I think the reason why Raphael and Mona Lisa's relationship works better than the others is that it's requited, they are both equally into each other instead of it being mostly one-sided.
I love how 2012 Shredder becomes more and more insane as the show goes on and even Splinter foreshadowed Shredder's downfall in Season 1 finale by saying: You have nothing but your hatred and if you defeat me you will have nothing. 2012 Shredder is kind of like Emperor Belos from Owl House
While 2003 Shredder is the most "cool" through his iconic design and intimidation (during the first few seasons at least), I find 2012 Shredder the most compelling iteration of the character in my opinion. Seeing him become a (literal) monster due to his obsession and having that be his downfall is fascinating to watch. It's certainly one of the most personal conflicts we're had with Shredder in TMNT shows.
you know i noticed out of the all the shredder's 2012 shredder is the one that's that's perhaps the most faithful to the original mirage version of the character, much like the original one his main goal is to kill yoshi.
I'd like to point out that Mona Lisa is voiced by Zelda Williams, and the fact that the daughter of one of the biggest goofballs to do voice work in the 90s was cast in two different Nick shows as the hardest of hardasses is funny to me.
I am personally glad they actually did something with Super Shredder instead of just having him show up for 2 seconds then die anticlimatically by having a literal bridge drop on him.
A few things to note: 1. In the first episode of season 4 you can see Leonardo extremely happy as with the space arc, he gets to live out his Captain Ryan Space Heroes fantasies. 2. One episode brought in the 2012 iteration of Armaggon from Tournament Fighters for the SNES as a hulking shark man with his armor that serves as transport. 3. The Neutrinos in this iteration are severely downgraded as they're essentially hunters that invade people's minds rather than hep cat teenyboppers. 4. Honeycutt did not give April the crystal, that would be the Aeons, a group of aliens that look like angels though without the sunstar crystal they transformed into hideous demonic aliens. 5. Remember Dogpound/Rahzar's former human self Chris Bradford, who was supposed to be a parody of Chuck Norris? Yeah, the producers parodied everything about him, including the foreshadowing cartoon. The late 80's cartoon, if anyone remembers it, was Chuck Norris' Karate Commandos. Nick's take on it was Chris Bradford and his 2 Ruff Krew. Heck in one episode Rahzar was watching the show looking back on his time as a human. 6. In the quarter finale episode the entire thing focuses on Tiger Claw and how he lost his tail, introducing us to the one off character Alopex, who, and I am not kidding on this, CUTS OFF TIGER CLAW'S ARM! 4 seasons down, one to go.
Also I’m pretty sure Pigeon Pete is just flat out dead. I don’t remember the episode where they mentioned this but he’s apparently “no longer with us” according to the Mutanimals. I didn’t really miss him (he just felt like a more annoying Mikey) but it was a shocking development.
That final battle between the turtles and Super Shredder will always be my favorite fight of the whole show. It was awesome seeing how both sides were holding NOTHING back. They were out for blood. And the fight between the turtles and Mozar is definitely my second favorite. That was a pretty intense fight too.
It would felt more useful and made more sense for leatherhead and slash helped out alittle bit with the footbots like they said. So the turtles to finish Shredder with enough energy
Wish you brought up Leatherhead more, he was pretty important. He drowns Rahzar in the finale, which is one of the more disturbing deaths of a villain in a kid’s show. Also wild that the turtles leave fishface to suffocate to death (even if he did survive)
@@twindrill2852My memory may be hazy, he did, just in the first story arc of season 5, he just retired from villainy after giving some sort of info to the turtles and decided to retire in somewhere remote I believe.
Even watching Splinter's death from the video alone felt emotional. I really like how they handled Splinter's character throughout the show compared to every other TMNT series.
At least the Fugitoid is voice by David "The Tenth/Fourteenth Doctor" Tennant. And Mona Lisa in voiced by Zelda Williams. Yes, that Zelda. Stacked cast all around.
The shipping is definitely noticeable, but I don't think it ruined the story. In fact, stuff like Raph x Mona does kinda help add depth to certain characters. I feel like compared to shows like SvTFOE, Netflix's Voltron, and She-ra, who's stories who drastically altered for the worst thanks to shipping, I think TMNT 2012 still managed to stick the landing with that amazing season 4 finale without it being affected by which main characters needed to be hooked up together.
As a guy who knows about Total Drama, I can tell you a show can do much worse with shipping, to the point of destroying and flanderising several characters. Or in Regular Show's case with Mordecai, making you stop rooting for someone. While I think the show has too much of Donnie's screentime being tied to the romance (meaning he doesn't get to shine much on his own), it's still Donnie with his identity retained at the end of the day.
It's a different problem, I'd say. These shows you list had shippings affect the story and alter the outcome. Here it's more that they're... distracting fillers that drag on and distract us from the actually interesting stuff.
I'd say the shipping in this show is more akin to regular show and adventure time, where its not terrible, but it can detract from the story and action. With she ra and especially voltron and star vs, the writers got way too trigger happy with the shipping that it destroyed what made those shows great
Fun Fact J: At 16:03 when Splinter falls, hallucinates the Rat King, actually happened in the comics, specifically thr City at War arc. Although, it was much darker because of one moment.
In the mirage comics, Splinter(the pet rat version) was actually forced to eat rats to survive despite his initial hesitation. Meanwhile the 2012 show has Yoshi!Splinter while tempted refuses to eat one and chose to fight the Rat King.
I really wish the TMNT shows would acknowledge the 2003 show in the "visiting previous turtles" episodes. I know the 80's turtles and the comic were important and all that, but I wanna see the one I grew up with get some love the same way the 80's show gets it
Making Karai's biological daughter really muddied the waters of the dynamic they were going for with Leo & Karai. Even after watching an interview involving the series creator, Ciro Nieli, which mentioned his reason to do so was to add another layer of drama to the relationship although I really think it could have been done without it. It was already good enough of a start with the opposing clans factor between the two, but instead we got the result of the most polarizing ship of the show. If it wasn't for that one detail I'd say it was a pairing done well.
A cool detail is that rahzar ends up dead in one of the final episodes and thats why he is not shown in the final episode alongside all the other mutants.
It's an honor and almost surreal to be featured in one of your videos; I'm glad that info helped with your insight. I don't even remember why I chose Squidward as my name haha. Another great entry and I look forward to the last part. I'm curious to see how you'll feel about the actual finale we do get in "Raphael: Mutant Apocalypse." (at least it was intended to be in production order) I remember when it first premiered it was very...divisive in the TMNT fandom, though I'm not sure if the tides have cooled since. There's also a debate if it even is a canon finale, with several crew members having a completely different answer depending who you ask. That's a whole can of worms and headache in its own right.
I'm just low-key happy that there's a there's someone not just trashing on the show cuz there's a good amount of people that just trash on the show when in reality it's not that bad.
@@adriannaranjo4397 Time loop is indeed what is intended, it works for me because time travel no matter the story and theory you go with never syncs up perfectly logically, so I expect some messiness when time travel is involved.
One thing that HAS to be mentioned is how the episode "The Weird World of Wyrm", is an homage to the 'Super Robot Monkey Team Hyperforce Go' episode, "Meet the Wigglenog" (The titular genie making a cameo on Honeycutt's screen). Don't know if you're familiar with that show, but if you know the program block Jetix, it was basically THE block original. Tl;dr, the plots are EXACTLY the same. Not just your bog standard trope episode that you see in every cartoon I mean beat for beat EXACTLY alike.
I feel you glossed over the fact tha Shredder's beheading it's even more badass when you realize Shredder's helmet fused to his head, so Leo basically scooped it out before tossing it to the ground. _Also Honeycutt was voiced by freaking Doctor Who himself, David Tennant which I hope helped get him casted as Scrooge McDuck on the 2017 reboot.._
I adored the 2012 series when it came out, quickly becoming my favorite version of the TMNT and that was a me in late high school at that point, so I had grown up with the 2003 Turtles and with VHS of the 1987 Turtles. What I came to realize, especially after seeing reveal art for Rise/it's animation, is that each incarnation of the Turtles is going to just be a fun ride no matter which way you slice it. The only way to up it is to take the best pieces of each one and frankstein them together XD
So Mona Lisa was a reference back to the 87 series. There was a single episode where Raph meets a mutant salamander named, Mona Lisa, and they became friends over that episode. However, they weren't lovers and Mona never showed up after that as Playmates didn't want to make a girl toy as it was assumed little boys wouldn't like her. However she left a big impact as I remember old forums for the 2003 series hoped she would return there.
I’ll give TMNT 2012 this much. At least it’s use of shipping didn’t ruin the ending like Star Vs, or make the show a hilarious mess of tropes like Miraculous Ladybug
Eh, the issue with Star Vs' ending, is they didn't actually spend any effort justifying the Starco ship. They just acted like it was a forgone conclusion throughout the entire show--and did nothing to actually justify those two characters being together They did more to justify the Tomco ship than they ever did for Starco So, it would be more reasonable to suggest that the ending was ruined that they didn't do enough shipping. At least enough shipping specifically with Star and Marco to justify Star behaving the way she does at the end As per Miraculous Ladybug--that is more because the person running the show is trash. Also a lot of it is "early installment weirdness".. but in a form that never actually gets sorted out. With them just adding more stuff to make it more "uh... wait... then what about" I'd compare the World Design of Miraculous Ladybug to the various game design elements that various Smart Phone games make use with. In that rather than smoothing out and refining what is there--they just add a bunch of new stuff that completely unbalances everything and makes it more and more unreasonable Another comparison to why Miraculous Ladybug kind of fails is to compare its World Design to how RWBY's World is "Designed"... in that RWBY also deals with the "just add more new crap into it" philosophy of world design--making RWBY a similar amount of completely unworkable So both of those weren't really messed up by the shipping. In that Star Vs was more messed up in that they didn't bother to do ANY shipping between Marco and Star. Then with Miraculous Ladybug's World Design is the "just add more stuff into it" that is how Smart Phone Games get their design done
The shipping in this show is my guilty pleasure. I loved it as a kid, and teens have crushes all the time. Besides I feel like mutants deserve some love, too. Also, I don't think Leo and Karai’s relationship was dropped but that could be my nostalgia talking.
i think as a turtles fan im in a strange lucky position i saw the goofy 90s version as a child, the darker 2003 version as a teenager and the 2012 version in 2015 with my nephew
14:07 Yeah, that's a timeloop arc for you. It all just depends on how time travel and parallel worlds work in the settings physics. It seems like a semi-stable enough timeloop, with shredder's death being in the aborted timeline cut off from when the +6mon turtles arrive.
The past selves do see their families again because of the time travel aspect and they need to go back in time so they can help themselves, it's a paradox.
The thing that is interesting with Season 5 is the plan was to have much more after Shredder’s Death, but Nick ended the show and basically let them do one last set of episodes while preparing for Rise of The TMNT. Thinking that people wouldn’t watch a show once they got too old
Part of Rise's controversy at the start was that it came out right after TMNT 2012 ended, when it probably would have been best to give it some time to let fans be ready for the next project. Ironically Rise itself had the same thing happen to itself with any more work on the series being stopped after 2 seasons and a film, with the 3D-stylised movie being the next major project.
I still think shredders death should’ve happened before they went to space, just swap the last 2 arcs around. Because the space arc basically just paused the main story for half a season and all I wanted to know at the time was what happened to karai
Curious what you'll think about season 5! Despite how it lasted past the intended end, which usually doesn't work, I thought their idea of having basically a bunch of side stories instead of trying to continue the main plot was a good choice. Some of the arcs were better than others, but the overall concept was cool. I love the characters, so I'm happy to watch them do random side quests!
I mean considering they're teenage, its weird to me there wasnt shipping in earlier series, a part of being a teenager is romance. Plus 2003 had a lot of shipping with april and casey, which i didn't like. Raph and Mona's relationship definitely had a positive influence between both characters, compared to leo and karai, mike and his love interest and so on
Interesting to find someone who dislikes the shipping between Casey and April in the 03 show, I usually hear positive things about that, and April and Casey being a thing was from the original comic. Was it the pairing itself you disliked, or maybe not the romance itself but how it was written?
Mona Lisa was a character in the 80s cartoon that the 80s Raph also had a crush on, but she was a mutant Earth lizard. At least, as far as I remember. Also, I wish the elaborated on this in the episode, but I think the past versions went on the same adventure their future selves just came back from, creating a time loop.
I mean the fact that they are teenagers explain why the romance plots. We all know teen's hormones are all over the place so for me I see it as a natural thing for teenage turtles that act like humans (not ignoring that they have humanoid bodies) also act as regular teens with their hormones going crazy and falling in love quite often (or for some just thinking about sex and its implications)
Personally I loved 87 crossovers in the 2012 series, idk I felt the 2012 respected the 87 turtles more than the 2003 series. The remix of the 87 theme was so good. Also Leo slicing Shredder’s Head as the scene turned into a comic book was so badass🔥
2012 isn't even close to 2003. 2003 was flowing with amazing story , amazing actions , phenomenal soundtracks for each character or even places. Like when Leo or turtles fight with Kari we hear her soundtrack with amazing matuer dialogs that kids even can't understand or when they fight with shredder we hear track, even his fortress had soundtrack or April shop. Everything's were matched together to make 2003 as amazing show.
I love Raph X Mona mostly because it doesn’t have any of the weird hangups from the other ships. Donnie X April is one-sided and tends to get really creepy on Donnie’s side and it’s kinda this weird cat and mouse thing where April may or may not be interested. It also tends to consume Donnie’s character when it arises which isn’t fun. Leo X Karai has the weird thing of them technically being siblings and also has that cat and mouse/ will they won’t they feel. Mikey x Renet/Shinigami are kinda flirty, but that’s it, neither ship really goes anywhere. Raph and Mona don’t really have any of these problems, not only do they both respect each other, but the interest is 100% reciprocated on both sides. I remember in one episode when she and her commander/boss are going to Earth she gets excited at the idea of seeing Raph and kinda fantasizes about him, and I think that was cute. For the whole show we’ve been seeing the boys fantasize about the girls who only show varying levels of interest, so it’s nice to see one of the ladies actually thinking of Raph in that way too.
14:26 I’m pretty sure that was meant to be a sort of stable time loop. The past turtles basically go off for adventures in space with the Fugitoid still taking them back in time so that they can replicate their adventures that their future selves just went through.
.... Wait, Mona Lisa in this version is the same species than the Newtralizer?! Wow.... that's actually kind of a cool piece of World-building. Personally my position regarding romance and shipping is simple: I see it as a tool for the story. It can be great if it helps flesh out characters, but if it doesn't, it can feel unnecessary at best and harmful at worse. In that case, i feel it's a bit more the last one, because Donnie's crush on April tend to become his defining character trait in screentime that'd be better dedicated to fleshing him out. The other shippings feel... well like you put it, gimmicky and not bringing much. In particular the fact that it seems to happen whenever a female character is introduced - again, Shinigami didnd't need Mikey to have a crush on her, he already had a love interest wiht Reinette.
It really bothers me that the turtles never once defeated Shredder in a fight pre-mutation. That should have happened at some point. You have a point about Mona and Raph not being any better than the rest of the shipping but they were cute together.
Plus, it's been done before. The character "Mona Lisa" first appeared in an episode of the original TMNT show called "Raphael Meets His Match". In that she was originally a human mutated into a salamander who became smitten with Raph. She was supposed to be his love interest but that was her only appearance in the show.
Just heads up if no one told you yet but in the final season with the batch of episodes with the turtles in a madmax apocalyptic world, the ending of that story was actually supposed to final episodes of the final season. Ciro Neil (I think) said he wanted to make sure that no one could touch the 2012 version of the turtles so it couldn't be rebooted or come back with a new season. But when Nickelodeon found out what he was doing they took all the episodes of the season and rearranged all of them and advertised the final season as a "What if" season full of misadventures for the turtles.
It was very cool seeing Lord Dredd and Mona Lisa make it onto this series. I was however disappointed in their version of the neutrinos. I wanted to see a new take on Kala but we got rock soldier looking guys instead.
Tmnt 2012 season 4 was a wild one but i love that they got the 80s cast back to return for the cameos in trans dimension turtles and lastly during the bebop and Rocksteady movie
Imo Season 5 has arcs and not so much an overall plot, although there is a standalone episode of Master Splinter that I think you're going to love. Amazing video
For me, the 4th Season of this show was my favorite season. Sure, most of the space episodes did feel like a bit of a drag, but after the 2012 turtles crossover with the 1987 turtles, the show really picks up its game and keeps getting better. I loved almost everything else up to the end when they fight super Shredder. You are doing a great job man with these videos and I can't wait for what you think about season 5
The whole of the series was my absolute favorite when it come to the reimagine of the TMNT. I don't personally have much of the whole shipping aspects throughout the show for it didn't ruined much of the story and at the time I didn't know what the term 'shipping' really meant, I just thought it was cute and nothing much to go of it like other shows do. The Raph x Mon Lisa ship was something that happened before in the 1987 cartoon when Rapheal & Mona Lisa was a thing in that series so it was (to me at least) was a nice callback to that. As for the rest of the turtles I didn't so much mind it as much, like Donnie & April I thought it to be cute couple but the story with them is kinda cringe and Leo & Karai was also the same but being that Karai could be his sister in a way. Mikey & Renet I feel was more palatable for they have much in common and Renet didn't so much over stay the welcome. Aside from the season 4 in it's entirety was peak with bringing back the 1987 turtles and giving them justice in this than it did in the Turtles forever movie. And as well some episodes where they were intense and have fun scenes with them such as the closing climax with super Shredder & the turtles. Also side note: it's great to see easter egg callbacks from other TMNT properties such as the elevator scene from the Micheal Bay movie and Shredder falling into the garbage truck with Casey pressing the button to crush him from the 1st TMNT movie. Like I said despite some faults with the whole shipping and other aspects about this show, this was to me the best rendition to TMNT ever made. That is of course whenever you decide to do a retrospective on the Rise of TMNT which in my honest opinion blows the 2003 & 1987 series out of the water.
14:07 if you really think about it, there's room to tell more stories set in the 2012 universe following this "plot point" of the past versions hoping along Fugitoid's ship. I don't know if the fifth season Tales of the TMNT is really canon or not, but in case it isn't we can get more stories (maybe more multiverse/time travel stories) of the past versions exploring new worlds, maybe still doing their own adaptation of Fast Forward and another run-in with the 1987 Turtles or elsewhere (hopefully the 2003 universe) within that multiverse. The past versions can just stay up in space forever because they don't come back. The show just ignores that. They can get lost into a time vortex or black hole and we can get a completely different sub-timeline of the Turtles April and Casey traveling in space? We can see them grow old and I would love to think April and Casey would interact with different variants of themselves from different dimensions like their 2003, 1987 and prime counterparts. But that's just my fanfic ideas brewing
Yeah, though unfortunately that’s because it was cancelled. Not saying the tv finale or movie were bad, but if anything the show had so much potential that was squandered because it dared to try something new with the formula.
I played Wanted Dead, and it was fun. It had cool, Gun/Sword Gameplay, I liked the Characters and loading screen was a treat. My Biggest Issue with Wanted Dead is that it was SOOOOO Short, I wish it was longer.
Again, a really good video. I remember season 5 been the one with really interesting episodes. Like the creator were allowed to have fun with the story. (mad Max episode comes to mind) can't wait to see your take in this
I have a question for this season of TMNT: How did Splinter survive Shredder stabing him in the back while they were saving New York from the Triceratons?
Time travel warning when they ran into Splinter with the other cartoon classic turtles. Leo implied something bad happens in the future and that’s how Splinter was prepared. Basically back to the future saving Doc
Something that really annoyed me rewatching this show is Leo’s lack of a consistent arc. Throughout the show, he goes in solo missions, (especially season one and two) typically to either meet up with Karai or to try and save her from captivity. Many of these times the other turtles (especially Raph) will complain that Leo shouldn’t be doing that because they’re a team and Leo should put his trust in them to help when he needs it. Then Leo got separated from the group in the season 2 final and, while he put up an admirable fight, got beat within an inch of his life. After that, he was not only focused on being a better fighter to try and recover from his losses, but be a better leader for his brothers. This goes literally nowhere because Leo STILL goes out on solo missions later in the show (only one I can remember off the top of my head is the raid on Shredder’s factory near the end of season 4 with Karai and Shinigami). Even in the finale, it felt kind of bittersweet for Leo to ultimately beat Shredder on his own. The team dynamic doesn’t play a super pivotal role like it does in other iterations of the turtles (even rise did this better, just look at any big fight scene and they all contribute and help each other until the end). I still like Leo, but the fact that he just kinda reverted on a pretty decent arc leaves a sour taste in my mouth. This kind of applies to the other turtles as well, especially after vision quest, where they all learn something crucial to take with them but then just don’t hold onto that going forward. Except Raph, he was told to let go of his temper and be calm and focused when it mattered the most, and he did. He still got mad obviously, because temper can be a useful tool if aimed correctly, but I think going forward he was able to learn when to let his emotions take control and when to control his emotions.
I don't hate shipping But like This show has every single main character have a romance basically And considering even the 1987 which had like 200 episodes didn't have every main character have a romance The 2003 only had like 1 romance which is just odd Just makes the amount of romance insane It doesn't remove from my enjoyment.. but like CHILL The worst part is when you realize it's probably the writers fantasy.... Now I'm not saying it is Just saying it probably is
... it is kind of weird how you have that much time and no relationships forming... Like... I'd argue what you said for the 1987 and 2003 are insane much before the 2012 one... Just that much run time... and nothing? Freaking weird
The reason why Raph's relationship with Mona is considered the best of the 4 (and a half) is because it's the only one where they didn't start it off with some load of awkward crap. Donnie and April just kept going and going. Korai (i KNOW i mispelled that) and Leo are siblings, so they dropped it immediately. Mikey ends up falling in love with not one, but two characters he's had maybe 3 interactions with each.
Gotta love how the 80s Krang in this show knew that destroying the Prime Universe would destroy every reality, as if he learned that from certain someone
Was very surprised to see the sponsor for this video as Wanted Dead was one of my favorite lower key releases this last year so happy to see it being promoted by one of my favorite content creators. Also yet another great look at Turtles media that I let pass me by, gives me a lot of inspiration to finally cut out the time to watch all the post 1987 series. I grew up on the original Turtles; had all the action figures, played all the Konami titles when they were new, and while I did sort of age out of them always kept at least one eye on whatever was going on but never committing. Discovered this channel when you were first doing the 2003 retrospective and were near the tail end of it, was the sickest I had been in years and during the time I took off work suddenly remembered being really interested in the couple of episodes of the show I had caught back when I was in college, and that coupled with all the recent gaming releases definitely rekindled my love for the franchise. Thank you again for reminding me that it's never too late to enjoy childhood passions. (Side note, also got me to give the Sly games a try and absolutely adore them, so yet another win for the channel).
I uh completely forgot about that two sets of characters thing that happened because of the time travel, I can’t believe they got away with just writing them off like that wtf.
Fun fact: after the supershedder and splinter fight on the roof in 4x25 splinter falls into a garvage truck and Casey then pulls the lever to squash him and says oops like in the 1990 movie, only it wasn't joyful
Season 4 is the best season of the 2012 TMNT imo. The space are was very good, better than 2/3rds of season 3 and 1/3rd of season 2, but the City at War/Battle With Shredder is the best arc from this show and the only flawless arc.
2:03 That's the first time that I heard someone talk about Wanted Dead without goofing about Main Character Lieutenant Hannah Stone being about 2,50 meters tall for no good reason. Seriously, that fact makes some cutscenes unintentionally funny.
2003 is my favourite, but i love the 2012 series too. And despite it being such a sad scene, when Splinter dies for good, it was a great addition to the story which is also something we havent quite seen in TMNT animated/live action history
7:47 this was pretty much why I never moved forward with the show after season 2. Nickelodeon was become very inconsistent with episode releases and the story arcs were like a pacing roller coaster. So I pretty much went from an avid watcher to just watch random episodes. Doing the latter made me enjoy the show more, but man based on your lovely review and Jax Blade's review of every TMNT show, 2k12 struggles on a pacing level that the others don't have
I think raph and mona lisa relationship is probably the best ship in the show. All the other ones didn't need to be there but this ship actually fits so well and it was awesome to see someone actually being able to chill out raph like she did and well she actually was a creture not a human so that does help. Also I believe that the reason why the creators did the whole shipping thing is because people at the time were losing there mind over it some not even watching the show just there for the shipping of the characters and I think the creators maybe saw that as something needed for the show to do good sense people focused so much on it.
Actually, I added the flashback. It’s funny you say that because there is a moment where they flashback to Season 1’s first episode and they do redub it with Seth Green.
Consistency is what I believe is the key word for this show. The good parts are consistently good. The characters are consistently written. And the bad parts are consistently bad.
For me personally the reason the Raph and Mona love thing works is because its not that weird when you compare it to the other relationships; for example Donnie's love for april is mostly forced, creepy, and weird, Leo and Karai's relationship is odd because theyre both siblings, even if it isnt biological, and Michaelangelo's relationship with rennet is odd because rennet wasn't even alive when Mikey is, she's just time-travelling back to when Mikey was a similar age to her. It also fits better, as Mona and Raph both love eachother, its a mutual feeling that isnt forced, they also have alot of things in common, their love for battle and rage, their protectiveness over their team and friends, and how they have a similiar age too.
Wouldn't the time travel be a infinite progression paradox. Where the turtles that left alway return to the battle, help win, leave with honeycome, go back in time, ect ect? It's honey all the way down.
Hey J's Reviews! Great to see another video from you! :) I guess there's just one more TMNT (2012) video left for you to talk about season 5. Are you also going to review Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, including the Netflix movie? I also wanted to know, do you take suggestions for reviews or is it just things you're interested in?
Oh wow, I could have sworn I saw the entire series because I remember watching the Turtles stop the Triceratons and Splinter surviving. I swore that was the last episode of the series because I didn't see anything else after that and then Nick's next iteration started and I wasn't a fan of it. I guess the show took a hiatus after episode 14 then and I some how missed everything. So imagine my surprise by the end of this video. Kinda wished I wished I did watch the series again. I may just do that for season 5 as I for sure never saw that. Thanks for another great review J
I kinda wish Shredder went in a different direction... Shredder was incapacitated by Splinter using a martial arts technique. Shredder would then be transported back to Japan to retrieve treatment. Using ancient herbal healing to undo Splinters technique. Shredder would then send his goons to find a hidden sacred relic. And afterwards, return to new york... Shredder would lay out a trap. And then challenge the Turtles one last time to see who is the better. The Turtles would get the upper hand, forcing Shredder to take a last ditch attempt to win. Standing under a device stockpiled with Mutagen. Shredder would first consume a powder. Then release the device, dropping the Mutagen onto himself. Shredder would then transform into a DRAGON; The Shredder Dragon. The powder with created from the claw of an ancient dragon from mythical times. Shredder Dragon would rampage throughout new york, while the Turtles would fail to stop him and be forced to retreat. Shredder Dragon and Splinter with Kari would face off. Splinter would get the upper hand but Kari would get injured. Shredder would then take more control over his Dragon form, being able to change into a Human Dragon hybrid. This would be called Dragon Shredder or Super Shredder. And allow Shredder to get the upper hand on Splinter. Splinter incapacitated, Super Shredder would change to normal Shredder, then kill Splinter. Saying he does not need his new power to finish off an insignificant sewer rat. When Shredder and the Turtles face off one last time. Shredder, Super Shredder, then full Shredder Dragon. In the end, the Turtles wound Shredder Dragon, causing Shredder Dragon to revert back to normal Shredder. Kari is there, and trying to finish off Shredder using the same insult he gave Splinter. But Shredder changes to Super Shredder and almost kills Kari. But is killed by Leo, saving her life. Leo earns a legendary rank of ninja for killing a Dragon. and the story of TMNT 2012 continues...
Take a drink every time he says something about how good the 2003 series was or that he didn't watch 2012 originally... I started with 1986 series and I love all the series (except Rise) equally, but my god, his obsession with the 2003 series bias shows heavily here
He’s a 2000s dude and like he said in the video, the 2012 series wasn’t supposed to be viewed like the 03 series and in my opinion, both are good and different in their own ways.
A lot of fans were split on them spending half the season going back in time to save Splinter, only to kill them off at the end of the season again. But I would argue that the whole point of it is to show that, sometimes, tragedy is just inevitable. No matter how much time travel bullshit you go through. And I won't lie, Splinter's for real death on the show didn't get me to cry on my first viewing.
This season was cool, but I was kinda getting tired of all the fake out deads of Splinter, to the point that when it actually happened, it just didn't hit quite as hard as it should've. While it's a good thing that they build up to it instead of making it a surprise, I think they had to tone it down with how much he got tortured this season.
I'm sorry to say that Splinter's death fell flat to me. I think doing too make fake-outs ended up desensitizing me from it, despite the scene itself being good. I did like the final raid and Shredder's defeat, though.
lol ok so if the turtles actually died in the 2003 show would it have no impact since they faked their death multiple times before commercial breaks and in cliffhangers?
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I think the reason why Raphael and Mona Lisa's relationship works better than the others is that it's requited, they are both equally into each other instead of it being mostly one-sided.
And besides, it happened in the 1987 version.
I love how 2012 Shredder becomes more and more insane as the show goes on and even Splinter foreshadowed Shredder's downfall in Season 1 finale by saying: You have nothing but your hatred and if you defeat me you will have nothing.
2012 Shredder is kind of like Emperor Belos from Owl House
While 2003 Shredder is the most "cool" through his iconic design and intimidation (during the first few seasons at least), I find 2012 Shredder the most compelling iteration of the character in my opinion. Seeing him become a (literal) monster due to his obsession and having that be his downfall is fascinating to watch. It's certainly one of the most personal conflicts we're had with Shredder in TMNT shows.
Nah the constant fake out deaths were just annoying and destroyed any tension
Oooooh I never thought of that before
It is amazing how deep 2012 Shredder goes. Once he gets mutated, Splinter tells him "You must be so proud. You are now a monster inside and out."
you know i noticed out of the all the shredder's 2012 shredder is the one that's that's perhaps the most faithful to the original mirage version of the character, much like the original one his main goal is to kill yoshi.
I'd like to point out that Mona Lisa is voiced by Zelda Williams, and the fact that the daughter of one of the biggest goofballs to do voice work in the 90s was cast in two different Nick shows as the hardest of hardasses is funny to me.
It is weird how obsessed this show was with shipping, but I love this season. The Super Shredder arc is my favorite TMNT story of all time.
They were doing it since the beginning
I am personally glad they actually did something with Super Shredder instead of just having him show up for 2 seconds then die anticlimatically by having a literal bridge drop on him.
@@Theokal3 Agreed. He didn't even look like a mutant in the movie.
@@theoutsiderjess1869 I said this show, not season.
i feel raph and mona’s relationship was the most appropriate one out of all the turtles.
I agree
Agreed
Facts
most likely bc it was an actual anthropomorphic like them & not a fucking human
Agreed
A few things to note:
1. In the first episode of season 4 you can see Leonardo extremely happy as with the space arc, he gets to live out his Captain Ryan Space Heroes fantasies.
2. One episode brought in the 2012 iteration of Armaggon from Tournament Fighters for the SNES as a hulking shark man with his armor that serves as transport.
3. The Neutrinos in this iteration are severely downgraded as they're essentially hunters that invade people's minds rather than hep cat teenyboppers.
4. Honeycutt did not give April the crystal, that would be the Aeons, a group of aliens that look like angels though without the sunstar crystal they transformed into hideous demonic aliens.
5. Remember Dogpound/Rahzar's former human self Chris Bradford, who was supposed to be a parody of Chuck Norris? Yeah, the producers parodied everything about him, including the foreshadowing cartoon. The late 80's cartoon, if anyone remembers it, was Chuck Norris' Karate Commandos. Nick's take on it was Chris Bradford and his 2 Ruff Krew. Heck in one episode Rahzar was watching the show looking back on his time as a human.
6. In the quarter finale episode the entire thing focuses on Tiger Claw and how he lost his tail, introducing us to the one off character Alopex, who, and I am not kidding on this, CUTS OFF TIGER CLAW'S ARM!
4 seasons down, one to go.
Also I’m pretty sure Pigeon Pete is just flat out dead. I don’t remember the episode where they mentioned this but he’s apparently “no longer with us” according to the Mutanimals. I didn’t really miss him (he just felt like a more annoying Mikey) but it was a shocking development.
@@twindrill2852 Then explain why we saw him in the finale.
That final battle between the turtles and Super Shredder will always be my favorite fight of the whole show. It was awesome seeing how both sides were holding NOTHING back. They were out for blood. And the fight between the turtles and Mozar is definitely my second favorite. That was a pretty intense fight too.
It would felt more useful and made more sense for leatherhead and slash helped out alittle bit with the footbots like they said. So the turtles to finish Shredder with enough energy
0:12 "Holy crap, this show is a shipper's wonderland!"
Star Vs. the Forces of Evil: Hold my Blood Moon.
Wish you brought up Leatherhead more, he was pretty important. He drowns Rahzar in the finale, which is one of the more disturbing deaths of a villain in a kid’s show.
Also wild that the turtles leave fishface to suffocate to death (even if he did survive)
I doubt Fishface survived, considering that we don’t see him in S5.
@@twindrill2852My memory may be hazy, he did, just in the first story arc of season 5, he just retired from villainy after giving some sort of info to the turtles and decided to retire in somewhere remote I believe.
@@twindrill2852 he’s alive in season 5
????????
Even watching Splinter's death from the video alone felt emotional. I really like how they handled Splinter's character throughout the show compared to every other TMNT series.
I would like that Slash Leatherhead and Rockwell for them to help at the beginning with the footbots
At least the Fugitoid is voice by David "The Tenth/Fourteenth Doctor" Tennant.
And Mona Lisa in voiced by Zelda Williams. Yes, that Zelda.
Stacked cast all around.
The shipping is definitely noticeable, but I don't think it ruined the story. In fact, stuff like Raph x Mona does kinda help add depth to certain characters. I feel like compared to shows like SvTFOE, Netflix's Voltron, and She-ra, who's stories who drastically altered for the worst thanks to shipping, I think TMNT 2012 still managed to stick the landing with that amazing season 4 finale without it being affected by which main characters needed to be hooked up together.
As a guy who knows about Total Drama, I can tell you a show can do much worse with shipping, to the point of destroying and flanderising several characters. Or in Regular Show's case with Mordecai, making you stop rooting for someone.
While I think the show has too much of Donnie's screentime being tied to the romance (meaning he doesn't get to shine much on his own), it's still Donnie with his identity retained at the end of the day.
It's a different problem, I'd say. These shows you list had shippings affect the story and alter the outcome. Here it's more that they're... distracting fillers that drag on and distract us from the actually interesting stuff.
I beg to differ
I'd say the shipping in this show is more akin to regular show and adventure time, where its not terrible, but it can detract from the story and action.
With she ra and especially voltron and star vs, the writers got way too trigger happy with the shipping that it destroyed what made those shows great
Don’t Voltron was ruined because of shipping the story the season was just horrible. That shipping thing was purely fanon/ fandom.
Fun Fact J: At 16:03 when Splinter falls, hallucinates the Rat King, actually happened in the comics, specifically thr City at War arc. Although, it was much darker because of one moment.
In the mirage comics, Splinter(the pet rat version) was actually forced to eat rats to survive despite his initial hesitation.
Meanwhile the 2012 show has Yoshi!Splinter while tempted refuses to eat one and chose to fight the Rat King.
@@marcoa6319 I know, that was the "one moment" I was talking about. I was shocked when that happened
Yeah, I read that panel too where he ate a rat to survive. It got really dark
Oooooh interesting. I know nothing about the comics but have always been curious
@@questworldiangreenknight7455 they’re pretty good
I really wish the TMNT shows would acknowledge the 2003 show in the "visiting previous turtles" episodes. I know the 80's turtles and the comic were important and all that, but I wanna see the one I grew up with get some love the same way the 80's show gets it
I'm think 2003 literally had own problem legally issues, while nick own whole TMNT but 4kids owned rights name 2003.
@@theboihilbirt1277 they've had 2003 content on their youtube channel for a while, and they re-released dvds under the nickelodeon brand
At least the Twitter account is good about celebrating previous versions. Something DC or Marvel could learn about.
Making Karai's biological daughter really muddied the waters of the dynamic they were going for with Leo & Karai. Even after watching an interview involving the series creator, Ciro Nieli, which mentioned his reason to do so was to add another layer of drama to the relationship although I really think it could have been done without it. It was already good enough of a start with the opposing clans factor between the two, but instead we got the result of the most polarizing ship of the show. If it wasn't for that one detail I'd say it was a pairing done well.
A cool detail is that rahzar ends up dead in one of the final episodes and thats why he is not shown in the final episode alongside all the other mutants.
It's an honor and almost surreal to be featured in one of your videos; I'm glad that info helped with your insight. I don't even remember why I chose Squidward as my name haha. Another great entry and I look forward to the last part. I'm curious to see how you'll feel about the actual finale we do get in "Raphael: Mutant Apocalypse." (at least it was intended to be in production order) I remember when it first premiered it was very...divisive in the TMNT fandom, though I'm not sure if the tides have cooled since. There's also a debate if it even is a canon finale, with several crew members having a completely different answer depending who you ask. That's a whole can of worms and headache in its own right.
oh my god its fucking squidward tennis balls
I'm just low-key happy that there's a there's someone not just trashing on the show cuz there's a good amount of people that just trash on the show when in reality it's not that bad.
I kinda like how they NEVER dwell too much on a much younger version of the Turtles, April, and Casey that just left Earth forever just because
I also found that plot hole confusing. Like where did they go, and what did they do
@leopoldmaximus145 I think they tried to imply it being a time loop but it just doesn't work logically given the circumstances
Lol
Yes realistically the ones that left for space would eventually get bored in space and come back to Earth.
@@adriannaranjo4397
Time loop is indeed what is intended, it works for me because time travel no matter the story and theory you go with never syncs up perfectly logically, so I expect some messiness when time travel is involved.
Note: Rahzar was drowned by Leatherhead and died in episode 25
Damn, the shipping is so frequent in this show it overrid J's title for this entire retrospective.
One thing that HAS to be mentioned is how the episode "The Weird World of Wyrm", is an homage to the 'Super Robot Monkey Team Hyperforce Go' episode, "Meet the Wigglenog" (The titular genie making a cameo on Honeycutt's screen). Don't know if you're familiar with that show, but if you know the program block Jetix, it was basically THE block original.
Tl;dr, the plots are EXACTLY the same. Not just your bog standard trope episode that you see in every cartoon I mean beat for beat EXACTLY alike.
That's actually really cool that they took an episode from that, especially since the show the Turtles watched in season 2 was a take on that show.
I feel you glossed over the fact tha Shredder's beheading it's even more badass when you realize Shredder's helmet fused to his head, so Leo basically scooped it out before tossing it to the ground.
_Also Honeycutt was voiced by freaking Doctor Who himself, David Tennant which I hope helped get him casted as Scrooge McDuck on the 2017 reboot.._
I adored the 2012 series when it came out, quickly becoming my favorite version of the TMNT and that was a me in late high school at that point, so I had grown up with the 2003 Turtles and with VHS of the 1987 Turtles. What I came to realize, especially after seeing reveal art for Rise/it's animation, is that each incarnation of the Turtles is going to just be a fun ride no matter which way you slice it. The only way to up it is to take the best pieces of each one and frankstein them together XD
I really wish they'd done more with Shinigami.
Absolutely. She and Mikey really seemed to click and it could have developed into a solid kind of relationship(Better than Renet and Mikey at least)
Agreed
Same here. She's a pretty underrated character, and the concept of a witch ninja is badass.
@@Wildcatt1999agreed
So Mona Lisa was a reference back to the 87 series. There was a single episode where Raph meets a mutant salamander named, Mona Lisa, and they became friends over that episode. However, they weren't lovers and Mona never showed up after that as Playmates didn't want to make a girl toy as it was assumed little boys wouldn't like her. However she left a big impact as I remember old forums for the 2003 series hoped she would return there.
Actually, Mona Lisa did get a toy in the original toyline.
@@mitchfletcher2386 then I have been mislead
I’ll give TMNT 2012 this much. At least it’s use of shipping didn’t ruin the ending like Star Vs, or make the show a hilarious mess of tropes like Miraculous Ladybug
@@CreativeStoryteller35 that doesn't excuse how terrible the romance is anyways
@@CreativeStoryteller35 Then why add magic? Why add superheros? Why add a supervillain? Why are the title and songs about Ladybug (and cat noir)?
@@madeliefynanaIt's to pretend it's a superhero show, but it doesn't feel or act like one, it's about ships for the fandom, like SVTFOE
Eh, the issue with Star Vs' ending, is they didn't actually spend any effort justifying the Starco ship. They just acted like it was a forgone conclusion throughout the entire show--and did nothing to actually justify those two characters being together
They did more to justify the Tomco ship than they ever did for Starco
So, it would be more reasonable to suggest that the ending was ruined that they didn't do enough shipping. At least enough shipping specifically with Star and Marco to justify Star behaving the way she does at the end
As per Miraculous Ladybug--that is more because the person running the show is trash. Also a lot of it is "early installment weirdness".. but in a form that never actually gets sorted out. With them just adding more stuff to make it more "uh... wait... then what about"
I'd compare the World Design of Miraculous Ladybug to the various game design elements that various Smart Phone games make use with. In that rather than smoothing out and refining what is there--they just add a bunch of new stuff that completely unbalances everything and makes it more and more unreasonable
Another comparison to why Miraculous Ladybug kind of fails is to compare its World Design to how RWBY's World is "Designed"... in that RWBY also deals with the "just add more new crap into it" philosophy of world design--making RWBY a similar amount of completely unworkable
So both of those weren't really messed up by the shipping. In that Star Vs was more messed up in that they didn't bother to do ANY shipping between Marco and Star. Then with Miraculous Ladybug's World Design is the "just add more stuff into it" that is how Smart Phone Games get their design done
Yeah, despite doing so much shipping, they kept it as a secondary element where it belonged.
The shipping in this show is my guilty pleasure. I loved it as a kid, and teens have crushes all the time. Besides I feel like mutants deserve some love, too. Also, I don't think Leo and Karai’s relationship was dropped but that could be my nostalgia talking.
I remember watching The War For Dimension X episode and being amazed as a kid with how much action they were able to fit in over 20 minutes
Splinter's death hit so hard. "And now Hamato Yoshi dies" was so cold
"Well if you're into shipping, JOIN THE NAVY"
~J. Jonah Jameson 2019
i think as a turtles fan im in a strange lucky position
i saw the goofy 90s version as a child, the darker 2003 version as a teenager and the 2012 version in 2015 with my nephew
14:07 Yeah, that's a timeloop arc for you. It all just depends on how time travel and parallel worlds work in the settings physics. It seems like a semi-stable enough timeloop, with shredder's death being in the aborted timeline cut off from when the +6mon turtles arrive.
The past selves do see their families again because of the time travel aspect and they need to go back in time so they can help themselves, it's a paradox.
The thing that is interesting with Season 5 is the plan was to have much more after Shredder’s Death, but Nick ended the show and basically let them do one last set of episodes while preparing for Rise of The TMNT. Thinking that people wouldn’t watch a show once they got too old
Part of Rise's controversy at the start was that it came out right after TMNT 2012 ended, when it probably would have been best to give it some time to let fans be ready for the next project. Ironically Rise itself had the same thing happen to itself with any more work on the series being stopped after 2 seasons and a film, with the 3D-stylised movie being the next major project.
I still think shredders death should’ve happened before they went to space, just swap the last 2 arcs around. Because the space arc basically just paused the main story for half a season and all I wanted to know at the time was what happened to karai
Curious what you'll think about season 5! Despite how it lasted past the intended end, which usually doesn't work, I thought their idea of having basically a bunch of side stories instead of trying to continue the main plot was a good choice. Some of the arcs were better than others, but the overall concept was cool. I love the characters, so I'm happy to watch them do random side quests!
I mean considering they're teenage, its weird to me there wasnt shipping in earlier series, a part of being a teenager is romance. Plus 2003 had a lot of shipping with april and casey, which i didn't like. Raph and Mona's relationship definitely had a positive influence between both characters, compared to leo and karai, mike and his love interest and so on
Interesting to find someone who dislikes the shipping between Casey and April in the 03 show, I usually hear positive things about that, and April and Casey being a thing was from the original comic. Was it the pairing itself you disliked, or maybe not the romance itself but how it was written?
You didn’t like 2003 April and Casey? They make more sense as a couple than all of the relationships in the 2012 show besides Raph and Mona Lisa
0:07 I think the entire Nickelodeon company has been a Shipper's Wonderland ever since iCarly and Victorious.
Mona Lisa was a character in the 80s cartoon that the 80s Raph also had a crush on, but she was a mutant Earth lizard. At least, as far as I remember.
Also, I wish the elaborated on this in the episode, but I think the past versions went on the same adventure their future selves just came back from, creating a time loop.
I mean the fact that they are teenagers explain why the romance plots. We all know teen's hormones are all over the place so for me I see it as a natural thing for teenage turtles that act like humans (not ignoring that they have humanoid bodies) also act as regular teens with their hormones going crazy and falling in love quite often (or for some just thinking about sex and its implications)
Never forget that Leatherhead straight up fucking drowned Razaar. That’s so metal how the hell did they get away with that?
Personally I loved 87 crossovers in the 2012 series, idk I felt the 2012 respected the 87 turtles more than the 2003 series. The remix of the 87 theme was so good. Also Leo slicing Shredder’s Head as the scene turned into a comic book was so badass🔥
I thought 2012 was more disrespectful than 2003
It's even more badass when you realize Shredder's helmet fused to his head, so Leo basically scooped it out before tossing it to the ground.
I really wish 2012 Turtles had Crossovered with the 2003 turtles. That would've been neat to see.
2012 isn't even close to 2003.
2003 was flowing with amazing story , amazing actions , phenomenal soundtracks for each character or even places.
Like when Leo or turtles fight with Kari we hear her soundtrack with amazing matuer dialogs that kids even can't understand or when they fight with shredder we hear track, even his fortress had soundtrack or April shop.
Everything's were matched together to make 2003 as amazing show.
no way you think 03s action is better than 2012
@sobhan1218 I talked about overall show not just action
Now that I think about it, I never saw season 5 actually.
This is probably where there was the Usagi Yojimbo episode.
See you next time, J!
I love Raph X Mona mostly because it doesn’t have any of the weird hangups from the other ships.
Donnie X April is one-sided and tends to get really creepy on Donnie’s side and it’s kinda this weird cat and mouse thing where April may or may not be interested. It also tends to consume Donnie’s character when it arises which isn’t fun.
Leo X Karai has the weird thing of them technically being siblings and also has that cat and mouse/ will they won’t they feel.
Mikey x Renet/Shinigami are kinda flirty, but that’s it, neither ship really goes anywhere.
Raph and Mona don’t really have any of these problems, not only do they both respect each other, but the interest is 100% reciprocated on both sides. I remember in one episode when she and her commander/boss are going to Earth she gets excited at the idea of seeing Raph and kinda fantasizes about him, and I think that was cute. For the whole show we’ve been seeing the boys fantasize about the girls who only show varying levels of interest, so it’s nice to see one of the ladies actually thinking of Raph in that way too.
14:26
I’m pretty sure that was meant to be a sort of stable time loop. The past turtles basically go off for adventures in space with the Fugitoid still taking them back in time so that they can replicate their adventures that their future selves just went through.
.... Wait, Mona Lisa in this version is the same species than the Newtralizer?! Wow.... that's actually kind of a cool piece of World-building.
Personally my position regarding romance and shipping is simple: I see it as a tool for the story. It can be great if it helps flesh out characters, but if it doesn't, it can feel unnecessary at best and harmful at worse. In that case, i feel it's a bit more the last one, because Donnie's crush on April tend to become his defining character trait in screentime that'd be better dedicated to fleshing him out. The other shippings feel... well like you put it, gimmicky and not bringing much. In particular the fact that it seems to happen whenever a female character is introduced - again, Shinigami didnd't need Mikey to have a crush on her, he already had a love interest wiht Reinette.
Don't forget the time travelling robot was played by David Tennant you know 10th doctor from doctor who
It really bothers me that the turtles never once defeated Shredder in a fight pre-mutation. That should have happened at some point.
You have a point about Mona and Raph not being any better than the rest of the shipping but they were cute together.
Ngl Mona and Raph just works for me. And it's more both ways so it's kinda cute and less groan inducing
Plus, it's been done before. The character "Mona Lisa" first appeared in an episode of the original TMNT show called "Raphael Meets His Match". In that she was originally a human mutated into a salamander who became smitten with Raph. She was supposed to be his love interest but that was her only appearance in the show.
IDW is the shipper's wonderland
So many ships, and they're good 🙏
Just heads up if no one told you yet but in the final season with the batch of episodes with the turtles in a madmax apocalyptic world, the ending of that story was actually supposed to final episodes of the final season. Ciro Neil (I think) said he wanted to make sure that no one could touch the 2012 version of the turtles so it couldn't be rebooted or come back with a new season. But when Nickelodeon found out what he was doing they took all the episodes of the season and rearranged all of them and advertised the final season as a "What if" season full of misadventures for the turtles.
Someone who didn't want a reboot, I respect that, also, more fuel for why I don't want to ship my stuff to execs
It was very cool seeing Lord Dredd and Mona Lisa make it onto this series. I was however disappointed in their version of the neutrinos. I wanted to see a new take on Kala but we got rock soldier looking guys instead.
Tmnt 2012 season 4 was a wild one but i love that they got the 80s cast back to return for the cameos in trans dimension turtles and lastly during the bebop and Rocksteady movie
Imo Season 5 has arcs and not so much an overall plot, although there is a standalone episode of Master Splinter that I think you're going to love.
Amazing video
For me, the 4th Season of this show was my favorite season. Sure, most of the space episodes did feel like a bit of a drag, but after the 2012 turtles crossover with the 1987 turtles, the show really picks up its game and keeps getting better. I loved almost everything else up to the end when they fight super Shredder. You are doing a great job man with these videos and I can't wait for what you think about season 5
The crossover episodes are some of my favorites in the whole series.
The whole of the series was my absolute favorite when it come to the reimagine of the TMNT. I don't personally have much of the whole shipping aspects throughout the show for it didn't ruined much of the story and at the time I didn't know what the term 'shipping' really meant, I just thought it was cute and nothing much to go of it like other shows do.
The Raph x Mon Lisa ship was something that happened before in the 1987 cartoon when Rapheal & Mona Lisa was a thing in that series so it was (to me at least) was a nice callback to that. As for the rest of the turtles I didn't so much mind it as much, like Donnie & April I thought it to be cute couple but the story with them is kinda cringe and Leo & Karai was also the same but being that Karai could be his sister in a way. Mikey & Renet I feel was more palatable for they have much in common and Renet didn't so much over stay the welcome.
Aside from the season 4 in it's entirety was peak with bringing back the 1987 turtles and giving them justice in this than it did in the Turtles forever movie. And as well some episodes where they were intense and have fun scenes with them such as the closing climax with super Shredder & the turtles. Also side note: it's great to see easter egg callbacks from other TMNT properties such as the elevator scene from the Micheal Bay movie and Shredder falling into the garbage truck with Casey pressing the button to crush him from the 1st TMNT movie.
Like I said despite some faults with the whole shipping and other aspects about this show, this was to me the best rendition to TMNT ever made. That is of course whenever you decide to do a retrospective on the Rise of TMNT which in my honest opinion blows the 2003 & 1987 series out of the water.
14:07 if you really think about it, there's room to tell more stories set in the 2012 universe following this "plot point" of the past versions hoping along Fugitoid's ship. I don't know if the fifth season Tales of the TMNT is really canon or not, but in case it isn't we can get more stories (maybe more multiverse/time travel stories) of the past versions exploring new worlds, maybe still doing their own adaptation of Fast Forward and another run-in with the 1987 Turtles or elsewhere (hopefully the 2003 universe) within that multiverse.
The past versions can just stay up in space forever because they don't come back. The show just ignores that. They can get lost into a time vortex or black hole and we can get a completely different sub-timeline of the Turtles April and Casey traveling in space? We can see them grow old and I would love to think April and Casey would interact with different variants of themselves from different dimensions like their 2003, 1987 and prime counterparts. But that's just my fanfic ideas brewing
I JUST realized that Rise is the only animated show that didn't get a chance to over stay its welcome.
Yeah, though unfortunately that’s because it was cancelled. Not saying the tv finale or movie were bad, but if anything the show had so much potential that was squandered because it dared to try something new with the formula.
I played Wanted Dead, and it was fun. It had cool, Gun/Sword Gameplay, I liked the Characters and loading screen was a treat.
My Biggest Issue with Wanted Dead is that it was SOOOOO Short, I wish it was longer.
Again, a really good video. I remember season 5 been the one with really interesting episodes. Like the creator were allowed to have fun with the story. (mad Max episode comes to mind) can't wait to see your take in this
I have a question for this season of TMNT:
How did Splinter survive Shredder stabing him in the back while they were saving New York from the Triceratons?
Time travel warning when they ran into Splinter with the other cartoon classic turtles. Leo implied something bad happens in the future and that’s how Splinter was prepared. Basically back to the future saving Doc
Something that really annoyed me rewatching this show is Leo’s lack of a consistent arc. Throughout the show, he goes in solo missions, (especially season one and two) typically to either meet up with Karai or to try and save her from captivity. Many of these times the other turtles (especially Raph) will complain that Leo shouldn’t be doing that because they’re a team and Leo should put his trust in them to help when he needs it. Then Leo got separated from the group in the season 2 final and, while he put up an admirable fight, got beat within an inch of his life. After that, he was not only focused on being a better fighter to try and recover from his losses, but be a better leader for his brothers.
This goes literally nowhere because Leo STILL goes out on solo missions later in the show (only one I can remember off the top of my head is the raid on Shredder’s factory near the end of season 4 with Karai and Shinigami). Even in the finale, it felt kind of bittersweet for Leo to ultimately beat Shredder on his own. The team dynamic doesn’t play a super pivotal role like it does in other iterations of the turtles (even rise did this better, just look at any big fight scene and they all contribute and help each other until the end). I still like Leo, but the fact that he just kinda reverted on a pretty decent arc leaves a sour taste in my mouth. This kind of applies to the other turtles as well, especially after vision quest, where they all learn something crucial to take with them but then just don’t hold onto that going forward.
Except Raph, he was told to let go of his temper and be calm and focused when it mattered the most, and he did. He still got mad obviously, because temper can be a useful tool if aimed correctly, but I think going forward he was able to learn when to let his emotions take control and when to control his emotions.
I don't hate shipping
But like
This show has every single main character have a romance basically
And considering even the 1987 which had like 200 episodes didn't have every main character have a romance
The 2003 only had like 1 romance which is just odd
Just makes the amount of romance insane
It doesn't remove from my enjoyment..
but like CHILL
The worst part is when you realize it's probably the writers fantasy.... Now I'm not saying it is
Just saying it probably is
... it is kind of weird how you have that much time and no relationships forming...
Like... I'd argue what you said for the 1987 and 2003 are insane much before the 2012 one...
Just that much run time... and nothing? Freaking weird
The reason why Raph's relationship with Mona is considered the best of the 4 (and a half) is because it's the only one where they didn't start it off with some load of awkward crap. Donnie and April just kept going and going. Korai (i KNOW i mispelled that) and Leo are siblings, so they dropped it immediately. Mikey ends up falling in love with not one, but two characters he's had maybe 3 interactions with each.
Gotta love how the 80s Krang in this show knew that destroying the Prime Universe would destroy every reality, as if he learned that from certain someone
Was it from… Ch’rell?
@@marioluigi3122 indeed
@@pedzad9528 sweet
Was very surprised to see the sponsor for this video as Wanted Dead was one of my favorite lower key releases this last year so happy to see it being promoted by one of my favorite content creators. Also yet another great look at Turtles media that I let pass me by, gives me a lot of inspiration to finally cut out the time to watch all the post 1987 series. I grew up on the original Turtles; had all the action figures, played all the Konami titles when they were new, and while I did sort of age out of them always kept at least one eye on whatever was going on but never committing. Discovered this channel when you were first doing the 2003 retrospective and were near the tail end of it, was the sickest I had been in years and during the time I took off work suddenly remembered being really interested in the couple of episodes of the show I had caught back when I was in college, and that coupled with all the recent gaming releases definitely rekindled my love for the franchise. Thank you again for reminding me that it's never too late to enjoy childhood passions. (Side note, also got me to give the Sly games a try and absolutely adore them, so yet another win for the channel).
I uh completely forgot about that two sets of characters thing that happened because of the time travel, I can’t believe they got away with just writing them off like that wtf.
Fun fact: after the supershedder and splinter fight on the roof in 4x25 splinter falls into a garvage truck and Casey then pulls the lever to squash him and says oops like in the 1990 movie, only it wasn't joyful
It was super shredder that felt into the garbage truck not splinter.
Season 4 is the best season of the 2012 TMNT imo. The space are was very good, better than 2/3rds of season 3 and 1/3rd of season 2, but the City at War/Battle With Shredder is the best arc from this show and the only flawless arc.
I always found so ridiculous that the turtles had 6 months of training and still got bodied by characters they shouldn't get bodied by
Good use of the Starship Phoenix theme at 7:20, it works.
15:56 I thought it was funny how Splinter said "SAKI WE DIE TOGETHER!!!" 😅😅😅
2:03 That's the first time that I heard someone talk about Wanted Dead without goofing about Main Character Lieutenant Hannah Stone being about 2,50 meters tall for no good reason.
Seriously, that fact makes some cutscenes unintentionally funny.
2003 is my favourite, but i love the 2012 series too. And despite it being such a sad scene, when Splinter dies for good, it was a great addition to the story which is also something we havent quite seen in TMNT animated/live action history
17:08 they made tokka planet sized! Mind blown imo
Loving the use of the Phoenix theme from up your arsenal when we're talking about the turtles in space
7:47 this was pretty much why I never moved forward with the show after season 2. Nickelodeon was become very inconsistent with episode releases and the story arcs were like a pacing roller coaster. So I pretty much went from an avid watcher to just watch random episodes. Doing the latter made me enjoy the show more, but man based on your lovely review and Jax Blade's review of every TMNT show, 2k12 struggles on a pacing level that the others don't have
I think raph and mona lisa relationship is probably the best ship in the show. All the other ones didn't need to be there but this ship actually fits so well and it was awesome to see someone actually being able to chill out raph like she did and well she actually was a creture not a human so that does help. Also I believe that the reason why the creators did the whole shipping thing is because people at the time were losing there mind over it some not even watching the show just there for the shipping of the characters and I think the creators maybe saw that as something needed for the show to do good sense people focused so much on it.
Would love to see "Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" after this
18:01-18:07 I like that they kept Jason Biggs as the voice Leo than redoing it with Seth Green
Actually, I added the flashback. It’s funny you say that because there is a moment where they flashback to Season 1’s first episode and they do redub it with Seth Green.
If i had a nickle everytime greg cripes and Ashley Johnston voiced love interests i have 4 nickles it isn't a lot but its weird it happened 4 times
Consistency is what I believe is the key word for this show. The good parts are consistently good. The characters are consistently written. And the bad parts are consistently bad.
Them having crushes on every woman they see makes sense because they grew up very isolated and curious about the outside world.
I love that Mona is a callback to the '87 turtles of a character I also shopped with raph. I think she was only in one episode but she was cool
I always like how leatherhead straight up murdered rahzar and its never talked about
For me personally the reason the Raph and Mona love thing works is because its not that weird when you compare it to the other relationships;
for example Donnie's love for april is mostly forced, creepy, and weird,
Leo and Karai's relationship is odd because theyre both siblings, even if it isnt biological,
and Michaelangelo's relationship with rennet is odd because rennet wasn't even alive when Mikey is, she's just time-travelling back to when Mikey was a similar age to her.
It also fits better, as Mona and Raph both love eachother, its a mutual feeling that isnt forced, they also have alot of things in common, their love for battle and rage, their protectiveness over their team and friends, and how they have a similiar age too.
Wouldn't the time travel be a infinite progression paradox. Where the turtles that left alway return to the battle, help win, leave with honeycome, go back in time, ect ect? It's honey all the way down.
I’m not joking when I say this everyone of the main characters other than splinter gets shipped
Hey J's Reviews! Great to see another video from you! :)
I guess there's just one more TMNT (2012) video left for you to talk about season 5.
Are you also going to review Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, including the Netflix movie?
I also wanted to know, do you take suggestions for reviews or is it just things you're interested in?
Oh wow, I could have sworn I saw the entire series because I remember watching the Turtles stop the Triceratons and Splinter surviving. I swore that was the last episode of the series because I didn't see anything else after that and then Nick's next iteration started and I wasn't a fan of it. I guess the show took a hiatus after episode 14 then and I some how missed everything. So imagine my surprise by the end of this video. Kinda wished I wished I did watch the series again. I may just do that for season 5 as I for sure never saw that. Thanks for another great review J
I kinda wish Shredder went in a different direction...
Shredder was incapacitated by Splinter using a martial arts technique. Shredder would then be transported back to Japan to retrieve treatment. Using ancient herbal healing to undo Splinters technique.
Shredder would then send his goons to find a hidden sacred relic. And afterwards, return to new york...
Shredder would lay out a trap. And then challenge the Turtles one last time to see who is the better. The Turtles would get the upper hand, forcing Shredder to take a last ditch attempt to win.
Standing under a device stockpiled with Mutagen. Shredder would first consume a powder. Then release the device, dropping the Mutagen onto himself. Shredder would then transform into a DRAGON; The Shredder Dragon. The powder with created from the claw of an ancient dragon from mythical times.
Shredder Dragon would rampage throughout new york, while the Turtles would fail to stop him and be forced to retreat.
Shredder Dragon and Splinter with Kari would face off. Splinter would get the upper hand but Kari would get injured. Shredder would then take more control over his Dragon form, being able to change into a Human Dragon hybrid. This would be called Dragon Shredder or Super Shredder. And allow Shredder to get the upper hand on Splinter.
Splinter incapacitated, Super Shredder would change to normal Shredder, then kill Splinter. Saying he does not need his new power to finish off an insignificant sewer rat.
When Shredder and the Turtles face off one last time. Shredder, Super Shredder, then full Shredder Dragon. In the end, the Turtles wound Shredder Dragon, causing Shredder Dragon to revert back to normal Shredder. Kari is there, and trying to finish off Shredder using the same insult he gave Splinter. But Shredder changes to Super Shredder and almost kills Kari. But is killed by Leo, saving her life.
Leo earns a legendary rank of ninja for killing a Dragon. and the story of TMNT 2012 continues...
Take a drink every time he says something about how good the 2003 series was or that he didn't watch 2012 originally...
I started with 1986 series and I love all the series (except Rise) equally, but my god, his obsession with the 2003 series bias shows heavily here
He’s a 2000s dude and like he said in the video, the 2012 series wasn’t supposed to be viewed like the 03 series and in my opinion, both are good and different in their own ways.
The shipping is what made me drop 2012 it just got really uncomfortable
“Krang Sub-Prime?”
“NO, Megan Fox!”
Anyone else find that funny?
A lot of fans were split on them spending half the season going back in time to save Splinter, only to kill them off at the end of the season again. But I would argue that the whole point of it is to show that, sometimes, tragedy is just inevitable. No matter how much time travel bullshit you go through. And I won't lie, Splinter's for real death on the show didn't get me to cry on my first viewing.
This season was cool, but I was kinda getting tired of all the fake out deads of Splinter, to the point that when it actually happened, it just didn't hit quite as hard as it should've. While it's a good thing that they build up to it instead of making it a surprise, I think they had to tone it down with how much he got tortured this season.
I'm sorry to say that Splinter's death fell flat to me. I think doing too make fake-outs ended up desensitizing me from it, despite the scene itself being good. I did like the final raid and Shredder's defeat, though.
lol ok so if the turtles actually died in the 2003 show would it have no impact since they faked their death multiple times before commercial breaks and in cliffhangers?