Where and When to Hang Food in Bear Country and Tips on the Perfect Bear Hang
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
- Where and when to hang food in bear country and tips on the perfect bear hang. I explore the controversy of hanging or not hanging food in bear country. I demonstrate how great bears are at climbing and then provide tips on how to make the best bear hang possible. I also discuss bear behavioral differences between the backcountry and the front country and alternatives to protecting your food if a bear hang just isn't possible.
00:00 - Intro
00:26 - Bad Bear Hangs
00:44 - Experts Recommend to Not Hang Food
02:37 - Bears Climb Trees!
03:37 - Do I Hang my Food? & Bear Behavior
04:28 - Backcountry vs. Front Country & Bears
06:18 - Campsite Precautions
09:03 - Alternatives to Bear Hangs
11:14 - Overcoming the Challenges - Tips for Hanging Food
13:16 - The Campsite Set Up
14:12 - An Ideal Hang
15:08 - Where and When to Hang Food
Andrew Skurka's Blog
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Disclaimer
Any opinions expressed in this video are mine and mine alone and are not related to my employer or any other organization or individual. I have not been paid to make this video or to endorse a product. If I am ever paid for an endorsement or provided other compensation, I will state it clearly in the video. Any advice or demonstration I provide is just advice. The viewer should take responsibility for their own actions, follow any manufacturers warnings and directions and act safely and responsibly when travelling in the backcountry.
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Bear's were never interested in my food until I got your cook book. Always great advice!
LOL, so then these two seemingly independent issues, my book and bears are more related than I thought. 😋
LOL
I keep laughing at the 14:48 illustration. That is one sadass bear. 🤣
Yeah, that is an illustration from my book. I thought the artist did a great job.
Well done, Kevin -- these decisions are never black and white. II think we have to recognize that there is a spectrum of threats to our food, from squirrels through raccoons and most bears to the professional gymnastic bears. Personally, I have practised throwing the rope enough that it no longer takes much time, so I always hang the food (I rarely camp where there are no trees) -- that tradeoff is worth considering. It does sometimes take time to find a good enough branch/trees, but I use a rock bag and twirl it with a windmill motion -- lots of height, good direction, and I don't throw out my shoulder! I have only recently started to use a purpose-built rock bag and notice that it already has small tears -- traditionally, I used an old cotton sock, which always lasted a few trips before needing replacement. Be aware also that a blue barrel will keep out squirrels and raccoons and most bears, but not all -- the Canoe Lake office used to have a display of a blue barrel destroyed by a bear. I like your idea of leaving slack in the rope -- it seems to me that would discourage some of the climbers. I've never before seen a recommendation as low as 5 feet from the trunk or branch -- 10 feet might be overkill, but if I can get it, I'll use it.
Awesome response to the video. Your comments are much appreciated! The windmill thing is something I rarely even try but perhaps I will.
Another great video, Kevin. Now I want to read Skurka’s article too. Another tip would be to set up your bear hang as part of setting up camp while it’s still light outside. Trying to find the right tree and hanging a bag in the dark is really challenging.
Great tip! Yes I encourage everyone to read Skurka's article. He was one of the first people to be brave enough to suggest not hanging your food. The article is very insightful.
Great tip! I agree, it is often the last thing campers think about. Lobbing a rock over a tree branch, at dusk, in the middle of the forest, can be tricky; not to mention finding an appropriate tree in those conditions.
Good information. Thank you for sharing. I haven’t read all the comments so I hope I’m not repeating someone else’s comment.
Here are a couple of things I have learned and a question for you. I hike in the north Georgia mountains. There are few campsites with enough flat ground for even a couple of tents. As a result you are required to hang your food in not so ideal situations. I use a fifty foot rope to hang my bag which is sufficient in most cases. It can be too short if you find the perfect tree on a slope. I had this happen, but luckily my friend had some extra rope in his pocket and we were able to extend the rope. I also like to use a smooth bark hardwood tree over a pine. It is easier to get your to rope hung up in a pine.
I throw my rock bag by spinning my rope vertically in a clockwise direction and letting it go on the upswing. This is very easy to do and requires little shoulder movement, which is is important for an old guy like myself. It takes a little practice but you can use this method even in a thigh spot.
Lastly, if my food bag is heavy I get a stick and wrap the rope around it to make a pull handle.
Now my question. What size limb do you think is optimal for a bear hang? The way I see it is if the limb is too big the bear will just climb out and pull the bag up. If too small the bear can just break the limb off. Any thoughts? Thanks and have a great day.
I wouldn't worry about the size of the limb, but the food bag should hang down from the limb a good 4' so that it is difficult for a climbing bear to access.
Thanks for this, Kevin! I agree and follow the same practice; hang in the front-country and strap to a tree in the back-country. Glad to know I am not completely clueless.
Not hanging your food is a bit controversial but I haven't ever seen anyone talk about the different bear behaviours between the front country and the backcountry. Thanks for watching!
Agreed! This is off topic but it's easy to forget about the little things, like forgotten dog treats in pockets (guilty). Always safety first! Great info.
So true!
Also scented things like toothpaste, soap, deodorant, etc.
Great video, Kevin. I've gotten posts removed on the SHT FB page multiple times as I simply stated that I sleep with my food on the SHT. I don't encourage others to use any specific technique, I was just sharing my approach. Anyhow, thanks for the video and thoughtful commentary.
Thanks for mentioning that. If I remember Skurka also admits to sometimes sleeping with his food. I don't recommend that but I do know there are a relatively large but quiet group of folks out there who do that and many have never had an issue. I think that most of the time bears don't want to mess with humans and places like the SHT that run through rural environments rather than true wilderness have bears that have learned to keep clear of humans.
@@KevinOutdoors I'm kind of drifting into another topic a bit, and you may have discussed it in one of your bear vids. But because bears (I like the incorrect plural, what can I say) have such excellent smell, people think they only discern appealing scents, i.e., if there's food at a camp, then that's all they smell and don't focus on anything else. Yes, they smell the food, but they also smell the multitude of fabrics and equipment made from petrochemicals that have been treated with all manner of deterrents, deet, picardin, permethrin, waterproofing, etc. I guess that has nothing to do with how you store food in a direct manner, but I just don't think we're as appealing to bears as we think we are when we're out there.
@@chrispiatt2235 Hi Chris, I did do a video on this. We don't know exactly what bears can smell but they have all the tools to do a much better job of smelling than even bloodhounds. There nose has many more scent receptors and the part of their brain that processes smell is much larger than ours. We don't know for sure but scientists think bears can pick out all those details you mention. ruclips.net/video/EUO_IU77KsQ/видео.html
@@chrispiatt2235 Very interesting, Chris! Thanks for posting this, it gives me food for thought!
@@schulme123 thanks, but I credit Kevin with introducing the topic of their dynamic use of senses.
When people ask me how far away from camp you should keep your food bag….I ask how close they are comfortable having a bear by their tent. That usually drives home the point.
Good point. Having dealt with bears before I get it! :)
As an AT hiker, I found states that allow for a bear hunting season were never a problem. The Shenandoah stretch was crawling with habituated bears :
I suspect the hunting keeps the general bear population more wild at least weary of humans.
Great info Kevin. Love the cips of the bears climbing trees.
Glad you enjoyed it 👍
Brilliant and informative video as usual. You nailed it all!
Wow, thanks!
Great video. Very informative.
I used to suck at hanging my food but think I've perfected it now.
Sometimes it can be hard finding the best spot to do it. Especially when trees are to close together.
I've been camping in the backcountry for 15 years now and never had an issue with bears getting my food. I did however have some rodent get my coffee once at Pakaskwa. Put my food bag in the food box and realized I forgot my ziploc of coffee packs. Went and just put it on top of my food bag. Next morning it was chewed through. There was a chipmunk or mouse out there that must have been really wired. 😂
I also noticed in the morning there was a rodent barrel in the food box I didnt see the night before
Ha, those 'little bears' can almost be as much of a pain as the big ones.
Very, very well said Kevin! As usual.
Thanks Silver Paddles!
Amem Kevin! This video is spot on! It's not so black and white. I've been in bear country where bears were very experienced with campers and the "puzzles" they educate bears with. I've also been in back-country areas where bears gave up on getting the prize faster because it was hung correctly. Usually that's in areas where bears and people are not as familiar with each other. That's getting more and more rare . Bears are like squirrels. They are amazing at survival, adaptation and getting at food. The best bet by far is a bear barrel. A real bear barrel! I've learned that the trade off of energy expended by schleping the barrels on the trip vs carrying the ropes and time and energy hanging EXACTLY correctly to defeat the bear isn't worth the risk. Just buy a few more bear barrels, store it far away from your camp and it works everywhere from Ontario to the north slope of Alaska! With all the ultra light equipment available these days, it's weight worth carrying and if that tiny amount of weight is a deal breaker than you are not fit enough for a back country trip!
Well said Jamie. This is why bear canisters are mandatory in many of the most popular trails in the U.S. west. The extra weight they represent should be considered as the price of admission.
@@KevinOutdoors Couldn't agree more, very well said!
Best video I have seen on this subject, and I've seen a lot of them. Thanks!
Thanks so much.
Your right on there Kevin. I have not had time to photo or video the pully hang set up I use but I will get it to you. Totally agree with the backcountry/front country difference. Algonquin or the Boundary Waters, better hang that food very well but Wabakimi or Temagami are a different story. The U S Forest service actually put out bear warnings in the B W this year, lots of issues.
Thanks Donald, it is interesting to hear what is going on in different areas.
Is this a retake or a continuing episode?
Either way, most assuredly a welcome video.
Thank you Kevin : )
This isn't a retake but it certainly is my strategy to release videos that are related to each other. Over the past year (perhaps 2) I have released a bunch of videos on how to hang food, PCT Method, Pulleys, Bear Bag Kits etc. Even some on how to coil a rope and what rope to use. I wanted to make this one for a long time but I realized all those others should come first in a build up to this one. Hopefully new viewers will find not just one video they like but a cluster of videos related to each other. Glad you liked it even if it may have blended with the themes of other videos. I think what this one has that others don't is the discussion of to hang or not to hang your food and how bears have very different behaviours in the backcountry vs the front country.
@@KevinOutdoors
It's a great mini series.
I learned a lot from your video. Thought your juxtaposition of camera angles was expertly done also. Thanks.
Awesome, thank you Paul. Trying to incorporate a camera slider.
I resisted getting a rock bag for as long as I could. I figured, I'm halfway decent at tying knots. I'll just tie my line to a rock. But finding a decent rock, then figuring out how to tie it well enough to keep it on the line while you chuck it around, but with a release so you can untie it when you're done, all of these things add complexity to a camp chore that is difficult enough as it is. Having a rock bag makes the job so much easier. You have a lot more flexibility about the size(s) of the rock(s) you're using, which makes finding them easier and instead of taking time to figure out the best way to tie it to your line, you just dump it into your bag, close it, and you're ready to throw. Spend your time finding a good tree limb or set of limbs to use for your hang, not finding a rock.
13:00 Instead of pullies, maybe just a truckers hitch. That way you don't need to carry a pully, but you still get a mechanical advantage similar to a pully.
In my younger days it wasn’t bears - it was raccoons! They can be fearless and can easily climb ropes. The new Kevlar bags would solve the problem. I live in the woods and there is no doubt that if a bear finds food he/she will come back for years to check out that spot.
Great insights, thanks Kevin.
In the circles of bear biologists and wildlife conflict managers, the Skurka article was (and continues to be) disappointing and irresponsible. I appreciate how your video describes hangs in detail and notes that there are regulations specific to some areas. Skurka argues that food might as well be stored in your tent since nobody hangs food properly, advice that one should be careful to give as we hear of fatal attacks in tents with food. You won't hear that from the bear biologists who study and respond to attacks and other incidents. Please note that the plastic used in many bear-resistant food containers is only meant to be effective for 8-10 years, so photos and reports of broken canisters should be reviewed with caution. Hangs are also used by hunters to protect game meat, so designing those well to accommodate the weight, maintain a 10+ foot height from the bottom of the carcass, and deter mustelids is important... but not impossible, as Skurka argues.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Marci. I agree Skurka goes a little too far when he suggests storing food in the tent. But I think his article is very valuable to the discussion. It challenges existing dogma and exposes issues like how hard it is to make a proper bear hang. I don't know if I would have made this video if the Skurka article didn't exist.
Your point about the age of bear canisters is an excellent one that I should have mentioned. Even new bear canisters are only 'resistant' and that certification is based on how long a bear takes to make a 1" hole in the canister. In my research I did learn about an area in up-State New York that specifically banned the 'Bear Vault' mode. They even had an exchange program, if you owned a BV you could hand it in and borrow a different model. You would get your BV back when you returned the other canister. I could not determine if this program was still in place. It seems that there was at least one bear that got very good at opening the Bear Vault model.
Great video, top notch.
Much appreciated!
Interesting stuff!
Thanks Andy!
Great video Kevin. Lots of great information as usual.
I grew up camping in the Adirondacks and the Green Mountains. Yellow-Yellow was infamous, almost legendary lol
In all my years, I’ve only had one bear try to access my food…that I know of. I was using a Backpackers Cache type canister (required in that area) that I had modified with many bands of brightly colored duct tape. In the morning it took me about 45 minutes to find it because it wasn’t where I’d left it, stuffed under a large downed tree. There were clearly claw marks in the tape.
Since most of my camping is front country, I’m much more likely to have my food attacked by squirrels, chipmunks and mice. Canisters are a great deterrent to these critters as well. I also use my canoe barrel (modified as per Chris Prouse) with a split ring in the metal band latch. I recently purchased an Ursack but I have used it yet.
Thanks for another great video
Thanks for commenting Alan. Yes I came across Yellow Yellow in my research. She has passed on but I was unable to determine if you could still not bring Bear Vaults into certain areas of the Adirondacks. I did find that there was once an exchange service where you could leave behind your Bear Vault and they would lend you another model to use. I can't tell if that is still a thing or not. I wonder if she transferred her skills on to other bears or if it is safe now to bring a BV into Yellow Yellow's former territory.
@@KevinOutdoors
I know that REI and Eastern Mountain Sports would rent the canisters and that NYS DEC would rent canisters at some locations too. I never owned a bear vault type because they didn’t meet the regulations for the park. Unfortunately I haven’t been in that area recently so I’m not sure what the deal is these days
Very informative, thanks! I actually never had problems hanging but practise is for sure helpful.
It certainly isn't easy, all those little tips I mention add up and do make hanging food easier.
New subscriber here... GREAT video! I'd like to add that bringing a pair of gloves (leather) will help pull that bear bag up the tree. There's been a few occasions where the rope has started cutting into my hand and having a leather glove on helped tremendously.
Great tip, and welcom!
Very informative, thanks
Thank you.
Thanks for another informative video, Kevin. Love the idea about practising what you’ll be doing!
Thanks Edward. My pleasure!
Thank you so much for these videos. I find I'm watching them more than once! I solo camp up north and this type of information is real and informative. After watching this, I do suck at hanging bear bags! I feel my big concern with bears is my dogs food and her strong smelling liver treats.
Thanks Pat, yes it seems bears will enjoy smelly food. Always best to do all you can to reduce the smells.
Excellent info, Kevin. The only time I have ever had a bear come in close to the camp was those habituated to the overused / popular spots.
Thanks Craig, interesting that I've never heard this discussed before.
Great tips for everyone in this video Kevin. I've only had one issue with bears and that was back in the day when I was younger and not as informed! Wish I had access to this type of information at the beginning of my camping days.
Thanks Winter 8, always good to hear from you.
Something I like to do is to wipe down my bear container with pine-sol or ammonia. I carry small spray bottles filled with pine-sol and ammonia along with rags which I spray around my camp site and hang rags around that have been soaked. Keeping a clean camp site is a must for sure in any bear country.
Bears have an excellent sense of smell and scented cleaners like pine-sol could actually attract them, they are curious creatures. Good luck.
@@KevinOutdoors Of course I'm no bear expert, but this is what was recommended to me by the RMNP Service several years ago. I was told that bears don't like the smell of ammonia or pine-sol. I have yet to have a bear wonder into my camp, mess with my stuff, or tear my car apart. Maybe I have been lucky, or there is some truth to what I was told. Only time will tell. Thanks for your input though, much appreciated.
@@coloradodayhiker That's interesting. I did find reference to pine-sol as a deterrent previously but didn't give it much thought. This is something that could make an interesting test with some wildlife cameras. Thanks!
@@KevinOutdoors Yeah, it would be a good test to try. I don't think I have seen anyone testing that out before.
Very informative - and I agree with everything you stated. Bottom line is - there are no guarantees in life, no matter what precautions are taken. But by taking your advice, chances of a bear getting your food are substantially reduced with these methods. Cheers Kevin 😊
Thanks Derek! I love the feedback.
Of note, there are more and more places that don’t allow the bear vault brand….and upstate New Yorks Adirondack high peaks is one of them.
Thanks for that, there are a lot of mixed comments about BV containers out there.
Great video with lots if good information! Curious, why do you hang your food in the frontcountry when you would have your car to keep your food and garbage in?
Good question, Often the front country is beyond where I would 'car camp'. There is no perfect definition but after parking and doing a full day's hike or a full day paddle you are likely still in the 'front country'.
@@KevinOutdoors interesting as I've been thought if you have to hike, canoe or kayak in to a campsite than its backcountry. I'd be interested in knowing more about your definitions of frontcountry and backcountry and when you believe the places you camp change from one to another.
@@katanaguttman4063 Almost anywhere you travel (towards the backcountry) you will have easily accessible campsites near an entry point. It always varies with the popularity of the location and how easy it is to get into but generally it is more than a day's travel. Usually you will find campsites that are more heavily used and 'trashy' conditions at those sites.
Often when canoe tripping in a popular area I'll find people carrying coolers or other large gear. Once you need to portage more than 1km this kind of thing drops off. And in backcountry areas that are not very popular you might be in backcountry that first night. So 'backcountry' conditions might be closer than you think if there is a challenge to get into the area or if the area you are in isn't very popular.
But regarding bears, most female black bears have a home range between 10-40 square km. Bears will become habituated to 'trashy' campsites where they can often find garbage or even food. So if you want to escape the bear's that have become habituated you will need to travel more than 10km (the radius of a 40 sq km circle) and likely double that to be absolutely clear.
@@KevinOutdoors thanks!
@@KevinOutdoors thanks!
Imagine doing so much hard work to get it up there only for a bear to get it in no time and even look silly doing it
Curious what your thoughts are on the 'The PCT method' of hanging. The The PCT method is what I have been using for years and heard it is slightly better than a regular hang
I think the PCT method is great. I have a video showing it in action. It has the advantage that a bear who has learned to bite ropes won't get the food. ruclips.net/video/cpNM256DUAM/видео.html
I try to use the PCT method when possible on my trips here in Ontario. I find if you have a tree on a hill you get an extra 5 feet minimum off the ground. I use the 'loose' end of the line running from the food bag to the branch to the ground to pull the food bag further away from the trunk...I hang it usually 10 feet away from the trunk when possible first then pull it further away with the 'loose' line. So even if the bear chews through the rope leading from the branch to the ground the bag will still be out of reach. The only option is for the bear to climb the tree and chew through the line slung over the branch. I also double bag my dried food and put it in an OPSak, which goes into my DCF food bag. Not perfect, but I hope other natural food smells in the forest will be stronger than that emanating from my bag. Another thing I sometimes do, if possible, is to hang the food not in a triangle formation, but inline. For example, if my tent is away to the left of the cook area (facing the campsite) then I will walk along the forest keeping the tent/cooking area behind me and set my hang quite a ways from the cook area. That places the food hang even further from the tent area. Just some thoughts.
If I put my food in a tree, does this make the family and I it’s food of choice⁉️