I'm seeing that forklift batteries usually come in 24, 36, and 48 volts, all made up of two volt cells. They are designed to survive being banged around on solid rubber tires with no suspension. Reconditioned used ones can last for decades in home solar applications. You're a helpful person, so I'm passing back to you what I've learned. Getting the two volt cells out of a steel case can be work. They weigh over 100 lbs each. The lead bars connecting them have to be cut, too.
Good coverage in a short time. I use AGM batteries in my small solar system but I'm fortunate to be in an area with a lot of businesses that use AGM batteries in their big UPS systems and for backup for their video surveillance. The last group of AGM (two 100AH and two 110AH, about 15 months old) cost me $305 (versus close to $800 new). My spreadsheet for power usage assumes a maximum of 50% Depth of Discharge and the previous group of used 80AH AGMs lasted almost 9 years (5 years in UPS service, 4 years for me [to below 80% capacity] - but they were only $35 each - not likely to find a deal like that again). Using AGMs means I don't worry about ventilation or weekly water checks and, if those checks fell to my better half, that might not get checked until we were in the dark. Plus they can be on a shelving unit in the basement with the charge controllers and inverter hung off the side of a shelf for good cooling air flow. Instead of the current 420AH of AGMs, I'd like to have triple that in LiFePO4 - currently about $2500 (Amazon, free delivery in about a week) with BMSs, but they'd likely outlive me and I'd have fridge power for almost a week. I am replacing some hard-to-find AGM UPS batteries with DIY LiFePO4 using cells from batteryhookup.com - beats the $50 the UPS manufacturer wants for the AGM with maybe a 4 year life in UPS service, especially when the parts cost (cells, BMS, holder) was under $20 and I got to learn about a new battery technology. The now 6-year-old battery that I took out of my truck a year ago when it sounded like the starter was turning a little slow, now sits in the basement for testing inverters and performing jump start duty. A battery impedance meter still shows it at about 90% of its original capacity and I have an Advance Auto battery from 2005 that's in a plastic battery case for when I need portable power - neither of those is deep cycle but they see only intermittent use and they work fine for that. My solar power spreadsheet does have a page for flooded lead acid batteries with the maximum DOD being 20% (but adjustable, depending on need). If things go sideways, there will likely be lots of abandoned vehicles - useless without fuel - but the parts are still useful (power seat motor driving a solar tracker?) and I have spare charge controllers configured for flooded batteries, just in case. One formula I found for RC to AH would make an RC of 160 = 94AH, but a new, name brand battery could be 9% higher than that or about 102AH (based on some testing I did). Using half the RC as an approximation of the AH ensures you won't exceed the battery's capacity I've been there when a spark exploded a lead acid battery. I was fortunate that the battery was in a vehicle and that it blew out a bottom corner and just ate up the cuffs of my jeans and my Keds ;-( That might be one reason I prefer AGMs and the newer lithium technologies ;-) The inverter is a 2000 watt pure sine wave unit from reliablepower on Ebay (now selling them with a WZRELB label) with an identical unit as a spare. The inverter's output is cleaner (oscilloscope check) than what the local power co-op delivers. The charge controllers are EPEver 3210A 30 amp MPPT units and all of it has been in place for 4 years. The maximum load on the inverter is about 1300 watts when fridge, freezer, furnace blower and a few LED lights are all on. The average load is much less as it's rare for everything to be on at the same time. If that became a problem, I have digital timers rated at 15 amps so the fridge and freezer could each be on for 2 hours at a time but in a staggered cycle. The inverter connects to a 4 circuit transfer switch via a 12/3 extension cord - the same cord is used when the inverter generator is in use (about two weeks of treated fuel for keeping the battery bank charged when power is off and there is no sun). Longest time on the backup syetem so far was 12 hours when the county had 7-12" of snow in an area that rarely sees more than 3". Sure is nice to walk down the stairs and flip a couple of switches to have power instead of shoveling 7" of snow in the dark at 30F to get a generator out of the shed and trying to start that gen at that temperature...
Pop the lids off and use a small pocket mirror to save your back from having to lift those heavy batteries. Use the mirror to look inside the battery to check the levels of course.
Your video has been very helpful to me as I prepare to put together batteries for my grid down preparation efforts. I will now share with you what I've since learned. Please, search RUclips for information on using forklift batteries for your solar. I predict that you may be glad you did. 🙂
I just bought two Group 29DC deep cycle marine batteries (flooded lead acid). I guess battery manufacturers are now putting the amp hours on the battery label instead of "reserve capacity" because both of my new batteries state 122 Amp Hours right on the top label where reserve capacity used to be.
Many manufacturers state the amp hour capacity - it's more so for marketing - Very few understand battery technology today compared to the past - if a battery states it 100 amps in reality only 50% of it is usable power with lead acid battery's that have been fully charged over 24 hours - If person sees 100 amps that looks good but most devices drop out at 10.5 volts - so on a fresh long charge the battery will delver 50 amps - if the battery is cycled daily as on a sail boat - they don't have the fuel to charge 12 to 16 hrs a day - so they fast charge 1 hr and 15 minutes a day or till the battery gasses - at 85% state of charge that's concidered full charged - it might take up to 24 hour to get the last 15% back into a battery -
@@thesolarjunkie that's good what you have as long as you still have good sun your ok - Far about 35 yrs I had 106 golf cart batteries - I was hybrid - My stand by generator burned 50 gallons of propane a day - After hurricanes and ice storms they don't deliver propane for w while - I would just have my stand by generator start an d run 3 to 4 hrs a day and replace the energy used out the battery's each day - instead of burning a 1000 gallons of propane in 3 weeks I would only burn around 150 gallons of propane in 3 week going hybrid - Today I just use a inverter generator so I gave the battery's to a friend - I just have a few battery's like you have now & just run a 5000 BTU AC - after storms like Ida
12v flooded battery and what may the settings be for, bulk, absorption and float... Yeah and equalization. Do you know? (Its a 12v tudor flooded battery with a victron 100/20)
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J. Lynn Engle, thanks for the question. There is absolutely no problem with leaving batteries and charge controller hooked to solar panels 24/7. My batteries do, and have been doing great for years.
As long as your using power off the battery's it should be ok - if your not using power off the battery's it's better to just put them on a float or maintenance charger from the grid when there not needed - The daily cycling of solar panels when battery's are not discharged will sulfate them - If they do sulfate you can look on you tube for desulfating battery's with a welding machine - amazon has $60 inverter welders that are fantastic for desulfating lead acid flooded battery's - That's method has been used for over 140 yrs with lead acid battery s - If there not on a charge maintenance charge you can top them off ever two weeks when it's warm - all that depends on the ambient temperature im using 80" f - High end. MPPT controllers have settings that will just monitor the battery's state of charge and give it a refresher charge when needed 😊
Hi, cool system. I have 2 big 200 ah deep cycle wet batteries in Parallel. So i‘m thinking about adding some 80 ah marine batteries parallel to the big ones. That shouldnt be a problem? Thanks a lot.
Are the 80 ah batteries the same kind of batteries as the 200 ah batteries? Both deep cycle? But presuming you have these attributes lined up, the answer to you question is that you may hook them together and it will work. It will not be as efficient as if they were all 200 ah or all 80 ah batteries. Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep thanks! I just hooked them up! It works. The bigger batteries just deliver more current. That‘s the advantage of an 12 volt system. I could theoretically hook as much batteries to the system as i want. As long as the type is the same. Thanks
@@batterynerd8779 The type, and as long as the VOLTAGES are already the same ( meaning closely the same,close to .02 or .03 volts diff); if not, the higher volts ones will discharge into the lower volts ones ( that is what volts do...) and tend to even things out; unless one of the batteries already has a bad cell, a lower voltage that is,and then it will keep on eating volts (milliamps!) from the good battery; i have one of those tiny red display digital voltmeters ( 4 of them..) atop each one of my 4 batteries,for just a glance; there are many other tests you can do when using multiple batteries; now a question : 4 batteries (or 6,or 8...) , 12v each, for a 24v system: is it better to parallel 2 series of 2 ,or to series 2 parallels of 2 ?
@@josepeixoto3384 it actually doesn’t matter too much. It depends on your setup. It‘s just important that you firet put all your batteries in parallel (12v,6v…) and charge them to 14.4 and 2 hours at 15 volts. They will be perfectly balanced. In series, all batteries need to be the same battery capacity and voltage. Then you can arrange them how you want to. It doesnt matter 2 p 2s or 2s 2p. Just how much cable you want to use. The more cable, the more resistance-> power loss
Love the content, Thanks for the tips. I have a tip for you as well. Please get a gimble. The video shaking is hard to watch the video. 100$ will get you one that keeps everything smooth no jittering. Get one that handles the weight of your phone.
Great video full of useful information. Just a heads up your microphone sounds good and picks up your voice pretty well, so you probably dont need yell in order to get your point across. Anyways, Thanks again for taking the time to put this video online. There isnt enough info on Lead acid based backup power sytems.
You said to not let the voltage go below 12.1vdc, but wired in parallel how to you know each batteries voltage to keep them above 12.1? Also having 4 batteries wired in parallel would you wire the charge source (solar) in the middle of at an end? Thanks
I keep my entire battery Bank from going under 12.1 volts. I read the entire battery Bank as if it was one battery. I connect the wires to the charge controller to one anchor battery and it works out just fine for me. Thanks for your comment.
You would need to put one lead on a end battery if you have four battery's Pharrell together - you would put one lead say the positive on #1 battery them the negative on the #4 battery - If you put both the charge leads on #1 battery - the number one battery will take all the charge - you also hook up your load just as you hook up your charging leads - If your load and charge leads are hooked to #1 battery it will only draw current and charge #1 battery - #2 through #4 battery's will sulfate on you in a short time - so to prevent that from happening you have to do what I had stated - There is a lot to learn about any battery technology - you can look at my other comments & learn more -
It does matter ware you terminate the load and the charger to a battery bank - I'm a 4th generation hybrid power generation electrician ; my grand father started into that field in the late 1800s - I spent my yrs working in the offshore gas & oil industry - we generated all the power we used on offshore platforms - I did that for decades - Many platforms are capable of going into hurricane mode when there is just to much moisture in the air for generators to run during hurricanes - In that case huge battrey's operate a platform - I'm very familiar with all types of battery technology - Even lead acid battrey's can be cycled many decades if you understand the applied technology - For some one to say it's ok to hook up a charger or load to the first battery in a group of batteries lacks knowledge - I spent decades maintaining large hybrid UPS systems - my comment on the proper way to hook up to battery has been the industry standard for 160 yrs for a good reason -
UPDATE : I have 18 batteries now...I may get two more. I have two more 100 watts solar panels coming Friday, so I thought I would get a couple more for them to charge. 1200 watts of solar charging 1000 amp hours of battery. These ones I use have 210 RC , they are a 29 DP-DL. It is 11 PM, 25.6 volts left. I think 20 will be enough. I'm trying to find some #2 welding lead wire locally tomorrow. I'm going to call it " The Twenty Mule Team " and hope it lasts twenty years. That's my plan for this year for my stuff. I have off grid power already but it won't hurt to improve it. I want to get my system in A number one shape this summer. At least no one should say I made a half way attempt at it. My power will be dependable and enough when I am done tinkering. Suppose I took two years' electric bill to build the whole thing ? And then I have 10 years of free power after that...that sounds okay to me. Well, it's like being in the lake above your knees, might as well jump on in there. LOL ...I feel for those who don't get something put together, whatever it is, big or small, as long as it is dependable. I want my stuff to be rock solid good to go. I'm hoping that by having a big bank the batteries will last a long time. Not much danger of boiling 20 of them all at once...they charge kind of slow when they all get together. Yeah since I will be done buying batteries this month, I will save for the pricey inverter. This is my first solar system. It is going to be nice when I get it all done, I think. Seems like everyone builds theirs a little differently. My 105 amp hour batteries cost me around $100 apiece, but they seem good enough to me for that price. The plates are just a little taller and wider in the ones I get. And they hold more acid , so less frequent checks. I've tried to cover my bases, that way. Oh, if your battery level is hard to see, a dental mirror from dollartree can be very useful...you might want to wrap it with tape before use though, except the end.
Most of what is stated about CMEs and EMPs on the domestic level is mis information - If a bolt of lightning strikes a car it can destroy some electronics - but cell phone battery's and car battery s are never damaged - if a bolt of lightning strikes right next to a car at times a car might shut down but starts back up and is fine - There many times lightning strikes. Next to solar panels and there fine even after several strikes - the battery's are ok - my house transformer was once struck 2 consecutive times - It burnt out a few phone chargers and a clock - but the phones were ok - The EMP of lightning is concentrated and a billion times stronger than a CME or EMP - they effect power lines the lines are gigantic antennas - the magnetic pulse creates a electromagnetic pulse that creates an induction strong enough to create counter EMF - It becomes surges for transmission transformers that generate extreamly high voltage and arc out the transformers and generators - as for the battery's they can absorb much of that just fine - in the oilfields offshore - all communications are supported by battery's of some sort - the battery's absorb the energy of direct lightning strike of towers. - They do that with high cell towers also -
I’ve been watching many different videos about batteries…..and after all is said and done, I’m thinking the Lead Acid Deep Cycle maybe my best option. I’m building a rather unusual set up, and durability is key. I’m setting up a service truck for a long term vehicle build, so it will be able to do many tasks. So it’s a 1992 GMC, I’m going to remove the bed, and build a custom utility bed with my welder/generator and a separate dedicated generator connected to an Automatic Generator Start switch a charge controller and a couple of inverters, as well as a DC to DC charger and at least one, possibly two 250 watt solar panels up top. A large dedicated metal toolbox up on top of the roof rack will hold the “house batteries” with one solar panel on it, the toolbox will be insulated and fire resistant, with cooling fans and a fire extinguishing system (just in case). I was going to get two large 250AH batteries, but it seems several car size RV batteries should work as well. The duties of the battery bank, will be to power one inverter for general 110 use in the cab, and a second inverter to power climate control system for the cab and battery box, the generator (insulated for sound) will automatically start early on cold mornings to heat up the cab, and warm the antifreeze with a block heater. Thermostats will determine when heating or cooling is needed.
I have been using FLA Batts and they last 6 to 7 years. Don't overcharge or run them down past 12.2 ---If they go down past 12 Volts and stay as little as I day they will sulphate and Die.
Yeap.12.2 is the number; they don't always die; if one forgets the lights on, in the car, until the battery reads near zero, no kind of signs of life, upon recharging (within ONE day,tops!!) it always recovers; been around cars for 40 years and this has happenned a few times to me and others; but if the battery was already old and barely making it,about to die,THEN it says the heck with it,and dies... rip (edit: recycle it please).
Thank you for this video. I built a lead acid set up in my RV. But the batteries are inside and aren’t ventilated ( yet) ( a huge retrofit would be needed).Is this a serious issue? Meaning, do they off gas when running or being charged only, or all the time? Is opening the door regularly going to be enough? I don’t smell anything ( gases)- is that an indication that it’s minimal, or are the gases odorless?? Thx for you answers. And I’m a new subscriber to your channel!
Welcome new subscriber! The batteries produce the most gas when they are charging. So during charging try to have a window or a door open. You cannot smell these gases. You should be aware they exist though. Thanks for your comment.
There are devices that detect when battery's are being charged and run a small axil ventilating fan on high after charging is terminated the fan runs on low - hydrogen is highly flammable it's what makes gasoline and vapor gases so flammable - On the old diesel submarines there were hoses connected to battery caps that drew air that pulled the hydrogen off the battery's and it went through a catalyst to burn off the hydrogen even when they were not being charged - In an enclosed area there should be a fan to ventilate hydrogen out side -
well at my location the cheapest lead acid deep cycle batteries , when i calculate the usable A in each type lead acid is 3-3,5 times more expensive the cheapest is the eve 280 ah lipo4 cells not the asembled ones they are however still cheaper then lead acid ,, i have been running a 8s 280ah 24v as my energy storage for about a year now its enough for 3- 4 days of power i am however gonna make a identical 24v more , for more storage i have been looking for used forklift batteries as i figured some of the smaller handtrucks were going to litium however no luck
@@shoestringprep thanks for your answer , if you are located in the states i can recommend looking into them they can be purchased cheaply compared to the durabillitythey are comprised by 2V cells but are 70cm high 25cm wide and they have huge plates and can take a real beating the ultimate deep cycle battery many buy 36 volt packs and sort the worst cells off and build either 2 12v or 1 24v battery
I have 14 of those from Autozone,...I'm thinking about getting two more...lol...they are running a 24 volts 2000 watts Aims inverter / charger ...I have 1000 watts of panels, and a 40 amp Epever charge controller, 4215 BN...I didn't use much power so the battery bank was at 24.4 this morning , sometimes it drops a little lower but not much...I got too many batteries and had to get more solar panels a month ago so I don't want to get too many more...maybe max out at 18 of them...lol...the first ten were 90 amp hours but the last 4 are 105, 180 and 210 reserve minutes, and if I get two more they will be the bigger ones...that would give me 765 amp hours @ 24 volts...I'm thinkin that's enough for me...I started this little solar journey about a year ago...I haven't used the grid for four months...I used to use the gasoline genereator some but now I've even stopped doing that...I used a # 2 welding lead on the battery wiring and there's four ends attached to the inverter...nothing has ever gotten warm on any of that...one thing I did on my system is, I put a #6 wire to all the 12 volts connections, like an 8 legged spider with a big brass Kearney in the middle...that's my BMS...so that when I hook up my 410 watt inverter to run small stuff, it is running off either the top set or bottom set of 7 ( for now) batteries, that way it doesn't run one battery down...This is one of the coolest things I've ever done...I guess it's a good thing I bought my inverter when I did...it has went up $116 since I got mine in December...I barely could afford it as it was...thanks for the great video...everyone said don't use those kind, but I've been around cars and batteries since I was a kid...and I know it takes a lot longer to charge a marine battery so I knew they would be okay...it just takes a lot of them to throw out a bunch of amps but they recover nicely...I'll probably get two more and stop at 16...I think I have about enough...yay...those things cost...lol Buying the last two will be like getting a get out of jail free card...
It's great you could build a system that works for you. Everyone's system will be a little different to meet their needs. Upload a photo of your system if you get a chance. We would all love to see it. Thanks for your comment.
IVE USED 2 CAR BATTERIES ON MY SMALL SYSTEM TO RUN LIGHT AND SYSTEM, FOR 2 YEARS NOW, I JUST MADE SURE CONTROLLER WAS SET TO 11 JUST OVER 59% OF BATTERY CAPACITY I FOUND I COULD GET 6 HOURS OF TV POWER AT LEAST OFF THE 2 BATTERIES,
I have a 48 volt 840 amp system off grid, 12 years. I just got done running a 3 1/2 day test on my essential load panels through my Sunny Island. Let me hit you up with a bit of grammar: Nothing is ever "four times (4X) less expensive." That is "getting bigger" to "get smaller." What you meant to say is that: "FLA IS 1/4TH THE COST OF LFP ... or ... 25% AS EXPENSIVE." Guess I'm a dickhead.
If you're going to go with lead acid, get some golf cart batteries with a high amount of amp hours. Those are better for off grid and those useless marine batteries.
I'd prefer to use Lithium phosphate, they're safe, higher capacity, they can be safely discharged to near empty, they have longer cycle life, and nowadays you can get them for the same price as AGM. They also produce no gasses and are very low maininence.
SLA batteries are a huge pain in the neck. Their only redeeming quality is lower INITIAL cost. The truth of the matter is that Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) is not significantly better than building your own LiFePO4 battery system. Add in the lower weight and size of lithium, the relatively constant voltage, and the dramatically reduced maintenance requirements, and you quickly realize why most of the systems being built today, at least in the US, are ditching the SLA batteries and going with either lithium or at least AGM. There are several DIY lithium batteries on the market today that make it easy and relatively affordable, over the long term, to get all of the benefits of a far superior battery chemistry. No need to stick with 20th century solutions, if you don't want to.
AGM batteries are a simple, inexpensive solution to help people on tight budgets with their energy storage needs. They work best in temporary off-grid situations and they do very well for that purpose. We appreciate your input. Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep - LiFePO4 batteries are a simple, cost-effective solution to help people who understand value versus cost with their energy storage needs. They work better than AGM batteries because they do not off-gas and are safer to use indoors. Lowest cost is almost never the best solution.
@@jasonbroom7147 i am pretty sure most people would opt to have a 3M USD house that is totally up to passive house standards with the latest up-to-date systems keeping it totally independent. It will most probably pay off. You "just" have to find the 3M USD and you are all set. A proper size of LiFePo4 battery bank costs more than three months of total income for a family where I live and we are not considered poor. Explaining why people should invest big money that they don't have demonstrates no understanding of the word "shoestring".
@@koborkutya7338 - If you don't understand what a false economey is, there's little chance I'm going to be able to explain it to you. Nobody should invest big money in anything, if they don't have it to invest, but buying SLA batteries versus LFP isn't an investment...it's just a bad, short-term money decision. Making decisions like that is how you STAY broke.
he statement regarding flooded lead-acid batteries in off-grid solar systems contains several misleading elements. Let's break down the factual inaccuracies and clarify why this view might be harmful, especially when considering current technology and the evolving landscape of energy storage. Misleading Claims and Clarifications Current Draw and Performance: Flooded Lead-Acid Batteries: These batteries can indeed provide high current, but their efficiency diminishes as the current draw increases. Flooded batteries have higher internal resistance, which leads to voltage drop under heavy load, reducing their effectiveness. AGM (Absorbent Glass Mat) Batteries: AGM batteries can handle higher current loads better than flooded cells. They have lower internal resistance and can deliver higher discharge rates without significant voltage drop. This means that in scenarios where high current is required, such as during heavy solar output or for powering high-demand appliances, AGMs outperform flooded batteries. Cost Considerations: Initial Costs: While flooded lead-acid batteries are often less expensive upfront compared to lithium-ion and AGM batteries, the total cost of ownership (TCO) over time is crucial. Flooded batteries require regular maintenance (checking water levels, equalizing charges) and have shorter lifespans (typically 3-5 years under optimal conditions). In contrast, AGM batteries, while slightly more expensive initially, offer maintenance-free operation and longer lifespans (up to 7-10 years or more). Lithium-Ion Batteries: In 2021, lithium batteries were relatively expensive but offered significant advantages in efficiency, depth of discharge (DoD), and lifespan (often exceeding 10 years). As prices have decreased since 2021, lithium batteries have become a more attractive option for off-grid systems due to their higher performance and lower long-term costs. Maintenance Requirements: Flooded lead-acid batteries require significant maintenance, including periodic watering and equalization charges to prevent sulfation, which can diminish capacity and shorten lifespan. This maintenance not only adds cost but also requires time and knowledge to perform correctly. AGM and lithium batteries are generally maintenance-free, leading to lower operational costs and less hassle for users. Technological Advancements: The shift away from flooded lead-acid batteries in off-grid solar systems is largely due to advancements in battery technology, specifically lithium-ion and AGM batteries, which provide better performance, higher efficiency, and more reliable energy storage capabilities. As energy needs grow, especially with the increasing integration of solar power and electric vehicles, technologies that support high current loads and fast charging capabilities are essential. Lithium batteries excel in these areas due to their high energy density and fast charge/discharge capabilities. Conclusion In summary, the statement promoting flooded lead-acid batteries as superior for off-grid systems misrepresents their performance, cost-effectiveness, and maintenance requirements. The reality is that while flooded batteries may seem cost-effective upfront, their inefficiencies and maintenance needs make them less suitable for modern off-grid solar applications. AGM and lithium batteries, despite their initial costs, provide superior performance, lower maintenance, and longer lifespans, making them more viable in today’s energy landscape. As technology continues to evolve, understanding these distinctions is vital for anyone considering battery options for solar energy storage.
Which is worse, shouting your entire RUclips or promoting batteries in parallel. Follow this episode and you will have hearing loss and a system that ages like an ice cream cone on a picnic bench.
car batteries compared to marine deep cycle, cost three times less, with 30 amp deep cycle you get a 90 amps regular, amazon prices or other reseller, i charge mine to 13.1, and discharge 11.7 early morning.
I'm seeing that forklift batteries usually come in 24, 36, and 48 volts, all made up of two volt cells. They are designed to survive being banged around on solid rubber tires with no suspension. Reconditioned used ones can last for decades in home solar applications. You're a helpful person, so I'm passing back to you what I've learned. Getting the two volt cells out of a steel case can be work. They weigh over 100 lbs each. The lead bars connecting them have to be cut, too.
Thanks for your comment.
Good coverage in a short time.
I use AGM batteries in my small solar system but I'm fortunate to be in an area with a lot of businesses that use AGM batteries in their big UPS systems and for backup for their video surveillance. The last group of AGM (two 100AH and two 110AH, about 15 months old) cost me $305 (versus close to $800 new). My spreadsheet for power usage assumes a maximum of 50% Depth of Discharge and the previous group of used 80AH AGMs lasted almost 9 years (5 years in UPS service, 4 years for me [to below 80% capacity] - but they were only $35 each - not likely to find a deal like that again).
Using AGMs means I don't worry about ventilation or weekly water checks and, if those checks fell to my better half, that might not get checked until we were in the dark. Plus they can be on a shelving unit in the basement with the charge controllers and inverter hung off the side of a shelf for good cooling air flow. Instead of the current 420AH of AGMs, I'd like to have triple that in LiFePO4 - currently about $2500 (Amazon, free delivery in about a week) with BMSs, but they'd likely outlive me and I'd have fridge power for almost a week. I am replacing some hard-to-find AGM UPS batteries with DIY LiFePO4 using cells from batteryhookup.com - beats the $50 the UPS manufacturer wants for the AGM with maybe a 4 year life in UPS service, especially when the parts cost (cells, BMS, holder) was under $20 and I got to learn about a new battery technology.
The now 6-year-old battery that I took out of my truck a year ago when it sounded like the starter was turning a little slow, now sits in the basement for testing inverters and performing jump start duty. A battery impedance meter still shows it at about 90% of its original capacity and I have an Advance Auto battery from 2005 that's in a plastic battery case for when I need portable power - neither of those is deep cycle but they see only intermittent use and they work fine for that.
My solar power spreadsheet does have a page for flooded lead acid batteries with the maximum DOD being 20% (but adjustable, depending on need). If things go sideways, there will likely be lots of abandoned vehicles - useless without fuel - but the parts are still useful (power seat motor driving a solar tracker?) and I have spare charge controllers configured for flooded batteries, just in case.
One formula I found for RC to AH would make an RC of 160 = 94AH, but a new, name brand battery could be 9% higher than that or about 102AH (based on some testing I did). Using half the RC as an approximation of the AH ensures you won't exceed the battery's capacity
I've been there when a spark exploded a lead acid battery. I was fortunate that the battery was in a vehicle and that it blew out a bottom corner and just ate up the cuffs of my jeans and my Keds ;-( That might be one reason I prefer AGMs and the newer lithium technologies ;-)
The inverter is a 2000 watt pure sine wave unit from reliablepower on Ebay (now selling them with a WZRELB label) with an identical unit as a spare. The inverter's output is cleaner (oscilloscope check) than what the local power co-op delivers. The charge controllers are EPEver 3210A 30 amp MPPT units and all of it has been in place for 4 years. The maximum load on the inverter is about 1300 watts when fridge, freezer, furnace blower and a few LED lights are all on. The average load is much less as it's rare for everything to be on at the same time. If that became a problem, I have digital timers rated at 15 amps so the fridge and freezer could each be on for 2 hours at a time but in a staggered cycle.
The inverter connects to a 4 circuit transfer switch via a 12/3 extension cord - the same cord is used when the inverter generator is in use (about two weeks of treated fuel for keeping the battery bank charged when power is off and there is no sun). Longest time on the backup syetem so far was 12 hours when the county had 7-12" of snow in an area that rarely sees more than 3". Sure is nice to walk down the stairs and flip a couple of switches to have power instead of shoveling 7" of snow in the dark at 30F to get a generator out of the shed and trying to start that gen at that temperature...
Thank you for your comment. It was very informative.
This is the exact group 27 battery that I use in all my solar setups and in my RV.
O'Reilly Auto Parts is the best place that I found to get them.
I received my from advanced auto parts. Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep O'Reilly's was a lot cheaper I got mine for 85 a piece compared to over 200
@@heroesandzeros7802 it is always nice to get a good price. Thanks for your comment.
Pop the lids off and use a small pocket mirror to save your back from having to lift those heavy batteries. Use the mirror to look inside the battery to check the levels of course.
Thanks for your comment.
Hey shoe string,what charge controller & inverter do u have hooked up to your batteries for emergency power?
I have a Morningstar TS45 charge controller and an Aims 8000 watt inverter.
Thanks for your comment.
Your video has been very helpful to me as I prepare to put together batteries for my grid down preparation efforts. I will now share with you what I've since learned. Please, search RUclips for information on using forklift batteries for your solar. I predict that you may be glad you did. 🙂
Thanks for your comment.
Great video what inverter do you use and. What is the safe watts I can draw of it
I used a AMIS 5000 watt modified sign wave inverter. I pulled about 3500 to 4000 watts if the system. Thanks for your comment.
I just bought two Group 29DC deep cycle marine batteries (flooded lead acid). I guess battery manufacturers are now putting the amp hours on the battery label instead of "reserve capacity" because both of my new batteries state 122 Amp Hours right on the top label where reserve capacity used to be.
That would be something new. Thanks for letting us know. Thanks for your comment.
Many manufacturers state the amp hour capacity - it's more so for marketing -
Very few understand battery technology today compared to the past - if a battery states it 100 amps in reality only 50% of it is usable power with lead acid battery's that have been fully charged over 24 hours -
If person sees 100 amps that looks good but most devices drop out at 10.5 volts - so on a fresh long charge the battery will delver 50 amps - if the battery is cycled daily as on a sail boat - they don't have the fuel to charge 12 to 16 hrs a day - so they fast charge 1 hr and 15 minutes a day or till the battery gasses - at 85% state of charge that's concidered full charged - it might take up to 24 hour to get the last 15% back into a battery -
@@thesolarjunkie that's good what you have as long as you still have good sun your ok -
Far about 35 yrs I had 106 golf cart batteries - I was hybrid -
My stand by generator burned 50 gallons of propane a day -
After hurricanes and ice storms they don't deliver propane for w while -
I would just have my stand by generator start an d run 3 to 4 hrs a day and replace the energy used out the battery's each day - instead of burning a 1000 gallons of propane in 3 weeks I would only burn around 150 gallons of propane in 3 week going hybrid -
Today I just use a inverter generator so I gave the battery's to a friend - I just have a few battery's like you have now & just run a 5000 BTU AC - after storms like Ida
12v flooded battery and what may the settings be for, bulk, absorption and float...
Yeah and equalization.
Do you know?
(Its a 12v tudor flooded battery with a victron 100/20)
AMEN !🤗 PREACH ON KNOWLEDGE SHOESTRING . THE TRUTH SHALL KEEP YOU BEST PREPARED IN A SAFE OFF GRID OPERATION WITH PROPER MAINTENANCE AND CARE FOR YOUR LEAD ACIDS DEPENDENCY OVER LIPOFE4 CELLS ON THIS GREAT VIDEO . 👍
Thanks for your comment.
Are there any issues to keeping solar panel and charge controller connected to battery continuously, 24/7?
J. Lynn Engle, thanks for the question.
There is absolutely no problem with leaving batteries and charge controller hooked to solar panels 24/7. My batteries do, and have been doing great for years.
As long as your using power off the battery's it should be ok - if your not using power off the battery's it's better to just put them on a float or maintenance charger from the grid when there not needed -
The daily cycling of solar panels when battery's are not discharged will sulfate them -
If they do sulfate you can look on you tube for desulfating battery's with a welding machine - amazon has $60 inverter welders that are fantastic for desulfating lead acid flooded battery's -
That's method has been used for over 140 yrs with lead acid battery s -
If there not on a charge maintenance charge you can top them off ever two weeks when it's warm - all that depends on the ambient temperature im using 80" f -
High end. MPPT controllers have settings that will just monitor the battery's state of charge and give it a refresher charge when needed 😊
Hello is it ok to discharge them to 10.5v ? also what percent discharge (DOD) is achieved from the 12v cutoff voltage ??
Dicharging to 10.5v will harm the battery. I would not go below 12.1 volts thanks for your comment
@@shoestringprep Many thanks, wondering at 12.1v could we achieve only 10% of the rated capacity ?
@@hasger1941 12V is 50% of the battery, and is the recommended level for FLA (Liquid Electrolyte) batteries.
Hi, cool system. I have 2 big 200 ah deep cycle wet batteries in Parallel. So i‘m thinking about adding some 80 ah marine batteries parallel to the big ones. That shouldnt be a problem? Thanks a lot.
Are the 80 ah batteries the same kind of batteries as the 200 ah batteries? Both deep cycle?
But presuming you have these attributes lined up, the answer to you question is that you may hook them together and it will work. It will not be as efficient as if they were all 200 ah or all 80 ah batteries.
Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep thanks! I just hooked them up! It works. The bigger batteries just deliver more current. That‘s the advantage of an 12 volt system. I could theoretically hook as much batteries to the system as i want. As long as the type is the same. Thanks
@@batterynerd8779 great! Thanks for letting me know.
@@batterynerd8779 The type, and as long as the VOLTAGES are already the same ( meaning closely the same,close to .02 or .03 volts diff); if not, the higher volts ones will discharge into the lower volts ones ( that is what volts do...) and tend to even things out; unless one of the batteries already has a bad cell, a lower voltage that is,and then it will keep on eating volts (milliamps!) from the good battery; i have one of those tiny red display digital voltmeters ( 4 of them..) atop each one of my 4 batteries,for just a glance; there are many other tests you can do when using multiple batteries;
now a question : 4 batteries (or 6,or 8...) , 12v each, for a 24v system: is it better to parallel 2 series of 2 ,or to series 2 parallels of 2 ?
@@josepeixoto3384 it actually doesn’t matter too much. It depends on your setup. It‘s just important that you firet put all your batteries in parallel (12v,6v…) and charge them to 14.4 and 2 hours at 15 volts. They will be perfectly balanced. In series, all batteries need to be the same battery capacity and voltage. Then you can arrange them how you want to. It doesnt matter 2 p 2s or 2s 2p. Just how much cable you want to use. The more cable, the more resistance-> power loss
Appreciate this video ALOT... A WHOLE LOT!!!
Thanks for your kind words and your comment.
shouldn't they also be kept in a relatively warm location? or is that only for the non deep cycle high cold cranking amp batteries (car batteries)?
Flooded lead acid batteries don't really mind the cool weather. Thanks for your comment.
Dear sir,
Thanks for the great video. Can I connect the new battery in series with the old one?
It is not ideal. But yes you can.
Thank you for your comment.
Love the content, Thanks for the tips. I have a tip for you as well. Please get a gimble. The video shaking is hard to watch the video. 100$ will get you one that keeps everything smooth no jittering. Get one that handles the weight of your phone.
Thanks for the tip and the comment.
Great video full of useful information. Just a heads up your microphone sounds good and picks up your voice pretty well, so you probably dont need yell in order to get your point across. Anyways, Thanks again for taking the time to put this video online. There isnt enough info on Lead acid based backup power sytems.
Thanks for your comment and kind words.
You said to not let the voltage go below 12.1vdc, but wired in parallel how to you know each batteries voltage to keep them above 12.1? Also having 4 batteries wired in parallel would you wire the charge source (solar) in the middle of at an end? Thanks
I keep my entire battery Bank from going under 12.1 volts. I read the entire battery Bank as if it was one battery. I connect the wires to the charge controller to one anchor battery and it works out just fine for me. Thanks for your comment.
You would need to put one lead on a end battery if you have four battery's Pharrell together - you would put one lead say the positive on #1 battery them the negative on the #4 battery -
If you put both the charge leads on #1 battery - the number one battery will take all the charge - you also hook up your load just as you hook up your charging leads -
If your load and charge leads are hooked to #1 battery it will only draw current and charge #1 battery - #2 through #4 battery's will sulfate on you in a short time - so to prevent that from happening you have to do what I had stated -
There is a lot to learn about any battery technology - you can look at my other comments & learn more -
@@able880 Thank you very much
In parallel all the positives are connected to each and all the negatives are connected to each other and it won't matter where you connect a charger.
It does matter ware you terminate the load and the charger to a battery bank - I'm a 4th generation hybrid power generation electrician ; my grand father started into that field in the late 1800s - I spent my yrs working in the offshore gas & oil industry - we generated all the power we used on offshore platforms - I did that for decades -
Many platforms are capable of going into hurricane mode when there is just to much moisture in the air for generators to run during hurricanes -
In that case huge battrey's operate a platform - I'm very familiar with all types of battery technology -
Even lead acid battrey's can be cycled many decades if you understand the applied technology -
For some one to say it's ok to hook up a charger or load to the first battery in a group of batteries lacks knowledge -
I spent decades maintaining large hybrid UPS systems - my comment on the proper way to hook up to battery has been the industry standard for 160 yrs for a good reason -
True Deep Cycle batteries will provide double or triple the Amp Hours that you're getting from the Marine Batteries you featured in the video.
Thanks for your comment.
I have truck batteries will they work
Truck batteries May last for a short time but a short time only. You should find and use some deep cycle batteries. Thanks for your comment.
Shoestring are you still using your LiFePO4 Flypower batteries. Are they any good?
Yes, they are still working great. Thanks for your comment.
UPDATE : I have 18 batteries now...I may get two more. I have two more 100 watts solar panels coming Friday, so I thought I would get a couple more for them to charge. 1200 watts of solar charging 1000 amp hours of battery. These ones I use have 210 RC , they are a 29 DP-DL. It is 11 PM, 25.6 volts left. I think 20 will be enough. I'm trying to find some #2 welding lead wire locally tomorrow. I'm going to call it " The Twenty Mule Team " and hope it lasts twenty years. That's my plan for this year for my stuff. I have off grid power already but it won't hurt to improve it. I want to get my system in A number one shape this summer. At least no one should say I made a half way attempt at it. My power will be dependable and enough when I am done tinkering. Suppose I took two years' electric bill to build the whole thing ? And then I have 10 years of free power after that...that sounds okay to me. Well, it's like being in the lake above your knees, might as well jump on in there. LOL ...I feel for those who don't get something put together, whatever it is, big or small, as long as it is dependable. I want my stuff to be rock solid good to go. I'm hoping that by having a big bank the batteries will last a long time. Not much danger of boiling 20 of them all at once...they charge kind of slow when they all get together. Yeah since I will be done buying batteries this month, I will save for the pricey inverter. This is my first solar system. It is going to be nice when I get it all done, I think. Seems like everyone builds theirs a little differently. My 105 amp hour batteries cost me around $100 apiece, but they seem good enough to me for that price. The plates are just a little taller and wider in the ones I get. And they hold more acid , so less frequent checks. I've tried to cover my bases, that way. Oh, if your battery level is hard to see, a dental mirror from dollartree can be very useful...you might want to wrap it with tape before use though, except the end.
Thanks for the update. It sounds like you are getting the type of system you want.
Thank you for comment.
Most of what is stated about CMEs and EMPs on the domestic level is mis information -
If a bolt of lightning strikes a car it can destroy some electronics - but cell phone battery's and car battery s are never damaged - if a bolt of lightning strikes right next to a car at times a car might shut down but starts back up and is fine -
There many times lightning strikes. Next to solar panels and there fine even after several strikes - the battery's are ok - my house transformer was once struck 2 consecutive times -
It burnt out a few phone chargers and a clock - but the phones were ok -
The EMP of lightning is concentrated and a billion times stronger than a CME or EMP - they effect power lines the lines are gigantic antennas - the magnetic pulse creates a electromagnetic pulse that creates an induction strong enough to create counter EMF -
It becomes surges for transmission transformers that generate extreamly high voltage and arc out the transformers and generators - as for the battery's they can absorb much of that just fine - in the oilfields offshore - all communications are supported by battery's of some sort - the battery's absorb the energy of direct lightning strike of towers. -
They do that with high cell towers also -
SIR, YES SIR!
I’ve been watching many different videos about batteries…..and after all is said and done, I’m thinking the Lead Acid Deep Cycle maybe my best option.
I’m building a rather unusual set up, and durability is key.
I’m setting up a service truck for a long term vehicle build, so it will be able to do many tasks.
So it’s a 1992 GMC, I’m going to remove the bed, and build a custom utility bed with my welder/generator and a separate dedicated generator connected to an Automatic Generator Start switch a charge controller and a couple of inverters, as well as a DC to DC charger and at least one, possibly two 250 watt solar panels up top.
A large dedicated metal toolbox up on top of the roof rack will hold the “house batteries” with one solar panel on it, the toolbox will be insulated and fire resistant, with cooling fans and a fire extinguishing system (just in case).
I was going to get two large 250AH batteries, but it seems several car size RV batteries should work as well.
The duties of the battery bank, will be to power one inverter for general 110 use in the cab, and a second inverter to power climate control system for the cab and battery box, the generator (insulated for sound) will automatically start early on cold mornings to heat up the cab, and warm the antifreeze with a block heater. Thermostats will determine when heating or cooling is needed.
Sounds like a plan. Let us know how it works out. Thanks for your comment.
I have been using FLA Batts and they last 6 to 7 years. Don't overcharge or run them down past 12.2 ---If they go down past 12 Volts and stay as little as I day they will sulphate and Die.
Thanks for your comment
Yeap.12.2 is the number;
they don't always die; if one forgets the lights on, in the car, until the battery reads near zero, no kind of signs of life, upon recharging (within ONE day,tops!!) it always recovers; been around cars for 40 years and this has happenned a few times to me and others; but if the battery was already old and barely making it,about to die,THEN it says the heck with it,and dies... rip (edit: recycle it please).
Thank you for this video.
I built a lead acid set up in my RV.
But the batteries are inside and aren’t ventilated ( yet) ( a huge retrofit would be needed).Is this a serious issue? Meaning, do they off gas when running or being charged only, or all the time?
Is opening the door regularly going to be enough?
I don’t smell anything ( gases)- is that an indication that it’s minimal, or are the gases odorless??
Thx for you answers. And I’m a new subscriber to your channel!
Welcome new subscriber! The batteries produce the most gas when they are charging. So during charging try to have a window or a door open. You cannot smell these gases. You should be aware they exist though. Thanks for your comment.
There are devices that detect when battery's are being charged and run a small axil ventilating fan on high after charging is terminated the fan runs on low - hydrogen is highly flammable it's what makes gasoline and vapor gases so flammable -
On the old diesel submarines there were hoses connected to battery caps that drew air that pulled the hydrogen off the battery's and it went through a catalyst to burn off the hydrogen even when they were not being charged -
In an enclosed area there should be a fan to ventilate hydrogen out side -
well at my location the cheapest lead acid deep cycle batteries , when i calculate the usable A in each type lead acid is 3-3,5 times more expensive the cheapest is the eve 280 ah lipo4 cells not the asembled ones they are however still cheaper then lead acid ,, i have been running a 8s 280ah 24v as my energy storage for about a year now its enough for 3- 4 days of power i am however gonna make a identical 24v more , for more storage i have been looking for used forklift batteries as i figured some of the smaller handtrucks were going to litium however no luck
I don't know about forklift battries. Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep thanks for your answer , if you are located in the states i can recommend looking into them they can be purchased cheaply compared to the durabillitythey are comprised by 2V cells but are 70cm high 25cm wide and they have huge plates and can take a real beating the ultimate deep cycle battery many buy 36 volt packs and sort the worst cells off and build either 2 12v or 1 24v battery
thank you dear
Thanks for your comment
what voltage would a 35ah battery after drawing 35 amps for one hour?
If you used the entire 35 ah in one hour the voltage of the battery would be to low to use. Thanks for your comment.
Is it true that flooded lead acíd batteries can survive a huge CME as opposed to lithium ion batteries in a freak solar flare attack
I don't know. Thanks for your comment.
I have 14 of those from Autozone,...I'm thinking about getting two more...lol...they are running a 24 volts 2000 watts Aims inverter / charger ...I have 1000 watts of panels, and a 40 amp Epever charge controller, 4215 BN...I didn't use much power so the battery bank was at 24.4 this morning , sometimes it drops a little lower but not much...I got too many batteries and had to get more solar panels a month ago so I don't want to get too many more...maybe max out at 18 of them...lol...the first ten were 90 amp hours but the last 4 are 105, 180 and 210 reserve minutes, and if I get two more they will be the bigger ones...that would give me 765 amp hours @ 24 volts...I'm thinkin that's enough for me...I started this little solar journey about a year ago...I haven't used the grid for four months...I used to use the gasoline genereator some but now I've even stopped doing that...I used a # 2 welding lead on the battery wiring and there's four ends attached to the inverter...nothing has ever gotten warm on any of that...one thing I did on my system is, I put a #6 wire to all the 12 volts connections, like an 8 legged spider with a big brass Kearney in the middle...that's my BMS...so that when I hook up my 410 watt inverter to run small stuff, it is running off either the top set or bottom set of 7 ( for now) batteries, that way it doesn't run one battery down...This is one of the coolest things I've ever done...I guess it's a good thing I bought my inverter when I did...it has went up $116 since I got mine in December...I barely could afford it as it was...thanks for the great video...everyone said don't use those kind, but I've been around cars and batteries since I was a kid...and I know it takes a lot longer to charge a marine battery so I knew they would be okay...it just takes a lot of them to throw out a bunch of amps but they recover nicely...I'll probably get two more and stop at 16...I think I have about enough...yay...those things cost...lol Buying the last two will be like getting a get out of jail free card...
It's great you could build a system that works for you. Everyone's system will be a little different to meet their needs.
Upload a photo of your system if you get a chance. We would all love to see it.
Thanks for your comment.
Can't you get a tiny mirror and a flashlight to check your fluid level without having to pull them off the shelf?
Yes you sure could
Thanks for the comment.
IFLA. Industrial flooded lead acid. Just search The Gilley Show. You may change what batteries you use. 🙂
Thanks for your comment
IVE USED 2 CAR BATTERIES ON MY SMALL SYSTEM TO RUN LIGHT AND SYSTEM, FOR 2 YEARS NOW, I JUST MADE SURE CONTROLLER WAS SET TO 11 JUST OVER 59% OF BATTERY CAPACITY I FOUND I COULD GET 6 HOURS OF TV POWER AT LEAST OFF THE 2 BATTERIES,
I'm pleased your system is working for you. Thanks for your comment.
I have a 48 volt 840 amp system off grid, 12 years. I just got done running a 3 1/2 day test on my essential load panels through my Sunny Island.
Let me hit you up with a bit of grammar:
Nothing is ever "four times (4X) less expensive."
That is "getting bigger" to "get smaller."
What you meant to say is that: "FLA IS 1/4TH THE COST OF LFP ... or ... 25% AS EXPENSIVE."
Guess I'm a dickhead.
Thanks for your comment
If you're going to go with lead acid, get some golf cart batteries with a high amount of amp hours. Those are better for off grid and those useless marine batteries.
Thanks for your comment
@RubenObed El Mejor send us a picture of your system. Thanks for your comment.
@RubenObed El Mejor upload it here on RUclips so everyone can see it please.
Thanks for subscribing.
@RubenObed El Mejor thanks
I'd prefer to use Lithium phosphate, they're safe, higher capacity, they can be safely discharged to near empty, they have longer cycle life, and nowadays you can get them for the same price as AGM. They also produce no gasses and are very low maininence.
Thanks for your comment.
use a scrap piece of a mirror and a light to check inside the lower batteries, no need to pull it out
Good tip. Thanks for comment.
SLA batteries are a huge pain in the neck. Their only redeeming quality is lower INITIAL cost. The truth of the matter is that Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) is not significantly better than building your own LiFePO4 battery system. Add in the lower weight and size of lithium, the relatively constant voltage, and the dramatically reduced maintenance requirements, and you quickly realize why most of the systems being built today, at least in the US, are ditching the SLA batteries and going with either lithium or at least AGM. There are several DIY lithium batteries on the market today that make it easy and relatively affordable, over the long term, to get all of the benefits of a far superior battery chemistry. No need to stick with 20th century solutions, if you don't want to.
AGM batteries are a simple, inexpensive solution to help people on tight budgets with their energy storage needs. They work best in temporary off-grid situations and they do very well for that purpose. We appreciate your input.
Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep - LiFePO4 batteries are a simple, cost-effective solution to help people who understand value versus cost with their energy storage needs. They work better than AGM batteries because they do not off-gas and are safer to use indoors. Lowest cost is almost never the best solution.
@@jasonbroom7147 thanks for your comment
@@jasonbroom7147 i am pretty sure most people would opt to have a 3M USD house that is totally up to passive house standards with the latest up-to-date systems keeping it totally independent. It will most probably pay off. You "just" have to find the 3M USD and you are all set. A proper size of LiFePo4 battery bank costs more than three months of total income for a family where I live and we are not considered poor. Explaining why people should invest big money that they don't have demonstrates no understanding of the word "shoestring".
@@koborkutya7338 - If you don't understand what a false economey is, there's little chance I'm going to be able to explain it to you. Nobody should invest big money in anything, if they don't have it to invest, but buying SLA batteries versus LFP isn't an investment...it's just a bad, short-term money decision. Making decisions like that is how you STAY broke.
he statement regarding flooded lead-acid batteries in off-grid solar systems contains several misleading elements. Let's break down the factual inaccuracies and clarify why this view might be harmful, especially when considering current technology and the evolving landscape of energy storage.
Misleading Claims and Clarifications
Current Draw and Performance:
Flooded Lead-Acid Batteries: These batteries can indeed provide high current, but their efficiency diminishes as the current draw increases. Flooded batteries have higher internal resistance, which leads to voltage drop under heavy load, reducing their effectiveness.
AGM (Absorbent Glass Mat) Batteries: AGM batteries can handle higher current loads better than flooded cells. They have lower internal resistance and can deliver higher discharge rates without significant voltage drop. This means that in scenarios where high current is required, such as during heavy solar output or for powering high-demand appliances, AGMs outperform flooded batteries.
Cost Considerations:
Initial Costs: While flooded lead-acid batteries are often less expensive upfront compared to lithium-ion and AGM batteries, the total cost of ownership (TCO) over time is crucial. Flooded batteries require regular maintenance (checking water levels, equalizing charges) and have shorter lifespans (typically 3-5 years under optimal conditions). In contrast, AGM batteries, while slightly more expensive initially, offer maintenance-free operation and longer lifespans (up to 7-10 years or more).
Lithium-Ion Batteries: In 2021, lithium batteries were relatively expensive but offered significant advantages in efficiency, depth of discharge (DoD), and lifespan (often exceeding 10 years). As prices have decreased since 2021, lithium batteries have become a more attractive option for off-grid systems due to their higher performance and lower long-term costs.
Maintenance Requirements:
Flooded lead-acid batteries require significant maintenance, including periodic watering and equalization charges to prevent sulfation, which can diminish capacity and shorten lifespan. This maintenance not only adds cost but also requires time and knowledge to perform correctly.
AGM and lithium batteries are generally maintenance-free, leading to lower operational costs and less hassle for users.
Technological Advancements:
The shift away from flooded lead-acid batteries in off-grid solar systems is largely due to advancements in battery technology, specifically lithium-ion and AGM batteries, which provide better performance, higher efficiency, and more reliable energy storage capabilities.
As energy needs grow, especially with the increasing integration of solar power and electric vehicles, technologies that support high current loads and fast charging capabilities are essential. Lithium batteries excel in these areas due to their high energy density and fast charge/discharge capabilities.
Conclusion
In summary, the statement promoting flooded lead-acid batteries as superior for off-grid systems misrepresents their performance, cost-effectiveness, and maintenance requirements. The reality is that while flooded batteries may seem cost-effective upfront, their inefficiencies and maintenance needs make them less suitable for modern off-grid solar applications. AGM and lithium batteries, despite their initial costs, provide superior performance, lower maintenance, and longer lifespans, making them more viable in today’s energy landscape. As technology continues to evolve, understanding these distinctions is vital for anyone considering battery options for solar energy storage.
Thanks for your comment.
I like the fact that the materials for my agm batteries were not mined out of the ground by 10 year old child labourers in Africa and slave labour.
Thanks for your comment.
Your annoying
Which is worse, shouting your entire RUclips or promoting batteries in parallel. Follow this episode and you will have hearing loss and a system that ages like an ice cream cone on a picnic bench.
Thanks for your comment
do you use an inverter or an ups?? , i used for years an ups, now i use a decent inverter no load 0,6A with a nice screen,
I use an inverter. Thanks for your comment.
car batteries compared to marine deep cycle, cost three times less, with 30 amp deep cycle you get a 90 amps regular, amazon prices or other reseller, i charge mine to 13.1, and discharge 11.7 early morning.
Do used golf cart batteries (8v batteries) suffice for solar set up?
Yes you can use golf cart batteries just be careful how you charge them. Thanks for your comment.
@@shoestringprep thank you!