Please see Disneyland Paris. There is an interlocking story between Big Thunder Mountain, Thunder Mesa, and Phantom Manor (their Haunted Mansion) where you see Thunder Mesa in hell. They tied it all together with a story that you should go over Rob.
I think with the cultural changes in the Disney Parks, you can learn that creativity does come best to you when you do have limits on what's possible. Phantom Manor, Mystic Manor, The Non-Twighlight Zone Tower Of Terror and Discoveryland are textbook examples.
It seems like a cool idea but also almost too big to be practical. If it had been built, I wonder if they would have been able to build the series of attractions the way that they planned or if they would have had to scale it down. I'd like to see the concept of multiple attractions interwoven in this way revisited.
thevine2010 those attractions at DLP may be interwoven interms of story, but they aren't physically interwoven like Disney World's would've been. Although the fact that DLP's Big Thunder is on an island is super cool!!
Holy cow, how did I overlook that one! Thank you! Not sure why I just pushed that one back a full decade! Made an edit to the video to fix this, but RUclips takes forever to push those changes so I'm pinning this so everyone can see in the meantime..
Hey Rob. Yet again, a completely fascinating video. I know that you usually focus on topics that are related to the parks, but would you consider doing a video about the Disney Channel? I think it would be interesting to know how it started and how it has evolved over the years. That's probably because I remember watching the Disney afternoon cartoons and when they showed a new DCOM every month, but my first memory of Disney channel was when I was very young and I got to watch at my grandma's since we didn't have cable and I loved Eureka's Castle!
I always liked some of the older areas in the magic kingdom, I like how the railroad goes through splash mountain, like how the people mover goes through most of the Tomorrowland attractions, kinda wish they had applied this idea to more lands in the parks.
Another awesome video. They've kinda come back to this concept in a different way with the way they are opening new lands like Pandora, star wars, toy story and cars lands. Not as spacially interwoven but great all the same.
I'm surprised you didn't mention how the idea for the attraction has lived on. Just as the Magic Kingdom Railroad would go through the ride, it now goes through Splash Mountain, the spiritual successor to the log flume idea. And the fact that many of the proposed scenes for the Western River Expedition ended up making their way into World of Motion.
As always love the thought provoking video's. Great Disney idea's never really disappear, and maybe one day Disney might take some of the show aspects of this attraction and make it a reality one day. One can only hope.
A few years back,Disneyland's old Adventure Through Inner Space ride was recreated through CGI (as of this post,it can be seen here). There's a project to similarly recreate WDW's Mr. Toad's Wild Ride (currently on hiatus). Imagine if someone chose to create a virtual version of this idea...or at the very least,the Western River ride.
Would you upload your ending video clips? I love the ambient WDW audio! Its so relaxing and amazing because it brings the feelings back to when i was a kid (I was a quiet kid and loved just sitting down and looking at all the details and exploring in the parks. Im 23 now and still do that and love it)
Honestly there are tons of Disney rides that were never built that I would rather have over Western River Expedition. Heck it even sounded like the least interesting attraction that you talked about of the 3 that where supposed to be added. We eventually got the mine train coaster and the log flume though so it sorta worked out.
Great stuff Rob! I wonder if Disney ever decides to create a new park would they approach this original concept . Westerns have been out of style for a while now but with Westworld being a huge hit , it's popularity is on the rise again. Disney's 5th park could be designed in a similar way like Islands of Adventure where you have unique experiences as you progress thought each island. Imagine you enter into Disney's Yesteryear .. walk through Western-land, Medieval Land, Feudal Japan-Asian Land etc.
I saw the models for this ride at Disney World in the late 70's. When the Indiana Jones ride was being developed for Disneyland there were also plans for it to include the Jungle Boats and the Disneyland train but all of that was scrapped.
Disney question: I know you often do Q&A's and I loved your video on Disney books. I was wondering if you have any recommendations for a book that just discusses the history of MGM/Hollywood studios? I'd also be interested to know how the rides themselves function. A possible book video in the future? Thank you for all your excellent videos!
Interesting question! Off the top of my head I don't know of any MGM specific books, but I can look into it, as if there is I would definitely want to read it!
Guess it's to know this, especially since Disneyland Paris eventually got this concept to an extent with their version of big thunder mountain and the phantom manor...
The complaints in regards to the lack of Pirates as an open day attraction for the Magic Kingdom reminds me of all the complaints of game exclusivity for either gaming system to keep a more healthy competition.
I've always felt their reasoning in not initially having PotC smacked of bad assumptions on the Imagineers' part. Florida is certainly not in the Caribbean (though there is definitely a Caribbean flavor) and at best, it was a sparsely populated frontier at the periphery of the age of piracy. There wasn't really a reason to assume Floridians were too familiar with pirates to build the ride. And by the same logic, it didn't make sense for Disneyland to have Frontierland. California was part of the Old West, after all, and the connection to that era is much more recent and tangible than any connection Florida may have to pirates.
What if Bob Igur or how ever you spell his name took this ride into action? Do you think it would be the way Walt wanted it? Or do you think it would be enhanced in the way Bob wanted it?
Though Magic Kingdom (and the "Disneyland [location]" parks) were designed to be more or less a clone of Disneyland, Disney seems to have kept coming back to this idea of differentiating them with differently themed attractions--only to eventually replicate the successful ones. Western River Expedition was going to be the East Coast Pirates with Big Thunder Mountain on top, but they built an actual Pirates instead, and twin Big Thunder Mountains. Space Mountain was the East Coast Matterhorn, only before long there was a West Coast Space Mountain and eventually a quasi-Matterhorn in Expedition Everest. And today, we have Radiator Springs Racers as the West Coast Test Track, and Dinosaur as the East Coast Indiana Jones. There are rumors of them someday taking out the Dinosaur theming and just making the ride over as Indiana Jones. How long before we get an East Coast Radiator Springs? I suppose it's design by experiment.
Maybe it’s for the best the original Thunder Mesa never came to be. I can imagine how poorly the scenes with the Native Americans would age. And all those rides being so tightly interwoven would lead to the whole land being shut down for renovations, overlays, maintenance, and (Heaven forbid) accidents.
Do you do requests for videos? If so, I would like to see two videos on two separate topics. Will there be a time when we stop talking about all things relating to Disney and what state would Disney be in if Walt Disney lived for 1-2 more decades?
The Magic Kingdom version of Pirates of the Caribbean is a disappointment. I was upset when I arrived in 2007 and rode it and realized it was a "foot-notes" version of the Disneyland original, omitting most of the cave scenes, and rushing straight into the town. It really lacked the same sense of mystery the Disneyland one has, with the long caves in the beginning slowly introducing rides to the themes of the ride. The line at the Magic Kingdom version though was pretty cool, although the lack of the Blue Bayou Restaurant inside the show building was a bit of a shock too. I really wish Disney World got Thunder Mesa instead.
Another factor working against the ride was the plight of Native Americans at the time. In the ride, the Indians were depicted quite cartoonishly stereotyped (i.e., politically incorrect), like the Indians in "Peter Pan". To have stuff in a ride like this, one that would likely be here today had it been built, would have been egregious by today's standards. Remember, movies like "Peter Pan" have been pulled from kids' accounts on Disney Plus, while adding those annoying "historical" warnings in front of them on regular accounts before you can watch them. If it had been built, it would surely have been in a tough spot today, just as Splash Mountain is now.
Another reason Western River Expedition was never built was the declining popularity of westerns. After the radical social change of the 1960's and the Civil Rights Movement, romanticized visions of America's Old West and American cowboys that were huge pop culture staples during the time of Disneyland's construction were falling out of favor with the general public. Hell, the most popular Western film that was made in the 70s was Blazing Saddles: a parody film that relentlessly mocked the entire Western genre. So Disney probably wasn't keen on building a ride that entirely focused on cowboys.
Could you do a video addressing the fact that a lot of people see the new slinky dog coaster is a cheap way to get more money a “ Six Flags coaster” if you will. I think it’s horrible for people to even think that there was so much work an effort put into it to make it as immersive as possible! I really trust that you will be able to make a video on the mater!
It would be interesting to see it come back in some way, it will never happen but maybe Disney could kill multiple birds with one stone. Buy HBO get a streaming service instead of making their own and theme this idea to Westworld and get multiple new IP for things not normally in their wheel house. It is likely too adult for them but it would be neat and I could see a bunch of benefits for Disney and viewers.
I'm glad it never happened because the section with the natives probably would have been racist and I'm good without that in Disney, thank you very much.
For a big(really..BIG) project like this,you have to accept the reality of what it becomes and accept that it is and isn't what one expects from their dream project,but personally,yeah,I do think this multi jointed ride(s) would have been awesome...had it not been for all the hurtles it faced. The biggest hurtle being the 1970's Gas shortage,ultimately,Mr. Disney made the right economical choice though. Reality sucks,huh??
It could have been fun but a generic cowboy land is not very Disneyesque. I would rather have Pirates quite honestly. Both would be good, but if only one - Pirates. 😀🍹🇵🇭
I hate how POTC is kind of sexist like I now that that happen with slaves but I feel for like ages 3 up is kind of bad like we can hide that from kids forever but I kind of through that how he held underwear yes that was bad but that was two but I love who the change it to where she stands up for woman I love that!?!?
Please see Disneyland Paris. There is an interlocking story between Big Thunder Mountain, Thunder Mesa, and Phantom Manor (their Haunted Mansion) where you see Thunder Mesa in hell. They tied it all together with a story that you should go over Rob.
That's about the closest thing we'll get, isn't it?
I think with the cultural changes in the Disney Parks, you can learn that creativity does come best to you when you do have limits on what's possible. Phantom Manor, Mystic Manor, The Non-Twighlight Zone Tower Of Terror and Discoveryland are textbook examples.
An amazing video as always. Whenever I see this ride I cry that it never happened. I wish it was here!
I love these vids, I always watch them on the bus to school
It seems like a cool idea but also almost too big to be practical. If it had been built, I wonder if they would have been able to build the series of attractions the way that they planned or if they would have had to scale it down. I'd like to see the concept of multiple attractions interwoven in this way revisited.
They did it. It's called Disneyland Paris. See Big Thunder Mountain, Phantom Manor, and Thunder Mesa.
thevine2010 those attractions at DLP may be interwoven interms of story, but they aren't physically interwoven like Disney World's would've been. Although the fact that DLP's Big Thunder is on an island is super cool!!
They are all in Frontierland. If anything, this is the entire Frontierland experience at DLP.
Yes they are in the same land. Are they physically intertwined? No. So this concept hasn't really been achieved in DLP.
Wow! I think I'm a true Disney fan but you teach me so much I didn't know about Disney!
Great video! One correction, it was 1979 and 1980 for Big Thunder Mountain.
Holy cow, how did I overlook that one! Thank you! Not sure why I just pushed that one back a full decade! Made an edit to the video to fix this, but RUclips takes forever to push those changes so I'm pinning this so everyone can see in the meantime..
Hey Rob. Yet again, a completely fascinating video. I know that you usually focus on topics that are related to the parks, but would you consider doing a video about the Disney Channel? I think it would be interesting to know how it started and how it has evolved over the years. That's probably because I remember watching the Disney afternoon cartoons and when they showed a new DCOM every month, but my first memory of Disney channel was when I was very young and I got to watch at my grandma's since we didn't have cable and I loved Eureka's Castle!
I always liked some of the older areas in the magic kingdom, I like how the railroad goes through splash mountain, like how the people mover goes through most of the Tomorrowland attractions, kinda wish they had applied this idea to more lands in the parks.
Another awesome video. They've kinda come back to this concept in a different way with the way they are opening new lands like Pandora, star wars, toy story and cars lands. Not as spacially interwoven but great all the same.
I'm surprised you didn't mention how the idea for the attraction has lived on. Just as the Magic Kingdom Railroad would go through the ride, it now goes through Splash Mountain, the spiritual successor to the log flume idea. And the fact that many of the proposed scenes for the Western River Expedition ended up making their way into World of Motion.
Never clicked so fast 😂 ❤️
i always come here before i prep for disney!!
Just got back from Walt Disney World! I already want to go back
Hope you had a wonderful time!
Tabtheperson same
I got back a month ago I miss it so much
Rob Plays Thanks it was great! Only downside my feet hurt, but that was expected
This is always one of the best "What If"s to think about with Disney. I've always been interested in this project
As always love the thought provoking video's. Great Disney idea's never really disappear, and maybe one day Disney might take some of the show aspects of this attraction and make it a reality one day. One can only hope.
grizzly river run?
A few years back,Disneyland's old Adventure Through Inner Space ride was recreated through CGI (as of this post,it can be seen here). There's a project to similarly recreate WDW's Mr. Toad's Wild Ride (currently on hiatus). Imagine if someone chose to create a virtual version of this idea...or at the very least,the Western River ride.
I love the Disney History of your videos ! best on youtube !!
Thanks!
Would you upload your ending video clips? I love the ambient WDW audio! Its so relaxing and amazing because it brings the feelings back to when i was a kid (I was a quiet kid and loved just sitting down and looking at all the details and exploring in the parks. Im 23 now and still do that and love it)
Honestly there are tons of Disney rides that were never built that I would rather have over Western River Expedition. Heck it even sounded like the least interesting attraction that you talked about of the 3 that where supposed to be added. We eventually got the mine train coaster and the log flume though so it sorta worked out.
Great video as always Rob!
Amazing! Once again an amazing video!
Great stuff Rob! I wonder if Disney ever decides to create a new park would they approach this original concept . Westerns have been out of style for a while now but with Westworld being a huge hit , it's popularity is on the rise again. Disney's 5th park could be designed in a similar way like Islands of Adventure where you have unique experiences as you progress thought each island. Imagine you enter into Disney's Yesteryear .. walk through Western-land, Medieval Land, Feudal Japan-Asian Land etc.
Love the work rob
I love those imagineering ideas, where multiple rides were built in one show building or small area. Kind of like he original Indiana Jones Ride.
I saw the models for this ride at Disney World in the late 70's.
When the Indiana Jones ride was being developed for Disneyland there were also plans for it to include the Jungle Boats and the Disneyland train but all of that was scrapped.
Another great one!!
I love to hear you talk about attractions! It fills the void of not being in the park #sadbuttrue
Haha that's a good part of why I make the videos! It helps me deal with not being at the parks!
Disney question: I know you often do Q&A's and I loved your video on Disney books. I was wondering if you have any recommendations for a book that just discusses the history of MGM/Hollywood studios? I'd also be interested to know how the rides themselves function. A possible book video in the future?
Thank you for all your excellent videos!
Interesting question! Off the top of my head I don't know of any MGM specific books, but I can look into it, as if there is I would definitely want to read it!
Awesome Video Rob!!!!! Love Your Content!!!!!!!
Thanks!
Pirates is my favorite MK ride!
Looks to blue sky,but i could see the western river expedition as a splash mountain like ride.
good info as usual, thanks Rob!
Guess it's to know this, especially since Disneyland Paris eventually got this concept to an extent with their version of big thunder mountain and the phantom manor...
I'd love to see you do a video on the new generation of Imagineers, seeing as Marty Sklar has passed.
New subscriber! Great work!
+Kactai Thanks!
The complaints in regards to the lack of Pirates as an open day attraction for the Magic Kingdom reminds me of all the complaints of game exclusivity for either gaming system to keep a more healthy competition.
Nice video!!!
I've always felt their reasoning in not initially having PotC smacked of bad assumptions on the Imagineers' part. Florida is certainly not in the Caribbean (though there is definitely a Caribbean flavor) and at best, it was a sparsely populated frontier at the periphery of the age of piracy. There wasn't really a reason to assume Floridians were too familiar with pirates to build the ride.
And by the same logic, it didn't make sense for Disneyland to have Frontierland. California was part of the Old West, after all, and the connection to that era is much more recent and tangible than any connection Florida may have to pirates.
Always love your videos but they make me fell what would happen if this ride was actually here now ???
They should bring it back
I really wish this came through fruition
I matched the area for pirates to the empty plot for western river on google maps.
I really wish they'd revisit this idea.
Nautical Films
They did...except you may want to plan a trip to Disneyland Paris though, alot of this idea ended up there 😌
Felicia Singleton I'm aware of Thunder Mesa and Phantom Manor. I'm referring to the Western River Expedition attraction
What if Bob Igur or how ever you spell his name took this ride into action? Do you think it would be the way Walt wanted it? Or do you think it would be enhanced in the way Bob wanted it?
Except Disneyland Paris did get a version of thunder mesa interwoven attractions
Clickbait Title: Did Baby Boomers Kill Western River Expedition?
Is this why people say almost all the Thunder Mountains are connected? Doesn't Paris have Big Thunder Mesa?
Though Magic Kingdom (and the "Disneyland [location]" parks) were designed to be more or less a clone of Disneyland, Disney seems to have kept coming back to this idea of differentiating them with differently themed attractions--only to eventually replicate the successful ones.
Western River Expedition was going to be the East Coast Pirates with Big Thunder Mountain on top, but they built an actual Pirates instead, and twin Big Thunder Mountains. Space Mountain was the East Coast Matterhorn, only before long there was a West Coast Space Mountain and eventually a quasi-Matterhorn in Expedition Everest.
And today, we have Radiator Springs Racers as the West Coast Test Track, and Dinosaur as the East Coast Indiana Jones. There are rumors of them someday taking out the Dinosaur theming and just making the ride over as Indiana Jones. How long before we get an East Coast Radiator Springs?
I suppose it's design by experiment.
Maybe it’s for the best the original Thunder Mesa never came to be. I can imagine how poorly the scenes with the Native Americans would age. And all those rides being so tightly interwoven would lead to the whole land being shut down for renovations, overlays, maintenance, and (Heaven forbid) accidents.
It seems like it would had been fun
Hey, man ever considered changing your channel name? Rob Plays is just a little too generic and I always get confused when I see it in my sub box
lol I don't get confused but ok
what?
hey yea 72k subs, change your name.... righhhtt.
Do you do requests for videos? If so, I would like to see two videos on two separate topics. Will there be a time when we stop talking about all things relating to Disney and what state would Disney be in if Walt Disney lived for 1-2 more decades?
The Magic Kingdom version of Pirates of the Caribbean is a disappointment. I was upset when I arrived in 2007 and rode it and realized it was a "foot-notes" version of the Disneyland original, omitting most of the cave scenes, and rushing straight into the town. It really lacked the same sense of mystery the Disneyland one has, with the long caves in the beginning slowly introducing rides to the themes of the ride. The line at the Magic Kingdom version though was pretty cool, although the lack of the Blue Bayou Restaurant inside the show building was a bit of a shock too. I really wish Disney World got Thunder Mesa instead.
Another factor working against the ride was the plight of Native Americans at the time. In the ride, the Indians were depicted quite cartoonishly stereotyped (i.e., politically incorrect), like the Indians in "Peter Pan". To have stuff in a ride like this, one that would likely be here today had it been built, would have been egregious by today's standards. Remember, movies like "Peter Pan" have been pulled from kids' accounts on Disney Plus, while adding those annoying "historical" warnings in front of them on regular accounts before you can watch them. If it had been built, it would surely have been in a tough spot today, just as Splash Mountain is now.
Enjoy your voice
Another reason Western River Expedition was never built was the declining popularity of westerns. After the radical social change of the 1960's and the Civil Rights Movement, romanticized visions of America's Old West and American cowboys that were huge pop culture staples during the time of Disneyland's construction were falling out of favor with the general public. Hell, the most popular Western film that was made in the 70s was Blazing Saddles: a parody film that relentlessly mocked the entire Western genre. So Disney probably wasn't keen on building a ride that entirely focused on cowboys.
Could you do a video addressing the fact that a lot of people see the new slinky dog coaster is a cheap way to get more money a “ Six Flags coaster” if you will. I think it’s horrible for people to even think that there was so much work an effort put into it to make it as immersive as possible! I really trust that you will be able to make a video on the mater!
And that's why Disney world doesn't have a critter country
There's also the potentially racist parts to consider in how it would age in today's times.
I wished they'd at least have put effort into pirates. Looking at California's makes Florida's so pitiful in comparison
If only Robbie Big.. and where's the beastly kingdom ?
It would be interesting to see it come back in some way, it will never happen but maybe Disney could kill multiple birds with one stone. Buy HBO get a streaming service instead of making their own and theme this idea to Westworld and get multiple new IP for things not normally in their wheel house. It is likely too adult for them but it would be neat and I could see a bunch of benefits for Disney and viewers.
I'm glad it never happened because the section with the natives probably would have been racist and I'm good without that in Disney, thank you very much.
For a big(really..BIG) project like this,you have to accept the reality of what it becomes and accept that it is and isn't what one expects from their dream project,but personally,yeah,I do think this multi jointed ride(s) would have been awesome...had it not been for all the hurtles it faced. The biggest hurtle being the 1970's Gas shortage,ultimately,Mr. Disney made the right economical choice though. Reality sucks,huh??
It could have been fun but a generic cowboy land is not very Disneyesque. I would rather have Pirates quite honestly. Both would be good, but if only one - Pirates. 😀🍹🇵🇭
Curse you OPEC!!!!!
I hate how POTC is kind of sexist like I now that that happen with slaves but I feel for like ages 3 up is kind of bad like we can hide that from kids forever but I kind of through that how he held underwear yes that was bad but that was two but I love who the change it to where she stands up for woman I love that!?!?
1st