@@exxusdrugstore300 True that... with the poor top end oiling and numerous other issues, it didn't make much sense to have a solid lifter V8 that could spin to 5500 or so.🤔
@billyfromtheusa I've seen several FE's run 200K+ miles no issues other than being tired and full of sludge from poor oil changes. SBF's are also not known for oiling issues. I don't really get what the oiling issues with the FE's are other than they like to fill the valve covers full of oil when the oil is cold and thick. Same could be said for a lot of engines in that regard.
Dad had an Edsel wagon back in the day. It had the MEL motor. Mom drag raced some kids in a Mustang from top light, beat them easily. 4 year old me was in the car- different times. A Ford Victoria with a MEL would be a kickass period hotrod. Great video, nice to see something different.
Hah hah, I always wondered about the lineage of those engines. I had a 1962 Ford 'unibed' pickup that someone shoehorned a 430 into, and it was claimed to have come out of a Mercury Marauder police interceptor. I'm inclined to believe that, because that thing would pass everything but a gas station, and the weight distribution was so bad with that pile of iron over the front axle, that you had to put 200 lbs. of sandbags up against the tail gate just to get traction!!🤣
@@daleostrom3613 when I was growing up a buddies dad had one in a 53 Victoria 4vdoor with a straight axle 4 speed and oddball big Pontiac rear-end with 486 gears that thing would flat get it when you laid into the tri power on some leaded race gas that 430 was worked over a good bit with head work and cam and rods and pistons
It's cool to see all those old engines competing. When I grew up in the 70's we used to hear a lot of stories from the old guys about these obsolete engines, and it's cool to see what they can actually do. Please keep this category. And how about the old, nobody cares about them straight sixes and V sixes? I've seen some of those engines run very well in bracket cars.
@@marshallmcdowell3369 There's a video on YT about a guy that has a Chevy 292-6 running in vintage gasser rail. Ahh just found it again.. they really twist that big 6 to the moon for an 8.75 1/4 mile!😁 ruclips.net/video/B-wmItuply4/видео.html
@@marshallmcdowell3369 Slant six Chrysler's are legendary for being almost bullet proof but don't expect much when it comes to performance, they have a terrible con rod length to stroke ratio for a high rpm engine.
Wish the old man was alive to watch this. Engines like these and others were spoken about frequently however my family was into Pontiac's dad had 57 StarChief with one of 500 engines installed at the Factory for the Stock car mandates. The engine was a Duntov designed Pontiac (I believe it was a 347) either way it was fast for its day and he raced one of those Lincoln engine cars and won! FYI GMC used to use Pontiac car engine in its medium duty trucks in the late 50's early 60's and they were 347's great motors of the era.
MORE OF THIS, PLEASE!!! Detroit was cranking out so many crazy engines back then... and sadly, so many are forgotten. Cuz yeah, it's cheaper to just get a SBC, but a Chevy crate motor will never be as cool as a Packard V8. I think there is some confusion here, though... the photo with the "E-475" valve covers is an MEL engine, the next engine with the Continental valve covers is a 368 Y-block. The editing makes it seem like Steve is talking about the 368, but he's not. Sadly, there's no footage of the MEL running :(
Yeah, that would be amazing. For a few years, I have often wondered what would happen to early forced induction engines if they had some more modern forced induction technology as well as other modern technologies added to them. I'd love to see a stock-appearing factory supercharged engine that has modern technology hidden inside of it.
Jess Stuart I bet you would be cleaning parts up off the floor at that kind of rpm. At 8000 rpm the vavletrain would most likely give up. That would be fun to watch.
Very nice, i have to say i am a ford guy but i respect any old school iron, that's when shit was built to last. bulletproof everything back then i can appreciate that. today we have turbo lsx vs your whatever on the track back then it was my iron vs your iron. the way it should be..
Really cool class. Fewer people around today remember when nobody wanted a ford or chevy. They wanted the Buick, Olds, Pontiac, Lincoln, Chryslers because of the bigger engines crom the factory.
I drove my Oldsmobile 350 for a week to work and back with spun bearings all over in the bottom end. The rod big ends finally wallowed out large enough that the rod bolts contacted the pan, scrapped a hole in it, and all the oil drained out as I was going down the road. It finally chucked a rod shortly after this. The engine would get so hot on the way to work once the bearings were spun, that it wouldn't turn with the starter until it sat and cooled down for several hours. Then it would run long enough to get home again. By the time I got close to home, you could just HEAR the engine laboring as it was starting to seize up again. The thing started sounded like a jack-hammer as the pistons started hitting the heads towards the end of 'er. 😆 My neighbors prolly thought "WTF is that RACKET??" when I would fire it up at 5:30a.m. to head off to work. 😂 It was a tough motor for sure... 👍
Your comment says it all. And like most of us from the 50's and 60's. Chevy had all the adv, speed parts were everywhere for that engine. However, both Ford, Mopar, and AMC. They had to be good from the factory because the aftermarket was just so small for those companies' cars. Makes you wonder if the situation was different and either Ford or Mopar had the same parts available for their engines, how different thing would be. There was a local guy who ran a Y block. And to date no one knew what he did to that engine, he shifted at 7K and had no trouble with any of the local Chevy guys cars. Usually pulling them by a couple of cars. Later he got a Mustang 427FE and took it up the same way. It got so people would run him, but seldom for cash,lol. True that!
I wish someone would have entered this competition with an old Lycoming V8 that Auburns-Cords-Duesenbergs used to be outfitted with. For their day, these are seriously impressive engines.
That last motor sounded like it might have been detonating pretty bad when the really laid the brake to it. Definitely would be interesting to learn what the failure mode was on it. Cool weird stuff for sure!
Hi all, Lily's husband here. Am I the only person on the planet who has noticed that the Chrysler B/RB and Chevy small block engines are virtual copies of the Lincoln Y block? Yes, there are some minor differences but they are outweighed by the similarities, especially when it comes to the head designs. The Chrysler is basically a scaled-up Lincoln Y-block and the Chevy is basically a scaled-down Lincoln Y-block. This engine deserves more respect.
Can you do a 20 or 30 minute verion of this ? This short verion of the oddball engines was really entertaining. Any time the dyno room has to be opened up in a hurry makes for good TV. This is an engine class worth promoting the hell out of. No one says no to catastrophic engine failure video footage. You may have to beef up the dyno control room room door with an old time bank vault door & frame , line the walls with multiple layers of ballistic material & swap out the plexiglass for armoured glass , all this stuff is free to take from a bank that has gone out of business , demolition people will pay you to take away to armoured room materials as it is no longer of any commercial value. Turning the dyno control room into a "bunker" also makes things a lot quieter inside & makes the computers etc housed inside it , less prone to damage & theft. The people who put all the extra time & effort into reworking these ecclectic engines deserve much more coverage. Also good to see no one is trying to get 300 HP outta a Ford Flathead. I'd suggest running an "open" straight 8 class , to show how well the 1920/30's engines like a DOHC 427 Dusenberg , Packard Super 8's etc go against the last of the straight 8's from the 1950's.
My cousin was Jim Hendrickson(modified champion X3), My dad was Harold Miller, Dad did an engine build contest back in the 60's or 70's and used a marine engine and turned it backwards and made 800hp. I wish my dad was here today so he can tell you about it. Also my cousin Doc Miller and Uncle Buck Miller race at Islip Speed way. My Dad was a genius.
The chrysler hemi marine motors were all backwards. The transmission hooked up to what normally mounted the harmonic balancer. The motors were all gear driven even the generator was driven by a gear drive.
all of the GM marine engines also ran backwards, so reversing that puts it back to normal, changers the firing order...the marine heads were non-sensational, on the street considered junk...I use to run an old .327 marine engine in my 64 chevy c-10...upgrading the heads was fantastic...(202 double hump heads from a 1965 .327 SS Impala)
It just isn't possible for a flathead engine to make the same power as an OHV engine. One reason is that the combustion chamber shape is far from ideal. 7.5:1 is the most you would want to run on a pump gas Ford Flathead. That is why you will only see OHV engines unless a seperate flathead engine league is created.
I've always loved seeing people build up old pre-war and postwar engines. That Packard power plant looked awesome. I would love to see an old Packard V12 built to make power and put into something like a older Jag or an old LTD or something along those lines. I have alot of really cool ideas but sadly, no money to make them a reality...
my dad was a Ford man and me also. when u was seven years old in 1969 he bought 58 mercury off an old man, it was sitting out in the field by this old man's house, I think he paid 30 bucks for it. turns out it had the 430 cubic inch motor in it, I don't know if it was the 400 HP version but it could have been because I'm here to tell you that sob would run.
The M.E.L. not only won at the dragstrip. A Thunderbird with a 430 M.E.L. won NASCAR once. I think, it was in '59. The driver of that Thunderbird complained about the excess weight of that engine affecting handling
I would really like to return to being involved with all things automotive,including all forms of racing. The trouble is the cost and I am no longer a young man (past 60). I do remember taking most every bit from many paychecks for "go fast" parts for a class 2 off road car I was involved with in the mid 70's. How guys find the money to do this stuff today is really a mystery. It was possible for the average group of working men to field a mildly competitive car in those early days.
My buddy made good $$ street racing his 69 W-31 back in the 70's.....took all the $$ from the "rich kids" with their "Bitchen Z28's". Good thing because he needed the $$ for his broken air scoop fund....they were around $30 as I recall.
Love the vintage engines and the engineering Solution these teams came up with....Kaase's MEL was from another demention.. outside the Box....and down the street....lol
That 1957 Lincoln engine is related to the Y-Block, it is not an MEL series big block engine and it's a much older design than the MEL series. The MEL series came out in 1958 and it's distantly related to the FE big block which also came out in 1958.
Yeah, but they aren't exactly uncommon when it comes to early, modified American v-8's. It was those early hemis that were used in all sorts of drag racing applications from the 50s and early 60s. They provided Mopar the inspiration to create the 426 Hemi. The purpose of the engine challenge in this video was to experiment with engines that weren't commonly used as performance engines. I'm a Ford guy, and although I've heard of early hemi engines being modified since I was a teenager in the 80s, it wasn't until maybe last year that I first heard of Ford Y blocks being modified, and not until today that Ive first heard of a Ford 'MEL' engine being modified.....
@@neiltitmus9744 Yeah the early pre-426 Hemis were used a LOT in racing, which is why Mopar brought back the design in a larger package for stock car and drag racing in mid 60s. That fact means that building them here would defeat the whole purpose of this show. They may as well bring in a Chevy 350 while they are at it! Lol. I think it's super cool that they are getting BIG power from old, relatively small cubic inch, Ford Y block engines, despite almost non-existent aftermarket high performance parts support. After watching this originally, I looked into the Y block a little deeper, and it turns out that the very design that gives it it's "Y block" name, makes it a very stiff, strong platform. Its called a Y block because the bottom end skirts drop down below the crankshaft center line, giving it a Y appearance when looked at from the front or back, and that lower skirt design provides increased stiffness and stability to the engine when compared to engines with shallower skirts. The so called 'replacement' for the Y block was the FE series of big blocks. But they really weren't replacements, as much as it was a larger companion to the smaller Y block in this video. The much more famous FE 390, 406, 427, 428CJ were also a Y block design.
The Poly engine that caught fire did not blow up. The oil filer gasket blew out and sprayed oil on the header Engine dyno pulls do not hurt the engines. Mine has 250 dyno pulls on it and 2 yrs of racing .. I made 12 pulls in 35 minutes and it did not even breathe hard
I always thought a dyno was good for your engine. It provides a great place to do a break in and you can save hours and miles when you are tuning. I feel that if you blow it up on the dyno you would have blown it up in the car. How many blown engines have put a beautiful old car body into the wall at the drag strip? If you are going to lose the engine no point in losing the car also. Any respectable dyno shop will have the equipment to check air fuel ratio and that can save you being lean on a new rebuild.
My dad was a die-hard Lincoln man, so I i got the FoMoCo bug when I started driving in 1961. Messed around with 272, 292, 312 fords and 368, 430 Lincolns. The factory porting really stank on the "Y" block heads. The only way Ford ever got any honest HP out of the 312 was to put a Paxton Blower on the 1957 T-Bird (in answer to the Rochester F.I. in the 57 'Vette).
Frank Fish; Actually, I have some old magazines from the 50s. THEY did performance testing on many brands with largest v8 and single 4 barrel carb. The 312 ford was substantially faster than the 283 chevy.
Yes pre 1930 engines, big 4, Ford and Dodge side valves and the fragile casting Chev 4 OHV, also the olds OHV. Engines no one has really advanced these engines with innovation for 60 + years. Other than some of the old time hill climb racers and later LSRs. The casting quality of some of these engines is amazing when you think of when they were made Go right back to the true roots of hotrodding :)
I hear that the power potential of the old Ford 4-bangers can surge well over 100hp. But when you think about it, they had 40 originally that's actually pretty badass. I respect the small block Chevy because of it's humble beginnings and how it dominated the market and all that. HOWEVER, I am sick and tired of every... single... engine... in a hot rod ever... being a 350 Chevy. I see guys with $50,000 dollar restomods and they drop a JEGS catalog motor in it. It screams to the audience "I have zero creativity".
Vinny, hot rods aren't all about creativity necessarily, it can be just as much about the old style with reliable modern motivation, nothing wrong with a crate motor.
bluepov Your right theres nothing wrong at all with a crate engine, he just said that would take it back to the roots of hotrodding, either way is cool in my opinion
Lot of people have been asking if this or that engine would be eligible. Here are the rules as currently written. Note that exceptions have been made for engines that follow the spirit of the competition.. Early Hemis are excluded because they typically have their own class. If someone wanted to run an Early AMC V-8 and was serious about bringing one, I am sure an exception would be granted. Keep in mind the test rpm range is 3500 to 6500 rpm.. Some of the heavy duty big displacement engines could never do that.. Also cubic in does not rule because your ave torque and horsepower is divided by cubic inches to produce the score.. 300 - ENGINE - updated 2/10/16 Normally Aspirated OEM domestic production passenger car V8 engine types or families introduced in 1954 or earlier. Normally aspirated OEM domestic production passenger car inline 6-cylinder engine types or families introduced in 1964 or earlier. Other antique V8 engine families introduced after 1954 allowed by specific listing. Listed engines include: Nailhead Buick, Packard V8, Y-block Ford, Ford Motor Corporation "MEL-Series, and Chrysler 1956-1967 A-Series Polyspheric small block. Other antique 6-cylinder engine types introduced after 1964 may allowed by specific listing.
Which engine had the most available factory power in the 1950's? Think the 392 Chrysler Hemi? Wrong, it was an MEL, Mercury "Super Marauder" with 400 horsepower in 1958. Steve you were right on top of this one.
Stephen M they came factory supercharged seemed to be best due to their long stroke make tons of power off idle maybe two small snails that spool fast cause i wouldnt want to rev those behemoths too tight
I really like you guys doing these video builds and reviews, detailed builds this engine masters challenge stuff. I've turned into a RUclips junky on account of you guys. More More More lol lol 😆
I was 15 and licensed in 1960. the fast old cars around were chrysler, chevrolet, cadilac, olds, pontiac, buick, some fords did pretty good. my dad had a 56 chevy 205hp 265, one uncle had a 230hp 283 57 chevy. a neighbor had a fast big engine AMC with push button trans selector. but the fastest car was a 56 dodge 300D that was a factory 3 speed column shift. I put a hopped up 283 in my 48 chevrolet. It was really the chevy small block because it was fast and cheap. Minnesota so not high altitude. The 283 with carter WCFB carb worked very nice. my 48 would go an honest 120mph(2 measured miles in 60 seconds). how the rayon 4 ply 600-16 tires up front took that still amazes me. I was a dumb lucky kid for sure. no scatter shield, no seat belts just luck.
I love the weird stuff! I'm a Chevy guy, but it is too easy to buy crate motors of small and big block Chevy stuff and make lots of power. The creativity of building some off-brand seldom-seen engine is hot rodding at its finest. I have a GMC big block V6 I have been working on. Maybe I should enter that.
Loved the video but I have 1 problem with it. Noone brought a 390 FE ford engine out to the dyno. Why not? I still race with a 390 engine in an all steel truck that does 12.0 On premium unleaded.
@@gordomiguel1931 Even with that limitation, they were still torque monsters out of the box. The old '63 Riviera's were the only car that year to outrun the Vette! With 401 cubes and 425 ft. lbs. of torque, they were tricky to launch without turning the tires (at least as big tire as you could fit in the wheel wells).😁
Really cool class. Fewer people around today remember when nobody wanted a ford or chevy. They wanted the Buick, Olds, Pontiac, Cadillac, Lincoln, Chryslers because of the bigger engines from the factory.
The class is for engines designed before 1955. The Y-Block design goes back to 1952 for the Lincoln version, and 1954 for the Ford version (basically, Lincoln is the "big block" Y, Ford is the "small block" Y). Even if it was made after 55, it is eligible for the class because it is still a pre 55 design.
The class is Pre-1954 not '55. That means the engine had to designed and into production prior to 1954 and if they used the same engine till 1960 it doesnt matter because it was designed prior to 1954. Simple really.
The MEL isn't so weird. It was sort of the precursor to the Ford 385 series in that it had the same bore spacing. That is a fairly important issue when you are an engine manufacturer as the tooling on the block machining line is a major investment, and you would like to use it again if you can. The old Lincoln version went up to 462 cubic inches. The Ford Super Duty V8 was another weird one. It had 477 and 534 cubic inch versions, and a combustion chamber design that was similar to the Chevy W-motor 348 and 409.
The W series is obviously less common than its replacements, but they were NOT uncommon at all in high performance applications during their heyday. When there's a Beach Boys song that sings the praises of a factory high performance car AND it's high performance production engine, then it was pretty common.
They are all genius works of art that can only come from extraordinary professionals who remain true to their passion for crunchy idle sounds
Our MK4 1966 Lincoln project car actually has a 462 MEL big block. Beautiful engine, glad to see someone even mention one!
got to love the sound of them old Y blocks..
Mad Mod I used to drive alot of old dump trucks around farms that had 262,and 292's in them if they ran anywhere near decent they all sounded good.
They have a distinct "yelp" that you don't really hear from other old-school V8's. Too bad Ford set them up to be boat anchors, same with the MEL.
@@exxusdrugstore300 True that... with the poor top end oiling and numerous other issues, it didn't make much sense to have a solid lifter V8 that could spin to 5500 or so.🤔
@@danw1955 oiling problems are pretty much a standard feature on Ford engines,Ford never really had a great engine.
@billyfromtheusa I've seen several FE's run 200K+ miles no issues other than being tired and full of sludge from poor oil changes. SBF's are also not known for oiling issues. I don't really get what the oiling issues with the FE's are other than they like to fill the valve covers full of oil when the oil is cold and thick. Same could be said for a lot of engines in that regard.
Dad had an Edsel wagon back in the day. It had the MEL motor. Mom drag raced some kids in a Mustang from top light, beat them easily. 4 year old me was in the car- different times. A Ford Victoria with a MEL would be a kickass period hotrod. Great video, nice to see something different.
Yea, the ole straight-six, 3 on the tree, mustangs could be beat by anything back then. They were turds
That 383 lincoln looks and sounds amazing !!
dam id love to have that 383 lincoln engine in my 68' continental.... those valve covers were badass
hah. sometimes it feels that long
They were actually underrated from the factory for insurance purposes. They were actually closer to 72 feet.
Valve covers we're art also 2 center bolts can't get easier than that
your '68 Continental should of had a 462 stock which was an MEL engine, the valve covers should fit if you can find a pair
come again?!? your saying the covers off the 383 will fit the 462 MEL?
My dad's got a 430 MEL in his 58' Mercury Park Lane, and when the four barrel kicks in, man does that car go.
Hah hah, I always wondered about the lineage of those engines. I had a 1962 Ford 'unibed' pickup that someone shoehorned a 430 into, and it was claimed to have come out of a Mercury Marauder police interceptor. I'm inclined to believe that, because that thing would pass everything but a gas station, and the weight distribution was so bad with that pile of iron over the front axle, that you had to put 200 lbs. of sandbags up against the tail gate just to get traction!!🤣
My dad had a pink 58 Mercury Monterey with the 383 engine in it had lots of power !
That 430 MEL could be purchased with tri power in 1958. That was the first American V8 to make 400 HP.
@@daleostrom3613 when I was growing up a buddies dad had one in a 53 Victoria 4vdoor with a straight axle 4 speed and oddball big Pontiac rear-end with 486 gears that thing would flat get it when you laid into the tri power on some leaded race gas that 430 was worked over a good bit with head work and cam and rods and pistons
Kettering style Caddys and Olds engines were awesome also👍
Love those Lincoln valve covers.
Had a V8 330ci olds "Jetfire Rocket" out of a 4-4-2. Years ago in the 80's
It's cool to see all those old engines competing. When I grew up in the 70's we used to hear a lot of stories from the old guys about these obsolete engines, and it's cool to see what they can actually do. Please keep this category. And how about the old, nobody cares about them straight sixes and V sixes? I've seen some of those engines run very well in bracket cars.
Kenneth Cohagen is love to see the old slant six, AMC 258, chevy 292, and ford 300 compete
@@marshallmcdowell3369 There's a video on YT about a guy that has a Chevy 292-6 running in vintage gasser rail. Ahh just found it again.. they really twist that big 6 to the moon for an 8.75 1/4 mile!😁 ruclips.net/video/B-wmItuply4/видео.html
@@marshallmcdowell3369
Slant six Chrysler's are legendary for being almost bullet proof but don't expect much when it comes to performance, they have a terrible con rod length to stroke ratio for a high rpm engine.
Dan W ruclips.net/video/zzwmr3OAb3g/видео.html here’s a very nice 300. They wind it up into another galaxy!!
Look up the Brazillian Opal drag racers using stovebolt Chevy 6's. They run in the 7's.
Wish the old man was alive to watch this. Engines like these and others were spoken about frequently however my family was into Pontiac's dad had 57 StarChief with one of 500 engines installed at the Factory for the Stock car mandates. The engine was a Duntov designed Pontiac (I believe it was a 347) either way it was fast for its day and he raced one of those Lincoln engine cars and won! FYI GMC used to use Pontiac car engine in its medium duty trucks in the late 50's early 60's and they were 347's great motors of the era.
The Poly at the end was awesome. Disappointed we didn't get to hear about that one...
The one that exploded? 5:00
Oooh the humanity
I did some reading on that engine, all it did was push the gasket out around the oil filter and dumped oil on the headers
@@powerstroke20111 thank god
@@powerstroke20111 - Would have been nice if they mentioned that in the video. Looked like a rod exited through the side of the block.
MORE OF THIS, PLEASE!!! Detroit was cranking out so many crazy engines back then... and sadly, so many are forgotten. Cuz yeah, it's cheaper to just get a SBC, but a Chevy crate motor will never be as cool as a Packard V8.
I think there is some confusion here, though... the photo with the "E-475" valve covers is an MEL engine, the next engine with the Continental valve covers is a 368 Y-block. The editing makes it seem like Steve is talking about the 368, but he's not. Sadly, there's no footage of the MEL running :(
Love the oddball stuff, roddin' at its finest!
I want to see some supercharged Studebaker V8s!
Yeah, that would be amazing. For a few years, I have often wondered what would happen to early forced induction engines if they had some more modern forced induction technology as well as other modern technologies added to them. I'd love to see a stock-appearing factory supercharged engine that has modern technology hidden inside of it.
Retroman why the V8? inline 8, now thats the way to go.
Yes do an R3 289 build.
Those were solid lifter motors. With the R3 heads, I bet you would make peak hp at around 8000 rpm.
Jess Stuart I bet you would be cleaning parts up off the floor at that kind of rpm. At 8000 rpm the vavletrain would most likely give up. That would be fun to watch.
My first car was a 57 Ford with a 312 Y Block V-8.
Those Lincoln valve covers are swanky as fuck
Yes they are, good looking engine all around. All those old engines look cool with modern single planes and tunnel rams on them.
Robin S
Debbie Warlow
Robin S and how
wow that episode went out with a bang
Very impressive work!
Very nice, i have to say i am a ford guy but i respect any old school iron, that's when shit was built to last. bulletproof everything back then i can appreciate that. today we have turbo lsx vs your whatever on the track back then it was my iron vs your iron. the way it should be..
Really cool class. Fewer people around today remember when nobody wanted a ford or chevy. They wanted the Buick, Olds, Pontiac, Lincoln, Chryslers because of the bigger engines crom the factory.
I almost said Lincoln is part of Ford 🤣🤣🤣 dam that rlly was back in the day
Lincoln engine looks awesome
they used that lincoln block in super duty ford trucks until 1963 i don't know why they had more powerful V8
I love those valve covers!!
The Mel's are Way cool. 👍
318 poly. Serious hp can be got from it. (1/2" wider than a 440.) Drove mine 30 miles with a hole in the sump.
I drove my Oldsmobile 350 for a week to work and back with spun bearings all over in the bottom end. The rod big ends finally wallowed out large enough that the rod bolts contacted the pan, scrapped a hole in it, and all the oil drained out as I was going down the road. It finally chucked a rod shortly after this.
The engine would get so hot on the way to work once the bearings were spun, that it wouldn't turn with the starter until it sat and cooled down for several hours. Then it would run long enough to get home again. By the time I got close to home, you could just HEAR the engine laboring as it was starting to seize up again. The thing started sounded like a jack-hammer as the pistons started hitting the heads towards the end of 'er. 😆 My neighbors prolly thought "WTF is that RACKET??" when I would fire it up at 5:30a.m. to head off to work. 😂
It was a tough motor for sure... 👍
Your comment says it all. And like most of us from the 50's and 60's. Chevy had all the adv, speed parts were everywhere for that engine. However, both Ford, Mopar, and AMC. They had to be good from the factory because the aftermarket was just so small for those companies' cars. Makes you wonder if the situation was different and either Ford or Mopar had the same parts available for their engines, how different thing would be. There was a local guy who ran a Y block. And to date no one knew what he did to that engine, he shifted at 7K and had no trouble with any of the local Chevy guys cars. Usually pulling them by a couple of cars. Later he got a Mustang 427FE and took it up the same way. It got so people would run him, but seldom for cash,lol. True that!
I need to see a 534 BBF hotrodded in this competition.
I wish someone would have entered this competition with an old Lycoming V8 that Auburns-Cords-Duesenbergs used to be outfitted with. For their day, these are seriously impressive engines.
The odder the better, 400 hp from an obscure engine nobody knows much about but you, what could be better
That last engine, I was cringing the whole time. Could hear that detonation from a mile away...
............f
What a great comp, glad you guys took it over after Popular Hottrodding went bust. Love this kind of coverage, please, please, please give us more...
3:37 the sound is so smooth!!..very classy looking looking motor!!..
That last motor sounded like it might have been detonating pretty bad when the really laid the brake to it. Definitely would be interesting to learn what the failure mode was on it. Cool weird stuff for sure!
Hi all, Lily's husband here. Am I the only person on the planet who has noticed that the Chrysler B/RB and Chevy small block engines are virtual copies of the Lincoln Y block? Yes, there are some minor differences but they are outweighed by the similarities, especially when it comes to the head designs. The Chrysler is basically a scaled-up Lincoln Y-block and the Chevy is basically a scaled-down Lincoln Y-block. This engine deserves more respect.
Can you do a 20 or 30 minute verion of this ? This short verion of the oddball engines was really entertaining. Any time the dyno room has to be opened up in a hurry makes for good TV. This is an engine class worth promoting the hell out of. No one says no to catastrophic engine failure video footage.
You may have to beef up the dyno control room room door with an old time bank vault door & frame , line the walls with multiple layers of ballistic material & swap out the plexiglass for armoured glass , all this stuff is free to take from a bank that has gone out of business , demolition people will pay you to take away to armoured room materials as it is no longer of any commercial value. Turning the dyno control room into a "bunker" also makes things a lot quieter inside & makes the computers etc housed inside it , less prone to damage & theft.
The people who put all the extra time & effort into reworking these ecclectic engines deserve much more coverage. Also good to see no one is trying to get 300 HP outta a Ford Flathead.
I'd suggest running an "open" straight 8 class , to show how well the 1920/30's engines like a DOHC 427 Dusenberg , Packard Super 8's etc go against the last of the straight 8's from the 1950's.
My cousin was Jim Hendrickson(modified champion X3), My dad was Harold Miller, Dad did an engine build contest back in the 60's or 70's and used a marine engine and turned it backwards and made 800hp. I wish my dad was here today so he can tell you about it. Also my cousin Doc Miller and Uncle Buck Miller race at Islip Speed way. My Dad was a genius.
The chrysler hemi marine motors were all backwards. The transmission hooked up to what normally mounted the harmonic balancer. The motors were all gear driven even the generator was driven by a gear drive.
all of the GM marine engines also ran backwards, so reversing that puts it back to normal, changers the firing order...the marine heads were non-sensational, on the street considered junk...I use to run an old .327 marine engine in my 64 chevy c-10...upgrading the heads was fantastic...(202 double hump heads from a 1965 .327 SS Impala)
If they knew about heading the heads and
welding in flow channels. Glad you engine guys know what in mean.
Love this Competition....Everything here had to be adapted or custom fabricated....Old School Hotrodding....at its best..👍
Aw damn I was looking forward to seeing a flathead in there
Big Mike me to
It just isn't possible for a flathead engine to make the same power as an OHV engine. One reason is that the combustion chamber shape is far from ideal. 7.5:1 is the most you would want to run on a pump gas Ford Flathead.
That is why you will only see OHV engines unless a seperate flathead engine league is created.
I've always loved seeing people build up old pre-war and postwar engines. That Packard power plant looked awesome. I would love to see an old Packard V12 built to make power and put into something like a older Jag or an old LTD or something along those lines. I have alot of really cool ideas but sadly, no money to make them a reality...
Yeah, me too. I feel your pain.
i want to turn my 400 small block in my 68 impala into a 8000 rpm 377....
but...money...
my dad was a Ford man and me also. when u was seven years old in 1969 he bought 58 mercury off an old man, it was sitting out in the field by this old man's house, I think he paid 30 bucks for it. turns out it had the 430 cubic inch motor in it, I don't know if it was the 400 HP version but it could have been because I'm here to tell you that sob would run.
Dad's 462 MEL in his continental laid black lines as long as you wanted.
Dulcich, come on let us see those blaze red eyes.
The M.E.L. not only won at the dragstrip. A Thunderbird with a 430 M.E.L. won NASCAR once. I think, it was in '59. The driver of that Thunderbird complained about the excess weight of that engine affecting handling
I would really like to return to being involved with all things automotive,including all forms of racing. The trouble is the cost and I am no longer a young man (past 60). I do remember taking most every bit from many paychecks for "go fast" parts for a class 2 off road car I was involved with in the mid 70's. How guys find the money to do this stuff today is really a mystery. It was possible for the average group of working men to field a mildly competitive car in those early days.
These days the middle man has two options. Save away and build something mild, or build it junky, cheap but smart and watch some magic happen.
The ol' Lincoln engine had some grunt!
Can we get a video of the Olds that scored 2nd in small block? That'd be awesome!
My buddy made good $$ street racing his 69 W-31 back in the 70's.....took all the $$ from the "rich kids" with their "Bitchen Z28's". Good thing because he needed the $$ for his broken air scoop fund....they were around $30 as I recall.
Love the vintage engines and the engineering Solution these teams came up with....Kaase's MEL was from another demention.. outside the Box....and down the street....lol
They need a category for flathead v8s and packard straight 8 engines
Dude it would take “masters” to get extreme performance out of those
That 1957 Lincoln engine is related to the Y-Block, it is not an MEL series big block engine and it's a much older design than the MEL series. The MEL series came out in 1958 and it's distantly related to the FE big block which also came out in 1958.
Hooray!!! My request has been fulfilled!!! Proud owner of a 66 Chevy with a 350 Buick.
No one showed up with a 534 CID Ford Super Duty engine? By the way the first MELs were 1958 along with the first FE's at FT's
A 534 weighs about 1300 lbs dry. That's probably why.
Ah the classic window block v8!
that was nice, I really appreciate your efforts
I'm surprised there weren't any 1st Gen Hemi's. I know they make good power on the dyno. I've seen plenty using iron heads making 550hp plus.
1967davethewave too obvious I guess. Not oddball enough.
Yeah, but they aren't exactly uncommon when it comes to early, modified American v-8's. It was those early hemis that were used in all sorts of drag racing applications from the 50s and early 60s. They provided Mopar the inspiration to create the 426 Hemi. The purpose of the engine challenge in this video was to experiment with engines that weren't commonly used as performance engines.
I'm a Ford guy, and although I've heard of early hemi engines being modified since I was a teenager in the 80s, it wasn't until maybe last year that I first heard of Ford Y blocks being modified, and not until today that Ive first heard of a Ford 'MEL' engine being modified.....
Kinda missed the point in the video
You kinda missed the point these were engines not usually used for race power i think the hemi probably was .
@@neiltitmus9744 Yeah the early pre-426 Hemis were used a LOT in racing, which is why Mopar brought back the design in a larger package for stock car and drag racing in mid 60s. That fact means that building them here would defeat the whole purpose of this show. They may as well bring in a Chevy 350 while they are at it! Lol. I think it's super cool that they are getting BIG power from old, relatively small cubic inch, Ford Y block engines, despite almost non-existent aftermarket high performance parts support.
After watching this originally, I looked into the Y block a little deeper, and it turns out that the very design that gives it it's "Y block" name, makes it a very stiff, strong platform. Its called a Y block because the bottom end skirts drop down below the crankshaft center line, giving it a Y appearance when looked at from the front or back, and that lower skirt design provides increased stiffness and stability to the engine when compared to engines with shallower skirts. The so called 'replacement' for the Y block was the FE series of big blocks. But they really weren't replacements, as much as it was a larger companion to the smaller Y block in this video. The much more famous FE 390, 406, 427, 428CJ were also a Y block design.
I had a friend who had a 410 MEL out of an edsel in a 60 Ford starliner that was wicked fast
More of this sort of stuff please
the MEL engine came in 2nd place at the debut first Daytona 500 when they opened the paved track in late 1950's- it was a photo finish -
Love the y blocks. I got one In a 59 f100. Only thing that bothers it is noy being ran much. But she dose run OK and will start at near 0 degrees
Early in the pull you could hear that polysphere detonating....
More of this please!
Let's see more of this!
The Poly engine that caught fire did not blow up. The oil filer gasket blew out and sprayed oil on the header
Engine dyno pulls do not hurt the engines. Mine has 250 dyno pulls on it and 2 yrs of racing .. I made 12 pulls in 35 minutes and it did not even breathe hard
Thanks for the info.
H. D. Yep. That Poly is in another video somewhere and they explain what the actual issue was.
I love those poly valve covers because they remind me of a 3208 Caterpillar V8.
www.hotrod.com/articles/video-fire-engulfs-mopar-small-block-engine-masters-2016/
I always thought a dyno was good for your engine. It provides a great place to do a break in and you can save hours and miles when you are tuning. I feel that if you blow it up on the dyno you would have blown it up in the car. How many blown engines have put a beautiful old car body into the wall at the drag strip? If you are going to lose the engine no point in losing the car also. Any respectable dyno shop will have the equipment to check air fuel ratio and that can save you being lean on a new rebuild.
In 1967 we found out that a 1960 Mercury Montclair 430 MEL could out top end a 275 hp 327 Camao. 5 people in each car.
My dad was a die-hard Lincoln man, so I i got the FoMoCo bug when I started driving in 1961. Messed around with 272, 292, 312 fords and 368, 430 Lincolns. The factory porting really stank on the "Y" block heads. The only way Ford ever got any honest HP out of the 312 was to put a Paxton Blower on the 1957 T-Bird (in answer to the Rochester F.I. in the 57 'Vette).
Frank Fish; Actually, I have some old magazines from the 50s. THEY did performance testing on many brands with largest v8 and single 4 barrel carb. The 312 ford was substantially faster than the 283 chevy.
Yes pre 1930 engines, big 4, Ford and Dodge side valves and the fragile casting Chev 4 OHV, also the olds OHV.
Engines no one has really advanced these engines with innovation for 60 + years. Other than some of the old time hill climb racers and later LSRs.
The casting quality of some of these engines is amazing when you think of when they were made
Go right back to the true roots of hotrodding :)
I hear that the power potential of the old Ford 4-bangers can surge well over 100hp. But when you think about it, they had 40 originally that's actually pretty badass. I respect the small block Chevy because of it's humble beginnings and how it dominated the market and all that. HOWEVER, I am sick and tired of every... single... engine... in a hot rod ever... being a 350 Chevy. I see guys with $50,000 dollar restomods and they drop a JEGS catalog motor in it. It screams to the audience "I have zero creativity".
Vinny, hot rods aren't all about creativity necessarily, it can be just as much
about the old style with reliable modern motivation, nothing wrong with
a crate motor.
bluepov Your right theres nothing wrong at all with a crate engine, he just said that would take it back to the roots of hotrodding, either way is cool in my opinion
I LOVE this!
Dear Poly...RIP.
HOT FIRE at the end
Lot of people have been asking if this or that engine would be eligible. Here are the rules as currently written. Note that exceptions have been made for engines that follow the spirit of the competition.. Early Hemis are excluded because they typically have their own class. If someone wanted to run an Early AMC V-8 and was serious about bringing one, I am sure an exception would be granted. Keep in mind the test rpm range is 3500 to 6500 rpm.. Some of the heavy duty big displacement engines could never do that.. Also cubic in does not rule because your ave torque and horsepower is divided by cubic inches to produce the score..
300
- ENGINE - updated 2/10/16
Normally
Aspirated OEM domestic production passenger car V8 engine types or families
introduced in 1954 or earlier. Normally aspirated OEM domestic production
passenger car inline 6-cylinder engine types or families introduced in 1964 or
earlier. Other antique V8 engine families introduced after 1954 allowed by
specific listing. Listed engines include: Nailhead Buick, Packard V8, Y-block Ford,
Ford Motor Corporation "MEL-Series, and
Chrysler 1956-1967 A-Series Polyspheric small block. Other antique 6-cylinder
engine types introduced after 1964 may allowed by specific listing.
i want Steves sunglasses!
1960 430 T bird NASCAR engine . They were very fast in their day like the Beach Boy's said in their music .
Can you guys do 1000 HP with an AMC motor? I think that ringbrothers Javelin shouldve had a true AMC mill in it
Were are the Dodge/ Desoto Firedome 331, 341.302 CDI in this test!!!
Great Steve is selling coke again.
He never stopped!
Powder or crack?
I’d like to see a GMC 637 industrial V8 on the dyno...
Cool stuff; has anyone done a nail head? I would love to see what they could do with one of those old torque monsters.
How does a straight eight do compared to v8? I got a flat-head, but I think a fireball would be interesting.
Straight 8s had a Big stroke (4.125" or 4.3125") and a Very small bore (
Which engine had the most available factory power in the 1950's? Think the 392 Chrysler Hemi? Wrong, it was an MEL, Mercury "Super Marauder" with 400 horsepower in 1958. Steve you were right on top of this one.
turbo some big block GM v-6's
Stephen M they came factory supercharged seemed to be best due to their long stroke make tons of power off idle maybe two small snails that spool fast cause i wouldnt want to rev those behemoths too tight
Jake Browne when did they supercharge their v6's?
Jack Spella the gm 6-61 blowers originally came off the big v6 large gas truck motors hence the 6 designation in the name
I really like you guys doing these video builds and reviews, detailed builds this engine masters challenge stuff. I've turned into a RUclips junky on account of you guys. More More More lol lol 😆
I was 15 and licensed in 1960. the fast old cars around were chrysler, chevrolet, cadilac, olds, pontiac, buick, some fords did pretty good. my dad had a 56 chevy 205hp 265, one uncle had a 230hp 283 57 chevy. a neighbor had a fast big engine AMC with push button trans selector. but the fastest car was a 56 dodge 300D that was a factory 3 speed column shift. I put a hopped up 283 in my 48 chevrolet. It was really the chevy small block because it was fast and cheap. Minnesota so not high altitude. The 283 with carter WCFB carb worked very nice. my 48 would go an honest 120mph(2 measured miles in 60 seconds). how the rayon 4 ply 600-16 tires up front took that still amazes me. I was a dumb lucky kid for sure. no scatter shield, no seat belts just luck.
I love the weird stuff! I'm a Chevy guy, but it is too easy to buy crate motors of small and big block Chevy stuff and make lots of power. The creativity of building some off-brand seldom-seen engine is hot rodding at its finest. I have a GMC big block V6 I have been working on. Maybe I should enter that.
I liked the look of Royce Becklers continental
Did that polysphere blow up? and it would be cool to see something like a desoto firedome on this show
Loved the video but I have 1 problem with it. Noone brought a 390 FE ford engine out to the dyno. Why not? I still race with a 390 engine in an all steel truck that does 12.0 On premium unleaded.
James T43 Had to have debuted before 1955. FE debuted in '58.
I think ol' Dulcich believes deep down that any non-Mopar engine is an oddball
5:03 Oh, evidently some dyno runs use a lot more than others
Hwæt! No Nailhead Buicks?
First engine I ever built
Nailheads are awesome engines.
You'd probably have to work miracles to get around the road block of valve size.
@@gordomiguel1931 Even with that limitation, they were still torque monsters out of the box. The old '63 Riviera's were the only car that year to outrun the Vette! With 401 cubes and 425 ft. lbs. of torque, they were tricky to launch without turning the tires (at least as big tire as you could fit in the wheel wells).😁
I believe it,but in this they're going for max horsepower,not maximum stump pulling torque.
Did the last engine blew off the header gasket ?
Really cool class. Fewer people around today remember when nobody wanted a ford or chevy. They wanted the Buick, Olds, Pontiac, Cadillac, Lincoln, Chryslers because of the bigger engines from the factory.
Why is it pre 55 but most of these are from 55-58? Why not just make it flatheads?
The class is for engines designed before 1955. The Y-Block design goes back to 1952 for the Lincoln version, and 1954 for the Ford version (basically, Lincoln is the "big block" Y, Ford is the "small block" Y). Even if it was made after 55, it is eligible for the class because it is still a pre 55 design.
ah, makes more sense
The class is Pre-1954 not '55. That means the engine had to designed and into production prior to 1954 and if they used the same engine till 1960 it doesnt matter because it was designed prior to 1954. Simple really.
I didn't see a Hemi either (first out in 1951).....that was an ODD Ball engine..only ones with that valve/combustion layout.
Polys were a cheaper$ version that fit in hemi blocks, originally.
Id love to see someone hot rod a Packard Straight I8.
Hey Dulcic...lose the glasses Homie... Not quite workin, or did you just Burn One Down and need them ?
Whats up with the sour grapes, I think they look cool, thats a good reason alone !
Could you guys build a very rare engine that is mostly forgotten? It's the Mercury 383 V/8 from 59 and 60.
The MEL isn't so weird. It was sort of the precursor to the Ford 385 series in that it had the same bore spacing. That is a fairly important issue when you are an engine manufacturer as the tooling on the block machining line is a major investment, and you would like to use it again if you can. The old Lincoln version went up to 462 cubic inches. The Ford Super Duty V8 was another weird one. It had 477 and 534 cubic inch versions, and a combustion chamber design that was similar to the Chevy W-motor 348 and 409.
{Combustion chamber design like the Chevy w-motor} - So did the MEL. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_MEL_engine
The W-series Chevy was introduce the same year as that MEL engine. Surprised there wasn't s few of those entered.
The W series is obviously less common than its replacements, but they were NOT uncommon at all in high performance applications during their heyday. When there's a Beach Boys song that sings the praises of a factory high performance car AND it's high performance production engine, then it was pretty common.
Old motors is just a question of money, how fast can you go?
Around how much fuel would the average engine drink on a dyno run? Just curious
Does mopar 318 count? It's kind of a sleeper.
I'd say. I took a 390 out of a 66 merc they had way different covers then a stock 390 .
WHO DOES YOUR HEAD PORTING?