely ready to go
@@AmericanGadfly With how short the DS stun is it really doesn't matter if the gate is 99%. Killers would just have to adapt and not hook near a gate and if they don't open it it's an opportunity for a 4k
@@jlovedown or you can adapt and deal with it not working in end game. 😀
This content is perfect we love it your voice works perfect for this format keep pushing these out!!! I hope you get to 100K soon :)
Legend, thanks son
@@Ardetha DAD???? I FUCKING K N E W I T WE'VE BEEN WAITING YEARS
Every time I’ve used DS since the latest nerf, the killer always continue chasing me and gets me fairly quickly, or before I can get to any vault or pallet. Especially now that killers can preform actions faster now, they have no reason to chase anyone else unless someone else directly gets in there face.
If I drop all the time into chasing you, just for your ass to hit me with DS... yeah, Of course I'm fucking going after you. I ain't dealing with any other bullshit, cause if they run decisive, you know they pullin some bullshit.
Think about this for a moment, it took the devs 2 years to fix a perk that was completely busted. Everyone knew that DS was overpowered and frustrating to play against as killer, especially during a time were absolutely anything in the game worked against killer and you couldn't catch a break.
But when it was shown that Enduring made DS useless they fixed it in two weeks.
And people still argue that the devs are not biased.
They're getting better though
the game now is more fair than ever, I remember being frustrated at the game Bc of the massive killer sided updates. But that’s exactly what the game needed, I have gotten used to playing with mediocre perks and making them work
you know you're old when you remember juggling the obbsession to the hook
I think removing the stagger after DS completely would make it worth running again.
Or up the duration to 4 seconds.
As it is now you basically get little to no distance and if you're against a nurse, blight or whiskas, good luck.
to be fair even with the old unnerfed DS you probably still wouldnt get away from nurse or blight theyre just built different, wesker though you'd probably escape from due to him hitting 37 trees along the way
I agree , I think 4 sec stun is a sweet spot and remove the stagger so some worthwhile distance can be made when using. Other than that I think the perk is in a great place balance wise
i dont use it anymore, it has too much conditions in its current state for almost zero gain.
unless you get caught near a pallet, but you dont really get to decide where the killer catches you unless you've been matched with someone that isnt playing well enough.
also, when i play killer i almost dont see it being used anymore
I gave up on DS. Most games that I really needed it I was first hooked after all the gens were done and the perk is deactivated so getting anywhere near a gate was impossible. You gain so little distance that if you are even slightly in a dead zone you’re pretty SOL and against certain killers it doesn’t really matter what you have to work with.
You're probably the one to run in front of killer every time you're unhooked with ds, get out positioned with no escape and then complain that it's useless.
@@niewiemkurde900 If I wasn’t being tunnelled I’d do a gen, heal up etc then the perk wouldn’t have to be used and I’d save it for if I was second hooked. How did you use DS?
Use adrenaline:)
Youll come off the hook full health with a speed boost, as long as you’re being carried or on the hook when the last gen pops.
@@bigsus4065 oh you better believe I’ve been using adrenaline every game lately loll!! Such a feels good when adrenaline pops in a clutch moment.
Watching these kind of videos, make me realize how slow behaviour is on balancing stuff. Like my god, 2 years is the average number for balance changing
Bruh, BHVR basically never actually balanced anything until this last big patch. In 6 years they've made 1 genuine rebalance of perks. Everything else was only ever slightly adjusting a perk that was fully broken. DS is the most 'rebalanced' perk in the game and like you said, that was a 2 year average waiting for 'rebalances' that didn't really do much at all.
I’m really enjoying these types of videos! I loved your Hex: Ruin one! Please keep them coming!
I've been sat here high asf and I realised this music is from Rayman 3, Hoodlum Havoc - the intermediate stage with the surfboard in the rainbow illusion stage between different maps. nice touch :)
Off the Record has replaced the functionality without stunning anyone, which is how it should have always worked. I would probably try to focus more on it being an anti tunnel measure but not have a stun. Idea: it gains charges while you're on the hook and the killer is within a range. The more charges, the more potent the perk. When you land a great skill check while being carried, it slows the killer, so the killer will know you have it. The more charges, the more intense the slowdown, to the point that the killer is moving at sub survivor speed. The charges are lost every few seconds you aren't in chase. So the counter would be to drop you and slug. The stun would only come from normal wiggle progress, but it would couple well with things like Boil Over. It would also be less effective if the killer actually left the area, and still not work at all if the killer avoided you. Also if the survivor gets downed right under a hook it's also not going to work. So basically, the intent is to force killers to slug and remove the stun without removing it due to the wiggle mechanic. But to give a warning.
Having originally played during peak decisive tyranny it still makes me unreasonably angry when I see it today. It may not be broken anymore but it gives ptsd to when it was.
I think the stun should be back to 4 seconds since it was a nice spot and it did do the job of being anti tunnel
5 seconds is fine, especially since y'know they can't do shit or they lose their DS.
BHVR just has a knack for nerfing perks to oblivion such as Ruin, Iron Will etc. DS is no different and that reduction to 3 seconds just proves how dumb they are with balancing.
No
@Lars Liam Vilhelm but if its not 3 seconds how will killers tunnel ,they should be able to camp and tunnel, survivor main spotted , this game is dead , coming from a solo q survivor main , i will now join a sweaty swf and genrush in 4 mins and get out , thats all survivors can do now , way too much buff this patch , dbd is dead
@@ZubtigoPlaza 5 sec stun was op and not fine at all it would lead into a blind or locker Head strong etc... it was OP and not balance period. 3 sec stun is 100% fine and survivors are bad and putting themselves out in the open, you get DS when you get off a HOOK! WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU GET OFF A HOOK you get a FREE BT place your damn self near a pallet or window!. that literally gives you another loop! which can cost the killer 30secs or 60secs etc... depending on survivor player if they can play!.
@Lars Liam Vilhelm 5 sec stun was op and not fine at all it would lead into a blind or locker Head strong etc... it was OP and not balance period. 3 sec stun is 100% fine and survivors are bad and putting themselves out in the open, you get DS when you get off a HOOK! WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU GET OFF A HOOK you get a FREE BT place your damn self near a pallet or window!. that literally gives you another loop! which can cost the killer 30secs or 60secs etc... depending on survivor player if they can play!.
Thank you for the history lesson, especially for guys like us who didn't join the game till mid late.
Same, I joined right towards the end of the End Transmission chapter (Gabriel and Singularity) and the way way they nerfed made for this … 😔
They could make Decisive Strike an Exhaustion perk like Adrenaline: DSing off the shoulder causes a full tilt sprint for the 3 seconds the killer is stunned for and bypasses normal Exhaustion. So if you DH before the strike, ok, you can still use it, but you can't just locker hop, DS, and have a DH next chase.
the locker 60secs wait or take the 5sec stun or into a head strong was SO op, game is extremely survivor sided you can still do that if your near a locker or come close to it, and its so much time wasted for the killer! on top of that the 5secs was so op as well, that survivor would just have a flashlight and the killer is forced into a blind it was no skill required on survivor side i can't believe survivors are crying about it cause they're extreme nubs depending on it we all know they want the OP crap back and abuse the game.
i honestly think it should be 3 secs, you can still forced a locker stun and they should just get like a 3 haste affect for survivors. survivors need to be punished if they go out and get downed in the open area with no loops for playing bad!, survivors GET FREE BT they have no excuse they can drop near a pallet or window for a free escape with the 3 sec DS which can lead into another full LOOP which is insane at times! and could easily cost the killer another 30 to 1min chase and that cost the killers the game right there.
Nothing was as infuriating and awe-inspiring than eating 4 DS's in a row with the unhook requirement. You did so well you hooked all 4 survivors and downed them again, so the game punches you in the gut.
2015-2017 were some interesting years for DBD. Rank 1 Killer winrate sat at an abysmal ~40% (compare that to the 80%+ of today), infinite loops were everywhere and every update buffed survivors even more. So what did killers do to maintain their rank 1? They played Nurse. They played a LOT of Nurse because the Nurse's only counter plays are to charge into her blink hoping to good she doesn't predict it immediately OR playing hella immersed. Crouch-walk everywhere. Hide, never run. And all this really accomplished was making sure you didn't depip when she inevitably won the game. And those who didn't play Nurse, or were forced not to by survivors disconnecting en masse played Huntress instead.
Rank 1 was such a shitshow back then, it wasn't fun for killers in the slightest. And it stopped being fun for survivors too because they faced the same two killers over and over and over.
The game is in such a good place right now and I really hope they don't screw this up in the future.
@@redshirt49 Too bad survivors don’t want to adapt
@@oneandonly3924 They'll bitch and moan as they've always done and adapt in the end, though complaining all the while.
I play a lot of survivor too, but I don't bitch and moan because I like where the game is at balance-wise.
You play half-decent, you get a pip. That's a win in my book.
Sometimes you get a killer who absolutely shitstomps you, and hey good for them.
Sometimes you get tunnelled or facecamped, it sucks but it's not like that happens ALL the time.
I really don't understand the RQs when you're on deathhook, or the insta-DC some teammates will do when they hear the Nurse's first cry.
@@oneandonly3924 adapt to what , almost every killer i face camps and tunnel , im a casual survivor who likes to play on weekends , and theres a bubba face camping me for 100 seconds , you think thats fun , killer mains ruined the game , now it will turn to swf or not play at all , i will now join a swf and play genrushing and t bagging builds , enough of this stupid killer mains face camping and tunneling me
@@AmanSingh-bt1rx Survivor mains have been ruining the game for years which is why killers are the way they are now. It’s our turn
We are back baby
*Sigh*
Time to pull out my old friend, the 60 second timer
4 seconds and no stagger or "stumble" when the survivor is freed and it's perfect in my book
Found the guy who only plays survivor.
@@JoveJoved false, but alright
yessir this content suits you mate
I think it should return to 5 seconds-stun because of the following:
1) When dropping from the killer's shoulders, you spend around 0.5 - 1 second on the animation.
2) Killers like Huntress, Deathslinger, Nurse, Blight, Trickster, and Freddy can counter DS by using their unique power.
3) If you get hit by a DS from an aggressive survivor, it means that he/she/they did not touch any gens, totems, chest, gates, and so on. So, he/she/they are not contributing to the game progress unless using himself/herself/themselves as bait to distract you.
4) You can't use it at the end game, so there are no free escapes.
5) It does not severely punish killers for tunneling because 3 seconds doesn't give survivors enough distance.
So, it is pretty much useless now. It is better just use a Out of Record + Unbreakable + Resilience + Deliverance (even though this one is kind of inconsistent).
I think the latest version of DS is usable vs most killers, but the nerf to the stun duration was completely unnecessary and a poor decision on BHVR's part, even if I understand why they were doing it (a desperate attempt at getting the huge number of killer mains they had alienated over the prior 7 months to come back to the game).
Disabling DS for "Conspicuous Action" (basically anything that advances the survivor's win-state like doing Gens or resetting) was the key element missing for balancing it to be a real anti-tunneling perk instead of the temporary god-mode cheat it had been since its inception and easily the best change made to the perk, ever.
Survivors still abuse second chance perks as god-mode cheats though. The amonut of times Survivors with BT or Off the Record just straight walk up to me and sandbag me in order to deny a hit on another survivor is infuriating. Instead of using the Endurance Effect as it's supposed to be used (as a form of protection against being tunneled) they just abuse it as a free hit and then complain about tunneling in post-game chat.
@@StabYourBrain I know man; I know.
But it's a sort of lose-lose situation because there's absolutely no way for the game to distinguish between a survivor using BT for anti-tunneling as intended or as a free body-block hit.
Your looping got me memorized and I stopped listening to what you were talking about
Lol!! I always get distracted by the looping in these kinds of videos and have to replay cause I wasn’t listening!!
I liked an idea that Scott Jund covered.
DS being a token perk, one that loses tokens when generators are completed.
At 5 gens, the stun is 7 seconds, but at 1 gen the stun is 3 seconds.
That would be the best balanced of anti tunnel I could think of. Punish the killer for tunneling at 5 gens with a hefty stun, but extended chases only very slightly when only 1 gen is left so the killer doesn't lose all pressure.
It's best to watch the video to get the full picture.
This was a really well-made and interesting video! Thank you for making this!
I never used it before and then as soon as I started using it DS got hit with that last nerf 😂🤦🏽♂️
Same! I had literally just bought Laurie before they nerfed it
That’s how i was with dead hard, back to sprint burst i guess ☠️
@@shurmarr Ong
@@RogueeRico same
same 😬 i got Laurie 1 day before nerf..
oh never realised they promised to bring the 3 second stun back, doesn’t feel like a true 3 second stun since half of it is getting off the killers shoulder. If it was changed to 3 seconds after the survivor has fully regained movement I think that would be a good spot for the perk
I played DBD back when DS only occured after an unhook. To think there was outcry is hilarious; it was still an extremely overpowered perk. Survivors were invincible for a full minute, and could bully you the entire duration. If you downed them, you either waited for a long time to pick up (losing a ton of time) or slugged, meaning they'd be healed to full as soon as you left by their SWF.
Current DS seems pretty good I would say. It's strong against tunnelers, but doesn't let survivors be obnoxiously in your face.
The more I learn about old DBD the more I am shocked this game ever survived.
I think the perk is fair. The only problem is if you miss the skill check the perk is automatically deactivated - utterly useless
Then don't miss the skill check duh 🙄
Didn't they like make the skill check even easier to hit?
As a killer main I’m not good at hitting skill checks under pressure 😂 e.g. overcharge, decisive strike
@@Destiny15 Fair point. It did take me months playing survivor to reliably hit those skill checks, including Oppression
Well it has a huge reward if you succeed in the skill check. If you don't, then you just don't get a 2nd chance, which in many cases can turn the tables massively
"There was only so long BHVR could ignore it - something had to be done. So, two years later" shows exactly how BHVR felt about the experience for killers back in the day (hint: they didn't really care about it). As if to pour salt in the wound, not even a year into DS existing (five months after the 1s reduction in stun time), Dead Hard was added, which - while nowhere near as bad as DS, since it still required more than just "hit a skill check" - was widely regarded as *yet another* second chance perk. This resulted in skilled survivors having the equivalent of four health states - healthy, injured, Dead Hard, DS - that the killer had to burn through before being able to hook them *on top of* the mentioned infinite loops, insta-gens, and other shit benefiting survivors.
This was so bad that at higher ranks (this was before SBMM) survivors could have to queue for half an hour (or longer) for just one match. Frankly, given just how long this "fuck killer players" mindset lasted at BHVR, I'm surprised the game is still around.
The 3 seconds of stun is definitely not enough. The killer can catch up to you very quickly and just down you again. If BHVR insists on keeping the duration at 3 seconds at least give survivors like a haste effect so they can get a bit more distance. Or just increase the stun duration to 4 seconds.
Just get good 😂
@@youngjacuzzi3676 then : same for killers... Just get good 😂 and you don't need any perk.
@@youngjacuzzi3676 get good and don't use hex perks🤣
@@KingJam3S glad I already always 4k without any hex then. 🤷♂️
Survivor mains coping
Man, imagine being the Entity in the early DBD days. You send your minions into trials with a bunch of juicy, supposedly defenseless sacrifices, only for those sacrifices to abuse your ill-thought-out object placement to stall the minion forever, run literal circles around them, abuse a physics oversight to *_literally teleport_* (something you only really wanted the Nurse to be able to do) and then stop your minion in their tracks for enough time to convince them to give up being your minion and face the inevitable consequences of failure the moment they actually caught one otf the slippery bastards.
I know it's lore-accurate that Entity fucks with some of the killers (like Trapper, Hag Oni--err, Samurai, etc.) but I doubt it'd allow bully squads and their associated tactics to make the lives of itself and its minions *this* miserable intentionally.
Plot twist: The Entity is actually punishing the killers for their sins in life
I had a Nancy being all smart last night. She butt bumped me out of a chase, so she could hide in a locker and force me to let her use decisive on me. So she got stabbed me, took about 5 steps and I threw a hatchet into her back. Was brilliant.
You sleeg. Hearing your voice again is like hearing from an old best friend. Love it everytime.
They should make DS so that it stays on indefinitely until another survivor is hooked. Forces anti tunnelling and allows survivors to progress the game instead of waiting out the 60 second timer.
I still think this was a money ploy from the beginning, just like the three gen build (Call of Brine/Eruption). Paywalling good perks and characters, waiting until most of the playbase buys the character or uses the perks, then nerfing the perks into oblivion.
Decisive Strike, Mettle of Man, CoB, Eruption, Reassurance (which hasn’t been nerfed but is behind a paywall). BHVR is nasty for that
DS is fair as it is now, the only reason it's not used after the 6.1.0 patch is because Off the Record is just a better anti-tunnel perk on all accounts and unless you're getting tunneled every game there is very little need to run two anti-tunnel perks. If OtR ever gets a nerf, I'd expect DS to start coming back. I agree on changing the amount of stumble a survivor gets after hitting their DS, maybe even give the survivor a little bit of a speed boost after hitting it instead? Other than that it's in a very good position right now and would still be used a lot if Off the Record wasn't better.
Rayman 3 is my favourite game of all time. Love the Rayman 3 funky board music in the background of this video. Also great video bro I hadn’t played dbd in awhile so had no idea they even changed it
It's pretty shit now, but it gives an extra dead hard, so it's decent on a looping build if the killer tunnels you. I think it's fine though, the meta needed a shake.
yeah so much for meta shake up when everyone already ends up using unbreakable, dead hard is still super common, OTR everywhere and also still gen slowdown galore on the killer side, pain res and DMS still just as relevant as ever.
@@LightBoltDash dead hard is still good imo, but no longer brain-dead easy to use, the DS nerf also nerfs unbreakeable, OTR gives you more STBFL stacks,wich is very strong right now and got nerfed on end game... And yes you can be a tryhard as killer but you dont have to as much as you used to imo, there is always gonna be a meta because people like to win, that is unavoidable.
@@Kasparth my point us there was no 'shake up' if people continue to still use the same shit
@@LightBoltDash You've named 4 perks that were meta and still are meta. The Meta changed. Plain and simple
@@ThyBigCheddar??? No it didn't??? literally every killer still runs massive gen slowdown, they just replaced ruin with overcharge, and survivors are STILL running only second chance stuff, DS just got replaced with OTR, meta didn't change if people still continue to use the same tactics just with slightly different perks, you're out of your mind lmao
i agree with the stumble buff you mentioned or like a 5% or 7% haste affect for 3 seonds after landing for a small amount of extra distance because it does very little to stop stronger killers at the moment
i would take away the stumble... but i would also add a extra deactivation effect of if someone else gets hooked after you have been unhooked.. it ends DS. ☺making it a true anti tunnel perk... if someone got hooked you were not tunneled... you lose your power.. done and done.
So what if someone trades with u in a camping bubba situation u get unhooked both of u go down at the same time and he hooks the other person before u and then hooks u would u want ur ds to be deactivated 😂😂
@@salvadornightingale8074 That's more of a Bubba problem rather than DS problem. We shouldn't balance the perk around 1 killer just because he can do some annoying Strat.
@@salvadornightingale8074 i have never run DS 😏 but that is a excellent point. i would like to see it still deactivate because it should if you were not tunneled... but killers with multi down powers are hard to balance around. we could just have it so a hooked state has to be done while you are out of the dying state for it to deactivate and that would solve the problem. 😎
A 3s stun on trapper means 15s more in chase at least whereas a 3s stun on nurse means no more that 3s more of chase
I like the idea that there's a anti-tunneling tool for survivors (I think that should be something baked in instead of a perk), but throughout DS's history it was an offensive tool for survivors instead of a defensive tool, and I don't think survivors should have _any_ offensive tools to use against the killer.
Survivor perks getting nerfed:
That's one perk in one slot of four, on one survivor out of four. Survivor perks have a quarter of the value of a single killer perk - four survivor perks equals one killer perk. (Hint: It should take an entire survivors perk build to counter one of the killer's slowdown perks...)
Killer perks getting nerfed:
That's like slamming four Survivor perks into the ground. An entire perk of four, when having to manage four people and their four perks each... That's huge.
It’s back to 5 now
Who's here after the buff hhh
One time I managed to use DS in the best way possible
Gates were open
I got put in the basement by a camper bubba
Managed to get myself off hook, use DS and escape
With the new update it's a shame a moment like that won't happen again
Yea but more often than not a survivor could be unhooked in front of the killers face and then be practically invincible for 60 seconds. It was a necessary change, but with basekit BT you can still do something similar
@@irritatingperson7882 tunneling 🧍
I played the most at the height of the BT/DS/DH Meta and I played primarily Killer and I do miss those days. Things were so much simpler. I never tunnelled anyone anyway, so Survivors only really ever had 2 perks to play with, since all their Borrowed Time and Decisive Strikes were useless, and Dribbling survivors was a useful tactic for getting around DS
With the first (video) chapter talking about what the Halloween chapter did for the game, it would be super interesting to see a video discussing the timeline from then till now, with perks, designs, and cosmetics
I main killer and I honestly think decisive pre 6.1.0 was fair enough with the only stipulation being that it should've been removed with endgame like what the overhaul did to it.
God the nostalgiaaa.. when he goes through each section of the video
That 2 week period where no one ran DS was so blissful for us killer mains. We never knew what we had until it was gone again 😭
lol, its basically gone now with its 3 second stun and being disabled after all gens are complete. Getting hit by the off the record endurance is a much worse setback now.
DS before the unsafe actions was my most hated perk to face in the game, still remember as a new killer getting hit by 3 DSes in a row as a SWF rushed hooks and bodyblocked knowing I couldn't do anything against their DS/UB
I loved the video, I never knew it was ever 3 seconds in the past I thought that was a new thing before it’s current form I always knew it as the perk that every killer fears I had no idea it used to be as useless as it is now
theyre planing to buff ds again ...
The one thing I hate about DS is that it's fair against almost all killers...except nurse and blight... especially good ones. IMO, deactivating when a gate is OPENED would be fair, because deactivating after gens finished plus I have No Way Out is just stupid lol. Literally a free 4k in most cases.
I'm for the idea of either increasing the stun time back to 4 or 5 seconds; and keeping the deactivation after the last gen. Or, keeping it at 3 seconds, and having it work during the endgame. I still believe the game is survivor sided, but for an anti-tunnelling perk, I don't see it helping protect against tunnelers. During the endgame is the prime time for a killer to tunnel, especially if a game has gone badly for them.
Agree to bring it back up to 5 sec but I would like to just see some ways to prevent survivors from using it aggressively, for example locker grabs don't activate ds and the killer can just slug you and move on + maybe deactivate it if the killers hooks somebody else between your hooks.
It should last for a minute after you’ve been unhooked and shouldn’t deactivate when hopping on a gen or healing
It was a bit over-nerfed. I was able to ignore the stun and tunnel someone through it as *Clown* whilst inside Dead Dawg main building.
This should not be possible unless the survivor just installed the game that day.
Was this today?? I was in a game exactly like that earlier 😂
I mean Clown is probably one the killers (m1 ones at least) that counters ds the most since he can just throw a tonic on the ground before picking up
Decisive strike still saves me from my own mistakes and has the potential to extend a chase well beyond it's limits. It's in a good place, though people who were used to DS being a god perk are liable to say it's useless because they have to put in more effort after getting the stun. Specifically for anti tunnel it is ok. I definitely think the Conspicuous Action needs more thought. Like I've accidently touched totems mid chase for a split second or self cared, and because of rules around DS it was technically "fair" that i was tunnelled. Maybe make it like 1 second of total conspicuous action time before it deactivates the perk instead of instant? That would mean survivors won't be penalized for accidental self care or totem tapping, but if they are trying to heal or do a gen they get punished? And i mean total as in you self care for .5 seconds then touch a totem for .5 seconds, and that creates 1 total second. To avoid gen tapping and heal tapping.
@Lars Liam Vilhelm if you go against the nurse, and the person playing nurse is actually competent, then yeah, but you're fucked even with 4 seconds. If you're against the rest of the top tier cast it can definitely feel like that (i don't really consider any killers s tier besides nurse) it's definitely a struggle. High mobility killers are definitely tougher to get away from in dead zones. I'm not against putting DS back at 4 seconds. But my experience is that DS is still viable in many if not most scenarios. The times I've used it have saved me from deaths and even helped win games.
Oh I remember those terrible hook days, you finally down a survivor and the nearest hook would be 50m away or there just wouldn’t be any in an area and you’d lose the survivor
I remember when they changed it to the unhooked requirement, I still juggled people for a couple months after the change lol
He is back. Literally watched a Yerv video and he mentioned Ardetha. Then I started wondering where Ardetha went. Now he's back. What a great way to start off the weekend
I think that the timer for DS shouldn't vanish if you do something, but should go down FASTER while doing something.
85% Faster?
Should have a longer stun, stay for a minute after you get unhooked, pause while you’re in chase and deactivate during endgame
Doing something shouldn’t impact the timer at all
I never played dead by daylight, but ive been keeping up with this community for like 6 months now lmao
I mean, I found it really entertaining to just juggle people. The salt was amazing
the only way i can see the perk being as it is with 3 seconds stun is if the survivor literally starts sprint bursting for 2 seconds or something after the stun otherwise 0 distance can be made. (doesnt matter if u were exhausted or not)
Ds is a perfect example of what happens when a decent perk is overused and abused to the point of frustration, all ds really needed was to be turned off after all the generators were powered, however because of how abused it was by toxic swfs and just survivors in general meant it had to get biggger nerfs. Remember survivors killers didn't get DS nerfed, you did. But i do agree it needs a buff just a tiny one
Ngl that killer was getting looped to infinity
I mean to be fair ds is still usable and there are other perks that deserve a buff more than ds. Ds consistently made it into my builds for so long and finally theres basekit bt, theres off the record, and new worse ds. Just because it was really good doesn’t mean it needs to stay decently good. It can be more niche and weaker. Perks like buckle up, up the ante, autodidact, guardian, leader, sole survivor, left behind, wake up, premonition, self preservation, and solidarity are all consistently weaker than current ds imo.
Depends on how you use these perks. Autodidact can be pretty solid in some healing builds. Leader is also good in some builds. Guardian is the same. Yeah, maybe these perks alone are kinda trash, but if you combine them well, they are not.
DS has some problems, because yeah, it's not so good anymore, but it doesn't do what it should and that's the bad thing.
I think old DS was perfect the way it was with the 5 second stun. just not letting you use it after the End game collapse start and if you touch a gen, totem or Unhook somebody you lose it. good anti tunnel perk not that strong since no free escape after end game collapse starts.
Dear fucking lord... cant believe behavior waited 2 damm long years on a much due nerf. Not to be missed really. PoS perk not only was punishing you for playing the game as a killer, also created synergies of absolute god states with unbreakable and adrenaline. Not only that it also killed any room for survivor perk creativity, forcing a system that was thought essentially to allow custom gameplay experience into the exact opposite that it was intended to do
The fall of Decisive Strike is only a small part of a larger problem really. This can be alluded to in this video when talking about how players originally approached the game for its novelty aspect & the competitive drive wasn't so heavily focused on. Since this is game is asymmetrical, it can never be truly balanced. When this game first started it was survivor side and it has ever gone more towards killer sided but finding the balance is something that can never be completely accomplished. I believe a lot of that has to do with players being either survivor sided or killer sided. To be honest I feel both sides are pretty entitled and toxic. It varies and has its own factors as well such as generally the pool of survivors is larger, but the voice of killer mains is louder. Seriously search anything dbd related on entitled or toxic in RUclips and you'll see a killer main video regarding it 9 times out of 10. More and more I feel like the game needs to be stripped down to a more basic approach. Sometimes I think all perks and add on(s) for Killer/Survivor should be removed. Also, maps should be even out as a 50-50 chance of getting either a large or small map. Hooks should never be gone even after a survivor is sacrificed and exit doors should be as far apart from each other as possible. Still with even that the game will not be truly balanced. Just like this Decisive Strike talk doesn't consider the factor of SWF. It is the SWF group that is generally the moments I have to buckle down more as killer. In a solo cue or even in just a duo set up, meta or sweaty perks are needed in order to survivor and generally it is still a hatch search in the end. Furthermore, it is my understanding MMR for survivors is based only on surviving the match so with conditions being narrower it is going to leave a more concentrated pool of more in likely sweaty survivors for high MMR killers to deal with. So, in the end you'll see the most meta perks on survivor and the strongest killers with best perk/add on(s) for killer. Additionally, I do not worry about decisive strike as killer because it really doesn't slow me down. Even in the old days I could tunnel as survivor with classic decisive strike, but it was more discouraging then. Problem is it gets exploited to the point it is nerfed till it is worthless and that is what the perk now is. Comparing DS to Ruin other than saying it was primarily used by their respective sides is laughable. DS only advantage over Ruin was that it had some situational windows of being used but you got no bang for your buck most of the time. The factor with ruin is different in that its effect is determined on if the totem is still up (varies when paired with undying) and how well the killer applies gen pressure to keep survivors from being able to just sit on a gen. The overall impact of DS vs Ruin is not equal at all. In the end so many factors determine the outcome of the game & it is impossible to account for them all. Killers have a power that survivors do not. In this game Killers are very different whereas Survivors are the same (they just have different appearances/skins). This alone leaves the killer in the power position but depending on how the four survivors play (also are they swf or not) & considering the skill level of the killer the outcomes can vary from a 4K to all the survivors escaping. Now consider throwing in the add on(s), perks as well as factor the maps (small vs larger vs hook locations vs pallets vs exit door locations vs loop locations) and it can be a nightmare depending on which main you play. I am not saying all but let's be honest that most survivors just want to survivor and killers just want to get a 4k. Out of that group I actually believe a lot like to gloat & rub their win in the face of their opponent. As a Killer I have played what I consider normal just doing my objects as needed in gen pressure & attempting to not tunnel but I will get survivors that flashlight click, gesture & tea bag. Then on the other hand, I can be playing as survivor & trying to run the killer as long as i can for my team, finally get caught & then get either camped (also at times slugged while I am on hook), tunneled after I am off or get killers shaking their heads yes or no if I get hit to the ground. The thing is I could see that behavior given if I did an action that warranted that response but, in the end, it was that person or persons that is starting the behavior. Maybe the games objectives should be changed something to like Friday the 13th's or Evil Dead.....something other than just gens? In the end though would it really matter? Maybe in the end it isn't so much the perks on this game but just the people that if either you are killer or survivor can't enjoy the game for fun but cry because taking the L is just too much?
That intro loop was so clean
I think a speed boost to the survivor after the stun would be nice.
You have several perks that already do that, dead hard, Sprint burst, lithe, balanced landing would you also like a perk where Killers can't chase you too? Or one that killers can't hit you?
@@norouziman8748 Bruh. How often do you use Sprint Burst after a DS without being slugged?
More often than not you've already used your exhaustion perk by the time DS activates.
I have nearly 1k hours in each side and I have very rarely gotten hit by DS but I've seen how little it does when the killer is actually tunneling.
Sure you can use OTR + DS + Dead Hard to make a little more distance but that's almost your entire build just to make sure you don't get tunneled and even then it only buys you so much time.
Watching this in April 2024, where they announced that DS is back to 5 seconds on the PTB is the spotlight of the next update. DS USERS REJOICE!
I don't think Decisive Strike is really even that bad now. The endgame change is good, because if you survived long enough for 5 gens to be completed then you weren't being tunneled anyways, and having Decisive Strike that late into the game could get pretty unfair very quickly.
So few people are running it, that it seems like killers aren't respecting DS nearly as much. The 3 second stun is pretty not great, but if you don't die in the middle of nowhere you can still get to safety
I kinda agree
I dont know why nobody brings this up, but to get a true anti tunnel perk, just make DS last for 30 seconds, but the timer is stopped once in chase and it disables itself after touching a gen etc. Its so obvious and fair that I have no clue how BHVR never even thought of this idea in all of the changes they made to the perk.
45 secs after being unhooked. Actions shouldn’t disable the timer. And the perk should stay disabled in endgame. Otherwise, I agree
DS used to be a perk that punished tunneling
I think the best state it was in was when doing something deactivated it but you had a 60 second timer for when you genuinely got tunneled
Because agressive or toxic survivors would have to waste their time doing nothing if they wanted to use it to be toxic
So that part of it's usage was discouraged
But killer mains spending literal years whining and screaming about how DS is so unfair and how tunneling is necessary to have a chance to win
Brought it to the state it is now
I think it's a testament to how entitled and whiny the dbd community is as a whole.
It was a 5 second stun that most killers could catch up to quite easily especially when the survivor wasn't that good.
If the survivor was good they would get a chance to prolong the process of tunneling which honestly takes less and less time with each update now.
I don't understand why Behaviour is so obsessed with making dbd competitive when it was never meant to be
And the fact there aren't ranked and casual mode also adds to it.
The game has become increasingly more toxic for casual players
And it's sad because let's be real
Playing a game as Chris Redfield against Michael Myers on The Game with Nicolas Cage, Bill Williamson and Nancy Wheeler
And other matchups like this is why most people play the game
If you're playing against a Ghostface on the game for example you'll get DS value but if it was nurse you might as well miss the skillcheck
Just make it 5 seconds again. I don’t care if it feels bad for the killer, IT SHOULD. You tunneled me, you should get a long stun as a punishment. It shouldn’t feel good for you to go against and let you immediately start chasing me again and down me instantly if you’re blight or nurse.
Ukrainian Jake
Putin poutine
Problem is most survivors didn't use it to prevent tunneling but aggressively. I would ok with 5 ds if locker grabs did not activate it so you can slug and move one + if you hooked somebody else DS would deactivate to prevent the killer being punished for playing to well
@@theslavicrat3784 yeah lockers shouldn’t activate it
And here we are, buff on Decisive strike haha
As a new dbd player, I love these vids so much. They help me learn how to play and teach me about thing I had no idea about.
I think the biggest problem with DS back in the day was simply how it could be combined with other things in order to make it take FOREVER to catch just one survivor, and then if the whole team used it there would be a 80% of losing no matter what skill level.
If the survivor used:
-Styptic agent / Syringe
-Dead Hard
-Decisive Strike
it could take up to 5 hits just to DOWN one survivor and have the ability to hook them, and back then body blocking and stuff like that was so much more common especially since self-care was in it's prime and people could just heal, there was also no Starstruck or Mad Grit to make it risky to block a killer.
Add this to an old toxic 4-man SWF group and that is 20 hits just to down each of them for the first time, without a guaranteed hook, not to mention the time it would take to get each of those hits due to the pallet vacuum, absurd amount of pallets, and the longer action times.
the stun duration nerf felt really dumb to me, the 3 second stun duration barely punishes most killers
9:27
Good one, m8. Dropped the game 5 years ago because of how babied killers were, and from what I've heard it's only gotten worse. The very idea the game was _ever_ stacked in the _survivors_ favor is simply _absurd._