What 20 Years of Power Creep Looks Like in a MMO | MapleStory
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Power Creep, when new features, weapons or other ways of getting stronger are added to a game. Creating an imbalance and making older content obsolete. No progression based MMO is safe from it, especially not maplestory. But what does it look like when the game has already been running for 20 years?
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Our ages power crept too 💀
thanks for the reminder 😭
*coughs in my 30s😂
I feel attacked.
Death comes for us all
Agreed been playing on and off since 2005 @ 8 years old and now 26 😢
I was thinking about it today how there are a large portion of us that have been playing this game for longer than a large portion of the players have been alive
At least they can never powercreep the music, those tunes are legendary and will always hold a place in our hearts
idk man some of the new bgm goes hard
@@Dnite13 Nah they ass
@@jjct111 have you even reached arcus and beyond
They literally did power creep the music, the OG stuff is great tho
@@Niko.. shangri lah and cernium is nuts bro
20 years ago we just need a straw hat, gloves and a towel / sauna robe to reach the 100% of powercreep... things changed quite a lot
Dexless sins
i remember when nexon locked magic guard for evan behind a paywall lol
Say what u want but i loved OLD MAPLE . Played it every day since 2005 for like 5 to 6 years non stop. lvl 1-30 took a long time, dmg was low but hey the game was way more fun
It wasn't that took a long time grind that made it fun
It was the social chat and activities
It was like MSN etc but more interactive in an RPG format
While it was pain but satisfying and sometimes even exciting when you start breaking certain damage thresholds, it was a slow grind so it was a game where you pretty much enjoy your time achieving everything in your slow time cuz speed grinding wasn't as encouraged cuz it was so slow anyway.
And while you can grind for a chance for above average power boost or you can go for the standard PQ for low power but consistent EQ rewards and they were basically the only way for you to gain more different types of EQ such as face acc.
Being able to grind, level up, do party quests and boss runs with all the friends you made is why I loved this game despite playing during post-Big Bang. I wish I could go back and experience the memories again, but it seems like it’s all about going solo now.. Bera, 2010 - 2012. :/
play kaizenMS guys
No kidding man.
I tried maplestory again several years ago and was shocked how fast you can level up; took me like 1-3 hours to get to level 20 when back in 2005 when I first started playing getting to level 20 with a lot of help from your friends would be consider an outstanding achievement if you could get there grinding an entire night.
Loved the simplicity of the early days. I tried to get back into this game again. I got overwhelmed by all the quests, icons and pop-ups. I can’t get into this game anymore unfortunately. Wouldn’t know where to start.
While I like some of the new classes, the best maplestory iteration will always be the 4 original explorer trees + pirate job era. Anything after just started getting a bunch of nonsense
Biggest power creep is the ability to jump down from platforms with +, the game changed drastically from that point on once players got their first taste of mobility creep.
How about giving every class a flash jump or teleport? It's makes having mounts redundant and speeds up farming a lot.
@@nobblkpraetorian5623 They did though
@@emoducky I know they did. That's why I'm saying that it made a big impact on clearing speeds.
Nah that just made the game not trash LaTale is bad because of that
@@nobblkpraetorian5623 Honestly mounts were always just mobile chairs
lets not forget mw30 books meant they were highly sought after and the fact you could fail skill books is a system I'll never miss
My bowmaster with only level 10 SE and MW feeling so useless in parties 😂
Ayy nice seeing you here, love your animations
Guess what, in 2023 you'll be getting a 6th job system where you can fail to upgrade your nodes. Same shit, different day huh?
Update: the hexa system's RNG is worse than skill books. amazing how far we've come
Nope, miss that.. and that too
failed 7 on it, and billions gone.
Screen was flooded with players back then, now it's flooded with flashy skills and lines
Ill never forget the first time i broke 1k damage in maple. It was on my second job page vs some poor mushroom. 😂
fires up Rage, uses a Warrior pot, uses Power Slash *Thwack!* +1005 damage!
Holy... The moment you mentioned Wonderking, my mind just raced back to so many years ago, when I first played it... I really enjoyed it a bunch when I was able to play it, and honestly miss it
i cry every time i remember that wonderking is dead
Same. I started playing maple because I got sick of waiting for wonderking to come back. As soon as it does, I'm there.
😢 me and a couple of friends of mine played it too. So much fun
To be honest, at this point I think nexon should just rework the whole numbers, cut some 0's from everything, and make things sane again. All in some "reverse" big bang update or something like that.
I thought of the same thing. Just divide everything by 1000 to make stuff readable again
So stat squish like what WoW did?
@@Jason-ix1yn they introduced unit damage skins just for that
@@Roflmao6173 yeah honestly i think its fine with the unit dmg skins, you still have the option to completely cover the screen with numbers if you want
0:35 it was so slow! but so much fun! it bring a tear to my eye. i stopped completely playing in august 2020.
Grandchase mentioned! Great video Coppersan! Loving this one a lot ☝️
Man this video sure brought back a lot of memories! Great video as always keep it up coppersan! ❤😁 I think the thing I miss most about maplestory (other than it being a more party based game) is the old monster carnival. that was so fun
Not to mention we had to roll our base stats with a dice at character creation. I spent a good hour click for 12/4/4/4 😔
Hit like a kick to the skull
Nothing quite like rolling a perfect 4/12/4/4.......on a Mage.
The pain was real with unstable dial-up too 😢
This brings back so much memories. I remember always struggling to find a party to join when you tried leveling up around level 30s
Aaahh so much nostalgia - thank you for this video, Coppersan! I used to play Maplestory for HOURS around when it first came out and I miss the old game sometimes. However, it's wild to see how much has been added, along with QOL features. The game is still so fun but it can definitely be a bit intimidating to new or very very old returning players like myself. This is a great TLDR of all the things that have happened over the years!
A lot of people started playing at 9-10yrs old. i got hooked on it in 2007 so i was basically in my last year of high school. dropped out to keep playing it more lol. So you would have to be Gen X to be consider old. Between 1970=11979 those were the harder years @ 20yrs you would be following the cycle of everyone else. School/work/sleep. So only a small amount of millennials had easy money from fortunate folks to invest in Maplestory back than. Given i was 17 in 2007 you can say the hackers were about 25+. "Hey hackers if you read this i know you are over 40+ and hopefully you have a family now, if not i guess karma got you finally from back than.
@@lordvasileLive I wasn't talking about my age, lol. I meant I was there in the first few years of the game coming out then didn't play for over a decade.
You forgot that on release Unique was the highest potential tier. Then you needed super cubes later on to try for legendary. :)
Love these look backs
one of the first sets introduced with a set bonus was actually the Von Leon set. Don't know the specifics but this was not too long after the Big Bang update and the Von Leon castle would be one of the first times where the Skele's in leafre would be dethroned as grinding spot. This period was also dotted with a lot of controversy in EU servers since hacking was rampant which led to one of the few major wipes of illegally acquired gear and mesos.
Oh man I remember Lionheart Castle like it was yesterday - ALL the KSing, the party and loot drama that came with it too lmao and having to constantly channel hop till you found a decent spot that wasn't taken by like 3 parties. It was fun as hell though, but you literally couldn't leave your spot for several hours on end if you wanted to grind for the day 🤣
Ah the good old days of spending days killing green mushrooms at the top level of HHG in hopes of finding a pan lid.
Another thing you could say that boosted the power creep was the decision, reiterated every single update, to balance the new content on the very few top geared players rather than considering them the outliers they were.
Still have my registration email for Wizet (before Nexon took over) from 2004. Almost been 20 years at this point, insane.
That subanis legacy quest is so OG, what a dopamine hit getting that 60% glove for att scroll
As soon as I saw that login screen then the MV. The nostalgia train came full speed and hit me
Anyone else remember people going over the 999,999 damage cap by like 50k or something? How did that work?
Savage Blow was such an awesome skill!
This video is perfect. Every minute detail.
Everquest 2 has a similar level of power creep. I played Everquest 2 when it came out, and damage numbers were fairly tame, only a couple thousand damage per attack. By 2013, damage numbers were already in the millions, and my Paladin as a tank was doing 1 million DPS. These days, characters do like 1 billion DPS in Everquest 2.
remember when you found a steely and got rich 😂
and i avoided playing the bowman class because i hated having to pick up arrows
I got rich buy selling MW books20-30.
The pain with old school skills was that they werent realy usefull until u got it to max lvl which was insane, like u mention thunderbolt, u had to get to from lvl 30 - 40 for it to be usefull both in dmg and economy because of the heavy mana. many character had this issue
Exactly. In modern day Maple, when you job advance, you can put a point in each of your new skills and mostly have them replace your previous job's skills.
Back then, if you advanced from Thief to Bandit you'd find that your lvl 20 Double Stab from 1st job was still doing two hits of 130%, a total of 260% per press of the button. But at lvl 1, your new Savage Blow skill would only be doing 4 hits of 40% damage, a total of 160% per swing. You'd need to raise Savage Blow to level 8 (of 30) to even get slightly above your 1st job skill, which is another 3 level-ups worth of SP after job advancing, and thats if you COMPLETELY IGNORE getting other skills like say.....Dagger Mastery, Dagger Booster, and Haste.
Of course, you could certainly grab a single level of those skills if you wanted.......if you don't mind them lasting for 10 seconds each....
I kind of liked this system because you had to make choices and prioritize certain skills and stats over others, feel like it made everything a bit more unique, but that might be the nostalgia talking
@@timeobsessed to be honest there wasnt much choice, ice mage and fp were probably the Only 2nd job with a choice. You either maxed ice first in order to spend the rest of your life at red rakes or u went with thunderbolt. And fp either went with poision or fire Arrow. The 3rd job is where stuff could go terribly wrong, if you took the wrong skills in wrong order on some classes you were screwd.
@KensBlade Don't forget warriors! Had to choose weapons (like Spearman had Polearm or Spear) with separate Mastery, Booster and Final Attack for each xD
@@timeobsessed it was more interesting but we would take a long time with them. Back then it was weeks if not months til the next job advancement. Now we zoom so fast from 0-100 that it doesn't really matter
I honestly have no idea how people (especially for the older generations dating back to pre-BB) keep up with the constant additions being added to the system for progression, it's all so overwhelming. I applaud the commitment, even for the casual players haha.
I missed the times where everything was simpler and the small things mattered a lot -- people appreciated and celebrated even the smallest achievements, not to mention a lot more social (MSN, Skype, and forums being the main ways to contact each other outside of the game). If you know how today's digital culture works compared to back in the 2000s (bonus points if you experienced it yourself), the concept of instant gratification also ended up creeping into this game in its own ways, which to me, is unfortunate (not to say I don't appreciate improvements). I quit the game a decade ago since I became no longer content with the path the game has gone into alongside with my friends quitting as well for similar reasons. The classes have little to no uniqueness to them anymore (MMs being the only class who can break the damage cap with Piercing Arrow, BMs with Hurricane, NLs with FJ...etc.) and not to mention the amount of pay2win aspects that are still involved.
Current MapleStory may has its upsides, but it'll never be at its prime as it was before. It was good when it lasted. 👍
maple will always hold a special place in my heart =)
Man, I haven't played MS since I was a kid, never made it past the early game. Suddenly feel like playing it again now after seeing how insane it looks.
When I was young, I swear I played for a year or more and only barely got above level 100. 10 years later in a hazy fit in nostalgia, I got past that in a few days of grinding.
I wish that they would make a nostalgia server! I think it would be such a hit with new and old players.
totally
Like maplelegends?
@@manoqueenz ya but official.
Unfortunatley with a dying population, powercreep feels like it was kinda necessary. Some fights would be impossible if you couldn't have the power to solo them considering how hard it can be to find people to play.
Great vid on the history of every gamers worst nightmare... Powercreep! :D
However, you're missing a few "Max damage" numbers in your information while you included pre-3rd job areas and all ;)
99.999 used to be a soft damage cap and doing higher damage would instantly disconnect you... No one even got CLOSE to it anyway pre-4th and potentials... beside ChiefBandit with Meso Explosion, R.I.P Zak runs.
This later became 199.999 when 4th job and Pink Bean came out.
Little later, we had 999.999 dmg cap (Around Merc, Kaiser and Phantom, not sure the specific date), and Hyper Skills came along there was also Hyper skill allowing for +50.000 for a dmg cap of 1.049.999
Hypers attacks could hit up to 10m (5m? higher? I have conflicting information in my screenshot folders).
A special mention to Angelic Busters who could hit 10m each hit when it came out, compared to everyone else who could only hit 1m at the same time. Which is why so many choose her for Magnus runs cause her Purple Ball attack was completely broken with the amount of balls possible and 1m dmg cap was to low for Hard Magnus.
This later became 50m as you mentioned, and the +50.000 became 10% instead so hitting 55m would be possible.. which later became "Epic Adventurer" which gives 10% dmg instead.
There was also something allowing you to hit +15.000 dmg more when 50m dmg cap was a thing... from somewhere, maybe a party skill or a ring.
I miss my assasin in Windia back in the days… childhood memories ❤ 🍁
Thanks for all the content
Still remember when I hit 1k damage on dexless sin. Was soooo stoked!
That's AweSun is Awesome (for those who's have time besides doing all the dailys, leveling up their mules, are unemployed and have nothing to do all day, and already earn some money on a youtube channel, to feed themselves, also have a good cell phone to download this mobile maple, and having a bathroom and a mother nearby to help you with the basics stuff). If you're part of it all, you're goddamn lucky.
Something you missed in this was the old equip enhance system, where you had to buy items in the cash shop to prevent your gear from blowing up when failing an EE/AEE scroll
Scissor of Karma was a game changer when I kept switching mains and only had one Zak Helm…
I want to go back to playing Maple, I stopped around 2013 with a lvl 200 Bucc, my gear then was soso, and now what's scaring me is that if i do go back to play once in a while i will have the worst equipment for training in my associated mob level.
Everything mentioned speaks to why I can never stay when trying to return. Less about it being intimidating, more about it being an insanely time consuming venture if you want to get anywhere.
Only real good thing I liked about classic maple was the fact that people actually grouped up, and grinded in groups, and did party quests all the time. Was a lot more entertaining. Sadly now not a lot of grouping going on, and I'm not even sure people do party quests anymore.
I wish Maple had a reasonable way to add low level gear appearance to higher level. I know, this might hurt cash shop sales, but the looks on armor up to level 120 is much more compelling and I feel it's wasted fashion
look at that end scene everyone just spamming big ass skills i love nexon
that year one and earlier years was some good shit, i remember getting the android set on my NL when almost no one had it
i remember when hyperskills first got released, my 200 marksman went from 4 shotting LHC mobs with ultimate strafe to doing 10 lines of 999,999 with spammable snipe and boosting e girl bishops and consistently getting top 50 dojo gloves every week, fun times
Never really played MS, but I have played BDO since it released, and this video got me thinking about power creep. Its actually pretty weird in BDO because the top gear has been around for a while generally, and they don't really make new gear sets, but instead make upgrading so prohibitively difficult that it ends up taking months between upgrades for many players. That said they still add new features that slowly add marginal upgrades to your speed and efficiency and those marginal upgrades really stack up over time.
Love the thumbnail! 🤣
I like this game so much because there is always something you can do hehe I started playing this game on 2020 but the way.
Insane, dude
This both makes me want to get back into MS again, and not at the same time. I've played somewhat recently, and nostalgia keeps pulling me back in, but with nobody to do party content with and the massive power creep, it never keeps me hooked for long.
Just started playing Royals for that classic vibes
I used to play MS all the time, but quit a long time ago - rejoined it today and all the memories are flooding back
welcome back to the grind soldier
love the wonder king mention
I miss having massive dupped glitched starforced items.... 300att+ cravens SHEESH good times.
I always get a dose of nostalgia seeing Maplestory back before the Big Bang update. It's too large a dose.
wow i have not heard wonderking mentioned in forever. what a fun part of my childhood that was.
I had been playing it since 2004-2005 and stopped playing around 10 years ago. This game just randomly popped up in my memory just now and I decided to search it up to see if this game even still exists. Wtf this game has changed so much
This story has a lot of parallels with the yugioh card game's state 20+ years later.
Got to admit, lowkey miss the long ass orbis ship-rides, or waiting to PQ. That was where the community shined
this bring back memory, i an 32 now and have play when i 14 years old, old game for sure
I remember to make my NL back in days to survive a hit was to get the DK skill which isnt that great but the skill itself would still keep a Dexless NL my self alive for a bit to fight BF or any other boss.
You got my like just for mentioning Grand Chase
Hey San or anyone, i have a question, im adele main 211 now and hiting 4.5m, am i supposed to be this weak or can some one actually guide me through😅 i try to transfer and all but pretty much my arcane set is way too level up, plz, and ty 🙏
Also, Ragnarok Online. Im surprised it wasnt mentioned. dealing constant 6-10 digit damage is a sign of power creep.
Empress set may have been made irrelevent but atleast it wasn't forgotten. Cant say the same thing about timeless set
Always wait to the special thanks to hear You saying ramaghja
I keep coming back once in a while. But when i log in i Quick get kinda bored bcs i don't like the endless grind and doing the same dailies over and over.
A video like this makes me miss the good old days where maple was a bit more straight forward.
I don’t know how we had the patience to play it 😂 minutes to kill 5 boars! it also took MONTHS to level up
I like the power creep, I was just thinking last night about how maplestory is like the king of power creep and how its not necessarily a bad thing if balance is maintained. Games like Destiny 2 could learn from this.
What makes power creep sustainable is new content and balancing. I feel like more INFLATED damage helps with the dopamine kick.
My biggest issue is a no spawn enhancement grinding at lvl 230+
Power Creep isn't inherently bad and exist in pretty much any game with progression. It's expected that the player get better the further they progress and are given new tools and abilities. This is especially true when you have a game thats gone on for 20+ years. Old content is just gonna be power crept and mechanically crept as new shit is done. What matters is what you said, that balance is maintain and that new content is designed with the current power and potential future power, or given some incentive to be done even after it's time.
@@HowlingDoom I guess what I'm pointing out is that MapleStory should be a model for games that are old that have plateaued. Like Halo, Destiny, and so on.
The issue i have with maple story is that the damage numbers are super cluttered. If you can just change the size, opacity or move it to a screen away from you character and what you're hitting it would be more enjoyable. Same with the flashy spells that take up a bunch of screen space. Just let use reduce the opacity so I can't see whatever I'm doing.
You can reduce the opacity of skill effects, it's in the options
Good old days ;)
I'm so surprised someone mentioned Grand Chance
Ha. Nice video. Perfect timing. I stopped playing MS in 2011 when I graduated college. Suddenly wondered what MS was still around 13 years later.
Can't believe the game is still alive.
This is confusing as hell though....... they added so much stuff.
I really liked when MS was challenging. EVEN when I quit in 2011, I thought it was getting a little too easy. I didn't like how they started making EVERYONE super mobile. The classes started to feel like all the same. There was no reason to choose one class or another anymore. EVERYONE was tanky, mobile, and had range, so why did classes even matter.
Instead of creating new areas and monsters, they just kept making changes to the classes. I didn't like the direction it was going in.
Crazy that it's still around though.
Back then When steely makes you a god
I can't believe the starforce system was added 9 entire years ago
you forgot to mention the family system as well
I feel like power creep made all sense of progression meaningless. I was playing on an prebig bang server and all the small details mattered, how much mesos you have saved up, getting your first 100k, doing damage, even increasing it by 100 more damage all felt good.
Yeah I was wondering this, you answered my question. I saw how crazy everythhing looked and was wondering if the game was even challenging anymore. I remember dying so many times just to kill Zakum back in 2008.
I quit in 2011. I remember it was getting easier and easier that it just got boring. And they weren't releasing new areas or content... just more cash shop stuff and class changes.
With how crazy it looked, it didn't seem like a hard game anymore. You confirmed it.
the old days of genesis spamming 99,999 at dragon nest
Pretty much sums up why even though I'd really want to get back to this game, but just can't. There is just too much complicated systems that I need to understand if I want to progress further. I'd really want to experience all those new bossing but it's just unrealistic for me. Surely there's gonna be quite a lot players that enjoys these system but its just not for me
The one thing I'm not a big fan of are the absurd animations. They're cool for a bit, but they just make it so hard to see what's happening on the screen, so you end up turning them off altogether most of the time.
I miss when Maplestory felt challenging.
I actually enjoyed Maplestory more when it was new. I came to it from Ragnarok Online. Might have been because it was new or because you could actually make builds since all stats did something and you could not max all skills. Back then i also loved the grind, not for the grind itself but because i was one of the top assassins on my server and that was a point of pride and i had gotten something from the time i put in. All in all i liked the game more back then but i still play it xD and i might just be old and sad now i dont know. I just think that by catoring to everyone you cater to no one.
Hey!!
I have a question,
If I have a hyper burning character lvl 235
Can I delete it and create new one? Will I miss some rewards?
The rewards at lvl 200 plus are once per account. So yes you wouldn't get those rewards if you've already claimed them.
@@itsjamesdude7423 oh so like all the nodes and the symbols?
@@DaCopps yeah. They can't be claimed on another character even if you start over now
The game went from "paper mario" to "disgaea" levels of damage 😂
Back in my day you don't kill snail, snail kill you 😢
Just got back to the game after a really long absence. Last time I played was when zero released. The game feels more bloated every time I try and come back and play lol. This time at least it feels fresher with the reworks compared to before. Reboot server is pretty fun!
Anyone else remember a 2d maple clone called Ghost Online?
man i miss old maple story
I think what would fix maplestory would be seasons. 2-3 month seasons everyone starts with nothing and theres special events etc specific to the season.
Like path of exile and diablo etc
I'm partially thankful I was never ensnared into this game when I was a kid. Otherwise, it might truly be the only thing I could remember growing up.
Oh man, POE did in 10 years of power creep, what Maple story took 20 years to do.
as a dude that played in 2008 for a while then quit.... BILLION DAMAGE LINES?? i kinda want to play again i cant lie