Oh man, this should be a required lecture in med school. We got some kind of big picture talks like “Don’t take kickbacks” but nothing about what it could look like in real life.
Don't take a gratuity. Period. If the doctor had not taken the gift cards and trips, he'd be playing golf and vacationing somewhere nice. My two cents is if he pleads guilty his wife will get probation but will remain charged with not all charges dropped. He will be given a prison sentence. It's in one's self interest to run for the hills if they hear the words "finders fee" or gratuity.
@@WhiteCollarAdviceOfficial That's an odd sentiment, here. My takeaway from the OP's comment was a PSA on _greed._ People that make several hundred thousand a year can afford "good" advice on whether or not what they want to do is legal. A "good" person doesn't ignore the burning question to the tune of $300K, and then suddenly act surprised.
All I can hope is that the day I self surrender is that all this powerful wisdom that I have been learning here and on Prison Professors resonates like a cannon and I can meet other people that are willing to do the work. Going to miss my family but will be looking forward to becoming a better person on the other side. Thanks again Justin for what you do.❤
When I think of 'gift cards' based on a Thank You, I think of $25 here or $50 there. Enough to get coffee or a meal. Conversely, if you're up to $300K in 'gifts,' you're obviously not just getting Thank You cards, anymore. That's more money than a lot of people have ever earned. The idea that the good doctor didn't know what he was doing wrong at that level of kickbacks, is preposterous. The best defense for him would be if he was issuing prescriptions equally across pharmacies. If he wasn't doing that, and there's more than one pharmacy in his town, than he _and his wife,_ who just so happened to work as a, "bookkeeper," both knew full well exactly what they were taking.
Of course he knew & his wife also knew., but I thought the wife worked in his office, not the pharmacy. This is just their “playing stupid” story and they are sticking to it.
@@lisamarielund6292 8:30: He said, "well, my wife worked there; she was a bookkeeper; she helped;" which I took to mean at the pharmacy. But you could be right. Normally, someone would say: _my wife works with me; at my office; she's my bookkeeper,_ if that was the case, instead. Nevertheless, it would be an interesting clarification, to be sure. But since she was also charged, the gifts and money would have passed through her hands, at some point. So, she can't very well play coy as the wife, while she was knowingly eating from the exact same trough as her husband.
I totally agee with you. I get the impression that the doctor is a narcissist so invested in his sense of entitlement that he believed he should continue to live a life of free gifts and get away with his lies under the guise of standing by his principles - and l don't believe every prosecutor wants to be on TV, or become a judge or flashy defense attorney. I know doctors like this individual, for whom l shed no tears, and a prosecutor who is fiercely devoted to sniffing out and prosecuting cyber pedophiles. Go feds go.
There is no excuse for physicians NOT to know the Stark Laws. Any in-kind or cash benefits for referrals of patients is absolutely illegal. Congress made it a felony punishable by prison sentence. I owned and operated my own Medicare Certified Surgical Center. If a clinical laboratory gave me a price break or didn't charge me for services because I sent them specimens, that would be a FELONY. It sounds like this doctor fell into that trap. My wife and I paid for our OWN vacations. Sanjosemike (no longer in CA) Retired surgeon
Great Channel! I applaud you for turning your painful experience into constructive guidance for others. This story, in particular, makes me cringe. As a recently retired “influential” physician who was identified (behind my back) by several pharmaceutical companies as a “KOL” (Key Opinion Leader), I was often invited to speak to colleagues at local, regional, national, and even international conferences. Although I was modestly compensated for my time and effort and there was NEVER a “quid pro quo” relation to my prescribing or referral patterns (yet, I clearly prescribed the products for which I advocated), it is FRIGHTENING that a self-serving prosecutor could initiate an investigation, make an assumption of violation of a statute, and initiate indictments which are nearly impossible to challenge or refute. While I’m sure there is financial loss due to fraud in the healthcare economy, physicians’ component is likely minimal (as in the case you presented). As you pointed out, the huge sacrifices and financial burden required to pursue a medical career, only to be then facing overregulation and threats of legal recourse, is likely influencing many excellent candidates with clinical skill sets to follow alternate paths. Is the pursuit of JUSTICE an illusion? צדק צדק תרדוף
Your firsthand knowledge offers valuable insights on this really tough issue. I have done this long enough to see both sides. It's crucial for doctors--any executive-- to recognize the fine balance between regulatory measures and maintaining the dignity of the medical profession. If it appears close, just run. There will never be enough upside to move into the gray zone. Thank you for watching and contributing to our community.
When the question on the table relates to independence or conflict of interest, one must consider them through two lenses: fact and appearance. If you are factually independent, but it appears otherwise, then you need to understand you're in for an uphill fight.
As someone who understands the medical system/industry - this guy may believe he's innocent but denial is not just a river in Egypt. At some level he knows he wasn't getting shipped to the Bahamas because of the "wisdom" he can impart at some conference. Of course he knows that at some level but maybe not at a conscious level. I've seen doctors drive 20 minutes each way to get a free lunch at the hospital worth what - $5 at the time? There is a sense of entitlement that is hard to convey. But the "honorarium" is a tried and true scam and at some level everyone "gets it". But this guy may be lying to himself as well as lying to the feds. Hard to say.
I support a trial 100 percent if innocence. If convicted I could live better with myself then selling out. We need to stop shaming and punishing people for exercising their constitutional rights.
@@walkyourdog6584 8:30: And his wife, who just so happens to also be the, "bookkeeper," is arguably even _more_ culpable, assuming the evidence shows that she used her position to enrich her husband, by signing off on kickbacks, raising the authorized kickback amounts, or worse yet, covering it up by manipulating the books altogether.
@mvpfocus I will give both the benefit of the doubt for being naive. But I think he needs to work with them and not go to trial. He could get a light sentence and his wife could avoid prison altogether.
@@walkyourdog6584 The fact that the wife worked as a 'bookkeeper' is highly unlikely to be a coincidence, here. That's the "money" department. Everything would have passed through her department. The fact that she was charged means that the government likely has evidence that she was possibly a vital crux of this scheme. So, while I agree that they should both cooperate, I don't think that she's the one that's likely to get off with a slap on the wrist, certainly not if she manipulated the purse strings in the furtherance of this scheme. Someone that runs the books for a living is going to be held to a higher standard, as well.
I do not have too much sympathy for this doctor. He is blinded by longtime privilege. This situation is exactly how the medical community actively contributed to the opiate addiction epidemic that has destroyed so many lives and has blighted our cities and communities. This is exactly the type of kickback that the drug manufacturers gave them. When I was employed by the USFS and my job entailed implementing projects contracted out, I could not even take a cold Coke on a hot day from any contractor employee. It was ABSOLUTELY forbidden.
Sometimes I disdain the US government
Oh man, this should be a required lecture in med school. We got some kind of big picture talks like “Don’t take kickbacks” but nothing about what it could look like in real life.
Well said. I’ve done some medical school events, but mostly it’s business schools.
Federal Government is out of control
Don't take a gratuity. Period. If the doctor had not taken the gift cards and trips, he'd be playing golf and vacationing somewhere nice. My two cents is if he pleads guilty his wife will get probation but will remain charged with not all charges dropped. He will be given a prison sentence. It's in one's self interest to run for the hills if they hear the words "finders fee" or gratuity.
It’s scary how many good people are in trouble.
@@WhiteCollarAdviceOfficial That's an odd sentiment, here. My takeaway from the OP's comment was a PSA on _greed._ People that make several hundred thousand a year can afford "good" advice on whether or not what they want to do is legal. A "good" person doesn't ignore the burning question to the tune of $300K, and then suddenly act surprised.
All I can hope is that the day I self surrender is that all this powerful wisdom that I have been learning here and on Prison Professors resonates like a cannon and I can meet other people that are willing to do the work. Going to miss my family but will be looking forward to becoming a better person on the other side. Thanks again Justin for what you do.❤
So happy to know our work helped you. You’re ready to go and make the most of the experience. Thank you so much for your note.
When I think of 'gift cards' based on a Thank You, I think of $25 here or $50 there. Enough to get coffee or a meal. Conversely, if you're up to $300K in 'gifts,' you're obviously not just getting Thank You cards, anymore. That's more money than a lot of people have ever earned.
The idea that the good doctor didn't know what he was doing wrong at that level of kickbacks, is preposterous. The best defense for him would be if he was issuing prescriptions equally across pharmacies. If he wasn't doing that, and there's more than one pharmacy in his town, than he _and his wife,_ who just so happened to work as a, "bookkeeper," both knew full well exactly what they were taking.
Of course he knew & his wife also knew., but I thought the wife worked in his office, not the pharmacy. This is just their “playing stupid” story and they are sticking to it.
@@lisamarielund6292 8:30: He said, "well, my wife worked there; she was a bookkeeper; she helped;" which I took to mean at the pharmacy. But you could be right. Normally, someone would say: _my wife works with me; at my office; she's my bookkeeper,_ if that was the case, instead. Nevertheless, it would be an interesting clarification, to be sure. But since she was also charged, the gifts and money would have passed through her hands, at some point. So, she can't very well play coy as the wife, while she was knowingly eating from the exact same trough as her husband.
I totally agee with you. I get the impression that the doctor is a narcissist so invested in his sense of entitlement that he believed he should continue to live a life of free gifts and get away with his lies under the guise of standing by his principles - and l don't believe every prosecutor wants to be on TV, or become a judge or flashy defense attorney. I know doctors like this individual, for whom l shed no tears, and a prosecutor who is fiercely devoted to sniffing out and prosecuting cyber pedophiles. Go feds go.
A piece of advice my immigrant father gave me, “you can only eat with one fork at a time”.
A lesson I’ve lived by which has served me well.
Thank you for sharing.
There is no excuse for physicians NOT to know the Stark Laws. Any in-kind or cash benefits for referrals of patients is absolutely illegal. Congress made it a felony punishable by prison sentence. I owned and operated my own Medicare Certified Surgical Center. If a clinical laboratory gave me a price break or didn't charge me for services because I sent them specimens, that would be a FELONY.
It sounds like this doctor fell into that trap. My wife and I paid for our OWN vacations.
Sanjosemike (no longer in CA)
Retired surgeon
They are going to make an example out of him in front of other doctors.As a pharmacist, we cannot even take pens from pharma companies.
Great Channel! I applaud you for turning your painful experience into constructive guidance for others.
This story, in particular, makes me cringe. As a recently retired “influential” physician who was identified (behind my back) by several pharmaceutical companies as a “KOL” (Key Opinion Leader), I was often invited to speak to colleagues at local, regional, national, and even international conferences. Although I was modestly compensated for my time and effort and there was NEVER a “quid pro quo” relation to my prescribing or referral patterns (yet, I clearly prescribed the products for which I advocated), it is FRIGHTENING that a self-serving prosecutor could initiate an investigation, make an assumption of violation of a statute, and initiate indictments which are nearly impossible to challenge or refute. While I’m sure there is financial loss due to fraud in the healthcare economy, physicians’ component is likely minimal (as in the case you presented). As you pointed out, the huge sacrifices and financial burden required to pursue a medical career, only to be then facing overregulation and threats of legal recourse, is likely influencing many excellent candidates with clinical skill sets to follow alternate paths. Is the pursuit of JUSTICE an illusion? צדק צדק תרדוף
Your firsthand knowledge offers valuable insights on this really tough issue. I have done this long enough to see both sides. It's crucial for doctors--any executive-- to recognize the fine balance between regulatory measures and maintaining the dignity of the medical profession. If it appears close, just run. There will never be enough upside to move into the gray zone. Thank you for watching and contributing to our community.
When the question on the table relates to independence or conflict of interest, one must consider them through two lenses: fact and appearance. If you are factually independent, but it appears otherwise, then you need to understand you're in for an uphill fight.
You are 100% right. It's downright scary.
You quoted Eric B and Rakim. You are my brother sir.
My son’s favorite song is Paid In Full!
He was low hanging fruit for prosecutors. Pure and simple.
As was his wife-she never should have been indicted.
As someone who understands the medical system/industry - this guy may believe he's innocent but denial is not just a river in Egypt. At some level he knows he wasn't getting shipped to the Bahamas because of the "wisdom" he can impart at some conference. Of course he knows that at some level but maybe not at a conscious level. I've seen doctors drive 20 minutes each way to get a free lunch at the hospital worth what - $5 at the time? There is a sense of entitlement that is hard to convey. But the "honorarium" is a tried and true scam and at some level everyone "gets it". But this guy may be lying to himself as well as lying to the feds. Hard to say.
I support a trial 100 percent if innocence. If convicted I could live better with myself then selling out. We need to stop shaming and punishing people for exercising their constitutional rights.
He thinks he is innocent, but he isnt if you listen to the story.
@@walkyourdog6584 8:30: And his wife, who just so happens to also be the, "bookkeeper," is arguably even _more_ culpable, assuming the evidence shows that she used her position to enrich her husband, by signing off on kickbacks, raising the authorized kickback amounts, or worse yet, covering it up by manipulating the books altogether.
@mvpfocus I will give both the benefit of the doubt for being naive. But I think he needs to work with them and not go to trial. He could get a light sentence and his wife could avoid prison altogether.
@@walkyourdog6584 The fact that the wife worked as a 'bookkeeper' is highly unlikely to be a coincidence, here. That's the "money" department. Everything would have passed through her department. The fact that she was charged means that the government likely has evidence that she was possibly a vital crux of this scheme.
So, while I agree that they should both cooperate, I don't think that she's the one that's likely to get off with a slap on the wrist, certainly not if she manipulated the purse strings in the furtherance of this scheme. Someone that runs the books for a living is going to be held to a higher standard, as well.
I do not have too much sympathy for this doctor. He is blinded by longtime privilege. This situation is exactly how the medical community actively contributed to the opiate addiction epidemic that has destroyed so many lives and has blighted our cities and communities. This is exactly the type of kickback that the drug manufacturers gave them.
When I was employed by the USFS and my job entailed implementing projects contracted out, I could not even take a cold Coke on a hot day from any contractor employee. It was ABSOLUTELY forbidden.
+1 for Rakim, very underrated rapper
A little confused why religion was part of your intro. Love your channel.
Thanks