A Tale of Two Streetcar Cities
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- Опубликовано: 21 апр 2023
- American cities are often criticized for their terrible public transportation. Meanwhile, Japanese cities are praised for their phenomenal trains. And in many cases, these assessments are very fair. But it can also lead to the mistaken assumption that the two places were never alike.
In this video, we look at Chicago and Tokyo. We cover a brief history of their respective streetcar (trolley/tram) networks, and what led to their demise. Then we take a closer look at the two remaining trams in Tokyo, the Toden Arakawa Line (Tokyo Sakura Tram) and the Tokyu Setagaya Line.
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The fact American cities all had streetcar systems is even referenced in Nacrene City in Pokémon Black/White, which is based off the NYC metro (Nacrene City specifically in Brooklyn). The games also reference the NYC subway as the Battle Subway. Watching this, I'm glad Pyongyang still has functioning trams. Even better, ones that were made in the former Czechoslovakia
Pyongyang streetcars still going strong yay.
Czechoslovakia doesn't exist anymore. It is the Czech Republic and Slovakia.
@@jacktattersall9457 I said Czechoslovakia as that was what the country was called when they made our trams. And it still exists in our hearts
@@SupremeLeaderKimJong-un Okay. Now about your human rights record. Because good cities and transit systems put human rights and democracy first.
You have to visit The Illinois Railway Museum in Union Ill if you want to see some great running examples of Chicago transit and interurban equipment.
I went there last summer and I was totally blown away by everything that's there!
The South Chicago branch of the Metra Electric district should be turned into a CTA line then extended North to Ave via Tunnel and in the Median of Lake Shore Drive
It's nice that a neighborhood/ward like Setagaya has their own special tram to connect them to the rest of the city. It's especially nice for convenience to still have it. The streetcars are part of Tokyo's heritage, and says a lot about how functional it is if it's still in use today. Tokyo may be famous for its commuter lines and huge subway, but there's nothing wrong with having another form of transit to complement them.
Tokyo is a true multimodal city! Add to the list rubber-tired people movers, water buses, and a host of local ward-run bus operators.
Even lots of european cities got rid of their trams to make place for cars and sent people to the metro/underground/subway.
For example, in my city, Barcelona, we used one of the most important tram networks in Europe, as the subway was not really extended yet. I think it was on the 60s-70s we got rid of it and in 2004 we built a new tram, but one of the modern ones with high capacity and separate operarion, not the historic 1-carriage trams running on the same lanes as cars.
Only 1 line of those lasts to this day, and it's been closed for 5 years for "renovation"...
I was very confused by the title as steetcars don't really come to mind when thinking of either city (although the L and streetcars did compete in most places in Chicago-that I had already learned), so learning that Tokyo still had streetcars was an interesting plot twist
Tokyo might've have more "trams" than we think, but the lines were...not exactly "trams". Lines like Keio Line and Keikyu lines all started as interurbans that pretty much likes their U.S.counterparts, but they were gradually updated to metro-like high-capacity lines we see today. Just like dinosaurs. Some went extinct, while some evolved into birds that fly high up in the sky.
Interesting. In Copenhagen where I'm from we used to have one of the largest tram networks in all of Europe with 107 kilometers of track and 20 lines at its peak. However in the 50's and 60's cars became ever more prominent and began clogging up the streets. At first the city bought 100 brand new trams from Germany with options for at least 100 more, however it was shortly after decided to began dismantling large chunks of the network. The original idea was to keep the 6 most important and heavily used lines around (probably Lines 2, 5, 6, 7, 10, & 16), until they could be replaced by new underground subway lines.
However no subway lines were built and the controversial mayor Urban Hansen decided to dismantle the remaining network and replace it all by buses. He was more keen on an ambitious and very controversial set of American inspired highway plans for the city that would've disrupted several neighborhoods. The planned timeline here was that the last tram would run in 1975, but Urban Hansen rushed it so the last tram line, Line 5, closed in 1972, just one year before the oil crisis. All the 100 brand new trams were sold at Scrap Value to Alexandria in Egypt as third world aid, where they still run to this day. The highway plans thankfully never materialised.
As for subways we wouldn't get any until 2002 when our automated light metro system, the Copenhagen metro, opened its first 2 lines. None of them directly replacing any former tram lines. This continues to be the case with Lines M3 and M4, and the proposed new M5 line, all of which are more focused on serving new developments, whose landsales help fund the metro.
Today the buses are quite neglected in Copenhagen, and the City's busiest line is the 5C bus. This bus almost directly follows the old line 5 tram and before covid had over 17 million passengers per year, or around 50k annual passenger trips! Its infamously slow and gets caught in congestion a lot! Residents in the Brønshøj neighborhood served by the bus are especially unhappy as they've been promised subway lines time and time again since the 1930's and never gotten anything. The whole area is also full of single family homes just beyond the main street the trams ran on. A few years ago there was a proposal for light rail on the old tram corridor in the northwest of the city, and it even received statefunding which is very rare for projects here! But the city rejected it on the spot with some right wing politicians from both conservative and liberal parties directly comparing tram tracks to the Berlin Wall!
Now new studies are under way, with both Light rail and BRT as possibilities, with BRT being the much favoured option. Largely because it keeps the pipe dream alive of saying "With BRT we can have a stop gap until we build a metro to Brønshøj", when its very clear that this neighborhood needs a lot more than just BRT. The current 5C bus is already a very lame BRT-lite service more akin to Chicagos Pulse bus, which itself was touted as a suitable replacement for light rail when it opened in 2017.
At least it ain't all over for trams in Copenhagen. A new circumferential light rail line is being built out in the suburbs along a circumferential stroad. This line will finally provide rapid transit across the arterials in Copenhagens suburbs with trams every 5 minutes that'll be at least 15 minutes faster than the current buses. Opening in 2025 if all goes according to plan. I just hope it won't be the only tram
Fascinating! I’d always wondered why Copenhagen had such little and new urban transport compared to most European cities. Denmark’s rail network is also only recently catching up, right?
Glad at least people are catching up with the times! I do love the Copenhagen metro.
@@Thom-TRA Yeah, Denmarks rail network has been slacking. In many cases it until recently wasn't changed at all since the 1970's. But the mainlines are being electrified and upgraded to 125mph. It also doesn't help that until 1997, all intercity trains between eastern and western Denmark had to go on a ferry. On top of that, we didn't have a single electrified mainline until 1986, and in the late 90's, the electrification program was halted by the politicians as they believed newer more efficient diesel trains would offset any climate benefit by electric traction... and thats how we got the infamous IC4 trains by Ansaldo Breda.
Plus the political parties here in Denmark aren't as keen on public transit and railways as in many other countries. Recently the new centrist government cancelled a proposed short HSR line that would cross a Fjord and reduce journey times drastically at a price tag of 2 billion dollars. All due to a few nimbys complaining about their property values dropping as a result of the proposed rail line. And the last few governments have pulled the brakes on much of the new 2nd gen electrification program. Particularly on secondary routes, as they're now gawking at battery trains and Hydrogen & Methanol with their whole Power to X/P2X Macguffin idea.
And if you're curious, the politicians here are still pouring more into highways and domestic air travel than into public transit, even now that much rural transit here is in an exitensial crisis akin to America in the 1950's. The current minister for transport simply doesn't care.
Tramlines are like Berlin wall but the highways they would have built bulldozing neighborhoods were ok. In the US we can still see the poorer or minority neighborhoods that were bulldozed and built up as highways, literally racism in concrete
@@davidemmyg Yeah. Meanwhile here in Copenhagen the Conservative party is going all in on Metro, but thats because 1. the Metro is spanking clean, 2. it has that techbro vibe we see with hyperloop and such, and 3. Because theyre complaining about stuff as minute as bus lanes and even bus stops and want them removed from the streets to make way for more parking and more lanes for car traffic.
@DrDewott Very insightful! I spent a year in Denmark (Roskilde) as an exchange student back in 1998, and I though the public transport was excellent both around the country and in Copenhagen. I found it clean, reliable and easy to use. But then, coming from Australia, pretty much anywhere in Europe has better public transport than back home. I never got the chance to ride the metro as it didn't open until after I left, but I did find inter-urban trains (copenhagen to odense for example) to be fast and comfortable. The S-train in Copenhagen was awesome and even local bus services were great in Roskilde. Plus, I could ride my bike pretty much anywhere on good bike lanes so that was great as well. Bike lanes in Australia are few and far between and normally place you in between parked cars and running traffic.
Yup, although US cities have built new light-rail systems, seeing the decline of huge streetcar systems in favor of automobiles hurts. Hudson County in NJ once had an impressive system called the North Hudson County Railway. The North Hudson County Railway was a complex streetcar network that connected Journal Square in Jersey City, Hoboken, Weehawken, and Union City (which the Hudson-Bergen Light Rail tries to accomplish today; minus Journal Square). However, a portion of Hudson County is a line of pretty steep cliffs that makes up part of the Hudson Palisades. So how did they get the streetcars down these dangerous cliffs to low-lying Hoboken and Weehawken by the Hudson River? With everything from a huge and long elevated trestle, funicular wagon lifts, and an elevator! Tackling the cliffs this way was an engineering feat, especially for the time.
Sadly, all good things must come to an end, and these lines were abandoned by the 1940s. However, there are still remnants of this streetcar feat, like two former trolley buildings next to the Supremo market on Palisade Ave in Jersey City (one of them is a doctor's office I had to go to...boy do I wish it was still a trolley house), and leftover trolley tracks on Hudson Place in Hoboken next door to Hoboken Terminal.
"It's a bit of a running joke that if you are fast enough you can out jog it" Was that pun intended? Great video, I love these history ones. Sad how so many streetcar lines in America got destroyed because of cars becoming the "best" mode of transport. Car dependancy has never had anything good come from it, only bad :(
It was intentional, glad you caught it! And totally agree with you
There's a third option for streetcar cities too: slowly letting them deteriorate without modernising them. We kept our trams here in Toronto, but despite high ridership and decent coverage the system has a lot of shortcomings. We failed to modernise our network to match tram networks in most European cities. Our streetcars have very low average speeds due to tight stop spacing and street running operations on most lines. There's a lot of potential for improvement if we could just undertake some simple reforms.
Toronto is great because at least the tracks are still there. But yeah, Canadian transit policy looks like it was barely any different than American.
@@Thom-TRA I'd argue against your last point. For a given metro area, Canadian cities have on avg. 3x more transit ridership/capita. There are many reasons for this: better bus networks, much higher frequencies and better service on rail networks, funding being more reliant on fares. As well, car ownership is more expensive and there's no comparable interstate program in Canada.
The busiest light rail system in the Americas? The Toronto streetcar. Yeah it's slow, but frequencies are good enough that if you miss one you can see the next tram down the road. Rapid transit systems in Vancouver, Montreal, Ottawa, Calgary etc. handily beat their population equivalents in the US, and usually with smaller networks too. Despite some sucky policy decisions occasionally, I'd say ridership is closer to some European cities than the US.
@@chloetangpongprush3519 yes, but how recent are these developments? And the size of networks still doesn’t compare to similar cities worldwide. Not to mention congested highways like the 401, where government policy has definitely gravitated towards for a long time.
I’m not saying it’s not better than the US. I’m just saying it took Canada a long time to realize the value of public transit, not as long as the US but longer than many other places. It’s in a way similar to countries like Spain and Denmark.
@@Thom-TRA I will add circumstances (and that cities usually legally can't run deficits) probably drove Canadian cities to push more efficient public transport options earlier than in the US.
@@Thom-TRA you are correct, policy was heading in the wrong direction for a very long time before taking a U-turn recently. We've had less to fall, however, and I'm glad Toronto now has the largest transit expansion program on the continent.
Funny, Tokyo's trams had a similar fate to Portugal's. The 28E tram is now a tourist "trap" and other 5 lines but one use exclusively historic rolling stock
I absolutely love the trams in Portugal
@@Thom-TRA we are getting new trams for the 15E, a narrow gauge version of the CAF Urbos!
When you interject humor, you always catch me off guard ( 'my worst nightmares... avoid like plague...'). Thanks for a Saturday smile, and your always masterful videos Thom.
I really dislike that bus route. Shame because it’s the closest one to my home…
This has happend in many cities around the world. Switzerland used to have more than twenty tram company's running over seventeen networks. How many do still exist? Five company's running over four networks. The network in Basel has two operators BVB and BLT and if i wouldn't have told you, you would have thought about a football club and a burger.
The football and burger thing made me laugh 😂
@@Thom-TRA even Basel lost many routes all international tram routes where closed in the 70‘s and 80‘s except of the short section of line 10 which runs in France but this is technically a railway that got converted to a tram line in 1986. The line to Rodersdorf always reminds me of the pink line to 54/Cermak of CTA because it has a lot of level crossing‘s with gates. The line to Rodersdorf used to have unsecured railway crossing’s till 2015 that’s why BLT trams have horn’s.
Switzerland has a lot less inhabitants than my (European) country and we also have four cities with a tram network, three had it since the horse tram and one has two tram lines since the seventies and one extra since 5 years or so. And we have a city with trolleybus lines. That’s all. We used to have regional tram lines also (from private companies) and more cities with tram lines, but all ceased to exist after the car and bus became common items of transportation in the fifties and sixties.
Very interesting discourse about street based transit (and metropolitan railways) in both Tokyo and Chicago. Lucid picks up on the Court challenge to the motor vehicle industry that caused a pause in streetcar destruction.
I was thrilled to see vision of two ex-Melbourne cars in Memphis in your presentation. Be sure to check out the historic cars from a number of different cities when you do your San Francisco trip in a few weeks time. There is at least one Melbourne Car amongst the collection. Seattle has several Melbourne cars on its waterfront streetcar route too.
While greatly modernised in recent times, Melbourne still has historic cars on a circular route around the downtown area. Back in the late 1980's, the Melbourne system was extended to take over two former suburban rail lines, including the first to be built. It is now the largest streetcar system in the southern hemisphere. Cheers from Melbourne.🙂🙂🙂
Oh the fun I would have making videos if I ever did another Melbourne trip! Last time I was there I was 6 years old 😂
I think a good third example would have been a city like Berlin, Munich or Paris. Large cities which built subway systems, but still feature trams as relevant parts of their transit. The reasons why they were kept were quite different, but but especially Paris shows you can build it from scratch again, if deemed necessary. In the end you’ll never be able to serve the entire city with subways, so having trams for important short and medium distances seems quite useful.
They’re cheaper to operate then busses, especially given the capacity, while giving a higher lever of ride quality and very importantly, people like them. It has been shown, lines converted from bus to tram show a significant rise in ridership, often doubling in a few years, just because people perceive trams as more reliable and faster. It’s also an important statement of permanence, the tram route isn’t going to be changed over night, they are basically only changed in big city development projects over the span of years. Their inflexibility is actually a strength in terms of planning around them.
I'm a bit surprised that you included clips of Memphis considering that our trolley system currently only operates less than 2 miles of track and is less than 30 years old.
But it uses old trolleys which are much older, and it's the vehicles I wanted footage of
FWIW I met Joe L. Diaz on the 'L' once years ago. When the video mentioned current CTA bus routes having the same numbers as former streetcar lines I thought of a great book "The Chicago Surface Lines" by Alan R. Lind.
Thanks for the video. Have ridden both Tokyo lines. Nice to see some footage of ex-Melbourne W class trams, my home town, which still has trams and is understood to have the largest tram/streetcar/light rail system in the world.
What a journey that must have been, from Melbourne to Memphis!
One thing I can't help to notice is that most of the modernized, metro-like private railways in Tokyo Metropolitian were trams or interurbans at the start, using tram-like vehicles and at-grade and even street-running routes. And due to increased ridership the lines were gradually grade-separated, double-tracked and started to use larger vehicles.
The reason behind the different choices Japan and America made, I guess, is the era when private cars gained popularity. Automobiles were popular in the United States before streetcars and interurbans have the time to upgrade themselves, and thus being easier to outrun public transports, which in return gave the car-owners rightful exuses to occupy rooms of streetcars for roads and highways, which makes the public transport loses even more. The snowball effect was formed, that eventually crushed the streetcar systems (and public transportations in the car-centric cities).
In contrary, when private cars became affordable in Japan, it's already in the '60s and what we had were fast, high-capacity urban railroad lines that fears little competition from road traffics. As a result private cars never completely defeat rails (at least in cities) and the railways always have enough riderships and incomes that support their motivation to improve, which is a positive cycle.
Hi Thom again a very informative & in-depth presentation- I recall when I first went to Chicago, in 1980 on a 6-week organised tour of the US. We arrived from San Francisco in mid-December to a very cold & windy Chicago (having traveled from a very hot Sydney Australia). I was amazed at the 8 lanes of the highway with cars streaming ever so slowly. The traffic was so bad on our bus trip to the various sights around the city, that the bus driver suggested it would be best if we got off & walked to our hotel as the traffic was not going to move for some time. Some 40 years later it would appear not much has changed, except that the car traffic has become worse! An efficient & effective transit system is vital for all cities & towns to thrive - hopefully, we have learned from the mistakes of the past - hopefully!
8:50 when you posed the question why was there a tram in a residential neighborhood, I thought you were gonna dive into the utilities of providing such a service, since i feel like you've already explained that the street car lines in Tokyo were all remnants of a bygone era.
otherwise great video! I'll be visiting Tokyo next month so for sure I'll be checking out the street cars!
That question was to ask why of all lines this one survived
Thanks for the informative video Thom! I never knew Chicago had streetcars until the 1950's! I knew about the Tokyo Sakura Tram but not the Setagaya Line! We have 7 operating tramways in the UK. South London's Tramlink is the closest to me but I've ridden all 7 🙂
I’d love to ride the double deckers in Blackpool someday! Good for you for riding all of them! Any new goals to complete?
Saw the cute streetcars on the Toden Arakawa line from a taxi from my Airbnb to an eel restaurant in Asakusa (I took it because an incident on the Asakusa Line was causing major delays to my schedule).
A couple of key tidbits regarding the abandonment of streetcars in Chicago. One was economic. Chicago streets were largely brick paved. Maintenance was by the streetcar company, which also had to plow the snow, having an easement. By paving over these streets with asphalt, it both saved the city money on initial infrastructure "improvements", and freed up the transit service's budget for ongoing maintenance which would be taken over by the city.
Additionally, the cost savings of wire maintenance was seen as a good thing.
Particularly to CTA ultimately abandoning streetcars, though, was the Englewood accident, in which a streetcar crashed with a gasoline truck. The resulting fire killed most, if not all, passengers; many of whose charred bodies were found near the exit doors, as they gad attempted escape. This was a final determinator for then CTA President George Krambles. Though the inflexibility of streetcars in getting around cars and road blockages of a growing post war car culture, at the time, was another key factor.
As was suburbanization. People simply wanted to get away from the city and what was often considered gritty transit systems. Housing subsidies offered by the G.I. bill, along the the Eisenhower led investment in expanding interstate highways facilitated such, with the promise of open space and fresh air, rather than reinvesting in already crowded cities.
Ironically, a couple of other things which facilitied the breakdown of Chicago's streetcar system was the CTA and expansion on the L. In the former case, since CTA conjoined the L company (Chicago Rapid Transit) with the streetcars (Chicago Surface Lines, which also gad buses on outlying routes) and, ultimately, the double decker buses (Chicago Motor Coach, operating many if the "100" routes, now express buses, along the lake shore), CTA had reason to ration services which had competed with each other. Many L stops were discontinued, as they originally served as a competitive system with streetcars. And a hub and spoke system was instituted, especially with L expansion from the 50s through 70s (and even 90s with the Orange Line), redirecting old streetcar/now bus (or for awile ETB) routes to funnel to the L. This was how the major "transit centers" came to be built.
The new "bilevel" commuter cars, which are often compained about today, were so innovative and clean/fresh at the time of their introduction that they seriously contributed to the economic downfall of the interurban lines, which were a competitor to the Chicago and Northwestern Railroad which had introduced these cars. Why take the old electric to work when you could ride in style?
But, as you note, the historic Chicago area infrastructure in both what is good and bad about the system. On the one hand, it's here and had not been destroyed like in so many cities. On the other hand, it's here and expensive to maintain. Whereas other American cities can reinvent as they attempt to renew what was lost, the Chicago (or New York, similarly) system has to work within the confines of what it has. Change, even it it's ultimately for the better, is expensive and hard.
Awesome facts my guy and I saw some clips of the advantage trolleys of my hometown Memphis Tennessee
Yep Memphis is one of the best places to see old trolleys!
@@Thom-TRA they definitely are “MATA” the cities transit system in few years those advantage trolleys are about to be replaced from 1993-present.
I certainly enjoyed this and I definitely learned something new!!! Thank you!!!👍🚝👍
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@Thom-TRA And I love that you speak other languages in your videos and I’m impressed that you know other languages. Press on and continue!!! We got your back!!! 😄
3:56 It is not just a conspiracy theory. "the Federal District Court of Southern California, which in 1947 indicted nine corporations and seven individuals on counts of “conspiring to acquire control of a number of transit companies, forming a transportation monopoly” and “conspiring to monopolise sales of buses and supplies to companies owned by National City Lines” in violation of the 1890 Sherman Antitrust Act. The conviction came in 1949, with GM, Firestone, Standard Oil of California, Phillips Petroleum, and Mack Trucks found guilty and subsequently slapped on the wrists. (GM paid a fine of $5,000.)" GM and others are not solely responsible for the decline of trams, but they did intend to capitalize on the few dying trams left.
Thanks for providing this information!
@@Thom-TRA If you or anyone else would like to read more you can copy paste the quoted part into Google and find a Guardian article. I can't paste the link on RUclips because it'll flag my comment as spam.
You should go to Toronto. A similar sized city to Chicago. Unlike Chicago, they were able to preserve their streetcar system because of the public outcry in the 1970s.
I went a long time ago but couldn’t ride them that time. Would love to go back!
Toronto's transit system is pretty damn good. Although you would never know it by listening to the media. It does have a funding problem. In that it is expected to get nearly 50 percent of its funding from the fair box. Something unheard of in large cities. (Toronto is the 4th largest city in North America. After New York, LA and Mexico City ) Our streetcar system is actually being expanded on. With the Waterfront East LRT in the planning stages now. And 2 major LRT style lines nearing completion. This might sound confusing. Because it is.. but Toronto has an LRT network and a legacy streetcar network which has LRT sections connected to the conventional system. The new LRT lines use standard gauge tracks and are not part of the legacy system. Which uses a wider gauge. (Confusing, yes)
Very informative and well done and I second your theory that big biz used their influence to replace clean trollies with diesel fumes from buses .
Very similar situation here in Cincinnati. We had 222 miles in our streetcar system. We now have a 3.8 miles loop downtown, but that was built in 2015
That one is called the Bell Connector right?
@@Thom-TRA it used to be when Cincinnati Bell owned the naming rights. Now it’s just the connector, but it’s free now! Also I love the channel, my new favorite place on RUclips 😁
What an absolute honor!
I was wondering if you are aware of the most disastrous trolley accident that occurred in Chicago, May 23, 1950...63rd and State street to this day has open lots from the fire which spread from the fuel truck the trolley hit. Thirty four on the trolley died, the combination of inward opening doors and windows with bars precluded many from escaping. To this day I beg the San Francisco MUNI system to remove those bars still on their historic fleet. Wikipedia has much more on this accident. I so believe Chicago knew they had to give up the PCC's from that accident...BTW an update of this story would be awesome being you are in that area !
Great video! I do feel like there's a sequel to be made here looking at how the two cities have a shared history with interurbans.
Chicago actually beat Tokyo in terms of thru-running, people could take trains from Milwaukee through to the Loop. And the length of streetcars is why the L's turns, including on the Loop are so tight.
It would be cool to contrast as Chicago was winding down their interurbans and starting to close off the L from mainline rail, Tokyo was replacing streetcars with subways connected to mainline rail.
Just a suggestion! Keep up the great work.
I wouldn’t say Chicago beat Tokyo in through-running, because Tokyo does and did it on a much larger scale. The first inter urban through running was in 1904, and after a brief pause from 1911 to 1925, it was reintroduced.
I rode it! It was right by my hotel so obviously I had to try it 🙂Great video, especially the clip at the start lol. Really well edited mate
The clip at the start came from someone extremely skilled. I think you’d like them.
Impeccable video! Thank you.
Thanks!
Great video!
Another great video!!!
I hope you get to attend some CERA meetings or the Hoosier Traction Meet, at some point, just to take a deeper dive into the history of streetcars and interurbans; often with presentations from people who experienced it firsthand.
That sounds really cool! Thanks for the suggestion
Thanks. I think will go check the tram lines tomorrow!
Let me know how it goes!
@@Thom-TRA I enjoyed the ride. I only rode the Toden Arakawa line from Michiya to Waseda. Didn’t expect trams to be so small. My tram was mostly full, I think they could really invest in doubling the length of trams…
Have you visited the Fox River Trolly Museum in Elgin? I remember there used to be tracks all up and down the Fox River towns.
I have not visited them yet!
If you're interested in the role of GM, Firestone and Standard Oil you should read the Snell report by Bradford Snell to the Senate Judiciary Committee. Moving Millions, the book, also is an interesting read. Before I got cancer I was working on a book on public transit (working title...Public Transit from the Underside...I was just a trolley operator so the book would be from a driver's perspective).
Thanks for the recommendations! Hope you are doing as well as you can. I bet you have some amazing stories as an operator.
@@Thom-TRA I'm Canadian but I can recommend publications from your Transportation Research Board in Washington. Also if you're interested search "Dewired Andy Hyslop" for an artcile I wrote for the trade publication, Mass Transit.
Snell's testimony is interesting only for creating an fake bogeyman who allegedly killed America's streetcar systems. His testimony was instantly discredited by transportation experts, and has since been entirely debunked. As partly stated in the video, streetcar companies were in a death spiral starting in the 1920's first with the inviolable nickel fare being erased by post World War I inflation, the explosion in car ownership after introduction of the Model T, and having to maintain the streets they shared with the traffic that ruined their schedules. Public policy supported the auto at every level, with the final nail in traction's coffin being the well intentioned Public Holding Company Act of 1935. Intended to bring electric power trusts under control, it forced those that owned systems to sell them. They soon folded, having being kept afloat by low cost power and profits from electrical generation. National Cities bears no responsibility for loss of streetcars. As they never owned more than 10% of streetcar companies, their only crime was taking advantage of a crisis created by government policy. www.vox.com/2015/5/7/8562007/streetcar-history-demise
Hopefully you can recover from your cancer
If you ever have a chance, visit downtown Memphis! I wouldn't recommend an extended stay (the crime is way worse than Chicago, and the downtown area has even been getting bad), but they have 3 street car line - one that runs up and down main street, one that runs along the river front, and one that runs from downtown to the medical district. It's around $1 per ride, and it's pretty cool to see the street cars. It's the only decent public transportation in Memphis since it doesn't share a street with cars and it runs on a track with overhead lines.
Some of the clips in this video were from Memphis!
You have got to ride the Utsunomiya lrt streetcar.Its the most lastest streetcar system in japan, it was built last year.
Love the design of the Light line vehicles.
Great video and where did you take the trolley videos?
In Memphis and Boston!
@@Thom-TRA cool thanks
It is worth noting that the North Shore Line, particularly the Skokie Valley Route, directly inspired the Japanese high speed railway network.
I’ve never heard that before
Those remnant lines in Tokyo are pretty neat.
The loss of streetcars in Chicago is extra frustrating because the CTA still uses the exact same routes, even when demand no longer matches up. For instance, the Armitage #73 ends at an old trolley turn around even though there's now tremendous demand west of that stop. No need to keep using the path the tracks had if you have tires and streets! Same for the eastern end of the #74 Fullerton bus - the trolley made a loop along Lincoln and Halsted to turn around before heading west. No need for that now, but the bus still follows the same route. Wouldn't it be nice to have a bus that ran all the way to the Lake instead of taking a circuitous loop a mile short of the shore?
And the bus drivers pay no attention at the loop. The number of times I’ve been passed or they haven’t let me off.
@@Thom-TRA So even if it's useful it's not reliable =[
good content, i subscribed. i live in brooklyn and either bike or use the subway - no need for a car. i moved from new orleans, which is very bike friendly.
Thanks for subbing!
New Orleans is bike friendly?? 🤨
Your street car system ended around the same year as ours did in N.Y.C. in 1957
London is another famous example of trams being replaced with buses, since in the 1900s, they switched from trams to trolleybuses to diesel buses, each time believing that the new mode of transit was better and more flexible. Then, more recently, they created the London Trams system in the south of London, bringing trams (or rather light rail) back to the city after a long time. I find it interesting how so many places around the world (especially economically developed cities) all followed a similar cycle of having trams, getting rid of them, and then wanting them back... what would things look like if they never got rid of the trams in the first place?
That’s a great question… I’m sure there’s a few cities around the world that could serve as an example. Sounds like a fun research idea.
Lake Shore Drive should have a Light Metro, essentally heavy rail vehicle running in a median in a roadway.
Great video! Streetcars would be such a great asset to the city if we kept them.
Their capacity is just better than Chicago and it’s easier to speed them up
Great video 😃👍
Thank you!
@@Thom-TRA you are welcome 😁
Love the ⚡ strike.
Thanks! Lucky shot
4:20 reminds me of the ghost metra cars in Southern California. IDK if you heard about it
I have heard about them! These are in the Chicago area. I’ll release my full video about them soon.
@@Thom-TRA my heart breaks on the fact that no one seems to care about them or try to restore them
Streetcars/above traffic sharing vehicles have got to be one of the worst forms of public transit. They have issues wtih bad people blocking them and have little ability to respond and punish those individuals.
Hearing that in charlotte where there is a street car, morons with oversized trucks will park on the tracks to run into a store. This becomes a massive problem for the network, the riders, and overall operation. On top of that these vehicles tend to be tiny compared to buses (which can be prioritized by lane, and navigate through traffic easier)
Seems like you have had a pretty interesting life I must say. You are dutch, have apparently lived most of your life in japan, and now live in Chicago? that's pretty cool.
Yeah I’m definitely blessed. Thanks for paying attention and asking, that means a lot to me.
@@Thom-TRA I’ve often wondered about this. You speak very good American English, and had “huh?” moment when I saw you were from NL. Imagine my jaw drop when I saw this video with you speaking very good Japanese pronunciation and hearing you grew up there.
Any other surprises?
@@sbossinger conversational German and French i guess haha
@@Thom-TRA Genau! Ich kann deutsch, leider nicht französisch.
I had expected a comparison between LA and Toronto, or maybe Melbourne.
I must say that I am much more interested in Japan transit topics than Chicago transit topics.
I must say that I offer a selection of both on this channel, since I used to live in one and now live in the other
The sad thing is, Chicago has much better transit than most places in US.
Boston, San Francisco, DC are in the same league.
Only NYC has 'European' level transit.
In most of the US a car (plus gas, insurance, maint., repairs) is a necessity.
Thanks for sharing. It's sad to see the U.S. be so far behind and favor the profits of a few industries over the common good and the environment. I think it will have to change though.
Great video! Tbh you missed the fact that San Francisco still had vintage street cars that run alone the embarcadero!
That would be the Muni ‘F’ Line. It runs along Market Street from The Castro to the Embarcadero. The restored classic streetcars are like a living transit museum. Thanks for mentioning it, @Timberho! And of course, when in San Francisco, one must ride the classic Cable Cars at least once.
@TenMinuteTrips yea they do! I've rode on them the last time I was in San Francisco a few years ago me and my aunt did a day trip using only public transportation and it was really fun!
Well, heck, New Orleans still has the St Charles line (a nice tour of the Garden District, btw)
I’m going to San Francisco for the first time in a few weeks!!!
Also I wanted to highlight cities that completely or almost got rid of everything.
@Trains Are Awesome nice! You'll love it! If you want some dining ideas or what you need to see you can ask me!
ARRRRGGGGHHHHHH!!! How are we going to build streetcars in Chicago now?
and what kind of streetcar would you like to see in Chicago? Brookville Liberty? Alstom Citadis? Bombardier Flexity? Or maybe something else?
Maybe even a heritage streetcar!
Thanks for the video. Yes I am sure Tokyo’s transit system beats any American system. However you should not knock Chicagos combination of subway, elevated, commuter trains and the bus system. I have visited the Chicago area many times and have never rented a car while I was there. I even visited some suburban areas but found I usually could get there by using a combination of the various forms of available public transit. In most cases it was relatively easy to use but it could be better with a unified fare system and better coordination of services between modes of transit. Trolley or light rail always work best when it runs on its own right of way. City street service speed would be about the same weather using busses or rail because the both could be caught up in traffic.
I live in Chicago and I’m sorry, but visiting is not the same as living here. The commuter rail hasn’t changed significantly since the 1950s and is a nightmare to navigate. The elevated rail is dirty and extremely unreliable. The amount of times I have had to wait upwards of half an hour because an operator did not show up for their shift. The L is good for one thing and one thing only: getting people to the Loop. And the loop sees only tourists these days.
As for walking: except for a few gentrified areas, cars have the priority everywhere. There are few quiet places where children can actually play outside. There are so many fatalities every year and our downtown streets are clogged up even on Sundays.
So no, Chicago is not this urban paradise that many Americans claim it is. In fact, its ranking among other US cities should act as a searing indictment to the USA, and not any sort of endorsement of the terrible policies that continue to be implemented here.
In Chicagos defense, because I realize I came across a bit harsh in my last comment, a lot of the bad policy comes from the state and not the city.
Hey the 66 Chicago is the most filmed and photographed bus line
I didn’t know that!
by building and maintaining roads/streets/highways, the auto industry has the biggest government subsidy!
3:38 as an aussie I claim that one, its ours
Sad but true!
Route 74 fucking sucks, I've missed shows because of hour long waits for that line. Also, where is that abandoned metra car? That looks really cool
The car is in Bensenville! I’ll be uploading a full video soon. And yeah, let’s be co-presidents of the anti-74 club. They need to get it together on that route.
Also in world war 2, massive amounts of Tokyo were bombed by the usa, including many parts of the streetcar system.
To me it seems like a huge issue is that the streetcars are running on public right of way. That makes it harder to adopt private ownership of the rail infrastructure as is common in Japan. It may not have been a huge issue before automobiles became widespread, but it quickly became an unattractive proposition to run streetcars in mixed traffic. Also, what is the difference between streetcars and heavy rail that is at street-level? The only difference I see is that heavy rail has much higher capacity, and it can connect to above ground or underground lines. Let me know the benefits of streetcars over street-level heavy rail.
Lake Shore Drive should have a Light Metro, essentally heavy rail vehicle running in a median in a roadway.
Tbh a lot of Tokyo’s streetcar network was destroyed by both Kanto Earthquake and WW2 and they were replaced by metro lines instead
The earthquake part is just false, sorry. The earthquake happened in 1923 and the first fragment of the subway didn’t open until 1927. It took decades for the network to expand, and the streetcars ran until well after the war.
Very interesting and for the CTA they should have copied Boston San Francisco and Philadelphia by keeping the PCCs and then replace them in the 1970s and 1980s with newer ones. Last part order ADA complaiant Trams in the 1990s. For Boston these were 1986-1988 Type 7s rebuilt in the 1990s with ADA compliance in addition to the 1990s order and then Type 8s 1999-2007 which replaced 1970s Boeing Vertol Trams & 2019-2020 Type 9s CAF Urbos. In the case of Type 9s in Boston they are never used on street running sections due to a missing stop sign. For Philly PCC replaced by Kawasaki which is then replaced by an Alstom Citadis. San Francisco PCC replaced by Boeing Vertol 1970s 1990s-2000s Breda LRV and 2010s Siemens LRV. I wonder what's the reason why the Japanese Tokyo Tram lines didn't buy off-the-shelf Trams from European manufacturers even though they could have simply done that just like how the US Tram networks in Boston San Francisco and Philadelphia did
I do love the green line in Boston, and I’m very excited to go to San Francisco for the first time in a few weeks!
Boston, Philadelphia, and San Fran’s systems all have something in common though: tunnels. They were forced to keep at least some trolleys or else squander the valuable tunnels.
Same is happening in Rotterdam The Netherlands. Removing trams and replace them with busses or even nothing. People are not happy with these plans are now in protest to keep the classic tramlines in the city.
I love the RET. We need to keep as much as possible! And please, build a branch line from Lijn E to the airport!
8:44 Was that an intentional pun? Or Accidental?
The running joke? Very intentional haha
Chicago is NOWHERE near the most car centric city in US, it's actually one of the best in terms of transit. Just go to Houston, Miami, or Dallas and then you'll learn what shit transit and what barely a sidewalk and 6 lane major highway really means LOL
When did he say it was the most car centric? Chicago is still way too car centric. I don't agree with all the people saying Chicago has the worst traffic in the country but everything else he said was true
I’m really sick and tired of people overrating Chicago. I live here, in one of the wealthiest, most livable neighborhoods, and the walkability, bikeability, and transit is subpar. In the South and West sides, Transit isn’t even an option for a lot of people, and roads have contributed to making these neighborhoods an unhealthy, dangerous place for people to live.
Transit doesn’t run on schedules here. Every morning I show up to my train station and I never know if I’ll have to wait 5 or 25 minutes for my next train.
This “at least we’re not a sun belt city” mentality is what prevents this city from ever getting better. Sure we have 8 small rail lines that all focus on getting people downtown and not between neighborhood. But try to cross a 6-way intersection when you have a train to catch and tell me Chicago doesn’t have a car problem.
One of the best is just a myth that isn’t true. Most east coast cities score much higher in a lot of metrics. Even the RUclipsr citynerd recently ranked the city a C Tier. As someone who lives here, this place really isn’t as revolutionary as people say it is.
@@Thom-TRA As a Twin Cities resident who visited Chicago not too long ago and used CTA+Metra to get around, both the train and bus system alike between electrified and diesel railways, I'm in complete agreement.
On the one hand, Midwestern cities would kill for a network like Chicago's. Many got close, as did we, to building a proper metro system in the 20th century just as we lost our 500+ miles of electrified streetcar and interurban lines. Now we have to work backwards to rebuild that system with buses, BRT, light rail, and regional/Intercity rail.
On the other hand, there's plenty that the Twin Cities does as a transit agency that I was shocked Chicago hasn't adopted. The lack of level boarding on many lines (save for Metra Electric in my experience), the lack of onboard WiFi for transit vehicles, the need for further fare integration across regional and local transit (thanks Metra lol), and the need for cleaner, lower/zero emissions vehicles are among my many issues with Chicago's transit. The Northstar doesn't match Metra's scale or frequency by a long shot, but it does get free WiFi and have full level boarding, and excellent transfers to the LRT system here.
Far from the world class scale of transit we used to have, the Twin Cities is still pushing for a lot of things I'm shocked aren't more common on systems that have way bigger networks and ridership than we do. We are rapidly improving, and though car dependency sucks here, I'm sure you can get the sentiment that no Midwestern city is immune to change and improvements to transit.
Vehicular traffic on the main streets in my somewhat outlying north side Chicago neighborhood is usually worse than in mid town Manhattan.
@@goldenstarmusic1689 most cities missed the opportunity to establish good transit before cars took over! however, there may be another chance as we ween off of fossil fuels.
You compared London traffic to Chicago - at least London has a pretty good cycling network.
I didn’t compare it, there’s research that came out earlier this year that ranked global traffic and those were the results.
@@Thom-TRA Sorry my message came across as a bit accusatory - that wasn't my intention at all.
I only meant to say that whilst London and Chicago have horrible traffic, London at least has some pretty decent cycling infrastructure including their "Cycle Superhighways and Quietways" which are used by hundreds of thousands per day and are far ahead of Chicago. The rest of the vid is great though.
@@kyletopfer7818 and London has great rail transit too!
What’s the thumbnail supposed be of?
Nvm. I see it’s of a Tokyo streetcar imposed on a Chicago street.
sprawl in memphis, and many other cities, is funded by the more dense inner city.
Very true
Wait, what's wrong with the 74 bus?
The operators are rude and the buses are unreliable. I live right by it and I walk 4 extra blocks just to take the 73, because that one doesn’t ruin my morning commute.
@@Thom-TRA Thanks for the reply! I was just in Chicago a couple of weeks ago and rode the 66 and 36 buses, no problems besides arriving late to our stops most of the time. Thanks for all your great videos!
Oh I love the 36! Did you catch an electric bus on the 66?
@@Thom-TRA I don't think so, though I wasn't really paying attention so maybe 😆 though it looked like most of the other CTA buses so I'm guessing it was diesel.
so route 74 is worth a look then
If you have all the time in the world maybe. If you’ve got places to be or prefer bus drivers to treat you with the respect you treat them, maybe find another route.
You lived in Tokyo?
Yeah for half my life
houston is the horror that (forced) car dependency creates!
Looks like they take their Irishness seriously in Chicago assuming that is why the river is green.I'm half Irish but don't think about it.The Dublin DART is coloured green.I don't think that the car makers have anymore love of buses than any other form of public transport and they try, and often successfully,to undermine public transport of any kind except for planes and ferries.Where they tolerate it it's only pseudo public transport like park and ride and parkway railways so a car is still used to get to the bus/train.
Interesting Thanks again John in Chicago
You’re welcome
The issue is that old style street cars were actually pretty bad in terms like ride quality. Buses had better ride quality and could divert around construction and accidents and other issues where street cars were fixed on the tracks. They were actually seen as an upgrade by most riders at the time. Most old style street cars were slow in general and had large street running segments to get stuck in traffic.
Now, modern light-rail style street cars have better ride quality and can carry more than buses. Still have the problem with street running unless they get a dedicated right of way, though.
I will say, when I rode the old buses on the CTA’s anniversary, they were extremely comfortable.
I want to see more Tokyo stuff not Chicago
I offer a selection of both on this channel, since I used to live in one and now live in the other
You let us American people off the hook. We always fall for advertised claims, and make a stampede towards every new thing. In the 19th Century it was the railway. In the 1890s, it was the streetcar/tram/trolley car. In the 1900s it was the subway. In the 1920s it was the automobile. In the 1940s and 50s it was the dispersed, auto-dependent suburb. In the 1960s and 70s it was air travel. In the 1980s it was megachurches and cable TV. In the 1990s it was the internet and cell phones. In the 2000s and 2010s it was the smart phone and social media. Each choice since the 1920s has led to increased atomisation, alienation and mutual hostility. Now we're at each other's throats, it seems. I hope you guys in the younger generation will make smarter choices.
Well with the wisdom from people like you to guide us I’m sure we will :)
@@Thom-TRA Hopefully I'll be wise enough 🙂
As always, interesting video. To my understanding, the cars taking over the public transportation in the US were not so much a hard push from auto-industry (although that did play a big role), but from a changing lifestyle by about 1920-s: Americans wanted to live in their own single houses with large backyards, somewhat isolated from their neighbors and busy cities. This resulted in a huge portion of population spreading over a huge land areas, far too big for any kind of public transportation to serve it efficiently and inexpensively. In contrast, Europe and Japan has majority of population living much more densely within cities and being able to enjoy the available public transportation (although sometimes the word "enjoy" may not accurately describe the experience).
I think you’re kind of glossing over many bad historical actors here. Americans didn’t just randomly want to move out of the city and have their own backyard. A lot of government policies, many of them racial and with huge amounts of corporate money funneled into them, incentivized people to live certain lifestyles, segregated from other people in society. Cars were an excellent way to achieve this.
Who do you think pushed for that "changing lifestyle" in the mid 20th Century? Watch some 1950's era films from companies like General Motors advocating for expanded highways and prioritizing cars over transit, the stuff is literally propaganda. If America continuted to develop postwar like its counterparts in Europe and Asia did, we would not only still have more widespread public transporation and passenger rail but also more pedestrian-oriented communities and less unsustainable unchecked suburban sprawl.
And there are many pedestrian bridges and tunnels to get across lake michigan, and a lot of people use them
Forcing residents to go through dark tunnels and climb over bridges just to get to their lake is a terrible use of space. and the lakefront is completely ruined by the noise and pollution of the highway. the lakefront would be so much better, safer, and more peaceful without Lake Shore Drive
because they have no choice, it's better than nothing sure, but better than that is no highway
@@carstarsarstenstesenn Agree, the idea of LSD being so close to the lake shore is not the greatest. You can also add how unsanitary, bad smelling and sometimes dangerous those underpass tunnels are (as many other bridge underpasses in Chicago). I don't know if the city is still doing it, but years ago they used to lower the LSD's speed limit by 10 MPG during the winters. Maybe raising this highway for its entire length above the street level, similar to other highways can make it a bit better, but I'm sure the residents of first few floors of all those tall buildings west of LSD will complain about the ruined view. Not to mention the cost of such a project.
By the way, I'm not saying Lake Shore Dr should be completely removed, just adapted to better fit the parkspace and urban environment.
Better Streets Chicago has a great proposal for this.
"Think of a future where Lake Shore Drive is part of the city grid - prioritizing the efficient movement of people through different forms of transportation, not just cars.
Picture a boulevard, with protected bike lanes and bus rapid transit, connecting lakefront communities to jobs and to each other in ways they’ve never been connected before. Imagine repurposing highway overpasses to create new trail and recreation opportunities"
I live less than a quarter mile from the lake, yet I have to walk over a mile to get there. That’s terrible. Plus you’re forcing people who want to enjoy nature to inhale particles and fumes.
Tokyo eliminated streetcars because they were becoming traffic hazards. They just moved everyone to the expanding Tokyo Metro and Toei subway networks.
That’s not true. Streetcars, which existed first and move predictably because they’re confined to rails, cannot be traffic hazards. The less predictable traffic around it is responsible for making it dangerous.
.... Why the hell do people say things in foreign languages only to INSTANTLY translate them? It's called the Tokyo Metropolitan Electric Trains. That's what the Japanese sounds 99.9999% of your audience can't understand mean. A translation is simply putting meaning to sounds that are meaningless to a given group. Tokyo to densha = Tokyo Metropolitan Electric Trains. You don't have to say both, infact you SHOULDNT say both, because it's hella distracting. Its not cool, or smart, or wordly to use random foreign language bits within your work. The video is in English for English speakers and is NOT a learning aid for languages. Keep it English.
Oooh someone is big mad they never paid attention in school. I have already spent five minutes laughing at some random guy on the internet who went into a meltdown because someone used a foreign language.
Who knows, maybe my deeply infuriating pronunciation of the language I happened to GROW UP LEARNING served to explain why the line is called the way it is. Maybe a decent part of my following is Japanese. Or maybe I just wasn’t expecting to encounter such an insecure loser (that ones on me, I should have known. There are some weirdos on this app who should go out and touch some grass).
Maybe I don’t sound smart or worldly to you. Honestly, idgaf. It just feels good to know I can call you a stupid idiot in 5 different languages.
Sayonara. (that means goodbye).