Silver Bullets! Winchester Silvertip .38 Special+P VS .380 ACP - Ballistic Gel Test
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- Testing the 'New'* .38 Special+P 125 gr Winchester Silvertip in my 2" Taurus 605 VS the .380 ACP 85 gr Winchester Silvertip in my S&W Shield EZ 3.68" in a 10% Clear Ballistics gel test. *Winchester Silvertip .38 Special+P 125 gr JHP previously was called the Winchester Super X Silvertip .38 Special+P 125 gr JHP. Always appreciative of any channel help :) www.patreon.co...
When I chronographed that older box of Super-X Silvertip 125 gr+P through my 1.875" S&W 342PD I got an average velocity of 824 FPS. Back then I was just doing a piece of thin carpet into water jugs (no bologna at that point yet). It stopped in the 3rd gallon of water and expanded. I didn't measure the bullet but I am guessing from the footage about .60" expansion.
Dude, your accuracy, to time on target…when you were not going for that…was pretty decent!
To heck with the naysayers!
So glad I found your channel!😊
Thanks for watching. When I do 12 yards I barely get a front sight picture. But I been training this way for a long time. My ultimate goal is to be proficient with no sight picture at all. I feel like this could save me some day.
Sam is a very good shot. I was good at one time but I got old and don't practice much now.
this dude needs a radio show - love his voice !
Looks like you’d be better off with a 158g LRN 38 special than a silver tip. 380 isn’t great either. Thanks for all the good videos.
I currently have the ole 158gr LRN standard pressure rounds loaded in all 3 of my 38's. Two snub- 2" barrels and one 4" barrel. I have an assortment of 38 Special rounds. But I just like the heavy, slow slug.
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@@shadowwolf9503 , Me too. I just find it easy to shot the same round at the range and carry the same round. I feel confident I’ll hit what I’m aiming at and that I’ll deliver the intended effect.
Run 380 fmj. Most 380 hollow points are a waste of money. The 38 didn't expand so might as well use fmj as well.
12 inch steel at 45 yards was my best snubnose performance from a very heavy pull SW. Never tried beyond that I was happy.
Sweeeet! I've been curious about that 125 grain +P silvertip for months, but I've been too busy to get around to doing this test. Thanks Gun Sam! (You saved me $30 bucks.)
Thanks for watching!
I gave up on 380 hollow points. I just carry FMJ now. 🤠
The Silvertip is a better bullet than many people give it credit for.
Great video. From information that I have seen, the 380 is used in more than self defense shootings. According to law enforcement agencies it's because over half of self defense shootings women are involved along with older people. The 380 is their weapon of choice. So According to the numbers the 380 is getting the job done.
Winchester "Silvertips" were originally developed specifically for werewolf hunting. They were so effective that werewolves are nearly extinct. Winchester kept the Silvertip in the lineup because they are effective on other game also (who knew?) and, y'know...just in case.
Your chances of being attacked by a werewolf are very low. But never -0-.
Always good to know the history behind the different rounds!
Several decades ago, my old Department went to silvertips. The performance was rather disappointing then and it seems the 38's still have an issue with expansion. We went to the new black talon until the media vilified them and made them a political and social nightmare. After that it was gold dots IIRC. It has been almost 30 years since I retired.
The media is so dumb. Even now days the younger LE are just as much of a sucker. My girlfriend had a city police officer take her gun because he claimed she was concealing without a permit though she wasn't. He saw her ammo which was basically just JHP ammo and said it was "cop killer" ammo, which is technically ass backwards seeing as a vest would easily stop the .38 Special new production Winchester Ranger 125 gr JHP ammo that was in it. Now we are suspecting these were dirty cops and they just stole her gun because the department and prosecutor have no record of this happening and she's without her gun. We really have no idea how to go about solving the issue because it happened when she was alone and she didn't take the officer's name. It's like the incident never happened.
GunSam - If there was no arrest and not even any record of the incident it sounds like the cop, if he really was a cop, just stole her gun. She should file a complaint and try to ID him if she was completely legal when it happened. Maybe he was a criminal impersonating an officer. How did he know she was carrying concealed?
@@GunSamI can't stand hearing stories like that. He's the real criminal. I'd definitely report it unless you are afraid of backlash in whatever area you live in.
Winchester Silvertips have never been "bad" ammo.
In rifle calibers and larger bores, they often work very, very, well.
For example, I carried .40 S&W 155 grain Silvertips for over a decade and never had any performance complaints or heard of any from anyone else.
It's more the fact that handguns in general are tricky, velocity dependent, critters.
Go too short in the barrel length department?
The Silvertip bullet underperforms.
Neither of these cartridges he tested were +P or had anything other than what quantifies as American "standard" velocity.
Which is kinda sub par when compared to ammo loaded to "standard" velocity in other countries.
For example.
A lot of European "standard" velocity ammo would be rated as +P in the U.S..
So, I'm not too surprised when American ammo underperforms and ammo with otherwise very nice HP bullets, proves underwhelming or behaves poorly.
Thank you for the great work you are doing!
What an awesome Test Sam !! Only the Best !!
Thank you. Too bad no Silvertip .327 Federal. Seems like a good caliber/weight for the Silvertip design. Maybe I should hand load pulled bullets from the .32 ACP silvertip ammo lol
@@GunSam that would be an incredible video !!!!!!
Winchester has 4 different cartridges in .32 caliber, and all of them are listed as "target" ammo, except for .32auto. No .32 H&R and no .327 Fed. Comon' Winchester.
@@exothermal.sprocket Off the top of my head, I think the only main manufacturers (outside of Underwood, BB, Corbon etc) that make .327 Federal are Federal, Speer and Hornady. Even Remington needs to step up their .32 game.
@@GunSam I've been a little skeptical about .30 Super Carry. But it's basically a shrunken 9mm offering the same ballistics as a .32 H&R mag, or better, in a very common semi-auto platform. What's your take on it?
accurate 38
GS. Good and interesting video. As always, thanks for sharing and take care.
Thank you, take care.
22 magnum silver tip worked out good in your test, reminds me more of a soft point as that tiny hollow point mushes usually rather then expand normally in short barrels, any 30 grain varmit load in my ruger lcrx 1 7/8 inch snub a fire ball and loud enough to wake up the dead as its intended for a rifle barrel , i think it can spook someone away because how loud it is, it draws attention indoor or outdoor ranges, its good to know super penetrating options
I thought we were friends Sam, please stop perpetuating the usage of silver bullets; not all of my kind are bad. Don't be a Speciast
Chukes Outdoor's has been working on silver bullets for some time now . Not sure where he is on it . Custom cast ??
As a teen…Michael J. Fox might disagree.😜
That's it. That mask is going on a bob punching target in my range. "Werewolf just transformed, for illustration purposes let's call this werewolf "Dan" for the time being".
@GunSam that would be hilarious....plz go ahead. I'm still hoping for Can even Random 40 perform? and Best Carry Caliber for Robust Winter Wolfman Attackers?. Remember to always save a few atleast of the better stuff for various Vids
@@DanTheWolfman I would be doing huge Chris Farley air quotes. "Let's call him Dan" "Dan from Detroit". I sometimes lose track of various tests like the .40 S&W tests. I know there's a few rounds of ammo of various kinds you sent left, like the Corbon ones with the blue tips which I am curious about, fluted polymers ones too. We will have to iron out exactly how a test should be as my mind is slow today.
Fine vid Sam. Thanks Man!
great videos Sam
I’ll take 38 plus p over 380 any day . But after the 6th rd the 380 in the beretta says I still got 8 left . For most situations I believe 6 rds of 38 plus p is adequate. Or just carry two 38s .
Yeah, my reload for my 38 revolver - is another loaded 38 revolver. Much faster than trying to reload the one that goes dry.
@@shadowwolf9503 also add another theatrical element . When a criminal finds out it was BOGO
@@RichiesHouse You'll have to excuse me, but I'm ole timer. What exactly does BOGO mean ? I'm not hip to all this modern lingo.
@@shadowwolf9503 “buy one - get one “
Thanks, good evaluation.
You should check out the 1776 .380 loads. Ive been very impressed with those. They are a flat nose and made of a sintered type material. Best penetration through sheet metal ive seen and 100 percent function in my lcp.
I have a couple boxes of the 125 grain silvertips in my reserves. If and when I use them they will be in a revolver with a 4” barrel. Which I think they were designed for.
Well, I'm glad the 125 gr+p .38 silvertips are back ... but I'm less than thrilled with their performance here. Not terrible by any means, and they certainly get to the vitals without being a for sure down-range hazard. I have a supply of older silvertips and Federal Nyclad 125 and 158 +ps. I think I'll stick to the silvertips for now, eventually replacing them as I shoot up older carry ammo with more modern stuff.
I had the original .380 slivertips back in the late .80s and after cycling through the action once, the bullets would get loose and if you chambered them again, the bullet would wind up pushed back down into the case. I think the new ones might be better in this regard. Not happy with that shallow penetration, though.
I remember back in the '80s and '90s gun scribes trying to convince us that .380 and .38 +p were about equal. No, I think I'll stick with my .38 snubby most days. :) Great video as always!
Velocity I got with these .38 Special was near identical to the older Super X Silvertips. Only a difference if I recall, of about 5 FPS average. And the older one was in a J-frame and not this 605, so that's pretty good consistency.
I think the .380 is an inherently low penetrator round to begin with , and you're better off using FMJs' . As for the .38 , I know many think it's "just marginal" , but its performance never seems to disappoint . That Silver Tip penetrated 16" in bare gel , and that's more than enough according to the FBI . Between the two , I'll take the .38 any day of the week . Great Test , Gun Sam and THANKS !
38spl hoje e sempre!
Abraço!
That’s my ammo! It kills vampires, werewolves, and zombies and stuff😅
my 3 favorite bullet company's are so far behind
missouri bullets i think are doing the may orders another company 14-16 weeks behind,another company afew months behind.i contacted hunter supply and they use a special clear coating advertising checked at 2000fps with no gas checks. i ordered 452dia cast 250 gr hp and 355dia 95 gr cast hp .working up loads for 45colt then ill test my 380 pistols.if they get the expansion and penetration i require then were friends .I'm also going to try.berrys hhp hp, I've seen some awesome expansion test for them .the prices are pretty good
Papa wishing you well
If I recall correctly you got more energy and better performance from the 110 grain standard pressure silver tip than you got from the +p version ......
Yeah, a little bit.
👍😊 it’s tough to get a little bit of expansion on tho two rounds.
Just thinking it'd be super cool if you included BB calibration of your gel in some of your videos. It'd be really useful to see, as far as the "real word" values of your penetration results.
one test of curiosity could still be done, pectoral muscle is one test with mdf but the sternum test gel would be no more then 1 inch, a friend of mine is 400 lbs and no more then 1 inch in front of sternum, since i would be aimimg center of mass hitting sternum, there would be differences in results maybe, because of the differences in gel thickness like a direct sternum shot vs a pectoral, someone firing a few shots in defence may hit one or both but a direct sternum shot for mdf is a test someone should try, with mdf sternum shot maybe bullet will delay expansion making 380 go deeper if we tried a test like that, depending on person the heart can be 2 inches from sternum plus 1 inch fat so that gives us 3 inches to hit the heart, so a broad side shot we may not get 12 but front sternum shots even 8 your probably through the heart wich will then drag fragments of bone into heart, even a fmj will do this, give it a tumble key hole like even a 45 grain 22 lr you could have a 40 to 50 cal keyhole with bone fragments, especially more then one shot or mag dump that heart looks like wisconsin swiss cheese
With 380 you might as well use fmj. Not heavy enough to get expansion and enough penatration.
Hey, both of these were my rounds of choice for my Glock 42 and Taurus 856!
...I'm very disappointed
I already know that the light weight 380 if it gets expansion it won't penatrate more than 10in.
What really surprises me is that the 380 ACP had more energy than the 38 Special. I think Winchester would have done better if they made the 38 in 110gr and gave it more energy.
Thanks for the warning, I'll pass on both.
Why is the revolver called peanut butter ?
Because it got not JAM
What type Chronograph do you use I'm looking for a good one?
Out of all the .38 special ammo you've tested out of a 2in barrel, what round impressed you the most?
There was a video of a robbery, the robber was shot in the heart, but he was still able to fire off some rounds back but he did die 2 minutes later and he was shot with 380. I often think about this because id rather have penetration of the 38, it wouldve pierced his heart better. Thankfully the store clerk was fine but shook I imagine
Sometimes those are just anomalies. Like 4 of 100 times a bad guy got shot with a full house .357 Magnum and just stood there, leaving the defender baffled.
I need some suggestions on carry ammo for .380 out of a ruger lcp max. I haven't seen any test results of a round that really stood out as good,
Watch Sam's video of the Federal Punch he posted just last week. There's one. His video of the Federal Hydrashok low recoil is another one to consider. They both expand and penetrate adequately. And there are a few others: XTPs when pushed over 1000 fps, Defiant Munitions 80 gr Copper HP. Underwood and Buffalo Bore load some HPs that are good. And don't forget the Xtreme Defender and similar designs.
These jammed in my shield EZ every 2-3 rounds would fail to eject. Haven't bought them since. Everything else runs fine lol.
I get what you are saying. Sometimes that just happens. No two firearms are ever exactly alike, even same make and model and why it's customary to test you carry ammo. My biggest pet peeve is people being like "that 9mm ammo jammed in your G2C, never has in mine" as if malfunctions are impossible if a certain ammo ran fine in their gun lol
@@GunSam It's kind of ironic actually because I am either carrying underwood +P or Federal HSTs and the HST is pretty much the same shaped round but it runs just fine. I found a handful of these silvertips after running hornady, underwood, federal, norma, and aguila through it without malfunctions and they jammed twice just in the handful(less than a mag) that I had fired. They would jam cartridge sticking up in the slide more often than not otherwise the slide would just jam up and not edject it. I almost wonder if they were slightly too wide. With the Shield EZ that last round likes to poke straight up sometimes, anyways so I found it curious.
Can you do a short barrel 22 Winchester mag with hollow points Vs flat nose projectiles or a short barreled 22 Winchester mag Vs 380 full metal and hollow just want to see how it would compare
All I really have in .22 Mag is my 3" LCR and 2 and something Heritage Barkeep
Better get out th 44 for the Zombes .
the silver tip .38spl +P showed very poor performance in comparison to other rounds you've demonstrated. it's clearly not ideal for pocked carry imo. as for the .380 round, I wouldn't stake my life on it
Early comment before I finish the video: I like that you use the S&W EZ for this test. I think it gives a "best chance" for .380s. If they do well in it they might do well in a micro-mini gun like an LCP, but if they don't do well then there's no way they'll perform from a micro. If they open well and penetration is just a couple inches short with the EZ, I'd guess we might make up for that with a micro. Anyway, my thoughts, for what that's worth. :)
Ruger SP101 has a 2.25 inch barrel. You should get one for this test LOL.
I used to have that revolver.
S&W model 60 is almost the same, at 2.125"
My 3rd time making this comment. Hence the way it's spelled. I haven't fully watched the vid, but Im going to say three eighty would be my choice. It really sucks how hard it is to find and how expensive. Thirty eight special isn't much easier to find.
They didn't nuke it this time! Can't use the numbers I guess.
RUclips has been giving me trouble as well. I often comment on friend's YT's and go back later to see if they replied, and my comments are gone. And these are people who wouldn't deleted my comments. I have also replied to people before and go back on my videos and see their comments are still there, but my reply to a comment on my own video that I made, is gone. It's really weird and don't know what is going on.
So the 38 special actually did perform well and the 380 failed miserably?
I don't think either of them did very well. I do think energy dump is crucial for ability to stop a threat, but with energy numbers like we saw with these two, I would say in this case penetration trumps rapid expansion/under penetration.
I agree, 380 just doesn't quite perform at plus p 38 spl levels. Interesting results, thanks.
Big fail on both of these. ☹️I was really rooting for the silvertips!
These two pistols with their respective loads would make great carjacking prevention tools carried in a cross draw holster. Along with a primary strong side carry of course. 👍🫡🇺🇸
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Gun Sam _Revolver: Wherewolf Hunter.
What's funny is people always talk silver bullets for fun, the one person I saw make one, it shot terrible as silver it too hard for rifling. I thought to myself, why can't it still be pure silver with an exposed silver tip, but be side poly coated like Nyclad or Federal poly coating, or even a .355" silver core coated in .003 of lead for a .38 Special load?
@GunSam stop it Sam, just stop it. Please don't make me call my old Lycanthrope group up in da Mitten
Kentucky Ballistics shot some 100% silver bullets not long ago. He was careful to recover them. hahaha
Horrible ammunition no matter the caliber.
Both were disappointing