As a requirement, no. When there's nothing to do, yes. Although allowing players to *choose* which they prefer : - to run a dungeon faster because they dps more - To run a dungeon faster because they heal more/have a better mana sustain
1000000% take away healers dpsing. Add more consistent incoming damage that doesn't spike to instant deaths during raids. 5 mans they need to increase the aoe damage for eveey class to make it more even and then let healers focus on healing.
Its frustrating because I know they will just make dps trinkets bad for healers and not add interesting/useful healing trinkets in their place. I'm willing to put money on the fact healers will still use dps trinkets despite the change.
They will. Healer trinket design is ... realy bad. You will never use 80% of them. You can chove between dps trinket or if you want more balanced trinket you get some stat stick.
@@0Nekromancer0it fucks with the balancing for them cause some classes scale more from trinkets, you may see more neltharion style trinkets, I’ve always been a way when dps get dps one healer get heal ones etc etc,
Aren't they meant to be making healers more fun to play? Healers have the hardest role and now they removing our dmg? Are they trying to drive us away?
I'd love to see some healer specific dps trinkets. Like - Overhealing damages enemies around the target Or - Store healing done into a damaging burst. Reduced damage beyond 5 targets Kind of things.
Healers doing less damage is fundamentally good as long as we're able to use that time to actually be a healer again. The problem with healing trinkets being good, is they quickly become mandatory for high keys (aka rageheart on every person). I think blizz forgot that healers like to feel like they are needed throughout the whole dungeon and not just to prevent a one shot with a cooldown and go back to DPS. My solution - cap initial hit damage and just make stuff apply different types of rot damage. Make more stuff unavoidable so we get to actually heal again and if we're good at it, we can find ways to add damage while healing.
Thats the reasons i loved healing during shadowlands healer dps was high and because of it felt good to press offensive ability. In DF we barely do 20% of what 1 dps do with full dps build and dps trinket. We are just here to do the healing check and then feels useless until the next one unfun tbh
I think we are being trained with Remix for big changes in the way we socket & gem. I wouldn't be surprised that the way we are doing things in Remix continues into the way we do things in Retail
The amount of changes to healers and their dps just tells you Blizz have really no clear idea or direction on what to do with healing. Do they want consistent healing output? Dealing with spike dmg? Or to have healers more like support dps that can occasionally heal? Just made up ur mind Bliz.
@@WickedFlamezZ I agree on that, thats why Blizz should make the decision on how they want healing to look like and take it one direction. Some players will not be happy, but it is better then this constant changes. Personally I'm ok either way.
Healers having time to DPS means a lot of healing downtime, which leads to scattered one shot mechanics and damage spikes aimed to kill the group, which I absolutely hate. I'm not against healers dpsing I just want to move away from current DF m+ scenario.
this is probably the worst change, good healers should know when a hard time is up coming and be able to prep. not everything needs to just be 100% healing output or the group is ded. doing this takes away any meaningful damage that healers bring and it just feels terrible. and will relegate us to affix duty cuz we cant bring anything meaningful damage wise. healers need to have more impact in dps on m+ as its the game mode of getting to the end as fast as possible. and the healer with the best dps is next to always taken as the best. as generally we are all equal in healing but never in damage.
More impact? Brother we already did every affix other than sanguine (unless they have knockbacks too). Ironically the best and most complained about healing fight was the 3rd boss in halls of infusion. It's literally the only pure healing boss in the expansion. Consistent simple mechanics and high constant damage allows us to just heal for once and it's fantastic. I would rather focus on healing and adding damage where I can instead of what we have now.
Im fine with it honestly. If they also ease the overall difficulties of playing a healer, its ok. But from a class fantasy standpoint, im not sure about it. 😊
I rather use healing trinkets and do more damage with my abilities. Also i would not mind it if they get rid of aug evokers and give healers some support stuff instead.
I can absolutely see why this would frustrate people. Because is it really hurting anything? But at the same time I can see how this new trend of being max damage as a healer is hurting a lot of the other specs that don't have as high of damage. And instead of balancing every single spec around that, they would rather just make it to where healers don't really benefit that much from those sort of things. I can understand both sides absolutely. I feel blizzard is making the right choice though. I think we need to retain the fantasy of a healer being a healer. And a tank being a tank. DPS should always be higher. A tang should always be tankier, and a healer should always be healing the most. Does it should figure out more intuitive and more fun ways for healers to be doing something rather than trying to do damage
blizzard hasnt shown they want to make healing better... just nerfing dps... ill still used dps trinket over healing trinket f damage profiles still look like dragonflight
Healers not being able to dps is partly why the role can feel miserable. Really wish WoW moved on from having "healers" and would just have "support" specs instead like in Mobas or Overwatch. AKA Specs that leans into healing/buffing/CCing but aren't completely useless damage wise.
Nerfing the damage of the trinkets without making interesting healing trinkets is just incredibly lazy. Make good healing trinkets and I will want to use them instead of damage trinkets. Not to mention that healing trinkets are just in general going to be bad for m+ because any healing over the amount to keep your party alive is just wasted globals.
Healers having to worry about pumping dps is a dumb design. That’s what makes classic so good each role has its legit purpose. Making healers focus on healing isn’t a bad thing.
Remove all healing from NON HYBRID and NON HEALERS specs... POINT! DK = no healing DH - no healing Mage - no healing WArrior no healing Rgoues \hunters etc etc etc etc ONLY HEALERS SHOULD BE ABLE TO HEAL. Value of a tank and healer should be restored. Also value of a tank witout healer should be restored too. I mean tank could MITIGATE damage. But tank should not be able to TOP UP his HP himself. CCs DPS should have 90% of all CCs in game. So value of CCs will go to DPS. And all will be good then. Only two ways. Let everyone do everything. Healers tank dps and heal and dps tank and heal and tanks dps tank and heal. Or Tank - tanking dps damage+ CC healers - heal
Healers should heal. Dps should dps. Tanks should tank. I think its horrible design when you have the trinity yet a tank can do all 3. FF14 has this same problem. But that games more story reliant and community based than actually about combat.
Oh nice....now the game will be very boring and we cant solo shit anymore out in the world. Retarded change caused by carebears that cant do two things .. Why not add more builds that you can damage and do healing like Monk amd disc? Community sucks in this game.
Honestly I think the trinket nerf for tanks and healers is fine and warranted. There's already so, so much competition for the best trinkets for DPS players. Reducing the competition for those is a really good thing imo. I don't think it's a change necessarily targeted at lowering healer/tank DPS and more about just making damage trinkets more accessible.
all our damage this season is comming from trinkets. healers do fuck all. this is literally a direct nerf to healer damage. plus healer trinekts are straight up dog water. and provide little to no benifit most of the time. our CDs are able to handle most if not all the healing checks.
@@athier5898 And maybe they're planning to change that. Or maybe they literally just don't want us doing that much damage. I personally really miss the Shadowlands season 1 hpal days where we'd absolutely crush the meters especially during Blust but ultimately wherever Blizz takes the game is what we have to adapt to. Plus, judging from a lot of comments sections I see, a lot of healers get really butthurt when even the mere *suggestion* of them doing damage during downtime comes up.
@@_alex_y.not_ i hope they plan to change that. but also those healers that say that generally are the healers you dont want in your keys. they dont understand that m+ is just the game mode where you want damage in some form (even if its small). i dont want to be relegated to affix duty just cuz my damage is ass :/
I never enjoyed dps as a healer. . if a healer has time to dps then the encounter isnt difficult enough. you don't see dps being required to heal if it was possible.. I think they need to get away from this in the trinity healers heal. tanks tank dps does damage.
they did this in s1 and s2 of DF. and it was fucking terrible. and literally the worst time to be a healer. to be a good healer you need to know when to heal, not just heal with out any mind. so if dps can keep them selves alive you as a good player should focus on dps. and these trinkets allow us to actually have some meaning impact. this is probably the worst take in god dam existence and is a cancer on this community.
@@athier5898 It was terrible because they failed with the numerical aspect of our HP, making every spell a one shot threat. So yes, they should do the same as season 1 but give us the tools to top off people, because spot healing is just sh*t af.
@yassimchenard243 since when have you seen a fight where the tank/ dps isn't taking damage? Always standing in some damn thing or busy not using personal defensive. Not to mention as a healer you have to keep the group alive, dps, handle the affixes, and dispels. When I play dps its like taking a vacation.
Do you enjoy DPS as a healer? 🤔
Yes, something to do when there is nothing else to do
As a requirement, no.
When there's nothing to do, yes.
Although allowing players to *choose* which they prefer :
- to run a dungeon faster because they dps more
- To run a dungeon faster because they heal more/have a better mana sustain
Only when I literally have nothing else to do. Nerfs to dps trinkets are fine, I just hope the healing trinkets are interesting.
No
1000000% take away healers dpsing. Add more consistent incoming damage that doesn't spike to instant deaths during raids. 5 mans they need to increase the aoe damage for eveey class to make it more even and then let healers focus on healing.
Its frustrating because I know they will just make dps trinkets bad for healers and not add interesting/useful healing trinkets in their place. I'm willing to put money on the fact healers will still use dps trinkets despite the change.
They will. Healer trinket design is ... realy bad. You will never use 80% of them. You can chove between dps trinket or if you want more balanced trinket you get some stat stick.
@@0Nekromancer0it fucks with the balancing for them cause some classes scale more from trinkets, you may see more neltharion style trinkets, I’ve always been a way when dps get dps one healer get heal ones etc etc,
Aren't they meant to be making healers more fun to play? Healers have the hardest role and now they removing our dmg? Are they trying to drive us away?
I'd love to see some healer specific dps trinkets.
Like - Overhealing damages enemies around the target
Or - Store healing done into a damaging burst. Reduced damage beyond 5 targets
Kind of things.
I think it's sad they're nerfing the trinkets tbh. I love, especially the tome trinket. I love dpsing in between the fights.
Healers doing less damage is fundamentally good as long as we're able to use that time to actually be a healer again. The problem with healing trinkets being good, is they quickly become mandatory for high keys (aka rageheart on every person). I think blizz forgot that healers like to feel like they are needed throughout the whole dungeon and not just to prevent a one shot with a cooldown and go back to DPS. My solution - cap initial hit damage and just make stuff apply different types of rot damage. Make more stuff unavoidable so we get to actually heal again and if we're good at it, we can find ways to add damage while healing.
Thats the reasons i loved healing during shadowlands healer dps was high and because of it felt good to press offensive ability.
In DF we barely do 20% of what 1 dps do with full dps build and dps trinket. We are just here to do the healing check and then feels useless until the next one unfun tbh
Great change, get healers back to healing and outside of throwing out a few dots I think it's a good change.
I think we are being trained with Remix for big changes in the way we socket & gem. I wouldn't be surprised that the way we are doing things in Remix continues into the way we do things in Retail
The amount of changes to healers and their dps just tells you Blizz have really no clear idea or direction on what to do with healing. Do they want consistent healing output? Dealing with spike dmg? Or to have healers more like support dps that can occasionally heal? Just made up ur mind Bliz.
The players don’t know what they want. Brother there’s hundreds of posts of every patch about healers shouldn’t have to DPS
@@WickedFlamezZ I agree on that, thats why Blizz should make the decision on how they want healing to look like and take it one direction. Some players will not be happy, but it is better then this constant changes. Personally I'm ok either way.
@@WickedFlamezZThe players absolutely know what they want.
Healers having time to DPS means a lot of healing downtime, which leads to scattered one shot mechanics and damage spikes aimed to kill the group, which I absolutely hate. I'm not against healers dpsing I just want to move away from current DF m+ scenario.
this is probably the worst change, good healers should know when a hard time is up coming and be able to prep. not everything needs to just be 100% healing output or the group is ded.
doing this takes away any meaningful damage that healers bring and it just feels terrible. and will relegate us to affix duty cuz we cant bring anything meaningful damage wise.
healers need to have more impact in dps on m+ as its the game mode of getting to the end as fast as possible. and the healer with the best dps is next to always taken as the best. as generally we are all equal in healing but never in damage.
More impact? Brother we already did every affix other than sanguine (unless they have knockbacks too). Ironically the best and most complained about healing fight was the 3rd boss in halls of infusion. It's literally the only pure healing boss in the expansion. Consistent simple mechanics and high constant damage allows us to just heal for once and it's fantastic. I would rather focus on healing and adding damage where I can instead of what we have now.
Im fine with it honestly. If they also ease the overall difficulties of playing a healer, its ok. But from a class fantasy standpoint, im not sure about it. 😊
I rather use healing trinkets and do more damage with my abilities. Also i would not mind it if they get rid of aug evokers and give healers some support stuff instead.
Make healers more focused on healing not dpsing. Mindblowing i know!
I can absolutely see why this would frustrate people. Because is it really hurting anything?
But at the same time I can see how this new trend of being max damage as a healer is hurting a lot of the other specs that don't have as high of damage.
And instead of balancing every single spec around that, they would rather just make it to where healers don't really benefit that much from those sort of things.
I can understand both sides absolutely. I feel blizzard is making the right choice though. I think we need to retain the fantasy of a healer being a healer. And a tank being a tank. DPS should always be higher. A tang should always be tankier, and a healer should always be healing the most.
Does it should figure out more intuitive and more fun ways for healers to be doing something rather than trying to do damage
Healer shouldn't be DPSing IMHO just possibly cc's interrupts and heals
Every time I try to dps as healer it feels horrible
blizzard hasnt shown they want to make healing better... just nerfing dps... ill still used dps trinket over healing trinket f damage profiles still look like dragonflight
i hope they add something fun for healers and not just nerf the dps :/
I am a healer and that is irrelevant for me. As long as all healers have same problems/struggles I'm fine. 😅
Healers not being able to dps is partly why the role can feel miserable.
Really wish WoW moved on from having "healers" and would just have "support" specs instead like in Mobas or Overwatch.
AKA Specs that leans into healing/buffing/CCing but aren't completely useless damage wise.
All Blizzard have for healers are nerfs. Give me a reason to press the “Enter World” button.
Nerfing the damage of the trinkets without making interesting healing trinkets is just incredibly lazy. Make good healing trinkets and I will want to use them instead of damage trinkets.
Not to mention that healing trinkets are just in general going to be bad for m+ because any healing over the amount to keep your party alive is just wasted globals.
Healers having to worry about pumping dps is a dumb design. That’s what makes classic so good each role has its legit purpose. Making healers focus on healing isn’t a bad thing.
They don’t know what they’re doing is the correct answer.
They clearly stated they want healer damage to come frm their kit/talents, not trinkets/cantrips
Mana regen got nerfed too.
yes, i do, and i dont think this is a good decision
gimme healing trinkets that are worth more
Remove all healing from NON HYBRID and NON HEALERS specs... POINT!
DK = no healing
DH - no healing
Mage - no healing
WArrior no healing
Rgoues \hunters etc etc etc etc
ONLY HEALERS SHOULD BE ABLE TO HEAL.
Value of a tank and healer should be restored.
Also value of a tank witout healer should be restored too.
I mean tank could MITIGATE damage. But tank should not be able to TOP UP his HP himself.
CCs DPS should have 90% of all CCs in game.
So value of CCs will go to DPS.
And all will be good then.
Only two ways.
Let everyone do everything.
Healers tank dps and heal and dps tank and heal and tanks dps tank and heal.
Or Tank - tanking dps damage+ CC healers - heal
Healers should heal. Dps should dps. Tanks should tank. I think its horrible design when you have the trinity yet a tank can do all 3.
FF14 has this same problem. But that games more story reliant and community based than actually about combat.
which tank are you playing that's this godly? 🤔
Why healer can’t just be a healer🤷🏽♂️
Healers should heal not DPS
Oh nice....now the game will be very boring and we cant solo shit anymore out in the world.
Retarded change caused by carebears that cant do two things ..
Why not add more builds that you can damage and do healing like Monk amd disc?
Community sucks in this game.
Healer shouldn't do DPS . This is bs
Spoke like a brainrot beta
Healers shouldnt be dpsing to begin with, it was an awful addition to the game and a reason why so many healer mains quit.
Honestly I think the trinket nerf for tanks and healers is fine and warranted. There's already so, so much competition for the best trinkets for DPS players. Reducing the competition for those is a really good thing imo. I don't think it's a change necessarily targeted at lowering healer/tank DPS and more about just making damage trinkets more accessible.
all our damage this season is comming from trinkets. healers do fuck all. this is literally a direct nerf to healer damage.
plus healer trinekts are straight up dog water. and provide little to no benifit most of the time. our CDs are able to handle most if not all the healing checks.
@@athier5898 And maybe they're planning to change that. Or maybe they literally just don't want us doing that much damage. I personally really miss the Shadowlands season 1 hpal days where we'd absolutely crush the meters especially during Blust but ultimately wherever Blizz takes the game is what we have to adapt to. Plus, judging from a lot of comments sections I see, a lot of healers get really butthurt when even the mere *suggestion* of them doing damage during downtime comes up.
@@_alex_y.not_ i hope they plan to change that. but also those healers that say that generally are the healers you dont want in your keys. they dont understand that m+ is just the game mode where you want damage in some form (even if its small). i dont want to be relegated to affix duty just cuz my damage is ass :/
What a load of rubbish… healing is boring, dpsing as healer made it more fun
I never enjoyed dps as a healer. . if a healer has time to dps then the encounter isnt difficult enough. you don't see dps being required to heal if it was possible.. I think they need to get away from this in the trinity healers heal. tanks tank dps does damage.
Well that’s why it’s call a healer and not dps. Dps just need to step up more and do their job!
Yes we should heal not dps!
they did this in s1 and s2 of DF. and it was fucking terrible. and literally the worst time to be a healer.
to be a good healer you need to know when to heal, not just heal with out any mind. so if dps can keep them selves alive you as a good player should focus on dps. and these trinkets allow us to actually have some meaning impact.
this is probably the worst take in god dam existence and is a cancer on this community.
So what do you do when boss/trash do no damage for 5+ seconds? Playing with urself?
@@yassimchenard243 with proper damage balance there will no times were you dont need to heal.
@@athier5898 It was terrible because they failed with the numerical aspect of our HP, making every spell a one shot threat.
So yes, they should do the same as season 1 but give us the tools to top off people, because spot healing is just sh*t af.
@yassimchenard243 since when have you seen a fight where the tank/ dps isn't taking damage? Always standing in some damn thing or busy not using personal defensive. Not to mention as a healer you have to keep the group alive, dps, handle the affixes, and dispels. When I play dps its like taking a vacation.