Thoughts and feelings become very intense in the beginning as the mind is let loose. I think this may be part of the reason why many schools teach Samatha at first as this tends to calm the mind. Just like a poor diet is unsupportive of meditation practice, I’m thinking the same can be said about mental health habits and medication. You helped me through one of these episodes where all my negative life history was unfolding in each of my sittings. You are great teacher with a simple and direct style. Thank you ! 🙏
This is a very important topic and as a MD and meditation teacher I thank you bringing it to the surface, I will do some research and respond to your video tomorrow, thanks brother!
I'm 19 and quite new to meditation, was introduced to it maybe 5 years ago, did it very sporadically for around a year and have been doing it daily for around a month now. I've delt with depression, addiction, depersonalization, and some other stuff as well, and I've truly found meditation to be the greatest thing to happen to me. I think that meditation alone is not the answer though, I've only reaped the benefits of doing it once I started implementing more mindfulness techniques as well as thought and behavior changes that I practice as close to 24/7 as I can. Truly putting in the effort to go deep into my feelings and practicing many different types of meditation and then using what I learn from that in my day to day life, not using it to run away from my problems but to run towards and ultimately through them. While my depression is not gone and I sometimes feel it more acutely after meditation it's much easier to deal with, it's simply a feeling, not suffering, I've also just generally been much happier. It's helped me to move past multiple addictions, realize my true self and my potentials, as well as being able to have the mental strength to take action to become that person I know I can become, it can truly be a life saving practice if done properly. Videos like these have been incredibly helpful to me on my journey, thank you.
Thank you so much for sharing this. You have used the tools you have been given instead of letting the tools use you. I hope your true self keeps shining always and everywhere. 🙏🙏🙏
Hi Jason, great video! I thought about the monk life-path for a years, but after three 7-day Kyol Che retreats, I decided it wasn’t for me. It’s just too hard! I still enjoy the practice and find it challenging! Thanks!
@@JasonQuinnZen I ran into Dae Kwang Sunim and he told me that 18 days are needed of Kyol Che in order to get used the schedule. The hard part of it was the lack of sleep. Everything else was fine and doable. But if I can’t get at least 5 hours of sleep then what good am I?
@@davidmendoza1300 I am not sure where the 18 days came from. Everyone is different. Kyol Che wakeup is at 4:30am and ends at 9:40pm. If you got to bed at 10pm you would have around 6 1/2 hours of sleep.
Thank you sir, for your thoughts on this topic. I've learned about Theocentric meditation. I think it's a bit different compared to the ones you've enumerated here. I must say I've not meditated as much as what's recommended through the University of Metaphysics (where I've been studying). Your thoughts are so valuable to what I'm going to be doing with my degree, which is (spiritual) counseling.
Asking why we want to meditate is a difficult question for beginners, who are yet to meditate. I think its important to remember it will not solve any mental/physical problem. However, the MBSR course is for depression/anxiety. It is a very well laid out, systematic, thoroughly tested method. That addresses questions before a student has thought of them. By contrast my experience of Buddhist methods give direction on a technique but never address the things that come up. To illustrate, the MBSR explains in detail the business of our likes and dislikes. It specifically encourages acceptance and non judgement. i.e. it's ok not to like something. Buddhist teachers will tell you how you should feel and that causes anything unpalatable to be repressed. Which only causes more problems. BTW I still don't know why I meditate, other than consciously wanting to reconnect to myself, when I feel scattered. Simple goals.
I found meditation was like calling in the plumber (and for me, the electrician at the same time, quite explosive and dangerous.) The first call you just get the water turned off and a list of what's wrong. (In my case I thing a mains burst under the house) And if you've had a party of mad teenagers running amok in the house it's pretty hard to do the work needed, especially if a lot of them are still running around and wont leave when the work is going on. You need other specialists to help dependent on how much work needs doing.
After two years of zen practice with 3 5 day retreats borderline bi polar and compulsive behaviour completely fell away. Although many challenges remain, I sit without any expectations.
Catchy title, Jason! Good to see you and I hope your family has fun on the camping trip. I definitely have has some intense experiences while meditating, especially during unwinding/conjoining being. #3 BELIEVE IT, FOLKS! I was an "independent" internet Zen student for 10 years, and I do not recommend. Just like many people use a mirror in their bathroom to see their face, it is difficult to see one's own karma clearly without a way to reflect it. #5 Thank you. As you touched on, and as I have experienced with addiction recovery work, meditation/practices can be a part of a management program but (in my experience) are never "the whole program" and acted more like a path for invoking self-kindness or forgiveness. These statements, of course, not a recommendation or endorsement of anything. #5 kind of falls back to #1, wanting something from meditating. I appreciate the stern warning and cautionary tale.
I suffer from sever mental health issues, ie bi-polar, schizophrenia and previously depression. How I came to meditate is because my ex-partner went on a meditation course and when she came back she was totally transformed. It's difficult enough to be in a relationship anyway but you get used to the rhythms but when they are disrupted it challenges the whole relationship. She stopped reacting to certain things that it was our regular thing to indulge in, just banter it felt like. But long story short, she was much more self possessed. So i decided to sit a mediation course too. After that I just seemed to be in a raging stream, things just seemed to be dragging/directing me along a certain course. Supernatural things started to occur and I was/am totally freaked. That was in 1996. When you put the dark side in your heading I was kind of hoping that it would have some answers for me. At the moment I'm looking for my 'tribe' I'm sure it's there somewhere. I'm looking for folk who've had similar issues. But most folk are either cool with meditation or they leave it. I'm one of the ones who really has no choice, yes things ARE horrendous when I meditate and yes stuff happens that folk tell me is my imagination even when they see or hear for themselves evidence of unexplainable events. However, the thought of not paying attention seems even more radical. It is absolutely like grabbing hold of a tiger tail. Bad idea but letting go is not possible cos if you let go you get a bite that's worse than the struggle. So although the struggle seems intolerable the consequences of letting go are worse. After 10 years or so I found a certain SCN group that really helped me but it broke up after a few years after the person who set it up left to become a Buddhist monk. They are not all run the same and so much depends on the participants. However, if you do come across any folk who find that life is extremely challenging when they meditate yet despite that they are determined to continue cos it would be worse not to then feel free to put them in touch with me. I get it that, for those that things are running smoothly for, it is too much to be around those who it is devastating, there;' no point getting dragged into stuff that is going to harm you yourself. I myself can't really help those who are looking to just get free of the black dog is it is called, and just return to 'normal', as I'm not sure that's possible once you are bitten. But if your attitude is I'm not giving in AND on top of that I'm going to help others with this even though I'm in a really bad place myself. Those are the type of folk I'm looking to link up with. Self help, for the blind to lead the blind. I very much admired your clear and calm but also passionate conviction in how you make your presentations it's clear you are well suited to being a dhamma facilitator, I dont really do teachers. I've actually managed to sit around 20 x 10 day courses in various traditions but not yet Zen. A while ago I sat a 5 day course with a zen practitioner and was very taken with his style, quite uncommon. It seems to me that most courses, in UK anyway, are run like marathons. Whereas the Zen guy I met treated it like a series of middle distance runs. As soon as he lost his posture he would get up and do something then wait a while and come back. This was totally new to me but it seemed intuitively much healthier and much less likely to lead to the type of dissociative/psychotic episodes I have experienced. Apologies for the lengthy exposition. One last thing, the reason I meditate is because I find that others say I'm nice to be around now a days whereas that was not the case before hand. best wishes Sandy
I want to thank you, Sandy, for sharing this. I often tell people that, in my experience, when you practice meditation, life doesn't necessarily become 'easier,' but it becomes CLEAR. Keep following your intuition, and reach out if you ever need anything.
Clear mind, clear mind, clear mind. Breathe in, breathe out, breathe in, breathe out, breathe in, breathe out. A/C going, fish tank running, wall is white. 🙏🙇♀️🙏🙇♀️🙏🙇♀️
Let me assure you it is not glamourous at all. Buddha clearly explains it when he cites the honey tipped poison roots analogy. It is just like drug dealers or loan sharks. Nice and smiley and warm, sweet and exciting til your hooked. Then when you try to pull away out come the demons but they're inside you not outside. .
![AI x Mathematics [Steven Wolfram, Deepmind's FunSearch, Khosla Ventures]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1ZrRl5ihBLY/mqdefault.jpg)
Thoughts and feelings become very intense in the beginning as the mind is let loose. I think this may be part of the reason why many schools teach Samatha at first as this tends to calm the mind. Just like a poor diet is unsupportive of meditation practice, I’m thinking the same can be said about mental health habits and medication. You helped me through one of these episodes where all my negative life history was unfolding in each of my sittings. You are great teacher with a simple and direct style. Thank you ! 🙏
Thank you for sharing 🙏🙏🙏
Thank gou for being our teacher Master Jason, guiding us in life with your gentle and subtle ways.
You are welcome!
I’m grateful and fortunate to have you as my teacher over the years. Thank you Poep Sa Nim! 🙏🙏🙏
You are welcome! 🙏🙏🙏
This is a very important topic and as a MD and meditation teacher I thank you bringing it to the surface, I will do some research and respond to your video tomorrow, thanks brother!
Looking forward to it!
I'm 19 and quite new to meditation, was introduced to it maybe 5 years ago, did it very sporadically for around a year and have been doing it daily for around a month now. I've delt with depression, addiction, depersonalization, and some other stuff as well, and I've truly found meditation to be the greatest thing to happen to me. I think that meditation alone is not the answer though, I've only reaped the benefits of doing it once I started implementing more mindfulness techniques as well as thought and behavior changes that I practice as close to 24/7 as I can. Truly putting in the effort to go deep into my feelings and practicing many different types of meditation and then using what I learn from that in my day to day life, not using it to run away from my problems but to run towards and ultimately through them. While my depression is not gone and I sometimes feel it more acutely after meditation it's much easier to deal with, it's simply a feeling, not suffering, I've also just generally been much happier. It's helped me to move past multiple addictions, realize my true self and my potentials, as well as being able to have the mental strength to take action to become that person I know I can become, it can truly be a life saving practice if done properly. Videos like these have been incredibly helpful to me on my journey, thank you.
Thank you so much for sharing this. You have used the tools you have been given instead of letting the tools use you. I hope your true self keeps shining always and everywhere. 🙏🙏🙏
Hi Jason, great video! I thought about the monk life-path for a years, but after three 7-day Kyol Che retreats, I decided it wasn’t for me. It’s just too hard! I still enjoy the practice and find it challenging! Thanks!
Old age, sickness, and death is the same for all of us. Very difficult to use them.
@@JasonQuinnZen I ran into Dae Kwang Sunim and he told me that 18 days are needed of Kyol Che in order to get used the schedule. The hard part of it was the lack of sleep. Everything else was fine and doable. But if I can’t get at least 5 hours of sleep then what good am I?
@@davidmendoza1300 I am not sure where the 18 days came from. Everyone is different. Kyol Che wakeup is at 4:30am and ends at 9:40pm. If you got to bed at 10pm you would have around 6 1/2 hours of sleep.
Thank you sir, for your thoughts on this topic. I've learned about Theocentric meditation. I think it's a bit different compared to the ones you've enumerated here. I must say I've not meditated as much as what's recommended through the University of Metaphysics (where I've been studying). Your thoughts are so valuable to what I'm going to be doing with my degree, which is (spiritual) counseling.
Thank you for sharing that.
Asking why we want to meditate is a difficult question for beginners, who are yet to meditate. I think its important to remember it will not solve any mental/physical problem. However, the MBSR course is for depression/anxiety. It is a very well laid out, systematic, thoroughly tested method. That addresses questions before a student has thought of them. By contrast my experience of Buddhist methods give direction on a technique but never address the things that come up.
To illustrate, the MBSR explains in detail the business of our likes and dislikes. It specifically encourages acceptance and non judgement. i.e. it's ok not to like something.
Buddhist teachers will tell you how you should feel and that causes anything unpalatable to be repressed. Which only causes more problems.
BTW I still don't know why I meditate, other than consciously wanting to reconnect to myself, when I feel scattered. Simple goals.
Good point. MBSR is a wonderful program from what I have heard.
I found meditation was like calling in the plumber (and for me, the electrician at the same time, quite explosive and dangerous.) The first call you just get the water turned off and a list of what's wrong. (In my case I thing a mains burst under the house) And if you've had a party of mad teenagers running amok in the house it's pretty hard to do the work needed, especially if a lot of them are still running around and wont leave when the work is going on. You need other specialists to help dependent on how much work needs doing.
After two years of zen practice with 3 5 day retreats borderline bi polar and compulsive behaviour completely fell away. Although many challenges remain, I sit without any expectations.
I am very happy to read this. Keep doing!
Catchy title, Jason! Good to see you and I hope your family has fun on the camping trip.
I definitely have has some intense experiences while meditating, especially during unwinding/conjoining being.
#3 BELIEVE IT, FOLKS! I was an "independent" internet Zen student for 10 years, and I do not recommend. Just like many people use a mirror in their bathroom to see their face, it is difficult to see one's own karma clearly without a way to reflect it.
#5 Thank you. As you touched on, and as I have experienced with addiction recovery work, meditation/practices can be a part of a management program but (in my experience) are never "the whole program" and acted more like a path for invoking self-kindness or forgiveness. These statements, of course, not a recommendation or endorsement of anything.
#5 kind of falls back to #1, wanting something from meditating. I appreciate the stern warning and cautionary tale.
Thank you for sharing this, Michael.
I suffer from sever mental health issues, ie bi-polar, schizophrenia and previously depression. How I came to meditate is because my ex-partner went on a meditation course and when she came back she was totally transformed. It's difficult enough to be in a relationship anyway but you get used to the rhythms but when they are disrupted it challenges the whole relationship. She stopped reacting to certain things that it was our regular thing to indulge in, just banter it felt like. But long story short, she was much more self possessed. So i decided to sit a mediation course too. After that I just seemed to be in a raging stream, things just seemed to be dragging/directing me along a certain course.
Supernatural things started to occur and I was/am totally freaked. That was in 1996. When you put the dark side in your heading I was kind of hoping that it would have some answers for me. At the moment I'm looking for my 'tribe' I'm sure it's there somewhere. I'm looking for folk who've had similar issues. But most folk are either cool with meditation or they leave it. I'm one of the ones who really has no choice, yes things ARE horrendous when I meditate and yes stuff happens that folk tell me is my imagination even when they see or hear for themselves evidence of unexplainable events. However, the thought of not paying attention seems even more radical. It is absolutely like grabbing hold of a tiger tail. Bad idea but letting go is not possible cos if you let go you get a bite that's worse than the struggle. So although the struggle seems intolerable the consequences of letting go are worse.
After 10 years or so I found a certain SCN group that really helped me but it broke up after a few years after the person who set it up left to become a Buddhist monk. They are not all run the same and so much depends on the participants. However, if you do come across any folk who find that life is extremely challenging when they meditate yet despite that they are determined to continue cos it would be worse not to then feel free to put them in touch with me. I get it that, for those that things are running smoothly for, it is too much to be around those who it is devastating, there;' no point getting dragged into stuff that is going to harm you yourself. I myself can't really help those who are looking to just get free of the black dog is it is called, and just return to 'normal', as I'm not sure that's possible once you are bitten. But if your attitude is I'm not giving in AND on top of that I'm going to help others with this even though I'm in a really bad place myself. Those are the type of folk I'm looking to link up with. Self help, for the blind to lead the blind.
I very much admired your clear and calm but also passionate conviction in how you make your presentations it's clear you are well suited to being a dhamma facilitator, I dont really do teachers. I've actually managed to sit around 20 x 10 day courses in various traditions but not yet Zen. A while ago I sat a 5 day course with a zen practitioner and was very taken with his style, quite uncommon. It seems to me that most courses, in UK anyway, are run like marathons. Whereas the Zen guy I met treated it like a series of middle distance runs. As soon as he lost his posture he would get up and do something then wait a while and come back. This was totally new to me but it seemed intuitively much healthier and much less likely to lead to the type of dissociative/psychotic episodes I have experienced. Apologies for the lengthy exposition. One last thing, the reason I meditate is because I find that others say I'm nice to be around now a days whereas that was not the case before hand. best wishes Sandy
I want to thank you, Sandy, for sharing this. I often tell people that, in my experience, when you practice meditation, life doesn't necessarily become 'easier,' but it becomes CLEAR. Keep following your intuition, and reach out if you ever need anything.
@@JasonQuinnZen thanks
Clear mind, clear mind, clear mind.
Breathe in, breathe out, breathe in, breathe out, breathe in, breathe out.
A/C going, fish tank running, wall is white.
🙏🙇♀️🙏🙇♀️🙏🙇♀️
People are looking for the golden fish, but you ate it 🙏🙏🙏
What you gain from meditation may not be the thing you originally sought when you began meditating
Great point. Exactly my experience.
Somehow the dark path of meditation sounds so cool, like how the sith have a cooler look in starwars
My son and I were thinking the same thing.
Let me assure you it is not glamourous at all. Buddha clearly explains it when he cites the honey tipped poison roots analogy. It is just like drug dealers or loan sharks. Nice and smiley and warm, sweet and exciting til your hooked. Then when you try to pull away out come the demons but they're inside you not outside. .
For me it lasted for 10 years
Well, they weren't actually meditating then.
The deep you dig the well, you will get more dirt and fossils there. Its natural.