Harada Finally Speaks on Tekken vs. DOA
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- Опубликовано: 6 фев 2025
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Intro/Outro by SKONK - / @bigskonk
Intro/Outro track by KEIFERGR33N - / @keifergr33n
Editors:
Ceezd: / ceezd_
Jack Clishem: @jackclishem
shishi: / @shishi4
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I'm PhiDX, I play Tekken professionally for DSG, Chipotle, and ArcadeShock.
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Harada's disclaimer at the start is so FGC coded, I don't ever want to hear that people think he's so disconnected with the community, LOL
"I know yall can't read" ahh disclaimer
He repeated the disclaimer multiple times too, like he knows some of you in the fgc are slow asf
Harada is one of the most involved game directors you’ll ever see. He’s constantly closely involved with the community for his game all year round. He’s long been at the point where he doesn’t have to do that but you can tell he really cares and loves this and that’s why he’s one of the best
@@nginroom8108 Damn Harada calling me out
harada: you play fighterz, you can't read
18:12 harada was at frosty and everyone thought it was gonna be to announce something, but turns out he just really likes to be at community events. thats cool af.
Yea he’s in the background of the VF grand finals seemingly happy his old rival is back
So basically Itagaki went full "Sega does what Nintendon't" on Tekken
Everybody loves consolewarring.
or when someone read the art of war too many times.
@@JackCrossSama Or played Koei Tecmo's Dynasty Warriors 😂
@@yourdagan The 90's really favored an aggressive competitive spirit, and then that disappeared around the ps3 gen. It's the fans that still engaged into those clashes (about the oldest gaming rivalries), because the internet only took off in the 00s, but actually they were fueled by that competitive culture in the 90s market.
Even today we can still come across guys probably in their 40s madly debating 16 bit consoles. At least I do because i have retro interests.
@@carlosaugusto9821No those 40+ year olds identify as Xbot & Ponies now unfortunately.
So, Itagaki was basically Harada's personal Vegeta to his Goku.
or basically Hwoarang to his Jin...
Itagaki was such a freak and I mean that in both an endearing and a disparaging way.
The PhiDX bedtime stories arc is upon us
Literally listening to this in bed before I go to sleep rn lmaooo
@ahnixcreations sleep tight!
@@ahnixcreationswait wtf same 😭
@@BloodMoon_124 hahaha I'm so here for it
Hideki kamiya also tweeted recently on his history with Itagaki if any are interested and also see the origins of the iconic pic of Kamiya, Itagaki and Kojima together.
That does sound interesting.
Looking back with how Itagaki really liked the Xbox and western style in general, it makes sense that he'd try a more western style marketing tactic. The stories about Harada setting up the arcade cabinets at events before his sunglasses era is really endearing too, he really really wanted to be out there in the community listening and talking to people. Wild stuff
DOA was never the same after itagaki left.
And so with ninja gaiden
It actually got BETTER without him. Unfortunately, it was short lived once the suits came in and demanded Team Ninja to mine that sweet, sweet gooner whale's money with "Last Round".
@@the13thjoker Well, you gotta remember that Itagaki making the Ninja Gaiden games Xbox exclusives didn't make sense to Tecmo at the time. The PS2/3 was super popular in Japan because Sony's a local company, so regardless of the potential success in the U.S, it wouldn't have mattered to them if the domestic market didn't even know about it. I'm sure it's pretty common knowledge at this point why NGΣ and NGΣII were basically inferior versions of their vanilla counterparts; they thought they knew better, and decided to mess things up to prove their own pride. This, combined with countless other tensions straining his relationship with Tecmo, led him to suddenly depart from the company.
And honestly, they deserved it. They didn't respect his vision, refused to be humble, and decided to attack his work with the abomination that was NG3. Now, let's hope they've learned their lesson with NG4...because holy shit, the Announcement Trailer is hella hype.
lol no, it got better actually. DOA5 was a significant improvement in both gameplay and story. DOA 1-4 story made zero sense even for a fighting game. Random cutscenes, nothing explained, no continuity. DOA Dimensions on 3DS retold those stories in an actual coherent way all thanks to no Itagaki.
Ninja Gaiden on the other hand took a huge downfall after he left. NG3 was awful. NG1 and 2 were still vastly superior, especially in level design. NG3 was pure linear.
@@YanDaMan263 Wrong...
DOA3>>DOA5
That's a very anime story arc. Personal rivalries and feuds will never not be entertaining.
I thought the same thing lmaoooo
@@electric_boogaloo496 Should be made into an anime, but with more drama.
How Itagaki tried so hard to beat Tekken could be seen as a parallel to how Harada tried as hard to beat Virtua Fighter, but in different ways: Itagaki deliberately made DoA to be as far away to Tekken, making sure DoA does everything Tekken doesn't; while Harada making sure Tekken can do everything Virtua Fighter does.
@@davidsentanu7836 on the technical side of things, Tekken owes a lot to VF. But on the cool and character design side of things, Tekken leaves VF in the dust. I respect VF, but it has never looked cool the way Tekken does.
@@electric_boogaloo496 Everything owes a lot to VF in first place, and DOA is even closer to VF technically. Then DOA owes a lot to TK for not walking the same path of VF regarding intentional bland presentation, lack of character background, etc and be purely about the gameplay.
That vision of Namco changed the future of TK and the rest of the 3d fgs. Then Namco made SC (Edge at first), that already started with strong roots in presentation, narrative,etc... And everything else followed the same direction, those minor 3d fgs like Bloody Roar, Rival Schools, Star Gladiator, etc.
Meanwhile VF devs were stubborn about keeping it the same boring way... and the game continued falling in appeal. It was totally outnumbered in a market where everything else valued presentation, and they keep fleshing out those elements after the 90's. The status of pioneer, the legacy, the truly good gameplay, none of that was able to save VF.
The personal irony of this feud is that DOA and Tekken are my favorite fighting games. The revival of NG gives me hope that a new DOA will be announced soon.
I'm glad you made this video man, I wanted to read this but the way you tell it makes it way more digestible than reading it alone.
he's a great reader, that's 100%
@danmarksfinestedaniel seriously though! Like he read it as if he'd been practicing and im pretty sure he didnt!
We need DOA to get out of its dating sim phase and have a new fighting game already
The DOA slander here is insane 💀
unfortunately that's most of the fanbase and that's where they're gonna put their money's worth into it
With Ninja Gaiden's comeback with NG 2 Black and the announcement of NG 4, I'd say there are hope for DOA considering both NG and DOA are the same universe. Heck maybe DOA already is saved with Ninja Gaiden.
the problem is that no one is willing to take that game seriously. Its well known to be the fan service gooner "fighting game"
@azizkash286 that's exactly the problem with it. experience wise it's gonna cater to what it's fanbase wants. I was in the same boat with this series years ago and wanted this to be taken seriously.
It's more probable a Soul Calibur comeback than DOA's.
But I believe that the fanservice of DOA can be better exploited in a new release. The potential is there. Imagine a Nikke, First Descendant or Stellar Blade fanservice collaborations. Those things cannot be done by other fighting games because they're more family-friendly (ofc, if the game wants to be also in the competitive scene, a "SFW" additional mode could be handy).
DOA2 was the shit back in the day, I played doa2 through 5 before jumping to Tekken 7 cause it was the only 3d fighter with online relevance. God I wish DOA had better online and crawled back to FGC and esports.
DOA 6 was their attempt at being taken seriously in the Esports scene and it basically killed the series.
@@thatonepenguinperson618 there were other decisions that killed the series, but you’re also right. A DOA that’s want to be taken seriously is not DOA. I wish people would just accept that not every game has to be a top tier esport game that has Tekken/SF-like player numbers instead of just some mindless fun for a smaller, but still healthy community
Same here
@@thatonepenguinperson618 the producer left on an "infinite vacation" so he just wont come back and no one wants to make a new game beeing busy. The same as Soulcalibour the people working on it left and the Tekken Team just dont have motivation/time but the VF6 comeback could bring every big fighting game from early 3d era back that we live an entire era one more time, thats my wish :D
DoA will never really be relevant in e-sports and that´s fine...they should just focus on making it as fun as possible with good online. as a competitive fighting game it´ll never be able to stay relevant while Tekken is around and doing well and now Virtua Fighter returns (which kinda felt like what DoA would be if it was more complex and competitive, at least VF4 and 5 did)
DOA is a good game, I don’t care for how Koei treats the series though.
I agree. koei as a whole kind of sucks in how they treat their ips I havent been a fan of them recently
@@lightning2034 Dynasty Warriors Origins, Romance of the 3 Kingdoms 8 Remake, Atelier Ryza series, Nioh series. Just some of the best games in their genre.
The game is from the Tecmo side of the conglomerate, not Koei.
Your point still stands, though.
DWO man amazing
During the fighting game dark ages I was Street Fighter and KOF player, and I always wondered how the Tekken players sourced their cabinets for tournaments and events since there were times when there were no console releases yet. Turns out it was Harada himself lending a hand.
as playing both fighting games casually, DOA has truly made me a better for both for how fundamentally driven the game is. DOA5LR is still a game that even still to this day I would say competes with that of Tekken 8 considering the stages, environment, the music is DOA is ridiculously good ❤️
DOA’s roster too is crazy!
If they update DOA 5 with a good netcode, I’ll play it more than Tekken 8. DOA is pure fun. DOA 6 was not very good, the stages were not great, Diego and electric loly were… not interesting, and the new super with 1 button was a bad mechanic as rage art in Tekken. We lost the tag mode and the dlc was bad (the same costume for everyone for a hudge price, doa 6’s dlc were better).
@ DOA5LR still has lobbies on PS, always on there. Matches are so clean !
@@PKMJyo that’s why DOA5LR on PS is so amazing, you can find lobbies there all the time. usually can find me there too and matches are so clean
@@PKMJyo "DOA is pure fun. "
well said, doa is first fun, then fighting game, that's make it too much cool
My first true fighting game experience is DOA5LR before Tekken 7 on PS4. My dad downloaded it for me and my younger siblings (we were 14 and below), not knowing it's 17+ rating until we found out ourselves through the costumes the npc were wearing. I don't care how people judged that game, it means a lot to me and my siblings. That game was fun, the animations were impressive, and being kids that time means we have so much fun discovering the animations they make when we mash buttons lol
We only get to enjoy it for three months. My dad eventually deleted it and immediately bought Tekken 7 to replace that game for us. It'll always have a special place in my heart.❤
I knew the two had rivalry and also are good friends, but the levels that Itagaki went through to make sure he stood on top is insane. There is why I love DoA2 to 4 so much when he was working on those games.
what about DoA5 or Dimensions tho?
@Evilriku13 As much as I also like those games, Itagaki didn't work on those.
@@MastermindAtWork true on that, just thought you didn't play those titles because Itagaki didn't work on them for example.
The credits thing is also crazy considering back then Japanese game devs went by pseudonyms a lot so that they couldn't be headhunted by other companies, so I'm sure it was something Itagaki had already been used to trying to decipher.
Hopefully, if Itagaki San decides to return to DOA, then him and Harada can collab for either a Tekken DLC featuring a DOA character or if DOA7 gets made... a DOA DLC featuring a Tekken character. This was some real wholesome stuff 👍🏼.
After the Geese announcement in T7 i wanted so bad that the next guests were from VF and DOA. We were close to having the biggest fg clash of all time in a way: TK x SF x KOF x VF x DOA. But Bandai Namco (or Harada, i don't know) focus on trends rather than historical and symbolic value, so it was natural to ignore VF and DOA, the 3d fg rivals that were falling in the 2010s.
damn that was a crazy read/listen. thank you for uploading this, as someone that doesnt use twitter i found this very interesting and helpful.
Itagaki is the GOAT. I was so happy to finally hear the details about the rivalry. This is lore that could've been lost to time.
Damn that's some crazy lore
Thanks for the storytime, I'd love more breakdowns or "history-lessons" regarding the development and business side of fighting games.
Side note: Harada and Nakatsu literally showed up to Frosty’s to just vibe and not have any Tekken related announcements (and probably do some business related stuff since the Sega/VF5 devs were there too and I saw them chatting after VF5 Top 8 but that’s not the point *cough*).
Anyways, for as much shit they seem to get I do think they try as much as they can to still attend events and connect with folks and I thought that was pretty dope.
What a neat story. I always remembered hearing about itagaki hating tekken so much he made DOA out of spite. This adds such a crazy context to it. Thank you for sharing this!
It’s weird because DOA actually plays like a reconstructed Virtua fighter/ fighting vipers.
That's crazy bro. Growing up in the 90's and early 2000's I was always the one the was more proficient in fighting games out of all of my friends. We played a bunch of fighting games from XMEN vs Street Fighter to Street Fighter 3 , Killer Instinct, Tekken, Soul Caliber, and so on.
However, one of the few games that they were able to provide some level of competition was DOA. There is something about DOA that makes it popular and resonate with the casuals who play fighting games differently than the rest of us do.
I hope the drunken phone call returns and we get a Tekken guest character from DOA. Maybe this is what Harada is foreshadowing.
Thanks for sharing this with the community! Super interesting stuff. I love learning cool little pieces of video game history!
Ngl this was one piece (IS REAL) of lore i wasn't expecting to learn today
Man that was really a delightful video. As someone who has been part of the fighting game community since the mid-90s and who played both games competitively I love hearing about this stuff that was going on behind the scenes. I even remember a DOA add in a magazine back of the day that seemed to be poking fun at Tekken. Man that was the heyday of it all when it came to technology in which game was playing better. And I remember her time when DOA overtook every other 3D fighter with the slickest gameplay and most advanced graphics. For my money Tekken was always going to be my game of choice but man the rivalries were good back then and the arms race did add excitement to it all.
Hope you get the opportunity to read us more stories in the future
The market and the industry worked differently in the 90's, the companies were working so hard to push new tecnologies, and everything about gaming was so new at the time that the evolutions felt more impressive. And pretty much every year was filled with important releases that had essential contributions.
Tekken 1 to 3 were yearly releases, which must be hard to believe for a much younger fan, as the company nowadays milks the same release for more than 5 years (all other companies do the same). So even a window of 1-2 years was critical in the 90's. Even more critical was whenever a company had the opportunity of getting ahead of the competition with a next gen release... that was exactly the case of Sega and Tecmo with VF3 and DOA2. Namco actually didn't stay totally behind thanks to SC1, but TK specifically was behind all those games.
At that time it was DOA2 vs Tekken 4 and I remember every magazine declared DOA2 as the clear winner. While ironically Tekken 4 is my favourite fighting game of all time I do think DOA2 was an incredible game and I spent so many hours with it.
Yeah funny enough DOA2 at that time was considered the more (or even most) popular 3D FG. At one point, Soul Calibur was an even more popular game than Tekken. Tekken didn’t get the same kind of foot hold as they do now until Tekken 7 when it became massively popular.
I feel like Harada’s initial efforts all those years finally paid off since it pretty much led to them developing Tekken 7 the way it did despite the loss they took with Tag 2.
The discourse was more around DOA2 vs TTT1. I remember a few Playstation magazines gave DOA2 better reviews than TTT1 as the interactive environments were considered more of a next-gen thing while TTT was looked at as a re-hash of T3. TTT1 was taken more seriously by actual fighting game players though and had a much longer lasting scene which was also in part due to T4's lukewarm reception
@@thoughtfulfoulmouthTrue, I was there when it was DoA2 vs TTT. But actually it was more like DoA2 vs SoulCalibur to me. Both are insane looking and really gave a taste what "next gen" is like.
TTT was more arcade thing (and turns out, according to this video, it was Harada's vision all along: competitive video game.) Which finally be proven to be the right direction in Tekken 7.
@@GaspoweR The next gen qualities of the Dreamcast were a big deal and helped to give a boost of attention to those games like SC, VF3 and DOA2, while TK was late to cross gen. And VF and DOA also got in the ps3/360 gen before TK, though not by a large difference this time.
Itagaki sounds like a mad genius.
Play ninja gaiden 2 vanilla and compare it to sigma 2 or 2 black and you'll realize quickly itagaki is a psychopath in the best way
He is. Actual madman
Just go into ng2 with caution. It's considered his Magnum opus, but it is an unfinished mess that itagaki himself laments not having time to finish properly. It's a good game, just kind of overblown by its diehard fans. Ninja gaiden 1 black is overall the better, more polished, and complete game.
@chozochiefxiii3298 unfinished sure but "unfinished mess" is very misleading. You making it sound like its painful to get through besides the inherent difficulty in the game.
@tearo Chapter 3 onwards kind of is. Even people who like the game despise at least half of it. I like the game personally. I just wish it wouldn't be used as a beating stick against the other versions. All the versions have their merits.
I love the fact that, throughout all development stories related to Itagaki, him being very drunk at one point seems to be a constant
i really like hearing you tell these stories, i put them on when driving and listen to them. very cool
I like Tekken but I will always be Team Ninja when it comes to 3D fighting games. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to Izuna drop this Ninja Gaiden 2 remake that just came out
Same, I like Tekken but Team Ninja is goated
Itagaki is the soul of DOA and Ninja Gaiden, without him a crossover would be pointless, now DOA vs Virtua Fighter is way better.
This was an amazing story. These guys are some characters. They were really rivals in a shonen manga kind of sense. Although there was some disrespect at times, they never truly meant ill will to each other and sometimes that’s a side product of competition. It’s great to hear they were able to clear the air and this kind of competition is what brings the best out of creative minds.
On Itagaki's Wikipedia page, the 4rth source link (at bottom of the page, called "Paradise Lost") is an interview where he actually says he likes Tekken 1 to 3, the 3 being his family's favorite (while he thinks Tekken 4 is lazy and brings nothing).
And he also talks about an air commercial where Namco made fun of his DOA licence when the 1rst went out (maybe that was fake to give credit to his attacks toward Tekken, who knows ?)
him saying Tekken 4 didn't bring nothing feels so awkward to me since it was the first game that included amazing full 3D stages with floor elevations, water and more... actually, Tekken 4 is very similar to DOA style... it's weird to me that Itagaki hates Tekken 4
He loves Virtua Fighter and he talked smack about that too when Dead or Alive came from Virtua Fighter.
The rivalry between Harada and Itagaki is so funny to me, given the fact that they BOTH attended the same university together😂💀
Doa and Soul calibur need a comeback
This was the least expected lore drop of the day lol. Great as always.
that was a cool reading thanks for doing it! i remember the adds and all that
Itagaki was a real character, I hope he’s doing good these days. Hopefully with Virtua Fighter coming back, Tekken will finally have some real competition in the 3D fighting game space.
When Bloody Roar comes back too, then we might get a fresh breeze of wind in the higher eschalons of that genre again! :)
@@Evilriku13How amazing wouldn't it be to have the return of the Bloody Roar Series.
itagaki has his own gaming studio
This is a great video and I’m glad to see it because I’ve been playing Tekken since Tekken 2 and in the late 90s early 2000s there was definitely a rivelry between DOA and Tekken. Tekken 4 was such a huge departure from the series and now that I see this video, I think Tekken was trying to prove to the world that they can do so much better than DOA’s style multi tiered arenas, walls etc.
Itagaki must have been a menace back in the day, that is some Machivelian shit. That being said game obviously recognizes game, cause Harada's strategy definitely worked and does go to show how tune in he is to the consumer base. Well was back in the day, not sure how true this is now.
I can see this being adapted into a movie
People comparing Dead or Alive to Tekken is kinda stupid
Dead or Alive is going for more absurdly epic moment
Hey, just found your channel. Already loving these news channel and some storytelling about the devs. Good shit.
DoA: Strategy
Tekken: Community Feedback
SF: Hibernation
The Doa hate to this day baffles me but the devs to get ridiculous tryna throw shade which is dumb
I've been a Tekken fan pretty much my whole life and I never really paid any mind to Doa. But now that Tekken 8 is super fun, there's a new VF on the way I would love to see a new DoA launch sometime soon
Even as a child, I always felt the subtle parallels between Tekken and DOA. The story of Kasumi (family issues/experimental cloning) felt like it mirror 'ed Jin's conflict to a degree. The movements, the attacks, it felt similar yet still all uniquely its own. Thus, why I always thought maybe I was projecting back then. At least now I feel valid in my old thoughts lol. That being said, I think now I really do wish some-day Kasumi (or Hayabusa) could join Tekken's guest characters one day, just to really wrap up the developer lore. 😄
It's more likely now, in the era of guest character fan service
After the Geese announcement in T7 i wanted so bad that the next guests were from VF and DOA. We were close to having the biggest fg clash of all time in a way: TK x SF x KOF x VF x DOA. But Bandai Namco (or Harada, i don't know) focus on trends rather than historical and symbolic value, so it was natural to ignore VF and DOA, the 3d fg rivals that were falling in the 2010s.
Gaming would be even more amazing if we had more leaders like Harada and Itagaki in the industry. Love them both
This was on the same level as Death Note
I quite liked this story. Thanks for sharing Phi!
It's interesting how Itagaki did market research and employed classic Western marketing tactics to advertise and market DOA, as well as the image of DOA being somewhat more "sexualized" seemingly intentional. And it's fascinating that it worked well for what it was but ultimately DOA never outright surpassed Tekken in terms of popularity and sales as Harada was focused on delivering better home console experiences, in terms of having more modes etc (vs DOA seemingly focusing more on the core gameplay and other stuff like skins or so, as well as the presentation of the series being vastly superior to Tekken's), as well as, and I think this was the huge key of Tekken's success now, Harada travelling and meeting people of different cultures + supporting the grassroots FGC community, which is why the Tekken series since T5 has that identity of representing these various cultures + why it's able to stand strong vs other IPs at the time, ESPECIALLY SF and VF struggling to not only put out games but really understand the community.
This gives me more respect to Harada and a newfound respect for Itagaki, who initially I thought was just being a hater or corny for no reason but was actually a strategic mastermind and employing all he could to push the DOA franchise.
Also, it's kinda funny now how DOA's reputation as a "gooner game" is seemingly intentional, at least when Itagaki was still there, in a way that also ties to the other aspects of the game; namely presentation and gameplay. Itagaki mentioned how he wanted to focus on developing DOA to cater to what Tekken is missing and it somewhat adds up: make female characters super sexy to bait in people since that does work -> make a gameplay system that feels good to play and is easier to pick up that Tekken while having as much depth, if not more in some aspects + make graphics and presentation far better than Tekken, with higher poly models and the crazy stage transitions to keep them staying for more.
Now it's time to create some Tekken X DoA games so we can figure out what's the best fighting game ! (That man that didn't understood anything ahah)
I wish there was someone worthy to take the reigns of the doa franchise but because the series is now aimed towards softcore dating sims there's not much we can do until then
I really wish Bandai Namco made a crossover between TK, VF, DOA (maybe SC too, i dont know). Crossover games had a big boost of appeal since the 00's, thanks to MvC, CvS, even SSB, etc, and it might work for 3d fgs.
(That's not my only fg crossover wish but that one is more viable than another much more ambitious idea that i have)
@@lightning2034 I have no hopes that DOA can be saved by a different direction. The game is in a tough situation and that has a lot to do with its history of fanservice and how it's apparently not respected by the fgc for that reason.
It's very different from VF, that is totally respectable and just has suffered from a direction that refused to take care of its presentation, so it was beated by TK with its cool and flashy characters and story. Now that VF is returning with a fresh new direction, it instantly looks like a very promising release and the fgc is truly engaged and curious to learn more of it.
So with DOA it's a problem of a more fundamental kind and it's ruined the game's reputation for literally decades. So it was never truly respected by the fgc. In these cases it's hard to imagine a positive change for the game. And there's also the problem that a part of the community (maybe most?) will complain about the fanservice toning down. Basically, saving the game involves some highly controversial decisions.
In the end if this story is accurate what Itagaki didn't understand is that focusing on attacking Tekken and comparing yourself to it is a double edged sword. If you go out of your way to draw comparisons between your games so will the playerbase... which means they will probably settle for the best product between the two. Tekken was ahead of all other 3D fgs, except maybe SC but ya know still namco, so trying to fight it on equal footing was always doomed.
@@zoroasper9759 it's also important to note that starting that kind of drama between your game and another so openly kind of kills behind the scenes relationships that would be more beneficial than artificial beef. Especially in fighting game development, they're not shy about sharing technology with each other. But Itagaki being so aggressive towards Tekken in his marketing meant that he burned that bridge and isolated his studio's reach.
i don't know how much of this tweet is accurate,
but i remember one stream of harada back in 2019, when he was making fun of Tamaki's reveal , and joking on doa,
and definitely itagaki was not around anymore in 2019
so if anything ,both of them likes to belittling each other,
it is just that harada is victorious here in the end , so he talks like victor
@@baziworld Harada also makes fun of Street Fighter and yet he's good friends with the director, it's more so about who shot first and whether they're friends or not. Making fun of a character's reveal is a lot different than publicly attacking a developer to bolster your game's sales.
You say they enjoyed belittling one another, and that could be true *now*. But that couldn't be true during the DOA vs. Tekken era unless both parties planned everything similarly to Harada and Ono's fake beef. ESPECIALLY since Itagaki established himself as Harada's senior. The Senior/Junior relationship is taken incredibly seriously there, you don't make jokes like this with that kind of relationship.
Regardless, I would be surprised if we heard anything from Itagaki since he's pretty deep into that NFT/crypto project of his...
@@thatonepenguinperson618 True, Itagaki left video game industry it seems(or he lost his touch on it)
*speaking of beefing , if i remember there was one beef between devil may cry and ninja gaiden too ruclips.net/video/e6KumZk8Tss/видео.html
but i guess the beef between tekken and doa left some marks on both itagaki and harada, nontheless great games series both of them
@@baziworld oh my gosh, I completely forgot about the DMC 4 vs. Ninja Gaiden beef x_x
Itagaki only knew one marketing strategy, and it's starting beef with his competitors xD Fortunately for him though, his games with Team Ninja were good enough to keep the beef going. The moment he left Team Ninja was when everything went south for him... And Team Ninja x_x
Harada is probably the most connected Director of a game that I can think of
No Sakurai?
I still remember the DOA vs Tekken beef lmao
VF vs Tekken was there too, but that was always like a healthy rivalry.
DOA vs Tekken was pure toxic. If I said "I like Tekken", not even "I prefer Tekken", no, the DOA players would go on a huge rant about how DOA is better.
As they should.
@@yourdaganYou're part of the problem.
@@BeretBay There is no problem homie. Dissent and debate are good drawers of truth and insight.
@@BeretBaynah games gas once u understand it but DOA fans not beating the gooning allegations
@@themythbigpumagang
DOA fans don’t try to beat allegations and TEKKEN fans are just as down bad just look at the modding community currently
This is actually a really interesting story. A lot of twists and turns and it is also really good insight
It’s so wild all this shit was going on behind the scenes before most people even had access to the internet lol
DOA 2 Ultimate is untouchable still!
By Junior and Senior, he's refering to the Senpai and Kohai Honourifics does commonly used in Japan.
Very good read. Like walking a mile in Harada's shoes. Appreciate it
Yeah. DOA2 did wall breaks, walk blast, tag team 2vs 2:way before harada even thought about it. DOA2;on Dreamcast play just as smooth as Tekken 8. Loads up faster, wall base, balcony breaks I'm a Tekken fan but harada stole allot of deas from a plethora of fighting games. Which is why it's so good.
The team attacks in Tag Mode in Dead or Alive 2 are better than any tag move in Tekken Tag 2. I don't think it can be beat. Even if a Tekken Tag 3 was made.
DOA and Ninja Gaiden are great. Tekken is also great. This lore is interesting lol
I Hope that DOA makes come back as soon as possible,
even there is no evolution without Rival, and even Tekken took inspirations from DOA From time to time, even T8...I like DOA makes its comeback better than ever before, Great series
Harada is such a boss and his twitter threads have been really great thanks for covering this for those of us not on twit
The story is weird and crazy af, but has a surprisingly wholesome ending.
Although I gotta say, I don't have the best opinion of people who create deliberately incendiary personas for the sake of marketing. The more coldly calculated that persona is, the worse.
Now look at the position that Bandai Namco and Tekken have in the fg market, compared to Koei Tecmo and DOA. Itagaki really didn't help himself, the game and the company.
Well I played DOA 2 and 3 in X-Box, the graphics were gorgeous back then.
Tekken and the PlayStation were an absolute force back in the day
Still are
This was fascinating! Thanks Phi!
I remember the times of DOA3 release, Itagaki were asked what were his top 3 most hated games and he said "Tekken 1, Tekken 2 and Tekken 3" LOL.
Really? x) On Itakagaki's wikipedia page, there is at the bottom a source link (link number [4] called "Paradise Lost") to an interview where he said he likes Tekken 1, 2 and 3 (which was his favorite along with his family), while he found Tekken 4 lazy development.
The exact quote is :
"XBN: You've made some harsh comments about Tekken. Do you regret saying these things?
Itagaki: Tekken 1 was good. Tekken 2 was better, and Tekken 3 even better than that. My family are big fans of Tekken 3! But Tekken 4 just did not push the genre at all. Such lazy development. I do respect what the AM2 team did with Virtua Fighter 4. I am a fan of simplification, and I liked that they tried to increase the mass appeal of the game by cutting out one button. But DOA 3 is still a better game."
@@jessierocket8227 Yeah, I don't doubt he had to take back his words, but was part of the show and advertisment in that time just as this video shown. I even remember he was asked what he thought about Tekken 4, and he said something like "they fail miserably to try to copy DOA3 stages transitions"
Itagaki was pretty controversial but they always remarked the strong points of their games compared to their rivals.
😂
Ok I didn't know I needed this
Phi can you make "I read a Harada tweet for you" into a series
This ended up being the perfect thing to put in the background while I was cooking my dinner in the kitchen
Itagaki went full on offensive, that was a good insight of this.
we need more videos of phi going through tekken's history the tekken3 match analysis and this one are some of his best vids and I would love to see him do more stuff like this, maybe make videos disscusing older tekken titles and the history behind them and the players that emerged from them.
I mean, Itagaki wasn't wrong. DoA2 IS better than any Tekken game.
Wait!?!?! Maybe I'm reading too much into this. But did Harada inadvertently screw over the Soulcalibur series?
Simple solution they each pick 10 fighters decide on gameplay and lets enjoy the fight
I’ve been saying Tecmo gotta put their pride aside and rehire Itagaki. Shit went left aside from DOA5. Seems like Itagaki was just playing a mind game to motivate himself to make great games and it worked
His five most hated game Tekken 1-5 he trolling like a mf 😂😂😂he said all they games was ahh at that time savage he basically try to son him you my junior Tekken still better tho
Man Dead or Alive 2 was amazing on the Dreamcast.
Storytime with Phi is a fun subset of videos I can get behind lol.
Ph this goated content my brotha🤙 love this type of stuff.
I absolutely love both Tekken and DOA, one thing that always got me playing DOA more was its fully 3D stage mechanics and multi-tier arenas. It was like exploring a massive map with hidden meanings behind what the world of DOA was.
Tekken always felt archaic when it came to that, sad because I felt Tekken 4 really felt like a great attempt at where Tekken could go with full 3D stage mechanics but with the low roster and unbalanced at high level it ended up being hated. Though now I feel people really appreciate what Tekken 4 tried to do.
Itagaki really said at the end of it all “Sorry bro it was all just kayfabe for the fans we cool?”
Of course DoA lost the war. They were fighting it one-handed.
In seriousness, I loved DoA4. 5 was... decent until the lolis released. 6 was... not great.
Awesome story!! Watched the whole thing!
Lol, I can see the similarities of this story with that of Sega of America's win over Nintendo during the Genesis era.
In a smaller degree, that attitude existed everywhere in the 90's gaming scene.
Thats crazy PhiDX managed to monetize reading a tweet with like 1 or 2 comments every 5 minutes
heard that story. man, what a crazy thing to happen.
I didn't know that, thank you mr phidx
14:59 Itagaki just wanted a friend. I knew it since the beginning.
wild history lol.
PhiDX said "Story time!!!" 😂
Lets goo new phi vid 🙌🏾
dang dat was awesome story time!
I played and loved both Tekken and DOA, and i liked/played them more in that order
Tekken 1
Tekken 2
Tekken 3/DOA
Tekken 4/DOA2
DOA3 (didn't like tekken 5 because i eventually got fed up with decisions taken in tekken 4 and they shifted over to 5. And DOA 3 looked amazing and i even bought my xbox for DOA3)
DOA4
Tekken 6 (After amazing DOA4, DOA became just a joke with DOA5 and DOA5 was a huge disappointment to me and DOA6 even more so i went back to tekken as Lars looked amazing)
Tekken 7 (went back to my main Jin after tekken 3/tag 1 in T7 season 3)
Tekken 8 (haven't played that much competitively as i don't like the whole mechanics of the game, its just too easy/scrubby. Yes i am one of them. So i only play tekken 8 to develop (by changing the current ones) my own moves and techniques by modding the move list)
This was awesome. Love Harada.
This was actually very interesting.