Nik Nocturnal | Slaughter To Prevail are suing Sumerian Records?
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- Опубликовано: 2 янв 2022
- Nik Nocturnal discusses the recent news about Slaughter To Prevail suing Sumerian Records. Come join the community and hangout on Twitch! / niknocturnal also, be sure to subscribe for more content!
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*What are your thoughts on this? Leave a comment down below!*
Labels are usually pretty protected by their contracts, so even if they're able to leave, there's probably gonna be repercussions.
Guess Asking Alexandria we’re right to leave
His Brand is bigger then Slaughter To Prevail! I know a lot of people who nod straight away when I say alex terrible and look at me strangely when I say Slaughter To Prevail. Don't think that someone can pretend to him :D
Unfortunately if they signed a contract it may be difficult to get out of that. I think it all depends on how much sumerian is going to throw at this (money-wise). Slaughter to prevail is blowing up recently, sumerian would be stupid to just let them go.
I feel like if they are not let out of their contract, they should make their next album for Sumerian be just 65 minutes of flatulence, with Pig Squeals, and trash can drums. Add a production with the clarity of a late 80's black metal band. I bet the label would love it lol
i am very much anti-label, they are very greedy and to a degree they are outdated, nowadays there are better ways of marketing without needing a corporate hand to do it, it just seems very 20th century in a 21st century world.
Not a lawyer, but I think that what happens will depend largely on a few things.
1: Why specifically do they want out? Is there something that Sumerian promised that they aren't delivering on? If so, they might be able to build a case around that. Does Alex just think that he can do their job better? If that's the case he may have a very hard time in court. A contract is a contract and simply not liking it usually not a good enough reason to get out of it.
2: Have they tried to renegotiate the deal? If Alex has tried and the label isn't having it, that might look good to a judge. However, if the interview was the first time that the label heard that there was an issue, that's problematic.
3: Are they suing in the US or Russia? If it's in the US they may have a very hard time getting out of a properly written contract. If it's in Russia there's a good chance that a Russian judge will tell a US based label to get bent just because it's American.
Those are all good points, and I think that’s also what will decide whether or not I will support S2P in court cause if they want out because they don’t like the contract that they signed them I’ll not really feel too bad lol
Alex and the band are not that stupid(at least i hope so) to just want to terminate the contract because of not liking it, they probably have a solid argument up their sleeves to go against sumerian.
@@cile5459 I think some nuance was lost in translation of the phrase "we're gonna sue them". What he said in Russian was a less aggressive form roughly meaning "we're probably gonna be settling termination of contract in court". From what I gathered there wasn't any breach from Sumerian's side, but rather Alex thinks label's %%% translates into a bigger load of $$$ than he anticipated.
@@bennymountain1 oh, i mean, i don't speak Russian. We will see, anyway i hope that they win whatever they try to do and move on on their own.
Can we just take a moment to appreciate Nik's Russian accent? Yes? 🇷🇺🥃
Slavic Metal 2 confirmed
'Phrost
@@NikNocturnalTwitchClips Oh my blyat da por favor
Being Russian myself can't appreciate it. Sorry, Nik, too stereotypic ;)
@@FoxyMitya Have you heard Alex? It's not stereotypic, it's facts
My friend thought he is Russian 😩
They shouldn't be doing any interviews about this before going to court. He basically said they wanna leave because they could make more money on their own. That's not a basis for contract termination. They need to show that the current contract is "damaging them" in order to base the request for termination.
Why is so much very serious stuff happening in this very serious time right now in the metal community
D:
In the music industry in general.
The Taylor Swift move is the biggest Fuck you an artist gives to them.
(She's currently rearranging and rerecording her old albums, and rereleasing them)
Rick Beato make a video about it.
The music industry is experiencing growing pains right now.
this, EC changing their name, and im sure theres a lot more going on too
Slaughter to Prevail changes name to Kill to Achieve
Record Labels screwing bands over? No Way!
I went to college for audio production it didn't work out for me but I learned a lot. One thing I remember was how predatory record labels could be. Some artists could have entire albums never released because a higher up doesn't like them. Massive loans with open ended rules on use of money, some bands would use them to keep themselves fed and not realise they should be using it to pay for studio time. Not knowing how expensive studio time actually was. Multi album deals where the band is forced to keep their sound homogenized so experimentation isn't truly allowed. The list could go on forever but most of the industry is still behind the times and more than willing to turn bands to ash then let those trees grow.
Exact thing happened to Michelle Branch, a few years ago.
Had a whole Americana-type album ready - label put it on a shelf.
Imagine Alex in court releasing the Devil 🤣🤘
Mental image of him in his Russian Hate gear, mask too 🤣
'Phrost
First Eskimos Callboys cancel themselves, now this, crazy
What do you mean canceled themselves
@@ryanholt1680 they may change their name
@@ryanholt1680 they're taking all their old albums offline and consider changing their name
@@DashhunterLP Good that stuff is dreadful!
They don't have to sue to get out of a deal, there'll definitely be paperwork, but suing is a bit of a drastic measure.
They could also sue for their music rights (the masters etc)
@@CertifiedSunset who are the producers? I believe it's Alex and his team, but I can be wrong.
Also, Alex can pull a Taylor Swift move by recording the tracks, if he's not the producer. (Never an artist pulls a bigger fuck you to the industry than Taylor Swift, what were the odds to be her than any other artist/band ?)
@@guy_autordie The difference here is Taylor Swift has a dummy rich father who could afford to go through the legal battles for her. And the contract they signed may have signed away the rights to their albums to Sumerian Records as part of the intitial agreement. If Sumerian Records owns all of their previous music then they can't make hardly any money off of it. Sueing to disolve the contract may give them their master versions of their music so they can actually get paid what they are worth.
Okay so, on one hand, they can't really sue the label just because they don't like the contracts. On the other hands, a LOT of labels are known to be pretty fucking predatory and a control freak. I'm saying depending on the amount of evidences, it can go both ways.
Going into a legal battle against a label doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
Look at what happened to Tom Petty for more on that.
Look at a day to remember, it can go both ways. I would say if they have enough evidence of wrongdoing then give it hell
Tom Petty didnt have youtube channel
Hey pre law/criminology student here it's hard to say with the label and band being to 2 different countries, but both the US and Russia both follow civil law (a country that uses legal codes and statutes in legal proceedings) so there may be more common ground there. With a civil case you need to be a balance of probabilities to win your case. So the judge has to be over 50% sure that you deserve a form of fix or compensation to win. We don't know what was in the initial contract or what happened between the label and the band behind closed doors so again its hard to say. What the band really needs is a good lawyer/ legal team to help them because they could look at either entering a negotiation with the label or full on sue them. Also the band needs to keep quiet about taking legal action because once mentioned the other side will start to prepare and its extremely hard to pull the brakes on the process. Love Slaughter to prevail, hope they become independent and make more awesome music. Sorry for the long comment. Just wanted to add my 2 cents.
I doubt Sumerian would be cool with letting them go. They've become big money makers for them
It's gonna be one awesome pokemon battle.
Alex Terrible: growl
Everybody: runs away
Alex just be like: record done we drop now right?
Labels usually are pretty protected by their contracts, so even if they're ending up able to leave, there's probably gonna be repercussions.
I think STP suing Sumerian just because "we don't like the contract" doesn't exactly give much legal ground for them to stand on. I could say otherwise and die on a hill defending Slaughter but "just not liking the way things are going" isn't really grounds enough for a lawsuit. Just my two cents
Well they did massively simplify the reason why they are sueing, I'm assuming there are the usual predatory things in the contract put there to screw the band out of money so the label can benefit.
@@CertifiedSunset And that's what Sumerian loves to do. agreed with OP but I'm not surprised Sumerian might get sued if it's money. they're dirty
The Russian flag with the Alex accent was hilarious, (coming from a slav myself.)
One thing's for sure, someone could sue Sumerian Records for putting an Egyptian Sphinx in their logo, and thus inflicting potential damages on the educational progress of broad public. What exactly is STP sueing SR for, remains mystery to me. Anyway, they should definitely abstain from posting open statements while drunk.
Well the sphinx isn't actually egyptian, there are iterations in Asian mythology, Greek mythology and Indian mythology around the same time, it is a mythical beast and cannot then be used in any lawsuit pertaining to its usage as an emblem/logo.
i think labels are big and important part in metal scene just like banks in local communities, they have their advantages and disadvantages just like going independent have its own as well, whatever happen between them i will still listen to STP and subscribe to Sumerian at the same time.
but banks are useless
Most likely sueing from lack of aid would be my assumption. Alex is very aggressive marketing wise with the covers as a way to generate an extra source of income which is funded via patreon. He didn't start pumping out covers until recent years which is all solo without a record label and gets just as much if not more publicity than STP stuff. So most likely had issues getting recording, marketing, merch, etc done through sumerian as from my perspective it means sumerian is dropping the ball on STP if the music straight up gets more views when released on his own channel then who knows what else the band does better without sumerian.
Edit: STP has also got to be one of the bigger bands signed to sumerian as their own video has 12m views and nothing in sumerian's uploads is over 10m views other than tv series related stuff in the last year or so, asking alexandria is close but that was also released almost 2 years ago and at this point anybody who has ever listened to metal or rock and now country rock knows who the fuck asking alexandria is.
Unfortunately we live in an age of algorithms and shit and there is no way Sumerian is in any algorithm gang if a channel with almost a third of the subs gets bigger publicity for the same content.
I wouldn't say that slaughter is bigger than like Veil of Maya or Animals as leaders etc etc... Sure Demolisher was a big song, because of the demon Russian speak, and everyone and their mother doing a review of the song. But STP is still not what I'd call a "big" band. Just my opinion, I don't even know why I'm putting it out there lol. If you disagree I'd love to hear your counter offer though.
@@danielnelson4881 I definitely agree on the popularity due to them both existing for like 3x the time that slaughter has existed for. For metal anything getting over 1 million views on youtube is pretty fucking big tbh.
If you go based on spotify monthly listeners they are twice as big as other massive deathcore acts like shadow of intent, brand of sacrifice and even stand above lorna shore. How many tours do they do? Like none in USA. They should be parading across the country especially since they could come to usa they aren't like banned or anything. USA is allowed to travel to russia right now and vice versa. Yet they only tour in RU.
Edit: unless sumerian literally doesn't care about their investment/brand they should have slaughter to prevail in every country by 2023 especially since i've already seen a few bands in 2021 2-3 times from tours in USA from much smaller labels.
@@ExiledVessel I gotta say... I don't disagree with a single thing that you've said. All of that is very compelling, and very true... I guess I didn't realize just how big STP had gotten!
Counter offer accepted. I think you're on to something here.
And I just bought a STP hoodie from Sumerian too :(
Anyone remember with what happened for ADTR vs. Victory records?
Adtr won
@@dragonpup1 exactly
Alex is the definition of a frontman hands down and if its not about the passion of the band and its members within sharing that same passion then what is the real meaning of a band? Id like to see how this shapes out. I wish the homies at Slaughter To Prevail luck in this lawsuit if it comes to fruition.
I'm not surprised by this honestly. First Periphery openly air their issues with Sumerian, then there was the issues with Jason Richardson and royalties involving "The Discovery" and Sumerian not paying him for years. Seems they have a lot to work on internally.
Yea, seems Sumerian has a history of some pretty strange contract deals going on. I still remember the 2014 / 2015 "The Road to the Sphinx" contest where some of the contract details were laid out in a youtube video. Sounds like Sumerian likes to control who stays in the bands, and what music ends up on certain albums. If they dont green light a song, its gone.
Holy shit.
It can be add to the case.
"Also all of this stuff, which doesn't affect us, but we don't want to deal with that kind of shit because SR are control freaks."
well Usually at least, they have x money that is put towards the album and everything it takes to get it done. You don't get anything until the money is made back then the band starts seeing x amount back, which is usually a percentage. Bands should read their contracts and negotiate before just signing..More than likely this is all on STP. Nothing new whatsoever.
I used to think a band who signed with a label got paid to record music, tour etc. After I realized that they still pay the label to record... Bruh. I had a naive outlook on labels in my younger years, thinking labels financed everything (especially when you got big enough to bring in the "big bucks"). Oh how wrong I was.
I used to think bands could use the studio for free and spend hours everyday in a studio lol.
Wait, bands still have to pay the label for recording? Really? I thought bands pay them by having certain amount of share from profits of their concert, merch & albums selling and stuff?
I saw it coming. It was really just a matter of time.
Alex actually mentions all of this on Zavali Ebalo. That song is basically a diss track to the label!
I've also seen some stuff around about sumerian not treating asking alexandria the best so its kinda disappointing to see more going on with them
Yup. Especially with LAHOF
Weird, love Alex and S2P but I side with the label. Just finish the contract and then go independent. Use the head start they gave you and then once your contract is fulfilled move on.
Dang... 2022 starting off with a charge!!
How Triple H says - this is best for business 😂😂
GOod video Nik ! as always
Nyet! Album is fine!
What a situation omg
As someone that studied the history of Rock from the beginning.
To put it simply.
If you can avoid labels. Do that.
Slipknot signed what I believe is a 7 album contract with road runner. 23 years later and they are working on that 7th album
Going off of what I just heard in this video, I hope they come out of this clean, but I’m a bit doubtful. Assuming Sumerian didn’t do anything wrong and kept to the contract, I think the only way they get out easy is if Sumerian lets them out. Regardless of whether they didn’t have any financial advisors when they signed the contract, going to court and admitting you put your signature on something you didn’t understand is something I can’t see holding up well.
Reminds me of when my friends band from Seattle, Numbers, won the battle of the bands contest with sumarian and the first prize was a record deal but the terms of the deal were sooooooooo unfair the band passed on the offer because sumarian wouldn't give them creative control. That label has been fucked for a while.
See your friends band was smart about this. Slaughter should of read their contract and shopped around a little more. It's all on them.
Well holy shit
it's not that new, 30stm has a documentary about it, and bands like ADTR were suing Victory about a decade ago
But what I will why would anyone sign to a label if they new it was a bad label. So it’s obvious that at the start it was fine. Ur a legend I love ur videos
im in the process of learning to read and speak russian, as well as getting my passport this weekend, to hopefully this year go to russia to see them, The Korea or Invertor if possible if not at least to just eat a meal
He is the new version of MITCh from suicide silence
They will have to buy out and loose all royalties. That's what I learned from Mark Tremonti and Alter Bridge with Wind-up records. I think it's very stupid to communicate it this way, it's a slippery slope with these legal issues.
2:41 Yes, this video is how I found out Alex Terrible is the lead of Slaughter to Prevail
I watched a Joe Rogan podcast with the singer of Smashing pumpkins , when he did his record deal...was stated that he had the rights to sell music on this earth and not any other to be discovered,.
That's what I call future proofing your paperwork.
the whole basis of music industry contracts is predatory by nature. If they're not happy who cares what they signed
you don't want to know whats outside the music industry... ITS THE SAME!
I'm siding with the label. If you're gonna claim that you were happy with signing and say that the label helped you get big, you should fulfill the contract.
You should honor the contrat even if there is wrong doings coming form the label?
SR seems to be control freaks with a bad behavior. Sooooo
You do have to realize he probably wanted to say something good about the label so it didn't sound like he was just straight dunking on them the entire time. Likely felt pressured to say something positive and that's just what came to mind. I'd doubt, although I couldn't possibly know this and it's just my guess, I doubt Sumerian did anything for STP that Alex's already established following couldn't have done alone.
When alex pulls up to the courtroom in a tank with a bear for a lawyer.
Labels are still useful. They're just not the end all be all that they used to be. I'm sure a label could be useful for me in some ways.
To quote a comment i saw on Facebook:
"I would too after an underwhelming album release"
They should have definitely gone independent but, yeah. Idk if they would've had as much as jump off if they didn't. Stir, I'd rather be independent. Hopefully they'll settle this to their favor.
I didn’t know who Sumerian was until slaughter to prevail signed with them
Idk how..Veil of maya, after the burial, stick to your guns, the faceless, born of osiris, animals as leaders all on there. Been one of the biggest, besides metal blade and road runner
Sounds like made their bed and they need to sleep in it. They can’t get mad if they signed and agreed to the terms. It’s their fault they didn’t know what they were doing
I can easily see a contract re-structure. Both parties stay happy and move forward.
All contracts are negotiable. Never forget that.
Kinda sounds to me like Tommy Vext vs. Better Noise Music part 2
if t swift can re record her old songs to gain the rights to her music, slaughter can too
All bands today should be independent if possible. Especially those who already have a fan base without a label. It’s basically the equivalent of saying you have to go to college in order to make money. Ya it may help but your gonna owe a lot of money and potentially not any better off.
Asking alexandria were told by Somalian to wait to release their last album as it was lockdown and Ben Bruce (creator of asking alexandria and lead guitarist and back up singer for asking) said our fans need something to keep them going so we are just gonna drop it and samarian were like nah we need to wait till its over so you guys can tour with it and get the max amount of money from it but they released it anyway and and the year after in 2021 they released yet annother album they already started before the release of the album before on a different label.. they had 4 albums backlogged due to samarian..... they even said in a small zippo acoustic performance that they had someone somewhere acoustic version that they had a music for and danny said and I quote.. "we only finished filming it 3 fucking months ago"
Chon needs to join in on this because Sumerian fucked them over HARD. I heard about what happened to them on Ando San's stream and it's disgusting.
Hi
Hello, have a cookie 🍪
'Phrost
I'm withholding judgement until we hear more details. If Sumerian is upholding their end of the contract, then STP likely won't have much of a leg to stand on in the courtroom. However, Sumerian has been involved in some shady dealings lately and it wouldn't surprise me if this was just another example in a long line of dissatisfied Sumerian alumni. Interested to hear more.
Nik should check out Steven segals epic guitar playing!!!
STP impressive is probably spot on
Hello there.
Hello, take this cookie 🍪
'Phrost
The angel from my nightmare
Yeah I don't think the label will let them go, but if slaughter somehow gets a small win, I think the label will definitely take as much as they can from them.
What I want to know is why Alex is suing them, aside from unhappiness and disagreements.
For not reading their contract. Legal binding of years of your life and your career...no big deal lol
Hm, interesting article, should check on Russian side of things later.
Btw, their recent live show in Saint-Petersburg was a fucking fire, never will I ever regret on buying ticket on drunk decision.
Привет, Андрей...
Yes YT did auto generate Hunky-Dory
Slaughter will probably have to pay sumerian a grip to get out of this contract.
I hope Alex comes through and that this isn't something negative to his mindset and motivation.
"What do u think? Did u make big messssss?!" Bonebreaker
Remember back in 2014 when Sumerian was top tier shit? Damn dude what happened to them
PLEASE REACT TO 2021 EM UMA MÚSICA by Inutilismo
Most likely they'll just adjust the contract.
i just hope it ends well, im hoping its an out of court settlement. my prediction: sumerian gets to keep their money from existing sales and productions, stp can claim royalties but does not own the rights and is no longer bound by contract with sumerian. win-win ya know
Was Nik drunk during this stream?
Nah that was the Christmas Eve stream 🤣
'Phrost
When will musicians learn that once you sign to a label your music is no longer yours. How many rock, punk and metal bands have gone through this before, we have all heard the scary stories, yet we still sign sign sign. It's ridiculous and I don't feel sorry.
why they sign the contract if they can fully rely in Alex with marketing and fan base? To get money for producing and realasing music and to have someone who organize tours etc... but its not free
Very similar to Slipknot when they signed with roadrunnner
Bears dont become regular lawyers. They become Barristers!
I predict Unique Leader snatching them up.
When renegociation fails, you sue.
But I like the franklyness of Alex. He is true to his words.
Also, he's russian, and the top side, not the bottow one, don't fuck with him.
Helloooooo☺☺☺
Hi there
'Phrost
Do we think that Slaughter to Prevail is serious? I'm an attorney in New York and I would love to help if I can.
I don't think this is going to be as impactful as you say. Slaughter seems to be doing this to just go independent for the sake of being independent. I know they are covered a decent amount, but if they factor in cost of touring and cost of everything else, I don't think they will get as far as they'd like to think they are. Plus the world is trending in the direction of Pandemic 2: Electric Boogaloo... Don't think you want to be picking that fight quite yet.
If we are talking one of the most impactful cases regarding label and band, ADTR set the absolute bar for that by proving Victory was skimming royalties and was able to get away from the label. They're arguably the most successful independent band out there. Even then, I believe they get some support from Fueled by Ramen and Epitaph.
Dude... You know how much a 12 million views video makes on RUclips alone? More than Sumerian paid them in total I'll bet. They not only *can* make it as an independent band, but they would be so much better off independent, and make so much more money.
Now don't get me wrong, STP is a special case. Because of Alex's RUclips videos, collabs with other bands like Shadow of Intent and whatnot... STP already has a huge shoe in the door for going independent. Not just any band could do this, in fact most should not. I'd say Alex has arguably just as big of a publicity machine going as the entirety of Sumerian records. Everyone I know who likes metal knows Sumerian, they also know who Alex Terrible is. Just like Nick was saying. So they could be doing things just as successfully as they are with Sumerian, without splitting the pie and giving over half of it away before they even divvy it up amongst themselves.
Also, the "support" you're talking about in your last sentence, that's called sponsorship earnings. They are earned... Not just some handout given to a band by a company who likes their music or something... So that was irrelevant. Sponsorships are part of paying your bills if you're going to be producing any kind of media, be that music, RUclips videos, or what have you.
if Alex and the boys are angry at Sumerian, it's gotta be for a good reason, i dont see this being done on a whim.
I'd say the ideal scenario would be Sumerian realizes how letting Slaughter out of the contract could help them (great positive PR) and tries to use that to draw in more talent so the revenue loss will be lessened or even entirely negated. That being said, most people in charge of decisions like this don't give a flying fuck about people and just want as much money as possible, I can see this going really poorly for the guys. I hope it doesn't, but I wouldn't be surprised if it does.
I know this is a year old but lets not forget about the rumors going around about chon getting fucked by sumerian as well, if the rumors are true, its the reason they haven't made music in years.
damn, now THIS is news. i really don't think they should SUE them, but Sumerian only has one or two good bands as we speak so they're pretty much fucking dead now, and STP leaving is gonna put a huge dent into Sumerian. i don't even like Sumerian that much, but they would be MUCH better with a label like Nuclear Blast or Century Media
Agreed with NB or CM. Much better bands on both labels.
More bands need to do this I love what they are doing. On top of that creators need to start complaining about copyright and how bullshit it is them taking down our streams! RUclips streaming is absolutely poop that's why I switched to Twitch cuz of a strike from an Imminence album review...
@Spiritset because of copyright idk either got my first strike. I tried to appeal and got rejected
Omg your russian accent killed me 🤣
I think UNFD just signed another band
Sumerian now seems rather weak in terms of promotion. And I suppose they have too much control on bands. I'm glad that ERRA has left Sumerian, hope Veil of Maya will (they deleted the majority of the new album because of the actions of certain individuals - possibly, Sumerian management)
I mean, Sumerian has been begging to get sued for years now. Just look at their name. Su me rian.....
I think I will....
His statement dooms any possible lawsuit. He shouldn't have said any of that. He stated they signed and were happy, now they aren't happy and wanna make more money than the contract they were happy with allowed. Not saying Sumerian is in the right, but man Alex shot them in the foot multiple times there.
New name: ESKIMO SLAUGHTERBOY