Thanks for the help. Even after the video I couldn't find proper alignment, so I just ended up taking the seat off. Now I just squat right over the shaft. It took a little getting used to at first, but it's breaking in nice.
I find these saddles very uncomfortable. I am 75 and my genitals are under constant pressure. Please give a diagram of where should one sit to go a long way. I believe saddle geometry needs to be totally redone, because the uncalled for protrusion in the front is a hassle for old men with dangling scrotum.
Fellas, I made a 10mm adjustment on my seat post. Didn't feel like I was toeing down previously but my hands were getting fatigued. And I leveled the seat to zero horizontal. Unbelievable change! I've been cycling for 30+ years. Next time I'm in the UK, I'm making an appt. Seriously, thank you.
I've bought Topstone 3 last year with some random setup and as you've mentioned it comes with the 42cm bar. I've followed your advices today. Now I can use the drops and reach the break levers. My royal behind is sitting more comfortably on the 145mm Sella seat , back and elbows are relaxed. There is a huge difference my posture with those simple tweaks ( far from a professional fit ). I am yet to test the new setup on a long ride but it does feel better on my indoor trainer. Thank you !
I juat wanna say back in August on the basis of these these bike-fit videos, I bought a Selle Italia Boost SLR Superflow and have found it to be wonderful. I'm thankful for these videos.
I am a 138 pound male at 5'5" and found the SMP evolution (2* nose down) to be the most comfortable saddle for me, despite their attitude towards the SMP's.
Another great video from Francis and James. James is such a knowledgeable and enthusiastic presenter I am happy to watch even if I don’t have any issues with the current episodes subject matter. I do actually get a sore butt after about 1.5/2.0 hours of riding and find that if I just stand up for 20-30 seconds it relieves it-probably just blood flow-unless James knows different?
What I really like about the SMP Dynamic is the fact that it does not allow for any kind of wrong positioning on the saddle. It is like a vise that gives you a more or less gives fixed position to craddle yourself into and I guess that is why it needs to be setup with more care than other saddles. All other issues that usually cause saddle-problems can then be sorted out as you will feel them instantly because you can't compensate any longer for them by slipping and twisting on the saddle. In the end, with bike, shoes and everything else adjusted properly, you can then even go back to something more conventional and less cringeworthy looking if you feel so inclined.
I love this info. I'm a casual rider, done a fair bit of bike commuting, off and on roads and light dirt and gravel, and I've been using the surprisingly solid included saddle that came with my 2012 cannondale quick 4. That being said, getting a slightly longer handlebar, mainly to better fit my shoulder width, with the same rise and sweep made a world of difference with general fit and then updating to slightly shorter cranks, 170 from 185, also helped a lot. It let me get the saddle in a good position, but also let me identify what I wanted to change about it. The transition from the seat to the nose looked a lot like the fabric scoop and always felt a bit in the way and the side to side rounder shape wasn't comfortable for me. Though technically a short nose saddle, I'm liking some of the wtb options as their wide is great fit and that nose transition cuts in a bit sharper and just seems to get out of the way, which means I feel like I can get into a solid position with it for regular pedaling. Your explanations have helped kinda put the pieces together with understanding the what and why of the various pieces and saddle shape issues coming together.
I have to give credits to James and Francis here ! Great content on the bike fit Tuesdays. I love cycling, but always had some issues due to physiology, had some bike fits, but they were basically all crap. Unfortunately I can't afford to travel to the UK just for a fit, and (understandibly) James does not do "zoom" bike fits. Still, following the tips here, I was able to experiment with my position (and more important shoes) and am now almost pain free and having the most fun on the bike ever ! I can't thank you guys enough for this !
I was born and raised in New Jersey (USA) and I talk fast. I am not in the same league as Francis and James. Love the subject matter and expertise in all the videos even if I have to pause and go back a couple of times. Keep up the good work and Happy New Year to all.
Such great info! Not certain I know how to apply it, but it educates me more than I was 30 min ago. I am a Bike Pro in Texas. I was racing in MT on a new bike and saddle and at mile 24 I stopped my bike on side of highway in the middle of the race and ripped my bike shorts down and gave myself an inspection to see what the heck was goin on down there (spectators were thrilled)... decided to pullout of race get to phone and called a DR! Saddle had excessive padding. Get fitted later and told I need a Power Comp 168mm,,, too wide! It did however cure my soft tissue issues, but made riding obviously sub-optimal. My sitbone width has now been measured over 50 times using everything from cardboard and tinfoil to a Ratul machine and every contraption inbetween and I measure 111-118mm depending on which Vudu contraption you believe . So that is according to Ratul a 143 saddle or almost a 155 saddle. The 143 saddles make me feel like I am going to fall off the side so I am on a 155 as of this week. Because just like James said I cannot get my saddle tilt correct I find myself sitting off to one side because my "boys" can't find a happy place in the middle. I stuck with Specialized and decided that when I road the 155 Power Comp (in parkiing lot) that my hamstrings still rubbed wings of saddle, so I had been told the Power Comp was laterally flat, but a Power Arc was rounded and so one was a "plank" and one was a "log" feel... I went with the log feel thinking it would help with the hamstrings not hitting the wings. I am now on the 155 Power Arc Expert and it has a flared up rear which makes me tend to slide forward... ugh... anyhoo like James said (notice a "like James said" pattern here!) my sit position is more of a constant compromise to avoid this or that... I am going to level the "middle third" of the saddle tomorrow and see if that cures things and see if my saddle it too high as I run it a little high because likeJamessaid some of us went a bought a bike that is too big for us and if my knees are too bent I get knee pain... the journey with the Marquis de Sade continues... thanks James for all your help!
Well, apparently the Selle Italia Boost SLR is good and James mentioned it twice. So, i had to go and get one and, how do i say this, it is indeed pretty nice! Saddle is sorted :D
On saddle width, I agree with the assessment and I think the main problem is the lateral curvature across many saddle designs. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the 'effective' width (i'm not sure if that's a real term or not), i.e. the width of the saddle utilised between the sit bones You talked about the curve of the saddle nose to tail, but not laterally and I think that's where a lot of issues/confusion with saddle width arise. Let's say you had a saddle that was pan-flat laterally, in this case a 135 might work for you. If you then switched to a 135 that was curved across its width, your sit bones are going to sit lower on the wings and then the middle pushes up into you soft tissues, so it seems like you need a 145. Does this make sense?
I wish I lived closer to James as I would surely drop by. About saddle type, I find pressure relief channels very uncomfortable as a result of pressure concentration along the girth of the channel itself. I'm now very comfy with flat saddle without channel.
I have a Selle Italia pro link genuine gel saddle without pressure relief chanel (but with a soft part where normally pressure channel is). First saddle on my first road bike, I've been using it for years and it has served me well, no problems at all and actually quite comfortable for me. My hips are crazy flexible rotating outwards but longitudinal axis is limited somehow. I do run it quite forwards, yes I know this adds pressure to my handlebars but I ride fine like that. I don't know why it feels good so I'm probably keeping this saddle and possibly shapewise very similar saddles on my future N+1 bikes (maybe yes with a pressure relief channel)!
Thanks for the good info, James! Wonder if you might consider addressing the benefits and drawbacks of using a leather saddle. I switched to a Selle Italia leather saddle a few years ago, and it's been a game-changer.
About 2am on Sunday morning I had a new insight about bike position. Straighten the abdomen. I'd had my first ever cluster of gallstones over about 14 days after 25 years of having them 2 or 3 times a year. On Friday, I suddenly thought to force myself into ten press-ups, kettle swings, plank, back to press-ups, etc. After a few sets, gallstones vanished. Felt fantastic. Did same on Sunday night but gallstones popped out after one set of press-ups! Googled it and got papers from Swedish Journal of Gastroenterology based on studies of huge numbers of men in Korea. Sitting, crunched up (as in curled up on bike which used to trigger gallstones occasionally) stops the bile flowing. Stretching the abdomen straight while pumping away in an effort (press-ups, planks, kettles, bike) is amazingly helpful. It will affect how I modify my bike set up this week (will build an adjustable jig based on a fit of about 20 years ago and work the jig measurements in relation to whatever works for straight abdomen). Aiming for 100km per day for a week as a test. Then will think about a new pro fit, being 67 now
I wish you were much closer to me (Las Vegas), because I'd book an appointment in a heartbeat. This is only the second video I've watched here, and I absolutely love what I see. Thank you!
He definitely has a point about the saddle width being fussed over to make it sound scientific! I am starting out. I'm currently 280 lbs. and still haven't found the correct saddle width. I'm on my 5th saddle now, and the width ranges from 168 to 178 mm because my sit bones were measured to be around 167 mm. Out of curiosity, I fitted a very narrow 143 mm saddle to my bike just today before buying another saddle, and I'm in absolute disbelief that it fits! It's the most comfortable saddle I've sat on in the past 7 months, and I've had this saddle in the box for at least 4 months, thinking, "No way is that going to work. I'll probably swallow the thing!" Like I said, I'm in disbelief! After researching all day, I found that bigger people with their weight are pushing the lower pelvic area (or whatever it is) closer together, not the fat making our backside wider! It's incredible that one of the smallest saddles is perfect! As for the Specialized Mimic Power saddle, I put it on and quickly took it off today before trying this narrow saddle. The nose is way too short, especially for men! It's crushingly painful, tilted, or leveled back or forward. It's definitely not unisex as it's now branded!
It's not a beginner's video, but it's full of hot and useful information. I'm kind of a micro-adjuster of my bike, and know that a few centimeters is the distance from heaven to hell in bike riding, with pain, inflammation and etc. Great video.
The biggest difference and improvement I've had with saddle comfort was changing the saddle angle. My seat was level from front to back, when i lowered fhe front part immediate improvement. Been adjusting to find the right angle that is just right, I have adjusted height and forward and backward position.
Very useful video again. What about the „rule“ that you should be able to lift your hand up from the handlebars whilst pedalling an be balanced (don‘t feel the urge to get back down on the handlebars)? What about advice on saddle width based on pressure measurement on the bike? On the „make selling things more scientific“ thing: Wherever I see simplified measuring devices and a wall with „pick one of 3“ products behind it, I will leave the store. 2 real bike fits, before and after buying the bike were a real eye-opener.
This was super helpful. I’ve been on a Fizik Arione for many years and definitely get numbness on any ride of around an hour or more unless I consciously move right back on the saddle and get on my sit bones, and sit more upright, exactly the type of ‘compensation’ you’ve described. So I think I need a bike fit to check my position first and possible cut out saddle to get comfy.
The Selle SMP TRK honestly changed my biking life. Maybe it looks silly, maybe some people think it does not belong on a road bike, but damnit it just works for me. I have no idea how people can ride on these flat saddles that come with most road bikes.
Love these videos so much. I have several bikes for specific purposes (gravel bike packing, road touring, city grocery getter) and for years I have been trying to dial them in with one bike feeling amazing to ride and the others becoming torture quite quickly. Watching your fit videos help me make more educated adjustments to make each bike fit for purpose instead of trying to make every bike a (less comfortable) mirror of my old road bike. I'm cursed with having average legs, a short torso and gorilla arms, no standard bike out there fits me well. It was incredibly frustrating because I'm a trained bike mechanic but proper fit was never really something I learned.
@JamesThomas, @bicyclerichmond love your videos. Went from Spez Power Arc 143mm to a Pro Griffon Team 142mm and the change in comfort was immediate as well as pressure on my hands/hoods virtually gone. Also went for a 38cm width bar and it's a match made in heaven. I've always had a 42, then a 40 and after your vids a 38....hooray! Thanks for all the tips!
I think the most important thing with saddles is to know what position you ride. If it's flat or curvy, and gels are not a good thing. Also not too wide, cause the edges of the saddle hurt! You will end up riding in the nose. Gonna buy one last saddle one more time. I hope it works cause i am fed up with the pain. Stuck in 50 km rides cause of it and i suffer.
Excellent video - I'm amazed how much was covered in the time; lots of great tips. However, WRT SMP saddles, I personally tend to run saddles quite rearward so they make my life easier as I don't need such offset posts. For me the angle is super critical, though once it's set all is good. Yeah, they look a bit odd, but when you're sitting on them you can't see them. If I'm ever in the UK again I might well visit. ;-)
Great vid - lots of saddle adjustments to play with in 2022. What’s your opinion on Garmin’s Cycling Dynamics? I use their Vector 3 double-sided power meters, and would like a better understanding of the power phase and platform center offset measurements, and how it relates to bike fit. Hope everyone has a happy New Year!
The Deda seatpost shown is not 25 mm setback but 12 mm, I have one and I really like it so far, nice middle ground especially for steeper seat tube angles.
Incredible video absolute genius stuff. One of the best explanations one can find on RUclips currently. Superb stuff keep it up need more videos from You two gents.
I have an SMH on 2 of 3 bikes. I had it dialed in relatively quickly. I haven't had numbness since. The 3rd has a Brooks, but it's low my low mileage classic.
I prefer more knee extension and less knee flexion. I like shorter crank length and more midfoot cleat position. I also like saddle nose down. Even after an extensive saddle audition choosing my favorite among 20-30 saddles (Bontrager verse; 135 or 145 mm) Im talking about 17 degrees down. It just feels best to me
Some things I’ve noticed in my personal setting up is that if the seat is lower or , I sit far back it messes with my ability to breath properly especially when climbing (which is a huge issue as it helps me climb faster and not blow up into a long climb).... when I used smaller cranks this was less an issue. Also I found there is a sweet spot for me with height and set back where I can get a good lift on the up stroke at the same time a good push down on the down stroke, it seems to be where the the load is spread fairy evenly between the glutes, hamstrings and quads.
Your videos are always loaded with great information / recommendations one query regarding saddle tilt. You mention measuring across the saddle from rear to tip with a maximum 1-2 degrees of downward tilt for some saddles this could result in saddle nose tilting up slightly if measured from centre.
More really informative content, teaching me a lot about the complexities of setting a bike up correctly. There's a very good chance I'll be booking myself a session with James in the new year to benefit from his undoubted skills in this area.
I don't really know what it means, but I put an inexpensive Selle San Marco short saddle with a cutout on my Bianchi Oltre in place of the longer one that came with the bike. It's much more comfortable, I find, so now I'm thinking of trying the SLR boost that is similarly contoured. Since the San Marco is such a good fit, however, and I don't need to worry about weight or racing, I'm also inclined to just keep with what's working. If a saddle for 25 pounds is comfortable, though, in the end it's my bum that has to ride on it.
my current saddle I get on with is the specailzied power arc pro version. It seems to have cut the transition width down its about the same length of 240mm vs the non arc power version so 8 mm shorter then the 248 of the slr boost. but for now my but has no issues with it
I have short torso and long legs like my daughter, as did my father and uncle. My wife and son have the opposite with son pretty extreme (great for football) so he can't ride my bike and I find his very uncomfortable. His feet are much bigger than mine too. We had fits based on the old Lemind system about 20 years ago. Despite being same height, all other measures are hugely different
I think there was a small mis-spoken spot at 5:38 I believe you meant to say "need more setback". Your hand gesture align with this, and you previously discussed less setback at 5:18 so it would make logical sense to then cover more setback.
Great stuff Francis and James! Thanks for sharing your know-how and and more importantly explaining the reasoning behind it. I was wondering how you go about defining a reference point on saddles for measuring saddle height/set back. There seem to be different approaches that lead to mixed results in terms of consistency. Selle Italia came up with their BRP (where the saddle reaches a width of 70 mm) which is supposed to work for most saddle brands!? Others suggest finding the widest point of the saddle +5mm towards the nose - because this is where the sitbones are. These methods are certainly better than just measuring along the seat post, but I am curious what your thoughts are for establishing a reference point to replicate the same saddle position across different saddle shapes and brands. Cheers!
Wonderfully practical. Hearing more from James about troubleshooting various issues, like ulnar nerve pain, how people ride in the fit studio vs real life, and maybe the future of AI bike fit tech would be insightful.
Question about changing and experimenting with saddles with different lengths and heights…(1) saddles with different lengths would you measure fore and aft from the front or the back of the saddle for the same position? Logic for me would be the back with rear tyre against a wall but the sweet spots are all different? (2) saddle rail to top heights again some saddles are flat and some dip so this is problematic? I’ve used the method over on cam Nichols channel which is drop the saddle lower by 20mm and come up in 3mm stages until you feel one leg dysfunctional if you have good body awareness on a trainer for example where you suddenly get a flick or snap due to loss of control at the bottom of the stroke? James what do you make of that as a method of setting saddle height?
As a guitarist/musician seeing Mary Spender is like accidentally running into an old friend at a coffee shop whilst on vacation far from home. Thanks for the information and tips guys.
How honest, practical, informative & appropriate todays BFT was 👏 Such sound advice and tips👌...... Francis, you'll have get James up to the Toon for a few days in 2022 ( just say its a "cycling holiday" 😉).
I have just realized that the factory saddle of one of my bikes is way too wide. If I follow James' thoughts, this may explain why I'm always moving forwards and backwards on the saddle while riding. I have been riding this bike for 2 years now 🤦♂️
Great learning this way, I will defenitly use your tips conserning the shoes... luckily for you I live in Flanders, otherwise you would have to throw me out of your shop before closing...seriously, job well done... 👍🏻👍🏻
Keeping all in mind you told us about shoes I purshased a pair of GAERNE HURRICANES MTB/Gravel shoes....thx again for the excellent educational vid...👍🏻
Great video as usual, especially as it addresses the problem that in some circles it seems the right thing to do to advise to run a higher than needed saddle. Maybe it must be a form of compensation for some, who knows. PS I will not tell my fellow Italian countrymen saddle makers that you called them out! What did they call it, find the animal in you or something? It implied that if you are flexible you would have to ride with a posterior rotated pelvis and a bent spine. Odd.
Thanks for the help. Even after the video I couldn't find proper alignment, so I just ended up taking the seat off. Now I just squat right over the shaft. It took a little getting used to at first, but it's breaking in nice.
I find these saddles very uncomfortable. I am 75 and my genitals are under constant pressure. Please give a diagram of where should one sit to go a long way. I believe saddle geometry needs to be totally redone, because the uncalled for protrusion in the front is a hassle for old men with dangling scrotum.
On UK roads?! God help you when you hit a pot hole 😳
Grease the shaft
Lmao. 😂
Fellas, I made a 10mm adjustment on my seat post. Didn't feel like I was toeing down previously but my hands were getting fatigued. And I leveled the seat to zero horizontal. Unbelievable change! I've been cycling for 30+ years. Next time I'm in the UK, I'm making an appt. Seriously, thank you.
Mary Spender! Weird how two separate circles come together. She's a fantastic guitarist for those who haven't heard of her
Seen her often on Anderson's guitar channel, very surprised to see her here... without a guitar!
Same! Didn't know she's a road bike enthusiast.
I thought I was going crazy 🤣
These BikeFitTuesdays videos are so informative and well presented - thank you for all the info you share!
Thanks for watching Tommy 👍
I've bought Topstone 3 last year with some random setup and as you've mentioned it comes with the 42cm bar. I've followed your advices today. Now I can use the drops and reach the break levers. My royal behind is sitting more comfortably on the 145mm Sella seat , back and elbows are relaxed. There is a huge difference my posture with those simple tweaks ( far from a professional fit ). I am yet to test the new setup on a long ride but it does feel better on my indoor trainer. Thank you !
I juat wanna say back in August on the basis of these these bike-fit videos, I bought a Selle Italia Boost SLR Superflow and have found it to be wonderful. I'm thankful for these videos.
curious, did you buy the 130 or 145mm version? and how large of a human are you? :)
@@consistentwinner 145, I'm 181cm tall and I have I'd say above average width hips for a guy my height.
I am a 138 pound male at 5'5" and found the SMP evolution (2* nose down) to be the most comfortable saddle for me, despite their attitude towards the SMP's.
Another great video from Francis and James. James is such a knowledgeable and enthusiastic presenter I am happy to watch even if I don’t have any issues with the current episodes subject matter. I do actually get a sore butt after about 1.5/2.0 hours of riding and find that if I just stand up for 20-30 seconds it relieves it-probably just blood flow-unless James knows different?
Maybe do some sciatic nerve stretching, it helped me a lot.
What I really like about the SMP Dynamic is the fact that it does not allow for any kind of wrong positioning on the saddle. It is like a vise that gives you a more or less gives fixed position to craddle yourself into and I guess that is why it needs to be setup with more care than other saddles. All other issues that usually cause saddle-problems can then be sorted out as you will feel them instantly because you can't compensate any longer for them by slipping and twisting on the saddle. In the end, with bike, shoes and everything else adjusted properly, you can then even go back to something more conventional and less cringeworthy looking if you feel so inclined.
I love this info. I'm a casual rider, done a fair bit of bike commuting, off and on roads and light dirt and gravel, and I've been using the surprisingly solid included saddle that came with my 2012 cannondale quick 4. That being said, getting a slightly longer handlebar, mainly to better fit my shoulder width, with the same rise and sweep made a world of difference with general fit and then updating to slightly shorter cranks, 170 from 185, also helped a lot. It let me get the saddle in a good position, but also let me identify what I wanted to change about it. The transition from the seat to the nose looked a lot like the fabric scoop and always felt a bit in the way and the side to side rounder shape wasn't comfortable for me. Though technically a short nose saddle, I'm liking some of the wtb options as their wide is great fit and that nose transition cuts in a bit sharper and just seems to get out of the way, which means I feel like I can get into a solid position with it for regular pedaling. Your explanations have helped kinda put the pieces together with understanding the what and why of the various pieces and saddle shape issues coming together.
More useful stuff from James, saddle is the only area I still need to perfect. A revisit to James will be on the cards for next year. 👍
So many bike fit videos talk down to the viewer...repeating, ad nauseum, "it's beyond the scope of this video." This is so clear and helpful. Cheers
I have to give credits to James and Francis here ! Great content on the bike fit Tuesdays. I love cycling, but always had some issues due to physiology, had some bike fits, but they were basically all crap. Unfortunately I can't afford to travel to the UK just for a fit, and (understandibly) James does not do "zoom" bike fits.
Still, following the tips here, I was able to experiment with my position (and more important shoes) and am now almost pain free and having the most fun on the bike ever !
I can't thank you guys enough for this !
I was born and raised in New Jersey (USA) and I talk fast. I am not in the same league as Francis and James. Love the subject matter and expertise in all the videos even if I have to pause and go back a couple of times. Keep up the good work and Happy New Year to all.
Such great info! Not certain I know how to apply it, but it educates me more than I was 30 min ago. I am a Bike Pro in Texas. I was racing in MT on a new bike and saddle and at mile 24 I stopped my bike on side of highway in the middle of the race and ripped my bike shorts down and gave myself an inspection to see what the heck was goin on down there (spectators were thrilled)... decided to pullout of race get to phone and called a DR! Saddle had excessive padding. Get fitted later and told I need a Power Comp 168mm,,, too wide! It did however cure my soft tissue issues, but made riding obviously sub-optimal. My sitbone width has now been measured over 50 times using everything from cardboard and tinfoil to a Ratul machine and every contraption inbetween and I measure 111-118mm depending on which Vudu contraption you believe . So that is according to Ratul a 143 saddle or almost a 155 saddle. The 143 saddles make me feel like I am going to fall off the side so I am on a 155 as of this week. Because just like James said I cannot get my saddle tilt correct I find myself sitting off to one side because my "boys" can't find a happy place in the middle. I stuck with Specialized and decided that when I road the 155 Power Comp (in parkiing lot) that my hamstrings still rubbed wings of saddle, so I had been told the Power Comp was laterally flat, but a Power Arc was rounded and so one was a "plank" and one was a "log" feel... I went with the log feel thinking it would help with the hamstrings not hitting the wings. I am now on the 155 Power Arc Expert and it has a flared up rear which makes me tend to slide forward... ugh... anyhoo like James said (notice a "like James said" pattern here!) my sit position is more of a constant compromise to avoid this or that... I am going to level the "middle third" of the saddle tomorrow and see if that cures things and see if my saddle it too high as I run it a little high because likeJamessaid some of us went a bought a bike that is too big for us and if my knees are too bent I get knee pain... the journey with the Marquis de Sade continues... thanks James for all your help!
Sounds like you need slightly shorter cranks
In a world with so many idiotic bike fitters, it’s wonderful to hear from James who is truly helpful. Thank you so much.
I have learned more about setting up my bike from these videos than anyone I've found. Because of this I'm enjoying my road bike more than ever.
💪👍
Well, apparently the Selle Italia Boost SLR is good and James mentioned it twice. So, i had to go and get one and, how do i say this, it is indeed pretty nice! Saddle is sorted :D
Check first which one is the right fue you I have the 130 mm switch to 145 mm try them both see and
On saddle width, I agree with the assessment and I think the main problem is the lateral curvature across many saddle designs. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the 'effective' width (i'm not sure if that's a real term or not), i.e. the width of the saddle utilised between the sit bones
You talked about the curve of the saddle nose to tail, but not laterally and I think that's where a lot of issues/confusion with saddle width arise. Let's say you had a saddle that was pan-flat laterally, in this case a 135 might work for you. If you then switched to a 135 that was curved across its width, your sit bones are going to sit lower on the wings and then the middle pushes up into you soft tissues, so it seems like you need a 145. Does this make sense?
I wish I lived closer to James as I would surely drop by.
About saddle type, I find pressure relief channels very uncomfortable as a result of pressure concentration along the girth of the channel itself. I'm now very comfy with flat saddle without channel.
I enjoy very much to hear this guy talking.
He knows what he is talking about. No cliche here, only deep experience!
I have had several bike fits over the years and watch a lot of videos. Your videos are very descriptive and just make sense.
I have a Selle Italia pro link genuine gel saddle without pressure relief chanel (but with a soft part where normally pressure channel is).
First saddle on my first road bike, I've been using it for years and it has served me well, no problems at all and actually quite comfortable for me. My hips are crazy flexible rotating outwards but longitudinal axis is limited somehow.
I do run it quite forwards, yes I know this adds pressure to my handlebars but I ride fine like that. I don't know why it feels good so I'm probably keeping this saddle and possibly shapewise very similar saddles on my future N+1 bikes (maybe yes with a pressure relief channel)!
Thanks for the good info, James! Wonder if you might consider addressing the benefits and drawbacks of using a leather saddle. I switched to a Selle Italia leather saddle a few years ago, and it's been a game-changer.
About 2am on Sunday morning I had a new insight about bike position. Straighten the abdomen. I'd had my first ever cluster of gallstones over about 14 days after 25 years of having them 2 or 3 times a year. On Friday, I suddenly thought to force myself into ten press-ups, kettle swings, plank, back to press-ups, etc. After a few sets, gallstones vanished. Felt fantastic. Did same on Sunday night but gallstones popped out after one set of press-ups! Googled it and got papers from Swedish Journal of Gastroenterology based on studies of huge numbers of men in Korea. Sitting, crunched up (as in curled up on bike which used to trigger gallstones occasionally) stops the bile flowing. Stretching the abdomen straight while pumping away in an effort (press-ups, planks, kettles, bike) is amazingly helpful. It will affect how I modify my bike set up this week (will build an adjustable jig based on a fit of about 20 years ago and work the jig measurements in relation to whatever works for straight abdomen). Aiming for 100km per day for a week as a test. Then will think about a new pro fit, being 67 now
Best bike fitting channel by a mile.
Always really informative and very well explained.
I wish you were much closer to me (Las Vegas), because I'd book an appointment in a heartbeat. This is only the second video I've watched here, and I absolutely love what I see. Thank you!
It's crazy how all your videos are jam-packed with top quality info. Simply invaluable. Thanks for sharing!
He definitely has a point about the saddle width being fussed over to make it sound scientific! I am starting out. I'm currently 280 lbs. and still haven't found the correct saddle width. I'm on my 5th saddle now, and the width ranges from 168 to 178 mm because my sit bones were measured to be around 167 mm. Out of curiosity, I fitted a very narrow 143 mm saddle to my bike just today before buying another saddle, and I'm in absolute disbelief that it fits! It's the most comfortable saddle I've sat on in the past 7 months, and I've had this saddle in the box for at least 4 months, thinking, "No way is that going to work. I'll probably swallow the thing!" Like I said, I'm in disbelief! After researching all day, I found that bigger people with their weight are pushing the lower pelvic area (or whatever it is) closer together, not the fat making our backside wider! It's incredible that one of the smallest saddles is perfect! As for the Specialized Mimic Power saddle, I put it on and quickly took it off today before trying this narrow saddle. The nose is way too short, especially for men! It's crushingly painful, tilted, or leveled back or forward. It's definitely not unisex as it's now branded!
You are great at explaining things, and you're little story interjections are refreshingly funny. I love your videos, please keep them coming
I love my short saddle, prologo scratch m5, eliminated leg rubbing, feels great
It's not a beginner's video, but it's full of hot and useful information. I'm kind of a micro-adjuster of my bike, and know that a few centimeters is the distance from heaven to hell in bike riding, with pain, inflammation and etc. Great video.
Would love to see a video on Q factor as I’m thinking about buy the assioma shi but are unsure due to the Q factor
We have a video on q factor here! ruclips.net/video/VXH9oXoJeOc/видео.html
The S3 saddle is 130mm wide (not 135) according to Selle Italia website. The L3 is 145mm.
Brilliantly explained
Any thoughts on 'BiSaddle'? It's a saddle of two halves that can be 'infinitely' adjusted for width, channel size and nose width.
The biggest difference and improvement I've had with saddle comfort was changing the saddle angle. My seat was level from front to back, when i lowered fhe front part immediate improvement. Been adjusting to find the right angle that is just right, I have adjusted height and forward and backward position.
clear, concise, precise. I wish i can be as eloquent as James. Thanks for these content
These are always so well done. Please have more James on days other than Tuesday.
Very useful video again. What about the „rule“ that you should be able to lift your hand up from the handlebars whilst pedalling an be balanced (don‘t feel the urge to get back down on the handlebars)? What about advice on saddle width based on pressure measurement on the bike?
On the „make selling things more scientific“ thing: Wherever I see simplified measuring devices and a wall with „pick one of 3“ products behind it, I will leave the store. 2 real bike fits, before and after buying the bike were a real eye-opener.
This was super helpful. I’ve been on a Fizik Arione for many years and definitely get numbness on any ride of around an hour or more unless I consciously move right back on the saddle and get on my sit bones, and sit more upright, exactly the type of ‘compensation’ you’ve described. So I think I need a bike fit to check my position first and possible cut out saddle to get comfy.
The Selle SMP TRK honestly changed my biking life. Maybe it looks silly, maybe some people think it does not belong on a road bike, but damnit it just works for me. I have no idea how people can ride on these flat saddles that come with most road bikes.
Love these videos so much. I have several bikes for specific purposes (gravel bike packing, road touring, city grocery getter) and for years I have been trying to dial them in with one bike feeling amazing to ride and the others becoming torture quite quickly. Watching your fit videos help me make more educated adjustments to make each bike fit for purpose instead of trying to make every bike a (less comfortable) mirror of my old road bike. I'm cursed with having average legs, a short torso and gorilla arms, no standard bike out there fits me well. It was incredibly frustrating because I'm a trained bike mechanic but proper fit was never really something I learned.
Yep, I have a short torso and short legs so I have a zero setback seatpost. Yay to my fitter!
this dude knows his stuff...as always make adjustments in small increments...it took me years to get dialed...RECORD your measurements!!!
How cool y'all had Mary Spender on the fit machine. She's so talented. Love her music vids.
Yep. The straight seat post has worked a treat for me since James made that adjustment. Top man 👍
Only started watching these the other day, hooked by them. Excellent information
@JamesThomas, @bicyclerichmond love your videos. Went from Spez Power Arc 143mm to a Pro Griffon Team 142mm and the change in comfort was immediate as well as pressure on my hands/hoods virtually gone. Also went for a 38cm width bar and it's a match made in heaven. I've always had a 42, then a 40 and after your vids a 38....hooray! Thanks for all the tips!
You still on the griffon?
@@hankschrader2353 I am. Still going well.
Would be great to have a TT/Triathlon specific bike fit video! 👌🏼
The width depends also if you have a touring (more upright) or a sports/aero position the the bike.
I think the most important thing with saddles is to know what position you ride. If it's flat or curvy, and gels are not a good thing. Also not too wide, cause the edges of the saddle hurt! You will end up riding in the nose. Gonna buy one last saddle one more time. I hope it works cause i am fed up with the pain. Stuck in 50 km rides cause of it and i suffer.
Easily the best saddle video out there.
Excellent video - I'm amazed how much was covered in the time; lots of great tips. However, WRT SMP saddles, I personally tend to run saddles quite rearward so they make my life easier as I don't need such offset posts. For me the angle is super critical, though once it's set all is good. Yeah, they look a bit odd, but when you're sitting on them you can't see them. If I'm ever in the UK again I might well visit. ;-)
I found the same...the shape tends to mess with your perception of angle....once set correctly they work great.
Great vid - lots of saddle adjustments to play with in 2022. What’s your opinion on Garmin’s Cycling Dynamics? I use their Vector 3 double-sided power meters, and would like a better understanding of the power phase and platform center offset measurements, and how it relates to bike fit. Hope everyone has a happy New Year!
The Deda seatpost shown is not 25 mm setback but 12 mm, I have one and I really like it so far, nice middle ground especially for steeper seat tube angles.
Incredible video absolute genius stuff.
One of the best explanations one can find on RUclips currently.
Superb stuff keep it up need more videos from You two gents.
James has surprisingly good comedic timing.
An Selle SMP TRK saddle worked for me....but yes the position has to be spot on.
I'm watching videos about bike fitment and start to watch this one and then randomly see Mary Spender who I follow for guitar tips!
and that is why james is a legend...
Miss the videos with James
I have an SMH on 2 of 3 bikes. I had it dialed in relatively quickly. I haven't had numbness since. The 3rd has a Brooks, but it's low my low mileage classic.
I prefer more knee extension and less knee flexion. I like shorter crank length and more midfoot cleat position.
I also like saddle nose down. Even after an extensive saddle audition choosing my favorite among 20-30 saddles (Bontrager verse; 135 or 145 mm) Im talking about 17 degrees down. It just feels best to me
Some things I’ve noticed in my personal setting up is that if the seat is lower or , I sit far back it messes with my ability to breath properly especially when climbing (which is a huge issue as it helps me climb faster and not blow up into a long climb).... when I used smaller cranks this was less an issue. Also I found there is a sweet spot for me with height and set back where I can get a good lift on the up stroke at the same time a good push down on the down stroke, it seems to be where the the load is spread fairy evenly between the glutes, hamstrings and quads.
Your videos are always loaded with great information / recommendations one query regarding saddle tilt. You mention measuring across the saddle from rear to tip with a maximum 1-2 degrees of downward tilt for some saddles this could result in saddle nose tilting up slightly if measured from centre.
How do you decide between the L3 and S3 boost saddle if you are unable to get to a bike fitter?
This was the best saddle video I have ever seen!!! Thank you so much!!!
Solid watch game James, love speedy on leather.
I love the Toupe saddles. I wonder why Specialized stopped making them, given their popularity
More really informative content, teaching me a lot about the complexities of setting a bike up correctly. There's a very good chance I'll be booking myself a session with James in the new year to benefit from his undoubted skills in this area.
James’ content is always on point, easily one of the best on cycling fitting on the Tube! I’ve learned a lot!
I don't really know what it means, but I put an inexpensive Selle San Marco short saddle with a cutout on my Bianchi Oltre in place of the longer one that came with the bike. It's much more comfortable, I find, so now I'm thinking of trying the SLR boost that is similarly contoured. Since the San Marco is such a good fit, however, and I don't need to worry about weight or racing, I'm also inclined to just keep with what's working. If a saddle for 25 pounds is comfortable, though, in the end it's my bum that has to ride on it.
my current saddle I get on with is the specailzied power arc pro version. It seems to have cut the transition width down its about the same length of 240mm vs the non arc power version so 8 mm shorter then the 248 of the slr boost. but for now my but has no issues with it
I have short torso and long legs like my daughter, as did my father and uncle. My wife and son have the opposite with son pretty extreme (great for football) so he can't ride my bike and I find his very uncomfortable. His feet are much bigger than mine too. We had fits based on the old Lemind system about 20 years ago. Despite being same height, all other measures are hugely different
Great Job James, You have pointed me in the right direction Soo many times!!!! and Thanks too Francis!!!
I think there was a small mis-spoken spot at 5:38
I believe you meant to say "need more setback". Your hand gesture align with this, and you previously discussed less setback at 5:18 so it would make logical sense to then cover more setback.
Great stuff Francis and James! Thanks for sharing your know-how and and more importantly explaining the reasoning behind it. I was wondering how you go about defining a reference point on saddles for measuring saddle height/set back. There seem to be different approaches that lead to mixed results in terms of consistency. Selle Italia came up with their BRP (where the saddle reaches a width of 70 mm) which is supposed to work for most saddle brands!? Others suggest finding the widest point of the saddle +5mm towards the nose - because this is where the sitbones are. These methods are certainly better than just measuring along the seat post, but I am curious what your thoughts are for establishing a reference point to replicate the same saddle position across different saddle shapes and brands. Cheers!
Was totally NOT expecting to see Mary Spender in a bike fit video! 🎸
Maybe a vid on proper bib fit..how to know yours is the right size so the cushion/shamy actually does it job
Wonderful stuff Francis & James! Absolutely loving how much insight and experiences you guys are sharing and much appreciated. Keep them coming!
Wonderfully practical. Hearing more from James about troubleshooting various issues, like ulnar nerve pain, how people ride in the fit studio vs real life, and maybe the future of AI bike fit tech would be insightful.
If I were into road bikes and lived in Britain, I would go to this guy for a fit.
It's almost worth flying to the UK to get a fit with James. Great tips and info.
Lots of people have!
Thanks for watching 👍
Question about changing and experimenting with saddles with different lengths and heights…(1) saddles with different lengths would you measure fore and aft from the front or the back of the saddle for the same position? Logic for me would be the back with rear tyre against a wall but the sweet spots are all different? (2) saddle rail to top heights again some saddles are flat and some dip so this is problematic?
I’ve used the method over on cam Nichols channel which is drop the saddle lower by 20mm and come up in 3mm stages until you feel one leg dysfunctional if you have good body awareness on a trainer for example where you suddenly get a flick or snap due to loss of control at the bottom of the stroke? James what do you make of that as a method of setting saddle height?
As a guitarist/musician seeing Mary Spender is like accidentally running into an old friend at a coffee shop whilst on vacation far from home. Thanks for the information and tips guys.
Had the exact same thought. What are the odds?!
You're awesome. I'm binge watching a ton of your videos right now 😆
How honest, practical, informative & appropriate todays BFT was 👏 Such sound advice and tips👌...... Francis, you'll have get James up to the Toon for a few days in 2022 ( just say its a "cycling holiday" 😉).
Every now and then my RUclips worlds collide. Crazy seeing Mary in here lol
I have just realized that the factory saddle of one of my bikes is way too wide. If I follow James' thoughts, this may explain why I'm always moving forwards and backwards on the saddle while riding. I have been riding this bike for 2 years now 🤦♂️
Great learning this way, I will defenitly use your tips conserning the shoes... luckily for you I live in Flanders, otherwise you would have to throw me out of your shop before closing...seriously, job well done... 👍🏻👍🏻
Keeping all in mind you told us about shoes I purshased a pair of GAERNE HURRICANES MTB/Gravel shoes....thx again for the excellent educational vid...👍🏻
Great video as usual, especially as it addresses the problem that in some circles it seems the right thing to do to advise to run a higher than needed saddle. Maybe it must be a form of compensation for some, who knows.
PS I will not tell my fellow Italian countrymen saddle makers that you called them out! What did they call it, find the animal in you or something? It implied that if you are flexible you would have to ride with a posterior rotated pelvis and a bent spine. Odd.
What's your take on 3d printed saddles? Are they worth it? Would someone be more comfortable... Say on a more affordable boost slr instead?
11:00 I love saddles like this as I am 6.5ft. It is greatly wide. For you, 5.11ft it may be to wide but for taller people it is awesome 😎
Im so ready for bicycle. richmond James approved certification. Lol
Whoa! Bonus content from Mary Spender the guitar lady? Would love to see her ride with Francis up north.
Until today I never realised the SMP looks like Concorde coming into land
Nice to see Mary Spender starring in your vid :)
Great informative vlog from James. Thanks.
Ooof one of the best BFTs so far
Also I love how James does a cross-eyed thing every time he quotes "opening up the hips" 2:28