Tool List- www.amazon.com/shop/acservicetech Support- www.patreon.com/acservicetech For those that are looking for the tools used in the videos: (Linked Below) Here is a link to the Yellow Jacket Pinch Off Tool- amzn.to/2uqV24o Here is the link to a 5 pack of Uniweld Hammer Swages- amzn.to/2uqWHqs Here is a link for RectorSeal Bubble Gas Leak Detector amzn.to/2ckWACn Here is a link to the Pasco Flare Block- amzn.to/2uoLdoS Here is a link to the Air Acetylene Torch setup- amzn.to/2aQalsb Here is a link to the 15% Silver Brazing Rods- amzn.to/2gVLyLc Here is a link the Nitrogen Regulator amzn.to/2bXdR5f Other tool links can be found in the video description section. ACSERVICETECH is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Been a tech for 33 years now and have to say you are one of the best out there making videos.we really need this in our trade considering what i have seen come out of our trade schools.keep up the good work.
As a mechanic for over 40 years, and a shop owner since 1991, I must say that the trade schools are good at sucking up student loan money, and not one "graduate" that i have met had much to show for 2 years of vocational training except $45,000 in student loan debt.
I'm a licensed contractor and I've never used a pinch off tool. I suppose you can charge more to recover the refrigerant and put new refrigerant back in. This is probably why I was never taught this method. If it don't make money it don't make sense. Now that I know this method, I can save customers money and save me a grip of time. Thank you kindly.
This is a great video. I'm just beginning to learn about HVAC service and I had yet to see a clear demonstration of how to close off then reopen a process tube in order to install a service port. The EPA 608 study guides tell you to remove the piercing valve when you're done using it "because they tend to leak over time", but give no indication whatsoever of how to do this without letting the refrigerant out.
Been using one for a few years now, it's great on small appliances, not sure why nobody did a review on one, now more techs can benefit from this. Great channel keep it up!
Thanks for this video. I'm a DIY home owner and I service my cars and home A/C units that come with ports. Now I should be able to add ports to the (cheap china) dehumidifiers that seem to be accumulating in my basement, and see if I can get one or more working again.
Nice that you recommend practicing before doing it for real. 75% or more of everything I've ever seen on your videos could be practised by new techs before trying them in the field. And for new techs, both boys and girls, the pre practice extends further than they'll realize for months to come. Best wishes to you.
A simple saddle solder valve is all you need. And I'm not talking about the bolt on kind either. I used them for years as a Sears refrigeration tech. It's made out of copper that is soldered on to the copper line while refrigerant is still in it then a cap is screwed on that taps a hole in the line that has a srader valve in it. That's all Sears uses. It only takes a couple minutes to have it installed completely. They are used on high and low sides. I never had one leak and we used a lot of them.
Edward HVACR CT What's the reason the service valves are not left on unit? The idea of propane systems sound great based on performance and GWP but sure scares the hell out of me thinking of firing up a torch on one. Do those systems blowup on a compressor burnout or does the lack of oxygen prevent that?
thanks for sharing excellent tutorial video ,have one pinch off tool like that never used it, now I m gonna apply that knowledge confidently Thanks again keep those Video coming😊👍👍👍
Just wanted to say, I've been watching you for years, I have your book, Your cheat cards, And I have all the videos in my favorites that I sometimes need, we've chatted before, here in Daytona, all I due package units, So all the stuff I save has been very helpful... Thank you my brother, you keep on teaching, You great at it....👍👍👍 Happy Easter...
@@acservicetechchannel Just one request, I'm kinda an odd duck here in Daytona.. I work on nothing but package units, a couple of splits here and there, but 95% of my work is on Tempstar, Rheem, And unfortunately noredyne... It would be real nice to see a few package unit trouble shooting videos...just saying... It would be nice... Anyway, once again Happy Easter....And God Bless... A C Bob Daytona...
That was very interesting and well done. My only concern would be worrying about the pinch-off tool weakening the tubing. Wouldn't this run the wrisk of damaging the tubeing at the point the tool was used on?
great foresight removing the lens covers to eliminate glare. It also would have been nice to show a processing tube tool being used to pull a vacuum and charge, then pinched off and brazed back to the sealed state. Some feel that striders a a constant leak course / weak point. I remember many years ago, when they first started the debate / proposals for 410a, The argument was to eliminate all schraeders and go to service valves and TEV's. That didn't happen though. Too many special interests.
Ha ha, yeah it is interesting what you would like the industry to move to and where we are at. Many things at play. Thanks for letting me know what you would like to see and thanks for the comment HVAC01453!
Good vid. I have just ordered a pinch off tool. I have up until now just used the bpv 31 bullet piercing valves , recovered and installed weldin access valves. Im gonna give a shot at doing the pinch off thing. You know if u use oxy acet rig u woukd of been in & out in a few seconds on that joint. But , still a good vid. Thanks for making it.
All the old timers nvr used nitro when brazing. And all those ac units ran longer then the new shit thats out with the new techniques in brazing applied 😂
acservicetech I think you might be right lol! Either way, thanks. It's a great video. You help me out a lot. I don't have to many folks to ask at the place I work lol.
Great info, Craig! Can I use the pinch-off tool to “fix” a kink in a copper line and re-round it enough for the refrigerant flow to work flawlessly? Will it work? Thanks for your helpful videos and the ton of info you provide.
Can I add one of these to my RV? I have two crappy dometic ac units that have leaked. I have a mini split installed so I'm good for now but I want to get them serviced and my friend does ac, one of the ac units have a piercing valve but it has leaked I believe, I know I should get both units replaced but I feel like the service port should be a good fix and hopefully be a permanent fix rather then a piercing valve
I'm a 15 year veteran of the field and have my masters refrigeration license--which definitely does NOT mean I know everything! Far from it. But we are beginning to see quite a few of the R-290 (refrigerant grade propane) reach-in freezers and coolers out there. These do require some facility with the pinch-off tool, which is required after the system is evacuated and charged in order to seal the punctures made with the required "bullet" access valves. On my last trip, I was not able to get 100% shutoff no matter WHAT I did--which included making multiple pinch-offs to break pressure down the access tube and cranking the tool as far closed as I could with vise grips--to the point where I was in serious danger of actually cutting the tube and blowing the charge (which I have done). Less than 100% shutoff causes the system propane to repressurize that end of the access tube and blows holes in the brazing solder. I finally had to remove the cores in 1/4" stem valves, pinch off as hard as I dared, braze in the stem valves with the propane seeping by the pinch-off tool venting out the end of the stem, then inserting the core and capping the new access. This worked, but I can't figure out why I can't get a 100% shutoff? Is there a different style and/or better tool besides the one shown in this video?
That is a really rough one! I have used this pinch off tool with r410a with no problems leaking but I know what you mean. You can't tighten it too much or it will cut through and blow the charge. That tubing could have had some flakes on the inside which didn't allow the inside of the tube to seal when it was compressed or something!
@@acservicetechchannel Your reply is very much appreciated. I am glad I am not the only one! And I have "cut through" in an effort to completely shut off leak by at the "pinch" and blown the charge and what could be worse on a Friday afternoon at 5:30 when you've told the wife you're taking her out to dinner. I went looking on line, and there is a different style of "pinch off" that will do 1/4" or 3/8" and the "pinch" looks more like a round ball tip you screw down on the copper into a kind of a cup shaped recess. I have it coming and will see if it works any more reliably. The advantage would be that you aren't cranking down a sharp edge like the traditional tube, which (see above! lol) is just to easy to cut right through soft copper. This looks like I can crank to my heart's content without severing the line. Interesting note: After identifying the manufacturer and part number, EVERY source I could find--including the factory!--was backordered two or three weeks--making me wonder if a whole LOT of commercial refrigeration techs were running into the same problem with these R-290 units and their special handling precautions all at once?
That's just cool. It reminds me of the AC's on my RV's and I always wondered about that. Would RV AC's be a good place to start? Are they a good overall training ground for all the fundamental skills? And excuses to buy tools?
Well, they don't have service ports so they would have to be brazed on. They only have line voltage controls typically unless it is a rv ac voltage system but they do have a capacitor and start capacitor usually. There are always excuses to buy tools, ha ha, thanks!
acservicetech Well good, your brazing was it that got me thinking. Well said on the tools! Love to see something on installation and control of electronic dampers by various thermostats. Thanks for everything!
Are the bolt-on service ports a permanent addition to small systems? Or just to recover the charge? And isn't the risk of 'black death flakes' clogging the cap tube very REAL without N2? Thanks.
What about the acid flux you have to use when silver soldering? You vacuum and install filter line dryers to prevent acid forming but silver solder with acid flux? Just curious, unless you have an acid free flux that works. But wouldn't you still get some sort of contamination from whatever type of flux as opposed to brazing? Also, couldn't you rig up a micro copper tube to your nitrogen tank and stick it down the 1/4 o.d. tube your brazing to feed nitrogen inside? Just a thought, if I was in A/C instead of plumbing I might make something like that. I enjoy your video's, you know your stuff and you teach well. P.S., after brazing you could also run a bottle brush down the tube to loosen the black oxidation and then blow it out with nitrogen. That might not get 100 % but probably an improvement and since it is a dead end access whatever is left should not cause a problem. Just trying to think outside the box.
Yes, sorry for the confusion. But you did say soldering was an option if it wasn't R410, so I was referring to what you said, not what you were doing in this particular video. Please clarify or expound further about using an acid flux or why you prefer brazing. Thanks AC!
I prefer brazing because that is what the manufactures now do on all their joints. Sometimes you need to silver solder because the part you need to fix is too close to an existing silver solder joint and you don't want to heat this up too much. Acid flux is less of a problem on r-22 with mineral oil than r410a with poe but silver soldering is and has been done succesfully for years on both r-22 and r-410a. I prefer to brae because no acid and this is what manufacturers are doing, thanks!
Obviously no way to "flow" nitrogen, but any advantage to filling the tube with a shot of nitrogen as you fit the access tube? Or am I just going way overboard?
Ha ha, I was thinking the same thing but no, the tube is too short to temporarily put nitrogen in and have the valve cap without a rubber o ring slightly cracked open. I did not think it would be worth it in case I accidentally held pressure which could create a pin hole leak. Ha you are not alone! Thanks David!
Awesome video, I'm glad you did a video on a small package unit. I work a lot with PTAC units at my work. Question, I've had electrical wires rub holes in the capillary tube from the vibration of the compressor. Is it possible to repair a hole in a small capillary tube? Thanks! If you can do more videos on small package units it would be much appreciated.
Yes you can fix them. You need to continue to cut through it all the way and braze another larger cap tube on as if it were a coupling and get in and get out fast with the braze so the braze rod is not sucked into the hole clogging it, thanks Danny!
Danny; We get these randomly on commercial refrigeration units--either the capillary feed tubes used commonly in reach-ins, or the capillary tubes associated with high and/or low pressure cutout switches. This AC Service Tech is exactly right. The trick is to cut all the way through . . . . I use the side (corner) of a standard file to saw through at the hole until I'm about 50% through the capillary then carefully bend it back and forth at the cut until it separates. If you try to file a cut all the way through the capillary, you risk squashing one side or the other of the cut partially or completely shut and you have to cut back more on either side. This tech is warning about the brazing technique because of the danger of "sucking" the solder into the cap. Again, that's exactly right. But one way to minimize that risk is to "sleeve" the two capillary ends like a coupling with a 1/4" tube that's as long as you want. Picture cutting and sleeving with a 2" long 1/4" tube over the capillary, basically butt the two capillary ends inside the 1/4" somewhere around the middle of the ~2" sleeve and simply braze each end of the ~2" long sleeve to the respective ends of the capillary. You ALSO have to be careful not to blow a hole in the really thin capillary copper when you make that joint. I heat the 1/4" to cherry red, and usually enough heat is conducted to the capillary at the end to pull the liquid solder on and around the cap with a less than one second pass with the torch and voila. While a long 1/4" sleeve on a capillary tube isn't the most beautiful piece of refrigerant work we ever do, it's very cost effective, works a long time, and the customer rarely if ever sees it. One last thing to "sweat." If you have a capillary that is really vibrating (as with some of the long pressure switch sensing lines), the extra mass of the 1/4" tubing sleeve--especially if you use a long one, can result in the tube really stress the cap tube at either or both ends of the sleeve. Think of it like a "pendulum" effect. That can work harden the capillary copper until it gets brittle and breaks at your brazed joint. If I'm looking at any significant vibration that is visibly moving the capillary while the compressor is running, I'll strap that section of the capillary to the insultated suction line or some other softer piece in the unit with tye wraps or duct tape to keep it from moving at all and potentially breaking at that joint.
I was going to suggest the braze saddle valve as well but was already mentioned. I noticed you mention not using silver solder on 410a. I've seen quite a bit of talk and literature on it's success and rated strengths so not really sure why one wouldn't consider it with it's liquidus @ 540f. The extra prep is the only down side I know of. Does that pinch off tool work well on 410a pressures? I noticed a commenter below stated he uses 2 pinch-off tools.
Yes a single pinch off tool can be used. I had people asking to see how the pinch off tool works. If I have the choice, Id rather use braze with no flux in the line, it is definitely a very debatable thing staybrite #8 or silphos 15 but I like to keep with what the manufacturers are doing. They braze their copper coils on R410a so I do the same. We are also now using aluminum with a very low melting point on those joints so that's right there is no real set thing, thanks a lot Tie Dye!
aren't you suppose to put the flame on the fitting instead of the pipe so that capillary action will draw the solder up into the fitting towards the heat.
Yes you heat the inner tube up first and then move back to the fitting. I may have had an issue with that pinch off tool being a giant heat sink with the tip size I was using, thanks.
Would it have been 'ideal' to pull a vacuum on that little process tube before un-pinching it, or do you feel like the air 'stays put' until you can purge it as you did? I know refrigerant is heavier than air - does the fact that it was pointing up affect your decision?
Great videos. Know this was filmed a while back. Have you seen the Vise grip style punch tools? Are they good to use? They seem easier and with less chance of cutting tube off
Yes I have used them and I do not like them because they will sometimes leak since they tend to smoosh the pipe when clamping down. I would advise to always use the bolt on clamps since it will put pressure on all sides of the tube and will make a better seal or the way done in the video for a permanent port, thanks Julio!
Yeah I have seen two versions of the tool. One is a vise grip and another is a blue handle with tension lock. I still like the bolt on clamp ones the best since I know they won't leak. You could pressure test different tube diameters and test them but in my experience, the needle is too big to easily puncture through and the force crushes the tup and doesn't allow a great seal each time on the rubber, thanks
Yes it does, you only have to open it back up a little to get pressure. Actually, you may even get pressure as soon as you take this off if it is not tightened down too hard, but I would open the copper up a little, thanks
Hey Danny- Here is a link to the Yellow Jacket Pinch Off Tool- amzn.to/2uqV24o Here is a link to the Pasco Flare Block- amzn.to/2uoLdoS Here is the link to a 5 pack of Uniweld Hammer Swages- amzn.to/2uqWHqs Here is the link for the Supco bullet piercing valve- amzn.to/2DRZj80 Here is the link to the sweat on 1/4" access valves 10pk- amzn.to/2ngFYmE
Hey Acservicetech, thought I would ask this here. Is it safe to use a pinch off tool on R410 or would high pressures make it unsafe. Just wondering. I have been doing it on little stuff just like you showed and it is working great. I have a dehumidifer that has R410 and may need to work on it soon just waiting on work order. Thanks
It is ok. Ha ha, I actually did a double pinch right in the middle of an r410a vapor line on a stand up ac unit since the unit I was working on didn't have a process stub, I brazed an access valve in, bled the air before releasing the second pinch and that one was good and didn't have any issues, thanks
There is not much you can do in this case. We do the best we can do with flowing nitrogen but in this case we can't. Silver soldering is also an option on this one, thanks Tom!
I have been trying to increase the volume on the videos before uploading and on my computer it sounds loud at 50%. Thank you very much, I would not have known unless you told me, thanks Gene!
The universal 608 covers anything with refrigerant in it. You can use a technique like the one in this video for units that have r-22, retrofit refrigerants and r410a if there are presently not any access ports, thanks
Tool List- www.amazon.com/shop/acservicetech
Support- www.patreon.com/acservicetech
For those that are looking for the tools used in the videos: (Linked Below)
Here is a link to the Yellow Jacket Pinch Off Tool- amzn.to/2uqV24o
Here is the link to a 5 pack of Uniweld Hammer Swages- amzn.to/2uqWHqs
Here is a link for RectorSeal Bubble Gas Leak Detector amzn.to/2ckWACn
Here is a link to the Pasco Flare Block- amzn.to/2uoLdoS
Here is a link to the Air Acetylene Torch setup- amzn.to/2aQalsb
Here is a link to the 15% Silver Brazing Rods- amzn.to/2gVLyLc
Here is a link the Nitrogen Regulator amzn.to/2bXdR5f
Other tool links can be found in the video description section.
ACSERVICETECH is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com.
Been a tech for 33 years now and have to say you are one of the best out there making videos.we really need this in our trade considering what i have seen come out of our trade schools.keep up the good work.
Michael, I really appreciate it!
As a mechanic for over 40 years, and a shop owner since 1991, I must say that the trade schools are good at sucking up student loan money, and not one "graduate" that i have met had much to show for 2 years of vocational training except $45,000 in student loan debt.
I'v never seen this. It's pretty cool. I was taught to remove the charge, braze in some access ports with nitrogen, vacuum, and weigh in the charge.
I'm a licensed contractor and I've never used a pinch off tool. I suppose you can charge more to recover the refrigerant and put new refrigerant back in. This is probably why I was never taught this method. If it don't make money it don't make sense. Now that I know this method, I can save customers money and save me a grip of time. Thank you kindly.
How much would you charge to do this?
$220 -$440 depending on size of equipment.
This is a great video. I'm just beginning to learn about HVAC service and I had yet to see a clear demonstration of how to close off then reopen a process tube in order to install a service port. The EPA 608 study guides tell you to remove the piercing valve when you're done using it "because they tend to leak over time", but give no indication whatsoever of how to do this without letting the refrigerant out.
Been using one for a few years now, it's great on small appliances, not sure why nobody did a review on one, now more techs can benefit from this. Great channel keep it up!
Thanks Dennis!
Thanks for this video. I'm a DIY home owner and I service my cars and home A/C units that come with ports. Now I should be able to add ports to the (cheap china) dehumidifiers that seem to be accumulating in my basement, and see if I can get one or more working again.
Nice that you recommend practicing before doing it for real. 75% or more of everything I've ever seen on your videos could be practised by new techs before trying them in the field. And for new techs, both boys and girls, the pre practice extends further than they'll realize for months to come. Best wishes to you.
Yes you are absolutely right!
Now I know what these tools are that were in my dad's tool box!
A simple saddle solder valve is all you need. And I'm not talking about the bolt on kind either. I used them for years as a Sears refrigeration tech. It's made out of copper that is soldered on to the copper line while refrigerant is still in it then a cap is screwed on that taps a hole in the line that has a srader valve in it. That's all Sears uses. It only takes a couple minutes to have it installed completely. They are used on high and low sides. I never had one leak and we used a lot of them.
Thanks M Watkins!
Edward HVACR CT What's the reason the service valves are not left on unit? The idea of propane systems sound great based on performance and GWP but sure scares the hell out of me thinking of firing up a torch on one. Do those systems blowup on a compressor burnout or does the lack of oxygen prevent that?
acservicetech, please do a video on this method also. Thanks
I use saddle valves all the time they work great 👍🏻
Can you put the saddle type on with Stay Brite 8 or do you have to braze them on? For R134A and R404A fridge and freezers
You are a very great teacher thanks for what you do for our community
Why all you do? you do it great? Amazing video. I was looking for a video to check my a/c window without refrigerant get out to the ambient
thanks for sharing excellent tutorial video ,have one pinch off tool like that never used it, now I m gonna apply that knowledge confidently Thanks again keep those Video coming😊👍👍👍
Thanks Gene!
Just wanted to say, I've been watching you for years,
I have your book,
Your cheat cards,
And I have all the videos in my favorites that I sometimes need, we've chatted before, here in Daytona, all I due package units, So all the stuff I save has been very helpful...
Thank you my brother, you keep on teaching, You great at it....👍👍👍
Happy Easter...
Thank you very much for your note! Happy Easter to you to! We ended up watching our church's Easter Service through Facebook this year!
@@acservicetechchannel Just one request, I'm kinda an odd duck here in Daytona..
I work on nothing but package units, a couple of splits here and there, but 95% of my work is on Tempstar, Rheem, And unfortunately noredyne...
It would be real nice to see a few package unit trouble shooting videos...just saying...
It would be nice...
Anyway, once again Happy Easter....And God Bless...
A C Bob Daytona...
Thanks good job
I want to ask please: what if you would find a leak after using pinch off tool ? What would u do ? Evacuate and braze ? Thanks
That was very interesting and well done. My only concern would be worrying about the pinch-off tool weakening the tubing. Wouldn't this run the wrisk of damaging the tubeing at the point the tool was used on?
It could possibly if the tubing was pinched too tightly. You could accidentally cut it too, thanks neutrodyne!
great foresight removing the lens covers to eliminate glare. It also would have been nice to show a processing tube tool being used to pull a vacuum and charge, then pinched off and brazed back to the sealed state. Some feel that striders a a constant leak course / weak point. I remember many years ago, when they first started the debate / proposals for 410a, The argument was to eliminate all schraeders and go to service valves and TEV's. That didn't happen though. Too many special interests.
Ha ha, yeah it is interesting what you would like the industry to move to and where we are at. Many things at play. Thanks for letting me know what you would like to see and thanks for the comment HVAC01453!
Can you use this on a process tube on a recip compressor instead of off the suction line? Thanks...your videos are always well thought out.
that is Excellent partner thank you for sharing I never knew how to do that procedure it worked really well just as you did it!!!!!
Thanks jimbolla77!
Great video thanks. These videos are all very valuable and its a privilege to have a skilled tech like yourself happy to share
Thank you very much Michael!
Good vid. I have just ordered a pinch off tool. I have up until now just used the bpv 31 bullet piercing valves , recovered and installed weldin access valves. Im gonna give a shot at doing the pinch off thing. You know if u use oxy acet rig u woukd of been in & out in a few seconds on that joint. But , still a good vid. Thanks for making it.
Absolutely right, Thanks OCRefrigeration!
That's a great way to save some time but didn't he just get the inside of that joint all covered in black carbon?
All the old timers nvr used nitro when brazing. And all those ac units ran longer then the new shit thats out with the new techniques in brazing applied 😂
I strive to be as good as you one day
Thanks for this Acservicetech! This is the best video I have seen yet on using these tools. Very well done and learned a few new tricks.
I think you asked for this a long while ago. Sorry it took a bit! Thanks
acservicetech
I think you might be right lol! Either way, thanks. It's a great video. You help me out a lot. I don't have to many folks to ask at the place I work lol.
Glad to help Nick!
Great info, Craig! Can I use the pinch-off tool to “fix” a kink in a copper line and re-round it enough for the refrigerant flow to work flawlessly? Will it work? Thanks for your helpful videos and the ton of info you provide.
Real good explanation thanks.
Nice job!
Thanks for the visit
I use Braze-on Piercing Saddle Taps like the BesTech 5538's. Bolt-ons leak especially when the o-ring dries out.
Thanks Dwayne!
@@acservicetechchannel No Problem. Keeping'em Cool, and our call backs to a minimum.
Robinair makes a piercing valve. It's much easier to use. I like your videos.
Thanks Ron!
Nice job!!
Thanks!
That was very informative 👍🏻
Glad you think so!
Great Video!
Saddle valve would be even better? Good video anyway. Thank you!
Can I add one of these to my RV? I have two crappy dometic ac units that have leaked. I have a mini split installed so I'm good for now but I want to get them serviced and my friend does ac, one of the ac units have a piercing valve but it has leaked I believe, I know I should get both units replaced but I feel like the service port should be a good fix and hopefully be a permanent fix rather then a piercing valve
I'm a 15 year veteran of the field and have my masters refrigeration license--which definitely does NOT mean I know everything! Far from it. But we are beginning to see quite a few of the R-290 (refrigerant grade propane) reach-in freezers and coolers out there. These do require some facility with the pinch-off tool, which is required after the system is evacuated and charged in order to seal the punctures made with the required "bullet" access valves. On my last trip, I was not able to get 100% shutoff no matter WHAT I did--which included making multiple pinch-offs to break pressure down the access tube and cranking the tool as far closed as I could with vise grips--to the point where I was in serious danger of actually cutting the tube and blowing the charge (which I have done). Less than 100% shutoff causes the system propane to repressurize that end of the access tube and blows holes in the brazing solder. I finally had to remove the cores in 1/4" stem valves, pinch off as hard as I dared, braze in the stem valves with the propane seeping by the pinch-off tool venting out the end of the stem, then inserting the core and capping the new access. This worked, but I can't figure out why I can't get a 100% shutoff? Is there a different style and/or better tool besides the one shown in this video?
That is a really rough one! I have used this pinch off tool with r410a with no problems leaking but I know what you mean. You can't tighten it too much or it will cut through and blow the charge. That tubing could have had some flakes on the inside which didn't allow the inside of the tube to seal when it was compressed or something!
@@acservicetechchannel Your reply is very much appreciated. I am glad I am not the only one! And I have "cut through" in an effort to completely shut off leak by at the "pinch" and blown the charge and what could be worse on a Friday afternoon at 5:30 when you've told the wife you're taking her out to dinner. I went looking on line, and there is a different style of "pinch off" that will do 1/4" or 3/8" and the "pinch" looks more like a round ball tip you screw down on the copper into a kind of a cup shaped recess. I have it coming and will see if it works any more reliably. The advantage would be that you aren't cranking down a sharp edge like the traditional tube, which (see above! lol) is just to easy to cut right through soft copper. This looks like I can crank to my heart's content without severing the line. Interesting note: After identifying the manufacturer and part number, EVERY source I could find--including the factory!--was backordered two or three weeks--making me wonder if a whole LOT of commercial refrigeration techs were running into the same problem with these R-290 units and their special handling precautions all at once?
Thanks for the video. Great tool, used one for years.
Thanks Jim!
acservicetech, You're welcome, sir.
That's just cool. It reminds me of the AC's on my RV's and I always wondered about that.
Would RV AC's be a good place to start? Are they a good overall training ground for all the fundamental skills? And excuses to buy tools?
Well, they don't have service ports so they would have to be brazed on. They only have line voltage controls typically unless it is a rv ac voltage system but they do have a capacitor and start capacitor usually. There are always excuses to buy tools, ha ha, thanks!
acservicetech Well good, your brazing was it that got me thinking. Well said on the tools!
Love to see something on installation and control of electronic dampers by various thermostats. Thanks for everything!
NMranchhand, thanks for letting me know what you would like to see!
How about setting up return/economizer boxes with controls.
Great videos you do!
Thanks for the tips on sheet metal tools!
Thanks Chris!
I believe 5% silver solder is good for around 10,000 lbs and 430F. More than enough for even most home and light industry.
Are the bolt-on service ports a permanent addition to small systems? Or just to recover the charge? And isn't the risk of 'black death flakes' clogging the cap tube very REAL without N2? Thanks.
What about the acid flux you have to use when silver soldering? You vacuum and install filter line dryers to prevent acid forming but silver solder with acid flux? Just curious, unless you have an acid free flux that works. But wouldn't you still get some sort of contamination from whatever type of flux as opposed to brazing? Also, couldn't you rig up a micro copper tube to your nitrogen tank and stick it down the 1/4 o.d. tube your brazing to feed nitrogen inside? Just a thought, if I was in A/C instead of plumbing I might make something like that. I enjoy your video's, you know your stuff and you teach well.
P.S., after brazing you could also run a bottle brush down the tube to loosen the black oxidation and then blow it out with nitrogen. That might not get 100 % but probably an improvement and since it is a dead end access whatever is left should not cause a problem. Just trying to think outside the box.
Thanks Azycray, I actually prefer brazing and that is what I did in this video with no flux, and 15% braze rods. Thank you very much!
Yes, sorry for the confusion. But you did say soldering was an option if it wasn't R410, so I was referring to what you said, not what you were doing in this particular video. Please clarify or expound further about using an acid flux or why you prefer brazing. Thanks AC!
I prefer brazing because that is what the manufactures now do on all their joints. Sometimes you need to silver solder because the part you need to fix is too close to an existing silver solder joint and you don't want to heat this up too much. Acid flux is less of a problem on r-22 with mineral oil than r410a with poe but silver soldering is and has been done succesfully for years on both r-22 and r-410a. I prefer to brae because no acid and this is what manufacturers are doing, thanks!
Great demo
Thanks WM!
Very good video! Thanks
Thanks a lot Chip!
Great instructional video, exactly what I have been looking for! :) Thank you!
Thanks JuhaEerikki!
Thank you for your great videos
Glad to help gymnrat lives!
Obviously no way to "flow" nitrogen, but any advantage to filling the tube with a shot of nitrogen as you fit the access tube?
Or am I just going way overboard?
Ha ha, I was thinking the same thing but no, the tube is too short to temporarily put nitrogen in and have the valve cap without a rubber o ring slightly cracked open. I did not think it would be worth it in case I accidentally held pressure which could create a pin hole leak. Ha you are not alone! Thanks David!
You could have flushed the tube of air with nitro before. At least most air/moisture would be gone.
Is it possible just to constantly purge that short piece with Nitrogen during brazing? Nitrogen through the Schrader valve but not fully tightened.
Thanks for this great video. I'm probably going to have to add some service ports on a wshp.
Oh nice! I just did a double pinch on a system that did no have a stub on it and put a port in the middle, thanks and nice to hear from you!
Is the pinch off tool, worth buying ?
Pretty cool! Thanks for sharing!
Glad to help!
Awesome video, I'm glad you did a video on a small package unit. I work a lot with PTAC units at my work. Question, I've had electrical wires rub holes in the capillary tube from the vibration of the compressor. Is it possible to repair a hole in a small capillary tube? Thanks!
If you can do more videos on small package units it would be much appreciated.
Yes you can fix them. You need to continue to cut through it all the way and braze another larger cap tube on as if it were a coupling and get in and get out fast with the braze so the braze rod is not sucked into the hole clogging it, thanks Danny!
Danny; We get these randomly on commercial refrigeration units--either the capillary feed tubes used commonly in reach-ins, or the capillary tubes associated with high and/or low pressure cutout switches. This AC Service Tech is exactly right. The trick is to cut all the way through . . . . I use the side (corner) of a standard file to saw through at the hole until I'm about 50% through the capillary then carefully bend it back and forth at the cut until it separates. If you try to file a cut all the way through the capillary, you risk squashing one side or the other of the cut partially or completely shut and you have to cut back more on either side.
This tech is warning about the brazing technique because of the danger of "sucking" the solder into the cap. Again, that's exactly right. But one way to minimize that risk is to "sleeve" the two capillary ends like a coupling with a 1/4" tube that's as long as you want. Picture cutting and sleeving with a 2" long 1/4" tube over the capillary, basically butt the two capillary ends inside the 1/4" somewhere around the middle of the ~2" sleeve and simply braze each end of the ~2" long sleeve to the respective ends of the capillary. You ALSO have to be careful not to blow a hole in the really thin capillary copper when you make that joint. I heat the 1/4" to cherry red, and usually enough heat is conducted to the capillary at the end to pull the liquid solder on and around the cap with a less than one second pass with the torch and voila.
While a long 1/4" sleeve on a capillary tube isn't the most beautiful piece of refrigerant work we ever do, it's very cost effective, works a long time, and the customer rarely if ever sees it.
One last thing to "sweat." If you have a capillary that is really vibrating (as with some of the long pressure switch sensing lines), the extra mass of the 1/4" tubing sleeve--especially if you use a long one, can result in the tube really stress the cap tube at either or both ends of the sleeve. Think of it like a "pendulum" effect. That can work harden the capillary copper until it gets brittle and breaks at your brazed joint. If I'm looking at any significant vibration that is visibly moving the capillary while the compressor is running, I'll strap that section of the capillary to the insultated suction line or some other softer piece in the unit with tye wraps or duct tape to keep it from moving at all and potentially breaking at that joint.
C DSERVICES Thank you! Really good info.
13:09 should you have the gauge connected to see when the pressure is released into the new port with a loose hose to bleed out the air?
I was going to suggest the braze saddle valve as well but was already mentioned. I noticed you mention not using silver solder on 410a. I've seen quite a bit of talk and literature on it's success and rated strengths so not really sure why one wouldn't consider it with it's liquidus @ 540f. The extra prep is the only down side I know of.
Does that pinch off tool work well on 410a pressures? I noticed a commenter below stated he uses 2 pinch-off tools.
Yes a single pinch off tool can be used. I had people asking to see how the pinch off tool works. If I have the choice, Id rather use braze with no flux in the line, it is definitely a very debatable thing staybrite #8 or silphos 15 but I like to keep with what the manufacturers are doing. They braze their copper coils on R410a so I do the same. We are also now using aluminum with a very low melting point on those joints so that's right there is no real set thing, thanks a lot Tie Dye!
Very informative and interesting video. Well done, thanks!
Thanks Gerard!
aren't you suppose to put the flame on the fitting instead of the pipe so that capillary action will draw the solder up into the fitting towards the heat.
Yes you heat the inner tube up first and then move back to the fitting. I may have had an issue with that pinch off tool being a giant heat sink with the tip size I was using, thanks.
How to add service port perpendicular to a line. Do I get 3way valve and cut the line in half and braze them?
Another great video. Thank you!
Thanks Ram!
Is MAP gas hot enough to do that, or must use acetyline torch?
Would it have been 'ideal' to pull a vacuum on that little process tube before un-pinching it, or do you feel like the air 'stays put' until you can purge it as you did? I know refrigerant is heavier than air - does the fact that it was pointing up affect your decision?
The refrigerant was not moving at that point so the air would have stayed put and then the refrigerant would have pushed it out, thanks!
Craig are the vise grip pinch off just as good as the pinch off block?
Did you make the pinch/ off tool? Very good info. Thank you.
Yellow Jacket makes it. I have this tool linked at amazon.com/shop/acservicetech thanks Bert!
what are you using to check pressure, air compressor air or something else ?
Nitrogen.
great video. thanks you for sharing
Thanks ZE!
I don't see a link to the port do you happen to have that
Soft soldering will be better since you couldn't use nitrogen at this kind of situation?
Yes silver soldering would be nice for this, thanks!
How much room do you need for the pinch off tool?
Great videos. Know this was filmed a while back. Have you seen the Vise grip style punch tools? Are they good to use? They seem easier and with less chance of cutting tube off
Yes I have used them and I do not like them because they will sometimes leak since they tend to smoosh the pipe when clamping down. I would advise to always use the bolt on clamps since it will put pressure on all sides of the tube and will make a better seal or the way done in the video for a permanent port, thanks Julio!
AC Service Tech LLC sorry. Just noticed I wrote punch tool. I meant to say pinch tool. Instead of the tool you used, it’s a Vise Grip pinch tool.
Yeah I have seen two versions of the tool. One is a vise grip and another is a blue handle with tension lock. I still like the bolt on clamp ones the best since I know they won't leak. You could pressure test different tube diameters and test them but in my experience, the needle is too big to easily puncture through and the force crushes the tup and doesn't allow a great seal each time on the rubber, thanks
Does that Pinch off tool kinks the cooper lines after get them straight?
Yes it does, you only have to open it back up a little to get pressure. Actually, you may even get pressure as soon as you take this off if it is not tightened down too hard, but I would open the copper up a little, thanks
Thank you so much for this video. You have help me alot.
which do you prefer: the signstek or fieldpiece dual temp meter or is there another brand you prefer?
Hey James, I prefer the FieldPiece ST4 Dual Temp Meter- amzn.to/2AhR6ph - thanks
Do you have a link for the piercing tool and the access service valve? Thanks!
Hey Danny- Here is a link to the Yellow Jacket Pinch Off Tool- amzn.to/2uqV24o
Here is a link to the Pasco Flare Block- amzn.to/2uoLdoS
Here is the link to a 5 pack of Uniweld Hammer Swages- amzn.to/2uqWHqs
Here is the link for the Supco bullet piercing valve- amzn.to/2DRZj80
Here is the link to the sweat on 1/4" access valves 10pk- amzn.to/2ngFYmE
Silver solder what is the melting point?
Hey Acservicetech, thought I would ask this here. Is it safe to use a pinch off tool on R410 or would high pressures make it unsafe. Just wondering. I have been doing it on little stuff just like you showed and it is working great. I have a dehumidifer that has R410 and may need to work on it soon just waiting on work order. Thanks
It is ok. Ha ha, I actually did a double pinch right in the middle of an r410a vapor line on a stand up ac unit since the unit I was working on didn't have a process stub, I brazed an access valve in, bled the air before releasing the second pinch and that one was good and didn't have any issues, thanks
Good deal! Thanks for the reply. I will be giving it a go.
do you not think it would have been worth the effort to remove the air instead of introducing it to the system after brazing?
sir, if i braze with refrigerant in the system and i did not pinch off the tube , is it posible to explode? the aircon?
Definitely don't do that, yes it would blow the charge at you. Don't do that, thanks
@@acservicetechchannel Thank you sir, now i know what to do.. thank's for your great video. very informative, .
@@acservicetechchannel he would also cause the refrigerant to break down forming phosgene gas. Not good.
Can you put a copper saddle valve on with Stay Brite 8 or do you have to braze them on? For R134A
You can use staybrite 8 or braze rod if the system is empty
Thank you so much! Amazing channel!
Why not use a line tap?
Can I use stay brite less heat less oxidation?
Sure can, thanks Hieu!
is it matter if you braze w/wo nitrogen in this case?
There is not much you can do in this case. We do the best we can do with flowing nitrogen but in this case we can't. Silver soldering is also an option on this one, thanks Tom!
Now is better way and tools
ps. could you increase your volume bit low thanks
I have been trying to increase the volume on the videos before uploading and on my computer it sounds loud at 50%. Thank you very much, I would not have known unless you told me, thanks Gene!
Would heat gel work ?
Absolutely, thanks Darrien!
If you know how to use Oxy/Acylen set up then you wouldn't have a no or low heat issue. Those little turbo torches are a pain in the ass.
What number tip did you use?
#6 then moved to an 11. I should have started with the 11, thanks
Can i do this on HVAC heat pump outside unit?
Hey Sam, are you EPA 608 certified for buying and working with refrigerants?
yes I am
Just to make sure it is not for appliances only
The universal 608 covers anything with refrigerant in it. You can use a technique like the one in this video for units that have r-22, retrofit refrigerants and r410a if there are presently not any access ports, thanks
What a nightmare, it's only a few more dollars to add ports at the factory.
it’s not a mater of cost. The factory wants to maintain a hermetically sealed system. It’s the same way on most small sealed systems.
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didnt vac it
Sand it first
You can by a new one cheaper than it'll cost for me to work on this dinky thing ...??
Why do you guys have to waste so much time brazing a quarter inch tube. Les these are amateurs
SCHRADER VALVE.
Great video
Thanks Channel Cat Chaser!