Audi B9 S4/S5 ECU Tune comparison APR and Unitronic Stage 1 - Episode 2 Unitronic at the Dyno
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
- This is the second episode in a series of videos comparing ECU tunes for the Audi B9 S4 and S5 platform. This video is from our Unitronic stage 1 + (93 octane) dyno day at Carburetor Connection in Kirkland, WA, the same place we measured APR Stage 1 91 octane. Stay tuned for Episode 3 when we get on the track with Unitronic Stage 1 +.
Watch this video for APR Stage 1 tune on the Dyno • APR Stage 1 Tuned Audi...
Pick up either of these tunes at Achtuning.com
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Hey there! We know each other indirectly through a common friend :)
Looking forward to seeing this beast at some point.
Thanks for the shirt by the way 🍻
Thanks for the support!
Thanks for helping me decide. Going with unitronic
I just did the 91 map for unitronic. Coming from a race chip, it’s so much nicer. I was having a low voltage issue going on too before the flash. Now it’s charging great. Really weird I know. But my stereo system appreciates it. I can’t wait for the TCU tune to come out. According to unitronic who I spoke with this morning, before the end of the year. Hopefully with a stage2 also.
Also I haven got a cel yet. I did use a mini cat on the back o2 sensor on the catted CTS down pipe. So far so good.
That close will stick, "Keep your VA-Guh tight". Another good one gents appreciate the consistent bad influence...
Maybe we’ll put that on a shirt!
Great video man! Thanks for the comparison! I’m running the EPL tune and just about to do their TCU tune. Would love to see how the Unitronic compares to the EPL too. In my driving experience, the EPL also has an earlier blast of torque, and even if it pushes nice to the red line, my guess is that it should look like a middle point between APR and Unitronic’s (if that makes sense). Thanks!
Love it! We have other tuners planned for the future. EPL would be a great one to do. At this point they haven’t offered theirs for review. If we get enough subscribers, we can just buy it. 😜
@@Vaguh C’mon RUclips community, let’s do it! 😁
Graphs compare a 91 oct. APR to a 93 tune thus not apples to apples.
Good point. I plan to do APR 93 in the future to get a more even comparison.
This is the comment I was looking for .. on my b8.5 A4 I had program switching and I could tell the difference from my 91 tune and 93 tune.. also APR was the only one that offered e85 at the time.
Unitronic Stage 1+ or IE stage 1 93 oct? Which one do you prefer? which one is faster? Thank you. Congratulations for the videos!
I'm about to pull the trigger on a stage 1 unitronic for my TTS. Did you also do the DSG upgrade? Seems like I should upgrade both, have you?
Based on your findings and others I would say due to providing a warranty and being carb compliant in CA which Unitronic to my knowledge doesn't offer. They probably drop the torque near shifting points to be easier on the transmission long term.
Going to get my S5 tuned this week. The guy at the shop said the APR is better due to the fact that it doesn't stress the engine as much as the Unitronic. Is he correct or is he just trying to upsell me?
With you running the 93 Tune, do you think it accounts for the 11 more HP? I keep trying to figure out what tune I want on my 9.5 - I do keep going back to APR due to APR plus.
Yeah think that’s likely the case, I ran the Unitronic 91 for a few weeks and I think the numbers and speed are almost identical between the two. Drivability is different and so is the ability to switch maps. For now I prefer Unitronic. If you like APR and don’t need to switch fuel types, then go for it. You won’t be disappointed.
I have the APR 91 tune on my S5 and just got the AWE Switchpath exhaust. That early hit of power / torque makes the car sound insane with an aftermarket system. Curious if you are going to switch out the stock system to get more power that way, I can actually feel a difference in power with the AWE from Stock. They claim 16 hp/17 torque
I have an aftermarket downpipe and deleted the first set of silencers (pre-muffler). I like the stock functionality of being able to open and close the valves with the MMI. That being said, we’re working with a company that will have an exhaust ready for release in the future that will retain that ability.
@@Vaguh good call! The stock sound on the S5's is pretty bad
I’m no expert on wheel vs. crank conversion, but if it’s an estimated 20% drivetrain loss, don’t you have to gross up the wheel hp by 25% and not 20% to get what you’re after? In other words 368whp * 125% = 460hp; 460hp - 20% drivetrain loss (92hp) = 368whp. Enjoying this series and leaning APR for more accessible torque. If I want hi revving hp, I’ll jump from the wife’s SQ5 to my X3M :) Hoping you’re able to get your hands on 034’s upcoming tune for a future comparison vid!
Thanks for following along. You’re right on the math, but since it’s all estimated, I tried to keep it simple, if slightly underrated. It would be awesome to get the 034 tune as well.
@@Vaguh I think the 20% estimate is more valid for low HP cars. basically cars that have 160 HP or less. The reason behind it is that the inertia and general power required to make all those drivetrain components move doesn't increase at the same rate as the engine power output. It is true that a car with more power is probably going to have beafier drive shaft, heavier gears and differential parts that require more inertia to move, but that doesn't change at the same rate as the engine power output. for example lets say we have a 1500 crank HP Bugatti. if we apply the 20% rule, we get 1200WHP, aka 300HP loss from drivetrain. with that logic, if we swap the Bugatti engine with one making 200HP, it should have a hard time running the car, but I don't think that's the case. From what I understand from the math, for a linear increase of engine HP, the drive train loss is a logarithmic function. (If you need a refresher of what that means, lookup y=logx vs y=x graph and you'll know what I mean.) So with that logic, I would say a better estimate for you WHP at 350 stock horsepower would be a %12-15 loss (so closer to 300-310 WHP), and 11-14% after tune (so 420-430 Crank HP).
@@pattvl1647 Part of the drivetrain losses is attributed to the increased load and friction on components (which can be observed as the additional heat generated throughout the system) as well as the rotational inertia, so the losses definitely increase along with power increase, maybe not linearly, but pretty close.
In other words, that 1500 bhp Bugatti needs a ton of cooling on the transmission, diffs, etc. and for all we know, there might just be 200hp of heat being dissipated/lost throughout the drivetrain in there that would simply not be there if the load was reduced to a simple 200hp engine.
This is interesting perspective, thanks for sharing! I have a question about the immediate response though... I have driven a Ghibli, an AMG C43 and an S4, all stock. Comparing them all at the sportiest setting, when you suddenly go full throttle, the power delivery in the S4 was smoother (gave a ligher pull for 0.5-1sec and then pulled really hard) whereas the Ghibli and the AMG gave that immediate bang that could hurt your neck if you're not attentive. How does the APR/Unitronic tune relate to that?! I imagine it may put some stress to the parts, but what doesn't?! Thanks in advance!! 🤙
With the tune and if you use launch control it’s a neck snappin’, head rockin’ good time. Otherwise it’s a V6 with a turbo, so depending on how you drive it, you still gotta wait for the turbo to kick in. A V8 will have a slightly more immediate response, in normal driving but can’t match launch control on a tuned S4/S5. Current 0-60 is 3.49.
Nice. Thanks for the reply! I love it during spirited driving while rolling already, like highway driving at 60mph and you get that same kick (obviously less intense) but it's always there on the Ghibli/AMG!
So does the apr have a more snappy and livelier throttle for every day driving?
I have a 2018 B9 S5 with a Weistec stage 1 tune. Mods include AWE intake and non resonated touring exhaust, Wagner tuning intercooler with chargepipe, Weistec diverted valve, and a CTS turbo inlet pipe. Car is insanely fast. I went with Weistec because at the time Apr or Unitronic were still developing. I plan on adding a Milltek cat and going to Stage 2 this summer.
Love it! Any idea what you 0-60 or 1/4 mile times are? If you DM us some pics of your car on Instagram, we’ll feature it in a post.
I’m selling my Vette soon and wanted a good idea how fast your car feels compared to some more common more faster cars? I plan to buy a S5 sportback this summer and would do a tune right away. I just wanna make sure it’s fast enough to my standards tuned. Plus does either company do a transmission (TCU) tune?
I think the both have TCU tunes I. The works. I know EPL has a TCU tune. Our next episode will be a track day, I beat a Challenger SRT with drag radials, but it was his first track day. Saw a Vette running in the 10s. That my goal, but it’s going to take some work. With some mods, the S5 will be faster than a Vette within the speed limits. My 60’ was 1.6.
Not really related to this video's content: What wheels are you running now? Are they a square setup and/or are you running a spacer in the rear to keep good fitment? Did you do a weight comparison to stock?
These wheels, no spacers and the weight is 53 lbs with tires, same as stock, but with more grip. Not a square setup, there’s still some camber. www.achtuning.com/hartmann-ff-070-cg-19x9-0-et25-wheel-for-audi-and-volkswagen/
Do you know if Unitronic keeps the exhaust valves open in S mode?
I don’t know for sure, but I don’t believe they keep them open all the time.
I’ve got a silly question does the Unitronic turn allow you to rev passed 4K rpm in park or neutral?
It does not. But the APR does. And it’s a pretty fun feature.
@@Vaguh thanks for clearing that up! Unitronic is looking like the way to go for me.
You seem to prefer the Unitronic, but I can’t nail down exactly why. Part of me wants to feel the difference all the time, but are you saying it’s too jerky for relaxed driving?
Both tunes are solid. I’ll try to upload a quick video that outlines my current preferences. In the meantime here’s a a few major differences between the two tunes.
1. We have 92 octane gas here. I can get e85 or race gas to make 93, but it’s a big hassle. So I daily drive on the 91 octane file. With APR I have to go to my local shop to switch fuel maps. With Unitronic, I can change whenever I want from home. This is a big deal. Because of this I’ve only driven on APRs 91 octane tune. I’m hoping to get into the shop today to get the APR 93 loaded up.
2. The APR is not jerky, just feels like they adjusted the throttle mapping so it feels more responsive in normal daily driving, which is good, but it also feels like theres not much left, when pushing down the second half of the gas pedal. Unitronic feels a bit more linear. This is just personal preference. APR is great for daily driving because of this, and on a road track, the earlier torque would be great for accelerating out of turns, but it feels like it hits the turbos limits sooner.
3. Sounds. There are two areas where these tunes sounds different. 1 - Unitronic has more pops and bangs in sport /dynamic mode. 2 - I think APR adjusts the open and close points of the exhaust valves, it seems to be louder overall. At startup, in comfort mode it just has a different tone. Unitronic sounds quieter until you mash the gas pedal. This is good for me, since my wife isn’t a fan of super loud exhausts.
I appreciate you following the series, I’ll post my thoughts on APR stage 1 93 soon. This weekend is episode 3, which is a track day with Unitronic, though. Thanks for following and for the questions.
for the unitronic can you run a different intercooler ?
I have an APR Intercooler, you can run whichever one you like.
Have you got rid of the check engine light? If so, how did you do it? Great content BTW!
Thanks!! Unitronic had a stage 1 + for off-road use that worked to remove the CEL. Can’t get it anymore thanks to the EPA. Anyway, I have a last o2 spacer option that might work. I’ll try it out and post a video of all my downpipe/ CEL findings .
@rcptuning
APR's 93 octane tune claims almost 30hp more - any plans to use that one so more of an apples to apples?
Yep. I got it on the track. Working on the final editing now. Might have it up tonight or tomorrow
What’s your 0-60 at on your current tune?
3.49 on dragy. Next episode is at the track some drag racing!
@@Vaguh thanks for getting back to me on the other video, I didn’t see you posted an earlier vid.
Can you tell me your wheel size please?
These are the wheels I have. They’re awesome! www.achtuning.com/hartmann-ff-070-cg-20x9-5-et25-wheel-for-audi-and-volkswagen/
Is there not a completely stock dyno run of your car on that dyno? A shame if not, because introducing backwards estimating calculations and drivetrain losses just muddies the water.
When you start comparing one tuner to another, may I suggest a disclaimer or statement about who is paying for what. What I'm perceiving from this series so far is that you had the APR tune (you paid for it, full price?), and it was nice and solid. Then came Unitronic and you got a discount (of some sort) - and now it sure sounds like you prefer it over APR! Hello, bias, nice to meet you :-) Moreover, you only appear interested in EPL if THEY offer you a tune for free? discount? Again, muddy waters.
Just be upfront so that the viewers can weigh the potential bias.
I appreciate your feedback. I don’t have a completely stock run on this dyno. I did receive Unitronic at a discount, in fact I got it significantly discounted and my local shop, Achtuning sponsored the rest. There were no strings attached and I did not disparage APR in any way. I have two other tuners offering free tunes and will be doing videos on them as well. My current preference for Unitronic is because I like the flexibility of changing maps at home and it’s driving experience so far. I’m doing my best document my experiences at my expense. I’m happy to try EPL but at this point, our time and platform are worth an investment to them. I have been upfront. Anyone who follows our Instagram knows Unitronic and Achtuning our local shop worked together to provide this tune for us to run tests. I will be getting APR 93 on the dyno and at the track, which costs money as well. I hope you continue to follow the series and offer your insights.
Also nice to see you just joined RUclips 13 minutes ago and this is your first ever comment, welcome to the community. Or thanks for trolling. 😉
@@Vaguh I am sorry if you feel that I am trolling simply because I joined (signed in would be more appropriate) YT and immediately left a comment. Is there even such a thing as a YT comment history or something? I am not a frequent RUclips browser or follower of people's channels. But everyone, at some point, had to 'join' YT to drop that first comment right? My point is simply that in the year 2021, when someone is clearly an influencer (congrats!), any product review without a clear explanation or disclaimer of who paid for the product should be considered paid advertisement. In my opinion, it becomes even MORE important to be clear about any discounts or freebies when you're directly comparing products - as you're doing here. Your audience goes beyond the followers of your Instagram, so I don't think unreasonable to say up front on each of your videos in this series "Hey guys, as a reminder - I got the APR tune for $100 back in the day, the Uni tune for $99, and the EPL and 034 for FREE!!" Gives you a little more credibility and allows your audience to process any perceived bias. With that said, keep the comparo series going, and I look forward to the additional tuners.
Why did u compare two different octanes? That makes a big difference... and why did u only go stage 1 with APR and not stage 1 plus and why only 91 with APR and not 93?
I started out with APR stage 1 91 because we have 92 here in WA. Got Unitronic and mixing to get to 93. I have APr stage 1 93 on the car now for the upcoming episodes. The series is ongoing.
Well u said ur comparing apples to apples in the video but the charts u put up are not apples to apples... that’s why I’m asking. And why only stage 1?
@@as5autotv574 yeah, I meant apples to apples with the way we were measuring the numbers. Not in the tunes themselves. I’ll be clearing that up in the upcoming videos where I compare the APR stage 1 93 and Unitronic stage 1 + (93). I should be getting the car to the dyno this week. And only stage 1 because that’s the only tunes available from APR and Unitronic at the moment. I have two other tuners that we’ll be testing as well. Appreciate your interest and input.
I have APR STAGE 1 + on 93 cost me $1,300 when the time 1st released. Then two months later The dropped the price! But my tune has had some issues when I got it. I’m interested in this series,.
Helps to use the 93octane tune from apr . When u compare it to a 93 octane unitronic . Really come on 91 tune wtf that's a 10 to 15hp difference mostly
Thanks for the feedback. I addressed this in a later video, and compared these tunes at the track on the 1/4” all on 93. This is best viewed on a computer but I compiled the results here. www.vaguh.com/blog/cyf695nfxbvuqliof9kis2lfmyj8hd
91 vs 93 octane. Why? Not a direct comparison.
It’s what I have for now. I plan on trying 93 when I can get to Achtuning and buy it. It’s an ongoing series. When I bought the APR stage 1, I wasn’t running a RUclips channel. It’s cost 💲 upgrade to 93 and to put this stuff together. 😜
Bro what about the APR stage 1 E85 !! That one is faster than any other stage1+ tune so why you don't try the E85 one ? Sure is gonna be faster that the unitronic one
I’m actually on the APR stage 1 e85 tune now. I’m trying to keep all the tests the same. For now it’s 93. I’ll do the e85 tunes next. It just takes time. I’m heading to the track on Friday to test another new tune this week! I’ll try to get through all of them.
@@Vaguh Allright man sounds great 👍I will be waiting to see the results hope you get happy with the E85 results 😊
Not a fair comparison at all. Couple of bolt on mods and the big one 91 octane versus 93 octane. Farcical even trying to compare them.
Bolt on mods are the same between the two runs. The VPS pre-muffler delete isn’t a power adder and the turbo inlet is minimal. It’s not really meant to be a fair comparison, just a comparison. I’ll be doing the same with APR stage 1 93 coming up. It’s pretty difficult to get dyno time and do a whole bunch of tune switching in one day. Thanks for watching and stay tuned. I should also mention, I was running on 92 octane for the APR dyno.
Whats up with the mask? LOL
Well, there was this thing a couple of years ago called COVID. Maybe you heard about it?
U are 91 octane APR????? Good gas on unitronic 93 octane nice to compare apples to apples
Yeah, I tried as best as possible. But with APR I have to get to the dealer to get the car flashed and then get to the track. It’s a bigger challenge. As the series went on I did compare similar fuel when possible. Our website has a data comparison of all our stage 1 testing at the strip.
The hp/tq numbers listed on Unitronics website for a stage 1 93 tune are way lower than what you're showing. I'm confused.