Dr. Cornel West of Union Theological Seminary speaks at 'Keeping Ferguson Alive!' about a healthy atheism. Full video: new.livestream.com/unionsemin...
Yeah, man. West is pretty tolerable for a theist - especially a public theist. Normally, they're insufferable dicks. Like, for example, William Lane Craig. That guy is crazy dishonest. Still, even he's not as bad as some of the deeply fucking crazy ones. Anyway, yeah, Cornel West, seems a really decent guy.
Rick Wolford I feel like I am in the position Cornel West. I think he is a closeted agnostic. He just uses a (not "the") Christian tenet of love and justice for ethical political reasons.
@@callidusvulpes5556 Dr. Cornel West is absolutely not an agnostic in any sense of the word. His Christianity is at the center of all his values, he says this time and time again. His interpretation of the gospels is what leads him to all of his other conclusions. It is a grotesque misrepresentation to suggest anything else. I myself am a hardcore atheist, I know for a fact that there is no God, but Cornel West has and always will be someone I strive to be like. As he said, secular folk, Jews, Muslims, Christians, etc. will all have their language for it, but the values you espouse are what matters the most. This is the best response I have ever heard a Christian give regarding atheism. "The god they've lost faith in was probably an idol anyway." I admire this man and will always look up to him. If everyone did Christianity the way Dr. West does, the only thing I would have to say is, "hallelujah, and praise Jesus."
@@stijndelie1458 Simply put, Nihilism in the grand scheme of things hasn't led to any noteworthy form of progress whatsoever. Why? This is because fundamentally, that philosophy/school of thought is devoid of any form of impactful responsibility. Having hope is a responsibility all on its own and further creates and has treated better result]s over time
I love Cornell, I’m an atheist and a socialist from the rural south, I’ve been hearing him speak since I was a teenager and he has left a profound impact on me. I will always hold in my heart a deep respect for him and what he does.
Me as well (atheist and socialist from the rural south), are you a green anarchist? I’m not sure ALL forms of authority are inherently negative, I think that ones that don’t derive their authority from the people are and ones that don’t have any checks to their authority are, but I also do believe anarchism can work and has proven to work in places such as Revolutionary Catalonia.
@@callidusvulpes5556 nah I’m not an anarchist I’m a green eco-socialist who’s more market oriented rather than favoring planned economy. I mostly support things like worker cooperatives, but I want to nationalize some things. I want to have a very democratic republic with more democratic structures and institutions. And I want strong protections for human rights, and for us to expand what human rights are.
@@democracydignityhumanrights I suppose that’s my view as well, I generally want to nationalize certain industries that are necessities such as healthcare, electricity, and water. I stray away from being called eco or vegan since it makes it seem as if I’m only subscribed to one or I’m doing it primarily for the environment or veganism.
His wisest words (that I've heard so far). A true leader- most of all because his message transcends racial, religious, and political boundaries. To see the whole picture engenders compassion, and real compassion drives an honest person to perceive the whole. The less easy a noble aim is, the more noble and important it becomes. We all gravitate to the ideas we think the most true, and naturally defend those ideas against all those who can't see eye to eye with us; yet in spite of all our divisions and disagreements as individuals and tribes and nations, ultimately we are all human beings on a tiny speck in a backwater of this stupendously vast and mysterious cosmos. We are all primitive hominids whose similarities encompass us more than our imagined differences. This is the truth, and no amount of propaganda can truly disprove or bury it. Many do not see, or even deliberately choose not to see the nature of our collective predicament (whence comes the lion's share of our species' problems)- which is that we are all one, and that this statement is true in spite of all our ignorance and competing agendas. From the perspective of cosmic harmony, to harm another is the same as harming yourself- and by harming oneself, you deprive others of your potentially very good work. To silence others is to silence yourself, for in our interconnectedness the tables can always turn on a dime, and the shoe is perpetually capable of finding itself on the other foot. So many media icons- when they aren't promoting hatred and division- sell platitudes and slogans cooked up by focus groups and public relations advisors, messages designed to lull the fragmented masses to sleep and lead them in the paths of war, without changing anything of substance in the system, and without truly committing themselves to this aforementioned truth of our common destiny. Far too few of our so-called "thought leaders" authentically promote the message Brother West is preaching here, which is the same message that all great souls have preached since time immemorial, regardless of their ethnic, cultural, religious, political or scientific affiliations: namely, that we're all in this together, and failing to deeply integrate this basic truth leads every individual- and thereby their nation and world- to needlessly march unthinkingly off a precipice into untruthful conflict with their brothers and sisters, their elders and children, and in the end leads humanity into an adversarial relationship with the whole web of life on this incredibly beautiful and delicate and sacred planet. Divided we shall undoubtedly fall, but together we can stand higher than we have ever stood before. But we have to be willing to put aside our personal prejudices, and reach out and listen to those we perceive as different from us. No one person or group understands the totality of our problems. Only through good-faith communication can we collectively as a species find our way forward into the best possible future. It's not about being a Yes-man or abandoning your principles, whatever they may be. It's about recognizing our common humanity, and working from there to transcend our differences and thereby working towards the common good: a better future for us all. Honest and respectful communication is the cornerstone of progress and peace.
Very deep and comprehensive analysis of human beings as we are. What about sacred literature that answers all of our collective as well as individual problems? Do you find value in the scriptures that are not only beautiful, but validating the Absolute Truth? I do because this ability to become self-realized is available only in humans. Animal life has no such chance. Human life is the rare opportunity given for higher consciousness.
“In the academy, everybody wants to be smart. That’s nothing but idolatry. Nothing but idolatry. Let the phones be smart, you’ve got to be wise.” God, I love this man.
I'm agnostic with inclination on Christianity as a religious language to communicate with God. A portion of this is due to Dr. West, Dr.MLK, Dr. Cone, Dr. Aslan,Dr. Spong, Dr. Erhman. Whom with their knowledge, wisdom, and experience have collectively helped me to understand a most complicated subject of theology in a healthy, more beneficial way for myself, and others around me.
To understand God we need to explore our innermost cosmology.. You are not the body... You are not the mind... You are the soul... Soul is the omnipresent, omnipotent...., The eternal God which exists in each one of us.... Idol worship is misleading.... Have love for your self... Explore....
@@MrStaano Primordial energy is another word.. It alpha Omega of all both gross and subtle manifestations in the universe... Heaven and hell are right here.... You can create your own hell here... Please help yourself..
@@radhakrishna1845 You are juggling words making word salad, dude. Primordial energy. Give me a break...... Is your "chakra" or äura" in balance?? hahahah !!! You think we humans have souls. You have no proof. You are just indoctrinated by thousands of years of ignorance and mythical thinking. We humans didnt know anything about anything. Rationality and science made us less ignorant and improved our lives. Not your deepak chopra mumbo jumbo. With respect of course. Although you were so arrogant to think i need help........ You might be the one that needs help and cant life without makebelief fairytales. Think. Its 2018. Dragons, demons and angels never existed.
I believe in love and justice, I just believe it comes from us. All we have is each other. The hardest thing to do is to make THIS WORLD better. The next, is not in our grasp
Wow, this is a believer I can totally respect as a former Christian and current atheist. I would love to spend time talking with him. I am totally open to there being the kind of god he talks about. A god that is truly an embodiment of love and justice I would totally be down with. Problem is that I have studied the Bible in my time as a believer, even graduated from Bible college. The god of the Bible is not a god of love. A god of love does not have a person tortured for an eternity for simply asking honest questions and following their rational mind if that leads to atheism.
I don’t think any entirety as powerful as described as such would even care in having someone worship them. The biggest problem is that the Bible was written by men, and has often been the mechanism for power in history. Also, the word does not function rationally, at the very least not in the way logic leads to truth. So weird. Maybe god lies between religions, maybe gods doesn’t e it’s within religions, regardless dogmatism is te key danger
I see this is two years old, but I think you have a tragic misunderstanding of what the bible says. Eternal life is only mentioned in reference to those saved by grace. "Fear the one who can destroy both body and soul in hell". The bible makes it clear that the antithesis to eternal life through grace is the death of the soul: ceasing to exist.
There are scriptures that have everything the Bible has, but have even more in addition, and if one loves the knowledge of the Absolute Truth, one will love the Vedas. krishna.org/bhagavad-gita-as-it-is-original-1972-edition-free-pdf-download/
Wow this is what was in my mind towards most atheists but didnt know how to explain it. I am muslim and I love this guy. PS. I want hell if my prophets are not in the heaven that I thout is heaven.
.Sir, I support Bernie as well as I support u. Although I've become used to ya'lls belief in fairytales, my family are believers, I still think ur belief is ur right, & I appreciate ur comments on non-believers! Bernie for President in 2020!
I heard another conversation of Cornel West and I think he uses Christianity as a philosophy rather than a religion in the true sense, especially some of the teachings of Christ. I remember he used the word humility for him being Christian, which suggests to me his family and environment was mostly Christian and brought him up as thus. And maybe not to ruffle a few feathers he has merged those teachings into his logical outlook. However I may be wrong.
I've been an atheist for over twelve years now, but I was never more convinced of the correctness of my atheism when when that Evangelical claimed that Trump spoke with the words of god. Idolatry, level 'Epic'.
Something higher than yourself can be anything that connects you to the reality outside of your own subjective experience. The problem I have with faith based beliefs is that the "something higher" always has to be divine or supernatural in some way. None of that is necessary. You can start a community garden that helps improve diets with your neighborhood. You can dedicate your time to teaching or volunteer work. You can literally live your life as normal as possible and just be a nice /caring person and you'd be connecting with something higher. Until people can understand that if we want the world to be a better place then we have to work together to make that possible. Supernatural and magical nonsense is irrelevant to that vey fact.
ty Brother West! Watched this up to about 03:08 when I burst into uncontrollable laughter. Not wanting to do anything but leave a tender moment alone, I didn go further with video nor will I now go into a harang gay as my mother used stay about the unsurpassed moral evil of promoting false beliefs and primitive thinking, especially for those who can least afford them .
I appreciate that atheism wasn't condemned here as evil; but I certainly don't agree with a lot of what he said. Still, I appreciate that he had a more positive look on atheism .
Yes, I understand why he said it and I don't think man knows a god, or that there are even any gods to be known. My comment here was to show appreciation that I was not demonized or condemned as many religious zealots do here on RUclips. If you want to talk religion, send me a message, I don't want my appreciation here watered down by a debate.
What I think is particularly nice is that it doesn't seem like his concern is really over claims about existence. It's not about 'god' being a deity that exists as is with traditional Christianity, Judaism, or Islam. His concern seems be more about moral action and virtue. He says he puts Jesus as the center of it, but that's only a traditional symbolic think (from what I can tell of West's various writings and interviews). That is, Jesus as a model for how to live a life. And even then, you see West picks up on some very specific characteristics of Jesus, and not others. For instance, if Carrier's arguments against the historicity of Jesus were to become mainstream historical opinion, I don't think it'd matter for West.
Agnostic Cynic The idea is simple. From a strictly anthropological stance, you can show that you can't have more then 200 people working together without structure and without fiction. From 200 and below you can have anarchic structures where everybody forms personal bonds with everybody else. This goes for our primate cousins too, it's not exclusively human in nature. And labeled as fiction, easily provable, are the following less obvious notions; money, states, corporations, sports teams, logos etc. So even if you don't believe in God any more, you might still believe in the supernatural, the corporation, derived from the word corpus(body), which ironically lacks one. I can name more then one anti-theist spokesperson with wild outlandish beliefs (pure idolatry). So even if the church is not progressive but reiterates what the community wants to hear, it provides cohesion. So we atheists have to have a sense of belonging, a spirituality (as close to reality as science has to give it) that will show our place in our families, groups, on the planet, in the universe etc. Spirituality is not some woo woo notion, it is the feeling of knowing where you stand. As an atheist I see no better tool then science for it. And I see very few better allies then Cornell West and the fellows in that church. I've just discovered Sekou and if you hear him speak and don't know it, you can swear he's an atheist, quoting Zizek, explaining what the church actually is, how changes are secular grassroots in nature etc. etc. Everything you and I know. Same goes for Cornell who is a philosopher for whom god is a construct, a philosophical prop.
People continue to have faith. They have faith in things which sadly will not lead them to higher consciousness, but animalistic life, of eating, sleeping, mating and defending only. Faith is naturally there, like a person getting a haircut or shave by a barber has faith that their throat won't be slit by the razor. Or simple faith that a bank will keep their money protected. So where there is light, there cannot be darkness. But remember too, where there is darkness, there cannot be light either. Losing faith in a false God, by accepting and understanding in faith who is actually God in truth should be the goal, not atheism.
He actually did. He's arguing at atheists are often justified in loosing their faith since the "god" that they lost faith in was probably confined to a certain set of dogma. He then calls the atheists to ask themselves the question on wether or not they still open to the idea of God and the transcendent. I have a few qualms with his argument, but he answered it well.
@Kevin Cobb We can read of God’s most trusted, to have been blessed with some of the greatest trials. It’s almost as if the mutual unknown is the only space for faith and belief. To have belief and faith and hope is never to know. Be mindful of this nuance. To know is to not have any room for faith and acting in faith. The genius of Dr West, is that he has a room for flexibility and fluidity for exploring other value structures that all move toward to the harmony and masterpiece of moving towards oneness. Perhaps a little more than some Christians who have a difficulty to embrace others value structures. I may be wrong in his literal claiming of knowing with a certainty, yet I, as a Christian, follow his work ‘religiously’(excuse the pun) and observe him to be one of the most open minded Christians. Omnist almost. This makes me respect his beliefs and assertions of what is real to him, a whole lot more than the arrogance of ‘knowing’ where there is no room for evolution and engaging with a mutual humility of being uplifted and edified together with someone of differing beliefs. Don’t you think?
@Kevin Cobb Thank you for your reply. I like the framing of your reflections and observations. I think we can quite confidently deduct that the ‘quest’ for truth or goodness, is indeed a more dynamic process, than such as can be ascribed to a ‘Jesus is the way’ framework. We can observe this with the heinous and barbaric movements of Christian groups in antiquity and up to this present day in catholic priests. The choices that one makes within the constructs of their own moral dichotomy’s and paradigms are surely where these ‘lies, untruths and evils’ manifest themselves in a completely arbitrary fashion, as we do not know the mental state of the individual. To construct a model of comparative evilness and try to distill a gauge of ‘more sinful’ is perhaps debunked by the clever metaphors of the effort that one sometimes does to remove the speck of wood from another person’s eye, while ignoring the 2 by 4 in their own eye. Although this ‘gauge’ and measurement of evilness is necessary to have some form of cohesion, it is surely not the exact measure of evilness and subsequent imprisonment is not actually about rehabilitation or Christlike forgiveness, it is about an inaccurate punishment and increase of likelihood to reoffend, yet quenching our desire for justice. Surely a flawed concept and not parallel with Christian teaching. But I digress. I might leave it there in anticipation for your response and perhaps finish with a thought I use sometimes. Being raised Christian, I found the religious upbringing like a beautiful scaffolding. A way to navigate around a building sight and to build my own home and value structures. When I developed my own home and values, the scaffolding became an inhibiting structure that blocked my view. For some the scaffolding becomes the building itself and one never builds their own value structures to look outwards, instead the scaffolding becomes their home and then continually look inwards, reinforcing the framework they stand upon. This scaffolding may serve them well and be a fine dwelling. I sense that we are integrally our own beings with opportunities to magnify our talents with perhaps the same moral compass that everyone has. Like homes that are all different yet all of value in their unique way and as long as there is a respect for each other’s unique homes and value structures, we can perhaps continue to see the moving moral zeitgeist in a good direction as we battle with these dichotomy’s of discerning our own heaven and hell and our own evil and goodness with each decision, without requiring a certain type of scaffolding to be deemed as the most useful one to build our own homes with. Blessings from a loving atheist 🙏🏾
God is not our order supplier. Whether He is useful or not is the attitude adjustment to be addressed. God is the well-wishing friend of His devotee. He can be the enemy of His enemy as well. If we really want to use God, He may consent to this, if we love and understand Him, or simply beg for His mercy and benevolence upon us, being needy for so many things. It's up to the mind of the human living entity, which is our rare opportunity in life. Animals have no such chance to have an actual relationship with God. Animals are conditioned to eat, sleep, mate and defend, full stop, period. Read if you are serious, my brother: krishna.org/bhagavad-gita-as-it-is-original-1972-edition-free-pdf-download/
@@tulayamalavenapi4028 I'm so serious that I've cursed that God repeatedly for his utter incompetence and hatred towards people that look like over the centuries.
@@thethird1967 Modern scientists, their first business is to deny that Supreme. That is modern. It is a curse for the scientist if they talk of God. Amongst the scientists this is an etiquette, not to talk of God. Everything science. Means everything nonsense, passing on as scientist. Do you believe this? Or how does your curse affect your actions?
Atheist are wounded but grown folks who believe in talking animals are considered healthy. Atheist need help but the ancestors of slaves subscribing to the god of their oppressor are doing just fine. Its a cold game
No, as an atheist I know my insignificance in the universe. I am atheist because I know that the so called holy books are full of errors, clearly are not holy and have many toxic things in them.
@@simstar6557 Ok, well, since you already know it all, good luck, but just because you don't believe there isn't a God, that doesn't mean He doesn't exist. You see, it's not only about YOU!!!!
@@dransomb1 you miss the point. I don't know it all. I am a life long student who will still die not knowing many things known even today. I just know more than the crazy people who wrote said holy books, as should any average semi educated person today. Don't let these absurd books become your idols. Believing in known to be erroneous things is not smart. Most of these holy books contradict even themselves, never mind today's science. Saying with confidence that such error ridden books are true and even holy is real arrogance, not people who are willing to admit that we need to put collective effort to discover the truth in a sensible way.
False equivalence; Atheism does have a better position because of a lack of wishful-thinking. It is therefore a clearer and more objective standpoint. Interesting speech nonetheless of the Matrix guy.
+MexxPowers but you are making a statement of metaphysics which is about self-perception. As Wittgenstein argues Atheism like theism has its weakness in skepticism.
@Kevin Cobb that would be humanism, not atheism. Atheism simply says there is no proof for any gods or goddesses. It makes no statements on humanity. Although atheists often are humanists, you don't need to be. You can think humans are a cruel and destructive species and still be an atheist.
@Kevin Cobb you still don't get it. Atheism is simply rejecting magical thinking which can no longer be defended. Other philosophies that one may hold are orthogonal. You can believe in many things larger than you while being an atheist, just don't have the arrogance to say that you have a direct line to the purely fictional creator of the universe. Saying we have to figure things out because no else will for us and we will make mistakes along the way is humility. People who insist that their fantasy belief or book is true no matter the evidence are arrogant.
@Kevin Cobb also there is no reasonable possibility of gods. The possibility is only an unreasonable one. Theists vastly inflate that and insist that they receive special privileges for that.
Atheist - this is gonna be a great video because West is an educated man and knows his stuff. Glad to see he knows that atheism is the smart choice. (After listening to West) Atheist - (sound of crickets)
I'm an athiest and I think that brother West is a great man, disagreement does not necessitate hatred.
I still disapprove of all religions though as fundamentally religion is a subscription to irrationality.
Yeah, man. West is pretty tolerable for a theist - especially a public theist. Normally, they're insufferable dicks. Like, for example, William Lane Craig. That guy is crazy dishonest. Still, even he's not as bad as some of the deeply fucking crazy ones. Anyway, yeah, Cornel West, seems a really decent guy.
@@callidusvulpes5556 Hell, yeah, I can get behind that statement!
Agree 100%
Una lástima que no esté subtitulada en español
I'm a de facto atheist and I love this guy. One of my heroes.
+Rick Wolford same here
same!
Rick Wolford
I feel like I am in the position Cornel West. I think he is a closeted agnostic. He just uses a (not "the") Christian tenet of love and justice for ethical political reasons.
@@Insert639 Yeah, I wonder if he’s possibly agnostic. I’m agnostic-atheist as I believe no god is the most likely possibility.
@@callidusvulpes5556 Dr. Cornel West is absolutely not an agnostic in any sense of the word. His Christianity is at the center of all his values, he says this time and time again. His interpretation of the gospels is what leads him to all of his other conclusions. It is a grotesque misrepresentation to suggest anything else. I myself am a hardcore atheist, I know for a fact that there is no God, but Cornel West has and always will be someone I strive to be like. As he said, secular folk, Jews, Muslims, Christians, etc. will all have their language for it, but the values you espouse are what matters the most. This is the best response I have ever heard a Christian give regarding atheism. "The god they've lost faith in was probably an idol anyway." I admire this man and will always look up to him. If everyone did Christianity the way Dr. West does, the only thing I would have to say is, "hallelujah, and praise Jesus."
Cornel West has been my inspiration for a long time. He gives me faith in humanity.
i'm stuck between George carlin's cynical nihilism and Cornel west's hopeful love motivated idealism
@@stijndelie1458 Simply put, Nihilism in the grand scheme of things hasn't led to any noteworthy form of progress whatsoever. Why? This is because fundamentally, that philosophy/school of thought is devoid of any form of impactful responsibility. Having hope is a responsibility all on its own and further creates and has treated better result]s over time
Let the phone be smart you gotta be wise....I love this guy
I love Cornell, I’m an atheist and a socialist from the rural south, I’ve been hearing him speak since I was a teenager and he has left a profound impact on me. I will always hold in my heart a deep respect for him and what he does.
Me as well (atheist and socialist from the rural south), are you a green anarchist?
I’m not sure ALL forms of authority are inherently negative, I think that ones that don’t derive their authority from the people are and ones that don’t have any checks to their authority are, but I also do believe anarchism can work and has proven to work in places such as Revolutionary Catalonia.
@@callidusvulpes5556 nah I’m not an anarchist I’m a green eco-socialist who’s more market oriented rather than favoring planned economy. I mostly support things like worker cooperatives, but I want to nationalize some things. I want to have a very democratic republic with more democratic structures and institutions. And I want strong protections for human rights, and for us to expand what human rights are.
@@democracydignityhumanrights I suppose that’s my view as well, I generally want to nationalize certain industries that are necessities such as healthcare, electricity, and water.
I stray away from being called eco or vegan since it makes it seem as if I’m only subscribed to one or I’m doing it primarily for the environment or veganism.
The heart only pumps blood.
You are not really listening to what he said in the first 1:30 of this video. In my opinion, it is pure manipulative religious BS..
"Let the phones be smart; you got to be wise." Wow.
Brother west is a real man of honour and values and being an atheist I revere him way more than some well renowned atheists.
That´s nice. Who are you?
0:12 What made that microphone slide extra funny was that grinding sound.
His wisest words (that I've heard so far). A true leader- most of all because his message transcends racial, religious, and political boundaries. To see the whole picture engenders compassion, and real compassion drives an honest person to perceive the whole. The less easy a noble aim is, the more noble and important it becomes.
We all gravitate to the ideas we think the most true, and naturally defend those ideas against all those who can't see eye to eye with us; yet in spite of all our divisions and disagreements as individuals and tribes and nations, ultimately we are all human beings on a tiny speck in a backwater of this stupendously vast and mysterious cosmos. We are all primitive hominids whose similarities encompass us more than our imagined differences. This is the truth, and no amount of propaganda can truly disprove or bury it.
Many do not see, or even deliberately choose not to see the nature of our collective predicament (whence comes the lion's share of our species' problems)- which is that we are all one, and that this statement is true in spite of all our ignorance and competing agendas. From the perspective of cosmic harmony, to harm another is the same as harming yourself- and by harming oneself, you deprive others of your potentially very good work. To silence others is to silence yourself, for in our interconnectedness the tables can always turn on a dime, and the shoe is perpetually capable of finding itself on the other foot.
So many media icons- when they aren't promoting hatred and division- sell platitudes and slogans cooked up by focus groups and public relations advisors, messages designed to lull the fragmented masses to sleep and lead them in the paths of war, without changing anything of substance in the system, and without truly committing themselves to this aforementioned truth of our common destiny. Far too few of our so-called "thought leaders" authentically promote the message Brother West is preaching here, which is the same message that all great souls have preached since time immemorial, regardless of their ethnic, cultural, religious, political or scientific affiliations: namely, that we're all in this together, and failing to deeply integrate this basic truth leads every individual- and thereby their nation and world- to needlessly march unthinkingly off a precipice into untruthful conflict with their brothers and sisters, their elders and children, and in the end leads humanity into an adversarial relationship with the whole web of life on this incredibly beautiful and delicate and sacred planet.
Divided we shall undoubtedly fall, but together we can stand higher than we have ever stood before. But we have to be willing to put aside our personal prejudices, and reach out and listen to those we perceive as different from us. No one person or group understands the totality of our problems. Only through good-faith communication can we collectively as a species find our way forward into the best possible future.
It's not about being a Yes-man or abandoning your principles, whatever they may be. It's about recognizing our common humanity, and working from there to transcend our differences and thereby working towards the common good: a better future for us all.
Honest and respectful communication is the cornerstone of progress and peace.
Very deep and comprehensive analysis of human beings as we are.
What about sacred literature that answers all of our collective as well as individual problems? Do you find value in the scriptures that are not only beautiful, but validating the Absolute Truth?
I do because this ability to become self-realized is available only in humans. Animal life has no such chance. Human life is the rare opportunity given for higher consciousness.
“In the academy, everybody wants to be smart. That’s nothing but idolatry. Nothing but idolatry. Let the phones be smart, you’ve got to be wise.”
God, I love this man.
←Another atheist who loves Cornel West. I agree with what he says about love and justice, and well pretty much every thing else I've heard him say.
I'm agnostic with inclination on Christianity as a religious language to communicate with God. A portion of this is due to Dr. West, Dr.MLK, Dr. Cone, Dr. Aslan,Dr. Spong, Dr. Erhman. Whom with their knowledge, wisdom, and experience have collectively helped me to understand a most complicated subject of theology in a healthy, more beneficial way for myself, and others around me.
It's fine to ask questions. It helps move from a bad place to a better place.
To understand God we need to explore our innermost cosmology..
You are not the body...
You are not the mind...
You are the soul...
Soul is the omnipresent, omnipotent....,
The eternal God which exists in each one of us....
Idol worship is misleading....
Have love for your self...
Explore....
Who says you have a "soul"? Unproven concept...... Wishfull thinking. Your "soul" will fly up to a heaven when you die ?? Please.......
@@MrStaano
Primordial energy is another word..
It alpha Omega of all both gross and subtle manifestations in the universe...
Heaven and hell are right here....
You can create your own hell here...
Please help yourself..
@@radhakrishna1845 You are juggling words making word salad, dude. Primordial energy. Give me a break...... Is your "chakra" or äura" in balance?? hahahah !!! You think we humans have souls. You have no proof. You are just indoctrinated by thousands of years of ignorance and mythical thinking. We humans didnt know anything about anything. Rationality and science made us less ignorant and improved our lives. Not your deepak chopra mumbo jumbo. With respect of course. Although you were so arrogant to think i need help........ You might be the one that needs help and cant life without makebelief fairytales. Think. Its 2018. Dragons, demons and angels never existed.
Hebrews 11:38 ".....the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, living in caves and in holes in the ground"
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin, that we might be made the righteousness of God on him. (kjv) II Corinthians 5:21
I believe in love and justice, I just believe it comes from us. All we have is each other. The hardest thing to do is to make THIS WORLD better. The next, is not in our grasp
This is true, we are programmed from an evolutionary standpoint to be empathetic and therefore cooperative.
You got me dead centre, Cornel - I have indeed taken part in the idolatry of Intelligence.
Wow, this is a believer I can totally respect as a former Christian and current atheist. I would love to spend time talking with him. I am totally open to there being the kind of god he talks about. A god that is truly an embodiment of love and justice I would totally be down with. Problem is that I have studied the Bible in my time as a believer, even graduated from Bible college. The god of the Bible is not a god of love. A god of love does not have a person tortured for an eternity for simply asking honest questions and following their rational mind if that leads to atheism.
Matt Alley "Seek and ye shall find" - Jesus Christ. Don't give up. Read John 14:26 and John 16.13.
I don’t think any entirety as powerful as described as such would even care in having someone worship them. The biggest problem is that the Bible was written by men, and has often been the mechanism for power in history. Also, the word does not function rationally, at the very least not in the way logic leads to truth. So weird. Maybe god lies between religions, maybe gods doesn’t e it’s within religions, regardless dogmatism is te key danger
I see this is two years old, but I think you have a tragic misunderstanding of what the bible says. Eternal life is only mentioned in reference to those saved by grace. "Fear the one who can destroy both body and soul in hell". The bible makes it clear that the antithesis to eternal life through grace is the death of the soul: ceasing to exist.
You're correct though, no loving God would torture his creation for eternity. Thankfully that's not the God of the bible
There are scriptures that have everything the Bible has, but have even more in addition, and if one loves the knowledge of the Absolute Truth, one will love the Vedas.
krishna.org/bhagavad-gita-as-it-is-original-1972-edition-free-pdf-download/
Teach Dr. West. Teach.
I’m an atheist and I love cornel West!
Wow this is what was in my mind towards most atheists but didnt know how to explain it.
I am muslim and I love this guy.
PS.
I want hell if my prophets are not in the heaven that I thout is heaven.
.Sir, I support Bernie as well as I support u. Although I've become used to ya'lls belief in fairytales, my family are believers, I still think ur belief is ur right, & I appreciate ur comments on non-believers!
Bernie for President in 2020!
I love this.
AMEN!!♥
agreed
THE GOLDEN RULE BECOMES ONLY THOSE WHO HAVE THE GOLD WILL RULE...
Let the phones be smart. You’ve got to be wise.
I respect the God in all people 💚💚💚💚
Long live communism and freedom
Deep ...
I heard another conversation of Cornel West and I think he uses Christianity as a philosophy rather than a religion in the true sense, especially some of the teachings of Christ. I remember he used the word humility for him being Christian, which suggests to me his family and environment was mostly Christian and brought him up as thus. And maybe not to ruffle a few feathers he has merged those teachings into his logical outlook.
However I may be wrong.
I've been an atheist for over twelve years now, but I was never more convinced of the correctness of my atheism when when that Evangelical claimed that Trump spoke with the words of god. Idolatry, level 'Epic'.
As an atheist much respect to brother Cornell
Wise one. Very very wise.
Paraphrasing Brother Cornel:smart dont mean shit,wisdom is all that counts
Something higher than yourself can be anything that connects you to the reality outside of your own subjective experience. The problem I have with faith based beliefs is that the "something higher" always has to be divine or supernatural in some way. None of that is necessary. You can start a community garden that helps improve diets with your neighborhood. You can dedicate your time to teaching or volunteer work. You can literally live your life as normal as possible and just be a nice /caring person and you'd be connecting with something higher. Until people can understand that if we want the world to be a better place then we have to work together to make that possible. Supernatural and magical nonsense is irrelevant to that vey fact.
ty Brother West! Watched this up to about 03:08 when I burst into uncontrollable laughter. Not wanting to do anything but leave a tender moment alone, I didn go further with video nor will I now go into a harang gay as my mother used stay about the unsurpassed moral evil of promoting false beliefs and primitive thinking, especially for those who can least afford them .
I appreciate that atheism wasn't condemned here as evil; but I certainly don't agree with a lot of what he said. Still, I appreciate that he had a more positive look on atheism .
The only reason he said it was positive was so you could clear the slate of worshiping false Gods and find the real God.
Yes, I understand why he said it and I don't think man knows a god, or that there are even any gods to be known. My comment here was to show appreciation that I was not demonized or condemned as many religious zealots do here on RUclips.
If you want to talk religion, send me a message, I don't want my appreciation here watered down by a debate.
Agnostic Cynic No worries. I am glad he didn't demonize you either.
What I think is particularly nice is that it doesn't seem like his concern is really over claims about existence. It's not about 'god' being a deity that exists as is with traditional Christianity, Judaism, or Islam. His concern seems be more about moral action and virtue. He says he puts Jesus as the center of it, but that's only a traditional symbolic think (from what I can tell of West's various writings and interviews). That is, Jesus as a model for how to live a life. And even then, you see West picks up on some very specific characteristics of Jesus, and not others. For instance, if Carrier's arguments against the historicity of Jesus were to become mainstream historical opinion, I don't think it'd matter for West.
Agnostic Cynic The idea is simple. From a strictly anthropological stance, you can show that you can't have more then 200 people working together without structure and without fiction. From 200 and below you can have anarchic structures where everybody forms personal bonds with everybody else. This goes for our primate cousins too, it's not exclusively human in nature. And labeled as fiction, easily provable, are the following less obvious notions; money, states, corporations, sports teams, logos etc. So even if you don't believe in God any more, you might still believe in the supernatural, the corporation, derived from the word corpus(body), which ironically lacks one. I can name more then one anti-theist spokesperson with wild outlandish beliefs (pure idolatry). So even if the church is not progressive but reiterates what the community wants to hear, it provides cohesion. So we atheists have to have a sense of belonging, a spirituality (as close to reality as science has to give it) that will show our place in our families, groups, on the planet, in the universe etc. Spirituality is not some woo woo notion, it is the feeling of knowing where you stand. As an atheist I see no better tool then science for it. And I see very few better allies then Cornell West and the fellows in that church. I've just discovered Sekou and if you hear him speak and don't know it, you can swear he's an atheist, quoting Zizek, explaining what the church actually is, how changes are secular grassroots in nature etc. etc. Everything you and I know. Same goes for Cornell who is a philosopher for whom god is a construct, a philosophical prop.
Sounds like a Buddhist of deep understanding
Cornel West said: A lot of folks who have lost faith in god is a healthy thing because the god they lost faith in was probably an idol anyway...
People continue to have faith. They have faith in things which sadly will not lead them to higher consciousness, but animalistic life, of eating, sleeping, mating and defending only. Faith is naturally there, like a person getting a haircut or shave by a barber has faith that their throat won't be slit by the razor. Or simple faith that a bank will keep their money protected.
So where there is light, there cannot be darkness. But remember too, where there is darkness, there cannot be light either.
Losing faith in a false God, by accepting and understanding in faith who is actually God in truth should be the goal, not atheism.
@@tulayamalavenapi4028 you are confusing trust with faith. Faith goes against evidence to contrary, trust does not.
Ok like i don’t know what he said but it was really smart
Those who have 'faith' belief with no proof think we athiests 'lost our belief' in something imaginary. Kinda an insult to non delusional humans.
DR WEST FOR PRESIDENT 2024 🇺🇸🇺🇸
He din't quite answer the question, did he?
He actually did. He's arguing at atheists are often justified in loosing their faith since the "god" that they lost faith in was probably confined to a certain set of dogma. He then calls the atheists to ask themselves the question on wether or not they still open to the idea of God and the transcendent. I have a few qualms with his argument, but he answered it well.
I have a sneaking suspicion they Dr West is a closet atheist.
Hard to change your tune after being a Jesus guy for so long.
He’s a wise dude
@Kevin Cobb
I think he’s masterfully redefined his terms of ‘Christiantoy’ and lives as if Christ is real, as Jordan Peterson says.
@Kevin Cobb
We can read of God’s most trusted, to have been blessed with some of the greatest trials. It’s almost as if the mutual unknown is the only space for faith and belief.
To have belief and faith and hope is never to know. Be mindful of this nuance.
To know is to not have any room for faith and acting in faith.
The genius of Dr West, is that he has a room for flexibility and fluidity for exploring other value structures that all move toward to the harmony and masterpiece of moving towards oneness. Perhaps a little more than some Christians who have a difficulty to embrace others value structures.
I may be wrong in his literal claiming of knowing with a certainty, yet I, as a Christian, follow his work ‘religiously’(excuse the pun) and observe him to be one of the most open minded Christians. Omnist almost.
This makes me respect his beliefs and assertions of what is real to him, a whole lot more than the arrogance of ‘knowing’ where there is no room for evolution and engaging with a mutual humility of being uplifted and edified together with someone of differing beliefs.
Don’t you think?
@Kevin Cobb
Thank you for your reply. I like the framing of your reflections and observations.
I think we can quite confidently deduct that the ‘quest’ for truth or goodness, is indeed a more dynamic process, than such as can be ascribed to a ‘Jesus is the way’ framework. We can observe this with the heinous and barbaric movements of Christian groups in antiquity and up to this present day in catholic priests. The choices that one makes within the constructs of their own moral dichotomy’s and paradigms are surely where these ‘lies, untruths and evils’ manifest themselves in a completely arbitrary fashion, as we do not know the mental state of the individual. To construct a model of comparative evilness and try to distill a gauge of ‘more sinful’ is perhaps debunked by the clever metaphors of the effort that one sometimes does to remove the speck of wood from another person’s eye, while ignoring the 2 by 4 in their own eye.
Although this ‘gauge’ and measurement of evilness is necessary to have some form of cohesion, it is surely not the exact measure of evilness and subsequent imprisonment is not actually about rehabilitation or Christlike forgiveness, it is about an inaccurate punishment and increase of likelihood to reoffend, yet quenching our desire for justice. Surely a flawed concept and not parallel with Christian teaching.
But I digress.
I might leave it there in anticipation for your response and perhaps finish with a thought I use sometimes. Being raised Christian, I found the religious upbringing like a beautiful scaffolding. A way to navigate around a building sight and to build my own home and value structures. When I developed my own home and values, the scaffolding became an inhibiting structure that blocked my view. For some the scaffolding becomes the building itself and one never builds their own value structures to look outwards, instead the scaffolding becomes their home and then continually look inwards, reinforcing the framework they stand upon. This scaffolding may serve them well and be a fine dwelling. I sense that we are integrally our own beings with opportunities to magnify our talents with perhaps the same moral compass that everyone has. Like homes that are all different yet all of value in their unique way and as long as there is a respect for each other’s unique homes and value structures, we can perhaps continue to see the moving moral zeitgeist in a good direction as we battle with these dichotomy’s of discerning our own heaven and hell and our own evil and goodness with each decision, without requiring a certain type of scaffolding to be deemed as the most useful one to build our own homes with.
Blessings from a loving atheist 🙏🏾
Preach thy people free from ideology into living salvation .BLESSID
Amy winehouse
*The black community needs more Bayard Rustins, A. Philip Randolphs and Oliver Laws, and less Jesse Jacksons, Al Sharptons and Jesse Petersons.*
God bless dr west
Why believe in a God in the first place, what use is a God to me if it is impotent, abhorrently violent and bigoted?
It depends on how you define God. God isn't necessarily how fundamentalists define it.
@@blaisemeguel6543 first person to address the concept of a God. Bravo!
God is not our order supplier. Whether He is useful or not is the attitude adjustment to be addressed.
God is the well-wishing friend of His devotee. He can be the enemy of His enemy as well. If we really want to use God, He may consent to this, if we love and understand Him, or simply beg for His mercy and benevolence upon us, being needy for so many things.
It's up to the mind of the human living entity, which is our rare opportunity in life. Animals have no such chance to have an actual relationship with God. Animals are conditioned to eat, sleep, mate and defend, full stop, period.
Read if you are serious, my brother:
krishna.org/bhagavad-gita-as-it-is-original-1972-edition-free-pdf-download/
@@tulayamalavenapi4028 I'm so serious that I've cursed that God repeatedly for his utter incompetence and hatred towards people that look like over the centuries.
@@thethird1967
Modern scientists, their first business is to deny that Supreme. That is modern. It is a curse for the scientist if they talk of God. Amongst the scientists this is an etiquette, not to talk of God. Everything science. Means everything nonsense, passing on as scientist. Do you believe this?
Or how does your curse affect your actions?
Mistitled but okay
Why is atheism considered being wounded. That’s why me as an atheist gets annoyed w them bc u see me as flawed or diseased. It’s insulting
Atheist are wounded but grown folks who believe in talking animals are considered healthy. Atheist need help but the ancestors of slaves subscribing to the god of their oppressor are doing just fine. Its a cold game
@@DJ-uc8mk what?! 😂
Most Atheists are their own idol. They think they're too smart to believe in anything but their own abilities.
No, as an atheist I know my insignificance in the universe. I am atheist because I know that the so called holy books are full of errors, clearly are not holy and have many toxic things in them.
@@simstar6557 Which one of the 'holy books' are you a scholar of?
@@dransomb1 no scholarship necessary to see the primitive ramblings for what they are.
@@simstar6557 Ok, well, since you already know it all, good luck, but just because you don't believe there isn't a God, that doesn't mean He doesn't exist. You see, it's not only about YOU!!!!
@@dransomb1 you miss the point. I don't know it all. I am a life long student who will still die not knowing many things known even today. I just know more than the crazy people who wrote said holy books, as should any average semi educated person today.
Don't let these absurd books become your idols.
Believing in known to be erroneous things is not smart. Most of these holy books contradict even themselves, never mind today's science. Saying with confidence that such error ridden books are true and even holy is real arrogance, not people who are willing to admit that we need to put collective effort to discover the truth in a sensible way.
False equivalence; Atheism does have a better position because of a lack of wishful-thinking. It is therefore a clearer and more objective standpoint. Interesting speech nonetheless of the Matrix guy.
+MexxPowers but you are making a statement of metaphysics which is about self-perception. As Wittgenstein argues Atheism like theism has its weakness in skepticism.
+MexxPowers what Cornel West is taking is a Wittgensteinian and Kierkegardian approach to theology and religion.
@Kevin Cobb that would be humanism, not atheism. Atheism simply says there is no proof for any gods or goddesses. It makes no statements on humanity. Although atheists often are humanists, you don't need to be. You can think humans are a cruel and destructive species and still be an atheist.
@Kevin Cobb you still don't get it. Atheism is simply rejecting magical thinking which can no longer be defended. Other philosophies that one may hold are orthogonal.
You can believe in many things larger than you while being an atheist, just don't have the arrogance to say that you have a direct line to the purely fictional creator of the universe.
Saying we have to figure things out because no else will for us and we will make mistakes along the way is humility. People who insist that their fantasy belief or book is true no matter the evidence are arrogant.
@Kevin Cobb also there is no reasonable possibility of gods. The possibility is only an unreasonable one. Theists vastly inflate that and insist that they receive special privileges for that.
They keep voting democrat. When will they learn
This guy is so full of himself that weirdness aligns very well with his personality!
Be vulnerable to bullshit? No thanks.
Cornel West's "sophisticated" gibberish is still gibberish nonetheless.
Bullshit is bullshit, no matter how you serve it up.
I'm an atheist and I understood what he was saying.
Atheist - this is gonna be a great video because West is an educated man and knows his stuff. Glad to see he knows that atheism is the smart choice.
(After listening to West)
Atheist -
(sound of crickets)