Buying Solar Batteries - 2023 Home Battery Buyer's Guide
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- Опубликовано: 31 май 2024
- Discover the 10 most important considerations when buying home batteries in Australia in 2023. Learn how to buy a solar battery with confidence, and at the right price.
Chapters:
00:00 - Introduction
00:35 - Is home battery right for you?
03:45 - How much do solar batteries cost?
05:42 - What size battery should you buy?
06:16 - Rebates and VPPs (Virtual Power Plants)
08:11 - Dodgey battery sales techniques
09:34 - Battery backup - know what to ask for
10:57 - Cheap home batteries - safety alert!
12:19 - Battery vs. solar panel degradation
13:40 - Analysing battery warranties - tips
15:50 - Important installation considerations
You can read the article version of this guide here:
www.solarquotes.com.au/101-gu...
For the home battery comparison table I mention:
www.solarquotes.com.au/batter...
This buyers guide is part two of my Solar Battery 101 series.
*** Part 1: Understanding Solar Batteries
Home battery storage basics
Video: • Understanding Solar Ba...
Article: www.solarquotes.com.au/101-gu...
*** Part 3: Owning Solar Batteries
What to expect and what you need to do during your battery-powered lifestyle.
Video: • Owning Solar Batteries...
Article: www.solarquotes.com.au/101-gu...
You can read all my solar and battery 101 guides here:
www.solarquotes.com.au/101-gu...
And to receive quotes from solar and/or battery installers I have personally pre-vetted and trust: www.solarquotes.com.au/quote/
If you have questions after watching the video, feel free to ask in the comments section below - and don't forget to subscribe to this channel :) 
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Thank you, Finn. As always, clear, entertaining and informative. Your effort to look after the non-technical public is greatly appreciated.
Owner of an Alpha ESS Smile-B3 5kw system. Perfect for our needs. It's low cost and generally allows us to never pay peak power rates. Great supplement for our 10.2kw solar system during winter when charging our EV. Very happy with what could be described as a bottom of the market system.
Great video Finn. I used your site six years ago to source a smallish 3kw solar system (roof limited space to 11 panels). The SolarEdge system has generated 19MWh since then paying about half its cost off. Thanks for the advice then, but lack of space makes more panels or a battery uneconomic.
Hi Finn,
I used Solarquotes in 2019 (along with a lot of other research to determine what I needed to best suit needs) to acquire an installer for my 10kW solar array (30 Jinko panels, fully optimised) with an 8kW Solaredge inverter. I ended up with one of your recommended installers.
Whilst covid has sent that installer to the wall, I have been quite happy with the system (with a minor hiccup - installation related) with ROI of about 6-7yrs (warranties are 10yrs for inverter and optimisers, 25yrs for panels, yes, with degradation factors of course) This was based on the previous 5yrs electrical energy usage, along with a projected 3% annual increase on power prices (which is extreme low end now!)
I looked into a battery at the time, but determined that it wasn't worth the capital outlay for the potential savings.
Subsequently, I 'ordered' the system to be battery capable so I could add a battery in the future with minimal further outlay, hoping the cost of the battery will come down with time.
At that time, in my ACT location (with subsidies) it was going to cost around $1k per kW/h for storage.
Now, it is around $1400 per kW/h... So much for my guessing that the batteries will go down in price!
With the solar system, I have reduced my annual electrical cost from $2.5k to ~$1k, so it's not worth it (for me) to invest in a battery, yet... but I see another increase in cost of electricity this year.
I have also looked into acquiring a 2nd hand EV battery (as they are replaced with around 80% effectiveness) but it would seem that the market has also jumped on that bandwagon, and they are around $600 per kW/h as a second hand item (stationary storage) but they do have the higher storage/capacity that I would prefer (2-3 days of household energy needs when overcast)
Meanwhile, I have replaced our gas storage hot water system with a (Reclaim) Hot Water Heat Pump and was quite amazed at how little energy a HWHP uses (abt 2-3kW/h for a 320L tank) to heat the water! They also have a good warranty period. This lower gas bill now adds to the savings, lowering our ROI.
Next stage is to replace our Gas space heater with a reverse cycle air conditioner. I guess at that time, I will have a serious look again at a battery, even to get us through the 'peak period' each evening.
And just for all the others reading this, my objective has environmental concerns, but it's mostly driven to minimise my bills for when I hit retirement in a few years. :) Once I get the house off gas, that will save me enormously (energy cost, along with 'supply fee')
For the stats (& the nerds):
Last calendar year, (electrically) our household used just under 10MW/h of which, 4.5MW/h was self consumption, 5.5MW/h from the grid and we put about 7.5MW/h feed in to the grid. Consumption was similar in 2021, with about 8.2MW/h feed in to the grid.
We have many fridges & freezers so have a 'base load' in our house of about 1kW.
Being in the ACT, our house is 35 degrees south and the panels are flat mounted onto our 22.5degrees pitch roof (facing about 5 degrees east of north with some morning and evening shading - hence the optimisers)
On another note, in 2019 when I was shopping around for a solar system, I had also approached a 'generic' solar system supplier for a quote and all they wanted to do is supply what wanted to supply (an 'off the shelf' 6.6kW system, actually, two systems as I wanted more than 6.6kW) I'm glad I had done the research and knew what I wanted - as they were quite convincing in their sales pitch - they were still contacting me 2 years later, even after I have told them on numerous occasions that I have solar! I had to threaten them with legal action (harrassment) to stop them contacting me (note: I read somewhere that this particular installer had imported many, many generic 6.6kW systems and so I guess that is why they wanted to install that size only)
Cheers,
What would you change after your install? Cheers in advance :)
@@Heshhion Not much really.
I had done my research and worked out what would work best for me. In my research/calculations, I assessed the previous 5yrs of electricity usage and what our overall needs are and will be to take the house off gas.
I would love a battery to capture the excess energy we produce (& sell for a pittance) and use that for ourselves, but the ROI (Return on investment) doesn't make sense at current battery prices.
I've just seen a 'community battery' on the news - this was in Sydney. I will be very interested in this concept if they bring it to the ACT. I would be quite happy to 'sell' my power to the battery at 8c/kWh and buy it back at (say) 16c/kWh. I'll wait and see what happens.
Have you calculated how much you will save on gas bills by replacing gas heaters with electric ones?
Thanks Finn another great presentation, and yes I have had a dodgy salesman ignore what I wanted and tried to sell me his superior system. He was most upset when I explained he was trying to sell me a Mini Minor when I wanted a Rolls Royce, he couldn't see that he had wasted one and hours of my life. The pretending to ring his manager to check the maximum KW of panels that the grid provider would allow nearly had him throw out the door.
I realise that 25kWh in a day is a Winter crop in Australia but with the current sunshine-palooza going on here in Manchester my 25kWh+ per day is making me smile non-stop.
My Panasonic battery cost $30,000 installed. It’s for 25kWh. The solar panels are also Panasonic, I recommend them.
Hey mate,
Can you please consider doing a video on Off-Grid systems, particularly for rural Aussies?
Cheers mate, thanks for sharing
Spite! I love it!! Never underestimate the non-financial payoff of an emotional purchase.
Very informative thank you
Enjoyed this video.
Somebody finally acknowledges the power of spite. Cutting off ones nose to spite one's face is real. Family member was ready to drop money on an overpriced quote (ended up helping them get a few more quotes from different companies to save 1/4 the first proposal) purely for never having to deal with their electric/gas provider ever again.
I had 54 good quality panels and inverter etc installed just over 12 months ago in Adelaide and recently had a "dark start" battery and hybrid inverter installed with one of your recommended SA installers and to be frank it's been a nightmare, and yes I sent you an email outlining my concerns and currently woking through a number of persistant issues. I now realise that when you do your due diligence and part of this was using information from Finn Peacock's site, you need to consult widely to be informed, don't just listen to the glossy brochure spiel or recommended installers.
Did you research failures in these batteries. I've come to believe that this is a considerable issue. At least that seems to be both my experience and all others with the same MAJOR band of battery. Mine does not work in backup mode (during a mains blackout) and since it is a firmware fault Apparently no others do also. Mine was upgraded for a reason unknown to me. I've been told it was a general widespread upgraded and apparently backup mode has not worked for some time. Mine had not needed backup mode since April 2023. It failure is not apparent since it only has effect during a blackout. The effect is for the battery to reports 0% SOC and provides 0.0000 kWh or power. The unit works without issue when mains power restores but does report some issues to the mobile app.
I'm still waiting for a solution 12 days later and advised it may take some weeks until a firmware upgrade will be available. One firmware upgrade was applied about a week into this but that did not work. The symptoms after the firmware change were identical to before the change.
My initial firmware version was 23.4.2-1 fe55682a 9:00 am, 9 June 2023 and the more recent installed 11:55 am, 9 June 2023 was 23.12.1 7ca1b02c. Neither of those worked properly. I believe that the "battery" had a different firmware version up until at least 4 April 2023 which seemed to work properly. It seems to take 2 to 3 hours to install a new firmware revision. It could be another problem but the OEM is telling the installer that the problem is only with the firmware.
I suggest you advise all owners to do a battery check by switch off mains at their fuse box at a frequency of between once a month and once every 3 months, depending on there reliance on backup power. To see the unit providing power and recharging during offpeak is zero indication of performance during a blackout. My experience may be a little different since major road works nearby may have caused more than 27 power interruptions in the last 18 months (since batteries were installed). Batteries handed first 26 of these but not the last one nor any of the 5 owner test since they failed.
I believe the "backup" battery sales pitch has always been a con job from the industry. They are not UPS... not even the Tesla
@@wapphigh5250 Why would you believe that domestic batteries "are not UPS?" A battery's islanding ability is dependent on how it is setup, and whether the inverter is capable of islanding.
Your statement is analogous to saying a commodore car is a con job, because it can't carry a 3 tonne load like the neighbour's traytop.
I have a BYD Atto 3. It has a power outlet capable of 2.2kw continuous. During the outage this last Saturday evening i ran a lead through the window into the kitchen and ran a portable induction cooktop, lights etc. One of my neighbours knocked on my door wondering how i still had power. Can't do that with a Tesla M3/MY.
What do you think of Dyness batteries? I’ve had a couple for a year and they work fine with my Solis inverter, in the UK.
Thanks for a great video. You are one of the few people mentioning the fire safyey hazzard. I have commented on this in a few other ESS You Tube channels. Normally there is a response that tjeir is now or very little risk. For sure the risk is maybe not huge but inte case of NMC batteries especially the outcome can be catastrpophic. The same of course goes for For an EV parked in a garge below your childrens bedroom.
Doing panels this fall and batteries in the next 12 to 18 months. If buying today I'd buy the Enphase 5Ps, but in 12+ months the new Tesla Power Wall 3 might be a game changer. Glad I have some time before I have to write the check.
How do I perform maintenance cleaning of my Franklin backup battery? I want to ensure there aren’t any dust or debris on the hot inverters.
Very interesting video, thank you. My personal feeling is that batteries are still too expensive, especially since the warranties are so much shorter than those for PV. I expect that the industry is still developing and that there are many more improvements to come in the next few years.
technology generally gets much cheaper over time....big arsed 70" TVs can be had for about $700, but used to cost multi $Ks. Same with batteries.
What energy monitor do you recommend?
Hi I love your videos. What do you think about Luna2000? Also could you keep 2 good fans going on the backup box?
Top vid!
Interesting you wouldnt recommend an LG. I was interested in the LG RESU 16KWh battery (is it due to it being a DC coupled battery? Even though they are said to be more efficient?). You are correct in saying it is a bit of a minefield trying to decide on the best option. My main concern is having enough power to actually charge the battery, no point buying a large system I can never fill each day.
Would you agree DC coupled for new installs and AC coupled for existing installs?
My reason was it allowed me to install a much larger amount of panels on the roof, without battery I could only get 6.6kw, with batteries I could get 9.3kw of panels! The cool thing is the inverter is DC coupled, so my system can over produce the 5kw AC because it uses DC to charge the battery in the morning, so on sunny mornings my system is using 8-9kw of free solar energy, then ramps down to the AC only value once the battery is fully charged.
Yes I have solar as well, the problem is batteries are not economical at current prices
please explain the the hard and software differences of a house and car battery. I can buy a 60kw/h blade battery off a crashed BYD for $3k nzd - why cant I use this from home storage?
My Powerwall 2 was installed start of August 2017 and the installation was nearly half the costs of what you said, and its been F ing brilliant, doing it's thing in my spare garage as happy as Larry.
I'm sure that there must be a drop in capacity, but its got to be small. I would really love more than my 5kw of solar from a 5kw fronius primo 5 , which is quite old and going great. Im getting 4.9out of a 5.22system with 7years on it. I need to use 18c cheap rate to top up the battery mid winter. I went 5years with zero bills even paying my gas bill heating bill with the FIT tariff, now with a halving of the FIT 6.2 and a 16c increase of the connection fee, there's no way that i can give them 17.7kw per day . I hate to think about the costs without my system.
Good timing! - there have been many Tesla PW2 price rises since then as per the graph half way down this blog post: www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/powerwall-prices-australia-mb2670/
Sounds like you should look getting rid of gas. The supply charge alone could go towards more panels if you have room
I am querying the placement of the battery in the video at about one minute .... I thought they must not be installed under the inverter! There are quite a few restrictions on where they can be installed I believe from previous reading.
AS5139 4.2.2.2 "...shall not be installed d) within 600mm of ... any appliance not associated with the ...BESS." The hybrid inverter is clearly associated with the BESS.
Wait, so do I need 20 extra panels just to charge up the battery storage??? (video reference- 6:00)
Can you pls assess Bluetti’s battery for solar? Thks
The Sonnen EVO 11kWh capacity, 10kWh usable is the fantastic choice for home battery based on the key points in this video presentaion by Finn.
I agree but does it stack up economically?
@@wapphigh5250 Depends on your solar array, your usage amount and patterns, your feed in tariff and grid power prices....etc etc. Hands you the calculator and watches.
I have solar, for about 4 or 5 years now. As far as I know the installation cost me $ 3,000 all up. I did not think that I even had one of those fangled batteries, but, there is some contraption in the car port which I thought was to do with hot water but it might be also some sort of electricity grid device. Not entirely sure because next of kin organised it all. In any case, I have never been in debit with electricity for the entire time and have since cashed cheques of $ 600 + and $ 500 +. I use one ninth of the electricity, on average, compared not only to any other household but also just about any other person.
Your contraption in the carport with the little LCD display is an inverter.... Wot converts the solar energy from the panels into 240V AC that you and the grid can use.
should roof top panels be earthed to the earth stake or fuse panel ?
Totally a battery question
Hi. I am new to solar and would like to install solar. Could you please let me know which company should I use? Is having a battery important? We mostly will be using power at night especially after work. Thanks so much.
What's your postcode?
What about batteries other than lithium? I have heaps of space, so I don't need the small form factor.
Thanks for the presentation. I would have appreciated your opinion on maximum and minimum inputs and outputs. In other words, is it ‘good practice’ to drain the battery to zero percent and charge it to 100%.
I have heard from some that leaving 20% and not charging to 100% will increase the life of it - or to put it another way, using it on a daily basis and using 100% of its capability can be detrimental to its life span. Thanks again for the presentation.
Great question - it depends on the battery chemistry, control software and nominal/usable capacity - so it's not really possible to give a general answer. I'll add it to the to-do list for a dedicated video/blog post though!
I have the 14.2kWh Redback battery/inverter system which will drain overnight to 20% if grid is on, but down to 10% if grid is down, in which case we would be extra careful what we used until it started generating the next day. If it can get pumped up to 100% during the day, it will be more than enough to last us through the night.
Discharging 100% is detrimental to battery life in any lithium technology battery. Rate of charge/discharge is a lesser factor.
Good practice would be 20% SOC. In fact, many/ most (possibly all) of the commercial offering for domestic use incorporate limitations on discharge level... where you see XXX KwH capacity, and then a figure for EFFECTIVE capacity which is lower. IE they self regulate, and when they stop supplying any power there is still some left in the battery.
@@franknyhuis6607 My kind of fella... what are you running there... some sort of time travel flux capacitor every night? Or is it another multi story no inner doors residence with AC permanently set to 25C in winter.
@@nateb3105 Sort of but... "Charging to a high voltage and discharging to a low voltage" is simply another way of saying charging to high SOC (state of charge) "capacity" and discharging to low SOC. Dunno if you were meaning to say charging and discharging at a high "C" rate, but not relevant compared to lead acid.
Lithium has a far lower self discharge rate than lead acid batteries. Lithium batteries in storage are NOT recommended to be fully charged first.
I recall a similar situation 20 years ago with rooftop "solar" water heaters. And rebates for those at the time > encouraging adoption. Everyone at that time joined the bandwagon. 15-20 years ago there were 4 maybe 5 manufacturers. Now there are 1? And the technology is obsolete?.. heat exchange water heaters being "all the rage". I have now removed 2 roof top solar water heater units off roofs, in the last 5 years ...as the technology failed, water damage occurred, units rusted etc.. access being a nightmare to remove and cost explosive to replace (given there is now no manufacturer competition). These have ended up going and the valuable sunny roof location will be used for solar electricity. So my WArnings are 1/ What technology is all the rage now, might not be the case within the life of the battery 2/ Yes : Site location is very VERY important (plan for the future very carefully) 3/ Rebates INCREASE prices (the industry pocketing the rebate due to reduced competition... They just load it silently and secretly onto the final price! ). I wish all government rebates went, so there was a proper "free" market to reduce prices ... beware and tread carefully IMO.
So to get this right.... 20 years ago you/ someone you met/ someone you met had met.... got a rooftop solar water heater. They had the financial benefit of that solar hot water for 15 or 20 years, and you're up in arms about it reaching the end of its life? Many owners forget the sacrificial anode technology which requires very infrequent attention.
What was the alternative 20 years ago.... an electric element hot water heater? Those never fail do they! Ahem. I'm guessing you're still driving great grandpappy's model A ford, and disdain any of these new fangled devices because they might wear out.
Your spray about rebates doesn't make sense. I'm guessing you'll be refusing the Small Scale Renewable Energy Scheme (SRES) rebates on the panels you are going to install on your empty roof space (those things which every rational person knows and accepts reduces solar panel prices down to the levels we have today.... a fraction of the cost of a few years ago)
No comparison with your solar heater bandwagon because Electricity bills are hitting sky high and batteries have started paying off much sooner than the video explains. Source: check Australian news for electricity price hikes.
Haha free market. I work in corporate. Free market is a lie.
Any comments on a senec system?
Clearly you are being very honest and clear about the benefits and issues. I agree with you. Many solar companies are being very dishonest.
I was quoted a tesla house battery for 22,000 and they take 8-12 months due to the backlog.
We upgraded from a 2.5kW solar system to a 13.5kW system last year..and OMG what a difference. We are considering adding a battery however we keep getting conflicting information. Our house for whatever reason is wired as 3phase.. we have had quoted from $9k - $20k for a system with different companies saying we either need a hydrid invertor to cover the 3 separate phases while another says we need 3 invertors one to cover each phase??? whats the truth about a battery system for something like this?
I have a 3-phase house with a one-phase battery - it works great. Here's a post that covers all the finer points of 3-phase homes and batteries: www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/home-batteries-3-phase/
Clearly each of your wall power points won't be 3 phase. Having 3 phace to your premises doesn't mean everything subsequent to your meter box is running 3 phase.
As another poster referred to, the 3 phase power is likely to be only driving your air conditioning. It may perhaps also be wired to your shed to run your big lathe, your giant bridgeport mill, and that huge arsed air compressor. That's not a problem, let them continue to run as they are now from the grid's 3 phase power, and run everything else off a single phase battery system, the same as it currently runs.
You can add Suness Lithium battery, discount and 5 years warranty
Thanks for information but I cannot understand the price of batteries, why so expensive. Getting solar plus batteries asap
Because battery technology is currently expensive.... see electric vehicles etc.
Solar panels and lithium batteries have come down in price a lot in the last 25 years.. like 80 to 90% I think.
Thanks for the info. Savings of 850 to 1000 per year will not pay itself back before warranty ends. On that fact I'm out.
Technology is getting so good now, it won't be long before your average home is Offgrid. Research into viability of going offgrid will be the next step IMHO.
Excellent but I live on a small farm and the power company wants $75.000 to put power on my farm I have been off grid for 7 years now with only a large forklift battery and a small generator with 22 solar panels but the battery is coming to the end of its life it’s a 24 volt system and I am looking to upgrade soon what’s the best option as all the options seem to come from the UK or the Us 😃
These "cheap" battery options as DEAD now thanks to overregulation of the solar industry
The specifications of a forklift battery are a bit like the length of a piece of string... in terms of voltage and amp hours. If it's 7 years old then it must be some type of lead acid battery, which is not as cost effective as lithium batteries now available. I'm guessing you've been looking at replacement lead acid. forklift batteries if you can only find something in the UK or US.
The price of solar panels has plummeted since your solar array would have been installed... 22 panels probably means something around 4.5Kw of solar, which is not a significant amount for a household with conventional habits living off grid. Panel degeneration isn't significant, so they should be fine but would be aided significantly by additional panels in a compatible setup.
You should find viable options with professional australian off grid technical advice (not from me) that would cost far far less than the power company's $75K, with cheaper ongoing cost, and little or no generator use.
@@wapphigh5250 This makes no sense... for a period there were/are cheaper battery options as a result of government subsidies, which is the opposite of overregulation.
Just working with the information you have provided: (considering your situation has been working for you for 7yrs, which is excellent for a lead acid battery!)
I would suggest you work out what the A/h (Amp hour) rating is for your forklift battery/ies and check the market for replacement/s. I assume you have 2x 12v lead acid batteries in the forklift.
Something you could look into is acquiring some 2v calcium deep cycle batteries - like they use in telephone exchanges. These get replaced often (as maintenance) so there are quite a few on the market - but you will need to buy at least 12 of them to make up a 24v system. There are several youtube tutorials on making battery banks.
Remember, Always use a fuse to protect your wiring!
I hope this helps.
Love the video, but I'm pretty sure it's lithium iRon (Fe) phosphate not "ion", probably a typo
"What is a lithium-ion battery? Lithium-ion is the most popular rechargeable battery chemistry used today. Lithium-ion batteries power the devices we use every day, like our mobile phones and electric vehicles. Lithium-ion batteries consist of single or multiple lithium-ion cells, along with a protective circuit board."
oops - well spotted! yes
@@jedbriimc9879 Good dictionary reference... but the key point here is that lithium "iron" (LiFePO4) is a subset of lithium ion batteries, many other versions (eg cobalt cathode technologies) are very different in fiery risk aspects.
TLDR I know you ordered barramundi for your main course sir, but it's a FISH.. I have served you a FISH... being carp.
3,000 for a 10 kwh solar battery, delivered to your door and 7,000 to hang it on a wall and plug it in?
Finn, Australia is winning at solar. We need help with heat pumps and replacing gas appliances like stove tops. It would be awesome for you to add more options for heatupumps and maybe induction cooktops on SolarQuotes.
Lmfao no WE ARE NOT you tree hugging freeeeeeek
So so many of this videos Buying Solar Batteries and moust of them who mention reason for buying mention BLACKOUT. What if you living in state where you have 0 blackout or preheps 1 to 2 in the midel of day for some maintinace reason and this lest up to max 30 minit. Izit still worted to buy solar panels + Solar Batteries? I did tray to find on google bot all I find is ths BLACKOUT 😡 Don't need this Solar Batteries for decoration purpes! Thank you for any usefull respond.
I’ve seen data on Teslas battery after 10 years and the degradation holds pretty flat
2years ago you said it want worth it and then I could of get a Tesla battery fitted for 6k snow it’s more than double the price
how do i double like this video?
Can you please do a guide to solar in WA. Is it even worth it now with almost no feed-in tarriffs. The cost has increase by 60-70% atleast since 2 years ago.
www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/solar-worth-it-perth/
I think this has been ask before BUT why do no solar salesmen mention anything about server rack batteries that use the same technology and BMS's and are half the price, you where talking 10KWH for about 10K+ and server rack batteries you could do for about 6 to 7K ??
Just my 2 cents worth
Cheers Mark
or even reuse of old technology like lead. Or second hand lead acid batteries from bank vaults etc
@@nateb3105 Yes overregulation is KILLING the solar industry 😒
@@wapphigh5250 chuckles.... there's enough inefficiencies and problems with new lead acid batteries! Not a problem fossicking about with old lead acid batteries if you're an enthusiast, but it's not an effective replacement for contemporary lithium.
Why do I say this? I've played around with different new and used lead acid battery banks... nearly 20KwH worth. It's been interesting and fun as an enthusiast, but would have broken the back and heart of anyone hoping it was a viable trouble free alternative.
There are many reasons lead acid is superceded... the prime but not the only one being lithium effectively has twice the capacity of lead, since more than 50% depth of discharge of lead will rapidly kill them. Then there's the higher internal resistance, meaning they take forevvvvver to fully charge, unlike the snappy lithium charge rates.
@@annpeerkat2020 I've read all your comments - you clearly don't get what I am saying. ALL the batteries listed here are 50-100% OVER the money to make them economically viable (rather than simply exporting excess power back to the grid). Even if you only use battery power to avoid peak rates.
@@wapphigh5250 I read everything you wrote, and every other poster. If you meant what you wrote I understood it.
When you say"EVEN if you only use battery power to avoid peak rates" suggests where the problem lies. You shouldn't be using battery power outside peak rates unless your operating hours are vampiric... you should be using solar power.
Battery should be used at peak hour rates time, giving nealy 50c/KwH saving per day (depending on your state and power rates)
Say 6KwH battery = $1100 per year (not taking into account guaranteed future price rises).
10+ years of use means $11K savings off power bill, with more years after that. How much was the battery initial cost again? Where's your calculator?
Risk of fire puts me completely off batteries.
Thank you for your informative and helpful vildeos.
Can you imagine a battery with up to 22kW charging and discharging power?
My Batterie has 32kWh and I load a EV with 11kW. My friend has the same Battery with only 12kWh capacity and he load his IONIC 6 with 11kW too, only from the Battery not from the Grid. The Battery you can buy are very bad, build it yourself.
Sorry to dump on your party, but my advice is to maximise household insulation, then install as many solar panels as you can afford & run the air conditioner during the day.
Vacuum tube solar hot water systems are super efficient & very cost effective.
My plan saves people a LOT of money, removes the potential threat of sales con artists, the volatility of power to grid returns & removes any fire risk.
Your insurance company will love you too.
Footnote : I am NOT in Australia so my 'cheap' situation noted here may not apply . BUT my intended point is to Think about what you Need versus what you are being 'sold' .
I would like to get a battery for reason 3 (1 and 2 are BS) but the batteries are still WAY TOO EXPENSIVE for that, so I may end up just add another solar system...
100% agree
I'm guessing reason 3 only applies to high usage cases? I doubt I'd ever breakeven, so I'll probably just install solar.
@@toby9999 not necessarily. In my case I produce more power than I consume but for the rigged system we have in place I still have to pay a bill… I would like to store the power and use it at night but the cost pf batteries is ridiculous! It would take roughly 12 years to repay themselves… but they only last 10 years 🙄
@@paolocardinali3951 I am in exactly the same position and 100% agree~ ! Prices need to about halve overall to make them viable. We need to ask ourselves why is it?... that in Australia ...with all the resources we have available... we aren't producing locally made home batteries for the domestic market? The answer in my opinion are 1/Over-regulation 2/Local business costs are too hi. Despite all the +ve government green initiatives. So why is that? The answer is we don't need more government "incentives".. we need governments in this country to stop spending on things that don't matter and start addressing why there is no true free market to drive prices down. It's a canary in the coal mine(literally) issue. JustMO
@@wapphigh5250 spot on mate! Less government in our lives and everything would be better! And utilities should NEVER be owned by foreign countries...
your missing the car i have a e.v. car and battery to store power while i am at work and charge the car at night
Noting your bat costs at present, it would be, no doubt, for the majority incredibly expensive. The outlay could never be recovered through savings on credits. You get more for a plastic bottle at an investment of $4.50 for .10c than $3000 on your roof at .7c. To spend between 5,000 and 20,000 on a battery for even five hours of storage is nuts. Solar buyers are about cost back in their pocket period. The environment is last on a smart persons list its about money in my pocket, not saving a bed bug. So, with technology and your sense of availability, would batteries get to the ballpark $2,500 with nine hours of stored power. You tend to waffle on, just talk about savings and cost. Your figure of $800-1000 a year saving with battery has to be wrong against investment, surely.
Get solar and then get a battery or 2. Power prices are going to continue to go UP and UP and UP. They are out of control. Each price rise makes batteries more economical. Just do it.
its spite for me lol
Where is the locally made product that stores about 10-13 kWh at a fully installed cost of no more than $5,000 AUD? (Cost per warranted kWh of 10-15c) only then will they be economically "viable". Just MO
@@nateb3105 Please link me some options. Thanks
Still not quiet worth it...
What a con job! Where did you get these crazy prices??? I installed 50kw for less than $20k, seems you're doing favorites fleecing the consumer.
Shucks... It wasn't that long ago that this bloke was telling everyone that it didn't make sense to get batteries...
It's almost as if things have changed in the Australian electricity market since 2015...
@@SolarQuotes It's almost as though I'm psychic then, isn't it? Or...I just read the tea-leaves better.
@@Qosmio1955 The best time to buy a battery is when it makes sense to buy a battery - not before.
also the grid should contain thorium nuclear - renewables are literally a waste - wind farms have been majorly exposed and though solar has benefits, solar farms are a burden to the environment and battery farms are endless money pits
Everything was good until you tarted talking about warranty- you should really be talking about Australian Consumer Law as it trumps warranty every time.
Did you see “to help us get to 100% renewable energy”? Australia is one of the worst fossil fuel users for electricity generation… are they not
what about the software, that's Tesla's big sell
Currently the ROI is around 12 to 15 years. This exceeds the warranty. Currently, not a single battery has lasted the warranty as they haven’t been in service long enough. Battery technology hasn’t been proven for this function. The current battery tech is highly dubious. They are prone to fires or explosion. The environmental damage is comparatively the same. You stop a coal mine you start a cobalt of lithium mine. It’s virtue signalling.
Compleet useless video .everyone here uses car batterys .far cheaper en wurks fine..same money but you have 50kw
There is no "environment" benefit from manufacture+use+disposal of batteries. Or solar panels.
So, 25 years of solar generation vs. 25 years of coal burning, and you think coal is cleaner? Seriously?
but they are recyclable into new batteries and panels so saving on a bit of mining
Compared to coal fired power, the benefits are considerable.
Coal isn't reusable & causes a lot of health problems, while PV & batteries can & are increasingly recycled.
@@guringai yup - www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/coal-vs-solar-mining/
Naive and incorrect. What's your motive grumpy? Shurely not a flat earther....
Disliked for being an anti social psychopath.