What model do you fly? I delivered the 560 XLS until 2007. This 525 has attenuators, otherwise I would consider blasting the TR's if there was no debris nearby.
I have a cousin that flies right seat on one of the larger Citations. From what she told me one time it seems reversers aren't needed when one of the mains loses its wheels. 😮
I believe the controller instruction "Ops 3 plus one for now hold short Runway 28R" might be an error and should have been "28L", since 28L was actively being used. Fortunately, Ops 3 had good situational awareness and confirmed that they were also to hold short of 28L.
@@jonathanbott87 - Probably gets the most use and therefore is the most likely to get shut down. Finagles Law: The perversity of the universe tends to a maximum.
@@gavinsingh4450 The only time a pilot should say the word "takeoff" is when acknowledging a takeoff clearance (FAA 7110.65 Section 3 para 4-3-1). At all other times, the word should be "departure".
@@gavinsingh4450 Using the word "takeoff" for anything other than reading back that specific clearance sets up the conditions for a Tenerife 2.0. ICAO and FAA (and all other authorities around the world) specifically bar it, in the FAA's case through FAR 7110.65 para 4-3-1. It took a lot of blood to write that law. "Departure" is the legitimate word to use.
Huh, I guess it's a small world after all. I was just at Montgomery Field not that long ago (San Diegan here). Cool to see that my local ATCs are good people :)
"Can you tell me the tail number for the guy that went off the runway?" WHY I DON'T WORK ATC - my response: "Yeah. Sure... it's 116ML. But he should be easy to spot. He's the guy that went off the runway."
Sure, but what if you have a hydraulic issue that results in a brake failure, and you don't find that out until after you've already deployed the thrust reversers.
Couldn't they use runway 5? Also if it was just a foot off the runway couldn't a couple of people push it back. Empty it only weighs like a heavy car and should be light on the nose wheel
They sent the King Air to runway 23, AKA runway 5. Nobody's gonna put his hands on a plane and push. You get sued that way. Your friends can do that, the staff won't. He apparently had flat tires, too.
@@GWNorth-db8vn I meant the pilot and maybe a couple of passengers. Tug might have trouble driving in the grass. Motors in the wheels might be good too
@@DanFrederiksen - It's just not done that way. You don't want people walking around on the field, and there are a lot of places on a plane where pushing on it will cause damage. You hook up a tug to the proper tow point. One person can maneuver a small plane around on flat pavement, but that's a lot different than pushing it out when it's stuck. Humans pushing and lifting is an emergency thing only. Motors on the wheels would mean carrying extra weight that you never use unless things have gone so far sideways that you have other problems anyway.
Cleared to land IS a full stop. You are LANDING. There are a few types of clearances in that sense, touch and go, low approach, stop and go, and full stop. If you are not given "cleared for the option" or "cleared (insert one of those options)", you are expected to complete the landing. Where did you learn your knowledge? I can pull up the FARAIM or 7110.65 reference if you want me to.
@@wingsleveladventures Yeah. Even another pilot questions the full stop access that was announced for the entire airport. So, I am not buying your explanation.
@@DomManInT1Tower usually clears aircraft doing pattern work "for the option" meaning the pilot (or student pilot + instructor or flight examiner) chooses which landing to practice (AIM 4-3-23). Cleared to land is always a full-stop landing. The clarification was provided by tower to mitigate expectation bias as folks flying the pattern were expecting to be cleared for the option as they practiced landings.
@@DomManInT1 It's rather simple, let me explain. "Full stop" means to fully stop, you know, like when you land at an airport you stop at the airport and don't just keep going, because that's what you do when you're "cleared to land." It's unlike "touch and go" where you don't fully stop but you actually touch and then go, like that part where it says "touch and go" and not "full stop" or "cleared to land" because you're not landing and you're not coming to a stop, you're touching and then going. Crazy how that works, I wonder if they did that on purpose or if it just worked out that way.
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One more reason to love the reversers on the Citation I fly.
Jokes aside, good job everybody on a busy situation and a runway closure.
What model do you fly? I delivered the 560 XLS until 2007. This 525 has attenuators, otherwise I would consider blasting the TR's if there was no debris nearby.
@@JSFGuy typed on all 560 family, currently flying XLS+
@VASAviation Great, they are popular.
I have a cousin that flies right seat on one of the larger Citations. From what she told me one time it seems reversers aren't needed when one of the mains loses its wheels. 😮
@@108gk they do provide a little directional control if used single. Things like this happen fast. The 525 does not have TRs.
Hey 184CC that's my student and I!
I believe the controller instruction "Ops 3 plus one for now hold short Runway 28R" might be an error and should have been "28L", since 28L was actively being used. Fortunately, Ops 3 had good situational awareness and confirmed that they were also to hold short of 28L.
Totally agree
Pilot was overly polite in trying to get towed off. Trying to keep it low key haha
He called to see if a tug was coming three times. Must have felt like every eye in the airport was on him.
@@GWNorth-db8vn Looks like 28R is the biggest runway there (is 23 width limited w/ the hash marks on the side?), so not an ideal runway to shutdown.
@@jonathanbott87 - Probably gets the most use and therefore is the most likely to get shut down. Finagles Law: The perversity of the universe tends to a maximum.
@@jonathanbott87 If you look at it again, technically, 28R and 28L are the same length. 28R just has a much larger displacement threshold.
I love the ATC’s way in saying number 1 when clearing 116ML to land
4:05 - Another "ready for takeoff". I wish these people's instructors and ATC would stamp on this, it's a safety-critical issue.
Elaborate.
@@gavinsingh4450 The only time a pilot should say the word "takeoff" is when acknowledging a takeoff clearance (FAA 7110.65 Section 3 para 4-3-1). At all other times, the word should be "departure".
@@gavinsingh4450 Using the word "takeoff" for anything other than reading back that specific clearance sets up the conditions for a Tenerife 2.0. ICAO and FAA (and all other authorities around the world) specifically bar it, in the FAA's case through FAR 7110.65 para 4-3-1. It took a lot of blood to write that law. "Departure" is the legitimate word to use.
@@TevildoTenerife vibes…
Dang good point
"just a foot off, only one foot is all"
Huh, I guess it's a small world after all. I was just at Montgomery Field not that long ago (San Diegan here). Cool to see that my local ATCs are good people :)
"Can you tell me the tail number for the guy that went off the runway?"
WHY I DON'T WORK ATC - my response: "Yeah. Sure... it's 116ML. But he should be easy to spot. He's the guy that went off the runway."
3,300 LDA & owner flown CJ what could go wrong?
Sounds expensive.
Was it really a blown tire situation? It was never mentioned and it would require a runway inspection right away
The pilot who reported this incident to me (not the one on N116ML) said this was a blown tire. She was a witness of the event.
@VASAviation thanks!
ATC said it over the comms on one of the frequencies we were monitoring, it’s the main reason we accepted the runway change
Runway overruns are entirely preventable. Airspeed control, flightpath control, and a willingness to go around if things aren’t working out.
Sure, but what if you have a hydraulic issue that results in a brake failure, and you don't find that out until after you've already deployed the thrust reversers.
Mr Ford??
Isn't this the guy that was racing his buddy?
I know you're not supposed to judge someone by the way they sound on the radio.… but…
Couldn't they use runway 5? Also if it was just a foot off the runway couldn't a couple of people push it back. Empty it only weighs like a heavy car and should be light on the nose wheel
They sent the King Air to runway 23, AKA runway 5. Nobody's gonna put his hands on a plane and push. You get sued that way. Your friends can do that, the staff won't. He apparently had flat tires, too.
@@GWNorth-db8vn Agreed. In addition, You would have non-cleared personnel in the RSA (Runway Safety Area). Big no no.
@@GWNorth-db8vn I meant the pilot and maybe a couple of passengers. Tug might have trouble driving in the grass. Motors in the wheels might be good too
@@DanFrederiksen - It's just not done that way. You don't want people walking around on the field, and there are a lot of places on a plane where pushing on it will cause damage. You hook up a tug to the proper tow point. One person can maneuver a small plane around on flat pavement, but that's a lot different than pushing it out when it's stuck. Humans pushing and lifting is an emergency thing only.
Motors on the wheels would mean carrying extra weight that you never use unless things have gone so far sideways that you have other problems anyway.
San Diegog
Lots of spelling errors again...do you need a proof reader? Just wondering.
I'm*
@@user-jt5vm3mi1w I used to point them out, but gave up already
@@sonickunckle yeah, it's really difficult even with proof-reading. Someone always misses any typo.
The spelling errors don't bother me. It's the blatantly incorrect transcriptions in a ton of his videos.
Gotta be honest, even an AI would catch these (though don't trust them to fix it, of course).
Spell check is your friend my friend
There should be a comma "," between 'friend' and 'my' to separate the main sentence from the addressee.
@@VASAviationTouché
@@VASAviationlove these videos as a student (and Checkride soon). Keep em coming!
@@islandwatch Go for it!! Good luck!
@@islandwatch Blue skies and favourable winds! You'll have a licence to learn before you know it.
Very silly
Cleared to land is not full stop. Where were these ATCs trained? FAA? Walmart?
Cleared to land IS a full stop. You are LANDING. There are a few types of clearances in that sense, touch and go, low approach, stop and go, and full stop. If you are not given "cleared for the option" or "cleared (insert one of those options)", you are expected to complete the landing. Where did you learn your knowledge? I can pull up the FARAIM or 7110.65 reference if you want me to.
@@wingsleveladventures Yeah. Even another pilot questions the full stop access that was announced for the entire airport. So, I am not buying your explanation.
Cleared to land is indeed a "full stop" instruction.
@@DomManInT1Tower usually clears aircraft doing pattern work "for the option" meaning the pilot (or student pilot + instructor or flight examiner) chooses which landing to practice (AIM 4-3-23). Cleared to land is always a full-stop landing. The clarification was provided by tower to mitigate expectation bias as folks flying the pattern were expecting to be cleared for the option as they practiced landings.
@@DomManInT1 It's rather simple, let me explain. "Full stop" means to fully stop, you know, like when you land at an airport you stop at the airport and don't just keep going, because that's what you do when you're "cleared to land." It's unlike "touch and go" where you don't fully stop but you actually touch and then go, like that part where it says "touch and go" and not "full stop" or "cleared to land" because you're not landing and you're not coming to a stop, you're touching and then going. Crazy how that works, I wonder if they did that on purpose or if it just worked out that way.