How Iroh got into the Spirit World? THEORY [Avatar the Last Airbender l Legend of Korra]
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Ahahha god what an awful theory
Haha then it's time to redo it!
U should talk about why zuko never went to meet iroh in the spirit world
I really liked it, iT's JusT a ThEorY, but it's cool
The comment near the end about Iroh not really having a physical change actually got me immediately thinking. Yue had a physical change in her appearance because the spirit that she connected with was a physical thing in the world - the moon itself as evidenced when the entire celestial body outright vanished when the fish was killed. Sure, he has dominion over the library and was able to bring it to the spirit world, but Wan Shi Tong merely brought himself and his knowledge seekers to the mortal world. Even if the library was built in the mortal world, it probably became just so ripe with his energy that it became an extension of himself, thus explaining why he could bring it with him. But the point is! Originally, his and the knowledge seekers’ presence was not a physical thing, so the change in Iroh may not have had to be a physical thing. More likely than not, the change was something mental. Like his ability to see the spirits or being able to more keenly sense spiritual things or perhaps when he imparts wisdom to others, they are more easily receptive of it.
Ha! Same feeling I get when reading old Discord messages. I understand 😭
Zuko: Wait, you talked with my uncle?
Korra: Yeah, in the spirit world.
Zuko: ಠ︵ಠ
Zuko is still a meme worthy
also Zuko: imma go to the spirit realm and see meh uncle offscreen but no one will be able to prove it muahahaha
ಠ︵(ಠE
ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ
I just liked and you are at 666 likes. Oh and nice comment
"It would explain why he was so wise and learned..."
"Do you remember that bush I said wasn't sure if it was tea or not?"
"Uncle, you didn't..."
"I did.... and it wasn't..."
He learned from it
True wisdom
"Delicious tea.......or deadly poison?"
Vocal Vortex Studios or he’s an avatar
“We’re not taking anymore chances with these plants!”
Iroh actually had a strong connection to the spirit world as a kid. When he took Banh sinh say back he said he had a vision of it from a young age only he thought he was to take it for the fire nation
"Banh sinh say" IM DEAD
Ba sing se
I thought that was in the more typical ‘vision,’ it was his goal, not like a spiritual thing
Banh sinh say...
@@jjjm7322 no it wasn't because Iroh said that he saw how he conquered ba sing se and I always imagined him as a kid seeing adult Iron standing there in front of the earth kings palast and thats it I think this vision is comparable with the vision of azula when she was practicing her lighting.
Uncle Iroh was my favorite character. He's so calm, humorous and also very skilled in firebending(and making tea), to the point where he even invented a technique.
He was also very wise. And even if Zuko technically betrayed him, he still cared for him, worried that Zuko lost his way. I cried when Iroh just took Zuko (I thought he was gonna beat him up) and hugged him. Damn that was one of the best episodes ever.
Best relationship in the show, of any kind
just a derpy dude in the internet Was? He still is
Iroh is my 2nd best character my 1st is toph shes good she was the first to metal bend to that’s amazing and she metal bended when she was like 12?
Koko melon lord is my favorite character
Truest comment in all of RUclips. We will never have another Uncle Iroh presentation in any other anime or film. He really is unique -- Mako Iwamatsu did great by lending his unique voice -- forever Uncle Iroh!
Iroh is a spirit, he's the spirit of tea
Edit: The reactions of everyone is perfect
and failure?
😂😂😂
And quitting!
Sooo... He turned into boiled bush
😹
When his son died Iroh had brown hair, but every time he’s shown after that he has grey hair. I guess you could say after being touched by the spirit, he turned into a... silver fox.
he had grey/white hair because he was old (and possibly stress from losing his son)
Hahaha
Or..he got old.
Either that or the stress of your son dying & your child dying and you out-living them, can hit you differently & fnck you up big time
@@Cvsmic-s4y Why not both
We need an avatar series based on uncle irohs early life :')
mainly his journey after lu ten's death and how he became wise
@@nabvhan Maybe it could also start a little bit before Lu Ten's death too. Sometime just before Lu Ten joined the Fire Nation Army.
Iroh's redemption.
I don't know. I think that what happened to Iroh is one of those things best left ambitious
I prey Allah it will never happen... it would ruin all mystery of him
Here is a better idea. Dragons although physical beings are spirit like. Iroh could have been given the spirit of a dragon, to pay a debt to protect the last dragons. We see dragons become spirits when they die. Thus Iroh has the spirit of a dragon. We know what dragons and how he got that power. He is also one of the few firebenders who can breathe fire. Asides Zuko and later Ang.
Evan Dugas azula and korra could as well
.
I like this theory and it also gives so much more meaning to his title Dragon of the west. While many think it's because he killed a dragon, it's actually because he became one.
Evan Dugas And Ozai and me...
I agree
How can this be a kids show regarding Iroh "singing leaves from the vine" it taught a lesson that took me years to learn in such a beautiful way: that it's okay to be sad, to be sad for a very long time, and to wish things had gone differently. It also shows how the surviving person can still go on to be amazing.
I am learning something similar. I am learning that it is okay to share my sadness with loved ones so I don't suffer alone, and that this is okay even if I'm sad for a long time. I thought my feelings would make people sad, but I now am learning who I can talk to, because not everyone feels burdened when you share your feelings.
Personally I think that Iroh just sensed his death coming, and ventured into the Spirit World through meditation, as he surely would be able to do, I mean, it's Iroh. And as he was in there his body passed away and the connection to it got severed. Rather than ending his soul when the body passed he became a spirit since he had no body to come back to. This to me is a far more sensible theory, and it keeps intact the personal growth of Iroh, since he did it all on his own, not on account of taking in the part of another spirit.
And you may well be right! 😊It is just a theory after all. Thanks for watching!
~ Tim
Haha thanks, cool video though, way to jump into a rabbit hole, All hail mishka
wait what? the time stamp says 44 min on the main comment but 1 hour on the replys..... I'm so confused.
for me at least
I like this simpler explanation better. He may or may not have acquired knowledge from the Great Library, but he could have just as easily traveled the world in disguise like he does with Zuko (notice how easily it comes to him to blend in or work for a living) while being fugitives. He probably visited the spirit world often, and was attuned to their presence. This is how he can see Aang and Fang in S2. Also how he could travel there near the end of his mortal life and stayed there. That is some next level enlightened!
Sokka was literally over the moon for suki!!🤣🤣
just rewatch atla again and now i realized : yue = moon (in chinese), suki (tsuki) = moon (in japanese)
Yohanes Bobby Sanjaya, Sokka has a very specific type
AnimeQverlord oh my god XD
DAMN THAT’S GOOD
@@Tigerlilly7827 he has pretty *high* standards
Maybe when the Dragons deemed him worthy they gave Iroh some of their power, this would explain his nickname and affinity for fire-bending and because of this maybe he was considered a spirit and was able to cross over opposite to over spirits.
Bruuuhh
Okay, but Iroh finding Aang's grown children in the spirit world with one of the spirit foxes kind of validates his theory... just saying.
@@ember-brandt OMFG that makes complete sense.
Dragons aren’t spirits tho
@@deuteriumjones in theory. In one of his other videos he talks about how Rah and Shaw could be the Sun spirits
Sokka:My girlfriend became the moon
*thats rough buddy*
Man I died during this scene lol
Dickey fuck off. I know the war between T-series and Pewds is important but you have come to the wrong place to take about it. We came here to talk about one of the most beloved characters in all of animated history.
Dickey wrong place at the wrong time my dude.
@@whonk6079 its never wrong to show love for your the lord pewdiepie
@@dickey951 F*** off!
I think it's the dragons. He became the Dragon of the West not only in title but at a spiritual level also.
Andrew Caleb Gorospe u smart bastard
Ooh thats an interesting theory
Wait wait wait, in a previous episode he explains that the dragons are spirits. It is FAR more likely that iroh merged with one of the endangered dragon spirits, when he visited the sun tribe, instead of the knowledge spirit. It would explain the dragon of the west nickname, it would explain why iroh could see the dragon spirit fang, it would also explain why in the legend of kora there is only one dragon ridden by lord zuko when in ATLA there are two dragons. It could have been upon the death of the other dragon that iroh gave up his body to go to the spirit world.
JoyAnne Tracy i feel like you just started watching avatar from netflix.
dreatyu walter she has an amazing point tjo
Wait wait wait, in a previous episode he explains that the dragons are spirits. It is FAR more likely that iroh merged with one of the endangered dragon spirits, when he visited the sun tribe, instead of the knowledge spirit. It would explain the dragon of the west nickname, it would explain why iroh could see the dragon spirit fang, it would also explain why in the legend of kora there is only one dragon ridden by lord zuko when in ATLA there are two dragons. It could have been upon the death of the other dragon that iroh gave up his body to go to the spirit world.
This makes more sense or in general, the 2 dragons gave a part of them to Iroh
The dragon of the west name is because when someone killed a dragon, they were given the title dragon.
You’re on to something.
I dig this theory!
exactly what i was thinking
NETFLIX SHOULD DO THE IROH CHARACTER RIGHT OR WE RIOT
Momo too..
AVATAR: THE LAST AIR BUFFALO (APPA-BASED TV SERIES)
You know it’s the original creators making it right?
What do you mean riot nuk em
How about Jack black plays Iroh?????
Iroh really said: "Yue, you're gonna have to sacrifice yourself"
Sokka was prolly internally screaming
But what kind of tea did they offer in the spirit world?
There's actually an answer to this question. When with Korra, Iroh remarks that there are spirit cakes which don't gain you any weight. I assume you can have tea that tastes like tea with none of the health benefits.
~ Tim
Tim Mingers finally someone is asking the important questions
tea of the Great Vine!
Consists of pyschotria viridis leaves & banisteriopsis caapi vine
honest-tea!
Erick Orantes and cactus juice don't forget the cactus juice
Iroh is so badass, he became a Force Ghost.
Hahahaha, Yea kinda true!😆😆😆
Zuko: * Thinks his bellowed uncle Iroh has died *
Iroh: "I think it's time for me to expand my tea business in to the spirit world!" * Leaves*
You know, it was never stated that Zuko didn't know that his Uncle was in the Spirit World... just that he was shocked that Korra met him... there is a difference...
Good point 👍
Why would he be that shocked if he knew iroh was in the spirit world with a strong tendency to help people and korra had also been in the spirit world seaching for someone ? If he knew, I think he would have kinda expected it, lol
Coco Noisette Do you think Zuko could go with Iroh to the spirit world? :O
@The KGB no. Zuko would know that an Avatar can access the spirit world since he could have learned it from Aang, and that it would be very likely that Iroh would guide the Avatar if needed. If he knew Iroh was in the spirit world, he would he excited about it, as mentioned above me, but the fact that he was shocked to hear that Korra met Iroh makes me think that he thought Iroh just passed away like a normal person
What happens to humans after their death in avatar ?
I think I solved it really..
I believe he isn't a spirit as in that he died first, because he doesn't get effected by Rava meaning he isn't a real spirit. I think he mediated into the spirit world and never left so his human body died and he stayed in the spirit world causing him to be not the spirit of a dead human that could get effected by Rava.
This is similar to the concept of "Samadhi" is Hinduism. A highly spiritual person, usually a guru or godman leaves their mortal body behind, promising to return when the time is right. Their bodies are then cared for until they return. Also when these people actually die, their bodies aren't cremated, instead it is buried substance such as ash or a water body "jal samadhi". This goes against the Hindu philosophy which mandates cremation.
And, seeing as this universe is based off of Asian traditions and such, it stands to reason that they created their "religion" (for lack of a better word) based off of Asian religions. So this is a very viable option.
What does rava have to do with Iroh???
@@barackobama5867 rava effected all the spirits but not iroh
@@bestgameplay831 no rava doesnt affect all spirits because when vaatu atacked rava and wan by transforming spirits into bad ones rava didnt turn them back into normal
I just remembered the episode where Zuko and Aang went to the sun castle thing because there fire bending wasn’t working right.There they saw the two dragons and the leader of the group said that Uncle Iroh didn’t kill the last dragons and let them live.Maybe The dragons also knew this and gave him a gift a bit of themselves for there gratitude.
(I actually haven’t watched this episode for so long so I don’t kno if they were talking about Iroh or Avatar Ruko)
I watched it recently, Iroh was seen as worthy by the dragons and he lied and said that he killed the last dragon so that they wouldn't go extinct, I don't know if there was only one left but I doubt it since I guess dragon can't reproduce asexually, anyway The good thing is that dragons didn't go extinct thanks to Iroh
I feel like you got close to the right answer, but I don't think iroh bonded his soul with one of the knowledge seeker spirits. Remember how iroh was recognized as the "dragon slayer?" Also, remember that there is at was at least one dragon left for zuko to learn from? I believe that during his journey, iroh bonded his soul to one of the dragon's. This could explain why he was able to see fang and other spirits.
This makes more sense than the fox, since Iroh found the last dragons and instead of killing them as the other firelords he decided to hide their identity. Maybe he received his "spiritual" powers after the dragons accepted him.
OOOOOHHH 😳😱
wait what. wasnt the dragon he supposedly "killed" the one from the sun place? the one that taught aang and zuko true firebending
Cat owls are cute
Elephant rats are ugly
My girlfriend's the moon...
That's rough buddy.
I remember the last one from the series but I don't know which episode, was it when Zuko went to prison with sokka to save his father ?
Gaby Gabriel yes, it was on the way there in the balloon that they talked
@@newtgaming1881 yeah now I remember, I wasn't sure because I watched the series just in Romanian (my language) so I didn't really know
Doesn't ryme
Steven Parkinson then you do it better
I think this is dope until you get to the knowledge seeker part. Instead, I think something far darker that occurred. Yue was sick at birth. There was something fundamentally wrong with her that only essence of a spirit could inhabit and heal. The question about why a spirit would care to put a fragment of themselves into a human should be reconsidered.
This show should not be a kids show...
I think Iroh was going to take his own life before a spirit (not a knowledge seeker) approached him. I think his damage was in the heart and a spirit healed that wound. The spirit deemed a general, and heir to a kingdom (like Yue) worthy of its essence. I do not have a solid guess as to which spirit that would be, but I would look into Iroh's existential crisis after the death of his son. ( I also think that there is a chance that the spirit that gave him a part of itself may have been one of the innumerable spirits that exist outside of the handful we see in the show).
Just imagine, maybe the creators wanted to expand on Iroh's lowest point in his life but they weren't allowed because it was a children's show.
that's an interesting idea.
I like this theory.
I also think it's fair to point out that Yue *replaced* the Moon Spirit when it died, whereas, if the fox spirit died, Iroh didn't replace it directly. Iroh is in the Spirit World as himself rather than having given up his lifeforce to the fox.
James DeMolina
The moon controls the ocean not random meteors
Gravity would solve this.
Personally I believe that Iroh learned everything and gained his affinity for the spirit world through meditation and deep introspection.
Just loving everything about Iroh - he and Zuko are definitely my favourite characters in Avatar TLA.
Friend: wow, there’s a lot of good characters in this show, which one is your favorite?
Me: *sees them all* Yes
Best characters are Iroh, sokka then momo and the list continues
Sokka’s wife: Who was your ex girlfriend?
Sokka: It was the moon.
Sokka’s wife: 🌚
🧐
Cool
2:23 If you're unable to summon tears at the mere thought of that song, you're not a real human...
Maurice Merry I didn't cry, it just makes me angry that people can care about others because I am. Incapable of love
I do apologize for not being able to conjure any tears at that moment. Humans dying doesn't bother me and the sounds they give off when others are hurt or dying doesn't make me sad at all. The music they play for that person is also very strange. You're dying and yet they're playing music. :P
Maurice Merry well I did not conjure a single tear so maybe I'm broken
Can anyone fix me
Maurice Merry
I didn’t even get sad
Summon tears? I have to fight for five minutes to stop them from flowing uncontrollably.
He meditated, that's it, why do you need a theory?
You CAN pop into the spirit world whenever you feel like it, all it takes is practice and training.
And leaving your body behind is the whole point, everyone who meditates into the spirit world leaves their body behind, Aang did it all the time, Korra did it, Zaheer did it, nose piercing guy did it, it's really not that complicated it's just how it works.
snapgab LoL true, I believe Iroh developed spiritually that's why he saw visions
And when jinora is stuck there her body started to deteriorate. Which is why it's risky for non avatars. The avatar spirit keeps the body alive... Which is also how aang was trapped in stasis for a century.
snapgab nose piercing guy
Then why couldn’t all the Air Monks be able to do it then, they all dedicated their lives to meditation, only the first Air Monks which still lived on the backs of the lion Turtles were able to do this, but after they lost the lion turtles protection, they also lost this ability
@@actiniumanarchy9237 they all could??? I mean the Airnomads are the most spiritual nation of the 4, literally there were no nonbenders births on the temples because of how spiritualized they were, No one ever mentioned that they couldn't meditate into the spiritual world
Plot twist:iroh is a dragon that entered the normal world
A past life maybe?
plot twist: iroh is reincarnated fang/feng, roku’s dragon lmao
I have numerous ideas spiraling around my head after watching this video.
In partnership with your 'Dragons Are Spirits' theory, I believe that Iroh could have been given part of Ran or Shaw's souls/life force. Furthermore, his nickname as 'Dragon of the West' would have a far more literal meaning if he had gained some part of a dragon. If dragons are technically spirits and Iroh had some part of a dragon within him, then it would be plausible that he could enter the Spirit World, like Roku's dragon, Fang. The fact that Iroh could also see Fang is rather interesting, considering his connection to dragons.
Another thought in my mind is that some individuals in the Avatar universe might have a natural ability to connect to spirits, such as Jinora. Both Jinora and Iroh were able to see spirits and easily enter the Spirit World when compared to other people. It is also possible that Iroh could have journeyed to Ran or Shaw or even to a spirit that he knew in order to gain passage to the Spirit World, as it has been shown in the past that spirits can bring people to the Spirit World. (The Soulbending Dragon Turtle does this with Aang, though he is the Avatar. A better example would be the kidnapping of Sokka during the Winter Solstice). Occasionally, mortal creatures do seem to find their way into the Spirit World, seeing as Koh the Face Stealer regularly meets with mortals and steals their faces.
I also believe that spirits may be capable of binding themselves to creatures. Jinora had her own 'Spirit Guide', in a sense, being the bunny spirit. Each Avatar has their own Animal Guide, which could be their 'Spirit Guide' in a spiritual way, but I believe that their 'Spirit Guide' is actually Raava, who is inside of them. Following this idea, Iroh's Spirit Guide could have been a dragon, or possibly Ran or Shaw, and it is known that he ventured to learn from the two. Roku's guide, Fang, was present in the Spirit World. It could be possible that these guides are capable of bringing mortals into the Spirit World. Raava allows the Avatar to journey into the Spirit World. Jinora's bunny allowed her to easily enter the Spirit World. Iroh's Spirit Guide could have done the same. If his body died while he was inside of the Spirit World, then his actual soul could have been present to live on.
It is apparent that people do not age in the Spirit World, as shown with Admiral Zhao, as he was still wandering the Spirit World after he was taken by the Water Spirit during the Siege of the North. Just some ideas.
Well dang this a whole essay
No hate
Good theory
This is super cool. I’d just like to add. Remember in the original show when Zuko said that all dragons were killed, and that Iroh supposedly went to kill the last dragon? To which he earned the name, “The Dragon of the West”. If this a different dragon apart from the two shown in the Sun Warriors episode, perhaps he gained wisdom and/or a spiritual connection/piece of the dragon and gaining access to the spirit world.
One counter argument would be that Sokka, and the other people, came out of the spirit world. When they did, they had their physical bodies, so this implies that Hai Bai somehow took their physical bodies to the spirit world. Remember that nobody could find their bodies. That may not seem like a big deal, but remember that Iroh said he LEFT his body. Maybe Hai Bai only chose to take the physical bodies as well? Who knows?
You also said that you don't age in the spirit world, as Zhou didn't change. Does this apply to your physical body as well, if it is taken like Hai Bai took Sokka? Again, who knows? Just some thoughts to leave you with.
I enjoyed the video because Iroh is by far one of the best characters in the Avatar universe! But I would say that there may be even more evidence supporting that--if Iroh did in fact have part of a spirit living inside him--it was one of the dragon spirits. We know he was at the Sun Warriors place before Aang and Zuko, and they granted him their firebending abilities. Additionally, he was known as the Dragon of the West and had the unique ability of being ablate fire bend through his mouth... an ability neither Aang or Zuko learned from the spirits. Lastly, if the rumour that Iroh could fire bend during the eclipse would mean that he definitely has spirit abilities, since Sun Warriors still draw their bending from the Sun--and not with rage--so they too would also lose their ability during the eclipse. If Iroh could bend, he must've had internal fire bending ability, much like dragons.
facts
Another theory: The bond from the two dragons he saved? Cool idea. *Shrug*
Jackie Jones that’s what I thought this video was going to be about
When his gf said she’d rather be the moon... that’s rough buddy
*laughter intensifies*
6:40 that’s shading. Your video shows the chest color changing with movement meaning its a shadow not the color of the chest.
yeah it seems like he's reaching cuz for the one he says is all brown he ignores the shots right before it that shows its obviously white chest and stomach that you can see a sliver of in that still
This is the exact moment I stopped caring about what he was sayin theres no way he really thought they had different patterns
@@Allieg806 also they all have the same white paw
In the guru episode the guru uses pools to explain the chakras. In the Winter Solstice Iroh is lounging at the bottom of a very similar chain of pools. This implies that he at some point opened his chakras, opening him up to spiritual influence.
I think it's a lot simpler than that. Certain people and spirits can pass over between the two worlds without needing the Spirit Portals. Examples are Habai and that face spirit from The Search comic, mother of Ko the Face Stealer. All the spirits who served her seemed to be capable of crossing over too. Korra, Zaheer, Iwaeh and many others can meditate and transfer their spirit into the Spirit World. Now, Zaheer threw Iwaeh into the Fog of Lost Souls, stopping him from returning to his body. Zaheer said he'd spend an eternity there. This means his body would undoubtedly die but his spirit would remain in the Spirit World. The same thing nearly happened to Jenora.
So to put it simply, if you meditate into the Spirit World and your body dies, you can stay there. Iroh likely did it on his deathbed with days or weeks to live. The real question now is whether he can leave the Spirit World on his own to truly pass on. Zuko was surprised to hear Korra spoke to Iroh because Zuko undoubtedly watched Iroh die.
You may well be right! I misphrased what I meant in saying people can't typically just pop off to the spirit world. On Zaheer and Aiwei - in my opinion, the Fog of Lost Souls is something of an exception. We don't know what happens to human spirits once the body dies, but we do know that those trapped in the Fog cannot usually escape. Hence why we see Zhao (whose body would be long dead).
Yet, the fact that we have heard of no other human transferring their consciousness to the spirit world before death (as many airbenders could, if it were possible), I personally doubt they can. The Fog seems to hold onto spirits and stop them from moving on/reincarnating/dying/whatever happens to them, I think. As for Jinora, Unalaq only ever commented that Jinora would never be able to leave the spirit world, which didn't preclude the idea that she would die there once her body did. Tenzin also remarks: "How long can *she survive* like this?" Now, while they could be talking about Jinora's physical body, the urgency of the situation suggested to me he was talking about her as a person. Unalaq also claims his spiritbending, as he does to Jinora, can destroy a human soul, which again would suggest she was going to die. But I could be wrong, of course :) These are all great points though!
~ Tim
On the topic of Jinora, my take on it was that none of them were sure what would happen to her spirit, trapped as it was, upon her death. But the more immediate concern was keeping her alive, because Jinora had nothing to eat or drink since she went into the Spirit World. She would have died already if not for the healing abilities of Kaya and Katara.
As for Unalaq's spirit bending, I expect if he destroys a spirit of a human then that person will be truly dead, just like ordinary people.
I agree that none of them really had a great idea about what would happen. That whole season was quite murky on what spirit energy did and so on. That said, in the scene where they are taking care of her body, they make the remarks "I've been trying to keep her energy circulating" and "she's remarkably strong to have held on this long." Jinora had been affected by Unalaq's spirit bending, which supposedly unbalances the spiritual energy inside a human being. Those remarks to me suggest they were concerned with retaining the energy connection between her body and her spirit and preventing her energies from becoming more unbalanced, rather than eating/drinking. This is, of course, all speculation. All up in the air! Man I love the Avatar universe :) So cool to know there are people who love it just as I do!
~ Tim
I belive that The Last Two Dragons blessed Iroh with incredible power because of his good heart. That's why he could cross over into the Spirit Realm.
ok next avatar cartoon should be based on uncle iroh's journey.
praetoriancorps agreed
And should be called Iroh's Spiritual Journey
I really wouldn’t mind that.
Yes, this!!
This “piece of a spirit” theory might also be a way for the Avatar’s past lives that were severed from Korra to still be out there, in the spirit world. Theoretically, each human Avatar spirit would have a piece of Raava in them as well, meaning they could also live on in the spirit world as well
Dear Tim,
I saw your live stream, and I would like to thank you. You actually recognized me, and a couple of others in that stream, showing that you remember, and care about us, unlike some other tubers. I also apologize for being one of those guys, who kept posting the same question during the stream, keep up the good work. ALL HAIL MISHKA! KAWWWWWWWW!
I want the subfury community to know that I do remember and care about you guys 😊 I love reading through comments and recognize those who watch each video. You all mean so much to me. All hail Mishka kaw!
- Tim
iroh is being shown with a fox spirit in the last episode of lok book 2
What if iroh's apearance did change? Is not like we've seen iroh during his travels, actually we've seen little of iroh before the legend of aang
I had a theory originally that his eye colour changed, but that didn't pan out. It's quite possible it simply isn't something visible.
~ Tim
Hello Future Me well his hair was gray before entering the spirit world now it looks white
We see him when Lu-Ten dies, but i'm not really sure if he was in the jurney when he meet the warriors of the sun before or after that. I think Zuko says that he did that jurney when he was young.
I presume it was way before, i'm not sure but i think that the guard in the day of black sun episode mentions that Iroh was the "dragon of the west" and the pride of the fire nation before his departure from war effort. This implies that he had gained the moniker way before his disgrace and subsequent discharge from the army (after lu ten's untimely death).
I considered whether his hair colour counted as a 'change', but Firelord Azulon, Firelord Zuko, and Firelord Sozin all grew up to have white hair just the same as Iroh in their old age, suggesting it was a hereditary thing. I think it's more likely there's an unseen change on his body.
~ Tim
when you mentioned the patchy chest dog I looked closely and realized that it was the shadow which changed the gray shade color.
Yup, the front left paw on each of them is white. Therefore, it's probably the same fox. (Also, I'm well aware this is a 1 year old comment, but it bothered me and I needed to share it =P)
Iroh talked very briefly about his studies on the water benders - so he learnt to redirect lightning. So he definitely travelled around the world. (this was way before Aang was out of the iceberg). He can see spirits and I think he has been travelling into the spirit world maybe through the portals in the North pole. But I also saw him in LOK with a fox. We will probably never know the full explanation of this; but thinking about this is so nice.
Iroh deserves a tv series of his own. There's so much the writers could do: him training with the original fire benders, travelling through the spirit world, and his years as a general.
I think when he saved the dragons they gave him some weird spirit power
I always thought that Iroh could tell that Yue had part of the moon spirit in her because her eyes still had color in them when everything else was in black and white.
b-but... her eyes were closed when he said that...
Favourite myth???
~ Tim
*We landed on the moon. Don't be stupid.
Hello Future Me FIRST
Hello Future Me YEZZZZ I LOVE YOUR VIDS THX FOR THIS!!!!!! :)
i love it i love it i love it
Hey So Uh About Dragons
i saw your Toothless being a titan wing, but in the book he was actually like a god maybe thats what will happen in Films?
Pandora,s box
I have a take on this theory, the old line of Avatars was always supposed to be broken. It wasn't that the fox spirit knew it was going to die but that the line of Avatars would (the layout of statues in the air temple support this). Without their past lives a new Avatar would need a guide in spiritual matters as past Avatars would normally do but they have also lost the collective knowledge and experiences of their past lives. If Iroh were to be one of the foxy knowledge seekers he would have access to the history of past Avatars in the library in order to bridge the gap. It isn't clear that the next Avatars will be connected in the same way as previously so this may actually be needed moving forward. Korra isn't connected to her successor so chose to have letters written by anyone who knew her or Aang to pass down to help bridge this gap. If Avatars weren't connected moving forward such letters would need somebody to pass them down over generations and who better than foxy knowledge spirit Iroh?
I️ Love Nordic mythology. Way more complex than Roman and Greek, and really it’s kind of interesting to read about. (Rick riordan. Or supposedly factional books) really I️ think you should make a video on how the gods in Nordic mythology always seem to be mortal and don’t really like to get involved with people on earth. “BOOM IM DONE ARE YOU PROUD OF ME MISSHIE?” (Paraphrased)
They all come from a cow that licked a rock i think there world veiw is a bit... different than most
Nordic, Celtic and Slavic mythologies are way more complex (and interesting, beatiful) than Greek. Roman mythology is basically copy/paste of Greek mythology.
4:42 “far less materialistic.”
me: suddenly remembering Iroh’s insane shopping spree on that episode where he “lost” his pai sho tiles and there were pirates
I reckon he went to see his son Lu Ten or for an attempt to revive,or maybe he was guided by spirits so that he could later guide Korra
Whatcha think guys?
Uncle Iroh was so special not only for the fans, but for the writers too, that they decided to turn him immortal, so his wisdom will never die.....
Let that sink in..
Dude Zukos reaction to Korra talking to Iroh and him being in the spirit world are incredible. It’s clear that even as an elderly man his uncle still left a massive impact on him.
I’d like to point out a different interpretation,perhaps swing as the moon spirit was a cultural deity, possibly this is what mortal-ized the spirits,I find it to be more likely that iroh was blessed by the fire nation equal (blue dragon ? ) and this knows these things he knows .i just feel it’s a stronger connection to character and story
A popular theory is that stricken with grief over the loss of his son Iroh entered the spirit world on his journey possibly looking for his son’s spirit and/or a spirit that could return his son to him. We saw the face stealer spirit was able to take humans faces so from Iroh’s point of view it could well be within the possibility of a spirit to return a humans soul. While he was in the spirit world although he didn’t get his son back maybe he connected with other spirits and exited the spirit world with a new found appreciation for life, and a new connection to the spirit world
Seeing spirits is just a high level spiritual move. Jinora can see bunny spirits in book 2 when others cant. And iroh did go on a spiritual journey
Awesome theory dude. I really like it! I’m new to your channel but I’ve been watching thru ur old videos. Looking forward to more! 😊
Honestly I never gave it too much thought, because we see a number of humans temporarily enter the spirit world of their own volition - Aang, Jinora, Korra, Zaheer and so on. We learn that it's bad for the body for its spirit to be gone too long, but we don't actually see what would happen to the spirit if the body dies. Since Iroh was nearing the end of his life anyway, he figured it was worth the risk to move there permanently. And with his charm, wisdom and teamaking skills, he managed to find friends among the spirits.
It's true that it's a decision we don't see anyone else make, which is kinda surprising because it worked out pretty well for Iroh. I guess it probably helps to be an airbender to gain this level of spiritual enlightenment and, well, there's a notable shortage of those in the world as it stands. Iroh's study of the other three elements probably helped him raise his own spirituality.
im fairly certain he has never heard of shadows with his whole “3 different spirits” thing
Well done! That is a robust theory around the knowledge Seeker, but also consider the dragons that Aang and Zuko learnt pure firebending from. As the last of their kind they would also benefit from creating horcruxes
I'm thinking that Iroh, on his deathbed, meditated into the Spirit world and never returned
Honestly he could have been another Jinora. Just naturally talented and connected to the spirits. It’s funny that both of them are the oldest when compared to their siblings, so maybe that has something to do with it.
Lol, your girlfriend sounds awesome!
I am pretty cool ;)
She's not his gf, she's the moon now.
The Moon spirit event makes me happy of the idea of Spirit and Human relying on each other.
Moon spirit saving a human and giving them a chance to live a happy life in the hopes when the time comes that human will do the same in their darkest hour, and that human in following through with that faith becomes a part of that spirit and both the better for it. I always adored symbiotic relationships like that between different creatures.
Loving your channel, especially videos like these about avatar
Thank you! I really love making them. I'm happy you enjoyed it so much 😊
~ Tim
When he’s talking about the foxes in one of the episodes and aang’s children got lost Iroh found em and had the fox with the full white chest so maybe that’s how he got so wise or that the fox (full brown) has crossed over the mortal realm and stayed within Iroh?
Prob doesn’t make any sense
I like this theory. Though I think there's just as much likelihood that when Iroh found a way to "pierce the veil" and travel into the spirit world looking for his son, he never entirely made his way back. He might have "one foot in the spirit world". Perhaps it's just easier to travel there once you've figured out how.
Personally, I think this is the best theory you have EVER made. You can clearly see that you put up a lot of work and effort in it and it's very interesting. Keep up the good work.
ALL HAIL MISHKA!!
KAAWWWWW
Antonia Sirotich I was first, check my reply to the first pinned comment. It says 13 minutes ago, and your’s says 12 minutes ago.
Asian Freshy Does it even matter? I mean, I edited my comment anyway so what? Its not a competition you know.
Thank you! I really enjoyed making this one.
~ Tim
Hello Future Me And I really enjoyed watching it!
Not to throw the Seekers out the window, but from the looks of it the Three Seekers we see are likely the same one, or just look alike. Because each have the same markings Just the Shadows and colors altered the perception of the color. The Front left paw is the same as well as the coat of fur on their undersides. It just looks different from again the shadows and the Backdrop color. Also looks like there is some color errors in a few of the Frames.
Besides It wouldnt much Throw the theory out the window, Just thought Id Add that in. Cause you can definatly see the Coat Change color between frames when the Seekers move.
Your thoughts did pass my mind, but I didn't feel I could tell for sure. You may be right though! 😊 after all, it is just a theory.
~ Tim
Yep! You can never be too sure, Its better to have a Consensus than not having one. Besides never hurts to throw in something more for the theory. Doesnt disprove anything just specifies.
They say multiple times knowledge seekers and not seeker in the series, so I think there are a couple of them. Although I do think all of them look really similar with subtle differences due to lighting as you said.
I always thought that some people are born more spiritual than others, but I love your theory better Tim.
Oh and btw, all heil Mishka.
LOL yeah was about to say this. That said, just because we see one doesn't mean there aren't dozens more. I doubt one fox is gonna find all that knowledge by itself.
the quality iroh got from the fox is the sheer charm.. you saw how he got into the earth kingdom!
I’m sorry, never try to turn “Leaves on the Vine” into a comedic point.
Otherwise, fantastic video! Loved it!
This is an awesome video, I absolutely love your Avatar Videos.
I absolutely *love* making them! So it makes me so happy people enjoy watching them.
~ Tim
I love that you love your cat. I don't love how your love of your cat is integrated into your channel.
"One does not just pop in on the spirit world!"
What? That's not how the quote goes? haha
I'm not sure if I buy this one. There's some evidence that contradicts a few things you mention. First off, we hear Azula speak condescendingly about Iroh BEFORE Lu Ten died, referring to him as "His Royal Tea-Loving Kookiness." This seems to imply that he was somewhat mild-mannered and humorous before his son's death, meaning it wouldn't really require a spirit-meld (or whatever we want to call it) to change his personality so drastically.
Also recall that when he laid siege to Ba Sing Se, he was already the "Dragon of the West." In other words, he was already famous for slaying the last dragon, and had already learned the truth of firebending from them.
You also seem to be assuming he was a materialistic militant before his son died, but I don't necessarily think that was the case. Yes, he was an accomplished military leader, but remember that he was also the crowned prince of the Fire Nation. Leading the Fire Nation's forces in major conflicts was kind of a requirement.
Also, considering how human nature works, losing a son is pretty traumatic. It can definitely change a person, for better or for worse, and considering Iroh abandoned the siege right afterwards, I think it's safe to say it changed him. Significantly. That doesn't require a spirit-meld, just raw human emotions.
When it comes to him recognizing Yue's spirit-meld, that doesn't really require supernatural insight, just two eyes, some common sense, and worldly experience. She has white hair. Other than her, the only people with white hair we ever see, from ANY nation, are old. The fact that her hair is white and she is young, and the fish Zhao killed was white, and the moon itself is white... you can see how someone as clever as Iroh would be able to put it together, no spirit required.
All that being said, the fact that he saw the Aang on the dragon, plus Zhao's comment about "rumors," both pretty much confirm he has been to the Spirit World. But that doesn't necessarily mean he's been to Wan Shi Tong's Library, or that he's got a piece of a spirit inside him. If he HAD been to the Library, I expect he would have mentioned that to Zhao when Zhao himself admits HE was at the Library. That's how Zhao found out about the Koi Fish, remember? This also indicates another lapse in logic: the Library is not part of the Spirit World until after Aang and the others visit it. Therefore, if Iroh did indeed visit the Library, it would have been a separate occurrence from his journey to the Spirit World.
Another point of note is that, at least until LoK (which I was not a big fan of btw), the Spirit World was a mysterious ethereal plane of existence. It's possible just being there could have an effect on one's own spirit, and therefore their perception of the world, both in mundane and spiritual matters. This would explain how Iroh was able to see Aang on the dragon, even though no one else could. On the other hand, just going to the Spirit World does not make one wise in and of itself. Sokka went to the Spirit World and came out relatively unchanged. But if Iroh already had the right temperament, knowledge, and experience, a journey to the Spirit World could certainly help him see things from a new perspective, making him wiser simply through the journey itself, not necessarily through a spirit-meld.
It's an interesting concept you bring up, but I don't really think it's feasible as a theory. All other arguments aside, it detracts from something ATLA did very well: character development. People are capable of enormous changes in personality, which can set them on vastly different paths than the ones they started on or expected to walk. Villains can be made into heroes. Heroes can become villains. Normal, average, everyday people can rock the very foundations of the world, if given the opportunity to do so. Saying that a spirit was responsible for altering Iroh's personality, in my opinion, does a disservice both to the quality of the show's writing as well as to human nature as a whole.
Overall I didn't dislike this video. It brought up some fascinating points and made me think about questions I hadn't really considered before. Just because I disagree with some of the points doesn't mean I didn't enjoy watching, and it certainly doesn't mean I discount the value in what you said.
I think the white hair bit in this comment was probably wrong because everyrhing became darker when the moon spirit was killed except yues eyes
One other point about the searches for knowledge… When Tenzin and his siblings met Iroh in the spirit world he had the fox with the fully white chest with him. He had told Iroh that the siblings were in trouble
Please continue to make these videos !
I shall!
~ Tim
“Fully brown” and “patchy” bruh shadows are a thing what’re you talking about
Fur patterns bruh whatre you talking about
"Patchy" does just look like a shadow over the white
Its shadow indeed lol
@@AkimboTimbo Yep. If you look back in the video where he shows the "patchy" helper its full white and turns patchy when it sits. 6:51
Iroh's connection to the moon spirit and the dragons due to his moral standing in terms of how he treats them and his respect and understanding of them, plus his ability to understand that the air nomad genocide was a mistake and also his obligation as head of the white lotus his spirit is part dragon and given those in Chinese mythos are the most spiritual of animals means he would of been granted his right to enter as a spirit guide
"M. Night Shamalamala" Haha :D
Holy shit, if your theory is right, the moon is a somewhere between Sauron and Voldemort.
Chalk Chalkson except not really since it did choose to become a part of the mortal realm, weakening it.
But imagining Sauron and Voldemort as a couple of koi fish swimming in a pond is really too good of a mental image to give up
It is a very interesting theory, and you do a good job articulating it, but I think it takes a few too many liberties with things we don’t know. For instance, we don’t know that Iroh ever went to the library. We don’t know how many knowledge seekers there aren(at least three, but it’s a big building and a big world. Could be scores of them in there) we don’t know that one of them died (he could have just been running an errand).
When his son died, Iroh was broken. He abandoned everything and I think ( but can not prove it) that he went to the spirit world (dunno how) to try to bring his son back. He failed because, as you say, the dead don’t go there. When he came home, though, he was changed by his experiences and was sensitive to spirit stuff, hence being able to see Aang, etc. there was another 20 or 30 years of his life after the war that we didn’t get to see, and whatever allowed him to move there permanently likely happened in that period.
All that said, it is a very interesting theory, and thank you for sharing it
yall forget that scene where tenzin was lost in the spirit world and finds iroh, he asks him how’d he know they were here, which iroh answers: “my friendly spirit fox let me know” or something along the lines.
M Night Shilaminom? That's not a pronunciation I've heard before.
I was just out searching for a new teapot to add to my collection, but instead I found you! - General Iroh
Or like a dragon spirit... “Dragon of the west“ dragon saw in future he would help make sure he would save the dragons 𓆉-save rhe turtles
This was good. It explains that the fox knew it was gonna die because it helped the avatar. I would think that it was banished after the library disappeared and by the time it found iroh again it passed away in his arms wanting go back to the spirit realm and so iroh went to the spirit realm. Forever to explore the knowledge of the spirit realm. The fox gave iroh a part of his wisdom and that is to be open minded. Tea is known to calm the mind and see clearly. Very cool I like it.
I'm sorry but I cannot agree about the knowledge seekers, what you see as different markings seem more like lighting differences due to the environment and pose of the animal.
DracoMhuuh true and it kinda take away iron hardwork and discipline he achieved
Finally I love these vids
Great video, but saying there's only two or three helper spirits in the library because that's all we can see, is like saying that Pakku was the only Waterbending master in the Northern Tribe because he's the only one specifically called a master.
So the dragon of the west is part fox knowledge seeker?
Okay.
The moon dumping thing is a weird trope in so many mythologies, it's a fun thing, when one chooses between a boyfriend and the moon, one chooses the moon every time.
I think the most saddest thing is when zuko acknowledges uncle's lost. Zuko realized the moment his cousin died and as a child doesn't understand what death means.
The moment zuko says about lu ten, "he's probably sad because his son died...forever." Like even though zuko didn't knew iroh that much at the time but it just shows how zuko understands at least the pain of loss as a child even tho he was once considered a non-bender at the time/lack of fire bender skills that he understood that he has the pain of loss that he couldn't get any respect from his dad.
My dude that leaves from the vine joking got me laughing and actually crying tears of sadness
I AM DYING FOR AN IROH SPINOFF !!!!!! He was my favorite character. He has such an interesting backstory we only get very few tiny hints of, he's relatable, n by far the most grounded character in the series. I DEMAND JUSTICE 4 IROH he's rarely shown at full strength, or even serious for that matter, he's mostly used for comedy, n even when he's not like Sozins Comet most of the fight/serious moments happens in the background.