“Avoiding the friendzone” is based on a false premise. It assumes you have agency to cause the other person to friendzone you or not. Life isn’t a video game where the correct actions guarantee you a specific result. Often no matter what you do, it has no effect on the other persons interest. You can avoid the friendzone more generally by not fixating on people that don’t feel the same about you.
Basically, if you don't intend to be just friends with them, express your intentions early and move on if they don't reciprocate and you don't see value in just a friendship.
You do have agency. A friendship is a two street therefore do not be their friend if friendship with that person hurts you. You wouldn’t be friends with someone who physically hurts you. Why emotionally?
another thing that sucks and wasn't mentioned it the video is that when you have feelings for somebody, you try to look for hints in every word they say and tend to misinterpret a lot of their words. I was in love with my best friend for many months and every time he would say that I look very pretty in a picture I would be like omggggg he is so in love with me. now, thinking about it after he rejected me, ummmm, no, he was just making a compliment and being nice while my brain was desperately clinging onto every gesture that could theoretically be considered romantic.
this is the thing i'm struggling with rn. it's fine because i know i will eventually get over these feelings, but i hate watching myself act like a conspiracy theorist even as i know that the connections i'm making are nonsensical
I don't know if she likes me or not. She said I'm cute cuz i did something , so i just said thanks and walked away xd She did some uh... Hints maybe? But she must've been just be kind to me. Idk dude I'm clueless and an IT guy, so i don't know anything about girls. She craves attention from others though, so i don't give in and compliment her or anything, but this takes away my flirt game. Also we only meet in work, so i don't even want to be seen as a creep. Also scared 🥹
Yes, this is what happens to many people, myself included. I think my ADHD makes it worse too. The social norm of "sending hints" is honestly cancerous because it keeps us in a state of ambiguity rather than saying how you feel. I actively try to stop myself whenever I feel like I'm over invested in the way the person is acting towards me. Better safe than sorry. If it's real, we should say it.
I'm an introvert, watched this video multiple times to gather up my courage before I ask her. Yesterday I told her about my feeling, I was so prepared to hear the rejection but turns out she gave me a green light. My response to her is "Okay" and then dead silent for 5 minutes because I did not expect that kind of reaction after being her friend for over 9 years. Now our conversation become more romantic and preparing to confess to her in a couple of days. Thanks for your help, Dr K!
Sorry for the late update guys, we've been in relationship for almost 2 months. The confession process is kinda chaotic and unprepared, glad she understand that I'm not experienced with something like this. For anyone wondering, the confession is different with talking about your feelings, I understand it's difficult to relate by just watching Dr K video, but you'll know what I mean after doing it too. Good luck everyone!!! 😇
@@ladapanda If you both actually value your friendship even if its "just" platonic, I don't think that is likely to happen. Also, what is the alternative? Hiding your feelings until they think you're creepy? It's much worse than being upfront about your feelings in the first place. I had to learn that the hard way, unfortunately.
yeah seems like it, but thats not always true. A friend of mine tried to push a relationship, but she said she just wants to be friends. 6 Month later and they are together now. So make your intentions clear is definitely good, but the second half of the statement is false.
That ending Very helpful You aren't being rejected. You aren't asking them out. You have a problem that you are talking out with your friend. I'm afraid of conflict and abandonment but my fear of conflict is much easier to control as I gain the slightest confidence. I can talk to a friend. It's still hard but I just talked to a friend about a problem and how I felt about it. I needed this.
You kind of are asking them out, you aren't deciding on a date but you're letting them know that you would be open to a date. The challenge is getting over the phrase "asking them out". In both scenarios of sharing your feelings or asking them out your feelings can be rejected. Getting over rejection is the hard but best route forward.
i really disagree with some parts of this video. it just flippantly ignores the complexity of how most of this goes down so much so that the recommended things to do makes one sound like a robot. i've been on both sides of the issue and i can tell you, its just not a fun experience for either side, the only thing that works is finding ways to distance yourself from the person you're in love with which to me is the one thing i can totally agree with him on in this video. Most ppl in friendzones know what the answer will be if they ask out "the friend", there are various body language or behavioural tests you start to carry out to see if a girl is feeling you like that, so most of the times you know if she's unwillingly to go act that way around you its a non-verbal communicado that she aint interested, so distance yourself abit just so you dnt fucking make things weird, find someone else way prettier to crush on.
Yeah me having romantic feelings for someone is a problem that needs to be fixed, that's all. That narrative will definitely help boys and men struggling with their feelings in a society that already tells them they're doing something wrong by having them.
@@Plasmafox the problem is not your feeling, the problem is the discrepancy of feelings between two people, it's both side. so talking it out is like a reality check together and then resolve from there.
This is THE video I needed to see today. Recently I started developing feelings for a guy friend and I have not known what to do about it. I became tired of years of bottling up my feelings, so I wanted to "confess" today and then run away scared of the answer, as I have always done previously. But I clicked at the video at just the right time. So, right now we're having the conversation (it's still going - we met offline, but live in different cities at the moment). And it's turning out to be one of the healthiest conversations in my life. I know: even if I'll be sad at the end, at least I've saved MONTHS of wondering and hoping, and I will get better much faster, because I'm doing it now
Key thing I have learnt today- If you want to avoid this whole FZ cycle you MUST: i. Be emotionally aware of yourself ii. You should recognize those romantic feelings iii. Have an EARLY convo with him/her/them, right then and there *You are actually TRYING TO SOLVE A PROBLEM WITH YOUR FRIEND*
Step no 1.Don't get into the friendzone . Show your romantic/sexual interest in a girl right from the beginning and take the risk of getting rejected .
@@debanikgoswami4834 Take it from an old dude, that is the best way to go. Sure, I've seen it work for someone else, and the gal was gorgeous, but there were a ton of vultures along with this guy waiting for her marriage to fail, so out of probably a dozen guys there was one and he got kicked to the curb after a while. She's been married 3 times. Just be upfront or flirt, if you get rejected at the flirt level, then either accept it or move on. Don't be wasting weekend nights on this kind of gal. Coffee, homework, but save your time and money for someone that likes you the way you like them.
It's weird though: why have we developed a convention, as a society, where men and women are basically required to be complete strangers in order to fall in love? Why CAN'T we start out as friends first? I would imagine that 3-6 months isn't, for a lot of people, actually enough time to get to know someone enough to know whether you want to engage in a romantic relationship.
I'll drink to that. It feels like a normal sunny cloudless day but all of a sudden a nuclear bomb drops. It takes time to get to know with each other, to warm up first. Unless... you're looking for a casual relationship though (not serious one).
Yeah, I totally agree. My crush at the moment told me the same. I realized that I grew feelings and not even three weeks in I told her, hey, I feel like I want to date you, what do you think about it? She told me she wants a relationship to grow out of a deeper friendship and leave the stress out of it, but she wants to deepen our relationship and know more about me. I still flirt outside of this engagement a little bit here and there, not that serious at the moment, but still.
Simply put, it's because of opportunity cost and ghosting. Why should you risk your friendship with someone for gambling on a romantic relationship if you can just keep it? It's pretty common in today's society to ghost your ex even if you had a good relationship and a "fair" break-up. So instead, people just avoid advancing in their relationship with another person and instead look for romantic feelings in complete strangers, 'cause you ain't losing anything if you get rejected, you break up or the relationship fails in any other way. In this day and age, it might even call it an inevitable process one individual has to go through. Forming friendships without tapping into the potential of romance and forming romantic relationships with strangers 'til something works out has now become the norm.
That’s not society unfortunately. That’s psychology. It isn’t logical. It is emotional. Love doesn’t make sense. Remember that. You can manipulate yourself and others to fall in love more or less, but it is like being controlling of your pet. It is not completely in your control, yet it mostly is, by using the levers that you have at your disposal.
I “escaped” the “friend zone” after 8 or 9 years of pursuit. Lusting over someone for that long doesn’t put you in a place to have a healthy relationship and ultimately the flame burned out instantly. I wish I would have seen something like this when I was much younger but I can’t trade the lessons I’ve learned. Good luck friends!
been in the friendzone for 2 years and thought its very long, just confessed my feelings a week ago and I got rejected, after that I became more sad and always thought to myself we could've just stayed friends but im only saying that bc I miss them to the point that I want them back even as a friend where in reality thats the reason I've been in pain for the 2 years and friends will never work out. Stay strong folks !
@@divhead3521 that sounds rough… :-( maybe you can take an official break from the friendship, so you can process your feelings (maybe with a therapist) and resume it a few moths from now? Wish you all the best.
The worst part about a huge confession at the end of the friendzone is that the girl might actually have feelings for you too, and if you make a huge confession and catch them off guard then they might just panic and say no, and then you end the friendship and both of you feel regret. So what you said about having a casual talk about it is the best way to communicate it.
This is most excellent advice. I'm proud to say I've broken the cycle recently. Told two women I had feelings much earlier than I typically would. It didn't result in romantic relationships, but the emotional self awareness to acknowledge it and not fear the outcome is freeing.
this is so helpful. i've had such horrible problems with intense jealousy for a long time, i've been hoping you'd do a dedicated video on jealousy but i feel like this addressed some of the fundamental causes of it pretty well.
if someone is in the formative years watching these videos, taking it in, re-watching them, applying it, this is a literal game changer. this is amazing content. thank you so much, doc.
I dont think the friend zone should be avoided, but rather accepted. One woman who was a friend zone character many years ago introduced me to another woman and we had a beautiful relationship for a while...... Accepting a woman only wants to be friends can open other doors with other women if you let her be herself as your friend.... In other words, if she only wants to be friends, then let her help you as a friend should; by introducing you to other women.
The possible bad side to this is that the other woman could have thought ‘oh, no other woman seems to want him, so would i want him?’ You must have had enough things going for you.
It's sad to see how many young adults (especially men) suffer from this huge problem in our society that no one is willing to talk about or solve. Glad to have someone like Dr K is addressing this issue.
Dr K definitely helps reduce the suffering, but I also have to be grateful for my suffering. If I would not have suffered from this in the past I would not be the person I am today and I am grateful for that. I don't wish anyone harm. However I do think men new to the dating space have to see this as an opportunity and learn from their mistakes in order to grow. One video might help but experience it what really matters!
There’s no solution, just stop pretending to be friends with people while having ulterior motives. It literally makes you manipulative. You don’t suffer as a result of it. It’s not suffering to be friends with someone and pretend to like them as a person you entitled, privileged fool. It’s being dishonest. Cry about it
Why is it a society problem? And why should anyone solve it? The friendzone is a term coined by men. Women just call it friendship. And no one puts men in that position, they put themselves there by not making their intentions clear. Why would you pretend to be friends with someone you don't see as a friend?
@@malenalucero6473 According to some statistics released in 2019, around 28% of men aged 20-29 in the US had no sexual partners in their whole life. After the pandemic I suspect that this number surpassed 30%, getting closer to 1/3 of all of them, which means fewer couples being formed and fewer people being born, hence it is something that will affect any human society (see Japan and South Korea with a birth rate lower than 1.0). I'm not from the US btw.
@@patrick-915 What about women not wanting to have kids? I don't really think the existence of 'the friendzone' is the reason why population is dropping. The case of Japan is very particular. Women are expected to choose between family or work, they can't have both because men don't do their part when kids get sick etc. Population drops when you force women to choose between financial independence and bearing children.
This is such an important conversation. Omg. Omg omg omg. The part about saying “hey I need to step out of this and give myself time” is a type of boundary you are setting which shall be respected. You deserve to have your own boundaries respected (and vice versa)
Man, I took your advice from this video and said something, and it was all it took for her to admit she also felt the same way Thanks Dr. K, your boy is massively up and I appreciate it.
Hopefully some people can genuinely find this helpful because what he is saying is completely true. I ended up figuring out how to do this on my own. I told her that I had feelings for her and wanted to know how she felt. When she rejected me I just explained that yeah, I needed time to process stuff and we needed some strong boundaries. We stopped being friends, and having months away from her was a massive benefit to my mental health. Even now I feel confident that we could be friends because I feel recovered from the whole thing. So big takeaway, disengage. Do not stay in the "friendzone," it will destroy your mental health. Be in healthy relationships, not ones like that.
Finally, the first time someone says something that actually checks out for me. I used to think I was alien and worked differently, because everyone would condemn my behaviour and recommend actions that never felt right. Normally, I only develop romantic feelings for friends, but I usually wait too much "to make sure", because I tend to be afraid of being premature...and then the entire cycle in the video happens and it finally makes sense. I usually heard things like "You should make your intentions clear from the get go" or "You should not make it seem you want to be friends", and those never worked for me, because they were wrong and dishonest, because I did want to be friends and I could not let intentions clear from the get go because they didn't exist in the beggining, the intention was to be a friend. I used to be terrible at emotional awareness and I would only notice I had romantic feelings when I was deep into it and I would shock myself like something unexpected happened, when the truth was that I never understood myself. I'm past those days, thankfully, but now I finally learned where lies the problem: it's not premature to let things clear on the first sign and it is harmful to grow the feelings while hiding them to be on "the safe side" by making sure "your feelings are true". I had long since given up on love because I would always hear stupid advices regarding "timing" and now I actually see a way to do something. It's been awfully long, however, I have to deal with my apathy first now, but at least I know a direction to take when I feel things again.
I relate a whole lot to that first part of "letting your intentions be clear from the get go". As you say, stuff feels dishonest. And, if I may add, completely counter-intuitive: if your partner can't be a good friend, then how can they be a good partner? I can't form romantic feelings without feeling they're good friends first. It just doesn't work that way for me, it simply doesn't. That said, it's also much better to realize and address those feelings as soon as they come up. That is where the problem lies for me.
@@andrecarvalho6691 yeah, exactly, but people always said that this was wrong, some would even say men only befriend women with second intentions, including my mom...I felt so alien compared to everyone else that I gave up by thinking the way romance works for me doesn't fit reality. But the video made clear this is actually a common occurence with scientific evidence and that it is not a problem in itself (like many people also say), you just need to recognize your feelings and let them clear as they arise. Like you, this was my true problem and one nobody I ever met in life adressed, ever. Some love advices I recieved I even preffered not to even try because of how scummy they were. I'm so glad this video exists and that I'm actually a normal person, I don't feel like I lost cause anymore
The friend zone is usually the man avoiding the risk of rejection by not making a move or showing his real intention. This is self defeating and leads to soft rejection + fake friendship. It absolutely can be avoided by making your intentions clear, making yourself a more attractive partner and being willing to accept rejection and quickly move on.
That's BS. Just keep your eyes open, if a woman is interested in you, you will feel it. You never knock on woman's door. if she wants you the door will be open.
@@axl1002 Most guys are terrible at reading signals from women and women often give mixed signals, so being passive and waiting until you know for sure is a quick path to nowhere. Guys need to flirt more, and be more clear with their intentions
@@WhitePillDave Dude, the game has rules. You don't go in foreign country and demand they to speak your language. Flirting is a game that is all about not exposing your intentions. Women want to play, if you don't like the game you move on and stay single.
@@axl1002 when I say show your intentions I mean by flirting. Flirting in it's very nature is showing romantic / s*xual interest. I'm certainly not implying a man should simp or confess his love, but he should be fun and flirt. But some men act too passive and justify it in their minds that they are playing it cool and not trying too hard.
@@axl1002 Not a game dude. If that’s how you feel about it you will get played. Just be clear with intentions. Most women don’t like the games. The guessing. Having to wonder if you’re a friend or a predator lurking.
Holy shit this explains so damn much! I used to get "friend zoned" all the time. Going to therapy helped me control my thoughts and convince myself to stay away from things that hurt me; like distancing a friend because my emotions were too much. I didn't realize how I've never been "friend zoned" since. The last friend and I talked about our feelings and decided the age gap was too much and we'd rather stay friends. Sometimes I crush on him more again but I tell myself it's okey to have these feelings and it's okey to let them go. Also the idea that emotional connection is different for guys and girls is eye opening.
I had one of these exact conversations with a friend I'd been having romantic feelings towards. She is also very emotionally aware, so I know that when she told me that she didn't have romantic feelings that she's telling the whole truth. Glad I had the conversation the day before I left for a vacation, it's giving me some good time to continue working through my emotions. Thanks Dr. K, giving me some real hope (and tools). It's going to take more time to move completely past this, but I feel as though the "friendzone" phase of my life is on the way out. Now to see if I can start dating for the first time in like 6 years
Long story short, people who experience the friend zone have anxious ambivalent attachment syndrome. I am so glad I am able to let go of friends and acquaintances and be secure by myself.
I really needed this right now, I started getting really close with this girl and I was going to let her travel far away from me without telling her how I feel about her. After watching this, everything makes sense from the first day we met to the day she left. I'm planning to meet with her this Sunday and I will "Solve this problem" with my friend :) thank you Alok
@@Yazan26579 hey man sorry for the late respond only saw this now. I ended up sharing with her my feelings, but she didn’t feel the same way and looked at me as a close friend and in a brotherly manner. At that time I was honestly quite infatuated with her and she wanted to stay as friends and keep in contact. I told her that I wouldn’t be able to do that right now because of my feelings for her but one day when I get over these feelings we might be able to reconnect in her home country in the future. Honestly things ended pretty badly and in an argument where I just left and never talked to her again. I still have her contact details and she messaged me not too long later and we had a short chat. She seems to be doing well. I hope she’s continues doing well wherever she is and I hope I can meet her again someday to atone for that argument and immaturity I showed.
Personal experience, I befriended a woman who was engaged to avoid friendzones and just have a genuine connection. Caught feels and spent 3 months out of contact before hanging out again. I'm proud to say we're gonna start making sour dough bread baking soon, and I'm hyped. It works, and I'm honestly pretty fulfilled just having a friend with a different perspective.
When I was younger, male friends wasn’t something that I even considered. I didn’t think I could relate to them in any way. When I got to know any boy, I immediately romanticized him and idealized him, so obviously eventually I’d develop a crush on him. But I really wasn’t attracted to him in a romantic sense. I just never had a male friend before. So I didn’t know how to FEEL. It’s so common to develop romantic feelings for others and later realize your mind didn’t know what to feel and kept trying to avoid you making friends, making those first months awful but as you actually get to know the person and build intimacy and trust, that shaky feeling, that nervousness, that awkwardness just vanishes. There’s a saying in Spanish that is very true "la confianza da asco" (something like: trust comes with disgust) meaning that when you have such a great amount of friendship and trust with someone, you’ll inevitably be more yourself. Normally people say it when their friends fart or do something embarrassing in front of their friends because they trust and love them like siblings, so they aren’t afraid a fart will break a relationship lol Long story short, congrats bro, having friends of all ages and sexes broadens not only our emotional range, but the amount of happiness and fulfillment we can feel.
as someone who does not have the money or time for psychiatry and therapy, this channel has taught me so fucking much about my life and put so much internal questioning to rest
I have had to learn this lesson the hard way over many years, and I'm still working on it. But it's very validating and reassuring to hear that the strategy you recommend (early conversation, stepping back for a while if feelings aren't reciprocated) is what I have begun to do on my own.
Your videos usually make me pause and tear up or cry outright because something hits pretty hard. I am the anxious attachment type, and I have always struggled with the concept of trusting that other options will present themselves. It's why I fell completely apart when my husband passed, and it's what's shaped my "friendships" (usually letting myself be taken advantage of, in order to make sure they don't leave), and my friendzonings. "Omg, this boy is perfect for me, I will never find another one because he's so close to my ideal man, and it is therefore IMPOSSIBLE that any other man will compare!" Even though finding him in the first place proves that it can happen again. I will have more rational conversations with men I like, as it happens. I did lose over a year in unrequited love with a man who catfished me. I never met him and he wouldn't talk with me on the phone. I convinced myself he became distant and eventually all but left the friendship because something was wrong with me, but after it ended and my roommate and I watched the entirety of the show Catfish, it became clear that he had been the one with the problem all along. I did some digging and figured out a lot of stuff about him and there were a lot of things he embellished to seem "better." I realized that he had encouraged me in words to become emotionally involved, while shoving me away in actions, because he was afraid of rejection but unable to communicate that, and afraid of being physically or mentally vulnerable because he didn't realize that any dumbass with $2 for BeenVerified could know everything about him in minutes. As you said, attachment cools over time. He refused to give me a rejection or acknowledge what he was doing, which dragged it out SO much longer than it should have taken, but I managed to move on on my own. But I do still think of him occasionally, because I have trouble believing I will find someone as good as what I found out was true. The stuff he lied about didn't matter much to me. I forgot I paid for your courses but I should actually look through them. Thanks for all you do
This sorta kinda happened unintentionally with a female friend of mine. I noticed I had a bit of these feelings when we first started to hang out (mostly just thoughts of "what would a relationship with her look like?") and as we hung out more, we just talked about relationships and marriage more in general (since we're both about to graduate) and we found out we just have different goals and values in our future partners. She wants a lot of kids, I'm not that picky but I'm worried about finances related to that to begin with since I have a passion I want to pursue. When it comes to our Christianity, she believes in predestination, I believe in free will (this is something you could 100% tolerate in a friendship but would be disastrous when it comes to raising kids together). And a few other things that I'd rather not disclose. I'm glad I do have that bit of self esteem to recognize what I want in partner and not ignore those needs when considering a relationship and we're both able to help each other grow into better versions of ourselves because we can basically check and balance each others' expectations of the other gender without any tension.
I don't think Calvanism vs Armenianism would be disastrous for raising kids... it's not enough of an issue to break fellowship over, so just both present your point of view and let them decide.
The time you waste with somebody doesn't value you the way you do to them, the time you are delaying other person to enter your life that does love you.
If you treat people like people and don’t expect an outcome from them things can happen. I asked a girl out and she said no and we stayed friends because I respected her boundaries and she respected that I didn’t try to “change her mind”. We are good friends to this day.
My current girlfriend sees me having female friends that i retained after asking out as a big green flag that raised her confidence in me as a romantic partner.
@@boxie13 1.) Congrats! it sounds like you have a healthy outlook on interpersonal relationships. 2.) This is always my advice since worst case scenario...you gain a friend!
@@brandonmai6278 thank you! I did not always. It took a lot of work and healing. Pro tip: if the idea of gaining a friend sounds bad look into that feeling dear comment lurkers
I believe you don’t actually even have to verbalize it. Just ask them to go on an actual one-on-one date once you get some feeling for the other side, and make sure to call it a ‘date’. They will get the message, and you should be able to know the answer simply from their reaction. It will either be: absolutely no, maybe, or yes. If it’s yes, just go for it. If it’s maybe, change your interaction or situation with them so it is slightly more romantic (late night study session, movie, etc.). If it was a clear no, give up and find a new girl to go after, and keep the friendship if you want to. Don’t forget that they used to be a great friend before you catched a feeling, no need to throw it out.
20:09 Dr K this is so important! At the beginning of the rejection period you must take some time and sort your feelings out. I repeat: it is not possible to remain a friend after rejection for some time. I went through this a couple of times and on one occasion it took nearly 2 years for things to settle. And it wasn't the same after. Trust me: it hurts like hell to be around someone you love without being loved back. Don't do this to yourself. Heal first!
you're very eloquent, dr. K. This topic is such a bummer, it's kinda sad that most of my friendships with men ended just like you said. The thing about "friendzone" is that it is implied that something is going on when there's nothing and it can be so pushy that you feel you're dodging flirts instead of chatting with a friend. You never know when it's coming but the feeling I have now is that this can happen anytime with any friend, that's how frequent it happened with me. The solution is so simple, just be honest about your feelings and your intentions, if they reciprocate, good! If they don't, don't force it, take your time and move on.
We need to stop having intersexual friendships, honestly. Neither gender is benefitting from them. Gender segregation should probably be a thing. Then, there could be designated areas to go where both agree that it's a "date seeking" environment.
@@peterharrell7305 Nah, segregation would just foster an “us-them” mentality and make relations between genders ten times worse. People of both genders just need to learn social skills and most of the crap that goes on can be avoided.
@richerDiLefto I'm gonna need you to qualify that statement. Please provide an example of the intergration having a positive effect for both genders simultaneously.
@@peterharrell7305 or maybe, but just maybe, men should start acting normal when around women and treat us like we are another human being and not something to sexualize, but yeah man, segregation is the answer
Well this has been a really helpful Video to me. I have been in the friendzone for a couple times, while not interested in Girls that actually liked me. Usually my problem was that my feelings always revolved around Girls that I was already friends with and deepened the friendship with them just as you explained in the video. Also the exact things you mentioned happened to me aswell, the exchange of intimate information, while I receive them as romantic they think of them as building the friendship. Since I'm currently in the same boat (once again), but this time it's even more complicated because it's a colleague at work, it was still at the beginning of developing feelings for them. So after watching you video yesterday and took my courage to tell them about me starting to get feelings. While the result was not mutual, I immediately felt way better and not as destroyed as usually after the the long build up. Also the response was really nice, letting me know nobody told them their feelings in this way yet. While obviously this is still a punch in the gut, I feel like now I can move on, not communicating for a while and come back once I have something else going for me and resume the friendship. Thanks Dr. K for this video, it really highlights a lot of the things going on in the friendzone, especially while others are trying to make you look at Love signs and stuff, potentially making you think it's actually reciprocated Love. Reading through the other comments here, I feel like this video already helped a lot of people.
A good thing is to not get „addicted“ to the other person. Don‘t spend every hour with him/her, dont‘t tell him/her everything and spend time with other people. The point is: If you are available all the time, there is no single need for the other person to want you because they already have you. So you need to control the availability and you also need to control rivality. If noone else wants you, you‘re still easily be available for that person. So you have to meet or even date other people that might start a relationship with you. Also don‘t be overwhelmlingly nice, but always be friendly on a normal level. So that the person you like might think: „Wow he‘s nice but I‘m shure there‘s more“ This of course doesn‘t work all the time but it increases chances (with that person but also with other people) and also doesn‘t make you addicted to one person. Nevertheless, you‘ll feel better.
The fact that what Dr. K explained about falling in love and expressing/confessing is counter-intuitive, at least in relation to what we think about love through media and what our parents told us about finding and getting a partner, is quite a shock. I can't recall anyone mentioning the "optimal period and method" (I'm paraphrasing what Dr. K said) of transforming friendship into love, it was always "if you have feelings towards someone, court them and confess, unless you're faced with a solid NO as an answer. and even then you can try some more, in case she's testing you".
Yeah no, you can't just assume she is testing you like that and even if she was then that is a bad sign as since you continued thinking "What if she is just testing me and actually means yes?" she could claim sexual harassment. If someone says no it is always better to assume they mean no
@@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena That was meant to represent the PUA and red-pill communities spouting the "shit-testing strategy" women are supposedly using. I respect the "no" as an answer.
@@Desteroyah195 Usually their shit testing strategies are not just saying "No". The red pill people avoids the ones that do say no even if they think the woman is shit testing as that is a major red flag to stay away from her especially if she comes chasing after you because you walked away. Also i have no idea what PUA means
Videos like this are so helpful because I feel like it’s made just for me. I’ve struggled with a lot of things described in here and now, I know a direction I can grow in. Thank you for doing what you do Dr. K!
The worst mistake is becoming too attached and having high expectations before any kind of relationship has been established. If you make an effort not to become too attached from the beginning and don't have high expectations, then it becomes easier to cut people loose, especially women. This can also lead to more honest interactions, which is good for building a solid foundation for a relationship to exist upon.
This video is literally the solution to the problem I've been having for the past 4 months. I wasn't really in the "friend zone", it was more like this romantic-but-not-dating hell scenario. But still, this video gave me the solution I've needed for a while. Thank you.
I totally agree, never get into the friend zone!! Start off with the intention of dating and romance. Make that clear right up front!! You can be friends afterwards if things aren't a great romantic fit.
@Nightsong Tarot having romantic feelings for someone is not exactly the same as wanting to "get into their pants".... it's often part of it, but definitely not the same. And why would that be hurtful to know?
the most profound HG video yet imo. it really resonated with me because it's been the last great problem in my life that I had left to deal with. my escape fantasies that I used to cope with a relationship that had some traumatic moments led me to having feelings of limerence for my best friend. fantasies aren't healthy to indulge in nor are they supposed to come true 🙏🏿
fuck, I makes so much sense why I feel so attached to my former date, now best friend. Deep down I'm clearly not over her yet. I don't feel like she friendzoned me, because we mutually decided that we'd rather be best friend than lose each other completely. It's the best friendship I've ever had and she says she really cares about me because for a brief moment we not only had a great time but we also got to know each other in a very meaningful way but man... I've never self such strong emotions since I met her... It would be easier (and not as healthy) to just cut ties and never see or deal with each other again.
ok so. think more about how you are being treated and less about your feelings for her. are you always being used for your time and resources? look objectively at whether or not you are being used or if it's a healthy 2 way relationship.
@@flowerbomb1907 Money and power will only make you feel as though you are compensating for your perceived "romantic failures." If you ever end up in the predicament that OP has, treat yourself kindly, and give yourself time away from this person your are heartbroken over, and converse about this issue with other friends in your life. Look for things you enjoy to do, and let yourself have a little bit of fun. Maybe even meet new people through mutual friends or at social gatherings. If your feelings end up leaving, then feel free to reengage into a friendship with your old friend.
I was supposed to hit the hay 30 minutes ago but I swear to god this video worth staying up past midnight. It is so life-changing that I thought WHY DIDNT I FIND YOUR CHANNEL BEFORE EVERYTHING! Thankyou!
Thank you for this. I've been talking with a long-time friend very regularly recently and knew I needed to have this conversation by the end of the month. This video gave me the motivation to advocate for myself and have it now, rather than waiting.
I have literally experienced and went through the stages you explained at 19:30 almost perfectly about a year ago (only difference is I told them about my feelings once they mentioned there was someone else they liked). It takes a while for the feelings to go away after cutting communication but it was incredibly effective and I'm glad I had the emotional awareness and understanding of the best thing to do in this scenario because I had my first experience with getting attention from a girl (and in response instantly pouring tons of emotional investment and attention back into her) a few months prior and oh boy I learned a lot about myself, my feelings and relationships from that. Found myself nodding along and being like "YEP exactly that, I've been there and done that!" during the second half of this video. My self confidence has grown in spades since the first experience, the old me and current me are like night and day difference, and that has also poured into me not worrying too much about relationships which is really nice. I actually cared about them like 0% up until these two experiences, but its a lot nicer to be in a space where I feel I'm worth being part of a relationship with someone, and have interest in one, but am not dying or really desperate for one right now.
I glade you learned more about your self. You better than you used to be. Stories like this are can be impressionable if society gave flying f about men's feelings and mental health.
This is actually true, after being friendzoned a couple times I have started distancing myself ever so slightly from girl friends who I'm developing feelings for. And they tend to remain at bay that way.
I wish I’d found this video sooner, I lost someone who I was my best friend and I didn’t tell her until the weeds had taken over. It ended badly and we aren’t talking anymore. Thank you for making content like this available for free ❤
That's very helpful and i learned so much from you and the community. This plus the calmness I've received from meditation made me so much more aware of everything. Thank you all for that.
6:01 This is actually really interesting. I used to catch feelings for people all the time, mainly because I struggled with making friends, so when I did, it was special to me. The last two times it happened, it was when I was under some level of stress. First when I was a month into my new job, and I was in full anxiety mode trying to figure out my life. Then, about 10 months into my job when I was really starting to get overwhelmed and unhappy.
Having a talk about arising feelings without confessions. The thing is, a lot of... young people catch feelings really fast, infatuation, it's hard to downplay that talk as if it's not a confession of sorts and a rejection of sorts if she doesn't share the sentiment. I have had a talk like this with a girl before and the worst part was that she was very "wishywashy", indecisive. It's ok to not know how you feel about a person, but it's frustrating to be on the receiving end of that.
Love the new topic focused videos that have banners for key points and the balance of Dr K talking naturally like he’s talking to a viewer but also structured and clear. I think it’s a good balance with the more casual and flexible viewer interviews esp as a lot of the “filler” words in between during those convos can also be beneficial
Hot take: Apart from what's being said in the video, I think a lot of hetero men who have this issue lean towards the 'demi' side of sexuality, but that is rather incompatible with how hetero dating dynamics normally work for the side of men. The expectations associated with the male gender role in the context of romantic relationships run contrary to a 'demi' leaning.
This is good advice if it actually plays out this way. The problem I run into is that several times the other person refuses to set clear boundaries and continues playing into the relationship because they like the adoration and attention they are getting from me. My feelings end up growing while they never have any intention of giving me a real romantic relationship. I've had this happen so many times I lost count.
Same experience, the woman kept hanging on me over and over again. The first time she rejected me I couldn't even process my feelings, she called me every day and talked about how much I meant to her for like 7 hours etc. Good luck with having any degree of clarity when the woman who friendzoned you desperately wants to keep you close no matter what.
@Duxshan i haven't watched the video, but the first thing I think of is both you and the OP aren't setting your own boundaries. The behavior of these women do not sound healthy. Don't be a validation machine for these people. You have to tell them something like "hey, I do care about you,but the amount of attention and love you're giving me is something I've come to expect from partners. We are not romantic, so you have to cool off."
@@D_Jilla exactly. The women these guys are talking about sound like they’re being selfish and playing games. The problem isn’t that the women haven’t set boundaries- their boundary IS overstepping, rejecting, and doing it all over again. So the real problem is that OP and the commenters did NOT send a boundary and consequence with the woman they were with. If you don’t like something, communicate it. If they don’t listen, enforce a consequence (ex: I’m not going to answer you when you talk like this because I’ve told you I don’t like it if you aren’t going to be honest with your intentions).
My humble suggestion to you guys is to keep in mind that interest in a person can evolve in romantic attachment or friendship like a crossroads. When you've met someone that attracts you, do NOT take the friendship path, but talk to them and ask them to go out and eventually date. They might say no, but at least you won't have invested a lot in that dream/hope and can avoid all the troubles (hurt, lower self-esteem, remorse, waste of time, self-isolation etc.) it might cause. Once you tread the apparently safer path of friendship, it's unlikely it will then transform into a romantic interest on their side. Better lose someone when they still dont mean too much to you than losing them anyway but with lots of damage.
This is probably going to come into play for me tomorrow! It will be a touching story of two friends addressing a pile of feelings by taking it out behind the barn, shooting it in the head before it ruins the friendship, and then burying the body together as pals.
Hey Dr K, I think out of all the videos this has been the most useful and something I've actually implemented into my life. Right now I have feelings for someone that I wouldn't have told originally, but maybe has gone on a little long. Going through these experiences has definitely let me grow
As a woman I'd like to contribute the fact that I TRY (as in make a very active effort) to friendzone everyone. Perhaps it relates more to my own experiences and a way to save some hurt in the first place. BUT. there's nothing more attractive than a person being attracted to me. So please take this as a generic advice to be brave to share your feelings. Presented with a fact that someone I haven't considered romantically prior shares their attraction would be the first time I consider it. Attraction to the idea then potentially GROWS (it takes time to reconsider status quo and unlock the safety vault on any feelings) into a mutual attraction. In my mind that's a perfect scenario for a potential relationship if I could make one up. I wouldn't date someone I haven't known as a friend first.
I recently went through a situation exactly like what you describe. I started a new job and within a few weeks of working there noticed I was getting feelings for this one girl. We were friends for ab 3 months before I told her how I felt, and got friend zoned. Now I’m in this terrible situation where we’re still actually friends and get along well at work and I still have feelings for her baddd. I don’t know if I should just quit my Job and distance myself from her so my feelings don’t keep growing or what To add to that , I was emotionally aware. I could feel myself catching the feelings and early on I tried to suppress the feelings but couldn’t. She’s older than me and I tried telling myself she’d never date me because of that , but that obviously didn’t stop my feelings from growing. I should’ve told her earlier on but I’d never told someone how I felt about them like that before. I count the fact that I was at least able to convey to her how I feel ,in person and not over text or something like that, as a win. But I regret, despite knowing that stepping away from the friendship after I was friend zoned would be beneficial, I didn’t. She said nothing would be awkward between us and I took her word on it and continued on as if nothing had happened and so did she. But that has not at all helped my feelings go away. I keep telling myself there’s still a chance one day even tho I know that’s not true. I mean it could be but that’d be a miracle lowkey lol
I’ve been friend zoned of course, but when they say it’s because they don’t feel like they’re good enough, that hurts more than just a normal friend zone.
Honestly, this was a revelation, thank you, Dr. K! Seriously, this should be shown to more people suffering from being put into the friendzone. I have been pondering how to build a relationship with one person I've been meeting and I want to be a friend, but I have been starved of a romantic relationship for so long, that it wreaks havoc to my emotional state. At the moment, we've called a pause on our relationship for two weeks, because my emotional state was so intense that it led to me spilling my frustrations and doubts to her. It's actually so refreshing to hear that we should discuss the feelings instead of, you know, closing them off to the other person until it comes out as a confession of love. There is a difference between you poking your friend to ask of their opinion compared to you pushing them to a corner and blasting them with a shotgun of love, lmao.
Easy to avoid the friendzone. If you are interested in a person, build up a tiny bit of a rapport with them, but do not become a friend. Ask them out straight away. If they aren't interested move on and ask other people out. If you have already been living in a friend zone for a while tell your friend you want to go no contact for a while to get over the unrequited feelings. Most adults will respect that.
You would be surprised how good the "I really like you so I am going no contact and let it pass" lands and how mutual contacts deeply respect that Edit: and sometimes this changes their mind, always do it for yourself though and never to play the long game
@@kamitorings you don‘t have to go no-contact forever. Just until things have calmed down. If you choose so. And proper communication would not hurt as well so you don‘t hurt that friend unnecessarily
Avoid the friendzone by not accepting it. Only you can frienzone yourself nobody else can. If you want romance and they dont move on simple as that. But this means you have to get rid of one-itis.
The problem with us indian kids back then was that unrequited love was romanticized by cinema and songs. They told us if we just kept trying eventually she'll change her mind.
That seems to be the case with American cinema as well, except it’s usually about a dorky guy who gets the cute girl at the end of a story instead of a “cool” guy (and the opposite is also often true). This trope is cute and entertaining, but it’s been on the media so long and so often that people forget that it makes for great storytelling because of its highly *unrealistic* and out of the ordinary nature. This sort of media sets average people up for having unrealistic expectations from the opposite sex in real life, and it’s harmful.
It’s exactly that in the US as well and it’s so toxic. I’ll have to find a go-to book that helps people deconstruct those ideas and beliefs because a lot of people then don’t have an example of what a healthy romantic interaction is and how to handle rejection in a way that respects both parties boundaries
@@richerDiLefto it’s not just unrealistic, it’s just not any form of a healthy romantic dynamic which pisses me off because then we have a bunch of guys who model their behavior off of this and keep getting awful responses so they’re left feeling confused and angry and then women are just being blatantly harassed and treated with no sense of agency or autonomy and so they’re scared and confused 🤦🏻♀️ just a giant mess
After being on the really bad end of this a few years back and now learning all of this information, this is like revisiting an area where you experienced a horrible accident and now are analyzing what, how and why it exactly happened as a third party of sorts giving lots of insight. Perhaps this is a form of closure.
Hey man thanks so much for making this. This has given me a lot closer to closure for me. During my teens, I feel in love with a chick way older than me and she exploited that and groomed me. I feel disgusting knowing it happened to me. If only you made this years ago before I got taken advantage of. This honestly explains my issues so well and it brings me peace
This has often been the problem when I tried to be friends with people who I thought were really attractive. What's worked best for me (and might not for everyone) is to really be aware of whether the other person is interested in me or not (its obviously very tough to tell, but I'll be looking for very obvious attempts at moving the relationship forward). If they don't then I'll think of them as a "no-go" and really focus on keeping the relationship platonic and maybe not investing too much emotionally. I'll also generally try to be social and meet new people. This has honestly worked wonders for me
I think I’m glad I’ve had awkward situations and blown up confessing because it helped me learned what not to do, as well as the moments things went well. I had a negative idea that things only went well when the girl asked because I could handle it on the other end. Tho I’ve had very healthy conversations with long time friends that continued because we talked it out and what we both wanted. Honestly and Communication at opportune moments (in the beginning). Super scary, but honest, rip the band-aid off while it’s fresh so you can move on in whatever direction in a healthy and timely manor. Got it.
This is amazing. I've struggled with the so called friend zone many times before and I've never realized it began with my attachment style and that I was investing so heavily and effectively smothering the other person. Your 3 steps, while really scary to consider doing, make so much sense. I've gone to therapy a few times but never heard this explanation. I think I can actually make meaningful change now. Wow.
I wish i could send this video to me a year ago, i could've avoided the aftermath of my actions. luckily, even though i did this desperate confession twice, my friend was understanding enough that we are still close friends. this video taught me that communicating your romantic feelings to the person doesn't necessarily mean that you want to enter a relationship with them, that it can just be one of the problems that you're struggling with, and you're just venting these and asking your friend for help to resolve it.
Can you please consider doing video on the topic about how to act when you're on the other end of the situation - when you don't return someone's feelings? (Thanks for you hard work and helpful content)
This makes so much sense. It's almost like you were there with me. already watched this twice. Please share more on how to stay out of friend zone. One of the problems with me is I just have very few friends or just one friend at a time regardless of gender.
If you find yourself catching feelings, then make your intentions clear. Then let her decide. Remember you're risking the friendship in order to be in a romantic relationship. If she doesnt recipricate then move the heck on. Thats how you get out of the friend zone. Shoot your shot or lose the friendship. Thats a risk youre going to have to take.
@11:16 - My plutonic relationship with the now disgraced former planet is, I am afraid, indeed unrequited. I am glad you made this video to help me identify my issues and move on from them.
key thing is being in control and alert of your emotions. if you just dive in with limerence you're just blasting one sided desire and it comes off as a huge bomb of feelings put on the other person.
just learned this lesson painfully, and this was actually the result i came to for how i would do things differently. walk away before your feelings grow (if the person is specifically unavailable), or have a conversation about it. im going to take this video as a sign that im getting over it 😅 and i'll be more aware if the situation comes up again
There is something I definitely agree with. When men has attachments to a girl that they are talking to more than anyone else. Females on their side has tons of guy friends they talk to on a daily basis. Whereas with men we establish are main source of friends being with men then having that emotional connection with a female definitely develops the relationship more into actually falling in love with them. I see the solution as either spending less time with them to not get emotionally attached or trying to get more female friends to release more emotional energy around them so you are not focused with one.
17:50 - I feel like, even among adults, this is a really good way to make people avoid you. I don't think the typical person can handle this kind of directness. I would _love_ being this direct with people, but is it actually practical?
That said, I do think this can be done in a more indirect way depending on your personality and communication style. I'm a goofball by nature so if I notice myself starting to feel attracted to someone I could say something like "Oh dang, I'm catching feels for you!" with a big smile. I can say it in a way they know I'm telling the truth, but not in a way that it has some huge significance or _gravitas_ where it needs to be responded with immediately or with uncomfortable seriousness.
In my experience, the more open and honest I've been with my friends and romantic partners, the better every single interaction have become. Even the ones involving rejections. So I'd totally try that if I were in the situation described in the video.
@@PierreMiniggio Interesting. I'll admit I've not had much experience in terms of romance-related stuff since my teen years. And I'm in my early 30s now. So maybe I'm still looking at things from an adolescent perspective, when really, people are more mature than I assume.
as another point to add to this definitely working out between mature, reasonably self confident people is making sure you’re on the same page about what the relationship is makes relationships 10x easier to be in, in my experience. Even friendships! I’d much rather know what kind of relationship I can have with someone and have that be secure then have the one I want and it be unsecure. i definitely hear your point about a lot of people being too insecure to have super direct conversations about this stuff though!
Dr. K I greatly appreciate your videos, they have helped me a great deal in this past month and they have greatly helped me in demystifying my own life and my own psyche. They have also helped me to reduce the number of bricks in the bag that I was carrying so to speak. Thank you! This is a great topic for a video and one that is relevant to me, especially having been friend-zoned more times than I care to admit. One thing I have struggled with when interacting with girls and women that I am attracted to is being able to effectively strike that balance between not being boring and platonic, but not being weird, creepy, overbearing and uncomfortably forward or aggressive. If you were willing, I'd love to see a video specifically on that matter. Another thing I have struggled with and I'd love to hear your insights into this, this may sound like a black and white statement, but it seems like every time a girl or woman I am attracted to seemed to like me or respond positively to me, I have done something or said something to screw it up or bungle it, often without realizing it. Again, I'd be interested in hearing about your thoughts on this.
Man, I gotta say: Discovering your channel feels like I'm entering a new chapter in my life.
Me too!!
I totally agree
Same
Same here. Definitely began a healthy journey of looking within myself to better understand myself
Me too bro happy to be on the journey with this community!
“Avoiding the friendzone” is based on a false premise. It assumes you have agency to cause the other person to friendzone you or not. Life isn’t a video game where the correct actions guarantee you a specific result. Often no matter what you do, it has no effect on the other persons interest. You can avoid the friendzone more generally by not fixating on people that don’t feel the same about you.
What I got out of this video was that I got to get my crush up on a high and rickety bridge somehow...
Basically unfriend them and move on lol
Basically, if you don't intend to be just friends with them, express your intentions early and move on if they don't reciprocate and you don't see value in just a friendship.
You do have agency. A friendship is a two street therefore do not be their friend if friendship with that person hurts you. You wouldn’t be friends with someone who physically hurts you. Why emotionally?
@@lemlonspirit1988 Dr. K’s advice was valid, not disagreeing with what he said. Just giving my take on the whole friendzone idea.
another thing that sucks and wasn't mentioned it the video is that when you have feelings for somebody, you try to look for hints in every word they say and tend to misinterpret a lot of their words. I was in love with my best friend for many months and every time he would say that I look very pretty in a picture I would be like omggggg he is so in love with me. now, thinking about it after he rejected me, ummmm, no, he was just making a compliment and being nice while my brain was desperately clinging onto every gesture that could theoretically be considered romantic.
this is the thing i'm struggling with rn. it's fine because i know i will eventually get over these feelings, but i hate watching myself act like a conspiracy theorist even as i know that the connections i'm making are nonsensical
This
I don't know if she likes me or not.
She said I'm cute cuz i did something , so i just said thanks and walked away xd
She did some uh... Hints maybe? But she must've been just be kind to me. Idk dude I'm clueless and an IT guy, so i don't know anything about girls.
She craves attention from others though, so i don't give in and compliment her or anything, but this takes away my flirt game. Also we only meet in work, so i don't even want to be seen as a creep.
Also scared 🥹
this is called limerence. Yes it has a therminology. There is a book called Love and Limerence that explain the whole process if someone is interested
Yes, this is what happens to many people, myself included. I think my ADHD makes it worse too. The social norm of "sending hints" is honestly cancerous because it keeps us in a state of ambiguity rather than saying how you feel. I actively try to stop myself whenever I feel like I'm over invested in the way the person is acting towards me. Better safe than sorry. If it's real, we should say it.
I'm an introvert, watched this video multiple times to gather up my courage before I ask her. Yesterday I told her about my feeling, I was so prepared to hear the rejection but turns out she gave me a green light. My response to her is "Okay" and then dead silent for 5 minutes because I did not expect that kind of reaction after being her friend for over 9 years. Now our conversation become more romantic and preparing to confess to her in a couple of days. Thanks for your help, Dr K!
I wish you the best!! May everything work out for the two of you! 😁
So are you double confessing to her?
How did it go?
Yo we need to hear what happened next
Sorry for the late update guys, we've been in relationship for almost 2 months. The confession process is kinda chaotic and unprepared, glad she understand that I'm not experienced with something like this. For anyone wondering, the confession is different with talking about your feelings, I understand it's difficult to relate by just watching Dr K video, but you'll know what I mean after doing it too. Good luck everyone!!! 😇
Just make your intentions clear bros, if you don't get a positive response you're not going to get further than the friend zone
and you should move on
What about if losing contact with that person if there’ll be a confession? So it’s not quite neutral result..
@@ladapandasucks but you’ll live
@@ladapanda If you both actually value your friendship even if its "just" platonic, I don't think that is likely to happen. Also, what is the alternative? Hiding your feelings until they think you're creepy? It's much worse than being upfront about your feelings in the first place. I had to learn that the hard way, unfortunately.
yeah seems like it, but thats not always true.
A friend of mine tried to push a relationship, but she said she just wants to be friends. 6 Month later and they are together now.
So make your intentions clear is definitely good, but the second half of the statement is false.
That ending
Very helpful
You aren't being rejected. You aren't asking them out. You have a problem that you are talking out with your friend.
I'm afraid of conflict and abandonment but my fear of conflict is much easier to control as I gain the slightest confidence. I can talk to a friend. It's still hard but I just talked to a friend about a problem and how I felt about it. I needed this.
You kind of are asking them out, you aren't deciding on a date but you're letting them know that you would be open to a date. The challenge is getting over the phrase "asking them out". In both scenarios of sharing your feelings or asking them out your feelings can be rejected. Getting over rejection is the hard but best route forward.
i really disagree with some parts of this video. it just flippantly ignores the complexity of how most of this goes down so much so that the recommended things to do makes one sound like a robot. i've been on both sides of the issue and i can tell you, its just not a fun experience for either side, the only thing that works is finding ways to distance yourself from the person you're in love with which to me is the one thing i can totally agree with him on in this video.
Most ppl in friendzones know what the answer will be if they ask out "the friend", there are various body language or behavioural tests you start to carry out to see if a girl is feeling you like that, so most of the times you know if she's unwillingly to go act that way around you its a non-verbal communicado that she aint interested, so distance yourself abit just so you dnt fucking make things weird, find someone else way prettier to crush on.
Yeah me having romantic feelings for someone is a problem that needs to be fixed, that's all. That narrative will definitely help boys and men struggling with their feelings in a society that already tells them they're doing something wrong by having them.
@@Plasmafox the problem is not your feeling, the problem is the discrepancy of feelings between two people, it's both side. so talking it out is like a reality check together and then resolve from there.
@@xCCflierx We have the same pfp. For a second, I thought I had already watched the video a year ago and commented lol
This is THE video I needed to see today. Recently I started developing feelings for a guy friend and I have not known what to do about it. I became tired of years of bottling up my feelings, so I wanted to "confess" today and then run away scared of the answer, as I have always done previously. But I clicked at the video at just the right time. So, right now we're having the conversation (it's still going - we met offline, but live in different cities at the moment). And it's turning out to be one of the healthiest conversations in my life. I know: even if I'll be sad at the end, at least I've saved MONTHS of wondering and hoping, and I will get better much faster, because I'm doing it now
Good luck with your approach
Good job! I hope it works out for you.
Hey, although random, I'm looking for someone like you.
Good luck Foxy!
Well I'm im glad you said offline and not online cause those are more often then not, not real
Key thing I have learnt today-
If you want to avoid this whole FZ cycle you MUST:
i. Be emotionally aware of yourself
ii. You should recognize those romantic feelings
iii. Have an EARLY convo with him/her/them, right then and there
*You are actually TRYING TO SOLVE A PROBLEM WITH YOUR FRIEND*
Step no 1.Don't get into the friendzone . Show your romantic/sexual interest in a girl right from the beginning and take the risk of getting rejected .
@@debanikgoswami4834 Take it from an old dude, that is the best way to go. Sure, I've seen it work for someone else, and the gal was gorgeous, but there were a ton of vultures along with this guy waiting for her marriage to fail, so out of probably a dozen guys there was one and he got kicked to the curb after a while. She's been married 3 times.
Just be upfront or flirt, if you get rejected at the flirt level, then either accept it or move on. Don't be wasting weekend nights on this kind of gal. Coffee, homework, but save your time and money for someone that likes you the way you like them.
YOOOOOOOOOO
It's weird though: why have we developed a convention, as a society, where men and women are basically required to be complete strangers in order to fall in love? Why CAN'T we start out as friends first? I would imagine that 3-6 months isn't, for a lot of people, actually enough time to get to know someone enough to know whether you want to engage in a romantic relationship.
I agree, it's so weird and seems extremely high-risk.
I'll drink to that. It feels like a normal sunny cloudless day but all of a sudden a nuclear bomb drops. It takes time to get to know with each other, to warm up first. Unless... you're looking for a casual relationship though (not serious one).
Yeah, I totally agree. My crush at the moment told me the same. I realized that I grew feelings and not even three weeks in I told her, hey, I feel like I want to date you, what do you think about it? She told me she wants a relationship to grow out of a deeper friendship and leave the stress out of it, but she wants to deepen our relationship and know more about me. I still flirt outside of this engagement a little bit here and there, not that serious at the moment, but still.
Simply put, it's because of opportunity cost and ghosting. Why should you risk your friendship with someone for gambling on a romantic relationship if you can just keep it? It's pretty common in today's society to ghost your ex even if you had a good relationship and a "fair" break-up. So instead, people just avoid advancing in their relationship with another person and instead look for romantic feelings in complete strangers, 'cause you ain't losing anything if you get rejected, you break up or the relationship fails in any other way.
In this day and age, it might even call it an inevitable process one individual has to go through. Forming friendships without tapping into the potential of romance and forming romantic relationships with strangers 'til something works out has now become the norm.
That’s not society unfortunately. That’s psychology. It isn’t logical. It is emotional. Love doesn’t make sense. Remember that.
You can manipulate yourself and others to fall in love more or less, but it is like being controlling of your pet. It is not completely in your control, yet it mostly is, by using the levers that you have at your disposal.
I “escaped” the “friend zone” after 8 or 9 years of pursuit. Lusting over someone for that long doesn’t put you in a place to have a healthy relationship and ultimately the flame burned out instantly. I wish I would have seen something like this when I was much younger but I can’t trade the lessons I’ve learned. Good luck friends!
exactly what has been happening to me
And here I thought my 3 years were a long time ;)
*_"Good luck friends!"_*
Are you friendzoning us?! ;-)
been in the friendzone for 2 years and thought its very long, just confessed my feelings a week ago and I got rejected, after that I became more sad and always thought to myself we could've just stayed friends but im only saying that bc I miss them to the point that I want them back even as a friend where in reality thats the reason I've been in pain for the 2 years and friends will never work out. Stay strong folks !
@@divhead3521 that sounds rough… :-( maybe you can take an official break from the friendship, so you can process your feelings (maybe with a therapist) and resume it a few moths from now? Wish you all the best.
The worst part about a huge confession at the end of the friendzone is that the girl might actually have feelings for you too, and if you make a huge confession and catch them off guard then they might just panic and say no, and then you end the friendship and both of you feel regret. So what you said about having a casual talk about it is the best way to communicate it.
more people should read this
man this thing happened to me...
This is most excellent advice. I'm proud to say I've broken the cycle recently. Told two women I had feelings much earlier than I typically would. It didn't result in romantic relationships, but the emotional self awareness to acknowledge it and not fear the outcome is freeing.
this is so helpful. i've had such horrible problems with intense jealousy for a long time, i've been hoping you'd do a dedicated video on jealousy but i feel like this addressed some of the fundamental causes of it pretty well.
@@EggEnjoyer ayeeee you as well friend!
Jealousy can come from being too possessive. A person is never yours! It's just your turn.
I suffer from intense envy as well, I made a post on the hgg reddit for it as well.
Bro I'm the most jealous person in the world and I need it to stop
I think this is one of those isolated cases where I would recommend you go to therapy instead, that takes time to manage in a healthy way imo.
if someone is in the formative years watching these videos, taking it in, re-watching them, applying it, this is a literal game changer. this is amazing content. thank you so much, doc.
I dont think the friend zone should be avoided, but rather accepted. One woman who was a friend zone character many years ago introduced me to another woman and we had a beautiful relationship for a while...... Accepting a woman only wants to be friends can open other doors with other women if you let her be herself as your friend....
In other words, if she only wants to be friends, then let her help you as a friend should; by introducing you to other women.
The possible bad side to this is that the other woman could have thought ‘oh, no other woman seems to want him, so would i want him?’ You must have had enough things going for you.
It's sad to see how many young adults (especially men) suffer from this huge problem in our society that no one is willing to talk about or solve.
Glad to have someone like Dr K is addressing this issue.
Dr K definitely helps reduce the suffering, but I also have to be grateful for my suffering. If I would not have suffered from this in the past I would not be the person I am today and I am grateful for that. I don't wish anyone harm. However I do think men new to the dating space have to see this as an opportunity and learn from their mistakes in order to grow. One video might help but experience it what really matters!
There’s no solution, just stop pretending to be friends with people while having ulterior motives. It literally makes you manipulative. You don’t suffer as a result of it. It’s not suffering to be friends with someone and pretend to like them as a person you entitled, privileged fool. It’s being dishonest. Cry about it
Why is it a society problem? And why should anyone solve it? The friendzone is a term coined by men. Women just call it friendship. And no one puts men in that position, they put themselves there by not making their intentions clear. Why would you pretend to be friends with someone you don't see as a friend?
@@malenalucero6473 According to some statistics released in 2019, around 28% of men aged 20-29 in the US had no sexual partners in their whole life. After the pandemic I suspect that this number surpassed 30%, getting closer to 1/3 of all of them, which means fewer couples being formed and fewer people being born, hence it is something that will affect any human society (see Japan and South Korea with a birth rate lower than 1.0). I'm not from the US btw.
@@patrick-915 What about women not wanting to have kids? I don't really think the existence of 'the friendzone' is the reason why population is dropping. The case of Japan is very particular. Women are expected to choose between family or work, they can't have both because men don't do their part when kids get sick etc. Population drops when you force women to choose between financial independence and bearing children.
This is such an important conversation. Omg. Omg omg omg. The part about saying “hey I need to step out of this and give myself time” is a type of boundary you are setting which shall be respected. You deserve to have your own boundaries respected (and vice versa)
Man, I took your advice from this video and said something, and it was all it took for her to admit she also felt the same way Thanks Dr. K, your boy is massively up and I appreciate it.
I told my friend that I have a crush on her in a discussions vibes but not confessing. And she reciprocated. Thanks Dr K ❤
Hopefully some people can genuinely find this helpful because what he is saying is completely true. I ended up figuring out how to do this on my own. I told her that I had feelings for her and wanted to know how she felt. When she rejected me I just explained that yeah, I needed time to process stuff and we needed some strong boundaries. We stopped being friends, and having months away from her was a massive benefit to my mental health. Even now I feel confident that we could be friends because I feel recovered from the whole thing. So big takeaway, disengage. Do not stay in the "friendzone," it will destroy your mental health. Be in healthy relationships, not ones like that.
Finally, the first time someone says something that actually checks out for me. I used to think I was alien and worked differently, because everyone would condemn my behaviour and recommend actions that never felt right. Normally, I only develop romantic feelings for friends, but I usually wait too much "to make sure", because I tend to be afraid of being premature...and then the entire cycle in the video happens and it finally makes sense. I usually heard things like "You should make your intentions clear from the get go" or "You should not make it seem you want to be friends", and those never worked for me, because they were wrong and dishonest, because I did want to be friends and I could not let intentions clear from the get go because they didn't exist in the beggining, the intention was to be a friend. I used to be terrible at emotional awareness and I would only notice I had romantic feelings when I was deep into it and I would shock myself like something unexpected happened, when the truth was that I never understood myself. I'm past those days, thankfully, but now I finally learned where lies the problem: it's not premature to let things clear on the first sign and it is harmful to grow the feelings while hiding them to be on "the safe side" by making sure "your feelings are true". I had long since given up on love because I would always hear stupid advices regarding "timing" and now I actually see a way to do something. It's been awfully long, however, I have to deal with my apathy first now, but at least I know a direction to take when I feel things again.
I relate a whole lot to that first part of "letting your intentions be clear from the get go". As you say, stuff feels dishonest. And, if I may add, completely counter-intuitive: if your partner can't be a good friend, then how can they be a good partner? I can't form romantic feelings without feeling they're good friends first. It just doesn't work that way for me, it simply doesn't.
That said, it's also much better to realize and address those feelings as soon as they come up. That is where the problem lies for me.
@@andrecarvalho6691 yeah, exactly, but people always said that this was wrong, some would even say men only befriend women with second intentions, including my mom...I felt so alien compared to everyone else that I gave up by thinking the way romance works for me doesn't fit reality. But the video made clear this is actually a common occurence with scientific evidence and that it is not a problem in itself (like many people also say), you just need to recognize your feelings and let them clear as they arise. Like you, this was my true problem and one nobody I ever met in life adressed, ever. Some love advices I recieved I even preffered not to even try because of how scummy they were. I'm so glad this video exists and that I'm actually a normal person, I don't feel like I lost cause anymore
"I have to deal with my apathy first now, but at least I know a direction to take when I feel things again."
Too relatable.
The friend zone is usually the man avoiding the risk of rejection by not making a move or showing his real intention. This is self defeating and leads to soft rejection + fake friendship. It absolutely can be avoided by making your intentions clear, making yourself a more attractive partner and being willing to accept rejection and quickly move on.
That's BS. Just keep your eyes open, if a woman is interested in you, you will feel it. You never knock on woman's door. if she wants you the door will be open.
@@axl1002 Most guys are terrible at reading signals from women and women often give mixed signals, so being passive and waiting until you know for sure is a quick path to nowhere. Guys need to flirt more, and be more clear with their intentions
@@WhitePillDave Dude, the game has rules. You don't go in foreign country and demand they to speak your language. Flirting is a game that is all about not exposing your intentions. Women want to play, if you don't like the game you move on and stay single.
@@axl1002 when I say show your intentions I mean by flirting. Flirting in it's very nature is showing romantic / s*xual interest. I'm certainly not implying a man should simp or confess his love, but he should be fun and flirt. But some men act too passive and justify it in their minds that they are playing it cool and not trying too hard.
@@axl1002
Not a game dude. If that’s how you feel about it you will get played.
Just be clear with intentions.
Most women don’t like the games. The guessing. Having to wonder if you’re a friend or a predator lurking.
Holy shit this explains so damn much! I used to get "friend zoned" all the time. Going to therapy helped me control my thoughts and convince myself to stay away from things that hurt me; like distancing a friend because my emotions were too much. I didn't realize how I've never been "friend zoned" since. The last friend and I talked about our feelings and decided the age gap was too much and we'd rather stay friends. Sometimes I crush on him more again but I tell myself it's okey to have these feelings and it's okey to let them go.
Also the idea that emotional connection is different for guys and girls is eye opening.
I had one of these exact conversations with a friend I'd been having romantic feelings towards. She is also very emotionally aware, so I know that when she told me that she didn't have romantic feelings that she's telling the whole truth.
Glad I had the conversation the day before I left for a vacation, it's giving me some good time to continue working through my emotions. Thanks Dr. K, giving me some real hope (and tools).
It's going to take more time to move completely past this, but I feel as though the "friendzone" phase of my life is on the way out. Now to see if I can start dating for the first time in like 6 years
Long story short, people who experience the friend zone have anxious ambivalent attachment syndrome.
I am so glad I am able to let go of friends and acquaintances and be secure by myself.
I really needed this right now, I started getting really close with this girl and I was going to let her travel far away from me without telling her how I feel about her. After watching this, everything makes sense from the first day we met to the day she left. I'm planning to meet with her this Sunday and I will "Solve this problem" with my friend :) thank you Alok
How did it go?
Hmmm maybe not that great?@@Yazan26579
@@Yazan26579 probably failed lol
Did you survive bro
@@Yazan26579 hey man sorry for the late respond only saw this now. I ended up sharing with her my feelings, but she didn’t feel the same way and looked at me as a close friend and in a brotherly manner. At that time I was honestly quite infatuated with her and she wanted to stay as friends and keep in contact. I told her that I wouldn’t be able to do that right now because of my feelings for her but one day when I get over these feelings we might be able to reconnect in her home country in the future. Honestly things ended pretty badly and in an argument where I just left and never talked to her again. I still have her contact details and she messaged me not too long later and we had a short chat. She seems to be doing well. I hope she’s continues doing well wherever she is and I hope I can meet her again someday to atone for that argument and immaturity I showed.
Personal experience, I befriended a woman who was engaged to avoid friendzones and just have a genuine connection. Caught feels and spent 3 months out of contact before hanging out again. I'm proud to say we're gonna start making sour dough bread baking soon, and I'm hyped. It works, and I'm honestly pretty fulfilled just having a friend with a different perspective.
When I was younger, male friends wasn’t something that I even considered. I didn’t think I could relate to them in any way. When I got to know any boy, I immediately romanticized him and idealized him, so obviously eventually I’d develop a crush on him. But I really wasn’t attracted to him in a romantic sense. I just never had a male friend before. So I didn’t know how to FEEL. It’s so common to develop romantic feelings for others and later realize your mind didn’t know what to feel and kept trying to avoid you making friends, making those first months awful but as you actually get to know the person and build intimacy and trust, that shaky feeling, that nervousness, that awkwardness just vanishes.
There’s a saying in Spanish that is very true "la confianza da asco" (something like: trust comes with disgust) meaning that when you have such a great amount of friendship and trust with someone, you’ll inevitably be more yourself. Normally people say it when their friends fart or do something embarrassing in front of their friends because they trust and love them like siblings, so they aren’t afraid a fart will break a relationship lol
Long story short, congrats bro, having friends of all ages and sexes broadens not only our emotional range, but the amount of happiness and fulfillment we can feel.
You're gonna make bread with your totally platonic female friend? Uh oh 🥴
Thank you Dr. K. The fact that you're sharing info like this, AND FOR FREE, is amazing.
Basically, there's a very thin line between friends first and friends only. Take what you will from that.
as someone who does not have the money or time for psychiatry and therapy, this channel has taught me so fucking much about my life and put so much internal questioning to rest
I have had to learn this lesson the hard way over many years, and I'm still working on it. But it's very validating and reassuring to hear that the strategy you recommend (early conversation, stepping back for a while if feelings aren't reciprocated) is what I have begun to do on my own.
Your videos usually make me pause and tear up or cry outright because something hits pretty hard. I am the anxious attachment type, and I have always struggled with the concept of trusting that other options will present themselves. It's why I fell completely apart when my husband passed, and it's what's shaped my "friendships" (usually letting myself be taken advantage of, in order to make sure they don't leave), and my friendzonings.
"Omg, this boy is perfect for me, I will never find another one because he's so close to my ideal man, and it is therefore IMPOSSIBLE that any other man will compare!" Even though finding him in the first place proves that it can happen again.
I will have more rational conversations with men I like, as it happens.
I did lose over a year in unrequited love with a man who catfished me. I never met him and he wouldn't talk with me on the phone. I convinced myself he became distant and eventually all but left the friendship because something was wrong with me, but after it ended and my roommate and I watched the entirety of the show Catfish, it became clear that he had been the one with the problem all along. I did some digging and figured out a lot of stuff about him and there were a lot of things he embellished to seem "better." I realized that he had encouraged me in words to become emotionally involved, while shoving me away in actions, because he was afraid of rejection but unable to communicate that, and afraid of being physically or mentally vulnerable because he didn't realize that any dumbass with $2 for BeenVerified could know everything about him in minutes.
As you said, attachment cools over time. He refused to give me a rejection or acknowledge what he was doing, which dragged it out SO much longer than it should have taken, but I managed to move on on my own. But I do still think of him occasionally, because I have trouble believing I will find someone as good as what I found out was true. The stuff he lied about didn't matter much to me.
I forgot I paid for your courses but I should actually look through them. Thanks for all you do
This sorta kinda happened unintentionally with a female friend of mine. I noticed I had a bit of these feelings when we first started to hang out (mostly just thoughts of "what would a relationship with her look like?") and as we hung out more, we just talked about relationships and marriage more in general (since we're both about to graduate) and we found out we just have different goals and values in our future partners.
She wants a lot of kids, I'm not that picky but I'm worried about finances related to that to begin with since I have a passion I want to pursue. When it comes to our Christianity, she believes in predestination, I believe in free will (this is something you could 100% tolerate in a friendship but would be disastrous when it comes to raising kids together). And a few other things that I'd rather not disclose.
I'm glad I do have that bit of self esteem to recognize what I want in partner and not ignore those needs when considering a relationship and we're both able to help each other grow into better versions of ourselves because we can basically check and balance each others' expectations of the other gender without any tension.
I don't think Calvanism vs Armenianism would be disastrous for raising kids... it's not enough of an issue to break fellowship over, so just both present your point of view and let them decide.
so you and her just hung out as normal friends and talked about relationship and marriage? isn't that discussion for when you are dating?
@@ms9001 Nah, it's more like we're just friends who can answer questions we have with the opposite gender's perspective
The time you waste with somebody doesn't value you the way you do to them, the time you are delaying other person to enter your life that does love you.
Thanks!
If you treat people like people and don’t expect an outcome from them things can happen. I asked a girl out and she said no and we stayed friends because I respected her boundaries and she respected that I didn’t try to “change her mind”. We are good friends to this day.
My current girlfriend sees me having female friends that i retained after asking out as a big green flag that raised her confidence in me as a romantic partner.
@@boxie13 1.) Congrats! it sounds like you have a healthy outlook on interpersonal relationships. 2.) This is always my advice since worst case scenario...you gain a friend!
@@brandonmai6278 thank you! I did not always. It took a lot of work and healing. Pro tip: if the idea of gaining a friend sounds bad look into that feeling dear comment lurkers
This doesn’t always work. If you watched the video youll know why.
@@chasey4069 I’m not giving you a method that always works. But thanks for the feedback
I believe you don’t actually even have to verbalize it. Just ask them to go on an actual one-on-one date once you get some feeling for the other side, and make sure to call it a ‘date’. They will get the message, and you should be able to know the answer simply from their reaction. It will either be: absolutely no, maybe, or yes. If it’s yes, just go for it. If it’s maybe, change your interaction or situation with them so it is slightly more romantic (late night study session, movie, etc.). If it was a clear no, give up and find a new girl to go after, and keep the friendship if you want to. Don’t forget that they used to be a great friend before you catched a feeling, no need to throw it out.
20:09
Dr K this is so important! At the beginning of the rejection period you must take some time and sort your feelings out. I repeat: it is not possible to remain a friend after rejection for some time. I went through this a couple of times and on one occasion it took nearly 2 years for things to settle. And it wasn't the same after.
Trust me: it hurts like hell to be around someone you love without being loved back. Don't do this to yourself. Heal first!
you're very eloquent, dr. K. This topic is such a bummer, it's kinda sad that most of my friendships with men ended just like you said. The thing about "friendzone" is that it is implied that something is going on when there's nothing and it can be so pushy that you feel you're dodging flirts instead of chatting with a friend.
You never know when it's coming but the feeling I have now is that this can happen anytime with any friend, that's how frequent it happened with me.
The solution is so simple, just be honest about your feelings and your intentions, if they reciprocate, good! If they don't, don't force it, take your time and move on.
We need to stop having intersexual friendships, honestly. Neither gender is benefitting from them. Gender segregation should probably be a thing. Then, there could be designated areas to go where both agree that it's a "date seeking" environment.
@@peterharrell7305 yeah, we should definitely segregate instead of... you know, making your intentions known from the start. great idea.
@@peterharrell7305 Nah, segregation would just foster an “us-them” mentality and make relations between genders ten times worse. People of both genders just need to learn social skills and most of the crap that goes on can be avoided.
@richerDiLefto I'm gonna need you to qualify that statement. Please provide an example of the intergration having a positive effect for both genders simultaneously.
@@peterharrell7305 or maybe, but just maybe, men should start acting normal when around women and treat us like we are another human being and not something to sexualize, but yeah man, segregation is the answer
Well this has been a really helpful Video to me. I have been in the friendzone for a couple times, while not interested in Girls that actually liked me. Usually my problem was that my feelings always revolved around Girls that I was already friends with and deepened the friendship with them just as you explained in the video. Also the exact things you mentioned happened to me aswell, the exchange of intimate information, while I receive them as romantic they think of them as building the friendship. Since I'm currently in the same boat (once again), but this time it's even more complicated because it's a colleague at work, it was still at the beginning of developing feelings for them.
So after watching you video yesterday and took my courage to tell them about me starting to get feelings. While the result was not mutual, I immediately felt way better and not as destroyed as usually after the the long build up. Also the response was really nice, letting me know nobody told them their feelings in this way yet. While obviously this is still a punch in the gut, I feel like now I can move on, not communicating for a while and come back once I have something else going for me and resume the friendship. Thanks Dr. K for this video, it really highlights a lot of the things going on in the friendzone, especially while others are trying to make you look at Love signs and stuff, potentially making you think it's actually reciprocated Love. Reading through the other comments here, I feel like this video already helped a lot of people.
I've listened to so many perspectives about this and THIS one makes sense! It feels so good to have clarity on this! Thanks for the wisdom 😁
The way he dissected my love life so accurately is honestly impressive and a bit terrifying
I'm a woman and I feel like I'm being friend zone by a guy and the timing of this video couldn't have been much perfect. Thank you Dr K 🙏
Do girls even struggle with this?
@@ayangko744 yeah, they do
A good thing is to not get „addicted“ to the other person. Don‘t spend every hour with him/her, dont‘t tell him/her everything and spend time with other people. The point is: If you are available all the time, there is no single need for the other person to want you because they already have you. So you need to control the availability and you also need to control rivality. If noone else wants you, you‘re still easily be available for that person. So you have to meet or even date other people that might start a relationship with you.
Also don‘t be overwhelmlingly nice, but always be friendly on a normal level. So that the person you like might think: „Wow he‘s nice but I‘m shure there‘s more“
This of course doesn‘t work all the time but it increases chances (with that person but also with other people) and also doesn‘t make you addicted to one person. Nevertheless, you‘ll feel better.
The fact that what Dr. K explained about falling in love and expressing/confessing is counter-intuitive, at least in relation to what we think about love through media and what our parents told us about finding and getting a partner, is quite a shock. I can't recall anyone mentioning the "optimal period and method" (I'm paraphrasing what Dr. K said) of transforming friendship into love, it was always "if you have feelings towards someone, court them and confess, unless you're faced with a solid NO as an answer. and even then you can try some more, in case she's testing you".
Yeah no, you can't just assume she is testing you like that and even if she was then that is a bad sign as since you continued thinking "What if she is just testing me and actually means yes?" she could claim sexual harassment. If someone says no it is always better to assume they mean no
@@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena That was meant to represent the PUA and red-pill communities spouting the "shit-testing strategy" women are supposedly using. I respect the "no" as an answer.
@@Desteroyah195 Usually their shit testing strategies are not just saying "No". The red pill people avoids the ones that do say no even if they think the woman is shit testing as that is a major red flag to stay away from her especially if she comes chasing after you because you walked away. Also i have no idea what PUA means
Videos like this are so helpful because I feel like it’s made just for me. I’ve struggled with a lot of things described in here and now, I know a direction I can grow in. Thank you for doing what you do Dr. K!
The worst mistake is becoming too attached and having high expectations before any kind of relationship has been established. If you make an effort not to become too attached from the beginning and don't have high expectations, then it becomes easier to cut people loose, especially women. This can also lead to more honest interactions, which is good for building a solid foundation for a relationship to exist upon.
I am so glad you said you can choose who you fall in love with because I've been feeling like that for a while
This video is literally the solution to the problem I've been having for the past 4 months.
I wasn't really in the "friend zone", it was more like this romantic-but-not-dating hell scenario.
But still, this video gave me the solution I've needed for a while. Thank you.
I totally agree, never get into the friend zone!! Start off with the intention of dating and romance. Make that clear right up front!! You can be friends afterwards if things aren't a great romantic fit.
@Nightsong Tarot having romantic feelings for someone is not exactly the same as wanting to "get into their pants".... it's often part of it, but definitely not the same. And why would that be hurtful to know?
I've been going through a phase of limerence for a friend of mine, this video is surely going to help me through it. Thanks dr.K!
the most profound HG video yet imo. it really resonated with me because it's been the last great problem in my life that I had left to deal with. my escape fantasies that I used to cope with a relationship that had some traumatic moments led me to having feelings of limerence for my best friend. fantasies aren't healthy to indulge in nor are they supposed to come true 🙏🏿
fuck, I makes so much sense why I feel so attached to my former date, now best friend. Deep down I'm clearly not over her yet. I don't feel like she friendzoned me, because we mutually decided that we'd rather be best friend than lose each other completely. It's the best friendship I've ever had and she says she really cares about me because for a brief moment we not only had a great time but we also got to know each other in a very meaningful way but man... I've never self such strong emotions since I met her... It would be easier (and not as healthy) to just cut ties and never see or deal with each other again.
ok so. think more about how you are being treated and less about your feelings for her. are you always being used for your time and resources? look objectively at whether or not you are being used or if it's a healthy 2 way relationship.
You said it yourself, you're not over her. And it's kinda hard to grieve for a relationship while it's still alive
She dont, become sigma, make the grind start, dont look for women, look up for money and power. Become the better u, become sigma.
Or meet someone else and spend more time with someone else or other people
@@flowerbomb1907 Money and power will only make you feel as though you are compensating for your perceived "romantic failures." If you ever end up in the predicament that OP has, treat yourself kindly, and give yourself time away from this person your are heartbroken over, and converse about this issue with other friends in your life. Look for things you enjoy to do, and let yourself have a little bit of fun. Maybe even meet new people through mutual friends or at social gatherings. If your feelings end up leaving, then feel free to reengage into a friendship with your old friend.
I was supposed to hit the hay 30 minutes ago but I swear to god this video worth staying up past midnight. It is so life-changing that I thought WHY DIDNT I FIND YOUR CHANNEL BEFORE EVERYTHING! Thankyou!
Thank you for this. I've been talking with a long-time friend very regularly recently and knew I needed to have this conversation by the end of the month. This video gave me the motivation to advocate for myself and have it now, rather than waiting.
Oh my god this explains so much about why a recent rejection I had was devastating and made me cry for weeks!
I have literally experienced and went through the stages you explained at 19:30 almost perfectly about a year ago (only difference is I told them about my feelings once they mentioned there was someone else they liked). It takes a while for the feelings to go away after cutting communication but it was incredibly effective and I'm glad I had the emotional awareness and understanding of the best thing to do in this scenario because I had my first experience with getting attention from a girl (and in response instantly pouring tons of emotional investment and attention back into her) a few months prior and oh boy I learned a lot about myself, my feelings and relationships from that.
Found myself nodding along and being like "YEP exactly that, I've been there and done that!" during the second half of this video. My self confidence has grown in spades since the first experience, the old me and current me are like night and day difference, and that has also poured into me not worrying too much about relationships which is really nice. I actually cared about them like 0% up until these two experiences, but its a lot nicer to be in a space where I feel I'm worth being part of a relationship with someone, and have interest in one, but am not dying or really desperate for one right now.
I glade you learned more about your self. You better than you used to be. Stories like this are can be impressionable if society gave flying f about men's feelings and mental health.
This is actually true, after being friendzoned a couple times I have started distancing myself ever so slightly from girl friends who I'm developing feelings for. And they tend to remain at bay that way.
I wish I’d found this video sooner, I lost someone who I was my best friend and I didn’t tell her until the weeds had taken over. It ended badly and we aren’t talking anymore. Thank you for making content like this available for free ❤
This perfectly just described me I can see basically everything you said connecting to parts of my life😭
That's very helpful and i learned so much from you and the community. This plus the calmness I've received from meditation made me so much more aware of everything. Thank you all for that.
6:01 This is actually really interesting. I used to catch feelings for people all the time, mainly because I struggled with making friends, so when I did, it was special to me. The last two times it happened, it was when I was under some level of stress.
First when I was a month into my new job, and I was in full anxiety mode trying to figure out my life. Then, about 10 months into my job when I was really starting to get overwhelmed and unhappy.
Having a talk about arising feelings without confessions. The thing is, a lot of... young people catch feelings really fast, infatuation, it's hard to downplay that talk as if it's not a confession of sorts and a rejection of sorts if she doesn't share the sentiment. I have had a talk like this with a girl before and the worst part was that she was very "wishywashy", indecisive. It's ok to not know how you feel about a person, but it's frustrating to be on the receiving end of that.
Im Brazilian, and i was diagnosed by social fobia, thanks dude u gave me a new perspective about relationships and myself.
Love the new topic focused videos that have banners for key points and the balance of Dr K talking naturally like he’s talking to a viewer but also structured and clear. I think it’s a good balance with the more casual and flexible viewer interviews esp as a lot of the “filler” words in between during those convos can also be beneficial
Hot take: Apart from what's being said in the video, I think a lot of hetero men who have this issue lean towards the 'demi' side of sexuality, but that is rather incompatible with how hetero dating dynamics normally work for the side of men. The expectations associated with the male gender role in the context of romantic relationships run contrary to a 'demi' leaning.
This is good advice if it actually plays out this way. The problem I run into is that several times the other person refuses to set clear boundaries and continues playing into the relationship because they like the adoration and attention they are getting from me. My feelings end up growing while they never have any intention of giving me a real romantic relationship. I've had this happen so many times I lost count.
Same experience, the woman kept hanging on me over and over again. The first time she rejected me I couldn't even process my feelings, she called me every day and talked about how much I meant to her for like 7 hours etc. Good luck with having any degree of clarity when the woman who friendzoned you desperately wants to keep you close no matter what.
@@EyeOfTheTiger777 Yup. At that point its just being used
@Duxshan i haven't watched the video, but the first thing I think of is both you and the OP aren't setting your own boundaries. The behavior of these women do not sound healthy. Don't be a validation machine for these people. You have to tell them something like "hey, I do care about you,but the amount of attention and love you're giving me is something I've come to expect from partners. We are not romantic, so you have to cool off."
@@D_Jilla exactly. The women these guys are talking about sound like they’re being selfish and playing games. The problem isn’t that the women haven’t set boundaries- their boundary IS overstepping, rejecting, and doing it all over again. So the real problem is that OP and the commenters did NOT send a boundary and consequence with the woman they were with. If you don’t like something, communicate it. If they don’t listen, enforce a consequence (ex: I’m not going to answer you when you talk like this because I’ve told you I don’t like it if you aren’t going to be honest with your intentions).
it sounds like you shouldn't give adoration and attention until you get a clear answer then.
My humble suggestion to you guys is to keep in mind that interest in a person can evolve in romantic attachment or friendship like a crossroads. When you've met someone that attracts you, do NOT take the friendship path, but talk to them and ask them to go out and eventually date. They might say no, but at least you won't have invested a lot in that dream/hope and can avoid all the troubles (hurt, lower self-esteem, remorse, waste of time, self-isolation etc.) it might cause. Once you tread the apparently safer path of friendship, it's unlikely it will then transform into a romantic interest on their side. Better lose someone when they still dont mean too much to you than losing them anyway but with lots of damage.
Yeah, too many simps put themselves into the friendzone .
This is probably going to come into play for me tomorrow!
It will be a touching story of two friends addressing a pile of feelings by taking it out behind the barn, shooting it in the head before it ruins the friendship, and then burying the body together as pals.
Hey Dr K, I think out of all the videos this has been the most useful and something I've actually implemented into my life. Right now I have feelings for someone that I wouldn't have told originally, but maybe has gone on a little long. Going through these experiences has definitely let me grow
As a woman I'd like to contribute the fact that I TRY (as in make a very active effort) to friendzone everyone. Perhaps it relates more to my own experiences and a way to save some hurt in the first place. BUT. there's nothing more attractive than a person being attracted to me. So please take this as a generic advice to be brave to share your feelings.
Presented with a fact that someone I haven't considered romantically prior shares their attraction would be the first time I consider it. Attraction to the idea then potentially GROWS (it takes time to reconsider status quo and unlock the safety vault on any feelings) into a mutual attraction. In my mind that's a perfect scenario for a potential relationship if I could make one up. I wouldn't date someone I haven't known as a friend first.
I recently went through a situation exactly like what you describe. I started a new job and within a few weeks of working there noticed I was getting feelings for this one girl. We were friends for ab 3 months before I told her how I felt, and got friend zoned. Now I’m in this terrible situation where we’re still actually friends and get along well at work and I still have feelings for her baddd. I don’t know if I should just quit my Job and distance myself from her so my feelings don’t keep growing or what
To add to that , I was emotionally aware. I could feel myself catching the feelings and early on I tried to suppress the feelings but couldn’t. She’s older than me and I tried telling myself she’d never date me because of that , but that obviously didn’t stop my feelings from growing. I should’ve told her earlier on but I’d never told someone how I felt about them like that before. I count the fact that I was at least able to convey to her how I feel ,in person and not over text or something like that, as a win. But I regret, despite knowing that stepping away from the friendship after I was friend zoned would be beneficial, I didn’t. She said nothing would be awkward between us and I took her word on it and continued on as if nothing had happened and so did she. But that has not at all helped my feelings go away. I keep telling myself there’s still a chance one day even tho I know that’s not true. I mean it could be but that’d be a miracle lowkey lol
I’ve been friend zoned of course, but when they say it’s because they don’t feel like they’re good enough, that hurts more than just a normal friend zone.
They lied to protect your feelings
This video is pure gold, thanks doctor
Honestly, this was a revelation, thank you, Dr. K! Seriously, this should be shown to more people suffering from being put into the friendzone. I have been pondering how to build a relationship with one person I've been meeting and I want to be a friend, but I have been starved of a romantic relationship for so long, that it wreaks havoc to my emotional state. At the moment, we've called a pause on our relationship for two weeks, because my emotional state was so intense that it led to me spilling my frustrations and doubts to her. It's actually so refreshing to hear that we should discuss the feelings instead of, you know, closing them off to the other person until it comes out as a confession of love. There is a difference between you poking your friend to ask of their opinion compared to you pushing them to a corner and blasting them with a shotgun of love, lmao.
Easy to avoid the friendzone. If you are interested in a person, build up a tiny bit of a rapport with them, but do not become a friend. Ask them out straight away. If they aren't interested move on and ask other people out. If you have already been living in a friend zone for a while tell your friend you want to go no contact for a while to get over the unrequited feelings. Most adults will respect that.
Soild advice, you must love your veggies.!!!
Solid! Can we pin this? I think a lot of ppl should read it!
You would be surprised how good the "I really like you so I am going no contact and let it pass" lands and how mutual contacts deeply respect that
Edit: and sometimes this changes their mind, always do it for yourself though and never to play the long game
No contact? I mean if they say no I just move on and not speak to them again to avoid any future conflict, if that's what you mean.
@@kamitorings you don‘t have to go no-contact forever. Just until things have calmed down. If you choose so. And proper communication would not hurt as well so you don‘t hurt that friend unnecessarily
Avoid the friendzone by not accepting it. Only you can frienzone yourself nobody else can. If you want romance and they dont move on simple as that. But this means you have to get rid of one-itis.
The problem with us indian kids back then was that unrequited love was romanticized by cinema and songs. They told us if we just kept trying eventually she'll change her mind.
Yeah, that sounds like terrible advise. Harass the woman until she breaks down. Classic 🫣
That seems to be the case with American cinema as well, except it’s usually about a dorky guy who gets the cute girl at the end of a story instead of a “cool” guy (and the opposite is also often true). This trope is cute and entertaining, but it’s been on the media so long and so often that people forget that it makes for great storytelling because of its highly *unrealistic* and out of the ordinary nature. This sort of media sets average people up for having unrealistic expectations from the opposite sex in real life, and it’s harmful.
It’s exactly that in the US as well and it’s so toxic. I’ll have to find a go-to book that helps people deconstruct those ideas and beliefs because a lot of people then don’t have an example of what a healthy romantic interaction is and how to handle rejection in a way that respects both parties boundaries
@@richerDiLefto it’s not just unrealistic, it’s just not any form of a healthy romantic dynamic which pisses me off because then we have a bunch of guys who model their behavior off of this and keep getting awful responses so they’re left feeling confused and angry and then women are just being blatantly harassed and treated with no sense of agency or autonomy and so they’re scared and confused 🤦🏻♀️ just a giant mess
Facts! Bollywood has the worst depiction of love and marriage
I NEVER thought of this or heard of this. Just having an honest easy going conversation with the person you like. Wow. 😮 so simple and yet brilliant.
After being on the really bad end of this a few years back and now learning all of this information, this is like revisiting an area where you experienced a horrible accident and now are analyzing what, how and why it exactly happened as a third party of sorts giving lots of insight. Perhaps this is a form of closure.
Hey man thanks so much for making this. This has given me a lot closer to closure for me. During my teens, I feel in love with a chick way older than me and she exploited that and groomed me. I feel disgusting knowing it happened to me. If only you made this years ago before I got taken advantage of. This honestly explains my issues so well and it brings me peace
This has often been the problem when I tried to be friends with people who I thought were really attractive. What's worked best for me (and might not for everyone) is to really be aware of whether the other person is interested in me or not (its obviously very tough to tell, but I'll be looking for very obvious attempts at moving the relationship forward). If they don't then I'll think of them as a "no-go" and really focus on keeping the relationship platonic and maybe not investing too much emotionally. I'll also generally try to be social and meet new people. This has honestly worked wonders for me
I think I’m glad I’ve had awkward situations and blown up confessing because it helped me learned what not to do, as well as the moments things went well.
I had a negative idea that things only went well when the girl asked because I could handle it on the other end. Tho I’ve had very healthy conversations with long time friends that continued because we talked it out and what we both wanted.
Honestly and Communication at opportune moments (in the beginning). Super scary, but honest, rip the band-aid off while it’s fresh so you can move on in whatever direction in a healthy and timely manor. Got it.
This is amazing. I've struggled with the so called friend zone many times before and I've never realized it began with my attachment style and that I was investing so heavily and effectively smothering the other person. Your 3 steps, while really scary to consider doing, make so much sense. I've gone to therapy a few times but never heard this explanation. I think I can actually make meaningful change now. Wow.
I wish i could send this video to me a year ago, i could've avoided the aftermath of my actions. luckily, even though i did this desperate confession twice, my friend was understanding enough that we are still close friends.
this video taught me that communicating your romantic feelings to the person doesn't necessarily mean that you want to enter a relationship with them, that it can just be one of the problems that you're struggling with, and you're just venting these and asking your friend for help to resolve it.
Can you please consider doing video on the topic about how to act when you're on the other end of the situation - when you don't return someone's feelings?
(Thanks for you hard work and helpful content)
Know your worth. If she/he isn’t interested, they will never be interested.
This makes so much sense. It's almost like you were there with me. already watched this twice. Please share more on how to stay out of friend zone. One of the problems with me is I just have very few friends or just one friend at a time regardless of gender.
Maybe try just talking to more people. Sure, a few of them may reject you, but overall you would gain more friendish people.
I swear your videos always find me when I need them the most.
Thank you for saying this, doctor. I need this
If you find yourself catching feelings, then make your intentions clear. Then let her decide. Remember you're risking the friendship in order to be in a romantic relationship. If she doesnt recipricate then move the heck on. Thats how you get out of the friend zone. Shoot your shot or lose the friendship. Thats a risk youre going to have to take.
I would actually like to hear what the impacts of the freindzone on the other attachment styles is.
@11:16 - My plutonic relationship with the now disgraced former planet is, I am afraid, indeed unrequited. I am glad you made this video to help me identify my issues and move on from them.
key thing is being in control and alert of your emotions. if you just dive in with limerence you're just blasting one sided desire and it comes off as a huge bomb of feelings put on the other person.
Here after viewing the most recent members stream. You can go back as far as you want in dr k's catalog and find something useful.
just learned this lesson painfully, and this was actually the result i came to for how i would do things differently. walk away before your feelings grow (if the person is specifically unavailable), or have a conversation about it. im going to take this video as a sign that im getting over it 😅 and i'll be more aware if the situation comes up again
...also it's not hard to get people to buy oreos 😂
There is something I definitely agree with. When men has attachments to a girl that they are talking to more than anyone else. Females on their side has tons of guy friends they talk to on a daily basis. Whereas with men we establish are main source of friends being with men then having that emotional connection with a female definitely develops the relationship more into actually falling in love with them. I see the solution as either spending less time with them to not get emotionally attached or trying to get more female friends to release more emotional energy around them so you are not focused with one.
17:50 - I feel like, even among adults, this is a really good way to make people avoid you. I don't think the typical person can handle this kind of directness. I would _love_ being this direct with people, but is it actually practical?
That said, I do think this can be done in a more indirect way depending on your personality and communication style. I'm a goofball by nature so if I notice myself starting to feel attracted to someone I could say something like "Oh dang, I'm catching feels for you!" with a big smile. I can say it in a way they know I'm telling the truth, but not in a way that it has some huge significance or _gravitas_ where it needs to be responded with immediately or with uncomfortable seriousness.
I’m a goofball when I’m happy around people I like
Don’t be a *****
In my experience, the more open and honest I've been with my friends and romantic partners, the better every single interaction have become.
Even the ones involving rejections.
So I'd totally try that if I were in the situation described in the video.
@@PierreMiniggio Interesting. I'll admit I've not had much experience in terms of romance-related stuff since my teen years. And I'm in my early 30s now. So maybe I'm still looking at things from an adolescent perspective, when really, people are more mature than I assume.
as another point to add to this definitely working out between mature, reasonably self confident people is making sure you’re on the same page about what the relationship is makes relationships 10x easier to be in, in my experience. Even friendships! I’d much rather know what kind of relationship I can have with someone and have that be secure then have the one I want and it be unsecure.
i definitely hear your point about a lot of people being too insecure to have super direct conversations about this stuff though!
You were merely placed into the friend zone, I was born in it, MOLDED by it ...
Dr. K I greatly appreciate your videos, they have helped me a great deal in this past month and they have greatly helped me in demystifying my own life and my own psyche. They have also helped me to reduce the number of bricks in the bag that I was carrying so to speak. Thank you! This is a great topic for a video and one that is relevant to me, especially having been friend-zoned more times than I care to admit. One thing I have struggled with when interacting with girls and women that I am attracted to is being able to effectively strike that balance between not being boring and platonic, but not being weird, creepy, overbearing and uncomfortably forward or aggressive. If you were willing, I'd love to see a video specifically on that matter. Another thing I have struggled with and I'd love to hear your insights into this, this may sound like a black and white statement, but it seems like every time a girl or woman I am attracted to seemed to like me or respond positively to me, I have done something or said something to screw it up or bungle it, often without realizing it. Again, I'd be interested in hearing about your thoughts on this.
And yes I have waffled in the friend zone when I liked a girl being afraid to make my intentions known.