Here in North India, beekeepers make Honey Vinegar locally. This is placed in a plastic bottle with a hole on the plastic lid. The brood chamber is then systematically squirted with the liquid all along the sides of each frame. The liquid trickles off the body of the bees. They have been doing this for years with success. If you cannot make honey vinegar you may use the usual sugar syrup with vinegar. I have tried this thrice this season. once before harvesting the honey and once after. The number of defective bees or dead larvae has gone down drastically.
I clicked like . .I clicked subscribe and your Powder Sugar treatment (as i seen it as ) is so effective and non intrusive . .I can respect your efforts in keeping your hives naturally healthy proactive approach . great team work . . .
Thanks for the video. I’ve attended beekeeping meetings where studies were discussed regarding varroa. Some treatments have modest to very limited effectiveness. I listened to both U of Minn & Georgia folks. They are kind in their comments and say doing something is better than nothing. That said screened bottom boards & powdered sugar fall in that category. I had hoped sugar would have a better result. The universities did extensive work and I have to admit I was impressed concerning the depth of their studies. Since varroa are mainly located in capped brood it is very rare to see them on a cell, frame or bee. Wish I could rave about this. So far using hopguard and Oxalic acid. Have used apiguard in past years. As is always stated, there are many ways to do a task.
Very well put. Something is better than nothing and applying powder sugar should NOT be the only thing you do to a hive and you certainly don't have to do it at all. We use it as part of our IPM processes and our bees do well, so we just want to let others know they could try it as well :)
Well you said you've been doing it for 12 years . If the study didn't cover many years , maybe it's the training over time. You can bet I'll be trying it for a while.
I am a new bee keeper this 16th July. I really liked you video and the fact that no chemicals are used to keep your bees healthy. It always been said prevention is better that a cure and I feel strongly that you have succeeded in preventing a problem before it takes hold. I think your method is well worth copying especially not knowing for definite that these bees are infected or not. I have seen two minute beetles that are definitely not red so whether they are varroa or not is very disconcerting to a new beekeeper. Due to seeing only two insects I intend to stock up on icing sugar and give them a light dusting as per your instructions.. Once they have had there first dust bath I feel sure they'll look forward to seeing me again when I approach them with the shaker! Three dust baths to come..... and best bit is no harm done....
As you can see, opinions for beekeeping can vary widely and everyone will give you their 2 cents, whether you ask for it or not haha. Do what you think works best for you. Always try to improve and test. Try to record the results of your treatments so you know what works better than another. Beekeeping can be different for people depending on geographical location, methods they use to beekeep, etc. In the end, it's your beekeeping journey, not others.
@@HoneyandHome I've just seen the reply =thank you.... A contributor to a forum last year was rather sarcastic and now I see why he was. He said all the icing sugar 'dustings' will not reveal what is really happening re Varroa and he was I feel right to say that. I never saw one mite for 6 months despite two really good dustings as well as having a stainless open mesh floor and catch tray from day one. Then I saw two dead bees on the floor with DWV. I immediately thought 'varroa.' It was 5th December 21. After 2 gram of fumigation delivered by my DIY but efficient contraption at 157C I counted 60 mites after three days. This I concluded was a better indication of the true picture of those horrible parasites hurting the bees. I now see there is even ,what I feel is a more effective method of control publicised by Randy Oliver and other astute 'thinking' beekeepers in the method of the 'strips' loaded with glycerine and Oxalic acid. The other day I was told by a very good beekeeper in Wales who I've bought beautiful honey from for years that 'you are not allowed to make your own 'things' for the treatment of bees.' I said it's typical that after all the thinking beekeeper is intent on doing what is best for the bees although it may not yet be within the legislation. I would ask = who's fault is that?
Some one said on a forum about beekeeping that the icing sugar method was not conducive of what is going on re varroa mite infestation. He was quite abrupt in saying if you don't see any after dosing with icing sugar they are still there. After using illegal oxalic acid and glycerine strips I have come to the conclusion that this method does kill all the varrao. I base my opinion on the fact that after two dustings of icing sugar last year that did not shift a single mite and dispite a vigorous fumigation with 4 gram of oxalic acid, some mites survived till this year. A month ago + one week I put in two 'strips' of oxalic acid and glycerine as per Randy Oliver's data. Within one month from 50+ drop per day at the beginning to 6 mites in two weeks and then NIL mite drop after a week I would evaluate that the 'strip' method works when the icing sugar did not. A caring beekeeper by the name of Harris says = this may be the silver bullet we have been hoping for' I now am very much inclined to believe him whole heartedly. I now feel the icing sugar is better on cakes than on bees. If the icing sugar works for certain individuals then great, but it did not work for my bees who must have been irritated by those terrible mites. Another plus is that I have seen not one bee with Deformed wing virus, as opposed to last December when I saw 2 dead with that virus. Although I saw not one single mite for 6 months I did see two dead with the virus Dec 5th 2021 so immediately used my contraption that delivers the oxalic acid fumes that does kill varroa but I might add -not all the varroa in the hive could have been killed. it's interesting to note that some scientific researchers on oxalic acid sublimation recommend 6 doses at 4 gram a time 3-4 days apart..... Wow.
I found this very helpful. I have mites on the screenboard, but alcohol washes are showing very few mites. My guess is that my bees are good at pulling the mites off. I'm about to use Apivar but I really want to avoid that, so I'm going to try this for a few days and see if I can get the screenboard count down.
great super great video ---mites --ok please post SHB video how you treat natural method next questions is ok sure mites fall through the screen on the ground --now would not the mites jump back into the hive
Yes, so put a sticky board under your hive so the mites fall off, down through the bottom screen board and get stuck on the sticky board. This also helps see how successful the treatment was because you can see the results. I would use a sticky board under you screen bottom every time you do a treatment, no matter what kind, so you can see your results. Some will be better than others :)
Oxalic strips are used extensively in NZ. A mixture of 40% oxalic acid and 60% glycerine is heated up to 60 degrees in pan ~ no more heat or it starts to turn into formic acid. Once colour is clear which shows glycerine has mixed with the oxalic acid, it can be poured on the special hardened cardboard strips. Strips are dipped in solution, then taken out of container llowed to dry for a day then draped over brood frames. three or four strips may be used on each brood box every second frame. Oxalic acid being a naturally formed acid in certain plants gets on the bodies of mites and kills them. Replace strips every six weeks. It is very effective in keeping mite to very low count and has benifit of keeping isease down too. Look up NZ oxalic strips and how to control Varroah...
Yes, you can have a LOT of Varroa in your hives and never see them. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they aren't in there. We definitely have lost bees due to Varroa, but the numbers are far less when we follow a solid IPM system of treating for them to keep their numbers down.
Loved seeing this! Please reach out to Just Alex and let him know about this. He's got a very large channel and bees. I suspect he'd love to learn about this.
I heard you say you never see any varroa mites---For the most part, none of us ever do. But trust me when I say this, all beehives nowadays have varroa. Either the bees themselves have learned methods to cope with it, or they have become VSH (Varroa Sensitive Hygienic,) but all hive have them. Also, be very careful adding that much powdered sugar--unless you are blending it yourself. Powdered sugar contains high levels of starch, and it will constipate your bees.
I believe this is the best if you use screen bottom board so mites can't get back up,slowest way to treat, fastest way is fogging these two ways no chemicals in the honey
I agree, you are not getting the worst of the mites. They do live mainly under the belly in the scales of the bees feeding on the fat body of the bee eventually killing it. You need to do a varroa alcohol test to kill the mites and count the amount of them.
@@nicoleannebecker1548 I am so happy to report I have yet to count or see for that matter, a single mite in my hive!!!! My hive is here in NYC and more than likely miles away from another other hive. I even pulled out a frame that had both drone and worker bee cell the other day and opened up 100 of them and did not see a single mite. I believe it is due to two parts. One, I ordered a "small-cell hygienic queen," as well as every 12 days or so, I feed them Reishi Mushroom Extract. It is amazing.
Just curious if this is what you guys still do? I just started keeping bees, first spring, first year and so I want to do it as natural as possible. This looks like it would not only be easy, but safe and best for my bees.
I make my own powdered sugar. Granulated sugar and my Vitamix blender. Approximately 1/2 C. Of granulated sugar blend and voi la. Note. It clumps pretty quick in a dry jar so I run it through a filter each time I use it.
What is the effect of missing all the foragers which are out of the hive? Have you tried doing this in the late evening to make sure you get them as well?
We do Drone Frames, Oxalic Acid, Powder Sugar dustings and Drone brood checks regularly. If Varroa gets too bad, we'll use Apivar or some other related strips in the hive. They key is, no matter what you use to try and control Varroa, to rotate treatments. Don't use the same one over and over and when you do treat, try and record the results, so you know which ones work better than others.
We did an icing sugar powdering of our new in July this year bees and saw no varroa next couple of days on the sticky board under the stainless mesh floor. I spoke with the bee breeder who sold me the bees and he said some hives have the varroa some do not have it. In the UK it is legal to use a certain oxalic acid treatment but that has another ingredient in it and is not for vaporisation. I would have thought that a vapour is more effective instead of squirting fluid onto the bees. I would think that Frederick Dunn is the expert to copy if indeed any varroa are actually seen. I treatment is advised, I see on new years day! If I don't see any varroa although I've manufactured the vaporiser,they will not be 'vaped'! There is a research chap south of England who sells 'hygienic' bees but no answer to his emails?
You say you do this once in the spring and once in the summer and twice in the fall. How soon in the spring do you do this and what time in the summer and when in the fall and how far between the two treatments in the fall? Would it be good to do this powder sugar dusting on newly installed package bees? Do you have a list of videos you do talking about all the non toxic, chemical free treatments you use such as this one? I refuse to use any chemicals and medications in my bees but am struggling to be a successful beekeeper.
It is pretty hard to get them all the first time, especially if you are doing it alone. Getting a bulk of the bees will help, next time around changes are good you'll hit some of them you missed the first time :)
Wonderful video! You said you saw 1 beetle in several years ... since you use this as part of an integrated approach, how do you know how effective the sugar treatment is as compared to your other treatments? Do you notice a difference between using sugar with regular Italian bees and bees that have hygienic characteristics.
George Garcia we use sticky board at the bottom of the hives after any treatment to make sure we actually see results from all our different treatment approaches. Different approaches target different areas, like the drone brood frames we use, those target Varroa reproduction under the capped cells as opposed to our sugar dusting or oxalic acid treatments which are more focused on the mites physically attached the the bees. And just to clarify, you said beetle, but I am assuming you meant mite not beetle as this is a treatment for mites :)
I'm sure this method is very effective. But the draw back that I see here. It's very time consuming. Going frame by frame when especially when you have two deep 10 frame brood boxes. With massive loaded bees in each frame. In your video clip. I guess it's okay when there's less bees roaming in the brood box. You can get away with this method. My preference and less time consuming is the Formic Pro strip method. Very effective and the efficacy is between 90-99%. And when you have a loaded colony. The bees will take care the 1-3% rest of mites. So simple and less invasive on the bees. Just place the opened strips on top of brood frames. The supers are safe from contamination and left on during treatment.
Thank you very much for the video. Well done! My question- Do you normally do these treatments early morning or late afternoon to get as many bees covered or does it matter?
Hi, I'm a new"bee" at this and this is a really old vid. I'd treat them when it's cooler out and they're more likely to be inside watching TV. I don't think time of day matters. These guys are great. Hope this helps!
Just happened to see. Most hives will get Varroa, only a matter of time and if they do get them, we're treating anyway, so matter how many we see in a wash. Washes help you determine how bad the mite load is getting and can be helpful, but we treat with our rotating IPM method all season anyway, so load isn't as big of a deal to us.
I was recently researching sugar syrup alternatives (and finding that I should ONLY be using regular ole granulated sugar...). I remember that it specifically urged not to use baking-use powdered sugar since it contains cornstarch as an anti-caking agent. I read in these comments that you believe the bees are consuming very little, but merely cleaning it off. But have you tried finding a powered sugar without this additive, or can you comment on the issue of cornstarch in the mixture?
Do you do any mite washes any time of year? How much powered sugar per box are you using? What's your winter survival rate? What is the honey production per hive? How many hives do you have? Is powdered sugar the only varoa managment method you use?
Hello Matt! We do mite washes occasionally, but our treatment methods are pretty standard and we do them regularly, despite mite loads in our hives, just to stay on top of it. The powder sugar isnt really measured, we just add a very fine dusting on the bees, not a thick coat. We average a 70% survival rate out of several hundred hives. Honey production isn't affected by mite treatments, as long as the different methods (like drone brood frames) are done properly and at the right times. Powdered sugar is not the only method. Any good IPM plan will rotate treatments in hives in order to hit the Varroa at different stages of their life cycle and to not allow resistance build up. We use power sugar, drone brood frames, Oxalic Acid, brood gaps, mineral foggers (to name a few) and occasionally strips if we are having a particularly stubborn hive. Rotating your methods and measuring how effective they are is key! Thank you for commenting!
@@HoneyandHome ok you might want to amend or put a disclaimer on this video because it gives the impression that this powered sugar treatment is all it takes to keep varoa in check which is false and by your own words isn't what you do. I run several hundred colonies and sell up to 500 nucs a year. I teach intro to beekeeping by the scientific studies and hard data over decades of research. We have 65-95%survival rates depending on the year and treatment method(s) used that year.
Yo what he said I don’t even own a beehive yet trying to do research so I know what I’m getting into and you had me fooled. You never use anything but powdered sugar as far as chemicals and now you’ve changed your stance.
@@HoneyandHome there's a company that makes an enclosed screened bottom board with an aluminum tray included. I used it back in 2017 with a Minnesota Hygeinics colony and had exceptional success. I know Hygeinics already groom on a regular basis but even after the mites will have dropped through a normal screened bottom board they can return. I filled the aluminum tray with Organic Diatomaceous Earth early on and then again about 2 weeks before late fall. When I checked the tray on 1st warm day of year it contained 1000s of mites and 100s of shb's. The screen and enclosed bottom board prevented bees from interacting with the deadly diatomaceous earth blades.
Around 3:00-4:00 mark you say you don't use chemicals, yet you posted this below " Honey and Home 2 years ago We also use oxalic acid treatments and occasionally Api Var Life"
i need to know all rhe kone chemical for my two hives. i ask other bee keepers and they are all against it. i lice in Florida and cant do the heat strips cas its to hot here. i will be doing this method for sure. it sucks cas im the only one that deals with the bees, tow people ugh
So I’m not much of a cook so forgive a possible dumb question all the powdered sugar I can find has corn starch in it is that ok to use or do I need to look further
Some Gefen Confectioners Sugar doesn't have corn starch, but most do. We use any type of powdered sugar without any issues, so I would say, based on our own usage, it doesn't matter much.
Nope. At most you may find some cells with a little sugar in them if you pull honey close to when you did a treatment. Remember you are putting a VERY light dusting of powder sugar on the bees, do NOT load them up with it or you'll make issues.
Hello In France, this method is not used or recommended. but I still want to test because my colonies are not very infested. I read that this method kills open brood, is this true? do you only use this method or do you supplement with oxalic/formic acid or thymol? Thank for sharing !
Hi Nest! We always rotate our methods for mite treatment. This just happens to be one of the many ways we try to control populations. Good IPM (Integrated Pest Management) should always rotate treatments to his mite life cycles at sifferent time. We have not noticed brood problems after treatments. We try hard to get the powers on the bees and not the frames as well. If there are any issues from this treatment, they are so minor we don't notice them.
How well are you able to have winter survival rates from powdered sugar methods like this? Can you consistently year to year get over 70% winter survival? Or more? I'd be highly interested in even a decent survival rate, and not expecting perfection. There's just the hope that something will work, especially when you hear about other people losing colonies in spring first inspections. You said you do this in spring, summer, and 2x in fall...its hard to perceive why it works to only do it that much? What would you do between those time periods? Will your method fail if someone isn't using a screened bottom, or a bottom where the mites can fall out of the bottom when knocked off by the bees?
Not sure it matters. It is just a matter of putting very thin dusting of sugar on the bees in order to stimulate grooming in the hive and to make it harder for the Varroa to stay attached. I would use the one that is the finest, if you see a difference at all.
How do you test for varroa mites? Do you use the most accurate method of an alcohol wash? I stopped watching at 2:39 because you said most varroa mites attach to the back of the bees. I've read multiple places, and heard the people in charge of the University of Nebraska at Lincoln Bee Lab say most of the mites attach themselves on the underside of the bees. The bee lab doctors are beekeepers. They say the powdered sugar control method isn't very effective because most mites are safe inside sealed brood cells busy multiplying.
We treat our hives with almost every method out there. Powdered sugar is just one method of a total Integrated Pest Management Plan (IPM). We have seen good results from doing this method as we put sticky boards under the screen bottoms so we can see what mites have fallen off or been removed via grooming. There are lots of methods to treat for Varroa and any good IPM rotates these methods to hit the Varroa in a every part of its life cycle possible. These methods has proven to work for us, so they remain a part of our regiment. I cannot speak to the Varroa attaching to the underbelly, as this information seems to be changing often as new science is published, but it was part of our training as Master Beekeepers from the University of Montana. While I am sure they can attach in many places, we seem to see them on the backs of the bees when we encounter them in our hives. Thanks for the comments!
I heard that this has worked for 12 years but then read you use other methods? What other methods are used, I got excited thinking this would be all I needed
Simply Garden no big concerns. We try not to put it on very thick, just a thin dusting to encourage grooming. We have done this process on our farm for about 10 years now and it has been a great addition to our mite arsenal.
I noticed you instructed that a 'fine dusting' is required in the treatment@@HoneyandHome Do good pastry cooks know more about a 'fine dusting' and maybee more adept at dispensing a fine dusting with a very fine sieve? I will follow your instructions and get my wife to operate the dusting procedure when we do the next inspection. Many who eat with us over the years pay her many a compliment because she is a brilliant cook. A story is that our son blew the candles out on his birthday cake and the area and others sitting opposite were engulfed in a cloud of icing dust. I think your idea is the best one since sliced bread. I'm an engineer and always want to cure problems. I see that some bee keepers are worried about getting the icing sugar into the comb. Would that problem be partially avoided by 'angling' the combe so that the dust is delivered at an angle to the comb, still getting onto the bees but not directly at 90 degrees to the comb surface? I worry about the bees eyes in this process but when a bee is seen forraging the pollen is all over the bee and the bee cannot possibly avoid getting the pollen dust over it's eyes. A bee is one of the most remarkable creatures that's for sure. They deserve the utmost careful handling don't they.
Depends, it is a little different from year to year. Generally, we have about 70% survival rate. Some years better, like this last year. We lost three hives out of 45 and it was probably because those were late swarms, but we still wanted to try and save them!
Love the idea of powder coating, I have to admit I tried the other way of coating the top of the frames.also what's your view on using oxalic acid with a vaporiser
Shaun Barker oxalic acid and vaporizer are also good methods. We don't use them, but many of our customers do and they have good success with them. They would be good preventatives as well and can be rotated with the powder sugar method. Thanks for the comments! :)
jackbquick123 I know many beekeepers that use them. I personally have not, so all I can go by is what others say and they seem to like it with comparable sucess to other preventative methods. It really is up to each individual and what they are comfortable doing and if they think it works. To my knowledge there is no definitive scientific study on the use of foggers and mineral oils in the hive, so if it works, keep doing it :) Thanks for the comment!
@@HoneyandHome Dear Shaun Barker. I noticed and others should take note that you saw one mite in years...... That's good enough for me but why it seems it's not good enough for other watchers of your excellent video. The old saying is as true as ever = Seeing is believing! Your results one would say 'speak for themselves in that your 'system' works....... You obviously are very concerned about the ethics of bee keeping and are passionate about your bees and their well being. You cannot please everybody and it is chancy sticking your head above the trench and especially so if your ideas are original. Your endeavour to help is admirable =Thank you so much. It pays to always keep an open mind, but I don't need to tell you that!
It is best to make your own powdered sugar. The store bought stuff has corn starch to prevent clumping and the bees can't digest that. Just put 1/2 cup or so of regular sugar in your blender and turn it on high for about 30 seconds or so. When it's nice and powdered, sift it through a fine sieve to get out any big bits and you're good to go.
I'm in Indiana. So timely. Did a couple inspections, but lovethis idea.
Newbie with the bees i've certainly learned alot Hooray for u tube Thank You.
Thank you. I wish we had more time to keep kicking videos out. Will try to add some more in 2024.
Here in North India, beekeepers make Honey Vinegar locally. This is placed in a plastic bottle with a hole on the plastic lid. The brood chamber is then systematically squirted with the liquid all along the sides of each frame. The liquid trickles off the body of the bees. They have been doing this for years with success. If you cannot make honey vinegar you may use the usual sugar syrup with vinegar. I have tried this thrice this season. once before harvesting the honey and once after. The number of defective bees or dead larvae has gone down drastically.
WOW that's awesome. What's the name of this method?
Can I get more info on this?
What is the ratio? Thank you, have a good day.
Mist bottle with sugar water works better than a smoker. And it reduces mites and helps prevent robbing.
Would that cause mold
I clicked like . .I clicked subscribe and your Powder Sugar treatment (as i seen it as ) is so effective and non intrusive . .I can respect your efforts in keeping your hives naturally healthy proactive approach . great team work . . .
It was just a great video! Really needed the support in not using chemicals and other options to deal with the mites. Thank you)))
Gary did you find this preventative to work well?
Thanks for the video. I’ve attended beekeeping meetings where studies were discussed regarding varroa. Some treatments have modest to very limited effectiveness. I listened to both U of Minn & Georgia folks. They are kind in their comments and say doing something is better than nothing. That said screened bottom boards & powdered sugar fall in that category. I had hoped sugar would have a better result. The universities did extensive work and I have to admit I was impressed concerning the depth of their studies.
Since varroa are mainly located in capped brood it is very rare to see them on a cell, frame or bee.
Wish I could rave about this. So far using hopguard and Oxalic acid. Have used apiguard in past years.
As is always stated, there are many ways to do a task.
Very well put. Something is better than nothing and applying powder sugar should NOT be the only thing you do to a hive and you certainly don't have to do it at all. We use it as part of our IPM processes and our bees do well, so we just want to let others know they could try it as well :)
Well you said you've been doing it for 12 years .
If the study didn't cover many years , maybe it's the training over time.
You can bet I'll be trying it for a while.
Amazing. Thanks for this. I don't like using chemicals and this seems win-win
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. Best to you and your bees.
Great video!
Great video. Going to try my first powder sugar dust tomorrow (7/13/24) . You are fantastic teachers!
Be carefull of what you wish for.
I am a new bee keeper this 16th July. I really liked you video and the fact that no chemicals are used to keep your bees healthy. It always been said prevention is better that a cure and I feel strongly that you have succeeded in preventing a problem before it takes hold.
I think your method is well worth copying especially not knowing for definite that these bees are infected or not. I have seen two minute beetles that are definitely not red so whether they are varroa or not is very disconcerting to a new beekeeper.
Due to seeing only two insects I intend to stock up on icing sugar and give them a light dusting as per your instructions.. Once they have had there first dust bath I feel sure they'll look forward to seeing me again when I approach them with the shaker!
Three dust baths to come..... and best bit is no harm done....
Big difference between mites and beetles. Imho if you don't want to be continually buying bees, save your powdered sugar for Christmas cookies.
As you can see, opinions for beekeeping can vary widely and everyone will give you their 2 cents, whether you ask for it or not haha. Do what you think works best for you. Always try to improve and test. Try to record the results of your treatments so you know what works better than another. Beekeeping can be different for people depending on geographical location, methods they use to beekeep, etc. In the end, it's your beekeeping journey, not others.
@@HoneyandHome I've just seen the reply =thank you.... A contributor to a forum last year was rather sarcastic and now I see why he was. He said all the icing sugar 'dustings' will not reveal what is really happening re Varroa and he was I feel right to say that.
I never saw one mite for 6 months despite two really good dustings as well as having a stainless open mesh floor and catch tray from day one.
Then I saw two dead bees on the floor with DWV. I immediately thought 'varroa.' It was 5th December 21. After 2 gram of fumigation delivered by my DIY but efficient contraption at 157C I counted 60 mites after three days.
This I concluded was a better indication of the true picture of those horrible parasites hurting the bees.
I now see there is even ,what I feel is a more effective method of control publicised by Randy Oliver and other astute 'thinking' beekeepers in the method of the 'strips' loaded with glycerine and Oxalic acid.
The other day I was told by a very good beekeeper in Wales who I've bought beautiful honey from for years that 'you are not allowed to make your own 'things' for the treatment of bees.'
I said it's typical that after all the thinking beekeeper is intent on doing what is best for the bees although it may not yet be within the legislation.
I would ask = who's fault is that?
Thank you. I like your method
What an absolutely brilliant idea
Some one said on a forum about beekeeping that the icing sugar method was not conducive of what is going on re varroa mite infestation. He was quite abrupt in saying if you don't see any after dosing with icing sugar they are still there. After using illegal oxalic acid and glycerine strips I have come to the conclusion that this method does kill all the varrao.
I base my opinion on the fact that after two dustings of icing sugar last year that did not shift a single mite
and dispite a vigorous fumigation with 4 gram of oxalic acid, some mites survived till this year.
A month ago + one week I put in two 'strips' of oxalic acid and glycerine as per Randy Oliver's data.
Within one month from 50+ drop per day at the beginning to 6 mites in two weeks and then NIL mite drop after a week I would evaluate that the 'strip' method works when the icing sugar did not.
A caring beekeeper by the name of Harris says = this may be the silver bullet we have been hoping for'
I now am very much inclined to believe him whole heartedly.
I now feel the icing sugar is better on cakes than on bees. If the icing sugar works for certain individuals then great, but it did not work for my bees who must have been irritated by those terrible mites. Another plus is that I have seen
not one bee with Deformed wing virus, as opposed to last December when I saw 2 dead with that virus.
Although I saw not one single mite for 6 months I did see two dead with the virus Dec 5th 2021 so immediately used my contraption that delivers the oxalic acid fumes that does kill varroa but I might add -not all the varroa in the hive could have been killed. it's interesting to note that some scientific researchers on oxalic acid sublimation
recommend 6 doses at 4 gram a time 3-4 days apart..... Wow.
I found this very helpful. I have mites on the screenboard, but alcohol washes are showing very few mites. My guess is that my bees are good at pulling the mites off. I'm about to use Apivar but I really want to avoid that, so I'm going to try this for a few days and see if I can get the screenboard count down.
Hi. What where your results?
Wow, this is very interesting. Thank you,
great super great video ---mites --ok please post SHB video how you treat natural method next questions is ok sure mites fall through the screen on the ground --now would not the mites jump back into the hive
Yes, so put a sticky board under your hive so the mites fall off, down through the bottom screen board and get stuck on the sticky board. This also helps see how successful the treatment was because you can see the results. I would use a sticky board under you screen bottom every time you do a treatment, no matter what kind, so you can see your results. Some will be better than others :)
My first year I like the idea and will try it Canadian here Alberta
Oxalic strips are used extensively in NZ. A mixture of 40% oxalic acid and 60% glycerine is heated up to 60 degrees in pan ~ no more heat or it starts to turn into formic acid. Once colour is clear which shows glycerine has mixed with the oxalic acid, it can be poured on the special hardened cardboard strips.
Strips are dipped in solution, then taken out of container llowed to dry for a day then draped over brood frames. three or four strips may be used on each brood box every second frame.
Oxalic acid being a naturally formed acid in certain plants gets on the bodies of mites and kills them. Replace strips every six weeks.
It is very effective in keeping mite to very low count and has benifit of keeping isease down too.
Look up NZ oxalic strips and how to control Varroah...
Yes, I would agree. Oxalic is the very best way to go IMO these days.
Great info, thanks for sharing
Just confirming that with hardly ever seeing mites on your bees, you’ve never had a colony loss to Verona mites? Thanks for the video!
Yes, you can have a LOT of Varroa in your hives and never see them. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they aren't in there. We definitely have lost bees due to Varroa, but the numbers are far less when we follow a solid IPM system of treating for them to keep their numbers down.
@@HoneyandHomewhats de meaning of IPM?
@@cecigreeneyes Integrated Pest Management
@@EVogel007 thank you
Great video! Thank you so much!
This is great information. What about waxx worms ?
SO this doesn't actually kill the mites just makes them drop off, what is to stop them from getting right back on?
Screened bottom board
Try dusting with Strong Microbials instead of powdered sugar. Strong Microbials does the same thing but it offers the bees probiotics.
Where do you get the strong microbials?
Loved seeing this! Please reach out to Just Alex and let him know about this. He's got a very large channel and bees. I suspect he'd love to learn about this.
I heard you say you never see any varroa mites---For the most part, none of us ever do. But trust me when I say this, all beehives nowadays have varroa. Either the bees themselves have learned methods to cope with it, or they have become VSH (Varroa Sensitive Hygienic,) but all hive have them.
Also, be very careful adding that much powdered sugar--unless you are blending it yourself. Powdered sugar contains high levels of starch, and it will constipate your bees.
You are correct, visually seeing Varroa is not the way to determine if you have them or what the load count is.
I believe this is the best if you use screen bottom board so mites can't get back up,slowest way to treat, fastest way is fogging these two ways no chemicals in the honey
Thing is, if your doing mite counts just with sight, you cannot always see them. They live in drown cells, and under the belly of worker bees.
I agree, you are not getting the worst of the mites. They do live mainly under the belly in the scales of the bees feeding on the fat body of the bee eventually killing it. You need to do a varroa alcohol test to kill the mites and count the amount of them.
@@nicoleannebecker1548 I am so happy to report I have yet to count or see for that matter, a single mite in my hive!!!! My hive is here in NYC and more than likely miles away from another other hive. I even pulled out a frame that had both drone and worker bee cell the other day and opened up 100 of them and did not see a single mite. I believe it is due to two parts. One, I ordered a "small-cell hygienic queen," as well as every 12 days or so, I feed them Reishi Mushroom Extract. It is amazing.
Thanks. Very interesting method. I will try it with my bees.
🛫📖🛬
Fantastic video; so very informative!
Thank you very much for sharing.
📖🛐✈️🐆
I’m in the northeast. When do you recommend to do this method?
Just curious if this is what you guys still do? I just started keeping bees, first spring, first year and so I want to do it as natural as possible. This looks like it would not only be easy, but safe and best for my bees.
We still use this method, along with others, as a complete approach to prevent and/or manage Varroa in the hives. :)
Are you using "store" bought powered sugar or do make your own by grinding regular sugar?
I make my own powdered sugar. Granulated sugar and my Vitamix blender. Approximately 1/2 C. Of granulated sugar blend and voi la. Note. It clumps pretty quick in a dry jar so I run it through a filter each time I use it.
Yes, store bought
Thank You
What is the effect of missing all the foragers which are out of the hive? Have you tried doing this in the late evening to make sure you get them as well?
what are all preventative measures that you do and how often do you do them? great video
We do Drone Frames, Oxalic Acid, Powder Sugar dustings and Drone brood checks regularly. If Varroa gets too bad, we'll use Apivar or some other related strips in the hive. They key is, no matter what you use to try and control Varroa, to rotate treatments. Don't use the same one over and over and when you do treat, try and record the results, so you know which ones work better than others.
As far as I'm aware we don't have small hive beetles in the uk.wax moth and varroa yes
That's good. Freaking beetles are rampant in the heat of South Louisiana.
thank you very much-I cant stand gloves, and in Florida, for me its short-sleeved shirts
lucky!
Does that hurt any eggs or larvae, or the queen?
Also de mite losses the grip on the bee
We did an icing sugar powdering of our new in July this year bees and saw no varroa next couple of days on the sticky board under the stainless mesh floor. I spoke with the bee breeder who sold me the bees and he said some hives have the varroa some do not have it. In the UK it is legal to use a certain oxalic acid treatment but that has another ingredient in it and is not for vaporisation. I would have thought that a vapour is more effective instead of squirting fluid onto the bees. I would think that Frederick Dunn is the expert to copy if indeed any varroa are actually seen.
I treatment is advised, I see on new years day! If I don't see any varroa although I've manufactured the vaporiser,they will not be 'vaped'!
There is a research chap south of England who sells 'hygienic' bees but no answer to his emails?
great vid! very informative
You mention how you treat the other pests. How do you treat or prevent for tracheal mites?
You say you do this once in the spring and once in the summer and twice in the fall.
How soon in the spring do you do this and what time in the summer and when in the fall and how far between the two treatments in the fall?
Would it be good to do this powder sugar dusting on newly installed package bees?
Do you have a list of videos you do talking about all the non toxic, chemical free treatments you use such as this one?
I refuse to use any chemicals and medications in my bees but am struggling to be a successful beekeeper.
GREAT THANKS BRILLIANT informative yay
Jaka przyszłość czeka małą komórkę 4 .9 mm? Pozdrawiam !
I don’t have a screen button to catch the varroa, what can I do? Thank you 🐝🐝🐝
Awesome
Does this method damages the egg of the bee, open or closed baby bees? I'll be glad if you answer my question. Thank you!
I noticed you didn't do the bottom of the frames missing alot of bees
It is pretty hard to get them all the first time, especially if you are doing it alone. Getting a bulk of the bees will help, next time around changes are good you'll hit some of them you missed the first time :)
Wonderful video! You said you saw 1 beetle in several years ... since you use this as part of an integrated approach, how do you know how effective the sugar treatment is as compared to your other treatments? Do you notice a difference between using sugar with regular Italian bees and bees that have hygienic characteristics.
George Garcia we use sticky board at the bottom of the hives after any treatment to make sure we actually see results from all our different treatment approaches. Different approaches target different areas, like the drone brood frames we use, those target Varroa reproduction under the capped cells as opposed to our sugar dusting or oxalic acid treatments which are more focused on the mites physically attached the the bees. And just to clarify, you said beetle, but I am assuming you meant mite not beetle as this is a treatment for mites :)
Thank you!
Once the mites fall off the bees how to get rid of them out of the hive?
great, thank you,,
I'm sure this method is very effective. But the draw back that I see here. It's very time consuming. Going frame by frame when especially when you have two deep 10 frame brood boxes. With massive loaded bees in each frame. In your video clip. I guess it's okay when there's less bees roaming in the brood box. You can get away with this method. My preference and less time consuming is the Formic Pro strip method. Very effective and the efficacy is between 90-99%. And when you have a loaded colony. The bees will take care the 1-3% rest of mites. So simple and less invasive on the bees. Just place the opened strips on top of brood frames. The supers are safe from contamination and left on during treatment.
Formic îs the best... BUT... it`s... Acid... 👀
What will be the quality of honey ?
I have beetle buster boards, not screen boards, would the mites just go back up onto the bees? Are you familiar with the beetle board????
Sorry but mites are not usually on the thorax they are on the fat body under the bee
Thank you very much for the video. Well done!
My question- Do you normally do these treatments early morning or late afternoon to get as many bees covered or does it matter?
Hi, I'm a new"bee" at this and this is a really old vid. I'd treat them when it's cooler out and they're more likely to be inside watching TV. I don't think time of day matters. These guys are great. Hope this helps!
So you say that you’ve only seen one…. But do you actually check for them with alcohol washes or do you just mean one you happened to see?
Just happened to see. Most hives will get Varroa, only a matter of time and if they do get them, we're treating anyway, so matter how many we see in a wash. Washes help you determine how bad the mite load is getting and can be helpful, but we treat with our rotating IPM method all season anyway, so load isn't as big of a deal to us.
I was recently researching sugar syrup alternatives (and finding that I should ONLY be using regular ole granulated sugar...). I remember that it specifically urged not to use baking-use powdered sugar since it contains cornstarch as an anti-caking agent.
I read in these comments that you believe the bees are consuming very little, but merely cleaning it off. But have you tried finding a powered sugar without this additive, or can you comment on the issue of cornstarch in the mixture?
I will check the ingredients on the bag. The two hive I powdered sugared turned out to bee the strongest. It may have been coincidence.
See You On The Mountain okay, great. I appreciate the follow up!
@@thomascarter6810 oh sorry I am on the wrong reply message.
Just regular granulated sugar in a blender (powdered) no additives !!
Do you do any mite washes any time of year? How much powered sugar per box are you using? What's your winter survival rate? What is the honey production per hive? How many hives do you have? Is powdered sugar the only varoa managment method you use?
Hello Matt! We do mite washes occasionally, but our treatment methods are pretty standard and we do them regularly, despite mite loads in our hives, just to stay on top of it. The powder sugar isnt really measured, we just add a very fine dusting on the bees, not a thick coat. We average a 70% survival rate out of several hundred hives. Honey production isn't affected by mite treatments, as long as the different methods (like drone brood frames) are done properly and at the right times. Powdered sugar is not the only method. Any good IPM plan will rotate treatments in hives in order to hit the Varroa at different stages of their life cycle and to not allow resistance build up. We use power sugar, drone brood frames, Oxalic Acid, brood gaps, mineral foggers (to name a few) and occasionally strips if we are having a particularly stubborn hive. Rotating your methods and measuring how effective they are is key! Thank you for commenting!
@@HoneyandHome ok you might want to amend or put a disclaimer on this video because it gives the impression that this powered sugar treatment is all it takes to keep varoa in check which is false and by your own words isn't what you do. I run several hundred colonies and sell up to 500 nucs a year. I teach intro to beekeeping by the scientific studies and hard data over decades of research. We have 65-95%survival rates depending on the year and treatment method(s) used that year.
Yo what he said I don’t even own a beehive yet trying to do research so I know what I’m getting into and you had me fooled. You never use anything but powdered sugar as far as chemicals and now you’ve changed your stance.
Will the powder sugar affect the honey?
Nope
Thanks for the tips I will be doing that to my bees . What kind of shaker do you use ?
The old baking sifters from antique stores or tour family baker work very well!
@@HoneyandHome there's a company that makes an enclosed screened bottom board with an aluminum tray included. I used it back in 2017 with a Minnesota Hygeinics colony and had exceptional success. I know Hygeinics already groom on a regular basis but even after the mites will have dropped through a normal screened bottom board they can return. I filled the aluminum tray with Organic Diatomaceous Earth early on and then again about 2 weeks before late fall. When I checked the tray on 1st warm day of year it contained 1000s of mites and 100s of shb's. The screen and enclosed bottom board prevented bees from interacting with the deadly diatomaceous earth blades.
Around 3:00-4:00 mark you say you don't use chemicals, yet you posted this below "
Honey and Home
2 years ago
We also use oxalic acid treatments and occasionally Api Var Life"
Oh yes, sorry, we should have said we rarely use chemicals. lol
i need to know all rhe kone chemical for my two hives. i ask other bee keepers and they are all against it. i lice in Florida and cant do the heat strips cas its to hot here. i will be doing this method for sure. it sucks cas im the only one that deals with the bees, tow people ugh
What about uncapped brood. Does this method effect them?
We haven't seen any signs of the process bothering enough brood to cause any issues.
So I’m not much of a cook so forgive a possible dumb question all the powdered sugar I can find has corn starch in it is that ok to use or do I need to look further
Some Gefen Confectioners Sugar doesn't have corn starch, but most do. We use any type of powdered sugar without any issues, so I would say, based on our own usage, it doesn't matter much.
Do you dust only the brood chamber frames or all that have bees on them?
which months are the most suitable, pls ?
Do you powder the brood boxes only, or also the supers once the summer starts? Thanks for the vid
Only the bees. Usually there are more bees in the deep/brood boxes, but if there are a lot in a super, then dust them too :)
If there are uncapped brood, would powdered sugar not fall on the larvae and eggs? If yes, would that not be an issue?
I want to try this next spring unless I half to I would rather not put poison in my hives That's a old flour sifter I have one lol
LOVE the idea of preventative measures without chemicals! New beek question...the powdered sugar is not hurtful to open brood?
Laura Ward no doesn't hurt brood :)
Yes, it kills open brood when powdered sugar is put into the cells!!! It should only be put on the bees.
ALso, does the powder sugar get into the honey?
A little, but we never notice it when we pull honey. They bees love the stuff so they're pretty quick to clean it up!
Does this affect the purity/flavour of the honey ?
Nope. At most you may find some cells with a little sugar in them if you pull honey close to when you did a treatment. Remember you are putting a VERY light dusting of powder sugar on the bees, do NOT load them up with it or you'll make issues.
I bought powdered sugar. It had corn starch in it. It seems like all powdered sugar does. Does that matter??
Hello
In France, this method is not used or recommended.
but I still want to test because my colonies are not very infested.
I read that this method kills open brood, is this true? do you only use this method or do you supplement with oxalic/formic acid or thymol?
Thank for sharing !
Hi Nest! We always rotate our methods for mite treatment. This just happens to be one of the many ways we try to control populations. Good IPM (Integrated Pest Management) should always rotate treatments to his mite life cycles at sifferent time.
We have not noticed brood problems after treatments. We try hard to get the powers on the bees and not the frames as well. If there are any issues from this treatment, they are so minor we don't notice them.
How long does it take to do one large hive? So you have very little hive loss using this method and your in Michigan?
This method kills open brood and although it's better than nothing ,I no longer use it because it's not a dependable treatment
How well are you able to have winter survival rates from powdered sugar methods like this? Can you consistently year to year get over 70% winter survival? Or more?
I'd be highly interested in even a decent survival rate, and not expecting perfection. There's just the hope that something will work, especially when you hear about other people losing colonies in spring first inspections.
You said you do this in spring, summer, and 2x in fall...its hard to perceive why it works to only do it that much? What would you do between those time periods?
Will your method fail if someone isn't using a screened bottom, or a bottom where the mites can fall out of the bottom when knocked off by the bees?
How about the mites in the cells.
Is pure or soft powder sugar (icing sugar in Australia) better? Or does it not matter which one? Thanks
Not sure it matters. It is just a matter of putting very thin dusting of sugar on the bees in order to stimulate grooming in the hive and to make it harder for the Varroa to stay attached. I would use the one that is the finest, if you see a difference at all.
Thanks. What are the other methods used in an integrated prevention/treatment?
How often do you treat the hive this way?
As part of our rotation of different methods, about every other month.
How do you test for varroa mites? Do you use the most accurate method of an alcohol wash?
I stopped watching at 2:39 because you said most varroa mites attach to the back of the bees. I've read multiple places, and heard the people in charge of the University of Nebraska at Lincoln Bee Lab say most of the mites attach themselves on the underside of the bees. The bee lab doctors are beekeepers. They say the powdered sugar control method isn't very effective because most mites are safe inside sealed brood cells busy multiplying.
We treat our hives with almost every method out there. Powdered sugar is just one method of a total Integrated Pest Management Plan (IPM). We have seen good results from doing this method as we put sticky boards under the screen bottoms so we can see what mites have fallen off or been removed via grooming. There are lots of methods to treat for Varroa and any good IPM rotates these methods to hit the Varroa in a every part of its life cycle possible. These methods has proven to work for us, so they remain a part of our regiment. I cannot speak to the Varroa attaching to the underbelly, as this information seems to be changing often as new science is published, but it was part of our training as Master Beekeepers from the University of Montana. While I am sure they can attach in many places, we seem to see them on the backs of the bees when we encounter them in our hives. Thanks for the comments!
Are the bees EATING the sugar so that they get some nourishment from it or just cleaning it off?
They probably eat some, but mostly trying to clean it off.
I heard that this has worked for 12 years but then read you use other methods? What other methods are used, I got excited thinking this would be all I needed
We also use oxalic acid treatments and occasionally Api Var Life
@@HoneyandHome Is that Apilife Var Or Api var Life as you wrote it ???
@@HoneyandHome k so you do use treatments
Did you continue to treat this way for season 2018. Any concerns about suffocating the queen with powder sugar? Thank you for your comments.
Simply Garden no big concerns. We try not to put it on very thick, just a thin dusting to encourage grooming. We have done this process on our farm for about 10 years now and it has been a great addition to our mite arsenal.
I noticed you instructed that a 'fine dusting' is required in the treatment@@HoneyandHome Do good pastry cooks know more about a 'fine dusting' and maybee more adept at dispensing a fine dusting with a very fine sieve?
I will follow your instructions and get my wife to operate the dusting procedure when we do the next inspection. Many who eat with us over the years pay her many a compliment because she is a brilliant cook. A story is that our son blew the candles out on his birthday cake and the area and others sitting opposite were engulfed in a cloud of icing dust.
I think your idea is the best one since sliced bread.
I'm an engineer and always want to cure problems. I see that some bee keepers are worried about getting the icing sugar into the comb. Would that problem be partially avoided by 'angling' the combe so that the dust is delivered at an angle to the comb, still getting onto the bees but not directly at 90 degrees to the comb surface?
I worry about the bees eyes in this process but when a bee is seen forraging the pollen is all over the bee and the bee cannot possibly avoid getting the pollen dust over it's eyes.
A bee is one of the most remarkable creatures that's for sure. They deserve the utmost careful handling don't they.
So what’s your mite count? Before and after your treatment??!!
We don't count mites. We treat as if we already have them and treat regularly, adjusting our IPM methods each time. Seems to do the trick.
What happen to all this sugar after they groom themselves? Do they use it?
Is it a concern to get some sugar into cells with eggs or larvae?
Some will get in there but doesn't usually end up being bad. Remember, it is a VERY light dusting on the bees only.
So powered sugar really works on mites then what do you do?
What is your survival rate through winter? Thanks
Depends, it is a little different from year to year. Generally, we have about 70% survival rate. Some years better, like this last year. We lost three hives out of 45 and it was probably because those were late swarms, but we still wanted to try and save them!
Can you use this procedure anytime like now in September?
How many colonies do you run? What’s you’re loss rate?
We generally have about 40 hives. About 10% loos from year to year on average.
Love the idea of powder coating, I have to admit I tried the other way of coating the top of the frames.also what's your view on using oxalic acid with a vaporiser
Shaun Barker oxalic acid and vaporizer are also good methods. We don't use them, but many of our customers do and they have good success with them. They would be good preventatives as well and can be rotated with the powder sugar method. Thanks for the comments! :)
Country Bee what's your thoughts on a insect fogger with mineral oil and winter green or spearmint mixture? Thanks for the great video.
jackbquick123 I know many beekeepers that use them. I personally have not, so all I can go by is what others say and they seem to like it with comparable sucess to other preventative methods. It really is up to each individual and what they are comfortable doing and if they think it works. To my knowledge there is no definitive scientific study on the use of foggers and mineral oils in the hive, so if it works, keep doing it :) Thanks for the comment!
@@HoneyandHome Dear Shaun Barker. I noticed and others should take note that you saw one mite in years...... That's good enough for me but why it seems it's not good enough for other watchers of your excellent video. The old saying is as true as ever = Seeing is believing!
Your results one would say 'speak for themselves in that your 'system' works....... You obviously are very concerned about the ethics of bee keeping and are passionate about your bees and their well being.
You cannot please everybody and it is chancy sticking your head above the trench and especially so if your ideas are original. Your endeavour to help is admirable =Thank you so much. It pays to always keep an open mind, but I don't need to tell you that!
What do you use for hive moths
Does this application not kill honey bee larvae
You have it over powdered sugar...
You do not mean the stuff you can get to put on top of cakes ??
Is it gem sugar grinded or ???
It is best to make your own powdered sugar. The store bought stuff has corn starch to prevent clumping and the bees can't digest that. Just put 1/2 cup or so of regular sugar in your blender and turn it on high for about 30 seconds or so. When it's nice and powdered, sift it through a fine sieve to get out any big bits and you're good to go.
Actually the mites leave for the vast majority under the body of the mites , powder sugar make the mites loose their grip , just saying .
realrambo1 yes, you are right, the sugar does also make it so mites can lose their grip as well.