Warning to MSI AMD graphics card buyers
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- Опубликовано: 16 июл 2023
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#gaming #games #gameplay #gpu #repair #nvidia #amd #fix #fixed # 
Хобби
AMD GPUs from brands that also make Nvidia are the worst because they jerry-rig their Nvidia coolers to fit AMD boards. By far the best AMD GPUs come from exclusive vendors like ASRock,PowerColor, XFX and Sapphire.
Sapphire cards are indestructible. I still have a functional HD 4830
Yep
Agreed... XFX has served me well
I have a 7900xtx liquid devil, seems to be pretty good so far
Actually, no.
Nvidia made them to sign a statement that they can't use the same coolers for amd cards, only lower performance ones.
Thats why the gigabyte cards have less heatpipe than the same nvidia card has.
Watching this channel reminded me that in engineering school 15 years ago we basically learned that you shouldn't fix electronics. You built them, and when something broke, you threw out the board and bought another one, which because of Moore, was always the better, cheaper alternative. That always struck me as strange and wasteful, given the effort and cost, but I think nowadays the game has changed, electronics don't improve so quickly anymore and they cost a pretty penny so the economics of repairing just makes more and more sense.
Moore's law doesn't practically exist. I can ask, if it was true then wouldn't GPU's in 2024 be roughly the same size as they were in 2004? The fact that isn't the case is proof that it isn't the case. Boards are getting larger, GPU/CPU dies have also gotten larger, power consumption has also gotten so heavy that that GPU/CPUs need far more powerful coolers than they used to require as well.
People who still think Moore's law is "Real" are fooling themselves. It's a pipe dream. People can not predict the future and Moore's law is just a prediction that hasn't existed in "functional" reality. Similar to flawed theories like the Horseshoe Theory, or Labour Theory, etc. Horseshoe exist because some social scientist don't understand specific ideologies/regimes, assuming they're a polar opposite ideology vs their rival ideologies which isn't true. Labour Theory exist because people don't understand economics. Moore's Law exist because some engineer made a prediction, and that's it. No human can predict the future so it's automatically defunked.
It's actually the reason I'm not disappointed with GPUs like the 4060 or 4070 for example. I don't care about that "REQUIRED" jump in performance from Generation to Generation. We saw what that kind of push did to the 3000 series, with them across the board being hungry GPUs. AMD GPUs are the same story, they're power hungry GPUs. We saw it again with the 4090 and 4080 also being power hungry GPUs, so much so the 4090 is a nightmare GPU that breaks too often.
Issue is pushing to meet some invisible law that doesn't actually exist has pushed GPUs to insanity. They've gotten too big, too powerful and too hungry. When I saw how much smaller 4070 GPUs were from their previous generation I cheered. I predict we may see single fan 4070s in the future like we did with the 1070 and 970.
@@Alte.Kameradenyou bro do u wipe it off ur face or try and get it in your mouth
I learned a different lesson. Multiple times, I have been able to fix electrics that cost as much as a new car in the field with a soldering iron and a few components that cost less than a buck.
How much would this repair cost?
@@charlesg5085buck you 😂😂 why because that’s the equipment we in 3rd world get for cheap and we repair it and use them , it’s because of people like you we will be unable to get used/defective products for cheap and have to buy expensive shit new from greedy companies that love capitalism 😂😂
3:01 "doubting myself is what I do quite a bit in my life"
dang, that hit home ....
I'm trying to believe in myself more and stick with my decisions. So far has been the right thing to do.
I know what that's like also. This guy is amazing however. If I ever need a component repaired I know who to contact now.
Actually some quite nice little techniques. Using flux as an "adhesive" for the solderballs and then using the ultrasonic cleaner to clean that "adhesive" (flux?) and make sure that all balls are melted and stick. Also using the fingers to check for irregularities, like a missed solderballs prior to removing them. Or the makeshift coke heatshields. :D
It is the little details that show the experience and are fun to see, since those are different for everyone.
I kind of guessed some of these as well, but while watching I thought that some written explanation on the screen of what's currently going on would've been great.
Isopropyl alcohol is great for removing flux.
Used it at work with microscope to check electronic.
Just wet it with a a tops and isopropanol on the flux and after a few seconds is disappeare with all the gunk.
The flux is marketed as being tacky, it's a really sticky flux, chipquik also market theirs as such. The solder flux can grab and hold parts in place under the hot air until the solder melts and then the solder can hold it in place, that is why the solder goes from looking all goey to looking like water as it gets hot it, it holds the chip until the solder can take it from there. A little annoying to clean afterwards, but these fluxes are technically no clean, it's just nice for there not to be sticky brown gunk co'ering the GPU.
You just earned a new sub with this one! Not only the sheer amount of work it takes but also having the patience to wait for 2 months for parts just to see if your work paid off is inhuman! Hats off to you
i do not intend to be rude by saying that you are unaware of the timelines that we as third party repair hobbyists/professionals work in on the regular. 2 months (1 month of lead time per part in this case) is on the low side for specialized/in demand components. to say its "inhuman show of patience", especially with a paying customer involved, would be grossly misunderstanding just how often/normal of a situation this is for us.
@@housemana I subbed off this vid too, but I still feel for the customer that was without their card for months!
@@housemana Take a chill pill karen, i wasn't complimenting you.
Yet another card saved from the landfill. You are doing a great job. Love the work. Nice vid. Love from Norway
He's doing God's work indeed. GPU Jesus, I call him.
Even Greta Tintin Eleonora Ernman Thunberg is gonna be proud when she sees this.
@@Mandrag0ras lol
Huge respect for doing an awesome job and making content out of it while advertising it in a non annoying way and even waiting months for parts to arrive, love your work and I hope you would get much more views, u deserve more!!!
I appreciate the editing of your videos. Chill music while watching a master of his craft, without making it too slow and boring. I really hope this channel blows up.
I've just discovered this little gem. I have no doubt this channel will blow up having seen it happen on similar smallish techtuber channels over the years. northwestrepair has all the necessary ingredients:
* mesmerising skills on display ✓
* high information content that is well explained, even to novice viewers ✓
* great personality, witty humour and story telling ✓
* excellent production quality of videos ✓
So word just needs to get out a tiny bit more to reach critical mass. Until then I will just enjoy this somehat hidden gem of RUclips. 👍
27kviews in 7 hours.
He is on the right track.
If I had only had teachers like this in high school.
It did. 6 months ago this guy only had 5000 subs.
man man, I commend you for not only taking on repair challenges like this but also recording everything a explaining your thought process. On top of all that you have self learn all this, that's amazing. I can relate how difficult it was to repair just power supplies for my internship. You have earnt a subscriber.
With the bend PCBs, isnt it a bit unfair to put the blame on AMD while the PCB was manufactured by a 3rd party manufacturer (in this case MSI)?
I got both Nvidia and AMD GPUs from various generations from ASUS for example, and none of them has a bend PCB, but for example a Gigabyte GTX1060 with a twist in the PCB
This is a question I have too
not really. the chip manufacturers are the one that can specify a minimum board rigidity or layer count, etc. Nvidia is rather famous in the past for pissing off OEMs by requiring overkill, lowering their profits.
and Gigabyte 3000 series nVidia cards are apparently cracking themselves open
I agree, it definitely appears to be a board partner issue. As others have stated, other AMD board partners (Sapphire, XFX, etc.) tend to not suffer from the same PCB issues that board partners like Gigabyte (MSI as well... on top of their stupid as hell plastic backplate design) do. I'm well aware/have read plenty of people complain about coil whine from AMD's ASRock & XFX 6000 series cards, but even the 7900 XTX (AMD's founder card included) is suffering from the same coil whine issue, but luckily that's far closer to an annoyance than a detrimental issue, but still a trend nevertheless. Just got my Sapphire Nitro + 6950XT, & very much looking forward to the rest of the parts for my build to play some max settings 1440p 👍
Well the ppl doing the final sign-off on the product is AMD so they should have inspected what they were given and caught this if there was an issue. They are suppose to ensure their products are as good as they claim.
The algorithm pushed me to your channel. Nice find. Then i see a video posted not even 30 seconds ago, cool, that 360p life. But then you said some things...
1: MSi "MECH" was created during the NVidia GPP kerfuffle (along with ASUS "AREZ") in which NVidia demanded that brands stop using their high end gaming brands on the same product lines for AMD and NVidia Cards, by creating a "sub-tier" for AMD. MSi dropped "Twin-Frozer" branding on AMD for "MECH", and ASUS dropped "STRIX" for "AREZ". While ASUS publicly denied that AREZ was created because of the GPP, and quietly killed the branding, and liquidated the cards, renaming them all as ROG STRIX... MSi Kept MECH around, and positioned it as a cheaper product line. Which brings us too...
2: PCB thickness, and GPU sag is not an "AMD problem", its a cheap manufacturer problem. Flimsy PCB's with low weight G10 is a classic problem of MSi cards going back to the days when they still branded themselves as MicroStar. And on something like a MECH card, where it is positioned as a budget product, you can all but expect it as they cut corners to meet a price point. It is more than a little disingenuous to make such a statement on quality, as if AMD specifies the PCB thickness that MSi must use on their cards. That makes zero sense, but we know for a fact the fanboys will take that as a fact, considering you a trusted source.
I have owned plenty of AMD cards over the years from Sapphire, Power Color, XFX, ASUS, ASRock, Gigabyte, and MSi...and those are in the order of quality that i would rank them, highest to lowest. With both Gigabyte and MSi (including their NVidia offerings) all suffering heavily from GPU sag, even with a brace, through all of their product lines, even their higher end offerings. To the point that i wont build with MSi or Gigabyte products. Unless i am building a system for someone that specifically wants those parts. From my decades of experience in the PC industry, and running a shop, i dont even bother to sell them, it is more hassle than its worth. Most of MSi's products have extremely poor quality materials, and the MECH is the ultimate personification of cutting corners. I am surprised you didnt get one of the ones where the heatsink was dead shorting and SMD on the PCB...because that was a thing they did by doing heatsink recycling, similar to what EVGA did, but it was on cheap cards, so no one really made a big deal about it, and MSi RMA'd them rather quickly and quietly.
Also, why go to all of this work, for a GPU that can be replaced for $200??? That seems like SUCH a waste of time and money, for you, and the card owner.
I think this comes down to where in the world he lives and does the repairs, In eastern europe/middleeast or Asia, i think repairing expensive(or cheap) gpu´s may make more sence, they can get hands on repair stuff cheaper, and have a low salleri, making it much cheaper to repair than to pay for a new product. Here in scandinavia where i live, its very rare that any hardware is repaired, since its to expensive compared to the cost of a new product in most cases.
@@AdaaDK he lives in the US.
And, yes, I completely agree with @bigbuckoramma. I really like this channel, but he sometimes does say pretty stupid/illogical things.
I have also been repairing video cards for a long time (going back to the ISA bus days, for those old enough to remember), and there has never been any correlation between the quality of the chip vendor and the quality of the board partner. Even going back to cards like the S3 Virge; the Diamond Stealth/Number Nine cards were known to be built like a tank (with very good/sharp video output quality), while cheaper/no-name brands like Yakumo had poor video quality and screwed up gamma levels.
In the past 15 years or so, things have changed a bit. We now have less AIB partners and they all make both good quality and bad quality boards: it's all about the price point. A cheap, entry level model from MSI, Gigabyte, Asus, etc, will always be MUCH worse in every way compared to an upper tear model.
Since, in this video, we are talking about a VERY entry level 6600XT... that says it all. It doesn't matter that it's an AMD chip, it doesn't matter that it's MSI. You will find the same poor quality on entry level RTX 3060 boards made by Asus.
I agree with this. It was uncalled for to call AMD "cheap", only because Nvidia wanted to be monopolistic about their cards and not allow the same aftermarket models to be used for the AMD cards.
After over 500 GPUs fixed, I stand by my statement.
How many GPUs have you seen in person and actually worked on ?
Let's be fair here.
@@northwestrepair since I have been in the PC repair space since the late 90's, I have literally built thousands of systems, and repaired hundreds, if not thousands of GPU's, along with extreme OC modifications like shunts and bypasses for LN2. About the only thing I can't do, is reball.
So, yeah, let's be fair.
With the 6700 XT deals we were seeing for the past few months, I continually recommended to people that they buy the Sapphire version, as it was often only 10 dollars more than cheaper models, such as the MSI mech model (not the same model as this one, but possibly just as bad).
I have often been surprised at just how close in price Sapphire Pulse models are to other models. Sapphire Pulse model cards are routinely offering the best value with AMD cards, though I have also heard good things about SOME (but not all) Powercolor cards, and there are surely other models out there which are decent as well. Sapphire and Powercolor are the two most popular AMD exclusive partners, and Powercolor really seems to have improved a lot over the years, but they still do make some cheaper and crappier models still.
Sapphire, among other things, has popularized putting a second bios even on most of their cheaper "Pulse" branded models.
I always love to hear more from professional repair people about which specific models they think are the best, or the best value. As consumers, we should never blindly trust any brand, no matter how much we like them.
I have the sapphire pulse 6650 xt, it looks good and its temperature is super cool all the time. First sapphire card for me and can highly recommend
Power Color have even cheaper models compared to Sapphire.. I have myself Red Devil 6800XT, and all i can say that card is very good...
Poor XFX playing 3rd fiddle. Though their Merc 310 seems to be slotting close to the Nitro+ this generation at a far more palatable price with the 7900XTX
welp, recently i bought a used MSI Mech 6700xt for around USD 200, and its junction temp keeps increasing on heavy load till it crashes and not throttle. I have to undervolt gpu too keep it cool.
I'm actually looking into buying an AMD card to finally upgrade to something better than my GTX 1070. Nvidia has been rather disappointing these past few years, so I'm giving AMD a shot.
Looking to pair a R5 5600x with an RX 6700 XT or RX 6800 XT, but was never sure which brand to use. Your comments have made it easier now, so thanks! :)
I've owned many MSI video cards - and I have never seen one made this cheap. Perhaps it's because I never buy MSI's lower end card models. These lower end cards are most likely mass produced for quick/cheap sales.
Yes this is why his vedeo have 2 misleads... MSI mid range to high end are all OUTstanding builded... Also Radeon cards are WAY more durable on the soldering, compared to Ngreedia cards...
What an excuse is that? You should have know that we make a poor job?
I think I can confirm this. I replaced my old low-end MSI Radeon 5700 Mech OC with a premium MSI 6700 XT Gaming X. Whereas the MEM and hotspot temps for the old Mech OC were substantially higher than GPU temp (like 95 C vs. 70 C), the MEM and hotspot temps on the new Gaming X were much nicer. However, even with MEM and hotspot temps in the 90's, my old Mech OC has always functioned fine, albeit with a louder fan curve.
discovered this channel few days ago...jaw dropping repair, skills and video editing!!!
Wow, thanks!
thanks for posting these videos, i feel like i've learned a lot. plus it's fun to watch someone who knows their stuff dive in to a tricky troubleshoot and repair.
Man I love watching you work. I almost wish I had some broking parts to send you for repair.
I'm coming from the YT recommendations after binge watching a Polish guy do similar works and I love your work too. I'm not too much into electronics but whenever any PC building/upgrade idea crosses my mind, I delve into it full force, this time ended up going THIS deep into GPUs and I'm so fascinated with the repairs. I really like your commentary too, very concrete unlike my comment.
You got me wondering, are there any dangers in having 30 degrees difference between the core temp and hot spot temp? Like, for example, if the fan speed is based off the core temp, may the cooling end up being not enough and therefore could excessive heat in the hot spot cause some damage? Or is there nothing else to it other than it being odd?
I bought a Mech 5700 in 2019, flashed it to a 5700xt BIOS and have been gaming well ever since. Guess I'm fortunate in that mine is still straight as an arrow. Gets cleaned every 4 months and new paste every 2 years, keeps it nice and cool.
Wow, i have a 1080 that gets lucky if I dust it every 3 years. Runs like a charm though.
@@Syncopia yäll sync id pvt my 70ti ^??^ tv an 80 ti ^?^ häl at least id büy söme 6700 büt häl. nö störes in ger häve 6950 for about 620 -.-
´ill vväDe ^??^
känt öc at least 1 räm chip... wonder if the päd is ök öhr sö... bäk in Zählmähn däyz sync were ´ez€´ ^ ^
I have a R9 290x lightning I bought second hand and currently still use it daily.
Guess each brand has its unlucky models.
You didnt undevolt?, the mech cooler is so bad, you can get 3000+ rpm on hot summers. On my mech 5700xt i went from obviously bad 1.2 stock volts and ran 3 years at 1.065, was super solid and stable card, traded 100 mhz for a silent unstressed ride. I wouldnt care for 2080mhz on games if the card felt like going to explode.
I still have the single 8 pin MSI RX 5700 Mech, runs like a champ!
love the LTT reference! your vids randomly appeared in my feed. enjoying your educational content!
I liked the video, interesting about how artefacts show up differently depending on what's wrong. Hopefully the owner of that mech considers third party cooling.
Watching you fix these cards is oddly satisfying ☺ Keep up the awesome work!
I agree, the close ups are great, as well as the attention to detail when making sure everything is as perfectly lined up as humanly possible.
Wow, that's really some repair skills you have - this is the 2nd video I've watched since I've only been tinkering with soldering some new contacts for my old Mechanical Keyboard before (had half a year of apprenticeship as "Assistant Engineer" at Siemens Technical Academy in the 2000s [which I couldn't finish though] after my High-School and [back then still compulsory] Military Service.
So, at Siemens, we tinkered with some circuit boards, too, but never really got into it then (I always got defeated by "Complex Numbers" in Physics/Maths ;-P ).
But tinkering with Technology is one of my hobbies still, so I love seeing how you do all that.
What would be really interesting to me though, is what all these replacement parts cost at the time of your orders (I know they vary very much) and what the whole repair cost in the end.
I mean, all this assembling and disassembling looks very quick on fast forward and it probably is much faster when someone's trained and has been doing it for a long while/very often than when a hobby-tech-tinkerer like myself does it. But I think it would probably be interesting for many people to just give a quick overview of total repair time (even estimated / educated guess is cool with me) and costs for spare parts and overall costs for the repair.
You sound like you're doing it because you love doing it, so I take it you enjoy getting broken tech to work again.
Anyway, before I explode into a wall of text (this is nothing lol ), I cut it here.
Thanks for sharing these repair videos and giving some insights to the quality of some of the cards, too - I would hope some of the manufacturers will learn from that - or at least A.I. will in the future when it sifts through all this information when making decisions for the former human employees lol.
I have a Mech x2 and it has worked hard and still does flawlessly (GPU and Hotspot are within 4°C, I checked after watching lol ). I wonder if some of these have been abused by miners/poor airflow cases and as such have gone through major heat cycles that may cause these issues. Still that was one great video, it is a pleasure to watch someone so dedicated to doing their job. Hats off Sir, keep it up.
Sadly... you can't "abuse" poor build quality by using the GPU 24/7 like it was made to be used. If the build quality would be good none of this would happen, but sadly they are created with "faults" like this so they last X amount of time until they die and people are "forced" to buy a new one. "You get what you pay for" is as real as it gets :(
@@Helifax19 Maybe, all companies seem to be party to manufacturing obsolescence, was it ASUS that made nVidia cards that were cracking at the PCI-e slot? At least some of us have recourse via consumer protection, sadly companies will keep abusing customers until customers stop buying from bad companies.
@@Helifax19very true but then again this is MSI. The worst motherboard, GPU and case I ever had were all from MSI. This company produces straight garbage.
@@LegionShade Meanwhile me, got stuff from MSI multiple times that never failed and is actually pretty good. I'd say it's hit or miss, rather than garbage.
@@Akirasip well true. But still, after multiple misses with this brand I don’t dare to buy it anymore
Do you think it was bent from the cooler being tightened onto the PCB or just from it's own weight hanging in the slot? It's really bad for a small card like that.
That feels like alot of work for a 6600xt. I'd have thought what you are doing costs more than replacing the gpu.
my thoughts too= this guys skill is worth way more than that card.
Buying a stencil for a chip means you can start repairing more of them.
@@motmontheinternet Forget actual material costs, his time and expertise alone is worth more than the card, especially because apparently this took at least 2 months to fix from when he started, owner should have cut their losses and just bought a new one or a better one for that matter.
@@xXEPIKgamerXx No, his expertise is not worth more than the card. Neither of them knew the time to complete the work when work started, either, and sunk costs aren't a factor when thinking about the future. Spending hundreds of dollars because you're impatient is childish. It doesn't cost more to just fix the card.
@@xXEPIKgamerXx Fixing shit is satisfying and a hobby.
Great work! quick one for you my friend, what do you do when one or more spheres bridge together after the stencil? I'm losing my mind because of that....
You, Sir, are a graphic card whisperer. Love your videos!
I’ve never seen anyone pull and replace the GPU, that’s damned impressive
When looking at MSI mainboards I always think that their solder joints look kinda minimalistic and are trimmed towards maximum material savings. Other things like the solder mask being extremely thin compared to some other manufacturers is what I noticed too.
Love your videos and how you sped them up, i just wished u did some more narrating to explain all the stuff. Would surely make your channel grow. Its super interesting to watch
This man is the man and should have wayyyyy more subscribers. You will have more it’s just taking more time and work. Iam so proud of you, you came so far already!!
Looking at the clips posted on youtube by you, I really learn something! At some things, the brain gets stuck, and I look 15 more times until it lets go! Congratulations for all the repair posts about video cards! I hope you post more videos with AMD video card repairs! But what fascinates me is putting the big parts back on the motherboard: the video chip and the vram memories! God, how much work it is! And you should know that I always watch the clips on RUclips, even if I've seen them once before! And I've been looking at them forever! Even if I don't know how to do it, I prefer to see them because that's how I'll learn them!
Love your videos, glad I found you lately. MSI Armor is the same. Had horrible temps with my 1080ti, and used a NZXT G12 to properly cool it.
Do you have any tips or solutions that people can do to resolve some of these issues (asides not buying the cards)?
Well the blame is on the stupid ppl, that spend money on crap such as Mech, Armor and other from that low class, no brand will spend much effort to produce something good, for very cheap... Everyone should avoid such models, and aim at lower tier cards, with better coolers, parts and build quality..
Never thought I'd say that I chuckled during a GPU repair. Excellent video, subscribed and will be waiting for more.
Great video! Whats the soldering station and BGA rework station you are using?
I like the Mech form factor a lot, but it's been pointed out several times that most of the applications of it are extremely lacking and leave a lot of potential heat sink scenarios ...on the table, so to speak. So it's cheap for MSI to use, but they very infrequently actually make sure it's working as well as it can, which is probably why Mech is always the first to go on deep discount and is generally widely available.
Wow. I have a number of Nvidia MSI cards. My first experience with MSI Gpus was a 2070 RTX OC base model back when they first came out. It ran great for about 6 weeks, just long enough to get past the Newegg return window. But I always register my cards for the warranty, and MSI did not give me any trouble RMAing the card. I was without the card for 2 months after that, but it ran great after they fixed it. I scratched my initials in it, so I know they did actually fix it and send it back. I've had 3 other cards from MSI since then, and no problems yet. However, I am running a 4070 Gaming X Trio now, and this card has kind of a funny bend to it, but I haven't had any issues from it. To be fair, the card is huge, with a blow through cooler, and I'm using the brace that came with it, but it still has a slight bit of bend lengthwise, which is kind of unsettling. However I know the actual board is only about half the length of the GPU, for whatever it's worth.
Hello, where you get that blue stencil reball thing? Thank you for your awesome videos❤
Just found your channel - Came for the repair video... stayed for the memes. Excellent Content - Another Sub For You Sir!
i have a 6600xt msi mech x2 and i confirm the big difference between core temp and hotspot temp , varies from 15 to 30 degrees , depending on the game
Love your videos man, keep up the good work !, to bad that are not more ppl like you there, that can repair GPU's in special ! Take care !
I'm touching wood right now . I have always bought AMD cards except my very 1st and I've never had a card fail . I just bought an MSI 6800XT I hope it's good :D . Love your vids great to watch a master at work .
most of msi cards are good just ignore those junky models like mech, aero, ventus etc.
@@Gerbi92 Yes people should avoid that lower class products liek plague... But the guy made this video pissed me off, as he blame the whole Radeon division/ brand for being crap, cheap and using bad solder, and that is misleading, and ignorant on his part... In fact Ngreedia is the brand that usually uses and prob spec all their cards and force every brand to manufacture their cards with ROSH solder, while AMD cards are with the good old fashioned lid soldering, that is the reason why they fail WAY more rarely...
I've had good luck with sapphire cards. Still have an HD 7970 that still works , had Rx 590 no issues but sold it.
@@Gerbi92 are mech that bad? i just got a rx6600 mech 2x without knowing any of these problems, mine is running on idle at 33-35 C and at max load at 50-55 C, are those good values? also the hotspot has the same temps
Nice.. the reballing core and memory is always nice to see out of your videos but I bet it can try patience. Cheers!
You are an absolute legend. The amount of patience, dedication and hard work you showed me today is astounding. The least I can do is to subscribe. So many cards I deemed unrepairable... Sigh, well, we learn everyday. Greetings from Slovakia.
Impressive video as always. How do you possibly get all the pins/pads lined up properly when you reconnect the GPU and memory chips?
Not sure what you mean
I think he is asking about lining it properly when doing the solder job to get it on the board back
You don't need to be 100% accurate when positioning the BGA components. When the solder melts, the components flow into their place.
Solder sticks to the metal and avoids the PCB, the oil makes it easy for the melted solder to move into the metal contacts.
While there is specialised equipment that performs the alignment and has x-ray scanning for a human operator to visually inspect, etc, an experienced technician such as our wonderful host here can use the simple laws of physics to have all the solder on the pads collectively draw the BGA package into alignment.
I logged in just to tell you you're amazing… I never thought these cards could be worked on so easily. Where did you learn this great skill? And yes you are great at doing this is fascinating. A really cool channel you've got here my friend…
Great to see a pro in action! And great that he's a fantastic video maker as well!
I had the same card and now you make me worried 💀
Nice soda can heat guards, may i suggest keeping shiny side outwards as it will reflect more heat..
The failed ic chip was not protected during reflow, could the prolonged heat be killing it? Its close to the core, i think the airflow coming from sides of reheater device adds even more heat to that area. Maybe try a temporary heatsink+ guard next time.
Also at 12:30 thats a 30 degree difference! Great channel i have learned much from you, thanks for all you do!
nice video bud what is that white liqued you use is this ultra sonic thing?❤
Yo man i was waiting some new video since early morning and here it comes
YOU ARE BECOMING AN EXPERT IN AMD CARDS TOO.. AMAZING..
The last Nvidia card I ever bought was the 1080ti and before that the only other in the video card I ever bought was the 8,800 ultra. Other than those two cards and a 1070 TI I got for free I have always ran AMD and specifically try to get either MSI or Sapphire and I've never ran into a single issue with any of their products
Even with a high failure rate many cards won't fail. It's about odds that it might which only comes from a source seeing many samples. Another channel that fixes PCs has a high rate of AMD CPU failure in one product line.
When the market underdog has more failures guess why. Design and QA issues.
Subscribed. Can't believe what i see on this channel. Sensational! 😊
just WOW, never done any work on cards, but this video was informative, well put together/edited, and relaxing in some (weird?) way. Keep it up, ill watch all your vids from now on!
The only MSI card I've owned was a RX 480 that had odd performance issues. Was able to exchange it for Asus equivalent which didn't have those issues. Now I have an MSI motherboard that is very fussy about memory seating. Never buying MSI again.
Yeah, sadly its one of those brands I try to avoid, honestly. I have heard/seen enough things here and there to put me off.
I own a MSI RX 6700 XT MECH X2 and havent had ANY issues with anything. probably just a rare case.
If you're willing to mod your cards would it work so slather the heatpipes in solder to connect them to the aluminum fins? Obviously you'd need to be careful and make sure there's no stray solder. But just as a project I'm curious if it's viable or a terrible idea....
i never thought id watch soldering videos on yt, but you have made me think otherwise, you got yourself a new sub :)
I maybe shouldn't have watched this....this is concerning-I have an almost identical card (mines a 6650xt-I think the one in the vid was 6600xt). I picked it mostly cause I thought MSI was a good brand-the price was reasonable and I was limited by the form factor of the case. Im pretty happy with it performance-wise. Is there anything I can do to prevent issues? Just try to keep it cool? Tbh if i get a couple/few years out of it I'll probably upgrade by that point-now that prices are coming back down (Edit)-i read someone in the comments mentioned sag being a possible cause. I'll find a way to help support it👍
My exact case too! I’m unfortunate enough though to have this exact 6600xt model. It was a great deal at the time and I had the same impression of MSI. How ignorant I am. If I waited 5 months I could’ve gotten a used or even open box Nvidia rtx3070 for about the same price. I guess I need a gpu bracket lol
You just need a flat pc case and turn off the stupid zero fan rpm option. Also a more aggressive custom fan control. You will be fine. Fans are cheap to buy, but you can't replace chips, ram, pcb, cap.....etc by yourself most of the time. You can even use 2x 120mm case fan to blow it. Zero fan is nonsense imo
I use a GPU brace support that’s a little cylinder whose top part extends and holds the GPU up from the opposite side of the bracket. It was like $6-7.
@@heilaw7002 whats the easiest way to access the fan controls? Is there a way to do it without having some extra software running-I.E. something that I dont have to manually restart every time?
@@colestowing8695 Yes, it is inside the AMD Adrenalin Driver control panel, go to performance >tuning
Awesome video. I've been exclusively AMD CPU and GPU customer since 2007, exclusively Gigabyte mobos, and since a Radeon 290 Asus was artifacting badly I switched almost exclusively also to Gigabyte GPUs and been running flawlessly ever since. Had to switch back to Asus when upgrading from RX Vega 64 to RX 6800 as that was the only thing in stock nearby me. Good to know MSI should be avoided. I guess Sapphire cards should be safe and well engineered.
Gigabyte mobos are one of the very best, i had multiple of them, my current AM4 mobo and backUP system LGA1366 are both Gigabyte, and they are just fantastic... But the Gigabyte GPUs have problems.. Sure they work, BUT Gigabyte NEVER think of making some support bracket to their GPUs, that did result in sagging cards even as back as Radeon R9 280x, as there was NO support.. Same did not happen on my MSI Twin Froz R9 280x, that i used for years problem free.. The Sapphire TriXX R9 290 i have also has no proper antisag support, so it got bend as well... ASUS as brand sucks overall, their mobos tend just to die some day whit now reason at all.. Their GPUs also suck for example the higher end ASUS R9 290/x was direct swap from Ngreedia model, that resulted in bad GPU die contact with the cooler and bad temperatures... Not to mention ASUS is expensive AF, same goes to MSI (tho MSI cards the higher end are usually one of the very best), so no point buying anything asus. Gigabyte only their motherboards are good, their GPUs not as much, sure they may be better then ASUS, but still.. XFX is well made, Sapphire too, Power Color (mine is Red Devil 6800XT, and is great), MSI is also very good, but above the mid range class. For Ngreedia i cant say really, as i dont use them, everyone will say EVGA, but i am sure EVGA is not good brand, only their outstanding customer support is, but the products are average or worse..
Anecdotally= MSI has always been great for me and gigabyte, not so much....just the luck of the draw I guess.
@@i_grok_u2902 Yeah there is so much anecdotal history that is also very emotional (because of the money involved) for each and every one of us, it's hard to make a real assessment over a large population of the real quality and defects. You can have a friend that swears by the opposite of the brands you had luck with, for example.
@@themobster7284 What do you think about Asrock? Thinking about that brand for the next Radeon upgrade, they seem to stay out of scandals like these.
@@Groaznic Well i dont have exp with their GPUs, as they did become AMD exclusive partner some time after Radeon RX580 series was for some time launched, i had XFX RX580 at that time... I had problems back on AM3+ socket got brand new A$$rock 990FX Extreme 3 mobo, and that piece of s**t + the crap Corsair vengeance memory did not output signal when i did assemble the whole machine... Later on turned out to be bad contact between the memory and the mobo.. Even after that fix, the garbage asrock mobo was unstable AF, then i moved to ASUS boards, and all stability problems did go away, but there were some ram compatibility problems, as ASUS boards are VERY picky about memory modules, some times need to replace x2 kits of memory brands in order to make them work properly... Still was WAY more stable the the shitty asrock mobo...
After that i did blacklist asrock and corsair memory, as they did piss me off for good amount of time back in 2013... So i dont use A$$rock after that, and i dont use ASUS after i saw their BS with memory, and some boards that just die for no reason at all....
From what i see these days i think the Tai-Chi series A$$rock have are well made.. Still my advice is if u will buy Radeon GPU consider getting only one of these brands, Power Color, XFX, Sapphire or MSI high end such as TrioX/ SupremeX, as these brands are proven to make good GPUs, asrock on other hand is new to the market compared to them, + i still hear stuff from some people, that A$$rock bios on motherboards sucks..
this is why i rarely questioned the price mechanic asked for. such dedication and hardwork!
Love your videos man, please keep them coming !
I would love a tier list of brands from you, esp for AMD cards, (even if you dont like those in general, since it sound that way), current higher end Ngreedia prices are making it hard to pick them for some of us.
You can never go by brand alone. MSI has excellently manufactured graphics cards in the expensive segment and at the same time junk in the cheap segment.
Sapphire
Asrock
Powercolor (high end)
XFX
Powercolor (low end)
For me at least 🤷🏼♀️
Sapphire is pretty much universally hailed as the best, but the rest is up to personal preference (except for low end powercolor, that stuff is the worst. don't touch it.)
I ranked Asrock high because of good experience and them getting better and better lately
Powercolor high end has some crazy cool designs
XFX is pretty much meh
Sapphire. Its the EVGA of AMD boards.
If you worry about price go with a Sapphire pulse.
They're cheap but amazing build quality and design wise.
They're usually more power efficient than Asrock or Powercolor.
It's the best quality for price out of all AMD "low tier" cards.
If you have a little more money to spare, the high tier Sapphire Nitro+ is amazing.
The three chipmakers don't give the actual card manufactures much time or profit margin for which to build consistently high quality products, and as a result they all end up sending out duds. Even if one manufacturer is more consistent overall, you'd still need to evaluate products on an individual basis.
We watch these videos to learn something but not if you don't explain technical stuff.
Please share more about the technics that you are using, what to look for, how to perform certain actions, solution and more while you're performing the repairs.
Thanks
Great video as always.
It would be beneficial if you write on the screen what you are doing during your high speed sections of IC reballing (i.e. heating, aligning, adding flux, alcohol cleaning, etc.)
Man I'm so addicted watching your content. 🤣 Keep it up! ❤
Genuine question: How can something like this happen?
I mean, it's quite the small card and I bet, it's pretty much lightweight as well.
This can't be GPU sagging like what happens with the big Nvidia cards, right?
I think it’s warping from the card going from hot to cool during its life
I would recommend PowerColor(best value) or Sapphire(more expensive) for AMD cards.
As for NVidea, I'd go with Gigabite Gaming OC cards as they are best combination of price and performance. MSI cards always seem to have cooling issues and run hotter while ASUS is too damn expensive.
I agree, but still, I always buy Rog Strix cards... :-D
Love Sapphire cards, wish they made Nvidia GPUs as well
Thank you, I was hesitant about whether to buy the MSI 3060 Mech or not, but I came across this video at just the right time. You helped me avoid a big risk.
Really wish you would have put this out a week ago before I bought this card lol. Thank you for the thorough rundown!
I'm rather surprised (and impressed) you decided to take on resoldering the core and memory on such a cheap GPU , would have thought it would take too much time for a $200 card.
MSI are generally good (I'm a happy 2080ti Gaming X Trio user) - but their Mech/Ventus models are cheap trash as you've explained well and I'd not touch them with a bargepole.
Yea. Brands always love to appeal to different budgets. And always love screwing over customers with cheap practices. I have a Suprim X 3070Ti and it has been incredible. And quite cool. Can't even get it over 70C. But damn does it dissipate some heat because the VRAM modules are also on the heatsink. That GPU is a space heater for 2 or even 3 rooms. MSI is not the only one.
A lot of AiBs love to go cheap with their AMD cards too. Something super fishy going on here and they have an extreme nVidia bias that needs stopped, and they need their ass chewed about it.
@@fulgerion I'm not a massive fan of gddr6x and the 3070ti is a perfect example , consumes so much power that the card isn't much more efficient than my overclocked 2080ti (330W) .
@@fulgerion p.s you're right about aibs being cheap with Radeon designs , Asus bodged their strix cooler onto a 5700xt after doing the same with Vega (along with Gigabyte on that occasion) . MSI only have one cooler design for rdna3 and it's a bodged "classic" cooler they used with Ampere. Quite impressive how they come up with new designs for Nvidia cards and have the hand me downs for Radeon.
MSI as a whole is not a bad company. Majority of their video cards are good. I don't use their cards but multiple friends of mine have useed them for years.
Unsoldered heat pipes are terribly inefficient. If MSI uses them, then i can't trust their cards.
@@sepg5084 tust me better than asus
damn 10k subs in a few day! thats awesome, im excited to see the growing comment section with all the extra people, great title too btw
What brand would you recommend for gamin computer nowdays ?
Motherboard and the gpu combo.
Near the end, you said, "and we all thought that MSI was a good brand."
LOL
Well, not all of us!
Personally, from the very beginning, I've NEVER EVER liked nor trusted MSI anything.
Their failure rates on too many products was always high. So I NEVER used their products at all.
I used to avoid them back in the days of Microstar, they had reputation for making cheap junk. I think now they are much better, at least for some product lines.
I’ve always had the feeling that MSI is a bit of a sketchy brand. Their motherboards like the Mortar and Tomahawk seem good, but their cards have always felt inferior to me. I don’t know why, but it’s just the feeling that I’ve got from them.
Like almost every other brand, they have their entry-level range (MECH), lower mid-range (Ventus), higher mid-range (Gaming X) and also flagship (Suprim X). It's really a case of "you get what you pay for". Their MECH line is part of their entry-level GPUs, mostly fitted to budget PC builds. Their Suprim X range however is a different story when it comes to build quality, aesthetics, gaming/thermal/acoustic performance.
They make solid nvidia cards tbh, but not the same can be said about all amd cards, they make them just to be a partner, from nvidia they earn more so why they would care about amd more then now.
@@pentecost_ Very true. That makes a lot of sense. Their Suprim cards do look quite nice.
Quick question, is there a specific use for the Gumout Carb /Choke cleaner @ 0:22 as opposed to electrical contact cleaner?
Thanks for all the info you provide!
Your editing style and videos are incredible. Would love to learn how to fix GPU's myself, congratulations on the views recently! 😊😊
Well it's not really AMDs fault for bad AIB design i rather lay the blame on either the user or MSI, otherwise great video!
Well dont blame amd for msi bad job.
Pure mastery! Well done man! Here's to a 100k Subs in no time!
Please tell us how much this repair cost, on expesive top end gpu I understand they would accept the repair price but 6600xt isnt that expensive of a card
So glad i use my card to do video editing and rendering, meaning AMD cards are useless to me and i don't need to deal with their Junk , never had an MSI Nvidia card fail on me
Haha, the low end Mech and Ventus cards from MSI are equally crap. It's misleading for this youtuber to blame AMD for MSI's junk components that are also junk on their Nvidia cards too.
not amds fault MSI made a crappy cooler
that was really cool. I didn't know you could repair a GPU like that. Subbed.
Hi, thanks for the upload. This style of "6600 XT MECH 2X 8G OC" Heatsink is just not great at cooling. I've had about 10 of these come through, and the hotspot temps are always relatively high and fans spin quite fast and loud. However, the "OCV1" variant uses the RX 5500 XT previous generation style heatsink, and while these are solid aluminum and not finned aluminum, they cool MUCH better and the fans are much quieter.
Also this particular card was in warranty with MSI, so it's possible headache could be avoided, though it's up to the customer if they still want to go through with paid repairs.
new sub here too. Love your work, lots of good info and hard work on your part.
glad to see your channel is growing cheers!
Great work. What is the name or brand of that mini ultrasonic cleaner that you used to clean the chips , does it have temperature control as well please?
Dunno about his, but Hornady makes a small sonic cleaner that's intended for gun parts but could clean anything.
Can you sent me the model number to study it please thank you in advance.
Awesome video! I got a MSI 5700XT Mech OC without doing my research back in the day and safe to say, it'll be my last buy from MSI(ridiculously loud and hot). Also had two mobo's from them that refused to boot, but atleast they gave my money back after the 2nd.
Didn't expect those huge design oversights on that heatsink!
These repair videos are fascinating. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Would really like to see you do a video about the tools you have and how you use them, maybe a multi-part series?
Excellent video!! I have a 6700 XT Mech card. It's fairly new and I use it with my kids gaming machine. She's been telling me that the fans are always running full blast on the card when playing games like Fortnite. I looked at Adrenaline and noticed the junction temp and gpu temp are roughly 20 degrees different. And since the fan curve is apparently basing its temps on the junction temp, all I could really do is lower the curve to neutralize the plane taking off in there. It's a great card in terms of FPS, but runs too hot. Now I at least have some perspective on why that is thanks to you. Subscribed!
You just earned my sub for doing such a marvellous job man! kudos!
Hello sir, love your work! You seam to have some brand that you don't like. From your experience which are the most serious manufacturer for gpu?
I dont know much about repairing electronic stuff, but for sure you're entertaining to watch even if I dont understand a bit of the technical parts.
I have just started learning how to replace larger BGA chips. What temp do you typically preheat the board to? I am having trouble getting the chips to settle into place property.
Its really fun to watch you fixing gpu especially for me who wanted to learn how to fix diy
The worst defect I had from RX 5600XT from MSI, is the improper placement of VRM thermal pads.
And I had an MSI GF65 Thin 10Ue 201 (made for and marketed to the US). And there was quite a bit of problem with it regarding to the EC Firmware (did pointed it out to MSI and they had it fixed, so that is no longer an issue). Then Intel managed to fix part of the VRM overheating problem. And I believe the heatsink dried up, which trying to use K5 Pro to cool the VRM down with the heatsink had been unsuccessful after a few hours later.
I had eventually caused a short by using too much K5 Pro. Which it is my fault. And the short is affecting the display power. So, a lot of the problems was on MSI end until the K5 Pro.