With the release of "Rebirth", certain things are coming to light that line up with and give more depth to the statements that I bring up in this video. I won't spoil exactly, but this is the narrative that's been put in place for the last 27 years. Now, everyone, please enjoy Rebirth.
Cloud seems to be more. Caring when talking to tifa. Where as when hes with Aerith she's kinda pushy on the date thing and it annoys cloud. Cloud cares for aerith though but you can tell his true feelings are with Tifa.
Cloud digs the attention no doubt, its critical to his character, but he also recognizes the difference in attention. Cloud is an edge lord 16 year old kid who wanted to impress the girl next door, and while Aerith isn't the exact girl whose fundamental to his motivations, he still takes pleasure in it. My suspicion is that the meta narrative plays a part in the attention she gives cloud as well. Its clear from the skywheel scene with Aerith that; 1. She was initially drawn to him because of how much he reminded her of Zack. 2. She knows Cloud (prime) is trapped and shes been trying to find him. One of these is reasonable, the other relies on information she should not have.
During one of the side quests in Coral del Sol, about the fashion one, Cloud said that he was only doing it to get paid and was hoping Aerith wouldn't refer to it as a date, to which Aerith insisted she's going to take it as a date anyways (pushy much). Also, it makes no sense that every time Aerith grabs onto Cloud's arm and claims he is hers (in remake) or that they were on a date (in rebirth) in front of Tifa, he looks taken aback and looks to Tifa with guilt. Why would he care about how Tifa takes his 'dates' with Aerith if Aerith is the girl he likes. He doesn't even know if Tifa likes him or not (which we know she did before moving to Midgar from the date with Yuffie) and during the date with Tifa, he is surprised when she says "Or am I getting ahead of myself, again" and cloud said "again?" Like he was surprised to hear that.
agree to disagreee, cloud always being a jerk while with tifa, but when she with aerith he seems more happy, also do u miss the scene that showing cloud mom
@@jasminelily94 not sure what bootleg game you played but being a a jerk to Tifa?? When he was having PTSD mode flashback( being taken over) you played a different game then everyone else seems like.
The almost kissing scene in Gongaga - that tells you who Cloud really has his romantic feeling for. And that’s not optional. The feeling Cloud has over Aerith is just guilt of not being able to save his friend in time when he was the only one that can. That’s why he never forgave himself. If it was someone else, he would feel the same way. It just so happened to be Aerith who had an interest in Cloud.
That's how I took it. Every time I watch the ending of Rebirth (putting aside how everyone feels about it and interprets it), I don't see someone trying to save the person they love. I see someone trying to save one of their best friends from dying.
After they all thought Tifa died in Gongaga, Cloud also shut down into a catatonic state. Like he simply ceased functioning. That is also a big sign of his feelings
@@adihsarstilinskih8237 Yup, he reverted into the black robe like state Tifa had found him in prior to the start of Remake. It's only when Barret gets through to him that she is still alive, only then does he slowly start to wake up and wiggle his way over to her (and only when he sees she is alive does he wake up again fully). He also tries to leave the moment he sees she woke up, he probably figured she would simply not want to be alone with him ever againy.
They legit want Aerith to be Tifa, it's so weird, just saw a post on twitter of Aerith and Cloud sitting on the water tower in Nibelheim. And the post quoted Cloud talking about how "sitting there hoping Tifa would wave at him" sounds like something he'd do....and this person did a heart eyes emoticon and a hashtag Clerith. There simply is nothing that will get through to some people.
I had an Aerhead tell me this optional water tower scene was "symbolic" and when I asked them twice to explain what the symbolism was they refused to answer. I honestly believe these people would prefer to see Cloud die just so they could say he's with Aerith.
@@darthlocklan6388 It is symbolic, of the history between Cloud and Tifa. Remember that Aerith asks cloud to leave her alone after he talks to her, she is clearly not happy. If I had to guess its a bit of jealousy. Not so much that she doesn't have that kind of history with cloud, but rather the access he has to the person he made that history with. The memories of Tifa and him aren't just memories, Tifa is still physically accessible to him. Aerith wishes she could look through that window and see Zack.
@@Otis-Spunks I only looked at that scene in an ironic sense. As in those shared memories Aerith's talking about are what saves Cloud later on in the lifestream with Tifa. I really like your deeper take on it, it's very empathetic. The person who called it symbolic meant it as proof of some sort of timeless love between the Aerith and Cloud, which I was still willing to hear them out on. Too bad you weren't around for that initial discussion, but you still left me with some food for thought.
@@Otis-Spunks I agree. I also don't understand how people can ship C/A when she doesn't even know what happened to Zack. No one does. Not Aerith, Cloud or his poor worried parents. Like let's recap here: Zack and Cloud were tortured and experimented on for years. Zack get free, and he doesn't even THINK of leaving his BFF behind. He gets them away and manages to keep ahead of Shinra until right before he can get safely into the city. This man was on a mission. He was saving himself and his best friend and trying to get back to his girl. Only to be shot down trying to save Cloud and then he dies- and poor Cloud is so messed up with all the trauma that he promptly forgets Zack even existed. Like... what a TRAGIC fate for this poor man. And then C/A's want to just throw Cloud with his best friend's girl just like that? Like they're interchangeable? No! I want Aerith to know that Zack didn't just abandon her! I want Cloud to remember his best friend. I want someone to tell Zack's parents what happened to their baby boy. That he went down fighting and that they, even in their grief, can be proud of him. I'm not saying Aerith can never move on, but for her to properly have closure - before she can even THINK about liking someone else-- she needs to know about Zack's fate and his bravery. And that he was trying to come back to her. So I am definitely on the Cloti and Zerith teams here. These pairings make the most sense narrative wise.
@@darthlocklan6388 Oh they definitely do, I've seen them say stuff like "don't worry cloud, she's waiting for you in the lifestream. *heart eyes emoji" like some kind of death cult, which they are.
Nice work ! I love the line, "so do the creators" because that exactly what the narrative is ! I hope this does not come across as too obnoxious, but I really really hope you do a similar video to add to this to follow up once rebirth is out ! because from the leaks (I have been spoiled unfortunately) the Devs are making things EVEN more clear on what the story and who and what is canon ! Thanks again for taking your time to make videos like this !
Cloud and Tifa have ALWAYS been canon. These people arguing different probably weren't even born when the original came out or played it back then. It was canon with the original, it was canon in Crisis Core, and it was canon in remake.
THIS!!! I was in the ff7 fandom in the 00's and the general consensus was that it was always CloudxTifa! sure Cleriths existed, but they were a very small minority. Ever since the remake announcement and a new generation of fans were introduced to the franchise, I've noticed a shift in the narrative, especially with the rise of social media 😒 I swear most of them didn't even play the og, spinoffs or read the novels, they just like stuff based on fanarts, YT clips and aesthetics 🙃
@@jinnimooWait what? I was 13 in 97 and the general forum for this talk was Famitsu letters and to lesser degree PSM. To be clear I prioritize the story above any shipping. But when the trailer states about Cloud and Aerith - purest love that could never be it gave meaning to the game. I remember clearly ppl writing it sucks for Tifa being his second choice. And ppl writing Aerith is clearly an escort. Sakaguchi was asked about it to which he was mad that he often gets this question he said: -its all in the game -Cloud has feelings for both -Aerith dies -its all in the game My og interpretation was actually different: Cloud is so f-ed he is neutral. Aerith flirts with him hard and Tifa is shy. Aerith dies. He had to have guilt because she ran on her own because of him. But at that moment she was the only person he had chemistry with. His love for her when she dies only adds to the narrative. Then he has that meltdown and Tifa comes in. The great part is that they BOTH restored their memories. Because in og Cloud makes Tifa doubt hers because he knows things she doesnt. Thats why she says nothing. So don't get your position. I doubt anyone argued Cloud is with Tifa after og. But Cloud loving Aerith was stated by Sakaguchi, the game trailer. Even Clouds last words in og are - I will meet her at the promised land, while holding Tifa. Ultimately I would say this all doesn't matter because you could view all of them as just friends and it wouldn't change the narrative. The optional sex scene could be old single friends before going on a suicide mission. Only narrative wise moment I would like is Sephiroth killing Clouds loved one. After destroing his village, killing his mother and love - he can finally break jenovas control.
@@jinnimoo Cleriths were never in a minority..,sorry. It's just that Cloti really does make more sense in the end...Most people I knew who played the game and weren't heavy gamers preferred the beginning over the end, and many got the sense that they didn't want the game to end at all...This is how attaching those characters are and their unique relationships. As an intelligent human being who understands the fiscal aspects of the gaming industry, you should be aware by now that the game was designed to confuse you about the pairing on purpose...in the beginning at least.
@@ChoompaLoompa1985-uw8lw dude, just look at the stats and numbers. Clerith is the less popular ship. Cloti dominates all polls, featured articles, google searches etc. Even back in the day there were way more cloti amvs and fan sites. Even now, views on cloti related vids always outnumber clerith. Clerith's popularity is on par with Zakkura, which is just as popular. Shippers in general is only a small (but loud) percentage of the fanbase, then you have clerith, the 2nd or 3rd most popular ship within that small percentage, making them a minority.
I love Tifa and Cloud, even with all the shipping chaos and girls thirsting for cloud 😅 Tifas and clouds chemistry aaalways stood out to me. With Jessi and Aerith it felt very forced. They were always kinda joking around and trying too hard, to get clouds attention. They also gave me the, being the typical sunshine girl that cheers up the grumpy character, vibe. It just doesn’t felt very deep with them, especially in a romantic way. But with Tifa you can see he has a soft spot for her. They’re very similar in many ways. They don’t open up immediately, when they feel troubled, but they’re always there for each other. Sharing not only similar traumas, but also saving each other, when they need it the most. Even clouds mom said in the remake he needs a girl that is mature and something else 😂 and that fits with Tifas character perfectly. She’s very compassionate and motherly and her energy just balanced clouds because of that and not because she has to be the opposite mood. In the end everyone can enjoy their Favorit ship, but we can also accept just the fact that Tifa and Cloud where meant for each other! I need more scenes with them ❤😩
I'm in my mid 30s, I grew up playing FF7 and it's probably my favorite game of all time. I don't understand why some people are so upset with the FACT Cloud and Tifa wind up together and have feelinngs for each other. It was officialy in 1997, it's official now.
I really don't care about ships to me let people have their head canon. But all the lore I've read it's pretty obvious where Clouds loyalties lye. Damn the whole story hinges on the fact that Cloud wanted to be a Soldier to impress Tifa everything he did was to gain Tifa's affection. And lets say they change it, despite all the books the scenes in the games that ultimately Cloud saves Aerith from dying and they live happily ever after, but what happens to Tifa and Zack do they end up together? two people who have no connection to each other at all. Or does Zack go back to being dead and Tifa starts dating Jhonny get real. I say again if you wanna make whatever fan fic you want go ahead I'm sure it will be a nice what if story. But I really feel like the creator's of these characters have made their choice.
They want to ship Tifa with Barret which makes little to no sense considering that there is a scene where Barret tells Cloud that someone tried to give Tifa a flower, and Cloud gets furious about it. I think Tifa, as a character, is strong enough that she doesn't necessarily need to be shipped with Cloud whereas Aerith's existence and value depends on a character like Cloud. Tifa is popular without the need of having a love interest. However, with that being said, it's clear that Cloud and Tifa are the better options.
@@anabelgonzalez8984 Aerith's value is in her death, both in terms of impact on the player and in terms of importance to the plot. That's her primary purpose and value in the story. Rebirth doesn't even bother to continue the illusion of any romance between Cloud and Aerith. Their relationship isn't explored and doesn't develop beyond what they had at the beginning of Rebirth. Instead the game uses every opportunity to build and develop Cloud and Tifa and more or less ignores Aerith until it's time for her big moment.
I genuinely do not understand how ANYONE can claim that Cloud and Tifa haven't been canon since the OG. Most people who try to push that narrative haven't even played the OG, or if they played it, they didn't progress past Disk 1. The Under the Highwind and Lifestream scenes were "you had to be there" moments, as I've been told by older players. We have SO much official material, we have quotes from Nojima-san and Nomura-san, we have 'On the Way to a Smile', 'Traces of Two Pasts', '2000 Gil to Become a Hero' written by Nojima-san, where it's shown VERY clearly that Cloud goes through his journey to become someone special to Tifa. I don't think people understand how important Tifa ACTUALLY is to Cloud, aside from being his koibito. All calls to action in Clouds hero's journey are facilitated by Tifa Lockhart.
Haha, oh trust me, even with playing the original game, plenty of people tried to push the narrative that he was pining after Aerith in Advent Children and they espouse that narrative still even with evidence to the opposite. It's a cult of shipping.
@@tanagreeknose7376 Reading comprehension and media literacy are dead, I see. I never knew just how vindictive Clerith fans really were until they started harassing Nojima-san at the start of last week when the behind-the-scenes dev interview was uploaded on SE's RUclips channel and Nojima-san explained that 'No Promises to Keep' is decidedly NOT a love ballad to Cloud, but a song from Aerith for all the people she's ever cared about, including Elmyra, Ifalna, Zack, Cloud, even Tifa and Barret. They've been filling his mentions on Twitter saying things like, and I quote, "We know you got death threats from the CloTis, that's why you're backpedaling" or "Don't insult our intelligence, we know it's about Cloud" and generally being very awful to the WRITER of the story. This level of delusion and entitlement is insane to me. Nojima-san had to put out a tweet to say that people can listen to the song any way they want, but his intentions when writing the lyrics were very specific. I've also seen them try to claim that hand-holding (which happened at max affinity with Aerith's date) is more romantic than kissing in Japanese culture. As a Greek woman who's been in a relationship with a Japanese man for the past five years, we both found that laughable. Imagine trying to appropriate a culture from a place of malice, just to prove a fictional ship that was debunked decades ago and to harrass the WRITER of the story itself.
@@decknamen4948 You're Greek? Me too. 🤣 But you probably gathered that already from my username. Don't even get me started on the song drama. It's exhausting, really. It just really has to do with people not accepting that their one-sided view is not the correct one and holding onto that because of emotional attachment. I mean, just because I got something entirely different out of someone's story doesn't necessarily make me ignorant, but I think the difference between that and shipping for instance is that my interpretation just happened to not be what the creator intended and the other one is just me believing in my delusions.
@@tanagreeknose7376 I will be honest, I was so engrossed in the great information you provided in your video that I just noticed the username! Fellow Greek 😄 The song drama has been going on for the week, and it's honestly both sad and exhausting. I feel for Nojima-san, he's never been shy about sharing his intentions behind his work, and I find it quite telling that he and Nomura-san call the FFVII characters 'their children'. They really do love this franchise and this story compilation. Interpretations of a story are totally valid, of course, and that's the beauty of storytelling in all its forms, but going as far as to claim that the artist/author is somehow wrong when they tell you what they wanted to convey? It baffles me. As Nojima-san mentioned before the release of the game, things will become clearer this time and FFVII Rebirth has been decidedly clear about where Cloud's romantic affections lie. While he most certainly cares about Aerith and she's an important friend, his heart never strayed from Tifa Lockhart. I'm excited for Part 3, the Lifestream sequence where Tifa puts Cloud's fractured psyche back together is going to write FF history.
Remake and especially Rebirth have went in so hard for Cloud and Tifa that there's just not an argument to be made for Aerith anymore. It's actually a laughable position to take at this point. Rebirth spoilers Aerith has more moments in Rebirth with TIfa than she does Cloud and on top of that seems to be shipping Cloud and Tifa herself most of the time. Then we have these little moments for Zach and Aerith, like the scene where she literally can feel his hand touching hers through the lifestream. They aren't putting those little hints in for no reason. Part 3 will almost certainly be a Cloti feast with a side order of Zaerith and an empty plate for Clerith fans, much like Rebirth was only even more so.
I also like to not comment and stay away from social media but Nojima put the choices in the game for YOU to choose not for Cloud the character who has his own thoughts, because if you take away your choices he would pick tifa, hope im not spoiling and DONT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED THIS PART YET. but look at Tifa's GS date, and also yuffie GS date she askes if cloud likes tifa,then she says that tifa forgot about him while busy in midgar and it bothered Cloud. People are right, many have been saying that people say this and that from nojima and the ultimania that are not true at all. TOTP tells you everything about Tifa and clouds relationship and im more exited about part 3 because to me the most important scene in all of gaming is her repairing his mind and bringing him back together, also when you get a glimpse of the lifestream Tifa says to Cloud "Cloud I NEED YOU" which should put things to bed hopefully. This video made me feel much better and i REALLY appreciate that, honestly. I just love the facts and also dont take too long with your next video of this topic and ill be watching your streams to see your views on tifa and cloud because this game is setting up them two for part3
Yup, there is also the question of why the hell would you write a book about Tifa and Aerith, were like a third of Tifas part is about her feelings for Cloud, write her LS scenes in Rebirth and her trial in the temple that deals with her feelings for Cloud only for the story to have him want to be with the other woman who died. Like, they go above and beyond to show how much Tifa loves Cloud, while all of Aeriths POV archs is about her role as a Cetra. Like, yes Aerith and Cloud grow a very strong bond very quickly and care very deeply about eachother, but they simply do not show any real signs of moving beyond the intial bond they made in Remake. You have 2 main quest dates with Aerith, one of which is her giving him shit for the fight he picked with Tifa the night before. Sure Aerith "shoots her shot" at him every now and then, but she also spends plenty of time scolding him in both Remake and Rebirth whenever he messes up regarding how he treats Tifa. Aerith is low key one of the biggest Cloti shippers lol.
When I played the original ff7 which was like 2 decades ago I wasn’t sure who Cloud would end up with and when the remake came out I just played it since it’s my childhood game, I’m not a shipper or anything but story kinda pushes Cloud and Tifa to be together noticeably like this time around you don’t have options to give Tifa flower or not, Aerith saying “ Lovers used to give these when they were reunited “ and later Cloud just gives Tifa a flower amd moments like Cloud kinda gets jealous when Sam ( one of the trio ) says something about Tifa, Cloud becomes aggressively protective of Tifa and also Andre says something like “ have you found where you are looking for? “ Cloud answers “ yes I do thanks to you “, Andrea “ don’t ever let it go again “ and also even Barret resolution in CH.14 Cloud not happy about someone giving Tifa a flower and so on, there could be a lot more moments but players just have to pay attention
and before the Rescuing Aerith in the OG, the options of saying "I don't know" or "let's hope so" when Marlene asked "Do you think she likes you?" at Aerith's house, that dialogue was cut out as well.
Cleariths see Aerith giving Cloud such a flower to be romantic as well but the Japanese dub never says anything about lovers as all and I take the japanese intent to be more authentic to what the story expresses then the english dub. The Flowers simply symbolize a "Reunion" it works for tifa and cloud seeing each other again after so long, and from aeriths point of view of both knowing the future and seeing a part of her lost love, zack in cloud in a way.
Yup, in OG Tifa took a backseat until Clouds brain completly fried and only when we get to play as her for awhile before we find Cloud in Mideel, do we start to see her feelings for Cloud be expressed and once she finds him in mideel she more or less says the world can go to hell because she only cares about him. That's were the cognitive disonance came from in my opinon because prior to her death, Aerith was more or less the secondary "main character" and only after did Tifa get to shine. Which is something they clearly aimed to correct in Remake and Rebirth by making Tifas role and importance to Cloud and Tifas feelings for him apparant from the get go.
Some in the comments section still don't seem to get the whole story. I cannot believe it. It's so goddamn simple. But i digress, I hope the lifestream event shows you confused people that cloud has more reason why he's like that in ACC. It has 0% to do with shipping nor love interests. it's a problem he had ever since tifa had an accident and continued on with his town, mom, zack, and aerith. Literally everyone he couldn't save and everyone in that movie, starting with tifa's talk, helped him to forgive himself. That's something only he can do. It's weird but that's what Tifa's shilly shally dilly dally is for, and aerith just repeats it to him later on with marlene comforting him as well later. Heck Zack was also there for him! As for canon pair, you'll see in lifestream as well (seriously some don't play this game at all). Cloud's heart never moved, it only and always stayed with tifa. Just as Cody said on twitter, platonic is a thing people. Don't let a great story be wasted by a wrong perspective. Btw he also literally sleeps with tifa in HW, I don't think that's someone who loves someone else would do days after they just died because that would make him an asshole in OG and AC for both of them. There's literally jp VAs and Andrea's JP VA talking about that event wondering what they would do about it and devs back in 1997 saying they had to tone it down for being too risque. Fill in the dots, the right dots and you'll find yourself a cohesive story than some telenovela. If anyone of you can, please read TOTP, CoT before ACC, watch devs interview about the movie. He wants forgiveness, he says that himself, nothing else.
Just you wait and see how in about 4 year when Part 3 comes out some people gonna go crazy trying to convince everyone how in certain cultures intertwined fingers in Aerith's optional date are more indicative of a couple than any amount of kisses and sex in the main story. Not to mention the long-running crush, the fall from the bridge, the promise, the 2-meter-long sword to the abdomen, Tifa being the only person to absolutely refuse to leave Cloud in Mideel, living as a family and so on. Some people just can't be helped
The Cloud and Aerith fans are delusional after the Rebirth game because Tifa gets a kiss at the date scene at the Gold Saucer, but they said it was an optional scene. Despite it being an optional scene. Cloud only kisses one person. They make no sense. I don't know how much clearer it needs to be.
Not to mention that all the emotional/romantic tension between Cloud and Tifa In chapters 1, 4, 6, 8 and 9 is hardwired into Rebirth. You get those moments regardless of the decisions you make with character relationships, and even in optional moments, It is Cloud who is initiating those moments with Tifa. The writers are already taking steps to solidify their feelings as romantic for the contextually challenged players and that is a good thing.
@@joshz2491Since you named all the chapters can you name them on the top of your head? Just curious since I was thinking the same that allot of these arent optional even if it looks that way. Just didnt have the time to replay the game so
Even if Tifa would give him a blowjob, in two of these three games plus all the expanded media he shows much more respect and emotional attachment to Aerith. If you want to make the kiss meaningfull than I kissed 90% girls I liked and never though about them. Rebirth clearly emphasises he sexually likes Tifa more but that's not what even you talk about.
I always loved Cloud and Tifa’s relationship over the alternative since it grew up and evolved along with them. It starts off fairly childish where each in a way idealizes the other and ends in a healthier place based on mutual respect, understanding, support, and love. Compared to that Aerith always just felt like she showed up, you know? She’s important no doubt but personally I find it dubious that she’d take the place in Cloud’s heart that Tifa has resided in since childhood.
It's definitely more akin to the way relationships work in real life as well. According to Nojima's novel "Traces of Two Pasts", Cloud and Tifa played together all of the time as young children, and then of course the mountain incident happened after Tifa's mother died. It'll be fun to get into Cloud's head in the new upcoming novella that will be featured in the FFVII Rebirth World Preview book, and find out how exactly he fell in love with Tifa.
@@tanagreeknose7376 are you sure because in one source it says they were close and in two other sources it says they were not sounds like a contradiction, I hear in the book it says that they invited Cloud and Cloud always refused, but in the OG game he says he wanted to play with everyone and he wanted to get accepted in the group and he wanted to be noticed
@@tanagreeknose7376 Turns out they went further and harder on Cloud and Tifa in Rebirth than I ever imagined they would that early in the story. Cloud sealed the deal with both a kiss, and perhaps even more surprising, WORDS, he actually used words. They might not be the only way to tell someone how you feel, but they are nice too.
When Tifa says, Do you love me? Do you love Marlene? It always breaks my heart. Cloud is such in a deep depression that when she sees that he feels better when Denzel shows up, it truly made my eyes tear up. That is why the ending of advent children means so much to me.
Cloud and Tifa are 100% canon. They literally have sex at the end of ff7, with everyone watching from the airship. Tifa searches for cloud in Kingdom hearts. Cloud literally attacks the main bad guy of Dissidia to protect Tifa. Cloud and Tifa have matching rings on their fingers in advent children. One of the main producers on FF7 said Sephiroth represented the darkness in Clouds heart, and Tifa represented the light in Clouds heart. Tifa literally has heart in her last name, and her last weapon is called "Premium Heart". Come on
Just because they had sex, dosent mean Cloud feels the same way for Tifa as he does Aerith. People in real life have sex without having a romantic feeling.
@@Matagu1 Except Cloud and Tifa having sex is them communicating their feelings, not in spite of. Why would Cloud of all people have sex with a woman unless he loves her?
I've always been of the, what felt like obvious, assumption that You'd and Tifa liked each other. After playing remake, it's even more obvious. After reading traces of two pasts, Tifa's section of the book describes her feelings for Cloud.
@@Matagu1 that...that is absolutely wild that you acknowledge they smash but still deny he's in love with her. Fam, you are hopeless beyond redemption. But if you want to go there you do realize this is made by the Japanese right? When it comes to sex they're culture is drastically different from the west. In Japanese media you'll rarely see them make anyone consensually bang if they weren't in love with each other, and FF7 is definitely not on of those rare exceptions. Sex is the ultimate, indisputable, undeniable proof of it. There is no argument to be made after that. and even ignoring all that, just look that who Cloud is. He's definitely not the type of that would smash just for the hell of it, he won't let just anyone that close to him
There is also Tifa's story in On The Way To A Smile where right after the end of FF7, Cloud smiles because he can start a life with Tifa. That absolutely destroys the opinion in the fandom that Cloud was yearning/searching for Aerith after the end of FF7 along with the other info you have showed. It's really not that hard.
If you payed attention, Cloud only moves slowly on at the end of Advent Children because Aerith was his true love. The end credits shows Cloud riding his bike, searching for flower places he can meet Aerith. The Lyrics and the scenes showing speaks volume. Hollow is a song from Cloud to Aerith. The new theme song where Aerith is singing, is her words for Cloud. Tifa being shallow at the beginning, only paying attention to Cloud because he said he wants to be a Soldier and Toifa grown up being center of attention, with nobody looking at her, of cours she wants to be rescued by Cloud, the only boy left in the Village her age, who wants be soldier. She wants to be praised and stuff. Only after Aerith came along Tifa realised she has a rival and her feelings for Cloud became honest. She knows Cloud is more open, relaxed and protective around Aerith, which she wants to win him. At the end, we all know, Aerith died. Tifa cant be happy because despite the fact they where love Rivals, even though Clerith where lovers, they where like best friends. Seeing Cloud crying and screaming like a Baby while holding Aeriths death body is something she never saw of him. Not with him mourning his mother, not with Jessie dying, not awkward holding Tifa while she crying after Sector 7 plate while thinking at Aerith(he was looking at the flowers) and hurting Tifa cause his muscle got tense. Losing a best friend is very hurtful. Seeing the one you love, holding his dead lover and screaming crying is more hurtful. Both of them had sex on disc 3, only because they thought they where alone and like "We will die anyways so lets have our moment of comfort". Sure Tifa thought she won, but Cloud never stopped grieving for Aerith and they never became a couple even after Advent Children(he lives in the Church to be near Aerith). Tifa in Advent Children shows annoyance because its not just Cloud never taking Tifas calls(which prooves he dosent care for her romanticly), he never stops saying its his fault for Aeriths death and also she is annoyed cause she is there for Cloud but he just dosent want to see it. His feelings for her is not like he had with Aerith. At the end he lifes with Tifa, Denzel, Barret and Marlene, becoming a chosen family. He started his healing process. I think their relationship after Dirce of Cerberus can be a good one like Clerith and not a toxic one based on loss which is never a good sign for a long term relationship. Just saying from a neutral FF7 fan. Clerith has more symbolism and is more popular in japan. The Theme Song Trailer didnt just got released before official Clerith day for a reason. You cant get Groom Cloud single but with Bride Aerith for a reason. Sephiroth is the villain, Cloud is the hero and Aerith is the Heroine, while Tifa and the others are supportive characters for a reason. At the very beginning there was Barret, Cloud and Aerith for a reason before Aeroth got split into two characters.
@@Matagu1 In the grand scheme of things, the in game timeline of ff7 is about 2 or 3 weeks. And once Cloud meets Aerith all the way up to when she dies is less than that so you mean to tell me that Aerith was so impactful to Cloud life that he forgot about the girl he literally joined Shinra for, a girl he's known for all of 2 days. Not to mention when we first meet Cloud he thinks he's Zack so his view of things is skewed. And did Cloud cry over Aerith's dead body because he loved her or was it because it was a friend who was just killed Infront of him so if Tifa was the one who was killed his reaction would have been different I don't think so. I think Cloud values all of his friends and would brake down hard if any of his friends was killed and he couldn't stop it. And how do you know that Cloud was thinking of Aerith when him and Tifa hooked up there was no dialogue or scene that even hinted at such a thing. And you're minimizing the role Tifa had in Clouds life and the love she has for him, for 1 Cloud only joined Shinra cause he thought it would impress Tifa he said so himself so FF7 wouldn't exist if Cloud never joined Shinra. 2 if Tifa is just a supporting character than anybody could have gone into the life stream with Cloud and helped him gather his Psyche back to normal but it wasn't it was Tifa it couldn't have been anyone else but her, Aerith didn't do it and she's connected to the life stream. And my last thing that I don't get with these Clerith shippers is let's say it happens, Cloud and crew are able to save Aerith from death and they both live happily ever after blah blah blah. What happens to Zack? You know that black haired guy who walks into the light with Aerith at the end of Advent Children, the guy who bought the bow she wears in her hair everyday for, the guy who gave her the idea to even sell flowers that guy. Cause with remake Zack is a playable candidate now and he is searching for Aerith. So what is the point of Zack coming back if not to reunite with the girl he actually likes. And what about Tifa does she say screw it and be with Jhonny. It is very obvious to me that Cloud loves all of his friends but he is in love with Tifa.
@@novusparadium9430 i am more a Cloud x Vincent Fujoshi and since remake a Barret x Cloud shipper cause Baret is hot and soft! Just because i have open eyes and pay attention, dosent mske me a Clerith shipper.
@@Matagu1your comment really screams you hate Tifa, the content is more focus on what is the POV of the creators. It doesn’t say anything bad about Aerith, yet you say words about Tifa being shallow and all. Tifa is a strong willed written character same with Aerith. Yet you slander Tifa’s character just because you’re CLEARLY A CLEARITH shipper.
What catches me off guard is when people state that cloud sees tifa as a friend… well um that’s now officially false…😭😂 HAVE YOU SEEN ANY OF THE LEAKS…. IM OFFICIALLY (GONE)GAGA
Thank you!! 👏 All of sudden when rebirth launches and Cloud kisses Tifa, extreme Cleriths dismiss the narrative and try to build up their own narrative on how he should be with Aerith. They ignore what’s shown in Cloud’s point of view. They can’t control how he feels😂
I think that cognitive dissonance is strong when one personally believes something is one way for over 20 years. The only thing to do at this point is to just enjoy the narrative for what it is.
My standard response to them after Rebirth is laughter. As long as they continue trying to push their fan fiction version of the story, that's all they deserve.
@@Matagu1I don’t know about that Cloud says that Aerith guided Denzel to him and Tifa so as much as they rescued Denzel; Aerith saved Cloud,Tifa and Denzel and brought their family together.
What is even more irksome than the extreme cleriths who still deny cloti is canon are the "Enlightened Centrists" who claim to be above all the shipping label those who actually know the lore and go by what the story blatantly presents as biased Cloti shippers. Or worse, that "both are canon". It's equally hilarious when their explanations prove they dont know the lore besides the remake trilogy. Hell, at least the Cleriths have the excuse of being delusional and in denial about what they know full well is canon, which is why they're wishing so hard to change it.
I'm quite curious to hear your opinions on certain interactions between these three throughout Rebirth. Since I deepened Cloud's relationship with Tifa (because, you know, that's what Cloud would do) I ended up watching alternate scenes where Aerith would be there instead. And, uh, to say that there is a difference in how Cloud interacts between the two would be an understatement. I honestly don't understand how people think Cloud romantically loves Aerith.
Might I add there’s a reason why Aerith approached Cloud in the beginning. It’s the Buster sword. It’s Zack’s. That’s why she had Cloud around to investigate.
The voice actor knows the character probably the best next to the writers and the director. So saying that the voice actors' words aren't true is a stretch. They know the character inside and out just like an on camera actor would that way they could embody the character as best as they could. I know that Cody said in an interview that he researched the HELL out of Cloud after he got the role that way that he could be as true to the character as he could and I think that work PAID OFF. And outside of the Devs, I trust his word over any other people in the gaming world.
If you actually listened to the interview, the guy is clueless about the plot. He doesn't even know who Zack is. And Sephiroths VA explained how VAs just move on from role to role and don't really think too much about the story
Tifa's line in the ending is also a reference to her mother. The one she almost died just to meet again (she didn't know then). Everyone they've lost, the two of them acknowledges that they will meet them all again later. Tbh this title probably has the most death count in FF titles lol. So many massacres and shit like that, can you blame cloud for being afraid of not protecting the happiness he has within those 2 years with his family? Then suddenly he can't even protect himself nor denzel because he's about to die and he's afraid to die and hurt anybody else.
Very well presented with absolutely loads of evidence, great job! At this point, people who still deny that CT is endgame despite all of the evidence will likely never change their minds. Not until Rebirth/part 3 lays it out clearly. Even then some won't. 20+ years is a long time to believe in something so unwaveringly.
For the Aerith fans who hold on to relationship affinitie. It's been clearly mentioned in an interview with the creators and the actual help section that relationship affinity represents how characters feel about Cloud. It has nothing to do with how Cloud feels about any of them. The thought of Cloud taking up with his BFFs G.F, after he died to save Cloud is just so bad taste it's disturbing
This court finds you guilty of sound reason and convincing evidence. XD In all seriousness, thanks for taking a calmer and less-attacky approach to this. As I've integrated myself back into the FF7 community, I'm seeing just how toxic the shipping side of it can really get, and its kept me from reaching out more and participating outside of certain circles. Aerith was the one who got away for a lot of gamers. Tifa is the one who so many pined for. Cloud was projected on by so many as well. It's a unique cocktail, to say the least.
Aerith in ff7 already move on she is with zach but fans of her didn't accept the true cloud feeling towards her, but it doesn't matter coz in the end of this story tifa and cloud living together as a family,❤ 7 years after they meet at sector 7 and now living together in 7TH HEAVEN #FF7 C❤T
I also think that Cloud is like a "medium" for Zack and Aerith. He actually connectes them spiritually without him realizing it. Also, Cloud and Tifa, and Zack and Aerith are the ultimate balance. The story will be off if Aerith somehow ended up with Cloud. They probably expecting Zack to be like "Oh well, that's fine. I died anyway.." Pfft.
"Memory" as a mechanism is extremely important to FF7. The Lifestream and Materia are made up of memories. There is a reason why Sephiroth appears to Cloud the way he does, and its because Cloud remembering him keeps him "alive".
6:20 If Cloud and Tifa are meant to be a couple in Advent Children, fine. But, I don't know if it was the English translation or the Japanese movie makers just weren't good at emphasizing them as a couple, it felt like Geostigma was being used as a plot excuse to keep Tifa and Cloud apart. That's the main reason why I don't care for Advent Children.
I think the disconnect with some fans understanding of FF7OG lies in what age or maturity level they had for their first play through. Back in the late 90s when I was 26, I marveled at how a game could put me into 2 years of mourning and make me go through all the stages of grief. I spent 2 years trying to find ANY way to bring Aerith back, but I had to eventually accept it. The purpose of the game was to enrich players by teaching them one of life's hardest lessons in the safe confines of a video game. To let go and move on with living our life (also the take away from FF7AC). That's what made the game a masterpiece. Aerith's death is the point of the story. Seeing so many players who are unable to let go and move on, even after a quarter century is proof that so many played the game wrong. I'm so grateful that I got to experience the game in real time the way it was supposed to be experienced. If not for that, then I may have wasted 25 years of my life arguing about trivial details while ignoring the giant neon letters that spelled it out.
This is a great way of looking at it. While FF7 has many themes, "life" is one of them, and how it can be so transient. To be so attached to what is now a dead character (who's purpose was so much greater than a 'love triangle'), is definitely missing a huge point!
@@tanagreeknose7376 I’ll give you credit, it must be tedious dealing with some of these people. Folks going on about characters furniture choices, high fives and all kinds of crazy stuff. Tearing apart the meaning of a song while completely ignoring the morale of the story? Maybe it's about him and Aerith or maybe it's about him and a few characters? What's most important is that we know it's about Cloud because he is hollow until his reconstruction in the Lifestream. That's all the thought I'll give it because my attention is on the story. He’s supposed to be a vegetable like Jessie’s Dad but he’s animated by Jenova cells that are feeding off Tifa’s memories, He believes he’s a Solder 1st class because that’s what Tifa believes he went on to become. He acts the cold prick like Sephiroth and a bit of a hot dog like Zack. The only two Soldier 1st class that Tifa has met. He possesses Soldier skills and talents because the J cells have intimate knowledge of the best Soldier 1st class (Sephiroth). I’ve always believed that he did lighten up a little bit after those J cells had more regular contact with Aerith (more Zack memories influence). The fact of the matter is that Cloud could fall to knees and pledge his undying love to either of these girls or bang everything in sight like my Grey Warden from Dragon Age Origins and it wouldn’t mean anything until he’s reconstructed. Aerith hasn’t met the real Cloud (until she's dead) and she says as much on their date. Which I believe is the canon resolution as much as I believe the lovemaking under the Highwind is canon. In FF7OG the affection points are also generated by time spent in party(besides choices), which has always given Tifa a long-term advantage since she's the second fastest and second heaviest hitter. I think most players would have to go out of their way not to get the love making result. Much like the date scene earlier which I believe is supposed to be Aerith (she starts with a numerical advantage) which you'd have to go out of your way not to get as a date. My very first playthrough before I was aware of any such affection mechanics, Cloud went on the date with Aerith and made love to Tifa under the Highwind. I'm sure most players who went first playthrough with no such knowledge also had the same result. In my Rebirth playthrough I will going for the date with Aerith (for the sake of exposition). Although I doubt I will have to try very hard and just play the game as I normally would. As someone mentioned earlier, I also hope SE nuts up and gives this thing some definite final word. I believe they will since it seems like a lot of trouble to make Zack a bigger character this time around just to have him spin his wheels in the mud. What really bugs me about this never ending droning is that it takes away from actual theory discussion with other fans in chats. In the almost 3 decades of talking about this game in chats, I have only participated in one thread that discussed who Cloud’s Father might be (I theorize he’s another Shinra bastard). Or how about the fact that Hojo always calls Cloud a failure even though he rivals Sephiroth? Another youtuber named Ray Coffman had an awesome theory on that. This triangle crap has stifled some great exchange of ideas. The truth is that most hardcore fans of Tifa don’t really care who she ends up with. They’re still going to online search girls who cosplay her and look for pics of her on deviantart. Most of these other players that are allegedly called CT's are simply players who take the story at face value. Am I supposed to be a "Frilma" because I take the Flintstone's at face value? To me a shipper is someone who wants to see Fred with Betty or Wilma with Mr. Slate. There's sites for you guys online, just keep it in a brown paper bag please. The toxicity comes from ONLY one group of fans and I'm not talking abut ZA's. The amount of times I’ve had to read “um nooooo” and “well actually” in chat threads attacking someone else’s comments for half of my life has been staggering.
@@darthlocklan6388Great comment! I will say that it's been wild seeing some of the replies but it wasn't a consequence that I didn't anticipate, having played FF7 a little before Advent Children was announced. After all, if you believe something for over 20 years (even though it's factually incorrect), cognitive dissonance will not allow you to let go! I definitely agree that anyone taking the story at face value shouldn't be labeled as anything but alas here we are, even with the writer and Square Enix liking certain posts on Twitter that talk about.. Cloud and Tifa as a couple. I'm actually working on a Sephiroth video next since FF7 is so multi-faceted and much more than the "LTD" but hopefully the shipping stuff dies down after this second part (we can hope)!
Remember when you parachute into Midgar late in the game? The original plan was to have every character you don't have in your party die off. Glad they didn't go that way with it.
@@Malohta Yeah, fans wouldn't have known who the two others who officially lived were until AC. Every time I watch the X-Force jump in Deadpool 2 I think about that FF7 "what coulda been".
Thank you so much for this beautifully articulate and sourced video. I’ve always believed that cloud and Tifa were the canon couple and that Aerith provides more than just a piece of a love triangle. I feel like people don’t pay attention to the friendship aspect of Aerith and Tifa because they’re so distracted by the love triangle, but we see in rebirth and remake how much they need each other‘s female companionship. Aerith was a very lonely child and it didn’t seem like Tifa had many female friends in her youth. We see in Costa del Sol how she is often looked at by other women with jealousy and has therefore been set apart by anyone of her age group.
I typically keep quiet about my thoughts on this, but I’ve recently been getting Cloud x Aerith tiktoks on my For You feed and in those comments I’ve found Clerith shippers to be hella scary and argumentative no matter what points you bring up lol Aerith is my QUEEN but I’ve always loved Cloud and Tifa together. Story wise, outside of just ONE game (which a lot of the opposing shippers ignore/try to rationalize) & your points, it just makes more sense to me. It could be bias (because Zack is my fave too) BUT I was so happy Aerith & Zack could be together in the end in AC.
It's crazy because the Cloud and Tifa quotes are very consistent. A lot of people try to use Benny Matsuyama's story or other games in which there are cameo appearances to argue a point.. but I think the key thing here is to see what Square most consistently portrays and what Nojima consistently writes. The writing is getting more refined as times goes on, with less wiggle room for interpretation, and I think the characters benefit the most from it too.
@@tanagreeknose7376 agreed! I also see the Voice actor argument brought up on TikTok as well, and I’ve concluded and rational and valid points are just aimed at a wall that is Clerith lol. As you’ve surmised, when you get a job, they tell you about what it entails, what they want you to do. Same goes for the cast so Cody, Steve, etc,’s “ship opinions” do not come from thin air. So to your point, I do like that the writing is getting more refined (& I’m glad they remastered Crisis Core too) so hopefully where the characters stand regardless of player preference/choice is more clear.
I cannot fathom why they get to SCARY about it!! lol Like I've seen arguments saying how Aerith accepted Cloud for who he is and saying "Did you even PLAY the game?!" MAINLY referring to REMAKE whenever someone brings up a good point and I'm like.... Did you EXPERIENCE the whole FRANCHISE?? @@lockh4rt__3
i mean i been in this fandom since 1998 and.. u right. "clert"h people has always been delusional even way back then. and they lash out so much because deep down even they know thier ship is more fan fiction than cannon. lol. It got worse when crisis core got released becase the devs all but confirmed Zack is Aeriths actual soul mate.
Clerith is definitely a red herring. At first glance it might seem like the setup for a "perfect" romance between a flower girl and her bodyguard, but FF7 is s lot more subversive than that. After Aerith's death things really start to unravel, the problem is that a lot of people lose the plot after that 😅 And yes, Crisis Core definitely drove the point home that Zack wasn't just some meaningless ex-boyfriend of Aerith's.
I was way more active in the early early 2000's but hoo boy yea Clerith's were always quite something. Someday I'll find some other FF7 folks who remember the Aerith shrine (and its owner) who used the carp as the ultimate proof of their love. 🤣 That girl would fight to the death for proving C/A...
@@tanagreeknose7376 OMG did you?? Idk how I missed that! I need to re-watch! That's hilarious though. 🤣🤣 I had many an experience with that girl since I used to run a big Cloud/Tifa site back then.
I mean, (in regards to the promised land) its also pretty evident that Cloud didn't want to 'die' to meet Aerith again when her hand becomes Tifa's hand. Whether or not you interpret that as Aerith leading Cloud to Tifa or Cloud choosing Tifa, it's the same end result--there's a lot going on in that ending sequence. Neither of which results in 'Cloud wants to die to be with Aerith'. That's a complete injustice to the scene.
Infact Cloud never wanted to die, he literally was about to die because of Geostigma and was destroyed because he couldn't stand letting them see him in that state and he couldn't bear the possibility of dying in front of them, so that's why he left. Cloud always wanted to live, but he had Geostigma, Denzel had it too so he had to find a cure for him, he also had survivor's guilt not just for Aerith, but for Zack too. The ultimania also says that Cloud's promised land is Tifa and the kids (his family and his life) and that Cloud is ready to go back to live with them because he has finally forgiven himself. Nothing romantic about a dude who's depressed, dealing with grief, an illness and self blame, but these weirdos are nasty and toxic like that.
I will never understand these FF7 shipping wars because, well..... Aerith is dead, so that means Tifa won. Cloud's future is with her, not Aerith. The end. Problem solved. Discussion over. Seriously, why keep arguing about this?
Wow, honestly this is incredibly well said and backed up with straight facts. I was never into the shipping thing either, but from what I gathered, It's Cloti and Zaerith that are the canon ships. Right?
I’ve always thought Cloud & Tifa was ment to be. When I found out Zack & Aerith were in love before he died I already knew she gravitated to Cloud because Cloud reminded her of Zack. Besides in my mind Cloud & Tifa hooked up before you go to the Northern Crater
Zack and Aerith are so cute but you also have to put into consideration that crisis core came out a decade after the original ff7. I felt like they copy the story of how Cloud met Aerith and then made it seem like this is how they met now and how she got her bow. I wish there was an original to it because it made it too cheesy for me. I would be happy if he didn't die and came back to her tho. 😭
Zack and Aerith are so cute but you also have to put into consideration that crisis core came out a decade after the original ff7. I felt like they copy the story of how Cloud met Aerith and then made it seem like this is how they met now and how she got her bow. I wish there was an original to it because it made it too cheesy for me. I would be happy if he didn't die and came back to her tho. 😭
Just because Cloud reminds her on Zack, dosent mean she has no right to have honest romantic feeling for Cloud, after 5 years of thinking that a Playboy found another girl and ghosting her, not answering Aeriths letters. You cant blame Aerith for that. Besides, i find Tifas behavior more toxic. Only showing interest ion Cloud because he said he wants to be soldier, wanting attention from a hero. Its no different from real life woman who suddenly has interest in a men who suddenly got rich or popular.
LMAO Bless you for compiling everything together! It's been a while since I braved FF7 related RUclips side and omg there's been a huge new wave of misinformation, like there are accounts that just spread lies about how "Nojima and Nomura said this and that" and I'm like "...dude, what is you talking about?? I've been in this fandom for decades and know every nook and cranny of this nasty debate and no one has ever said that shit!" lol, and those posts have a number of Likes, so you can tell it's like a mob going around, probably thinking that if they can misinform and gaslight more newbies, then Clerith may become as popular as Cloti and the devs will change canon 😂 But anyway, you laid down all the actual facts and it's always been clear for those who cared that it's Cloud and Tifa. Another thing I'll add for the points about taking things out of context: one doesn't even need exact translation or book quotes to realize it's ooc, all one has to do is finish the scene after the misleading excerpt (like actually LISTENINING TO what TIFA says after "I'll meet her there" and realizing this is a group meeting of the loved ones and not a romantic rendezvous between Cloud and Aerith lol), or just watching AC TO THE END and realizing that Cloud only stayed temporarily in that church and returned home afterwards, that he only wanted forgiveness from Aerith and Zack and wasn't pining romantically. Everything is spelled out right in front of us, but those that are biased refused to see or listen. Which is, ok whatever, but at least don't pretend you're right or knowledgeable lol
@@tanagreeknose7376 Hahaha it was hard not to notice! I was looking around, seeing these new bot-like accounts talking about how Nojima and Nomura confirmed that Aerith and Cloud are in love, or that Aerith is the love of his love and so on and I was like 'what the HELL are these guys talking about?? This NEVER happened, where did these lying bots even come from??" 🤣
If they're really worried about mature ratings, they could just replace the whole sex scene with a Wedding on the Highwind with Captain Cid performing the ceremony. Maybe they could even find Zangan to fill in the Father of Bride duties and have Cloud give Tifa that ring she was wearing in AC? After a wedding they don't got to show anything, a honeymoon romp is a given. Besides, after that Italian Senate incident how much more do I really need to see?
Square Enix up until these days never made them official. People can have sex without having feelings of Love. How do you think Hookers work? It is so clear, i dont know why Cloti fans ignore many facts. Cloud and Tifa slept with each other and still they are not a real couple. Cloud needs therapy and moving on from Aerith before he can think of Tifa.
@@Matagu1 And so you are equating Tifa to a hooker? That's pretty disrespectful to the narrative. And if you actually watched this video and came out thinking that Cloud was depressed over his love for Aerith in Advent Children.. then I really don't know what to tell you.
Fr. Clerith shippers is the most cancerous people i ever encountered like, Crisis Core is my intro to ff7 and when i joined a group of ff7 fandom i got burned when i said i like Zack, they hated Zack so much just because they feel threatened for their ship
I agree, and they make up so many stupid narratives just to try to prove Aerith is the ship. If Cloud were to sneeze, they would say he blew her a kiss. Cloud and Tifa are the ship.
The reality regardless of anyone's ship, the devs made it clear already that its all going to lead back to Advent Children. So the likely scenario will be the original canon in which Cloud and Tifa do ending living together. Their situation is not outwardly confirmed, though it should be assumed that there is some romantic conclusion there. Advent Children ultimately confirms Aerith is content, reunited with Zack in the Lifestream. I think we can all acknowledge that Cloud loved Aerith, or at least was taken aback by her ability to break through his walls. But in the final scene of Advent Children, Cloud says "I'm not alone, not anymore..." which ultimately means Cloud realizes he has something to live for. he has something special to fight for. We can say thats Tifa, or the kids, or his friends. But by the end of Advent Children, Cloud has let go of Aerith and fully accepted his future with Tifa and whatever comes next. If the devs plan to lead it all to Advent Children, then we have to assume the finale will be the same. Especially since much of Cloud's turmoil in Advent Children is the loss of Aerith and his feeling that he lets people down. He's afraid to let Tifa and his friends down so he tries to find ways around issues, rather than facing them head on. Its ultimately his conversation with Tifa that shakes him out of his self-doubt and allows him to finally start fighting for the people he cares about. To reiterate, Cloud lets go of Aerith and his regret, and embraces a life with Tifa. Some might take that as their romance confirmed, others just see it as the inevitable outcome. But its canon, regardless of anyone's opinion... Unless the devs change everything in Rebirth, which remains to be seen 🤔
I think that "outwardly confirmed" for a lot of people means sealing it with a kiss or something physical, which is of course implied but never shown. Now that Clive and Jill exist though.. part 3 sure is gonna bring the heat. Cloud lets go of both the guilt of Zack and Aerith's deaths, people forget that they both affected him deeply. The devs really rectified this with Advent Children Complete by adding Zack's scenes in there.
Yo. Play the game again and watch the movie again (ACC NOT AC), perhaps watch ACC's interview with the devs. Look closely, as in look at how cloud relates and interacts with EVERYONE. Look at how he slowly defrosts ever since marle tells him to be more nice, and he does. He's soft on tifa, he's super kind with wedge and even offers to take him home. And so on, he's a good person. I won't go over Jenova's laugh in OG or how different SC is to Real Cloud that's on you. You're missing and wrong with a lot of points ngl. That's all I'm going to say. I can't believe this interpretation is still alive smfh. It's been so many years already.... This video even provides good sources. Sigh..
Cloud was suffering from guilt and anxiety in ACC, it was not some "romantic heart break" as some people tend to interpretate. The devs made it abundantly clear in interviews. He wasn't holding onto Aerith, he was holding onto his guilt. But at the end, he forgave himself for not being able to save his friends, got atonement and that ended his self imposed exile, thereby "not alone anymore". Nojima even said, Tifa and the kids are his promised land.
Thank you for this video! Love the information you put forward from reputable sources. I'm so, so excited to see how they're going to bring my favorite couple together in Rebirth and in the 3rd game. The lifestream sequence is one of my most-anticipated. ❤️🔥 Also, the faces you were making at the camera had me cackling...😆 I'm not ready, and I DEFINITELY don't think other people are.
@@tanagreeknose7376 I feel you, your feelings definitely echoed my own haha. And of course!!! Been loving your videos on this topic and will continue to do so. ☺
The fact that there is a camp of people who vehemently believe that Aerith and Cloud are meant for each other or that Aerith is undoubtedly alive speaks to the brilliance of the meta narrative that was constructed for the Remake. Consider what the big twists and shocks of the original game were and how the current Remake needs to recapture that shock. These people are being Jenova'd HARD. They are being set up to be cut down, just like we were back in 97'
I agree. Since there are three parts, they are looking for ways to mislead even the people that know the game up and down. Add in a little wishful thinking with that and years of waiting, and you've got a recipe for a shipping disaster.
Really glad you enjoyed it! I feel like the "love triangle debate" is like a metaphor for life where no matter how much you would like someone to believe the facts presented to them.. they will still choose to believe in something based on their emotions.
I'm not really a fan of the series anymore but i shipped Cloud x Tifa because it just seemed better for everyone. And Zack x Aerith. No one gets left behind.
This video is amazing and well thought out and once again I agree with everything you said 🙌🏻 I can’t wait to see your playthrough of rebirth!🤩 The 29th of Feb needs to get here quicker 😆
Once again, we have the incel Clerith shippers attacking everyone, including the voice actors for having their own opinion. They’re always super toxic and try to hate on Tifa at every chance they get. Like it’s perfectly fine if someone wants to ship Cloud and Aerith together, but these people tend to try and deny what’s canon as if they’ve never even played the games. Tifa has always been the main girl for Cloud. Both of Cloud’s VA (Cody Christian, Steve Burton), and his Japanese VA who know the character better than anyone else have stated Cloud and Tifa have the better chemistry.
FF7 is a game with plot twist after plot twist. Shinra isn't the main villain lf the game. Cloud isn't a SOLDIER, Cloud and Tifa weren't close as children (Remake retconned them to having been close at some point prior to Tifas moms died, though so maybe when they were 4-5?). Something that recently dawned on me is the plot twist that Aerith isn't the main love interest.... went over my head? There never was a "both". He wasn't himself during the time he knew Aerith, sure she became close to him in that short time but yeah, she wasn't Tifa. When Tifa restores his memories in LS, we see that he was in love with her as a child and attempted to join SOLDIER just to get her attention, he killed Sephiroth in rage for murdering his mother, burning his village and almost killing Tifa. The final plot twist. Tifa is the love interest.
Def Tifa was meant for Cloud. Forget the fact that there’s history dating back to childhood, you want to aim for the girl that challenges you to be a better man, not just the person that takes care of you like your mom would. Still love you Aeris ❤️
the whole point is neither is canon. the player choses. they both have equal romantic scenes together, yet people still argue which is canon.. hopefully rebirth will fix this but theyve already discussed a point system like in the og
In this video I acknowledge the fact that there was a dating mechanic put in, but the whole point was that the character designer and writer said that there's a canon route.
@@tanagreeknose7376 yeahh i was always so curious on what it is though cause from everything ive seen, they made both sides canon at different times ? it’s always so conflicting heh cause cloud seems to always be yearning for aerith, even in ac after the whole zack memory thing. and theyre pictured as married in whatever event that happened in another ff side game. but at the same time , you cant deny the chemistry between him and tifa and they have similar pairings in other games as well as tifa being clouds “light” and the obvious childhood friends trope they got going on… part of me wants them to keep it neutral like this in the new game too cause i can just smell the incoming chaos from both fandoms
Ngl this video keeps my anxiety down for the upcoming FF7 Rebirth lol, cause they kept referencing the new song which Aerith 'sang' in the trailer for CA ship🤸♀️ but i don't get why😭 cause it seems like a song for the general friendship or smth. Though, I'm more curious about Zack's role in rebirth tho--
It will definitely be interesting to see how the game progresses with the "romance" and see which becomes canon or if neither gets their way, maybe both can become "canon", i see valid evidence for both girls, they're both special in their own way
Man I love this channel I’ve only seen a couple of your videos but I can tell as a 27 year long fan that you really have a deep love for this game compilation and really understand it’s lore. Cheers from an elder FF fan!
As someone who always preferred Aerith (and still does), ultimately Cloud ends up closest with Tifa. She's the one he has always had feelings for, and is the one who has spent the most time over the course of the original to bring him back.
I don't deny that Cloud also loves Aerith, if not how could he be like that after her death. However, his true love has always been Tifa. But Aerith's death broke him that it'd be just too troublesome for him starting a real romantic relationship and I can understand that. On another hand, if we refer to FF7 OG, its underlaying story is about Cloud's moving on from his pain and grief, from him losing his mom, good friend and mentor Zack, his idol Sephiroth, and his special person Aerith. If SE has intregrity to keep FF7's essence, they'll make Cloud move on, even if Aerith's saved, I do not think SE will make their relationship romantic, best it'd be good friend, and we'll see once again how Cloud admires Aerith WHILE HOLDING HANDS WITH TIFA.
i feel like the story runs better with the scenario of cloud wanting to be with aerith.They met like it was fate. Both of them overcoming problems in their lives and fate has brought them together. Hes a hard ass that only finally starts changing his ways due to being around aerith. Aerith feeling like her life is worthless and losing her first love, only to start enjoying living again and finds comfort in the person that reminds her of her old love. If cloud never has feelings for aerith, then the story just doesnt feel right. Every time tifa is with cloud it feels very natural in the sense that cloud isnt nervous. He very okay with everything almost as if he doesnt see anything with them being alone together, like a childhood friend. But with aerith hes very nervous and chokes on his words a lot and doesnt know how to handle himself when alone with her. Almost like he doesnt know how to handle these new feelings and emotions that hes never experienced before. A lot of the moments throughout rebirth show us that cloud has these romantic feelings for aerith and she does as well towards him. I think hes contemplating between how he feels for both aerith and tifa. In loveless when aerith is singing, if you get the tifa route you can see that tifa goes to hold his hand and for a moment there's confliction in his eyes as if hes asking himself if what hes doing is the right thing. The scene just feels very odd with aerith singing about cloud while cloud is holding hands with tifa. While yes they do kiss when on the Ferris wheel, it still is like hes battling with himself all the way up until the end. In Aeriths playthrough you can see that hes memorized with everything that's happening. He doesn't shift is eyes or anything. Hes constantly in awe listening to her sing about him and the time shes spent with him. I think the story is more beautifully conveyed with aerith and cloud in the beginning and after aerith passes he finally ends up with tifa. Kinda like aerith and zach until zach passes, then its aerith and cloud.
I did not play ff7 for the first time until remake. Im not going to lie. I was immediately a Cloti shipper. Had no idea whether it was canon or not and didn't care. Mostly because I loved Tifa and it was very obvious she was into cloud. At the end of Remake, I believed that Cloud's feelings were more towards Aerith. By the end of Rebirth it was obvious to me Cloud had romantic feelings more towards Tifa, but I still believed he had developed some romantic feelings for Aerith. Than I watched my husband play through the original ff7, and to me it is pretty obvious who Cloud loves especially once you get to the part where Tifa enters his consciousness and you see he's basically obsessed with her. 😂 Ive since rewatched cut scenes and just little bits of gameplay. Everything about Cloud is different in regards to Tifa. The way he talks, his body language. Even in the LA GS date he still confirms his feelings for her. Now Im of the opinion that Cloud genuinely only loves Aerith as a friend.
@tanagreeknose7376 I think Cloud loves Berret🤣🤣🤣... That's what's happened to me when Cloud chose Berret at gold soucer in the original game😅 I still have the FF7 CDs for almost 24 years now. I was 13 years old back then, .... I can hand it over to you. If you ask for its platinum version,
Zack and Aerith are meant to be koibito (lovers) Aerith loves Cloud but she is in love with Zack. Aerith's love towards Cloud is like how sister loves her brother. Zack will always be #1 guy for Aerith. Aerith never got over Zack. In Remake when Aerith and Cloud had their date she tried to ask Cloud if he knew Zack but even mentioning Zack's name out loud was too much for her and she almost broke into tears. There are 3 parallel worlds in this trilogy and I hope that Zack and Aerith get their happy ending in the ending of this trilogy. I hope Zack from his altered world will live with Aerith after Sephiroth is destroyed. Maybe these worlds will become mirrored versions. 1. Og World = everything happens like in the og game. 2. Remake World = Everything happens mostly like in the og but there will be some differences. Aerith doesn't die in forgotten capital but she will eventually sacrifice her life in order to save the planet from the meteor. 3. Rebirth World = Everything is altered. Cloud and Tifa will both die and Zack and Aerith from this world will live together.
I'm unsure about the parallel worlds aspect of it, but it's a good theory. I doubt they will kill Cloud and Tifa though. Linking up everything with Advent Children means that they will have to continue living on, thanks to Zack and Aerith's heroic sacrifices.
@@tanagreeknose7376Nomura confirmed this parallel world theory. Those three different colored skies in cover art represents different worlds that form the story. Trailers showed us that Tifa is already dead in Zack's world. We saw shinra troopers carrying her lifeless body away, also those shinra wanted posters have red crosses drawn over every avalanche member except Biggs's and he says to Zack that he is the last avalanche member alive. There are also two Aeriths in this game. I doubt they kill them both because after Sephiroth merges these worlds into one then the story needs only one Aerith to make a sacrifice and fulfill her og destiny. I bet that after Sephiroth has been destroyed these worlds will split and return to normal and Zack and Aerith return to their world where they live together. The story linking up with AC does not mean the same as story leading to AC. This trilogy will be a sequel to AC and Sephiroth from remake is actually AC Sephiroth who has used the lifestream and found his way into a parallel world where he wants to fix his past mistakes and change his destiny. He has full knowledge on what happened in og game and AC movie. He knows that killing Aerith was his biggest mistake that sealed his fate and led to his downfall. That seven seconds until the end message was a warning about Aerith's death. Og/AC Sephiroth wants to keep Aerith alive so that she won't ruin his plans again. Og/AC Sephiroth wants Cloud to save Aerith from real Remake Sephiroth who will make his appearance in rebirth. It is quite possible that those Cloud's visions about Aerith's death are all Sephiroth's doing. He probably wants to prep Cloud so that he will be ready when the time to save her comes.
@@SilverSisu Ah, you meant the cover art. The Cloud, Sephiroth, and Zack and then Tifa, Sephiroth, and Aerith. The red definitely evokes destruction a la Sephiroth, the starry sky Tifa/Cloud, and the clear blue sky as Zack/Aerith. I think it's more the symbolism/characters rather than there being three versions of each character. I'm not ruling out your theory, it's just that we don't know yet for sure. About the footage on the Shinra monitors: well it's Shinra enough said, can we fully trust them? There's also a question of it being another one of Sephiroth's illusions, since he has the ability to make them SO vivid. About it being a sequel: I'm more of the opinion that it's just a re-imagining of the original game where they are able to express more of their ideas and expand upon them in this trilogy, and that includes more exposition on the lifestream and Sephiroth's intentions. Of course, we know that Sephiroth's conciousness traveled through the lifestream which gave him knowledge of the Ancients and so forth, so time in the lifestream probably does not flow 'linearly'. I think we can still have a time travel aspect of it without it being a sequel, since these concepts were introduced in the original game to an extent as well.
@@tanagreeknose7376 Well we know that one thing is certain. We have two Aeriths alive. One who is with Cloud, Tifa, Barret and Red in Remake world and second one who is in coma and Zack is watching over her and is waiting for her to wake up. She must have got injured by that tornado that hit them when they tried to escape from Shinra HQ. This is going to be a theory section: My theory is that the world where Tifa and the rest are dead is a world where Cloud never joined avalanche. He is still mako poisoned and with Zack. Tifa and Barret still somehow met Aerith (maybe it was Tifa who fell on Aerith's flower bed and they formed a deep friendship earlier than normally or maybe it was Jessie because she was supposed to be on that mission but whispers made sure that Cloud replaced her.) Aerith and Jessie never met so it would be pretty interesting to see them interacting together. Fast forward and Shinra dropped the plate and Aerith saved Marlene like in remake and they had that moment where Aerith was comforting Marlene and she saw something that she shouldn't have seen. Marlene saw a glimpse of the future and Sephiroth killing Aerith. Aerith noticed this and showed Marlene a shush sign. She clearly wanted to keep her fate secret from the others. Aerith gets captured by Tseng and Tifa, Barret and maybe Jessie and Wedge try to rescue her from Shinra HQ. If Jessie and Wedge were there they probably get killed during the rescue mission but they manage to rescue Aerith and Red XIII joins them but their escape fails when they get hit by that massive tornado. The party gets critically injured and Shinra troops arrive to the scene and they kill Tifa, Barret and maybe Red and then they capture unconscious Aerith back. Meanwhile Zack has arrived to sector 5 slums and he tries to reunite with Aerith and he heads to the church but she wasn't there. There were only sector 7 refugees. Zack heads back wondering what has happened and then he sees a live shinra news report on the big screen and he notices injured Aerith being in one of those Shinra helicopters. Zack decides to break into Shinra HQ and bring Aerith back to Elmyra. He will succeed but she is still in coma. Zack watches over her and this is where Marlene tells Zack about her vision and says "Promise not to tell? When she wakes up a scary man is gonna kill her." Zack will be fully aware about Aerith's death and because Tifa is dead she is not there to fix Cloud's mind and he will eventually get corrupted by Sephiroth. I think we will have Zack vs corrupted Cloud duel. Zack wins and he is forced to kill Cloud and end his best friend's misery. Nomura said that those different colored skies represent different worlds. In Remake world (green sky) where Zack is dead Stamp is a beagle and in Rebirth World (blue sky) where Zack is alive Stamp is a terrier. Red sky must be OG world and this is where Advent Children links up with the story. Maybe we see a geostigma pandemic in part 3? In trailer Sephiroth says "It is upon us, the reunion...when the worlds merge." Sephiroth's goal is to merge these worlds into one. His motives are unclear but it is safe to say that he is after power. Maybe he wants to merge Remake and Rebirth worlds lifestreams into one and absorb them and become an ultimate being with nigh limitless power and have his revenge on og Cloud and Aerith?
Actually there is four parellel worlds , you have to look at the dogs, the dogs tell you which world is which, and two of them have zack as being alive, 3 of them have aerith alive in them. Only the prime one has aerith as being dead.
Great video cause I ship Cloud & Tifa myself and you explained it very well for those who still don't get that fact. Besides Aerith really belongs with Zack and they might finally see each other again soon enough in FF7 Rebirth.
Thank you for your video. The shipping wars can be pretty brutal here so I hope you don’t get any hate from angry fans on this and people behave themselves in the comment section. These days I’m definitely Cloud X therapy and personally feel like Cloud is not mentally in a healthy place for a relationship in the games runtime and AC but appreciate the cute and drama moments with the different characters (Tifa especially because she my main lady and Aerith because she’s super cute). I do feel though after the ending of AC when he is in a place to embark on a healthy romantic relationship it’s gotta be Tifa. It seems a bit dark that Cloud would forever be mourning aerith to the end of his days and meet her in death while our man Zack is also present. Doesn’t seem very happy ending to me but okay. I also don’t understand how Cloud and Tifa wouldn’t be together after AC? Like they live together right and have a family. Tifa gonna bring boyfriend bob round for dinner while she’s living with Cloud????😂 I could be wrong but isn’t this obvious what happens end game and in the future? Anyways can’t wait for Rebirth! We’re in for a treat!
I considered the reaction that I would get, but then I thought about how many people might appreciate this video. When you're just relaying the truth.. it is what it is right? The problem with the "Cloud mourning for Aerith" headcanon is that it really paints Cloud in a bad light, and I don't think Cloud is that type of guy!
@@tanagreeknose7376 for sure, and I agree with you that many people would appreciate this video. Thank you again for your time and research making it 😊
With the release of "Rebirth", certain things are coming to light that line up with and give more depth to the statements that I bring up in this video. I won't spoil exactly, but this is the narrative that's been put in place for the last 27 years.
Now, everyone, please enjoy Rebirth.
Cloud seems to be more. Caring when talking to tifa. Where as when hes with Aerith she's kinda pushy on the date thing and it annoys cloud. Cloud cares for aerith though but you can tell his true feelings are with Tifa.
Cloud digs the attention no doubt, its critical to his character, but he also recognizes the difference in attention. Cloud is an edge lord 16 year old kid who wanted to impress the girl next door, and while Aerith isn't the exact girl whose fundamental to his motivations, he still takes pleasure in it.
My suspicion is that the meta narrative plays a part in the attention she gives cloud as well. Its clear from the skywheel scene with Aerith that;
1. She was initially drawn to him because of how much he reminded her of Zack.
2. She knows Cloud (prime) is trapped and shes been trying to find him.
One of these is reasonable, the other relies on information she should not have.
During one of the side quests in Coral del Sol, about the fashion one, Cloud said that he was only doing it to get paid and was hoping Aerith wouldn't refer to it as a date, to which Aerith insisted she's going to take it as a date anyways (pushy much). Also, it makes no sense that every time Aerith grabs onto Cloud's arm and claims he is hers (in remake) or that they were on a date (in rebirth) in front of Tifa, he looks taken aback and looks to Tifa with guilt. Why would he care about how Tifa takes his 'dates' with Aerith if Aerith is the girl he likes. He doesn't even know if Tifa likes him or not (which we know she did before moving to Midgar from the date with Yuffie) and during the date with Tifa, he is surprised when she says "Or am I getting ahead of myself, again" and cloud said "again?" Like he was surprised to hear that.
agree to disagreee, cloud always being a jerk while with tifa, but when she with aerith he seems more happy, also do u miss the scene that showing cloud mom
@@jasminelily94 not sure what bootleg game you played but being a a jerk to Tifa?? When he was having PTSD mode flashback( being taken over) you played a different game then everyone else seems like.
The almost kissing scene in Gongaga - that tells you who Cloud really has his romantic feeling for. And that’s not optional. The feeling Cloud has over Aerith is just guilt of not being able to save his friend in time when he was the only one that can. That’s why he never forgave himself. If it was someone else, he would feel the same way. It just so happened to be Aerith who had an interest in Cloud.
That's how I took it. Every time I watch the ending of Rebirth (putting aside how everyone feels about it and interprets it), I don't see someone trying to save the person they love. I see someone trying to save one of their best friends from dying.
After they all thought Tifa died in Gongaga, Cloud also shut down into a catatonic state. Like he simply ceased functioning. That is also a big sign of his feelings
@@adihsarstilinskih8237 Yup, he reverted into the black robe like state Tifa had found him in prior to the start of Remake. It's only when Barret gets through to him that she is still alive, only then does he slowly start to wake up and wiggle his way over to her (and only when he sees she is alive does he wake up again fully).
He also tries to leave the moment he sees she woke up, he probably figured she would simply not want to be alone with him ever againy.
Cloud and Tifa were always meant to be bro
They legit want Aerith to be Tifa, it's so weird, just saw a post on twitter of Aerith and Cloud sitting on the water tower in Nibelheim. And the post quoted Cloud talking about how "sitting there hoping Tifa would wave at him" sounds like something he'd do....and this person did a heart eyes emoticon and a hashtag Clerith. There simply is nothing that will get through to some people.
I had an Aerhead tell me this optional water tower scene was "symbolic" and when I asked them twice to explain what the symbolism was they refused to answer. I honestly believe these people would prefer to see Cloud die just so they could say he's with Aerith.
@@darthlocklan6388 It is symbolic, of the history between Cloud and Tifa. Remember that Aerith asks cloud to leave her alone after he talks to her, she is clearly not happy.
If I had to guess its a bit of jealousy. Not so much that she doesn't have that kind of history with cloud, but rather the access he has to the person he made that history with. The memories of Tifa and him aren't just memories, Tifa is still physically accessible to him.
Aerith wishes she could look through that window and see Zack.
@@Otis-Spunks I only looked at that scene in an ironic sense. As in those shared memories Aerith's talking about are what saves Cloud later on in the lifestream with Tifa. I really like your deeper take on it, it's very empathetic. The person who called it symbolic meant it as proof of some sort of timeless love between the Aerith and Cloud, which I was still willing to hear them out on. Too bad you weren't around for that initial discussion, but you still left me with some food for thought.
@@Otis-Spunks I agree. I also don't understand how people can ship C/A when she doesn't even know what happened to Zack. No one does. Not Aerith, Cloud or his poor worried parents.
Like let's recap here:
Zack and Cloud were tortured and experimented on for years. Zack get free, and he doesn't even THINK of leaving his BFF behind. He gets them away and manages to keep ahead of Shinra until right before he can get safely into the city. This man was on a mission. He was saving himself and his best friend and trying to get back to his girl. Only to be shot down trying to save Cloud and then he dies- and poor Cloud is so messed up with all the trauma that he promptly forgets Zack even existed.
Like... what a TRAGIC fate for this poor man. And then C/A's want to just throw Cloud with his best friend's girl just like that? Like they're interchangeable? No! I want Aerith to know that Zack didn't just abandon her! I want Cloud to remember his best friend. I want someone to tell Zack's parents what happened to their baby boy. That he went down fighting and that they, even in their grief, can be proud of him.
I'm not saying Aerith can never move on, but for her to properly have closure - before she can even THINK about liking someone else-- she needs to know about Zack's fate and his bravery. And that he was trying to come back to her.
So I am definitely on the Cloti and Zerith teams here. These pairings make the most sense narrative wise.
@@darthlocklan6388 Oh they definitely do, I've seen them say stuff like "don't worry cloud, she's waiting for you in the lifestream. *heart eyes emoji" like some kind of death cult, which they are.
They will kiss in the Gold Saucer date, mark my word.
BRO IM SO READY ITS HAPPENINGJDBBDDB
I came from the future to tell you a secret
You were right
This aged like the finest wine
Bro... give me lottery numbers. Hurry!!!!
Good call
Nice work ! I love the line, "so do the creators" because that exactly what the narrative is ! I hope this does not come across as too obnoxious, but I really really hope you do a similar video to add to this to follow up once rebirth is out ! because from the leaks (I have been spoiled unfortunately) the Devs are making things EVEN more clear on what the story and who and what is canon ! Thanks again for taking your time to make videos like this !
Rebirth is definitely going to inspire a whole slew of videos from me. Thanks for your comment! ❤
Cloud and Tifa have ALWAYS been canon. These people arguing different probably weren't even born when the original came out or played it back then. It was canon with the original, it was canon in Crisis Core, and it was canon in remake.
THIS!!! I was in the ff7 fandom in the 00's and the general consensus was that it was always CloudxTifa! sure Cleriths existed, but they were a very small minority. Ever since the remake announcement and a new generation of fans were introduced to the franchise, I've noticed a shift in the narrative, especially with the rise of social media 😒
I swear most of them didn't even play the og, spinoffs or read the novels, they just like stuff based on fanarts, YT clips and aesthetics 🙃
LMAOOO FAX😂
@@jinnimooWait what? I was 13 in 97 and the general forum for this talk was Famitsu letters and to lesser degree PSM.
To be clear I prioritize the story above any shipping. But when the trailer states about Cloud and Aerith - purest love that could never be it gave meaning to the game.
I remember clearly ppl writing it sucks for Tifa being his second choice. And ppl writing Aerith is clearly an escort. Sakaguchi was asked about it to which he was mad that he often gets this question he said:
-its all in the game
-Cloud has feelings for both
-Aerith dies
-its all in the game
My og interpretation was actually different:
Cloud is so f-ed he is neutral. Aerith flirts with him hard and Tifa is shy. Aerith dies. He had to have guilt because she ran on her own because of him. But at that moment she was the only person he had chemistry with. His love for her when she dies only adds to the narrative. Then he has that meltdown and Tifa comes in. The great part is that they BOTH restored their memories. Because in og Cloud makes Tifa doubt hers because he knows things she doesnt. Thats why she says nothing.
So don't get your position. I doubt anyone argued Cloud is with Tifa after og. But Cloud loving Aerith was stated by Sakaguchi, the game trailer. Even Clouds last words in og are - I will meet her at the promised land, while holding Tifa.
Ultimately I would say this all doesn't matter because you could view all of them as just friends and it wouldn't change the narrative. The optional sex scene could be old single friends before going on a suicide mission. Only narrative wise moment I would like is Sephiroth killing Clouds loved one. After destroing his village, killing his mother and love - he can finally break jenovas control.
@@jinnimoo Cleriths were never in a minority..,sorry. It's just that Cloti really does make more sense in the end...Most people I knew who played the game and weren't heavy gamers preferred the beginning over the end, and many got the sense that they didn't want the game to end at all...This is how attaching those characters are and their unique relationships.
As an intelligent human being who understands the fiscal aspects of the gaming industry, you should be aware by now that the game was designed to confuse you about the pairing on purpose...in the beginning at least.
@@ChoompaLoompa1985-uw8lw dude, just look at the stats and numbers. Clerith is the less popular ship. Cloti dominates all polls, featured articles, google searches etc. Even back in the day there were way more cloti amvs and fan sites. Even now, views on cloti related vids always outnumber clerith. Clerith's popularity is on par with Zakkura, which is just as popular.
Shippers in general is only a small (but loud) percentage of the fanbase, then you have clerith, the 2nd or 3rd most popular ship within that small percentage, making them a minority.
I love Tifa and Cloud, even with all the shipping chaos and girls thirsting for cloud 😅 Tifas and clouds chemistry aaalways stood out to me. With Jessi and Aerith it felt very forced. They were always kinda joking around and trying too hard, to get clouds attention. They also gave me the, being the typical sunshine girl that cheers up the grumpy character, vibe. It just doesn’t felt very deep with them, especially in a romantic way. But with Tifa you can see he has a soft spot for her. They’re very similar in many ways. They don’t open up immediately, when they feel troubled, but they’re always there for each other. Sharing not only similar traumas, but also saving each other, when they need it the most. Even clouds mom said in the remake he needs a girl that is mature and something else 😂 and that fits with Tifas character perfectly. She’s very compassionate and motherly and her energy just balanced clouds because of that and not because she has to be the opposite mood.
In the end everyone can enjoy their Favorit ship, but we can also accept just the fact that Tifa and Cloud where meant for each other! I need more scenes with them ❤😩
I'm in my mid 30s, I grew up playing FF7 and it's probably my favorite game of all time.
I don't understand why some people are so upset with the FACT Cloud and Tifa wind up together and have feelinngs for each other. It was officialy in 1997, it's official now.
I really don't care about ships to me let people have their head canon. But all the lore I've read it's pretty obvious where Clouds loyalties lye. Damn the whole story hinges on the fact that Cloud wanted to be a Soldier to impress Tifa everything he did was to gain Tifa's affection. And lets say they change it, despite all the books the scenes in the games that ultimately Cloud saves Aerith from dying and they live happily ever after, but what happens to Tifa and Zack do they end up together? two people who have no connection to each other at all. Or does Zack go back to being dead and Tifa starts dating Jhonny get real. I say again if you wanna make whatever fan fic you want go ahead I'm sure it will be a nice what if story. But I really feel like the creator's of these characters have made their choice.
They want to ship Tifa with Barret which makes little to no sense considering that there is a scene where Barret tells Cloud that someone tried to give Tifa a flower, and Cloud gets furious about it. I think Tifa, as a character, is strong enough that she doesn't necessarily need to be shipped with Cloud whereas Aerith's existence and value depends on a character like Cloud. Tifa is popular without the need of having a love interest. However, with that being said, it's clear that Cloud and Tifa are the better options.
@@anabelgonzalez8984 Aerith's value is in her death, both in terms of impact on the player and in terms of importance to the plot. That's her primary purpose and value in the story. Rebirth doesn't even bother to continue the illusion of any romance between Cloud and Aerith. Their relationship isn't explored and doesn't develop beyond what they had at the beginning of Rebirth. Instead the game uses every opportunity to build and develop Cloud and Tifa and more or less ignores Aerith until it's time for her big moment.
I genuinely do not understand how ANYONE can claim that Cloud and Tifa haven't been canon since the OG. Most people who try to push that narrative haven't even played the OG, or if they played it, they didn't progress past Disk 1. The Under the Highwind and Lifestream scenes were "you had to be there" moments, as I've been told by older players. We have SO much official material, we have quotes from Nojima-san and Nomura-san, we have 'On the Way to a Smile', 'Traces of Two Pasts', '2000 Gil to Become a Hero' written by Nojima-san, where it's shown VERY clearly that Cloud goes through his journey to become someone special to Tifa.
I don't think people understand how important Tifa ACTUALLY is to Cloud, aside from being his koibito. All calls to action in Clouds hero's journey are facilitated by Tifa Lockhart.
Haha, oh trust me, even with playing the original game, plenty of people tried to push the narrative that he was pining after Aerith in Advent Children and they espouse that narrative still even with evidence to the opposite. It's a cult of shipping.
@@tanagreeknose7376 Reading comprehension and media literacy are dead, I see. I never knew just how vindictive Clerith fans really were until they started harassing Nojima-san at the start of last week when the behind-the-scenes dev interview was uploaded on SE's RUclips channel and Nojima-san explained that 'No Promises to Keep' is decidedly NOT a love ballad to Cloud, but a song from Aerith for all the people she's ever cared about, including Elmyra, Ifalna, Zack, Cloud, even Tifa and Barret. They've been filling his mentions on Twitter saying things like, and I quote, "We know you got death threats from the CloTis, that's why you're backpedaling" or "Don't insult our intelligence, we know it's about Cloud" and generally being very awful to the WRITER of the story. This level of delusion and entitlement is insane to me. Nojima-san had to put out a tweet to say that people can listen to the song any way they want, but his intentions when writing the lyrics were very specific.
I've also seen them try to claim that hand-holding (which happened at max affinity with Aerith's date) is more romantic than kissing in Japanese culture. As a Greek woman who's been in a relationship with a Japanese man for the past five years, we both found that laughable. Imagine trying to appropriate a culture from a place of malice, just to prove a fictional ship that was debunked decades ago and to harrass the WRITER of the story itself.
@@decknamen4948 You're Greek? Me too. 🤣 But you probably gathered that already from my username.
Don't even get me started on the song drama. It's exhausting, really.
It just really has to do with people not accepting that their one-sided view is not the correct one and holding onto that because of emotional attachment. I mean, just because I got something entirely different out of someone's story doesn't necessarily make me ignorant, but I think the difference between that and shipping for instance is that my interpretation just happened to not be what the creator intended and the other one is just me believing in my delusions.
@@tanagreeknose7376 I will be honest, I was so engrossed in the great information you provided in your video that I just noticed the username! Fellow Greek 😄 The song drama has been going on for the week, and it's honestly both sad and exhausting. I feel for Nojima-san, he's never been shy about sharing his intentions behind his work, and I find it quite telling that he and Nomura-san call the FFVII characters 'their children'. They really do love this franchise and this story compilation. Interpretations of a story are totally valid, of course, and that's the beauty of storytelling in all its forms, but going as far as to claim that the artist/author is somehow wrong when they tell you what they wanted to convey? It baffles me.
As Nojima-san mentioned before the release of the game, things will become clearer this time and FFVII Rebirth has been decidedly clear about where Cloud's romantic affections lie. While he most certainly cares about Aerith and she's an important friend, his heart never strayed from Tifa Lockhart. I'm excited for Part 3, the Lifestream sequence where Tifa puts Cloud's fractured psyche back together is going to write FF history.
Remake and especially Rebirth have went in so hard for Cloud and Tifa that there's just not an argument to be made for Aerith anymore. It's actually a laughable position to take at this point.
Rebirth spoilers
Aerith has more moments in Rebirth with TIfa than she does Cloud and on top of that seems to be shipping Cloud and Tifa herself most of the time. Then we have these little moments for Zach and Aerith, like the scene where she literally can feel his hand touching hers through the lifestream. They aren't putting those little hints in for no reason. Part 3 will almost certainly be a Cloti feast with a side order of Zaerith and an empty plate for Clerith fans, much like Rebirth was only even more so.
I also like to not comment and stay away from social media but Nojima put the choices in the game for YOU to choose not for Cloud the character who has his own thoughts, because if you take away your choices he would pick tifa, hope im not spoiling and DONT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED THIS PART YET. but look at Tifa's GS date, and also yuffie GS date she askes if cloud likes tifa,then she says that tifa forgot about him while busy in midgar and it bothered Cloud. People are right, many have been saying that people say this and that from nojima and the ultimania that are not true at all. TOTP tells you everything about Tifa and clouds relationship and im more exited about part 3 because to me the most important scene in all of gaming is her repairing his mind and bringing him back together, also when you get a glimpse of the lifestream Tifa says to Cloud "Cloud I NEED YOU" which should put things to bed hopefully. This video made me feel much better and i REALLY appreciate that, honestly. I just love the facts and also dont take too long with your next video of this topic and ill be watching your streams to see your views on tifa and cloud because this game is setting up them two for part3
Yup, there is also the question of why the hell would you write a book about Tifa and Aerith, were like a third of Tifas part is about her feelings for Cloud, write her LS scenes in Rebirth and her trial in the temple that deals with her feelings for Cloud only for the story to have him want to be with the other woman who died.
Like, they go above and beyond to show how much Tifa loves Cloud, while all of Aeriths POV archs is about her role as a Cetra. Like, yes Aerith and Cloud grow a very strong bond very quickly and care very deeply about eachother, but they simply do not show any real signs of moving beyond the intial bond they made in Remake. You have 2 main quest dates with Aerith, one of which is her giving him shit for the fight he picked with Tifa the night before.
Sure Aerith "shoots her shot" at him every now and then, but she also spends plenty of time scolding him in both Remake and Rebirth whenever he messes up regarding how he treats Tifa. Aerith is low key one of the biggest Cloti shippers lol.
When I played the original ff7 which was like 2 decades ago I wasn’t sure who Cloud would end up with and when the remake came out I just played it since it’s my childhood game, I’m not a shipper or anything but story kinda pushes Cloud and Tifa to be together noticeably like this time around you don’t have options to give Tifa flower or not, Aerith saying “ Lovers used to give these when they were reunited “ and later Cloud just gives Tifa a flower amd moments like Cloud kinda gets jealous when Sam ( one of the trio ) says something about Tifa, Cloud becomes aggressively protective of Tifa and also Andre says something like “ have you found where you are looking for? “ Cloud answers “ yes I do thanks to you “, Andrea “ don’t ever let it go again “ and also even Barret resolution in CH.14 Cloud not happy about someone giving Tifa a flower and so on, there could be a lot more moments but players just have to pay attention
and before the Rescuing Aerith in the OG, the options of saying "I don't know" or "let's hope so" when Marlene asked "Do you think she likes you?" at Aerith's house, that dialogue was cut out as well.
@@NP-Channel i'm sorry but where i can see that info please?
@@xlamnidaex you can search for FF7 OG gameplay, it happened at Aerith's house just after the collapse of Sector 7 Plate.
Cleariths see Aerith giving Cloud such a flower to be romantic as well but the Japanese dub never says anything about lovers as all and I take the japanese intent to be more authentic to what the story expresses then the english dub. The Flowers simply symbolize a "Reunion" it works for tifa and cloud seeing each other again after so long, and from aeriths point of view of both knowing the future and seeing a part of her lost love, zack in cloud in a way.
Yup, in OG Tifa took a backseat until Clouds brain completly fried and only when we get to play as her for awhile before we find Cloud in Mideel, do we start to see her feelings for Cloud be expressed and once she finds him in mideel she more or less says the world can go to hell because she only cares about him.
That's were the cognitive disonance came from in my opinon because prior to her death, Aerith was more or less the secondary "main character" and only after did Tifa get to shine. Which is something they clearly aimed to correct in Remake and Rebirth by making Tifas role and importance to Cloud and Tifas feelings for him apparant from the get go.
Today is a good day to believe in canon. Time to accept that Cloti has always been canon.
Ohhhh yes. 🤪
REALLL I THINK I JUST DIED 😭😭😭
Some in the comments section still don't seem to get the whole story. I cannot believe it. It's so goddamn simple. But i digress, I hope the lifestream event shows you confused people that cloud has more reason why he's like that in ACC. It has 0% to do with shipping nor love interests. it's a problem he had ever since tifa had an accident and continued on with his town, mom, zack, and aerith. Literally everyone he couldn't save and everyone in that movie, starting with tifa's talk, helped him to forgive himself. That's something only he can do. It's weird but that's what Tifa's shilly shally dilly dally is for, and aerith just repeats it to him later on with marlene comforting him as well later. Heck Zack was also there for him! As for canon pair, you'll see in lifestream as well (seriously some don't play this game at all). Cloud's heart never moved, it only and always stayed with tifa. Just as Cody said on twitter, platonic is a thing people. Don't let a great story be wasted by a wrong perspective. Btw he also literally sleeps with tifa in HW, I don't think that's someone who loves someone else would do days after they just died because that would make him an asshole in OG and AC for both of them. There's literally jp VAs and Andrea's JP VA talking about that event wondering what they would do about it and devs back in 1997 saying they had to tone it down for being too risque. Fill in the dots, the right dots and you'll find yourself a cohesive story than some telenovela. If anyone of you can, please read TOTP, CoT before ACC, watch devs interview about the movie. He wants forgiveness, he says that himself, nothing else.
Just you wait and see how in about 4 year when Part 3 comes out some people gonna go crazy trying to convince everyone how in certain cultures intertwined fingers in Aerith's optional date are more indicative of a couple than any amount of kisses and sex in the main story. Not to mention the long-running crush, the fall from the bridge, the promise, the 2-meter-long sword to the abdomen, Tifa being the only person to absolutely refuse to leave Cloud in Mideel, living as a family and so on. Some people just can't be helped
The Cloud and Aerith fans are delusional after the Rebirth game because Tifa gets a kiss at the date scene at the Gold Saucer, but they said it was an optional scene. Despite it being an optional scene. Cloud only kisses one person. They make no sense. I don't know how much clearer it needs to be.
Not to mention that all the emotional/romantic tension between Cloud and Tifa In chapters 1, 4, 6, 8 and 9 is hardwired into Rebirth. You get those moments regardless of the decisions you make with character relationships, and even in optional moments, It is Cloud who is initiating those moments with Tifa. The writers are already taking steps to solidify their feelings as romantic for the contextually challenged players and that is a good thing.
@@joshz2491Since you named all the chapters can you name them on the top of your head? Just curious since I was thinking the same that allot of these arent optional even if it looks that way. Just didnt have the time to replay the game so
Even if Tifa would give him a blowjob, in two of these three games plus all the expanded media he shows much more respect and emotional attachment to Aerith. If you want to make the kiss meaningfull than I kissed 90% girls I liked and never though about them.
Rebirth clearly emphasises he sexually likes Tifa more but that's not what even you talk about.
I always loved Cloud and Tifa’s relationship over the alternative since it grew up and evolved along with them. It starts off fairly childish where each in a way idealizes the other and ends in a healthier place based on mutual respect, understanding, support, and love. Compared to that Aerith always just felt like she showed up, you know? She’s important no doubt but personally I find it dubious that she’d take the place in Cloud’s heart that Tifa has resided in since childhood.
It's definitely more akin to the way relationships work in real life as well. According to Nojima's novel "Traces of Two Pasts", Cloud and Tifa played together all of the time as young children, and then of course the mountain incident happened after Tifa's mother died. It'll be fun to get into Cloud's head in the new upcoming novella that will be featured in the FFVII Rebirth World Preview book, and find out how exactly he fell in love with Tifa.
@@tanagreeknose7376 wait in the OG game Cloud and Tifa were not close as kids even in rebirth in the demo
@@darksoultrey167 Read Traces of Two Pasts. It gives context to the confusion.
@@tanagreeknose7376 are you sure because in one source it says they were close and in two other sources it says they were not sounds like a contradiction, I hear in the book it says that they invited Cloud and Cloud always refused, but in the OG game he says he wanted to play with everyone and he wanted to get accepted in the group and he wanted to be noticed
@@darksoultrey167 Read the book.
Just saw the title, and I already love the video! Cloud & Tifa will be sealed in Part3 for sure or maybe in Rebirth too!
I think Rebirth is gonna seal the deal early this time, but in part 3 there will be no question.
@@tanagreeknose7376 Turns out they went further and harder on Cloud and Tifa in Rebirth than I ever imagined they would that early in the story. Cloud sealed the deal with both a kiss, and perhaps even more surprising, WORDS, he actually used words. They might not be the only way to tell someone how you feel, but they are nice too.
On a way to a smile its pretty clear that Tifa and Cloud are in a relationship and both are suffering from survivors guilt after the events of FF7.
This is such a key point that is so often ignored.
When Tifa says, Do you love me? Do you love Marlene? It always breaks my heart. Cloud is such in a deep depression that when she sees that he feels better when Denzel shows up, it truly made my eyes tear up. That is why the ending of advent children means so much to me.
@@Mormegil452 me and you both 😭
Cloud and Tifa are 100% canon. They literally have sex at the end of ff7, with everyone watching from the airship. Tifa searches for cloud in Kingdom hearts. Cloud literally attacks the main bad guy of Dissidia to protect Tifa. Cloud and Tifa have matching rings on their fingers in advent children. One of the main producers on FF7 said Sephiroth represented the darkness in Clouds heart, and Tifa represented the light in Clouds heart. Tifa literally has heart in her last name, and her last weapon is called "Premium Heart". Come on
Just because they had sex, dosent mean Cloud feels the same way for Tifa as he does Aerith. People in real life have sex without having a romantic feeling.
@@Matagu1 Except Cloud and Tifa having sex is them communicating their feelings, not in spite of. Why would Cloud of all people have sex with a woman unless he loves her?
I've always been of the, what felt like obvious, assumption that You'd and Tifa liked each other. After playing remake, it's even more obvious. After reading traces of two pasts, Tifa's section of the book describes her feelings for Cloud.
@@Matagu1 bro just… get off this vid and cope harder
@@Matagu1 that...that is absolutely wild that you acknowledge they smash but still deny he's in love with her. Fam, you are hopeless beyond redemption. But if you want to go there you do realize this is made by the Japanese right? When it comes to sex they're culture is drastically different from the west. In Japanese media you'll rarely see them make anyone consensually bang if they weren't in love with each other, and FF7 is definitely not on of those rare exceptions. Sex is the ultimate, indisputable, undeniable proof of it. There is no argument to be made after that. and even ignoring all that, just look that who Cloud is. He's definitely not the type of that would smash just for the hell of it, he won't let just anyone that close to him
There is also Tifa's story in On The Way To A Smile where right after the end of FF7, Cloud smiles because he can start a life with Tifa. That absolutely destroys the opinion in the fandom that Cloud was yearning/searching for Aerith after the end of FF7 along with the other info you have showed. It's really not that hard.
If you payed attention, Cloud only moves slowly on at the end of Advent Children because Aerith was his true love. The end credits shows Cloud riding his bike, searching for flower places he can meet Aerith. The Lyrics and the scenes showing speaks volume. Hollow is a song from Cloud to Aerith. The new theme song where Aerith is singing, is her words for Cloud.
Tifa being shallow at the beginning, only paying attention to Cloud because he said he wants to be a Soldier and Toifa grown up being center of attention, with nobody looking at her, of cours she wants to be rescued by Cloud, the only boy left in the Village her age, who wants be soldier. She wants to be praised and stuff. Only after Aerith came along Tifa realised she has a rival and her feelings for Cloud became honest. She knows Cloud is more open, relaxed and protective around Aerith, which she wants to win him.
At the end, we all know, Aerith died. Tifa cant be happy because despite the fact they where love Rivals, even though Clerith where lovers, they where like best friends. Seeing Cloud crying and screaming like a Baby while holding Aeriths death body is something she never saw of him. Not with him mourning his mother, not with Jessie dying, not awkward holding Tifa while she crying after Sector 7 plate while thinking at Aerith(he was looking at the flowers) and hurting Tifa cause his muscle got tense. Losing a best friend is very hurtful.
Seeing the one you love, holding his dead lover and screaming crying is more hurtful.
Both of them had sex on disc 3, only because they thought they where alone and like "We will die anyways so lets have our moment of comfort". Sure Tifa thought she won, but Cloud never stopped grieving for Aerith and they never became a couple even after Advent Children(he lives in the Church to be near Aerith). Tifa in Advent Children shows annoyance because its not just Cloud never taking Tifas calls(which prooves he dosent care for her romanticly), he never stops saying its his fault for Aeriths death and also she is annoyed cause she is there for Cloud but he just dosent want to see it. His feelings for her is not like he had with Aerith.
At the end he lifes with Tifa, Denzel, Barret and Marlene, becoming a chosen family. He started his healing process.
I think their relationship after Dirce of Cerberus can be a good one like Clerith and not a toxic one based on loss which is never a good sign for a long term relationship.
Just saying from a neutral FF7 fan. Clerith has more symbolism and is more popular in japan. The Theme Song Trailer didnt just got released before official Clerith day for a reason. You cant get Groom Cloud single but with Bride Aerith for a reason. Sephiroth is the villain, Cloud is the hero and Aerith is the Heroine, while Tifa and the others are supportive characters for a reason. At the very beginning there was Barret, Cloud and Aerith for a reason before Aeroth got split into two characters.
@@Matagu1 In the grand scheme of things, the in game timeline of ff7 is about 2 or 3 weeks. And once Cloud meets Aerith all the way up to when she dies is less than that so you mean to tell me that Aerith was so impactful to Cloud life that he forgot about the girl he literally joined Shinra for, a girl he's known for all of 2 days. Not to mention when we first meet Cloud he thinks he's Zack so his view of things is skewed. And did Cloud cry over Aerith's dead body because he loved her or was it because it was a friend who was just killed Infront of him so if Tifa was the one who was killed his reaction would have been different I don't think so. I think Cloud values all of his friends and would brake down hard if any of his friends was killed and he couldn't stop it. And how do you know that Cloud was thinking of Aerith when him and Tifa hooked up there was no dialogue or scene that even hinted at such a thing. And you're minimizing the role Tifa had in Clouds life and the love she has for him, for 1 Cloud only joined Shinra cause he thought it would impress Tifa he said so himself so FF7 wouldn't exist if Cloud never joined Shinra. 2 if Tifa is just a supporting character than anybody could have gone into the life stream with Cloud and helped him gather his Psyche back to normal but it wasn't it was Tifa it couldn't have been anyone else but her, Aerith didn't do it and she's connected to the life stream. And my last thing that I don't get with these Clerith shippers is let's say it happens, Cloud and crew are able to save Aerith from death and they both live happily ever after blah blah blah. What happens to Zack? You know that black haired guy who walks into the light with Aerith at the end of Advent Children, the guy who bought the bow she wears in her hair everyday for, the guy who gave her the idea to even sell flowers that guy. Cause with remake Zack is a playable candidate now and he is searching for Aerith. So what is the point of Zack coming back if not to reunite with the girl he actually likes. And what about Tifa does she say screw it and be with Jhonny. It is very obvious to me that Cloud loves all of his friends but he is in love with Tifa.
@@Matagu1 Holy copium. Just say your a aeirth shipper goddamn it.
@@novusparadium9430 i am more a Cloud x Vincent Fujoshi and since remake a Barret x Cloud shipper cause Baret is hot and soft!
Just because i have open eyes and pay attention, dosent mske me a Clerith shipper.
@@Matagu1your comment really screams you hate Tifa, the content is more focus on what is the POV of the creators. It doesn’t say anything bad about Aerith, yet you say words about Tifa being shallow and all. Tifa is a strong willed written character same with Aerith. Yet you slander Tifa’s character just because you’re CLEARLY A CLEARITH shipper.
Hell yeah they are meant for each other
What catches me off guard is when people state that cloud sees tifa as a friend… well um that’s now officially false…😭😂 HAVE YOU SEEN ANY OF THE LEAKS…. IM OFFICIALLY (GONE)GAGA
Thank you!! 👏 All of sudden when rebirth launches and Cloud kisses Tifa, extreme Cleriths dismiss the narrative and try to build up their own narrative on how he should be with Aerith. They ignore what’s shown in Cloud’s point of view. They can’t control how he feels😂
I think that cognitive dissonance is strong when one personally believes something is one way for over 20 years. The only thing to do at this point is to just enjoy the narrative for what it is.
@@tanagreeknose7376 yep no use arguing they’re free to ship who they like
My standard response to them after Rebirth is laughter. As long as they continue trying to push their fan fiction version of the story, that's all they deserve.
sure yeah Cloud and Tifa are Denzels new parents, but I hope people acknowledge that Marline is still Barret's daughter so he is in the family too
Denzel is Clouds and Aeriths spiritual son. His father was blonde, mother brunette. ^^
@@Matagu1 Yeah that's true
@@Matagu1I don’t know about that Cloud says that Aerith guided Denzel to him and Tifa so as much as they rescued Denzel; Aerith saved Cloud,Tifa and Denzel and brought their family together.
What is even more irksome than the extreme cleriths who still deny cloti is canon are the "Enlightened Centrists" who claim to be above all the shipping label those who actually know the lore and go by what the story blatantly presents as biased Cloti shippers.
Or worse, that "both are canon". It's equally hilarious when their explanations prove they dont know the lore besides the remake trilogy.
Hell, at least the Cleriths have the excuse of being delusional and in denial about what they know full well is canon, which is why they're wishing so hard to change it.
I'm quite curious to hear your opinions on certain interactions between these three throughout Rebirth. Since I deepened Cloud's relationship with Tifa (because, you know, that's what Cloud would do) I ended up watching alternate scenes where Aerith would be there instead. And, uh, to say that there is a difference in how Cloud interacts between the two would be an understatement. I honestly don't understand how people think Cloud romantically loves Aerith.
Love all the information from the ultimanias. Very informative. Thanks for taking the time to put it all together.
Might I add there’s a reason why Aerith approached Cloud in the beginning. It’s the Buster sword. It’s Zack’s. That’s why she had Cloud around to investigate.
The voice actor knows the character probably the best next to the writers and the director. So saying that the voice actors' words aren't true is a stretch. They know the character inside and out just like an on camera actor would that way they could embody the character as best as they could. I know that Cody said in an interview that he researched the HELL out of Cloud after he got the role that way that he could be as true to the character as he could and I think that work PAID OFF. And outside of the Devs, I trust his word over any other people in the gaming world.
If you actually listened to the interview, the guy is clueless about the plot. He doesn't even know who Zack is. And Sephiroths VA explained how VAs just move on from role to role and don't really think too much about the story
The same people think they know the meaning of Aerith's song better than the writer too so....
Tifa's line in the ending is also a reference to her mother. The one she almost died just to meet again (she didn't know then). Everyone they've lost, the two of them acknowledges that they will meet them all again later. Tbh this title probably has the most death count in FF titles lol. So many massacres and shit like that, can you blame cloud for being afraid of not protecting the happiness he has within those 2 years with his family? Then suddenly he can't even protect himself nor denzel because he's about to die and he's afraid to die and hurt anybody else.
FF6 had the most death in all Final Fantasy. Just saying, destruction of earth.
Very well presented with absolutely loads of evidence, great job! At this point, people who still deny that CT is endgame despite all of the evidence will likely never change their minds. Not until Rebirth/part 3 lays it out clearly. Even then some won't. 20+ years is a long time to believe in something so unwaveringly.
Thank you so much! I agree! At this point, we can only sit back and enjoy the story for what it is.
For the Aerith fans who hold on to relationship affinitie. It's been clearly mentioned in an interview with the creators and the actual help section that relationship affinity represents how characters feel about Cloud. It has nothing to do with how Cloud feels about any of them. The thought of Cloud taking up with his BFFs G.F, after he died to save Cloud is just so bad taste it's disturbing
This court finds you guilty of sound reason and convincing evidence. XD
In all seriousness, thanks for taking a calmer and less-attacky approach to this. As I've integrated myself back into the FF7 community, I'm seeing just how toxic the shipping side of it can really get, and its kept me from reaching out more and participating outside of certain circles. Aerith was the one who got away for a lot of gamers. Tifa is the one who so many pined for. Cloud was projected on by so many as well. It's a unique cocktail, to say the least.
Aerith in ff7 already move on she is with zach but fans of her didn't accept the true cloud feeling towards her, but it doesn't matter coz in the end of this story tifa and cloud living together as a family,❤
7 years after they meet at sector 7 and now living together in 7TH HEAVEN
#FF7 C❤T
Thank you for this, I’ve been saying the same things. How could she get over Zach so quickly it doesn’t make sense.
I also think that Cloud is like a "medium" for Zack and Aerith. He actually connectes them spiritually without him realizing it. Also, Cloud and Tifa, and Zack and Aerith are the ultimate balance. The story will be off if Aerith somehow ended up with Cloud. They probably expecting Zack to be like "Oh well, that's fine. I died anyway.." Pfft.
"Memory" as a mechanism is extremely important to FF7.
The Lifestream and Materia are made up of memories.
There is a reason why Sephiroth appears to Cloud the way he does, and its because Cloud remembering him keeps him "alive".
6:20 If Cloud and Tifa are meant to be a couple in Advent Children, fine. But, I don't know if it was the English translation or the Japanese movie makers just weren't good at emphasizing them as a couple, it felt like Geostigma was being used as a plot excuse to keep Tifa and Cloud apart. That's the main reason why I don't care for Advent Children.
Litteraly died watching the jap motion actor. Go doggy brained on Tifa!! 😂😂
I think the disconnect with some fans understanding of FF7OG lies in what age or maturity level they had for their first play through. Back in the late 90s when I was 26, I marveled at how a game could put me into 2 years of mourning and make me go through all the stages of grief. I spent 2 years trying to find ANY way to bring Aerith back, but I had to eventually accept it. The purpose of the game was to enrich players by teaching them one of life's hardest lessons in the safe confines of a video game. To let go and move on with living our life (also the take away from FF7AC). That's what made the game a masterpiece. Aerith's death is the point of the story. Seeing so many players who are unable to let go and move on, even after a quarter century is proof that so many played the game wrong. I'm so grateful that I got to experience the game in real time the way it was supposed to be experienced. If not for that, then I may have wasted 25 years of my life arguing about trivial details while ignoring the giant neon letters that spelled it out.
This is a great way of looking at it. While FF7 has many themes, "life" is one of them, and how it can be so transient. To be so attached to what is now a dead character (who's purpose was so much greater than a 'love triangle'), is definitely missing a huge point!
@@tanagreeknose7376 I’ll give you credit, it must be tedious dealing with some of these people. Folks going on about characters furniture choices, high fives and all kinds of crazy stuff. Tearing apart the meaning of a song while completely ignoring the morale of the story? Maybe it's about him and Aerith or maybe it's about him and a few characters? What's most important is that we know it's about Cloud because he is hollow until his reconstruction in the Lifestream. That's all the thought I'll give it because my attention is on the story. He’s supposed to be a vegetable like Jessie’s Dad but he’s animated by Jenova cells that are feeding off Tifa’s memories, He believes he’s a Solder 1st class because that’s what Tifa believes he went on to become. He acts the cold prick like Sephiroth and a bit of a hot dog like Zack. The only two Soldier 1st class that Tifa has met. He possesses Soldier skills and talents because the J cells have intimate knowledge of the best Soldier 1st class (Sephiroth). I’ve always believed that he did lighten up a little bit after those J cells had more regular contact with Aerith (more Zack memories influence).
The fact of the matter is that Cloud could fall to knees and pledge his undying love to either of these girls or bang everything in sight like my Grey Warden from Dragon Age Origins and it wouldn’t mean anything until he’s reconstructed. Aerith hasn’t met the real Cloud (until she's dead) and she says as much on their date. Which I believe is the canon resolution as much as I believe the lovemaking under the Highwind is canon. In FF7OG the affection points are also generated by time spent in party(besides choices), which has always given Tifa a long-term advantage since she's the second fastest and second heaviest hitter. I think most players would have to go out of their way not to get the love making result. Much like the date scene earlier which I believe is supposed to be Aerith (she starts with a numerical advantage) which you'd have to go out of your way not to get as a date. My very first playthrough before I was aware of any such affection mechanics, Cloud went on the date with Aerith and made love to Tifa under the Highwind. I'm sure most players who went first playthrough with no such knowledge also had the same result. In my Rebirth playthrough I will going for the date with Aerith (for the sake of exposition). Although I doubt I will have to try very hard and just play the game as I normally would.
As someone mentioned earlier, I also hope SE nuts up and gives this thing some definite final word. I believe they will since it seems like a lot of trouble to make Zack a bigger character this time around just to have him spin his wheels in the mud. What really bugs me about this never ending droning is that it takes away from actual theory discussion with other fans in chats. In the almost 3 decades of talking about this game in chats, I have only participated in one thread that discussed who Cloud’s Father might be (I theorize he’s another Shinra bastard). Or how about the fact that Hojo always calls Cloud a failure even though he rivals Sephiroth? Another youtuber named Ray Coffman had an awesome theory on that. This triangle crap has stifled some great exchange of ideas.
The truth is that most hardcore fans of Tifa don’t really care who she ends up with. They’re still going to online search girls who cosplay her and look for pics of her on deviantart. Most of these other players that are allegedly called CT's are simply players who take the story at face value. Am I supposed to be a "Frilma" because I take the Flintstone's at face value? To me a shipper is someone who wants to see Fred with Betty or Wilma with Mr. Slate. There's sites for you guys online, just keep it in a brown paper bag please. The toxicity comes from ONLY one group of fans and I'm not talking abut ZA's. The amount of times I’ve had to read “um nooooo” and “well actually” in chat threads attacking someone else’s comments for half of my life has been staggering.
@@darthlocklan6388Great comment! I will say that it's been wild seeing some of the replies but it wasn't a consequence that I didn't anticipate, having played FF7 a little before Advent Children was announced. After all, if you believe something for over 20 years (even though it's factually incorrect), cognitive dissonance will not allow you to let go!
I definitely agree that anyone taking the story at face value shouldn't be labeled as anything but alas here we are, even with the writer and Square Enix liking certain posts on Twitter that talk about.. Cloud and Tifa as a couple. I'm actually working on a Sephiroth video next since FF7 is so multi-faceted and much more than the "LTD" but hopefully the shipping stuff dies down after this second part (we can hope)!
Remember when you parachute into Midgar late in the game?
The original plan was to have every character you don't have in your party die off.
Glad they didn't go that way with it.
@@Malohta Yeah, fans wouldn't have known who the two others who officially lived were until AC. Every time I watch the X-Force jump in Deadpool 2 I think about that FF7 "what coulda been".
It's always been simple and clear. Some people have lost their minds, or they're just playing dumb.
Thank you so much for this beautifully articulate and sourced video. I’ve always believed that cloud and Tifa were the canon couple and that Aerith provides more than just a piece of a love triangle. I feel like people don’t pay attention to the friendship aspect of Aerith and Tifa because they’re so distracted by the love triangle, but we see in rebirth and remake how much they need each other‘s female companionship. Aerith was a very lonely child and it didn’t seem like Tifa had many female friends in her youth. We see in Costa del Sol how she is often looked at by other women with jealousy and has therefore been set apart by anyone of her age group.
I typically keep quiet about my thoughts on this, but I’ve recently been getting Cloud x Aerith tiktoks on my For You feed and in those comments I’ve found Clerith shippers to be hella scary and argumentative no matter what points you bring up lol
Aerith is my QUEEN but I’ve always loved Cloud and Tifa together. Story wise, outside of just ONE game (which a lot of the opposing shippers ignore/try to rationalize) & your points, it just makes more sense to me. It could be bias (because Zack is my fave too) BUT I was so happy Aerith & Zack could be together in the end in AC.
It's crazy because the Cloud and Tifa quotes are very consistent. A lot of people try to use Benny Matsuyama's story or other games in which there are cameo appearances to argue a point.. but I think the key thing here is to see what Square most consistently portrays and what Nojima consistently writes. The writing is getting more refined as times goes on, with less wiggle room for interpretation, and I think the characters benefit the most from it too.
@@tanagreeknose7376 agreed! I also see the Voice actor argument brought up on TikTok as well, and I’ve concluded and rational and valid points are just aimed at a wall that is Clerith lol. As you’ve surmised, when you get a job, they tell you about what it entails, what they want you to do. Same goes for the cast so Cody, Steve, etc,’s “ship opinions” do not come from thin air.
So to your point, I do like that the writing is getting more refined (& I’m glad they remastered Crisis Core too) so hopefully where the characters stand regardless of player preference/choice is more clear.
The end of AC is as clear as day but they still twist it up like I lose brain cells when I read the points they try and make 😭💀
I cannot fathom why they get to SCARY about it!! lol Like I've seen arguments saying how Aerith accepted Cloud for who he is and saying "Did you even PLAY the game?!" MAINLY referring to REMAKE whenever someone brings up a good point and I'm like.... Did you EXPERIENCE the whole FRANCHISE?? @@lockh4rt__3
@@jazzy_okami indeed 🥲🥲, I even got downvoted several times on Reddit for bringing it up and im just like LMFAO
i mean i been in this fandom since 1998 and.. u right. "clert"h people has always been delusional even way back then. and they lash out so much because deep down even they know thier ship is more fan fiction than cannon. lol. It got worse when crisis core got released becase the devs all but confirmed Zack is Aeriths actual soul mate.
Clerith is definitely a red herring. At first glance it might seem like the setup for a "perfect" romance between a flower girl and her bodyguard, but FF7 is s lot more subversive than that. After Aerith's death things really start to unravel, the problem is that a lot of people lose the plot after that 😅 And yes, Crisis Core definitely drove the point home that Zack wasn't just some meaningless ex-boyfriend of Aerith's.
I was way more active in the early early 2000's but hoo boy yea Clerith's were always quite something. Someday I'll find some other FF7 folks who remember the Aerith shrine (and its owner) who used the carp as the ultimate proof of their love. 🤣 That girl would fight to the death for proving C/A...
@@ultroswuzhere Oh yes, Destiny Fulfilled. The one I shared in the video 🤣😆
@@tanagreeknose7376 OMG did you?? Idk how I missed that! I need to re-watch! That's hilarious though. 🤣🤣 I had many an experience with that girl since I used to run a big Cloud/Tifa site back then.
I mean, (in regards to the promised land) its also pretty evident that Cloud didn't want to 'die' to meet Aerith again when her hand becomes Tifa's hand. Whether or not you interpret that as Aerith leading Cloud to Tifa or Cloud choosing Tifa, it's the same end result--there's a lot going on in that ending sequence. Neither of which results in 'Cloud wants to die to be with Aerith'. That's a complete injustice to the scene.
That too. All roads inevitably lead to Tifa.
Infact Cloud never wanted to die, he literally was about to die because of Geostigma and was destroyed because he couldn't stand letting them see him in that state and he couldn't bear the possibility of dying in front of them, so that's why he left.
Cloud always wanted to live, but he had Geostigma, Denzel had it too so he had to find a cure for him, he also had survivor's guilt not just for Aerith, but for Zack too.
The ultimania also says that Cloud's promised land is Tifa and the kids (his family and his life) and that Cloud is ready to go back to live with them because he has finally forgiven himself.
Nothing romantic about a dude who's depressed, dealing with grief, an illness and self blame, but these weirdos are nasty and toxic like that.
I will never understand these FF7 shipping wars because, well..... Aerith is dead, so that means Tifa won. Cloud's future is with her, not Aerith.
The end. Problem solved. Discussion over. Seriously, why keep arguing about this?
Wow, honestly this is incredibly well said and backed up with straight facts. I was never into the shipping thing either, but from what I gathered, It's Cloti and Zaerith that are the canon ships. Right?
You are correct. It's not up for debate at this point.
I’ve always thought Cloud & Tifa was ment to be. When I found out Zack & Aerith were in love before he died I already knew she gravitated to Cloud because Cloud reminded her of Zack. Besides in my mind Cloud & Tifa hooked up before you go to the Northern Crater
Zack and Aerith are so cute but you also have to put into consideration that crisis core came out a decade after the original ff7. I felt like they copy the story of how Cloud met Aerith and then made it seem like this is how they met now and how she got her bow. I wish there was an original to it because it made it too cheesy for me. I would be happy if he didn't die and came back to her tho. 😭
Zack and Aerith are so cute but you also have to put into consideration that crisis core came out a decade after the original ff7. I felt like they copy the story of how Cloud met Aerith and then made it seem like this is how they met now and how she got her bow. I wish there was an original to it because it made it too cheesy for me. I would be happy if he didn't die and came back to her tho. 😭
Just because Cloud reminds her on Zack, dosent mean she has no right to have honest romantic feeling for Cloud, after 5 years of thinking that a Playboy found another girl and ghosting her, not answering Aeriths letters. You cant blame Aerith for that. Besides, i find Tifas behavior more toxic. Only showing interest ion Cloud because he said he wants to be soldier, wanting attention from a hero. Its no different from real life woman who suddenly has interest in a men who suddenly got rich or popular.
@@Matagu1please not the playboy bs 💀💀💀 if you check out the intro of rebirth and say the same shit I have no hope for you people
@@lockh4rt__3 Playboy is OG
LMAO Bless you for compiling everything together! It's been a while since I braved FF7 related RUclips side and omg there's been a huge new wave of misinformation, like there are accounts that just spread lies about how "Nojima and Nomura said this and that" and I'm like "...dude, what is you talking about?? I've been in this fandom for decades and know every nook and cranny of this nasty debate and no one has ever said that shit!" lol, and those posts have a number of Likes, so you can tell it's like a mob going around, probably thinking that if they can misinform and gaslight more newbies, then Clerith may become as popular as Cloti and the devs will change canon 😂
But anyway, you laid down all the actual facts and it's always been clear for those who cared that it's Cloud and Tifa.
Another thing I'll add for the points about taking things out of context: one doesn't even need exact translation or book quotes to realize it's ooc, all one has to do is finish the scene after the misleading excerpt (like actually LISTENINING TO what TIFA says after "I'll meet her there" and realizing this is a group meeting of the loved ones and not a romantic rendezvous between Cloud and Aerith lol), or just watching AC TO THE END and realizing that Cloud only stayed temporarily in that church and returned home afterwards, that he only wanted forgiveness from Aerith and Zack and wasn't pining romantically. Everything is spelled out right in front of us, but those that are biased refused to see or listen. Which is, ok whatever, but at least don't pretend you're right or knowledgeable lol
You've noticed it too. In the age of misinformation, I had to bring the real quotes back 😂
@@tanagreeknose7376 Hahaha it was hard not to notice! I was looking around, seeing these new bot-like accounts talking about how Nojima and Nomura confirmed that Aerith and Cloud are in love, or that Aerith is the love of his love and so on and I was like 'what the HELL are these guys talking about?? This NEVER happened, where did these lying bots even come from??" 🤣
Awesome job! Your effort in creating this content really shines through, and it fills a much-needed gap. Thank you for sharing!
I really appreciate your comment!
The third part of Remake needs to be rated MA for the scene where we finally get to see CloTi bang under the Highwind 😁
If they're really worried about mature ratings, they could just replace the whole sex scene with a Wedding on the Highwind with Captain Cid performing the ceremony. Maybe they could even find Zangan to fill in the Father of Bride duties and have Cloud give Tifa that ring she was wearing in AC? After a wedding they don't got to show anything, a honeymoon romp is a given. Besides, after that Italian Senate incident how much more do I really need to see?
@@darthlocklan6388 A wedding would be even better!
Hell yeah
Seriously tho if there won’t at least be a kiss I’m gonna riot.
@@lockh4rt__3 No, not just a kiss. We want tongue or it's viva la revolución 😆
Very well said. Cloud and Tifa are perfect couple❤❤❤
Cloud sleeps with Tifa in ff7… how is it not clear they are together
Square Enix up until these days never made them official. People can have sex without having feelings of Love. How do you think Hookers work? It is so clear, i dont know why Cloti fans ignore many facts.
Cloud and Tifa slept with each other and still they are not a real couple. Cloud needs therapy and moving on from Aerith before he can think of Tifa.
@@Matagu1 And so you are equating Tifa to a hooker? That's pretty disrespectful to the narrative. And if you actually watched this video and came out thinking that Cloud was depressed over his love for Aerith in Advent Children.. then I really don't know what to tell you.
@@Matagu1 Honestly, your comment says more about you and your values than about anything else
Great video! love the insights 😊
Fr. Clerith shippers is the most cancerous people i ever encountered like, Crisis Core is my intro to ff7 and when i joined a group of ff7 fandom i got burned when i said i like Zack, they hated Zack so much just because they feel threatened for their ship
I agree, and they make up so many stupid narratives just to try to prove Aerith is the ship. If Cloud were to sneeze, they would say he blew her a kiss. Cloud and Tifa are the ship.
The reality regardless of anyone's ship, the devs made it clear already that its all going to lead back to Advent Children. So the likely scenario will be the original canon in which Cloud and Tifa do ending living together. Their situation is not outwardly confirmed, though it should be assumed that there is some romantic conclusion there. Advent Children ultimately confirms Aerith is content, reunited with Zack in the Lifestream.
I think we can all acknowledge that Cloud loved Aerith, or at least was taken aback by her ability to break through his walls. But in the final scene of Advent Children, Cloud says "I'm not alone, not anymore..." which ultimately means Cloud realizes he has something to live for. he has something special to fight for. We can say thats Tifa, or the kids, or his friends. But by the end of Advent Children, Cloud has let go of Aerith and fully accepted his future with Tifa and whatever comes next.
If the devs plan to lead it all to Advent Children, then we have to assume the finale will be the same. Especially since much of Cloud's turmoil in Advent Children is the loss of Aerith and his feeling that he lets people down. He's afraid to let Tifa and his friends down so he tries to find ways around issues, rather than facing them head on. Its ultimately his conversation with Tifa that shakes him out of his self-doubt and allows him to finally start fighting for the people he cares about.
To reiterate, Cloud lets go of Aerith and his regret, and embraces a life with Tifa. Some might take that as their romance confirmed, others just see it as the inevitable outcome. But its canon, regardless of anyone's opinion...
Unless the devs change everything in Rebirth, which remains to be seen 🤔
I think that "outwardly confirmed" for a lot of people means sealing it with a kiss or something physical, which is of course implied but never shown. Now that Clive and Jill exist though.. part 3 sure is gonna bring the heat.
Cloud lets go of both the guilt of Zack and Aerith's deaths, people forget that they both affected him deeply. The devs really rectified this with Advent Children Complete by adding Zack's scenes in there.
Yo. Play the game again and watch the movie again (ACC NOT AC), perhaps watch ACC's interview with the devs. Look closely, as in look at how cloud relates and interacts with EVERYONE. Look at how he slowly defrosts ever since marle tells him to be more nice, and he does. He's soft on tifa, he's super kind with wedge and even offers to take him home. And so on, he's a good person. I won't go over Jenova's laugh in OG or how different SC is to Real Cloud that's on you. You're missing and wrong with a lot of points ngl. That's all I'm going to say. I can't believe this interpretation is still alive smfh. It's been so many years already.... This video even provides good sources. Sigh..
Cloud was suffering from guilt and anxiety in ACC, it was not some "romantic heart break" as some people tend to interpretate. The devs made it abundantly clear in interviews. He wasn't holding onto Aerith, he was holding onto his guilt. But at the end, he forgave himself for not being able to save his friends, got atonement and that ended his self imposed exile, thereby "not alone anymore". Nojima even said, Tifa and the kids are his promised land.
Thank you for this video! Love the information you put forward from reputable sources. I'm so, so excited to see how they're going to bring my favorite couple together in Rebirth and in the 3rd game. The lifestream sequence is one of my most-anticipated. ❤️🔥 Also, the faces you were making at the camera had me cackling...😆 I'm not ready, and I DEFINITELY don't think other people are.
My face defienitely doesn't hide my emotions ahahaha! And thank you for supporting and commenting!
@@tanagreeknose7376 I feel you, your feelings definitely echoed my own haha. And of course!!! Been loving your videos on this topic and will continue to do so. ☺
The fact that there is a camp of people who vehemently believe that Aerith and Cloud are meant for each other or that Aerith is undoubtedly alive speaks to the brilliance of the meta narrative that was constructed for the Remake. Consider what the big twists and shocks of the original game were and how the current Remake needs to recapture that shock. These people are being Jenova'd HARD. They are being set up to be cut down, just like we were back in 97'
I agree. Since there are three parts, they are looking for ways to mislead even the people that know the game up and down. Add in a little wishful thinking with that and years of waiting, and you've got a recipe for a shipping disaster.
Thank you for this! As a new fan to FF7R I’ve learned a lot! I hope you make a longer version in the future. ❤
So glad this video reached you and that it was understandable! This probably won't be my last video on the topic. 😅😆
@@tanagreeknose7376I look forward to watching them!
Amazing job! We really need to hear it more and more
Awesome video, concisely explained and backed up with facts and evidence. Anyone who doesn't understand, doesn't want to.
Really glad you enjoyed it! I feel like the "love triangle debate" is like a metaphor for life where no matter how much you would like someone to believe the facts presented to them.. they will still choose to believe in something based on their emotions.
Amazing video❤❤
Someone had to say it! 😊 Well done :)
I'm not really a fan of the series anymore but i shipped Cloud x Tifa because it just seemed better for everyone. And Zack x Aerith. No one gets left behind.
This video is amazing and well thought out and once again I agree with everything you said 🙌🏻 I can’t wait to see your playthrough of rebirth!🤩 The 29th of Feb needs to get here quicker 😆
I can't wait for the date scene with Tifa. 😍
Once again, we have the incel Clerith shippers attacking everyone, including the voice actors for having their own opinion. They’re always super toxic and try to hate on Tifa at every chance they get. Like it’s perfectly fine if someone wants to ship Cloud and Aerith together, but these people tend to try and deny what’s canon as if they’ve never even played the games. Tifa has always been the main girl for Cloud. Both of Cloud’s VA (Cody Christian, Steve Burton), and his Japanese VA who know the character better than anyone else have stated Cloud and Tifa have the better chemistry.
This comment needs to be pinned
Perfect analysis!!!!!!
Thank you!
FF7 is a game with plot twist after plot twist.
Shinra isn't the main villain lf the game. Cloud isn't a SOLDIER, Cloud and Tifa weren't close as children (Remake retconned them to having been close at some point prior to Tifas moms died, though so maybe when they were 4-5?).
Something that recently dawned on me is the plot twist that Aerith isn't the main love interest.... went over my head? There never was a "both". He wasn't himself during the time he knew Aerith, sure she became close to him in that short time but yeah, she wasn't Tifa.
When Tifa restores his memories in LS, we see that he was in love with her as a child and attempted to join SOLDIER just to get her attention, he killed Sephiroth in rage for murdering his mother, burning his village and almost killing Tifa.
The final plot twist. Tifa is the love interest.
Def Tifa was meant for Cloud. Forget the fact that there’s history dating back to childhood, you want to aim for the girl that challenges you to be a better man, not just the person that takes care of you like your mom would. Still love you Aeris ❤️
Yeah right. Only getting interest in Cloud after he mentioned he wants to become a soldier.
@@Matagu1 So I take it you’re super excited to watch Aeris die again right??? Lmao
@@Matagu1if you’ve read totp yk that isn’t true lmao 🤣
I agree with everything you said!❤
the whole point is neither is canon. the player choses. they both have equal romantic scenes together, yet people still argue which is canon.. hopefully rebirth will fix this but theyve already discussed a point system like in the og
In this video I acknowledge the fact that there was a dating mechanic put in, but the whole point was that the character designer and writer said that there's a canon route.
@@tanagreeknose7376 yeahh i was always so curious on what it is though cause from everything ive seen, they made both sides canon at different times ? it’s always so conflicting heh cause cloud seems to always be yearning for aerith, even in ac after the whole zack memory thing. and theyre pictured as married in whatever event that happened in another ff side game. but at the same time , you cant deny the chemistry between him and tifa and they have similar pairings in other games as well as tifa being clouds “light” and the obvious childhood friends trope they got going on… part of me wants them to keep it neutral like this in the new game too cause i can just smell the incoming chaos from both fandoms
Ngl this video keeps my anxiety down for the upcoming FF7 Rebirth lol, cause they kept referencing the new song which Aerith 'sang' in the trailer for CA ship🤸♀️ but i don't get why😭 cause it seems like a song for the general friendship or smth. Though, I'm more curious about Zack's role in rebirth tho--
Haha don't worry! Trust me on this.
This comment of mine aged like fine wine😌 NPTK is about everyone HAHAHAHAH💗💗💗
@@ribonella9690 told you not to worry! 😛
❤Cloud and Tifa❤ since 1997 - peace and out 😎✌🏼
Excellent video!
Cloud goes on a date with yuffie cause in Japan 16 is the age of consent.
What a revelation!
good video
PERFECTION
It will definitely be interesting to see how the game progresses with the "romance" and see which becomes canon or if neither gets their way, maybe both can become "canon", i see valid evidence for both girls, they're both special in their own way
Man I love this channel I’ve only seen a couple of your videos but I can tell as a 27 year long fan that you really have a deep love for this game compilation and really understand it’s lore. Cheers from an elder FF fan!
This is such a sweet comment. Thank you! I love making FF7 content. Cheers to us who have been on the journey for this long.
As someone who always preferred Aerith (and still does), ultimately Cloud ends up closest with Tifa. She's the one he has always had feelings for, and is the one who has spent the most time over the course of the original to bring him back.
in Remake, Cloud always protects Tifa from harm.
He also does with aerith
I don't deny that Cloud also loves Aerith, if not how could he be like that after her death.
However, his true love has always been Tifa. But Aerith's death broke him that it'd be just too troublesome for him starting a real romantic relationship and I can understand that.
On another hand, if we refer to FF7 OG, its underlaying story is about Cloud's moving on from his pain and grief, from him losing his mom, good friend and mentor Zack, his idol Sephiroth, and his special person Aerith. If SE has intregrity to keep FF7's essence, they'll make Cloud move on,
even if Aerith's saved, I do not think SE will make their relationship romantic, best it'd be good friend, and we'll see once again how Cloud admires Aerith WHILE HOLDING HANDS WITH TIFA.
Great Video
Damn I think this is the video with the best foundation about who Cloud partner/love interest is, Amazing video.
You have sailor Moon yes . we are going to have a good zerith reunion in part 3
Cloud and Tifa has always been canon ❤
100%
Wundervoll! Was ein fantastisches Video! ❤
i feel like the story runs better with the scenario of cloud wanting to be with aerith.They met like it was fate. Both of them overcoming problems in their lives and fate has brought them together. Hes a hard ass that only finally starts changing his ways due to being around aerith. Aerith feeling like her life is worthless and losing her first love, only to start enjoying living again and finds comfort in the person that reminds her of her old love. If cloud never has feelings for aerith, then the story just doesnt feel right. Every time tifa is with cloud it feels very natural in the sense that cloud isnt nervous. He very okay with everything almost as if he doesnt see anything with them being alone together, like a childhood friend. But with aerith hes very nervous and chokes on his words a lot and doesnt know how to handle himself when alone with her. Almost like he doesnt know how to handle these new feelings and emotions that hes never experienced before. A lot of the moments throughout rebirth show us that cloud has these romantic feelings for aerith and she does as well towards him. I think hes contemplating between how he feels for both aerith and tifa. In loveless when aerith is singing, if you get the tifa route you can see that tifa goes to hold his hand and for a moment there's confliction in his eyes as if hes asking himself if what hes doing is the right thing. The scene just feels very odd with aerith singing about cloud while cloud is holding hands with tifa. While yes they do kiss when on the Ferris wheel, it still is like hes battling with himself all the way up until the end. In Aeriths playthrough you can see that hes memorized with everything that's happening. He doesn't shift is eyes or anything. Hes constantly in awe listening to her sing about him and the time shes spent with him. I think the story is more beautifully conveyed with aerith and cloud in the beginning and after aerith passes he finally ends up with tifa. Kinda like aerith and zach until zach passes, then its aerith and cloud.
I did not play ff7 for the first time until remake. Im not going to lie. I was immediately a Cloti shipper. Had no idea whether it was canon or not and didn't care. Mostly because I loved Tifa and it was very obvious she was into cloud. At the end of Remake, I believed that Cloud's feelings were more towards Aerith. By the end of Rebirth it was obvious to me Cloud had romantic feelings more towards Tifa, but I still believed he had developed some romantic feelings for Aerith. Than I watched my husband play through the original ff7, and to me it is pretty obvious who Cloud loves especially once you get to the part where Tifa enters his consciousness and you see he's basically obsessed with her. 😂 Ive since rewatched cut scenes and just little bits of gameplay. Everything about Cloud is different in regards to Tifa. The way he talks, his body language. Even in the LA GS date he still confirms his feelings for her. Now Im of the opinion that Cloud genuinely only loves Aerith as a friend.
thank you, also when rebirth releases you planning on streaming it or making playthrough videos of it ?
Yes, absolutely planning on that!
You better! coz we watching!!
is Final Fantasy 7 famous game ?
Oh yes.... VERY famous. 😅😆
@tanagreeknose7376
I think Cloud loves Berret🤣🤣🤣... That's what's happened to me when Cloud chose Berret at gold soucer in the original game😅
I still have the FF7 CDs for almost 24 years now. I was 13 years old back then, .... I can hand it over to you. If you ask for its platinum version,
Clotiiii❤❤❤❤
CloudXTifa period.
Zack and Aerith are meant to be koibito (lovers)
Aerith loves Cloud but she is in love with Zack. Aerith's love towards Cloud is like how sister loves her brother. Zack will always be #1 guy for Aerith.
Aerith never got over Zack. In Remake when Aerith and Cloud had their date she tried to ask Cloud if he knew Zack but even mentioning Zack's name out loud was too much for her and she almost broke into tears.
There are 3 parallel worlds in this trilogy and I hope that Zack and Aerith get their happy ending in the ending of this trilogy. I hope Zack from his altered world will live with Aerith after Sephiroth is destroyed. Maybe these worlds will become mirrored versions.
1. Og World = everything happens like in the og game.
2. Remake World = Everything happens mostly like in the og but there will be some differences. Aerith doesn't die in forgotten capital but she will eventually sacrifice her life in order to save the planet from the meteor.
3. Rebirth World = Everything is altered. Cloud and Tifa will both die and Zack and Aerith from this world will live together.
I'm unsure about the parallel worlds aspect of it, but it's a good theory. I doubt they will kill Cloud and Tifa though. Linking up everything with Advent Children means that they will have to continue living on, thanks to Zack and Aerith's heroic sacrifices.
@@tanagreeknose7376Nomura confirmed this parallel world theory. Those three different colored skies in cover art represents different worlds that form the story. Trailers showed us that Tifa is already dead in Zack's world. We saw shinra troopers carrying her lifeless body away, also those shinra wanted posters have red crosses drawn over every avalanche member except Biggs's and he says to Zack that he is the last avalanche member alive.
There are also two Aeriths in this game. I doubt they kill them both because after Sephiroth merges these worlds into one then the story needs only one Aerith to make a sacrifice and fulfill her og destiny.
I bet that after Sephiroth has been destroyed these worlds will split and return to normal and Zack and Aerith return to their world where they live together.
The story linking up with AC does not mean the same as story leading to AC. This trilogy will be a sequel to AC and Sephiroth from remake is actually AC Sephiroth who has used the lifestream and found his way into a parallel world where he wants to fix his past mistakes and change his destiny. He has full knowledge on what happened in og game and AC movie. He knows that killing Aerith was his biggest mistake that sealed his fate and led to his downfall.
That seven seconds until the end message was a warning about Aerith's death. Og/AC Sephiroth wants to keep Aerith alive so that she won't ruin his plans again. Og/AC Sephiroth wants Cloud to save Aerith from real Remake Sephiroth who will make his appearance in rebirth.
It is quite possible that those Cloud's visions about Aerith's death are all Sephiroth's doing. He probably wants to prep Cloud so that he will be ready when the time to save her comes.
@@SilverSisu Ah, you meant the cover art. The Cloud, Sephiroth, and Zack and then Tifa, Sephiroth, and Aerith. The red definitely evokes destruction a la Sephiroth, the starry sky Tifa/Cloud, and the clear blue sky as Zack/Aerith. I think it's more the symbolism/characters rather than there being three versions of each character. I'm not ruling out your theory, it's just that we don't know yet for sure.
About the footage on the Shinra monitors: well it's Shinra enough said, can we fully trust them? There's also a question of it being another one of Sephiroth's illusions, since he has the ability to make them SO vivid.
About it being a sequel: I'm more of the opinion that it's just a re-imagining of the original game where they are able to express more of their ideas and expand upon them in this trilogy, and that includes more exposition on the lifestream and Sephiroth's intentions. Of course, we know that Sephiroth's conciousness traveled through the lifestream which gave him knowledge of the Ancients and so forth, so time in the lifestream probably does not flow 'linearly'. I think we can still have a time travel aspect of it without it being a sequel, since these concepts were introduced in the original game to an extent as well.
@@tanagreeknose7376 Well we know that one thing is certain. We have two Aeriths alive. One who is with Cloud, Tifa, Barret and Red in Remake world and second one who is in coma and Zack is watching over her and is waiting for her to wake up. She must have got injured by that tornado that hit them when they tried to escape from Shinra HQ.
This is going to be a theory section:
My theory is that the world where Tifa and the rest are dead is a world where Cloud never joined avalanche. He is still mako poisoned and with Zack.
Tifa and Barret still somehow met Aerith (maybe it was Tifa who fell on Aerith's flower bed and they formed a deep friendship earlier than normally or maybe it was Jessie because she was supposed to be on that mission but whispers made sure that Cloud replaced her.) Aerith and Jessie never met so it would be pretty interesting to see them interacting together.
Fast forward and Shinra dropped the plate and Aerith saved Marlene like in remake and they had that moment where Aerith was comforting Marlene and she saw something that she shouldn't have seen. Marlene saw a glimpse of the future and Sephiroth killing Aerith. Aerith noticed this and showed Marlene a shush sign. She clearly wanted to keep her fate secret from the others. Aerith gets captured by Tseng and Tifa, Barret and maybe Jessie and Wedge try to rescue her from Shinra HQ. If Jessie and Wedge were there they probably get killed during the rescue mission but they manage to rescue Aerith and Red XIII joins them but their escape fails when they get hit by that massive tornado. The party gets critically injured and Shinra troops arrive to the scene and they kill Tifa, Barret and maybe Red and then they capture unconscious Aerith back.
Meanwhile Zack has arrived to sector 5 slums and he tries to
reunite with Aerith and he heads to the church but she wasn't there. There were only sector 7 refugees. Zack heads back wondering what has happened and then he sees a live shinra news report on the big screen and he notices injured Aerith being in one of those Shinra helicopters.
Zack decides to break into Shinra HQ and bring Aerith back to Elmyra. He will succeed but she is still in coma. Zack watches over her and this is where Marlene tells Zack about her vision and says "Promise not to tell? When she wakes up a scary man is gonna kill her."
Zack will be fully aware about Aerith's death and because Tifa is dead she is not there to fix Cloud's mind and he will eventually get corrupted by Sephiroth. I think we will have Zack vs corrupted Cloud duel. Zack wins and he is forced to kill Cloud and end his best friend's misery.
Nomura said that those different colored skies represent different worlds. In Remake world (green sky) where Zack is dead Stamp is a beagle and in Rebirth World (blue sky) where Zack is alive Stamp is a terrier.
Red sky must be OG world and this is where Advent Children links up with the story. Maybe we see a geostigma pandemic in part 3?
In trailer Sephiroth says "It is upon us, the reunion...when the worlds merge."
Sephiroth's goal is to merge these worlds into one. His motives are unclear but it is safe to say that he is after power. Maybe he wants to merge Remake and Rebirth worlds lifestreams into one and absorb them and become an ultimate being with nigh limitless power and have his revenge on og Cloud and Aerith?
Actually there is four parellel worlds , you have to look at the dogs, the dogs tell you which world is which, and two of them have zack as being alive, 3 of them have aerith alive in them. Only the prime one has aerith as being dead.
Great video cause I ship Cloud & Tifa myself and you explained it very well for those who still don't get that fact. Besides Aerith really belongs with Zack and they might finally see each other again soon enough in FF7 Rebirth.
I need to order the ff7 ultimania omega
@@charlesbrown1570 It's a great item!
Thank you for your video. The shipping wars can be pretty brutal here so I hope you don’t get any hate from angry fans on this and people behave themselves in the comment section.
These days I’m definitely Cloud X therapy and personally feel like Cloud is not mentally in a healthy place for a relationship in the games runtime and AC but appreciate the cute and drama moments with the different characters (Tifa especially because she my main lady and Aerith because she’s super cute).
I do feel though after the ending of AC when he is in a place to embark on a healthy romantic relationship it’s gotta be Tifa. It seems a bit dark that Cloud would forever be mourning aerith to the end of his days and meet her in death while our man Zack is also present. Doesn’t seem very happy ending to me but okay. I also don’t understand how Cloud and Tifa wouldn’t be together after AC? Like they live together right and have a family. Tifa gonna bring boyfriend bob round for dinner while she’s living with Cloud????😂 I could be wrong but isn’t this obvious what happens end game and in the future? Anyways can’t wait for Rebirth! We’re in for a treat!
I considered the reaction that I would get, but then I thought about how many people might appreciate this video. When you're just relaying the truth.. it is what it is right?
The problem with the "Cloud mourning for Aerith" headcanon is that it really paints Cloud in a bad light, and I don't think Cloud is that type of guy!
@@tanagreeknose7376 for sure, and I agree with you that many people would appreciate this video. Thank you again for your time and research making it 😊