The BMW i3 Is Sketchy In The Snow! Here's How We Fixed It
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- Опубликовано: 3 авг 2024
- Kyle has found the BMW i3 to have a serious issue in the snow after driving them for years on snow and ice. We find out if new software and some Blizzak LM500 winter tires solve the problems on this 2016 BMW i3 Rex that have plagued this car for a long time.
Install and efficiency test of these tires: • Prepping Our BMW i3 Fo...
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#BMW #i3 #Snow
0:00 - Hello and welcome!
0:58 - What's the problem?
5:29 - Here's the fix
6:34 - Driving in the snow
13:21 - Roller Mode (DSC OFF) Skids
16:31 - Did it make a difference? 
Авто/Мото
0:00 - Hello and welcome!
0:58 - What's the problem?
5:29 - Here's the fix
6:34 - Driving in the snow
13:21 - Roller Mode (DSC OFF) Skids
16:31 - Did it make a difference?
Please stop saying RWD is not good in the snow. All other things being equal, it’s the amount of weight over the # of driven wheels that determine traction. Also, put the car in neutral when going down a slippery hill to prevent the regen from unbalancing it. DSC can only do so much.
@@willaerley7140 I had F07 and E60 diesel BMW's and they were not good in the snow. I always used the best Bridgestone snow tires. The E60 almost got stuck in 5 cm of snow. F07 was a lot better, but both of them had a hard time accelerating from 0. Cheap cars are easily overtaking BMW's at the red light during winter. Drifting was fun though, once I had some momentum.
@@gergelyszabo3760 There’s a lot of factors at work here. Wide, low profile snow tires combined with a high torque engine are not optimum in snow. Assuming a 50/50 weight distribution, a fwd version would not perform better. I think a few 50 lb sandbags in the trunk may have helped.
@@willaerley7140 dsc does the same thing in the i3 it put the car into neutral by killing the power to the motor which is all you can do as electric do not have a clutch to disengage the motor from the wheels also he was on brand new summer tires cause I had the same issue with the summer tires my first winter this past second was not harry at all even though they were the exact same summer tires mind you they were some what tore up from having 10k of driving on them at that point mind you with two car accidents and shockingly enough the car stops super fast when I needed it to because the truck IN front of me wanted to stop hard and fast for the car accident ahead
U scare easy! 😉
Driving with summer tires in winter conditions would get you €120 fine in Finland. And if you don't flatbed your car to the nearest tire shop, you could get higher fines or even jail time (max 3-Month)...
That's awesome.
3 years ago I went from Serbia to Finland (over Russia, and back over Oulu and Tornio) in mid July. I had 2 spare tired in my car, both winter, just to be safe.
Finland, home of more top level Rally drivers than almost any other country in the world! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_Rally_Championship_Drivers%27_champions
This isn't Finland mate
@@y0ur_name_here No but the US should follow Finland and the rest of developed countries in regards of using winter tires in winter-conditions
I drive the i3 on a daily basis in Norway (on ice and snow) and it does it well. I would say its a very good car on snow, its fun, agile and have good traction.
I will recommend the i3 for arctic conditions :)
where do you live in norway ??
Kristiansand or Trondheim... Lillehmmer is the optimal test... a city with snow and ice but full of ups and downs..
What did he show on the video?? put winter tires on ??
LOL.. he actually showed NOTHING!!
So glad you made this video, because in 2020 I bought an i3 during the summer in NY and LOVED the vehicle. Since it was my first EV, I had no idea that all of the issues you mentioned that made the vehicle so dangerous in snow without snow tires. My first winter I didn’t get snow tires because I had a second vehicle, but now that I plan on driving this in the snow this year regularly, I just bought the Bridgestone Blizzak tires and am really looking forward to winter now! My first time being caught in snow was one of the most stressful times ever on the road for me because I had cars honking at me just like your father mentioned because I had no acceleration in the snow, and I was literally sliding around on the highway. If anyone is considering the i3 I would recommend to make sure you have the 19” wheels and not the 20” like I had. The issue is that the Blizzak tires only come in 19” so I had to buy not only the tires but the rims as well, but it is well worth it to be able to have fun in the snow! With the right tires, this is a great vehicle and I absolutely love it!
Thanks for sharing! :)
Greetings from Norway! The Nokian Hakkapelitta tire is much better than the Bridgestone. I have driven both in several seasons with real winther condition. Nokia is especially good in icy conditions.
I have the Nokian’s on our Tesla, love them!
Wish I went with those.... Our i3 and Tesla won't make it up our small culdesac and my Hummer comes down it sideways. Can't seem to win.
I had an i3 for 5 years and was living part of the time in the central mountains of Germany (Harz). I obviously invested early in good winter tires from Nokian (Nokian WR D4) on 19” BMW rims (155 all around). Was a good experience and with traction in “TRACTION” mode you could easy dig out of difficult situations. I had also the range extender engine, which definitely helps to get some weight on the back axle. So overall I did not find that the i3 is particularly difficult to drive in the winter. Anyway, cool video of the awesome car 👍⚡️
Is there a reason to go 155 all round? I got 2 sets of factory wheels with my 2018 i3 and I think they are both staggered
@@mtumasz as I’m aware of, only summer tires come in a staggered configuration. 155 front and 175 back. Standard i3 winter tire configurations only come in 155. An overview of possible tire configurations can be found here: goingelectric.de/forum/download/file.php?id=82724
Thnx for making me check. Indeed, my Blizzaks are 155 all round.
Thank you for the vid! Yes, you need proper winter tire in the winter (Bridgeston is an entry level tire), but you also need nice and soft blades/wipers. Take it seriously. You will see micro scratches from spring time when the sun shines through if you do not change it. I live in Norway. I needed to change it yearly, but it worth it.
A European store says there are at least 6 major brands selling winter tires for i3
Please list the stores ?
@@vosaaudits here’s the one I used. It’s in Polish but there is a number of flags to click at the bottom. www.oponeo.pl/opony-do/bmw/i3
Bridgestone Blizzak LM-500
Nokian WR Snowproof
Goodyear UltraGrip Performance +
Michelin Alpin 6
Continental WinterContact TS 850 P
Goodyear UG Performance G1
If you need real wintre roadholding on the i3, go for the Nokian Hakkapelitta R3. I have them on my i3 and I went steep uphill and down snow and ice and had no issue.
Setting Eco Pro+ mode will reduce regen braking, btw.
Yes perfectly true
i got those tires without studs, would NOT recommend that setup on the i3... next time i buy new tires i will go for studs, these narrow tires needs every grip they can get.
@@_TrueDesire_ I would also not recommend using the Nokian Hakkapellitta R3 without its integrated studs. The studs are integral part of the tire itself, so removing the studs is quite a damage.
The studs are little hard plastic pins in the rubber which improve grip on ice. They are road legal and wear down with the rubber of the tire.
Just got my 2015 i3 rex last July. I live in Minnesota. The first snow we had quickly melted then turned to ice. On the freeway it was terrifying. Almost got in accidents several times. This was on factory tires. But, I think the traction control is really good. It saved me every time. But just barely.
Would've liked to see you get on the highway and on some ice.
Mid winter temps dropped to 20 below. I was getting 32 miles on the battery fully charged. Summer is 76-82. Lots of stops to fill the tank.
At those temps you will get a power loss when the Rex kicks in. When the battery gets to 6%, you need to turn off the heat and stay below 70 mph until the Rex catches up and the percentage starts climbing again. You can use the heated seats but it gets cold in there fast at 20 below. Wear thick socks and gloves. And a hat.
It is not a great winter car any way you slice it. But I still love my i3. I'm going to get a newer one when I can afford it and hopefully won't need the Rex.
Snow tires are definitely in my future.
15:37 "It's a giggle machine" - yes, yes it is
BMW RWD in the snow ICE/EV, lovely. In the UK where noone uses winter tyres we love to watch the BMW's on the smallest of hills in the wet snow we get.
No one uses winter tyres in the UK? Well I do...
@@tsb3093 I use crossclimate++
Thank you we learn something new every day
I had an i3 rental car which felt unstable in summer. Then I got my own i3 Rex and of all the cars I have owned so far, it felt the most stable in winter. Of course I am using winter tires and the correct tire pressures. The effect of incorrect tire pressure is significant, the rental i3 did not have the correct pressure and felt really sketchy. By the way the i3 was the first BMW car with a very fast electronic stability control, using a much higher "frame rate" than usual. Which helped making it a very stable and sporty car in my opinion and experience. A warning regarding tires and rims: The summer tires use a wider rim on the rear. The winter tires have the same width in the front and in the rear. The rims are also specified for the left or the right hand side. Which means that i3-unexperienced shops can mess up big time. It also means that you need two set of rims, one for summer and one for winter. Due to the carbon frame it is important the car is jacked up at the correct points of contact.
Regarding wheels: 2017 REX owner for 4 months here. Agree about i3 lightning-fast TC on slippy roads!
Like you, I also understand that we will cause damage if using the (wider) rear tire & wheel up front (clearance, I assume)
However, I can't see any difference side to side.
Do you have a good source for that?
Still running the 19" all-season tires on Giga 5-blade turbine wheels. Seattle-area, so rarely snowbound.
@@donswier There should be markings on the rims. In Germany there are no all season tires which you are allowed to use with the i3 Rex. Things are also complicated by the required load limit. Which means up to now only the Blizzard tires can be used and only a very limited number of rims have the correct size. BMW is also only selling one fitting snow chain, which is rather expensive like all things related to tires on the i3.
Update: Apparently BMW sold rotation specific rims until 2015, which means that for summer tires each rim had an individual place to go to.
Its a regen issue on the gen1. They fixe it on gen2. I own a gen3 i3s.
For me its a super good wintercar. The advanced esp computer mixed with the narrow tyres makes it a very good rwd winter car. I sometimes drive past the bigger 4x4 SUVs because they are to heavy and just end up spinning in the hills.
Thanks for nice video. I live in the west coast of Norway and we have lots of hills and snow here in Winter time.
I feel that the reegen is less stronger when its colder to prevent lose the grip on snow or ice.
I have NOKIA Hakkapalitta on my i3 and they are very good up hills and down hills.
Every car in Norway have to use snow tires in winter and you can get them with studs also. Talking about narrow tires. If you look at the Rally cars they use very narrow tires for winter rally, they use studes on tires also. Narrow tires is good against aquaplaning. Love my i3. :)
Yes, it is less by the sw. when it is cold. I amalso running on Hakka R2. Very good tire, but it wears quickly. I like the winters, with my i3 and I am in Traction mode all the time, but mine worn out in 15k-17k km. Now I have around 3 mm left. Hakka R3 is ordered recently.
@2good2be4gotten I have 120 amp, i think is nearly 38 kwh usable energi.
I havent drove on long trips during the winter, so is difficult to tell.
But my range now its around 240 - 260 KM this is small driving 5 -15 km.
The consumption in summer is around 11,0 kwh pr 100km . Winter 15.0 kwh pr 100km
Summer the range with good condision i get easely 350 km.
I got one with proper winter tyres and each winter I am going skiing driving 150km - no issues at all! Also the narrow tyres are better in winter - check WRC cars
Hmm, did I get this correct: A car (in this case an EV with high regen) on summer tires feels sketchy in the snow ?!
So the headline could be "Cars is sketchy in the snow. Here's how we fixed it" ?
In general: If it is snowing you use winter tires. Especially in places where snow is common (I get why people in Florida doesn't have snow tires, even if it would be snowing like one time in 10 years :))
Here in Sweden you even could get fined if there is risk of frosty or snowy conditions between October - April, if you drive around without winter tires...unfortunately such a law seems to be needed also, since there are always accidents in the begginning of winter becuase of lost traction...although you would think people would know better anyway than to drive on summer tires in the winter when ity happen every year...
Damn that looks like sooo much fun! Hope you have a ton more snowy Colorado videos coming soon.
yeah brand new summers are that much fun not as much fun though once they get tore up some from summer time fun mind you I drive an i3s so my summer tires are the 20's which are over 11 thousand kilometers on them and there still going strong
I can tell he's on brand new summer tires that are in pristine condition cause they are dangerous in the snow more so then after they get broken in a bit
I remember my first winter with my brand new i3s and I hadn't yet got the 20's tore up cause I got it just before winter hit and didn't have enough time to scratch the treads up a bit from sport modeing her in summer time fun
Hi Kyle. I appreciate your reviews. I was wondering beside how it handles in snow with winter tires what is the range like in winter?
Newer Tesla's do not come with the option to turn regenerative braking down to low it is set permanently to standard
Right! Something we’ll have to test for sure
I believe Tesla’s regen cuts back significantly if it feels slipping, I had it happen a few times this week.
Great video thank you. I suspected there would be problems in snow due to the rear wheel drive but was unaware of the additional issues. Here in the UK it doesn’t snow every winter so generally people don’t buy snow tyres. I’m hopefully picking up an i3 in March. I’ll maybe have to stay at home if it snows!
Winter tiers is not a solution, it is mandatory for all cars in snow conditions. The solution for you and your father is education in driving. I guess there is corses in the US. Or consider hiring a Taxi 🚕 during the winter. A quick suggestion, don’t use the throttle as an on and off button. Take care.
Wouldn't either Eco Pro mode be a good idea as well, seeing the throttle response isn't as aggressive? I couldn't tell what mode you were in. Thanks for the vid, getting my snows soon. I'm a newbie 2018 owner, this vid was just what I needed for winter.
He used for most if video😜 same here 2018 since 2 months, factory winter wheels on, first ride in snow ❄️ CHECK!
@@mtumasz Thank you!
I just experienced this exact issue yesterday in my 2018 i3. Was running errands and it started to snow (we've had an unusual absence of snow here in MN.). A light coating, but roads went from dry to slick. I had traction mostly, but when lifting off accelerator, the i3 began to slide in a manner described here, definitely unnerving. I consider myself an excellent winter driver, I was able to adjust. Haven't purchased my snows yet, because we're having an unusually warm winter, still no real snow in the upcoming 10 days.
Love your Videoes!!!!!!!!! great Job
No tires are a must in the i3.
I've never needed them before (our winters are mild), but they are a must have with the i3.
Hi neighbor. I live on Stanford, just off Columbia. Next snow, we should have an i3 drift race around the block. A friend of mine saw you doing your video, sliding around and thought it was me. :)
It's amazing that it's legal to drive on summer tires in snow. In Norway we have to use winter tires from 1st November until April, if you have an accident while using summer tires in winters your insurance won't cover you and you'll probably lose your drivers license.
I commented this on your other snow tire video, but you have the Blizzaks on a rim that is too wide for the tire in the rear. They are meant for 4" wide rims at the max. The rear rims are 4.5" wide, as you mentioned the tire shop missed this and mounted the rear rim on the front. Not a huge difference, but I wonder if that difference in contact patch is affecting the performance and if it will wear the rear tires more aggressively or less. My experience with the 2018 BEV has been great with the ABS blending very seamlessly with regen in cold temps.
I live in Michigan, so I also see real snow situations with my BEV.
Thank you for pointing this out.
How about a new wiper blade?
Your a weirdo
Order a pair for like 45 bucks meant specifically for the i3 from oreillys if in the US. Beats the dealers 90.
I live in Stamford ct shout out to the amazing reviews buying my first EV because of you !
Can I use these tires all year? If so, how often do you think they would need to be replaced?
It must be a night a day difference then to the i3S odel. BMW changed the traction control and for the first time ever in any of their cars the calculations and adjustments happen in the drive unit and it responds 50x faster than any car that sends it out to a control module. The TC in the 2019 S feels seamless. With the exception of steep hills (as with any RWD car) I think my i3s is great to drive in the snow and better than my Hummer H2 in everyday urban winter driving. BMW should have made the traction mode easier to access and with a little more clarity on its importance (better yet a snow mode). I programmed it to memory spot 8 for faster access as I like using it in the summer a lot too as it improves off the line performance as well.
looking to buy a used i3. what model year do you suggest then. I live in a snowy environment like CO
Always start off in eco pro+. and keep it in that mode as often as possible around town.
I have an i3 on in England and on the west facing coast. Actual on-the-ground snow is typically rare - a 1 or 2 day passing event. So never worth buying snow tyres. Every few years you might get a week of it...but again ....what to do?
Maybe its part to do with traction control but I do find with the thin tyres the i3 has always been a squirly thing to drive - snow or not.
I am not sure why i still like the car so much...but I do
There are a lot of cars that are uniquely dangerous in the snow. I've found the Nissan Altima to be one of these which is probably why an all wheel version is now available.
I have a 2016 i3 Rex. Can I put wider tires on the front and back? I heard there is also a spacer kit available.
Im 100% with you..im missing regen control when its slippery. The control isnt enough.
And yes good tires is a must but the characteristics is the same.
If I wanna drift the i3 is great, real fun. But I want my wife to drive the car and not go off the road just because she move her foot of the gas pedal
So ive been rocking mine this whole winter on the all year ecopia 600s. Yes, when you let off the gas pedal and its slick itll butt wobble a bit but the i3 has so many sensors to control its traction and regen its not funny. I have full foot floored it in the ecopia 600s and it doesnt lose control, sure it slips but ive always had full control with the adaptive traction control.
Mine also does the regen control based upon traction and its a 2014. I think in your dads case, the biggest issue was simply it was a brand new to him car and driving in uncertain circumstances.
Ive had my i3 now for 6 months and regen has not been an issue ever
The i3 (or "13" as it looks on the thumbnail) was one of three used EVs I was considering for my first EV purchase (the other two were the VW eGolf and the Kia Soul EV), but those super skinny tires were always worrying to me for several reasons. I ended up with a 2016 Kia Soul EV+ and love it love it love it. Best car I have ever driven, let alone owned. No regrets, but I may be driving that i3 if it had normal width tires on it.
The skinny tires look awkward but they are not an issue. They are skinny but, for such a small car, extremely tall (19 or 20 inch). Therefore, the contact area is similar to that of standard-sized tires of similar cars. The size of contact area is the key parameter for e.g. braking performance.
@@niels5194 I've heard that also, but several reviewers complain about loss of traction on bumpy and/or wet roads. Has anyone tried putting beefier (wider) tires on it to see how it affects performance and efficiency?
Have you had a chance to try the emergency brake by pulling on the parking brake knob? Curious to know if it will still apply ABS while in roller mode.
Unfortunately winter tyres for i3s are not available in the UK. Mine was undrivable for a couple of weeks in the snow this winter.
Driving an i3s for two years, i strongly disagree that regen is the problem. Attempting to drive with summer tires in winter is. Especially the ones of the i3, that are specially made for hot summer conditions; In Europe, we also have all-season-tires.
The traction control software on the first batch of i3 must have been bad all the way. The newer one is better, and starting with the i3s 94 and later the 120-versions, that issue is gone as they implemented the fastest ECU on the market for stabilization, that really utilizes the fast control of the electric motor.
I have seen there is a new option of wider winter tires. at least here in Europe.
Nankang Ice-1 175/60-r19. But they out of stock sadly. I would love to se them tested, if they are any better than those narrow 155s!?
BTW. there are around 10 different winter tyre options for the I3 in 155 width here in europe! :)
have these as rear tires . Paid 127 euros each . Wanted to avoid buying an extra pair of rims only for winter . Nothing unusual to comment .
The bigger issue (believe it or not) is when you get into really deep snow and there is no way to get enough wheelspin to get the car moving, in any available mode. It just sits there and lets the wheels turn about half a turn at a time..
Is there any way a snow tire for the i3 ?? I live in a seasonal city and we get snow rarely . I get the hydro planing and the issue with its traction but what if there was a heavier tire created for the electric cars for snow only? These tires will need changing but for isolated purposes there should a heavy tire
I3 winter Tires should be wider
Hello from mountains in middle Europe, I prefer winter tires Michelin Alpin and to be honest we are not allowed to drive on summer tires in the winter here.. :-)
I think the problem lies between the steering wheel and the seat.
👍🏻😁
BMW engineers have refined the software 2017 onward, When set in Eco+ mode with traction mode the i3 is excellent in snow, Refined and super safe when used with winter tires. Winter Tyre's are needed at temperatures 7 Degree and below, as the Rubber doesn't harden as do summer tires. Even if you don't experience snow, when the climate Changes 7 Degree and down, put on winters!! " The Cut-In-Sipes will adhere to cold wet roads as well as the snow" . Thanks for Posting Vid
Why does the speedometer screen flash?
Here in Switzerland, only crazy people use summer tires in the snow. Besides, you will get a big fine and insurance won’t cover you in case of accident ..
How much battery do you lose in the cold weather
We’ll be testing that!
my uses with heating on about 25% more, without heating it‘s still 10% more then on a warm day.
Driving in winter conditions with summer tires is not allowed in Germany. Everyone doing this is a danger to others and should be sued. This is not the problem of the car. However regen braking of the i3 is too strong for slippery conditions. I had issues on steep winter roads 20% plus. Downhill better switch to Neutral and use the friction brake. The other dangerous situation was at higher speed when lifting the accelerator abruptly. It is the same effect as using the hand brake, to the rear of the car tends to overtake you. Some people say Comfort mode reduces regen, I would go to traction. On the LCI facelift model from 2017 on there should be improvements on this issue.
The i3 n Fords Mach E are the best ev's out there pity bmw will be discontinuing production of the i3 it's a true icon which could've been the top ev for yrs to come with a little more development
hills in Ft Collins ?...not a common sight.
drift vid please
So the solution is to use snow tires in snow conditions??? WOW! Blows my mind! 🙄
Pro tip from Europe: Always use snow/winter tyres as soon as the temperature is below 45 °F. You will have much more traction and grip in corners and for braking.
I have driven an 2018 F80 M3 on summer tires in the snow.
I have no concern my new 2020 i3s on summer tires is going to be an issue 😂
Maybe so ,but it does make a massive difference the winter tyres
haha so cool!
Snow tyres utterly useless in UK where snow is quite rare - but can come instant overnight but by nextday after all gone. Need 'fix' that doesn't involve swapping to winter tyres on/off every few days or weeks.
Snow tyres are not just for the snow they work better in any conditions less than 7c,(due to softer compound I think? )
it's so bad in the snow, it slides out of control for 100 feet in any direction and the generative braking making it slide like you are on skies when the tires try to regen, turning that off isn't possible since it's a built in regenerative feature, it's less but not gone, and the sensors getting any amount of snow makes them go off when there is nothing there, totally dangerous in the snow.
Drive a 2WD in the snow?
I am from Georgia, why am I watching this. I am not even in the possibility of snow, mountain area of Georgia.
rwd with wide tires .. is poor in the snow. my old rwd Volvo with narrow tires wasn't too bad
I often wonder if Americans have any knowledge and experience of driving in snowy/icy conditions. As soon as there is snow in USa, we get to see chaotic news entries of car sliding on American roads. I guess most of you still carry on driving summer tires in the snow and on ice right? How come snow and ice cause so much chaos on American roads ( we have like 5.5 months of snow and ice each winter here in Sweden, and public life and transport just carries on as normally) ?
Walmart sells temporary plastic tire chains.
So your dad has no idea how to drive a RWD without snow tires on the snow. Damn.
Do You want to drive on the snow same like on summer time!?! No go!
"Problem" not "issue".
skinny tyres should be ideal in snow
so snow tires are better in the snow
I kind of expected a more substantial answer than "we put on proper snow tires on the car". But hey, it was fun to see the difference.
That being said, yes...proper winter tires will go through winter easier. That's...kind of a given. Maybe it's a Québec thing to think that's obvious since we're legally obligated to have winter tires between the 15th of November and the 15th of March, I don't know...
But yes, winter tires...will do better during the winter. I mean...uh...yes.
. . . and his dad is Marc Harman. Who would have thunk? HA!
Just on the old ones, just stop yanking your foot off of the pedal. Lol. You can see on the bar how far its going towards regen. You dont "leg off the gas" in this car.
I love so many things about this car... we live in CO and this video convinced me not to buy this car, LOL
You don't have to come to a complete stop in your country? Stop sign at 15:43
Watch out folks, the RUclips police is here!
Nope, it's just suggested. In fact many states are removing stop signs all together.
This video is just dumb in my opinion. If you guys were a little more enlightened, you would know its huge differences between the winter tires...
All i3' that use 3G wifi service will cease to have navigation, connect drive services, no more app services, no more satellite radio, no more voice control, no bluetooth, no SOS, no more updates after February 2022..
These cars will be useless and can not be updated to 4G. BMW is blaming cellular services. BMW will not update these i3' to 4G.
I thought this would be an informative video, but the "magic" trick was to put on winter tires? Seriously?! 😂 If you are dumb enough to drive in snow on summer tires, then don't drive in snow 🤣
I appreciate your discussion about driving the i3 in the snow. We rarely have snow in the south but we had a snow storm last night and my i3 drove excellent in the snow this morning...without snow tires. It feels so much more stable than any conventional vehicle I have had before. I have had that same stable, steady and confident experience while driving my i3 during heaving storms. I do appreciate your advice to put the car in eco pro and turn on the traction but I must say I disagree with you and your dad about how the car reacts in the snow. I have a 2018 REX so maybe there is a difference in the programing. Anyway, I greatly appreciate the enthusiastic and detailed discussion and your tips. One more quick comment: The Blizzak LM-500 tires you recommended are only available for the front rims for the 2018 as the back tires are a wider size. @tjsean0308 also comments on this below as well.