This is the best way no doubt. I learned the same way in diesel school. It showed how diesel ignites when it’s misted. It’s a great way to test injectors too
You guys really provide great insights on alot of cloudy subjects when it comes to Cummins. Love your channel and how much passion you guys have for the sport. Just got rid a 6.7(no fun) and picked up a twelve valve, cant wait to try some of your products
After searching the web for (mis)info and opinions to find injectors, I ended up ordering your 145 5x14 VCO injectors for my 93 two days ago. Can't wait for them to come in so I can install them along with my HE 351CW and 4" exhaust. Today I saw this video and i'm glad I ordered the VCO's for my truck.
@@pddofficial I finally got around to installing the injectors and the first thing I noticed what is the idle dropped about two hundred RPMs and the truck idles like it has a lumpy cam in it and the truck rocks back and forth. I adjusted my fuel screw and brought the idol back up. The stock h1c turbo jumped up to 39 PSI boost which is about 7 PSI more than I had before and the smoke isn't actually too bad so I think I'm going to leave the h1c turbo on this engine since it performs very well. I also have a 1997 engine with a p pump on it and for that I just ordered your AFC live. What do you think I should do it this one to get it to idle correctly, reset the pop pressure slightly lower, or bump the timing up? I already have a dynamic timing spacer installed on this engine.
Hi I’m looking for new injectors and not sure what % I should get I have a 04.5 truck with built trans head studs 165 lift pump and plans for turbo and cam within a year i live around 500’ above sea level I drive the truck a few times a week and pull a boat on the weekend I’m looking at 30% and 45% my rwh goal is 550 hp
son has a '98.5 auto holy grail, brother has a 99 auto both stock dodge cummins. From Loveland, CO to Cabo and back the 99 24 valve got 10% better fuel milage..and a failed vp44 injection pump. Might mention, our '05 common rail has had 8 injectors fail..none of our 6 dodge 12 valves (stock) have EVER had a failed injector
what is the stock 24v (vp truck) spray angle and why change it? I see a lot about 145° and 155°, but would like to know why you would change. Thanks, and good video!
Anthony Pfohl It all depends on your injectors and foot. both 12&24 valves can get great or complete crap MPG if ur in the throttle with high boost every vehicle is different
Good info. Complexity forgot I had posted a comment over here. I have been playing with timing and seem to have fallen into the 18-19 degree range, just to find you also think around 18 is a good spot. If I get a wild hair I might pick up a set of SAC's. Never tried them before.
Awesome format Nothing to do with diesel Buddy of mine asked a question Sense y’all make a awesome oil for diesel What would you recommend Oil for a gas engine ?
Does the sac make it black smoke more while the truck idles. Cause I got some injections from a buddy with the other stuff done I can tell the truck idles more smoke comes out. So does that mean I can possibly have sac I’m trying to get another set of injectors for my other truck and I tow akot of heavy equipment I was guna get 200hp cause I currently run 150 in the other truck I got from a friend but I wanted to go a little bigger cause I’m started to tow some different loads
That could be a sac Nozzle that is causing the problem but if you went from a stock injector to a much bigger injector that would also cause more smoke at idle
I have a 2000 dodge ram 4x4 Cummins 5.9l I was wanting to add some power but just not sure how much the stock transmission is able to handle I'm wanting to use to tow a trailer
I'd get that stock auto & torque converter beefed up. If nothing else at least more of the power you make today will get to the ground. Stock gets the job done, but man it sure is sloppy.
What would be the most efficient injector for 97 12v 5 speed. Truck is stock and never been messed with. For me it has all the power I need. Just would like more mileage if possible. Gets 21mpg if driven lightly. Thank you
You aren't likely to do much better than that as an average. Remember you're pushing a 3.5 ton (unloaded) brick down the highway. That's not taking in to account the tire size and rear end ratio. The stock injector for a 5spd is known as a 5x10, auto's had a slightly smaller injector. If you think the truck has all the power you need, I'd leave it as is. How many miles are on the current set of injectors? More than 150k and I'd probably go ahead and change them. Other than that be sure to periodically add cetane to the fuel to keep the system clean and change the fuel filter. You aren't really going to want to add larger injectors if you like the truck in stock form. You'll be adding more than you think to properly support the injector, 5x11 is the next size up and 5x12 is probably the most popular. They will add roughly 70 and 90 hp respectively. Either one of these really will be more fuel than the HX35 will be able to clean up. Sure you could run the larger injector and then clean up the smoke (and diminish power) with AFC live, but it will defeat the purpose. A short list of mods and add ons suggested to run those injectors: BHAF (Big Honkin' Air Filter) 4"or 5" Exhaust with correct downpipe for new turbo 57mm or 62mm turbo 60# Valve Springs 4k Governor Spring Kit AFC Spring Kit AFC Live (an absolute must have) Gauges (Pyro, Boost, Fuel Pressure) Dual Disk Clutch
Thank you so much for your time and knowledge. I have 210K on my truck now and it does have a BHAF but that’s it. Exhaust is stock and was thinking of 4 inch turbo back straight pipe. For now I think I will leave it the way it is. Thanks
What are the injectors psi rating? Most diesel injectors are between 10,000 psi - 30,000psi. There were a few performance injectors which advertised 50,000psi. Unfortunately nobody uses this metric anymore. The higher the psi the smaller the droplets of fuel and hence more power and greater efficiency. GreenDiesel Corp. from Australia produced a 160,000psi injector, producing nearly vapor with a 99.7% burn in the combustion chamber. It was possible to achieve 500hp @ 40mpg, both power and efficiency. Company was destroyed and consumed by a diesel big rig distributor who has done nothing with the technology since acquiring it.
I Know You're Right But basically they’re both excellent engines. I’d almost rather have the 24v just cause of some extra things like double the valves , two oil drains for turbos things like that. Although you can get a storm block 12v. I’d say only reason 12 is better is cause of the p7100 and ve pump.
And the next expert tells me that the SAC style won’t be good for towing, and they only recommend them for those making huge power. So one or the other is wrong🤷🏻♂️
@@pddofficial Ok, have you noted any differences in mileage between the two? The other video I was watching was saying that a SAC will live longer in a long duty cycle application (ie boat, tractor, generator, etc) due to better tip cooling and will also flow more, but will not do as well as the VCO in terms of driveability, mileage, and idle haze. He recommended the VCO for towing. So I’m just trying to sort out my thoughts
“Let’s see what that looks like with a little fire on it.” Absolutely outstanding. 😂
"Big kids like to play with fire too." Hell yeah!!
Best explanation I've ever seen, I had a rough idea of the differences but the visual really dialed it in! Great video!
This is the best way no doubt. I learned the same way in diesel school. It showed how diesel ignites when it’s misted. It’s a great way to test injectors too
I love you guys lol !! Thanks for share all this inf. For all of us who we are blessed by own a legendary 12 valves.
You guys really provide great insights on alot of cloudy subjects when it comes to Cummins. Love your channel and how much passion you guys have for the sport. Just got rid a 6.7(no fun) and picked up a twelve valve, cant wait to try some of your products
Why do you not like 6.7s? I think they are the greatest ever
Awesome demo. Love it. Great to see how these guys don't push a specific product, but rather the product best suited for each customer.
Very well explained guys, keep these videos up 👍
After searching the web for (mis)info and opinions to find injectors, I ended up ordering your 145 5x14 VCO injectors for my 93 two days ago. Can't wait for them to come in so I can install them along with my HE 351CW and 4" exhaust. Today I saw this video and i'm glad I ordered the VCO's for my truck.
@@pddofficial I finally got around to installing the injectors and the first thing I noticed what is the idle dropped about two hundred RPMs and the truck idles like it has a lumpy cam in it and the truck rocks back and forth. I adjusted my fuel screw and brought the idol back up. The stock h1c turbo jumped up to 39 PSI boost which is about 7 PSI more than I had before and the smoke isn't actually too bad so I think I'm going to leave the h1c turbo on this engine since it performs very well. I also have a 1997 engine with a p pump on it and for that I just ordered your AFC live. What do you think I should do it this one to get it to idle correctly, reset the pop pressure slightly lower, or bump the timing up? I already have a dynamic timing spacer installed on this engine.
love the detail stuff your phone crew is awesome love the afc live been running over a year now and will be back soon for the next build👍
Awesome thank you!
That was a great and informative video thank you guys for producing it keep up the great work.
Awesome Will!!!!! You and Todd keep up the good work. Maybe if you race in texas this year I can see you guy's!!!
Thanks for this im looking for some 7x.012s for my 24v and this explains everything I needed to know
With as loud as a cummins already is, do you really notice that much difference in the sound between the two injectors?
If you know the engines you can tell yes, its more of a ting kinda
You’ve made a difference to my mob in Australia, thank you
Hi I’m looking for new injectors and not sure what % I should get I have a 04.5 truck with built trans head studs 165 lift pump and plans for turbo and cam within a year i live around 500’ above sea level I drive the truck a few times a week and pull a boat on the weekend
I’m looking at 30% and 45% my rwh goal is 550 hp
son has a '98.5 auto holy grail, brother has a 99 auto both stock dodge cummins. From Loveland, CO to Cabo and back the 99 24 valve got 10% better fuel milage..and a failed vp44 injection pump. Might mention, our '05 common rail has had 8 injectors fail..none of our 6 dodge 12 valves (stock) have EVER had a failed injector
Excellent illustration, thanks for the tutorial
Great video
what is the stock 24v (vp truck) spray angle and why change it? I see a lot about 145° and 155°, but would like to know why you would change. Thanks, and good video!
So for the mild guys wanting to run under 500hp. What impact do the SAC injectors have on mileage?
Shain Andrews it wont really change that much it all depends on your foot
do you find that the 24v or the 12v perform better for fuel economy? all thing being equal?
Anthony Pfohl It all depends on your injectors and foot. both 12&24 valves can get great or complete crap MPG if ur in the throttle with high boost every vehicle is different
Good info. Complexity forgot I had posted a comment over here. I have been playing with timing and seem to have fallen into the 18-19 degree range, just to find you also think around 18 is a good spot. If I get a wild hair I might pick up a set of SAC's. Never tried them before.
@@ShainAndrews I was getting 20 mpg with a bad vp44 lol
Awesome format
Nothing to do with diesel
Buddy of mine asked a question
Sense y’all make a awesome oil for diesel
What would you recommend
Oil for a gas engine ?
Awesome stuff! Thanks
This is a fantastic video on this topic. Great job putting it together!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Very interesting and informative, thank you.
Wow you look alot younger will! Is this shot 20 yrs ago?
Does the sac make it black smoke more while the truck idles. Cause I got some injections from a buddy with the other stuff done I can tell the truck idles more smoke comes out. So does that mean I can possibly have sac I’m trying to get another set of injectors for my other truck and I tow akot of heavy equipment I was guna get 200hp cause I currently run 150 in the other truck I got from a friend but I wanted to go a little bigger cause I’m started to tow some different loads
That could be a sac Nozzle that is causing the problem but if you went from a stock injector to a much bigger injector that would also cause more smoke at idle
I love this VIDEO I LOVE PDD! Im getting yalls vco
Does the VCO make a smoother idle, or is it simply less idle noise? Thanks.
Great video and explanation !
What about alternative fuels will the vco offer a larger pathway if contamination come though or will it cause less of a clean burn?
Nice, very helpful, now I know which injectors I want. :)
Older video but love the information you guys put out on the channel!
You guy need to make one on how to build ur own valve body with ur kit
I’m gonna run 150’s on my 62/68/14 borg warner svx.. I have sac 75hp now and love them.. not sure which ill choose next..
PowerDrivenDiesel I was gonna convert to a P7100 but went back to vp one more time. I have a 180hp 911 pump in the garage. Next year with twins.
PowerDrivenDiesel yeah running the P7100 with a 62/75 will make me happy. I got a fully built suncoast. I just want to get above 3000 rpm.
i have 98 12v .Ive upgraded the intake (AFE)low rest. and exhaust (3inch). Which injectors would you recommend 5x11? 5x12? thanks!
I have a 2000 dodge ram 4x4 Cummins 5.9l
I was wanting to add some power but just not sure how much the stock transmission is able to handle
I'm wanting to use to tow a trailer
PowerDrivenDiesel
Ok thanks
I'd get that stock auto & torque converter beefed up. If nothing else at least more of the power you make today will get to the ground. Stock gets the job done, but man it sure is sloppy.
What about towing noise, or just loading the motor down?
What style injector is quieter under load? On the hyw.
Yes they are also more noticeable at hwy speeds
@@pddofficial
What are?
They?
Sac. Or other styles.
I need elaboration please.
@@hardhead7056 VCO is quieter!
@@pddofficial thanks.
Where do powerjets fall in that category? Loudness.
Vco sac powerjets.
Rate them in order please.
Do you happen to sell a tester like what you’re using there for a 12 valve ?
Great job with this, thanks.
Glad you liked it!
What about injector life on the two styles? I've read that tha SAC injector potentially has better life vs the VCO
Awesome video.
Great content
Are there any good videos explaining %(50,60,100) over injectors?
The percent is just how much more power than stock they add with supporting mods
Cool video see even 8 can still learn new things 🤔😄😀
Thank you for the Comment
What's the music you used in the compound turbo video?
Congratulations, excelent didactic video.
What would be the most efficient injector for 97 12v 5 speed. Truck is stock and never been messed with. For me it has all the power I need. Just would like more mileage if possible. Gets 21mpg if driven lightly. Thank you
You aren't likely to do much better than that as an average. Remember you're pushing a 3.5 ton (unloaded) brick down the highway. That's not taking in to account the tire size and rear end ratio. The stock injector for a 5spd is known as a 5x10, auto's had a slightly smaller injector. If you think the truck has all the power you need, I'd leave it as is. How many miles are on the current set of injectors? More than 150k and I'd probably go ahead and change them. Other than that be sure to periodically add cetane to the fuel to keep the system clean and change the fuel filter. You aren't really going to want to add larger injectors if you like the truck in stock form. You'll be adding more than you think to properly support the injector, 5x11 is the next size up and 5x12 is probably the most popular. They will add roughly 70 and 90 hp respectively. Either one of these really will be more fuel than the HX35 will be able to clean up. Sure you could run the larger injector and then clean up the smoke (and diminish power) with AFC live, but it will defeat the purpose.
A short list of mods and add ons suggested to run those injectors:
BHAF (Big Honkin' Air Filter)
4"or 5" Exhaust with correct downpipe for new turbo
57mm or 62mm turbo
60# Valve Springs
4k Governor Spring Kit
AFC Spring Kit
AFC Live (an absolute must have)
Gauges (Pyro, Boost, Fuel Pressure)
Dual Disk Clutch
Thank you so much for your time and knowledge. I have 210K on my truck now and it does have a BHAF but that’s it. Exhaust is stock and was thinking of 4 inch turbo back straight pipe. For now I think I will leave it the way it is. Thanks
great info thanks
Thanks guys good info
Hey, what were you pushing through the injectors? Kerosene?
PowerDrivenDiesel so you just took the solenoid off? Just to use poppet pressure?
PowerDrivenDiesel no I get that part, but could you test a piezo injector that way?
I'm looking to making 300hp on my 12v but I do like the low idle noise. Which vco do you guys recommend?
5x.010
@@pddofficial thank you!
Terry is the Diesel Yoda.
What are the injectors psi rating?
Most diesel injectors are between 10,000 psi - 30,000psi.
There were a few performance injectors which advertised 50,000psi.
Unfortunately nobody uses this metric anymore.
The higher the psi the smaller the droplets of fuel and hence more power and greater efficiency.
GreenDiesel Corp. from Australia produced a 160,000psi injector, producing nearly vapor with a 99.7% burn in the combustion chamber.
It was possible to achieve 500hp @ 40mpg, both power and efficiency.
Company was destroyed and consumed by a diesel big rig distributor who has done nothing with the technology since acquiring it.
LOL. I can set any injector to any pressure you want... Nothing special about that.
Banging material
What does SAC stand for ?
It doesn't stand for anything it is literally the resemblance that the nozzle has at the tip.
So what style would a set of 370s be? SAC?
@@pddofficial sac or vco?
I can see bit of blue flame in the vco than the sac
If I got 100hp sac style injectors, could that give better fuel milage? Or any upgraded injector I guess
How can I get a cool shirt like yours
@@pddofficial cool will check it out i'm glad your educating customers
👍
Can you guys do a video on 12 Valve longevity, reliability & weak points VS a 24 Valve? And Pros & Cons of each?
I Know You're Right But basically they’re both excellent engines. I’d almost rather have the 24v just cause of some extra things like double the valves , two oil drains for turbos things like that. Although you can get a storm block 12v. I’d say only reason 12 is better is cause of the p7100 and ve pump.
So when you say more idle noise you are saying the truck is going to be louder
@@pddofficial ok thank you
Everybody knows that was “ trick” diesel and “fake” fire......fire is my friend......lol
Orifii?
And the next expert tells me that the SAC style won’t be good for towing, and they only recommend them for those making huge power. So one or the other is wrong🤷🏻♂️
we have had no issue out of the sac towing
@@pddofficial Ok, have you noted any differences in mileage between the two? The other video I was watching was saying that a SAC will live longer in a long duty cycle application (ie boat, tractor, generator, etc) due to better tip cooling and will also flow more, but will not do as well as the VCO in terms of driveability, mileage, and idle haze. He recommended the VCO for towing. So I’m just trying to sort out my thoughts
Ford small Vinny vans