We have had a battery electric vehicle for over two years now. The experience of charging away from home is so depressing that we would consider going back to a petrol only car. Uptake is very much dependent on the available infrastructure. Infrastructure should be the highest priority in encouraging people to go electric.
I have a Skoda Enyaq with an 80kwh battery. That means I can go on pretty long road trips and either have no need to charge or only very rarely. Went on holiday to the Lake District. Getting there was about 340miles. Found a charger near the M6 on the way up and put in 50%. I had 36% left at my destination. A similar story on the way back. I also have a Nissan Leaf, which I still have, and with only 20kwh of usable battery capacity I could still do fairly long trips, albeit charging up after 60 miles or so. The Leaf did give me some range anxiety but I never ran out of charge and the charging provision has come on by leaps and bounds recently. Just stick with your EV. Your grandchildren will thank you for your altruism.
Yup, it’s now accepted (by data driven people, at least), that EVs will soon be the less expensive option. It’s now entirely about infrastructure. Charging at home is a wonderful convenience compared with an ICE experience. Charging away from home is a relative inconvenience.
@@G-ra-ha-m Which is good for second-hand buyers, making EVs cheaper for them. All this will stabilise soon as EVs stop being a novelty. They are already cheaper for a lot of people - that number will grow over time.
I think the people with driveways are the ones buying BEVS at present for cheap charging. There are a lot of people who live in terraced houses and flats that BEVS are impractical.
@@paulc6766 You don't have to schedule out an hour of your day to refuel your ICE car at the station tho. For people who rent/live in flats/roomshare EVs are basically impossible to own.
@@sudiptodas0001 If 10 million UK homes have off road parking how many more EVs to saturate that market? (8.5million more EV sales ? ) I have 2 on my drive and my son and daughter will make 4 when they get them.
PLEASE Don't confuse vehicle registration statistics with actual SALES. The SMMT figures do NOT relect the true position.Just look at the number of pre-registered new EVs on Autotrader. Not facing up to the facts will put many dealers and possibly a major car manufacturer out of business.
@@SigFigNewtonutter rubbish! Look at the number of delivery mileage Tesla models on Autotrader all manufacturers are forced into it because of Government meddling and it is killing the motor industry. I worked in motor trade for 18 years. You clearly have no clue.
In Australia, GM and Ford withdrew from local manufacturing 10 years ago, so there is no home industry to protect with tariffs. We are currently enjoying the choice of cheap chinese EVs and a price war for market share. Australian buyers are very happy ! 😊
@@ElectricCarAustralia I forgot to mention that ANY cars above the $76,950.00 luxury tax threshold still attract a 33% additional Government tax. (Alot of vehicles listed around the $70k mark).
On the other hand Every tradie here aspires to drive the likes of dodge rams etc and the government uses our taxpayer dollars to subsidies the fing things.
The only problem is that every tradie and his dog aspire to drive things like dodge rams etc and the government uses our tax dollars to subsidies the fing things.
Only one in ten battery electric vehicles sold in the UK is to private buyers. The rest are business purchases because of tax incentives. EVs are currently too expensive for private buyers
So why wouldn't private buyers consider a decent used EV instead of a new one? I saw someone get a really nice 2016 Renault Zoe with 35k miles on it, for £4400 a while back. Why do you assume an new EV is the *only* option? Plenty of decent used EV's out there now.
@@Brian-om2hh I imagine the reason private buyers who buy new is the reassurance of a long warranty and the relative absence of risk. Buying a used EV is very high risk.
@@andyburns6496 i bought a 2 year old nissan leaf in 2016 , ran it for 7 years. No issues , very reliable. someone bought it off me at 9 yrs old . asked me if it had a new battery because it still had all its battery bars and range. I've been driving 40 + years. All cars have risk attached to failures. Battery and drive train warranties for current electric cars are longer than any vehicle i've owned in the past. Hence why i bought another EV with my own money brand new.
@@andyburns6496 This is a fair point. Thankfully we now have a few years of EVs being around and are better able to gauge the risks. 5 years ago I would have been more wary but now I would be more than happy to buy an EV that's 3 or 4 years old ... and there are some bargains to be had! I would say the risks are now comparable with buying a used combustion car.
What this ban is going to do is stop people from throwing cars away and keep them running instead. First step is reduce, second is reuse. Everyone forgets those because they want to consume
Keeping old cars running is 'good' in terms of getting the most out of the original production emissions... however, it's bad given that older ICE cars typically have higher emissions than (equivalent) newer ones, and they will still emit very mile they drive. As such, personally I think older ICE vehicles should be replaced (e.g. with a *second hand* EV, not a new one) as soon as a reasonable (price, range, and features) EV is available. After all, if it's a second-hand EV, then it's already paid off it's 'production emissions' *and won't generate any more*, unlike the older ICE vehicle.
@@logicalChimp A person who continues to insist on driving petrol doesn't care about the used EV market, it's not about accessibility. There will be a bastion of resisters for as long as petrol cars remain available. This ban means that everyone recalcitrant to the new tech, who already wasn't going to switch, is now forced to maintain the carbon captured by reusing the old, rather than buying new and continually throwing away the older cars. I am not talking about a cool hypothetical best case scenario, I am pointing out a silver lining in the inevitable. We can't take all gas cars off the road, but we can make them recycle
This is a transition not a revolution. Keep doing the basics - better batteries, cheaper batteries, better charging infrastructure. It's not rocket science, how quickly it happens depends getting the basics right & stop being distracted by all these 'digital extra' features that EV manufacturers seem to be obsessed with.
Take the mandate away and make the new tech desirable so people choose to have them. And as you comment, by making them basic focusing on the main requirement for a car they become more affordable.
@@palemale2501 and also, cars that are quicker than an ICE sports car from 0-60, ripping up the road surface, how do insurance companies ever begin to provide affordable insurance for younger drivers, when every car made is a performance car, in my day you got into your 1.0L Austin Metro , or mini, and it did 0-60 eventually, everyone was happy
@@craigsketo- Nearly every EV involved in an Accident is currently written off too - higher insurance costs, more complex waste to be disposed of too ! The conundrum goes on ?
@@cad4246 Those will be the ones paying over the odds in PCP interest who can't get on the housing ladder! There will come a time when buying on-the-tick reverts back to save and buy outright ... that cycle has happened a few times since the 70's! I bought my last car on PCP and paid it off after a month. Got a great discount because of the finance deal and saved £4k in interest ... just because I saved up for the 3 years prior to that first. Had the car 8 years now. Couldn't do that with the starting price of a comparable EV workhorse!
Majority are company car leases. However, I have noticed some amazing deals in the public market recently - eg Lease Loco for Ora Funky Cat or VWID7. Being able to get a new high quality BEV for £200 a month is incredible. The used market is even better - Peugeot and Vauxhall have depreciated so much they're at bargain prices.
I live in Las Vegas and was living in LA last year. It seems that one in every five cars is an EV now. It's great. As charging infrastructure and battery tech continues to evolve, things will accelerate. People saying "EV sales are dropping" are also saying that in the context of very high interest rates with a slowing economy. At this point you couldn't pay me to go back to gas! I charge up at home for like $6, it's fantastic.
@@Crusader1984 did you know that gas cars catch on fire 60x more often than EVs? It happens so often that the news doesn’t report it. Where do you live, Mad Max?
@@Crusader1984we have had multiple Battery storage fires here in SanDiego. Communities are getting wize to this and blocking them from ever coming in. Why is it Libs are pouring Billions of dollars into Conserative Republican States. For Votes literally buying votes! Why do EV need so much Govt money?
It is superior period. I give you the caveat of towing with ICE vs towing with BEV but that will fall also. Remember when Leaf was the only BEV people could buy and the range was pathetic? Truth is electric will take over before the ban takes effect. Norway is your avatar. 90% of new sales are BEV.
@@cre8tvedge beta max was superior to vhs . Vhs still won. Lazerdiscs to dvds . Hd dvds to bluray . Vr will take over gaming Just because rich business men want their tech to succeed doesnt mean the public has any interest in buying it . The government trying to force people to buy this one true tech will make most people want to buy any other alternatives possible. Of course there will always be the elites who will rush out to buy the latest gimmick.
@@kevenharvey9711 As a family who have ditched combustion cars it was 1, a big outgoing buying fuel 2, a lot of kwh equivalent 3, more than double our also gone gas boilers annual energy consumption. So if we as a family can ditch 12500 kwh of gas , 26000kwh equivalent in petrol/diesel. and replace that with an additional 7000kwh of electric minus 3300kwh we now generate from PV its looking achievable to me.
I'm hanging on to my Ford Fiesta for as long as possible. With no recognisable EV charging infrastructure outside of London the future looks dim for EVs here in the UK.
There is plenty of EV charging infrastructure outside London. There are ten level 3 chargers from various providers within 6 miles of home and I live in the sticks.
@@rogerphelps9939how many vehicles can each of these chargers accommodate simultaneously? How does that compare to the throughput achieved by all the filling stations within 6 miles of the same location? (I strongly suspect I already know the answer.)
@@lukedogwalker There are 4600 cars per filling station on UK roads , we have seen what happens with panic buying. The number of filling stations has peaked and is falling.
You should not try to shut your eyes to some key factors on EV sales : 1. poorer countries will slow down sales earlier if EV prices Don’t lower down quickly 2. some countries have a huge percentage of people living on flats with no chance of charging at home 3. electricity price plays a big factor in EV sales 4. The lack of any kind of legislation regarding battery condition and range on used cars can have a big impact on used market and therefore on increasing the number of EVs on the road 5. The unknown world of battery replacement is still a big fear on second hand buyers . While EVs are the future of cars they have a huge number of game stoppers to a huge number of people . My parents for example, will not go for an EV : they don’t have money to buy a 15.000€ used car - they are the kind of people who have a 25 year old car and will use it until he doesn’t work anymore. I guess you can all imagine the millions of people in the world who are in the same situation. I’ve been in the UK some days ago and I can understand the hype there: you can buy a 10 years old car for 3.000 ou 4.000£, or even less. In Portugal the same car will cost you twice of even 3 times that value . That is the kind of numbers you have to understand when looking at EV future . A 2019 Tesla Model 3 here , with a respectable mileage costs between 20.000 and 25.000€ for you to know …
@joaoreis1079 You made some good points. In China next year there will regulations that evs will need to be checked every year and come up to a standard. This is where ev battery swapping will come into its own, every swap the battery gets checked, no need to charge at home, no need to get out of the car in the dark and rain to charge, don't have to worry about the battery, can upgrade in 3 minutes to a bigger battery for the holidays, civilised queueing on the app. Nio just introduced a cheaper brand Onvo, and a smaller cheaper brand coming next year, also Changan, Chery, Forseven and many other brands will be using Nios platform, they're trying to get swap stations into the UK soon.
As Harry’s Garage stated, only 40% of homes have access to a garage/forecourt for home charging. Public charging is expensive and stressful. My partner and I were desperate to buy an EV, but when we did the maths, considered the problems of charging, we ended up buying an ICE Clio. For many people EVs just aren’t viable atm.
There's a big difference between not having access to a charger right now, and not having it in 10 or 20 years time. People like Harry confuse the two and assume that landlords and councils will never install chargers, and ignore evidence from places like Norway that have solved the problem fairly easily. And if 60% of people do have a drive but only 10% of the cars on the road are EVs, there's plenty of time before this becomes a real issue. You should write to your local councillor and ask what they plan to do about it.
Transitioning the cabling infrastructure to cope with the massively increased demand millions of evs would place on it will cost in the trillions, not billions. It simply isn't going to work when better alternatives already exist, doesn't make economic sense.
@@robinbennett5994 We will never have a charger where we live, the cost is prohibitive and we can't charge from home (we live in a flat). The owners of the property have said that it would literally cost millions to provide chargers. In our area public chargers are being removed and/or not being commissioned due to lack of demand....
@@salnaturile8653 No need for massive infrastructure upgrades... the grid already handled peak-time power demands, which are 3-5x higher than overnight demand... and most EVs charge overnight. If anything, increasing the number of EVs will help *stabilise* the grid, and reduce electricity prices (and it's the national grid and power companies saying this - the National Grid posted a study about it a year or two ago, iirc).
I have looked at a few Harry’s garage videos and I’m afraid he’s a very biased petrol head. But you did the right thing and did what works for you in the end after some research. Based on your figures 40% of the UK may find an EV and much better choice for them.
As it stands the government has a 22% BEV sales target and fines for not meeting this. The current situation is BEV are struggling to make 16% so the supply of ICE cars are being restricted to avoid fines. But this situation is even worse as the sales figures for BEV are heavily manipulated by industrial scale pre-registering with the manufacturer taking massive loses. Sales to private individuals have collapsed in the UK with only company car sales and schemes like Motability propping up sales. But the smoke and mirrors are coming to an end and with the mandate increasing to 28% next year it will be carnage in the car market. Already the waiting lists for ICE cars is stretching out to 6 months and dealers are saying 1 year waiting list will be upon us soon.
@@OverlandExpedition Good point, I keep forgetting about the link ban :( F**king spammers. Anyway... First one I'd like to see clarified: "the sales figures for BEV are heavily manipulated by industrial scale pre-registering with the manufacturer taking massive loses" Second one: "the waiting lists for ICE cars is stretching out to 6 months" (and what's the comparable waiting list for a BEV? It was 3 months when I got mine, 18 months ago)
Imagine *wanting* an ICE car😂 I want a noisier drive for a worse music listening experience. Slower acceleration is really my cup of tea. Most importantly, I love going to petrol stations. Filling up at home sounds like a nightmare.
Didn't know about that proposal ban...Wow..that is how you save the planet and its resources. Make everything non-reparable and make people buy new stuff every year. What a hypocrisy...
No it hasn't. This is disinformation. Go and read a fact-check site. They have proposed better tracking of scrapped cars so make use they are disposed of properly. People still get to decide for themselves when to scrap a car, just like now.
The increase in used bev will be due to huge surge of end of company car lease agreements as well as some selling to buy another new but I agree the 93% seems a tad optimistic and goes against my experience with friends and colleagues
You are right because I just walked past a Tesla dealership and was dragged in and the thumb screws were put on and I was beaten mercilessly until I bought an electric car. True story.
@ouethojlkjn some dealers have already stopped selling ice cars this year because they are nowhere near the EV sales targets, when people go in to buy a new ICE car the dealers are trying to force them into buying an EV. If EV's were so good they would sell on their own merit without all this bullshit. To put into perspective when pro EV people bang on about how sales are going up last year ICE fiestas alone outsold all the EV's combined. I am an electrician and have been fitting domestic chargers since 2012 and the majority of our customers have got fucked off with them and gone back to ICE cars. We did an NICEIC update training course last year and the bloke running the course said make as much as you can as quick as you can because the arse is going to fall out of the market. Ev sales across the board are nowhere near hitting their targets and used ones prices are going through the floor.
@@ADYDRURY1234 Interesting what you say and of course, you will not be surprised that I disagree with you. I was in a car dealership myself last weekend and there was no pressure at all for me to go one way or the other. So it's isn't the recent experience I have had. Incidentally, I went to look at a Dacia Spring - an EV for less than £15k on the road. Note that in America, there are at present 3.5 millions unsold new cars sat on dealer forecourts going all the way back to 2022 models. So someone in their millions isn't buying ICE either. Finally, don't be confused about all the subsidies and tax breaks the petro chemical industry receives globally - if these were not in place, UK diesel per litre fuel costs would be around 60p per litre more than it is now. Nice to know EVs owners are forced to give tax breaks to fossil fuel drivers eh? Oh, and a sub £20k Fiesta is not a £90k Mercedes so a rather pointless comparison. What sort of Fiesta can you get for £15k I wonder - that Dacia Spring will be in direct competition with them.
There was no need to mandate a stop of sale of vinyl records or cameras with film, it just happened anyway apart from some small number of enthusiasts. It will be the same for cars regardless of mandates.
That already happened when people transitioned from EVs to IC over 100 years ago. 100s of EV makers who could not make this advancement went bust. Forcing a return to EVs is like forcing a return to film cameras. Very few people want to do it. But if you created enough incentives and penalties, and claimed it would 'save the planet' you could probably hit similar re-adoption levels. And no doubt enthusiasts would sing it's praises- "I don't mind waiting an extra hour for my photos to get developed, I like taking breaks anyway" :)
@@SteveLomas-k6k The switch to ICE was greatly helped by the convenience of the electric starter, few enjoyed the manual crank to start the car. Now the starter can run the whole car...
@@zapfanzapfanI take your point! But it wasn't the last IC improvement. My local golf course switched from electric to gas carts a few years ago. Electronic ignition and fuel injection removed the easy-start advantage electric carts used to have. Now you have the same convenience without the charging and degradation issues that killed EVs the first time around. If they can't compete on a golf course, that doesn't say much for real world use.
@@zapfanzapfan Fair enough! But that wasn't the last advancement: My local golf course switched from EV to gas carts years ago. Electronic ignition and fuel injection took away the easy-start advantage the electric carts used to have for many decades. If they can't compete on a golf course, that doesn't say much for real world use.
@@SteveLomas-k6k I've never seen a gas powered golf cart, not even back in the days when they ran on lead acid. These days ATVs are going electric, you don't want to scare away the deer with some noisy engine... 😉
Are the sales statistics real sales or registrations? Dealers will register cars to meet sales targets (to get their bonus), then sell the cars as second hand but with only delivery mileage. There are lies, damn lies, and statistics.
One reason BEVs are useful here in the Netherlands is the infrastructure. Just look at the number of charging stations we have! It makes destination charging really quite simple and we generally don't have the complex set of different cards required for different stations. Plus the local authorities are installing charging stations at the road side so that most people can have access to a charge point near home. I've had a PHEV for 10 years and if that is replaced it will absolutely be with either a new or used BEV.
When visited the Netherlands, I've seen the chargers adjacent to residential buildings, and I think that's the really obvious answer to "but what if I live in an apartment and don't have a driveway?" - bear in mind that the solution is provided by the government installing the chargers, so you can't really blame people in this case. It can be done
@@JDESP We're about the size of Wales but with 18 million people, why has Wales not done it? Norway is massive compared to a lot of countries and they are invested in EVs. This is not about size, it's about having the foresight, the same with our cycling infrastructure, we didn't just wait for some company to come up with a plan, we got together and pushed. Now that could have gone wrong, I mean if we have to change the socket on all those existing chargers, we are facing a problem. Personally I think this should be encouraged at EU level with an EU standard. Then half a billion people would pretty much be setting the standard.
Hey, if you want to punish yourself every time you drive somewhere, that new (and very cheap) Dacia has almost no mod cons worth speaking of. Buy one, and wear your hair shirt with pride.
@@theelectricmonk3909 The Darcia. Finally, someone got it right. This is a brave EV that’s taking on the big guys just like the Dacians who took on the Roman Empire in 27BCE.
@@Bluetop-ez8ic Which software are you referring to? There's a huge amount of software in most modern ICE cars too (as I mentioned in another reply, check out that new Dacia electric car if you want bare bones, and cheap).
@@theelectricmonk3909 Yes, electric cars generally have more software compared to internal combustion engine (ICE) cars. Here are a few reasons why: Battery Management Systems (BMS): Electric vehicles (EVs) require sophisticated software to manage the battery pack, ensuring optimal performance, longevity, and safety. Motor Control: EVs use software to control the electric motor, which is crucial for efficient power delivery and regenerative braking. Charging Systems: Software is needed to manage the charging process, including communication with charging stations and handling different charging speeds. Advanced Driver Assistance Systems (ADAS): Many EVs come equipped with advanced driver assistance features, which rely heavily on software for functions like adaptive cruise control, lane-keeping assist, and automated parking. Infotainment and Connectivity: EVs often have advanced infotainment systems with features like over-the-air updates, smartphone integration, and real-time navigation. In contrast, while ICE cars also have software for engine control, infotainment, and some driver assistance features, they generally do not require the same level of software complexity as EVs.
The internet is the equivalent of a men's room wall. Anybody can write any garbage they want there, so why do we trust so much of it without checking the source?
I went through a period of feeling that I had to try and correct everyone taken in by the anti-hype too. Now I just chill in the sure knowledge that it has too much momentum to stall now. We are on our way to a sustainable future despite the vested interests, the wibbly wobbly government, the bleating few car makers who can't keep up with the majority and the Chinese/Koreans/Tesla, the lack of commitment to getting the infrastructure where it needs to be and of course the 'petrol heads' who's only argument for their ICE cars seems to be that they make a noise!!!
The only fake news is the sales figures for BEV cars. They are pre-registering cars on an industrial scale to manipulate the new BEV sales figures. These cars are then sitting in fields in some cases for years before they sell them on as secondhand with the manufacturer taking the loss. Even with this manipulation they cannot make 16% therfore setting a limit on how many ICE cars can be sold. Already the waiting list for a new ICE car is over 6 months and some dealers are saying 1 year for popular models. When the mandates increase to 28% next year this situation will get worse. We will end up like Cuba running old ICE cars for years.
You do realise most of this channel is fake news don’t you? Those SMMT figures are fudged for a start. Manufacturers are pre registering cars to meet figures. You can buy 1 year old EV’s with delivery miles, what does that tell you.
I would like to know where the EV charging infrastructure is going to come from - and how it will be funded - to serve the millions of households, like mine, that don't have off-street vehicle parking?
It will be installed according to market demand, like most things. There is already a lot of on-street charging, and more will appear as demand makes it viable. It will be funded largely by commercial debt, like most businesses.
@@xxwookeyoh no, you seriously don't expect the "market will provide"? Good god, where you living under a rock when Truss was PM? Get your coat. You do not live in the real world.
@@lukedogwalker That makes no sense. Truss put out an idiotic budget and markets reacted, so that example is hardly proof that markets don't work. Chargers are installed as demand appears, in just the same way that petrol stations were. The basic demand incentive is modified by grants, first-mover advantage of acquiring good sites, desire to provide customer amenity, and so on. It seems to be broadly working so far, and I don't see any reason why that should change.
@xxwookey you're just quoting a GCSE business studies textbook. None of this is happening at the necessary scale or pace nationwide. We have no time. The 2030's may as well be tomorrow. Rolling out this new infrastructure in time would require a war time economy. And you'd still have to rehouse everyone living in dense inner city housing so there would be sufficient space to provide at home charging options without compromising on basic health and safety. And there's much more but it just passed midnight so I'm done.
@@Toqtamish129 if you can barely afford the car loan, you are more likely to stick to what you know is good and meets your needs than buy the ‘hype’ with EVs
Buy second hand. The cognitive dissonance of all the people complaining about EV prices while also complaining how second-hand EV values are crashing... 😂
Well the SMMT (who compile the figures for the *whole* car industry - both manufacturing and sales - say that sales of both new and used EV's are up on the same period last year. Still, what do they know, eh?
Manufacturers and infrastructure suppliers have been profiteering and it’s backfired. The charging price hikes have destroyed one of the ‘pull’ factors.
95% of charging is done at home, so I don't think it's a factor. If you need that much DC fast charging, which is not as good for your battery pack, BTW, you can get on a subscription plan that can save you a bundle.
I'm occasionally intrigued when I see comments like this. If I had read this in 2012, I would have to shrug and agree, although it was possible to drive anywhere in an EV back then, it was a massive pain, and a huge compromise from driving a fossil burning car. There was probably 150 places you could find a rapid charger and they often didn't work. Now, in 2024, there are 70,000 publicly available rapid chargers at 32,000 locations across the UK. The chargers are easy to use (tap to pay) much faster and much, much more reliable. By the end of this year, at the current installation rate, we will reach 100,000. All of these rapid chargers have fairly low utilisation rates, meaning that although there are now 1.1 million EVs on the road in the UK, people use these chargers way, way less than people who have only ever driven a fuel burning car can understand. We have infrastructure, you don't see it because you don't use it. This channel is here to counter the casually held misinformation that so manny people are so willing to spread on behalf of the fossil fuel industry.
@@fullychargedshow We have infrastructure, you don't see it because you don't use it. Wrong. We don't have infrastructure. I am working on electrical industry. Stop lying.
This increased number of second hand EV sales in the UK - have you done a research why? If people are selling the car they have bought after 3-4 months - there you get your number. Why would you sell a car after a few months owning it - is the question. If there is such a huge natural demand for second hand EVs - the prices will go up. And it is the total opposite.
I love ICE cars, I will keep driving and owning ICE cars for as long as my can. But I would love to have an EV daily driver for the work commute. Unfortunately, no automaker is producing a small, simple, cheap and repairable EV option. I want a basic, no-frills car with physical buttons and knobs for every single control, no giant touchscreen. I want to be able to perform work on my car without jumping through modern car hoops like parts pairing. I don't want my car sending my data to everyone every single second of the day. New ICE cars suffer from the same issue, but in the ICE world I can take my pick from any number of older used cars which just provide the basics I want, I can perform basic maintenance and drive an old car just as well as the day it rolled off the line. As it stands there are simply no good options in the EV world. Old used more basic EV options all have tired batteries which cost 3x the price of the car to replace and modern ones are all expensive computers on wheels. I honestly don't think automakers will ever produce what I'm looking for so I may end up looking at an EV conversion of an older car. I am ready to daily drive electric as soon as an option that meets my criteria exists.
You can buy a two-year-old Tesla for less than a new Honda Civic. It would help if you were a genius to be able to work on new ICE vehicles. But then I have both an EV and an ICE. I can't fix much, if anything on either
Jay Leno has one of the worlds most extensive collections of classic and unusual automobiles in the world. It goes all the way back to the steam age and all the way up to today. I saw one of his recent videos, where he was showing a famous Brit around who said he loved his two EVs, and Jay replied that he prefers driving around town on business in his 9 year old Tesla, because that's the best car for doing that. No maintenance, no gas. The gasoline cars are a hobby, and he wants to preserve them and drive them for fun, not for necessity, and driving them on the freeway would not be fun.
@@Trashed20659 I don't actually disagree, part of why I'd love an EV daily is the reliability and lack of maintenance. However, when something *does* go wrong, which will absolutely happen, I want the ability to repair it myself or at least get a trusted local garage to perform the work. The only current option for a lot of EV issues is being forced to ship it off to some service centre and wait for them to charge me for a whole new battery pack when the only actual issue a small plastic part has worn out or just one cell is bad or something.
All that you mentioned can be done on an EV. There's just less basic maintenance to do on them. Also, you can get a VAG derivative of the eUP. No touch screen and plenty of buttons for you to fondle. Why do naysayers talk such rubbish?
If you want an EV that is like an ICE without a mega touch screen and lack of conventional controls go for a Nissan Leaf, it has all the buttons IRL. They are also incredibly good value second hand/used and so long as you don't believe the conspiracy theory lies about battery life there is no reason not to get one.
The car companies are forced to sell their EV cars as a percentage of the total that they sell. This percentage of EV sales is going up as a percentage year on year to 2030 as forced by governments. Therefore there will be fewer ICE cars sold as heavy penalties will need to be paid if they sell too many ICE vehicles. Also that means there will either be a shortage of ICE vehicles that dealers will be willing to sell, or that the price of these cars will become much more expensive to compensate the dealers for the penalties charged. So in reality drivers who want to continue to buy a new ICE vehicles will be shafted, either through initial cost or availability. A disgrace in my opinion.
An older BEV like a LEAF or a Zoe is not that expensive ( a few thousand). OK, there aren't any EVs that only cost hundreds yet (and still work), but there aren't many ICE cars in that category these days either.
I would have gone bev by now, had I not had the feeling that car makers have cynically used the transition to hike prices of all cars, wether bev or not.
While you are not going EV you are missing out on all the savings. There is no servicing a Tesla and even at the most expensive public supercharging rates a diesel in the uk would have to do 60 miles per gallon to be competitive.
after COVID inflation + every car having to come with extra bells and whistles (Hyundai started that) means all cars cost more than ever today. Used cars are even higher as they become scarce.
@@rhysbevan429 some more than others. As better models come out, few people want a less capable one, but if you don't need gobs of range, great deals abound! Give the teenager a car with a short leash, and he will stay in the neighborhood, but thank you for the free "gas".
I believe that there will be a tipping point where areas of the country (probably big towns and cities initially) we'll see the closing of filling stations simply due to lack of use. The lack of pumps will cause the remaining fossil drivers to think about a switch. The ripple effect will spread out and, while petrol forecourts will still exist, the cost and complexity of getting the stuff will cause the demise of the internal combustion engine could be faster than you might think.
I was thinking the same thing myself. but big oil are out in front again, the shell garage, and mobile hqve added on what used to called supermarkets in the uk, now do tea time shopping and fill up your gaz car, they adopting. and they even under cuttting supermarket petrol prices,,,,,
Petrol stations have been closing down for the last 30 years. So it's nothing new. I expect we will lose more standalone stations but the supermarkets will keep fuel for a long long time. People still visit the supermarket to buy food, so they will keep fuel as long as they can or they lose that ICE customer. But whatever happens it's a long way off yet.
@@gavjlewis It would make more sense for them to put in chargers. If you need to stay for half an hour to recharge, you have more time to spend buying other things.
I would have thought the reason for any plateau is obvious. We are just buying our first EV (we are very excited!), a model noted for a low price AND we got a substantial discount. But it is still by far and away the most expensive car we have ever bought - and we are in our 60s! Until EVs can break into the budget market, they will always remain niche.
I dont want screens and apps and gimmick's and beeps and pings and stuf you immediately turn of when you really dont want to use it . I just want an car that drives me from a to b
Three questions regarding the proposed switch to EV's. 1. Where will all the electricity come from to power EV's? 2. How much copper will be required to upgrade the electricity grid to deliver the electricity to the consumer? 3. Can HGV's be powered by electricity?
1 Electricity generators (we only need about 12% more peak generation to power all the cars) 2 Some. We have enough. 3 Yes - some already are. None of these things are particularly hard to deal with, given the 15 year timescale for most of the switchover, and 25 years for the tricky cases. That's time for plenty of change.
You'd better direct your last question to Volvo, M.A.N. , Mercedes, Scania and the others, who already have fully electric HGV trucks on sale.... Auto Express had an overview of the latest M.A.N. fully electric articulated HGV a few weeks back. It has a 500 mile range, and can pull the same trailer as the diesel powered version. The drivers who tried it, commented on the fact it had massively more torque over the ICE version... It seems you had no idea these even existed...
EVs are still primarily purchased as company cars or leased. When these uses cars hit the second hand market they depreciate heavily because when the battery is out of warranty it is very expensive if a cell fails. Tesla is the best EV in the market and only 2.5% of the batteries fail.However if you are the poor sod whose battery fails a refurbished battery at best is £5000. For this reason alone less well off people can not afford to buy one.
... and the reason why so many dealer don't want to handle 2nd hand EV's, because the cost of a warranty claim (even if they just give you 6 months) on a battery pack failure totally writes off any profit they can get for the sale! The risk is potential commercial suicide for smaller independent dealers.
The manufacturers warranty is portable, so if it was a seven year one then four years likely to remain at the end of the lease. An EV's price, like an ICE car, at the end of warranty (8th/9th year) will be a small percentage of it's original price - good running cost savings will still be available though. So you either run in into the ground as many do at the car age, or pocket the savings to spend on parts if needed; there are shops now who can replace cells/modules, and more will appear over time as EV numbers increase.
@@GruffSillyGoat so who takes the hit when the battery fails when out of warranty....bin the car on year 8? What is needed is the option to buy insurance to cover the 2.5% of the batteries that fail. If this insurance was affordable I'm sure the cars would sell.
@@madmcadder4536 - the same person as now who takes the hit when a timing belt goes on a used ICE car. Timing belts have a higher incident rate than a bettery repair at that age of car. Note I said repair, as more shops are opening up offering the ability to swap the damaged battery cell/module, at a similar cost to a timing belt fix.
Most leases last 3 to 4 years. An EV has an 8 year battery warranty...... Why might it be "very expensive" if a cell fails? I watched a RUclips video of an EV having a battery pack refurb (with some cells being replaced) The work took 4 hours, and the cost was £500. A new engine in an ICE car could typically cost anything from £4k up to almost £10k....
You said it; the luxury end of the BEV market is saturated. More smaller, cheaper versions are needed. Maybe if vapes were banned those resources would help bring BEV prices down too!
America has this issue, which will change. In the EU they have many cheaper EVs to chose from now. Kia is bringing their $35K EV3 to America soon, and it's gonna kill a lot of competition, even in the ICE space.
@@Trashed20659GM stupidly canceled the affordable Bolt/Bolt EUV, causing its sales to crash. It "replaced" the Bolt with a bunch of the same overpriced mid-size EV crossovers that every other car company is trying to flog. Supposedly a cheaper Chevy Equinox EV trim is coming, and a new Bolt. Meanwhile Ford in the USA seems to have no plans for a cheap EV, but it has a skunkworks project that's going to do something really amazing, honest! With steep tariffs neutralizing the threat of cheap Chinese EVs, it's obvious Western car makers want to keep selling expensive EVs, and they'll push governments to relax emissions targets and EV mandates because "our customers just aren't ready."
@@skierpage It's wild. Everyone was promosing a cheap new EV by 2025 a few years ago. Heck, they were all promising like 20 new EVs. It's very interesting that after the US introduced tariffs on Chinese-made EVs suddenly they all backed out and got very quiet. Which is incredibly stupid because the Chinese are already building factories in Mexico that will defeat the tariffs. So when the Chinese enter the market, the US companies will all be even further behind. Heck, they've all had 20 years to figure it out. And when the Chinese come, who will they have to blame?
@@patreekotime4578 yup, Western manufacturers have always promised more EVs than they actually deliver, starting a decade ago with Nissan and Renault both promising a range of BEVs and only delivering one. Ford still only sells three beevs in the USA (yet another midsize crossover, a big truck, and a commercial van), Stellantis nothing, and VW only the ID.4. GM will be selling about nine bevs by 2025, but it's a big truck, a Hummer and seven ^$#@&! midsize crossovers.
@@skierpage Meanwhile the Koreans seem to be able to make plenty of them and more all the time, sell them at somewhat reasonable prices, achieve class-leading efficiency, offer class-leading warrantees, with class-leading beautiful designs, class-leading charging rates, and seem to have few major issues. If you told me 30 years ago that Korean car companies would be kicking American car companies behinds I am 100% positive I would not have belived it. And yet here we are.
But it is a ban. A ban on new sales. I'm a three time BEV owner, and I appreciate the need to decarbonize, but banning petrol vehicle sales just makes people resist the change. If they really want to promote it, remove new EV sales tax and give apartment complex operators an incentive to install EV charging.
I'm old enough to remember similar arguments when leaded petrol was banned. "'Forcing' expensive catalysts on people." "Engines need lead to last more than 50,000 miles", "pushing owners out of cars they love". Some people are just scared of something new.
Incentives worked to kick start sales of BEVs, reintroducing them will just add ammo to those who like to complain even more. They already claim BiK means they are paying more tax, which isn't the case means EVs company car drivers are taxed but to a lower degree. There is already regulation around landlord and flat lease owners increasing deployment of charging. We'll have to see what happens in the budget to beef this up.
EV owners only pay 5% vat on the electricity they purchase to charge their cars at home, or no tax if they charge from their solar panels. ICE car driver's pay out hundreds £££ every year in fuel duty that is hidden in the cost of every litre. ICE car drivers already pay per mile as soon as they start their engines and more so if their car isn't very economical.
Well I am old enough to know that replacing one gadget for another every few years is never a good solution. EV are getting dumped, written off by Ins Co's by people who do not hold on to these cars ...why ? The next better model comes out, the next better gadget, the next better iPad etc. Technology is disposable. So are EVs stop acting like these people buy their toys and hold on to them forever. @@TheGramophoneGirl
HOLY FRUNK! Great surprise seeing my EV sales report here. Took me weeks to put together. Thanks for the great stuff as always! ⚡ -- Jaan, the guy behind EV Universe.
"Loads" of EV factories shutting down, are they? Name 4..... And nobody is investing big money into ICE engines anymore. You obviously haven't heard about Euro 7, due next year.....
I cant afford to buy even a 2nd hand BEV now , so when they ban sales of new ICE cars - the 2nd hand prices will rise dramatically , and I have no doubt that BEV prices will rise as well to take advantage of us not being able to buy a cheaper ICE car new anymore. in 30yrs time, the UK will be like Cuba , everyone will be driving 40yr old cars apart from the rich.
"Less people chose to smoke". They were priced away from smoking. The same will happen with combustion vehicles through aggressive fuel tariffs, forcing car manufacturers to sell a constantly reducing proportion of ICE vehicles or be subject to fines. Remember when Unleaded was introduced? The moment a good proportion of vehicles were using it, the price went up. Diesel? We were encouraged to switch because of greater economy and lower CO2 emissions, then the price went up. This country is not prepared financially or in its infrasture to convert to a mainly electric fleet. And when it does? The price will go up!
EVs are not the reason the grid needs investment. There's plenty of spare capacity during off-peak hours, when most charging occurs. The grid needs investment because we're switching from burning stuff right next to cities to renewable power hundreds of miles away. And if you're sure the price of electricity is going to go up, get some solar panels.
@@robinbennett5994 Well yes, however due to EV they need to increase the grid. If EV manufacturer would enable vehicle to grid charging\discharge, the grid would improve greatly as EV could be the surge protection of the grid.
Repairing a battery is a rare occurrence. People don't buy ICE cars based on the cost of a new transmission, because they don't expect to ever need one. Insurance companies are still trying to figure out their actuarial tables for EVs, which are still so new. But competition will force them to compete on price just like with ICE cars. Most experts agree there is no good reason they should continue to be expensive indefinitely.
Not for me it isn't, because both the guys in my local (village) garage are HEVRA certified to work on electric vehicles..... Higher insurance costs? I paid £82 more for insurance cover, over the last petrol car I had...
I recently switched to electric and can't see ever going back to an ICE. We used to have a small 'fuel efficient' car but running an electric car is 10x cheaper on fuel costs. We are lucky that we can charge at home on a cheap tariff most of the time. Hopefully the price of charging away from home will drop to be more inline with the price of petrol / diesel. Saying that it wouldn't need to drop by much and it would then be equal.
News from Norway would be really interesting because they are approaching EV/ i c e parity and in some specific locations it will be much higher than that so we'll get to see what the the changeover scenario will actually be like
You didn’t even mention the MASSIVE DEPRECIATION that new ev’s suffer from- after 2 years they can lose 50% of their value- who wants to waste their money this fast?!
@@xxwookey but it’s not sustainable for most car makers if hardly anyone (apart from fleet buyers) buys them new. Car companies will be forced to leave uk market and crap chinese makers will dominate. And currently only BYD is a profitable Chinese ev maker- the rest are struggling to make profit
@@trev1978 Obviously if no-one buys new cars, then the supply of 2nd-hand cars will be reduced and prices will rise. My point was simply that higher depreciation benefits 2nd-hand buyers. 2nd-hand prices are quite sensitive to supply, as we discovered during covid. These effects work exactly the same for all manufacturers, whichever country they are based in - this isn't a Chinese vs other countries issue. Ultimately car companies have to compete on the quality of their offerings. Given carbon border adjustments and WTO-regulated adjustments to counter unfair subsidy, then we have a healthy market. Personally I'd be very keen to see car sales halve worldwide as we have way too many of the damn things, and car-centric transport systems just produces inefficient, expensive, unreliable, transport, with high death rates, high energy use and high resource use, and a lot of social exclusion. They have their uses, but places like the US and the UK have gone way too far in that direction. Decarbonisation is a good time to make some adjustments in favour of active travel, public transport and just less travel, as well as getting rid of (almost) all the ICE cars and associated pollution.
And you didn't mention the fact that most who choose a new EV will *lease* it rather than buying it, which means they side-step the worst of the depreciation. Why the concern about depreciation on a car you don't wish to own?
@@Brian-om2hh the lease companys will stop buying them too when they are almost worthless at end of lease and rapid depreciation has made them unsellable
It is different in Norway and Denmark :D But politicians must give people a financial incentive to buy an EV. Norway and Denmark have done this with good results.
@@RamsayandClements Denmark has the same advantages, perhaps on a smaller scale, but still a lot of wind energy and more and more solar energy - and is self-sufficient in the oil and gas that is still needed + exports.
@@john681611 this would disproportionately affect people on lower incomes more, they can’t afford the expensive EVs. So this wouldn’t be a fair policy.
@@john681611 Why, when it comes to making the "alternative" more attractive, do you insist on making ICE cars worse rather than "improving" EVs? The same "tactic" has been used for public transit and hasn't worked, ever. All it does it syphon more money out of normal people's pockets.
It's important that people test drive any EV before they reject the idea. People are being "forced" into something that is cheaper to run, more reliable, faster, smoother, lower NVH. When I went to Shanghai, half the cars are EV's and the air in the city is clean. As a UK oil refinery is planning to close, maybe the market is deciding. It's difficult to hold back progress but if you think that the best way to spend time, have at it.
Perhaps its being phased out in favour of the lithium refinery in the NE, that's received planning permission to go ahead. After all, the focus is on creating a green industry base to grow the economy and jobs.
@@kristopherharvey3499 It was a decision made by the private company itself, the Chinese and Mr Brexit no less, owns a substantial proportion of Grangemouth.
To be honest, it was noticeable when I visited London earlier this year (lived/worked there for 15 yrs, before leaving a decade ago) - the difference those 10 years have made was significant, in terms of background noise, air quality, and so on (as an asthmatic, it was a very pleasant surprise :D)
If governments would stop subsidizing big oil (trillions of dollars) gas (petrol) prices would explode and you'll then see people stop driving their guzzlers. But you don't hear people complainig about those subsidies, only about for EVs.
I guess in America........ Look from a diffrent point of view, in the Uk £58p of every liter of fuel is tax and then 20% of the pre tax cost is vat. Thats a lot of money, we are already seeing the roads decline at an alarming rate because the income of road tax is not covering the amount of money needed to maintain the raods. So if the cost of Electric doesn't get taxed to death i guess EV's will have to start paying some form of raod tax in the very near future.
@@K2edg The state of the UK roads is nothing to do with EVs, and everything to do with a Government who failed to pay for their upkeep. For sure, I would eventually (sooner rather than later) expect to see some form of per-mile road pricing, at least for trunk roads, to make up for the reducing income from petrol/diesel sales. I've no problem with that per se, as long as it applies to all road users & isn't exclusive to EVs.
Big oil subsidies, your living in fairy world, the ev industry runs on subsidies, without corporate car tax on ev ownership no one would be daft enough to touch one of these things.
@@K2edg I have driven a Ford Fiesta since 2013 and never paid a penny in VED ("road tax") on it. It's not just an EV thing. It's linked to level of emissions. If you have been following the UK news you will know that electric vehicles will be subject to annual VED from 1st April next year. However, you also need to know that VED is not responsible for the level of road repairs in this country ... Vehicle Excise Duty was introduced in 1937 and the revenue goes into the treasury for anything that the government chooses to spend money on. There is no "ring fenced" money for roads that is associated with this tax.
Been driving a BEV for 5 years now, and Im never going back to ICE. If you just focus on the driving experience its way more pleasant than an ICE car.Yes there are some charging headaches, but if you can charge at home, a BEV is hard to beat in terms of convenience.
The rising popularity of electric vehicles (EVs) could trigger a domino effect, ultimately leading to the demise of traditional petrol stations. As more people switch to EVs, the demand for petrol will dwindle, forcing many petrol stations to close due to lack of profitability. The remaining stations may then increase their prices to compensate for the reduced customer base, creating a vicious cycle that further accelerates the shift towards EVs. Additionally, the closure of petrol stations will create inconvenience for those who still rely on petrol-powered vehicles, as they will have to travel longer distances to refuel. This inconvenience, coupled with rising fuel prices, could be the final nail in the coffin for the petrol industry.
@@cal_lywalICE cars will be around forever - parked in the yard with weeds growing around it or gathering dust in a barn while an EV displaced it as the daily driver.
It's already happening. I've been involved in a few projects that include proposed new petrol stations. During the planning stage or during design development these petrol stations have been omitted and charging bays added. It would be an absolutely bizarre decision to build a new petrol station now..... BEV's will dominate by 2027. There are thousands of used EV's coming onto the used market all the time ready to be hoovered up by people who don't buy new. I don't go into London much now but if you walk through central it's often really quiet compared to when all the dirty ICE vehicles were rumbling past. You just hear the soft whoosh of tyre noise and the odd beep....
Of course they don't make what most people want. They need to reinvent the vehicle kinda like when the little truck 1st came out. It was no frills, cost effective, durable and hit all the marks. So much so it created a new class of vehicle. The electric vehicles are not no frills,cost effective or durable. This is the real reason they are struggling they miss read the market
Whilst you are correct, it is not only EV that suffer this pricing up high end malaise. Last time I checked the average price of a new car in the UK was a whopping £34,000 EV or no EV…
If they don't profit, they won't make it. The lead cars for the new technology are always going to be expensive, just like the first cell phones and computers. They were too rich for my blood! Now powerful phones and computers are cheap. Give it time, they know that they haven't met the sweet spot yet.
Unfortunately, in my opinion, it's about finance and commercial advantage. We used to buy our own cars as a personal purchase. We were careful in our choices and obviously tried to avoid paying any more than we had to ... because it was obvious when the costs were high or low because that money came out of our account in a lump! For many years now we have been tempted and manipulated by the possibility of owning a vehicle that would normally have been out of reach. The calculations are rolled into a monthly "affordable" payment which may not even result in you ever actually paying for the car ... or never owning the car if it's a lease ... for just a few extra $ or £ you can have this bigger fancier etc etc. The EV thing is just part of the same story. Now people have acquired higher expectations ... check out the upholstery on cars we were happy with 25 years ago ... so though you would think people are ready to buy a cheap small cost-effective vehicle I suspect that the marketing departments have "done their job" and customers are still going to be more attracted to those higher margin vehicles ... I wish it wasn't the case ...
Sales of cars of all kinds fell in Ireland, ICE more than EV. So I assume there is just a global manufacturing slowdown across the board. But let's focus on EVs because that makes the news.
The lack of off-street parking can make electric vehicles impractical for many households. According to Lloyds Bank, only 56% of British homes can currently support electric charging points. This means that many people will remain unable to charge an EV at their home.
This is a big problem. I'm still stuck in a filthy old diesel for this reason. Fitting street-side charging is great where possible, but I'd take some slow chargers in my local supermarket car park.
In some cities, they have put level 2 chargers on the power poles right on the street. If that can be done, why not run power straight from the street (where it comes into the house) down the pole to a charging unit on a stand or on the pole directly if it is in front of your house?
So you opportunistically charge your car when you park at the shops, or at work, while you're doing something else. Absolute worst case you drive to a fast charging station and spend 20 minutes scrolling through your phone. Burning fossil fuel is causing massive harms to the only planet known to Harbor life, and people are whining about having to change their habits.
Sort of like gas cars now, I've yet to meet someone who has their own oil well and oil processing plant at home but I know people with solar and a plug
Okay, cigarettes weren't band, but smoking them in public places was. It was a forced choice: stop smoking and meet your friends at the pub, or smoke at home alone. Perhaps governments shouldn't ban anything, just the places where users use.
when enough EVs are marketed at the right price, the transition will occur naturally. As more folks come into contact with EV owners who have nothing bad and plenty of good things to say about their cars when they have their ICE car in the shop again, or are worried about making it to one of the remaining gas stations on a low tank, or are given the evil eye because of the sound and smoke emanating from their cars, they will only see buying their first EV (new or used) as a positive possibility. I remember in the US, when smokers were given their own area of the restaurant, most thought "well maybe this will make the non-smokers happy now", but it didn't because smoke drifts. So then restaurants put in partitions of glass or plastic to contain the smoke, and smokers though "I don't care for the segregation, but it does make sense I guess". But smoke still got out of those areas, and non-smokers were getting used to not having to smell it any more, because businesses had banished smoking inside the office by then, so restaurants banned it altogether, and office buildings moved the smoking areas to 20 plus feet from the building, which meant smokers had to stand in the rain and smoke, and everyone could watch them through the windows. That, and a lot of public service campaigning, combined with huge tax increases imposed on tobacco made smokers a smaller and smaller minority, to the point that they have no say in anything based on that habit anymore. Just like smokers, ICE drivers will not in the end make a compelling case for why their preference should continue to be supported.
So along the lines of your smokers bann, you do realize EVs will all get banned eventually due to the fire and toxic Smoke EVs emit when they catch on fire via thermal runaway. As I my self dont want an EV anywhere near me, my family, my home, my place of business, my airport, my local resturant or Costco @Trashed20659
I cant care less about the battery. People like me just want to go from A to B as cheap as possible, and comfort is a welcoming bonus. In fact where I live, electric car is the norm now. You go to car dealership, and you will be hard pressed to find ICE car. They are just so much cheaper to run.
@notme943 you obviously do care about the battery or you wouldn't of bought a car powered by one haha and isn't it cheaper just to keep your old petrol car on the road than pay max dollar for a new car?
@@tincambo I don't pay in dollars, and from where I live, the gas price is very very expensive. As my old car becomes too risky to maintain, it just makes a lot of sense to make the shift. Electric car are even very competitive in term of price, so I can't understand your point of "max dollar". I don't understand your argument about the battery. Had petrol car been cheaper, I would've bought it. Your obviously have something against electric car, I don't.
I have an ev and love it. But I wouldn’t have purchased if I couldn’t charge from home. I think we need to accept that there will be this mix of ev and ice cars because of charging capabilities.
Planet earth disagrees. The damage done to our environment is just starting to be felt. The issue is that just like with COVID deniers, proclaiming how wrong we were on our death beds will be too late, so saying we will end up with a mix doesn't address the environmental problem.
In the USA there isn't climate change according to most people I talk with. ICE cars will be fueled forever by unlimited oil and EVs can't be charged in a apartment, so they don't work for anyone. Don't pop the bubble of their reality.
@@ChaosSwissroIl It is already a meaning issue and getting worse. It is really noticable up North in North America. Draughts, floods, forest fires, permafrost melting, the foundation of buildings and roads are getting destroyed, pine beetles are destroying forests, glaziers disappearing or massively shrinking, diminishing farm yields, rising ocean levels etc. It is hitting the economy really hard.
@@ChaosSwissroIl Oh! a scientist. It's so nice to hear from you. I really does piss me off when Know-it-alls make comments with absolutely no facts behind them. You've got to wonder how they manage to get out of bed in the morning - come to think of it, maybe they don't. Anyway, thanks again.
@@gerryparker7699 It seems like a natural result if the car manufacturers are unable to supply electric cars in large enough numbers or if consumer interest is not high enough. Or the price of ICE cars will skyrocket to allow the manufacturer to swallow the cost of the fee.
My only counter question is infrastructure. More EV chargers are being installed which is great. This enables more "on the go" or mid level trips. But one area ICE cars have the advantage still is the pure quantity of stations. They are everywhere. And yes it's true home charging eliminates a lot of need for that level of volume when it comes to EV chargers. But Home chargers is another "added tax" to buying an EV to first time buyer. That installation cost. A large bunch of home owners and renters it's just not an option. Again yes this is improving. The shear scall of infrastructor in a fully EV auto world, imho, isn't keeping up. Where the financial incentives need to be is for those gas stations to afford conversions to chargers. A gas fill up is 5 to 10 min ish. An average charge stop can be 10 to 30 min, depending on lots of factors. So a matter of simple space to allow the same time turn over of customers for a station/shop. It's my observation stations don't have to room to support EV stations plus keep gas pumps. There is likely safety rules about how far apart those services need to be. We can't just think of the cars. The whole ecco system has to evolve in a way that is financially viable for station owners to succeed. More coverage of that please.
you should think of the cost of a charger as part of the first purchase. It will pay for itself quickly in reduced fuel costs, as well as time and mileage spent on out of the way trips to get gas. Gas stations are not free infrastructure, you pay for those locations with the price of your gas. Part of the reason home charging is cheaper than gas, and cheaper than fast charging is that you already have paid for 95% of the infrastructure. You already pay rent or a mortgage...check. You already pay for electricity, which is already connected to your house....check. You just need to hookup a charger ...done. Many dealers will even help you with that and roll the cost into your car payment. I took the cheapest route, and had an electrician install a 40 amp service box outside my home months before I bought the car, then after purchasing said car, went next day to Home Depot and picked up a level 2 charger, which comes with a bracket I hung on the wall, then slid the charger into the bracket and plugged in the power cord. Done.
Every time you park a plug-in car is an opportunity to charge it. Unless they're in the middle of a long trip, people would rather charge while they're doing other things. We need much more moderately fast charging at parking spaces.
Every building that has power is a charging station. Get PV solar on your roof and not only is your house a charging station, but also the generator as well. Why would you incentivise fuel stations to install chargers? Do you want to keep paying over inflated prices for something you have at home for half the price? Screw station owners, they've been ripping us off for decades and the sooner they're out of business the better.
This varies by country, some are way behind in their EV infrastructure roll-out' typically those who have problems with funding infrastructure in general. In terms of the UK, there are about 8k petrol service stations in the UK (est. 64k pumps @ average 8 pumps per station), down from about 13k stations in 2000 and have been decreasing every year due to competition (supermarket in partiicular) and shrinking margins. Whilst there are 38k charging locations with 68k devices (i.e. pumps) growing 1.5k per month with over 100k individual car charging connectors. So it seem the crossing point between quantity of fuel stations vs pblic electric recharging locations has been crossed already. Given 70% of the UK are able to home charge, this means there is a sufficient supply of EV charges to support charging on the go, although there are particular places in the country that need foccussed improvements in the availability of charger. However, the numbers of chargers still needs to go up generally, increasing the ability to both destination charge and perform transit charging en-route for longer distance journeys. It is the destination charging that is key for the 30% without home charging, particularly if chargers are sited at retail parks, town car parks, entertainment locations and supermarkets as this enables similar background charging to be performed.
Electricity is about halve the cost of petrol. The charger pays for itself. Even charging from a regular plug works: a typical car would charge about 125 miles in 10 hours. Should be enough to barely need a visit to a fast charger.
In summary, outside China and a few small markets, BEV market expansion is in a pause. My prediction is BEVs will go mass market when they hit normal ranges of 600km+, while long range variants are 700km+ and purchase price hits parity with ICE across a wide choice of models. Early adopters have to realise that even if they don't suffer from range anxiety, most people do. Manufacturers have to realise there's a range threshold they must meet for mass adoption to take place. Higher charging speeds and charging infrastructure build outs will help normalise EVs too. When non-enthusiasts see EVs as affordable and practical it's game over.
You will note that cars are only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to global emissions. Targets & incentives are therefore not tackling the problem. Public transport & freight are the biggest vehicle related problems & this is where we should be starting. Additional cheap EVs from China have resulted in the increase of fossil fuel power generation, causing their emissions to grow. Targets need to be set for global power generation & manufacturing. Emissions reductions are being targeted at the wrong end because they are easier to sell.
I completely support a transition to EVs (just to be clear), I want to see it happen, but I am not in the least surprised that numbers aren't looking great (massage the figures all you like). Speaking to friends who have no bias one way or another, the overwhelming consensus is that people feel EVs simply aren't good enough - the battery technology isn't there yet - and they're far too expensive. The charging infrastructure is insufficient, becoming ever-more expensive, and if you live in a town or city and park on the street, the cheaper option of home charging generally doesn't work. These are all totally legitimate concerns. I use my car mostly for shorter journeys that could be done with an EV, but probably 25% of my driving is to remote parts of Scotland with minimal charging infrastructure and requiring long journeys. Until EVs can do everything an ICE vehicle can, and for the same, or less money; they will struggle with sales. So far they have sold to the people who can work with the tech we have and to companies/organisations replacing fleet vehicles, I would suggest the sales are slowing because for most people they don't make sense. As an example, I drove over 350 mile round trip last weekend to drop off a heavy item and pick up another one, I took my Ford Focus estate - it did the trip on less than 3/4 tank of fuel, I had no range anxiety, and because the car is worth about £5000, I didn't have to worry too much about marks to the boot carpet etc. Most people don't have £30k+ to spend on a car and they probably don't want to be stuck on a lease deal that requires large monthly payments - until you can buy an EV equivalent to my Focus that can do the sort of trip I've just described, EVs will struggle to break through.
Exactly! The charging infrastructure is slow, Tesla massive network only does a max of 250kw charging. And, they haven't upgraded alot of their older 150kw charging stations. Imagine when more people buy Tesla and going long distances. They will need to spend atleast 20 minutes at a site with queue. I think EV will probably be a no discussion just like ICE probably like the next 10 years or so. Tesla been over a decade and their charging stations have yet to reach 400kw. Battery charging tech needs to be innovate. Otherwise, I'm sticking with ICE for long distance travels. Not worth the headache.
Very similar here, I am running around in a similar value petrol vehicle that will last years if looked after and not a worry about how/where to fuel up. An ev makes no sense for many people so they wont do it and the government cant afford the gargantuan subsidies that will be required - right now - to get people to shift en-masse. And if you have no facility to charge at home overnight its pointless even thinking about it, unless perhaps you do very limited trips I suppose.
We did a trip through the Scottish borders in a Tesla and it was effortless. There were chargers absolutely everywhere. I don’t know what part of Scotland you’re talking about. You can buy a dacha spring EV for less than £15,000 on the road how many petrol cars come that cheap? And if you want range a Tesla model three long range will do 420 WLTP miles on a charge. Just do a bit of research you might be pleasantly surprised.
@@ouethojlkjn I think you've just illustrated my point! A Dacia Spring has a real world range of 100 miles (probably less in winter on longer runs) and still costs more than three times the value of my Focus, not even taking into account its depreciation. A Tesla Model 3 long range is £15k minimum for a used car with over 100k miles. If I was to put a heavy load in it and drive it to the Highlands - I was in Glen Urquhart last weekend and charging options are slim to none - how well would that range hold up on a used car like that? I suspect not very well. So I could maybe get away with replacing my Focus with a Model 3 long range, but it would cost me £10k at least and I'd have less practicality and more range anxiety. This is why it isn't a realistic option for most people.
@@tobee1k Good grief Glen Urquhart is less than 20 miles from Inverness, capital of the highlands ... hardly remote and distant from charging opportunities! (I'm not suggesting that EV is ideal for every person's use case but I suspect some people start off thinking it's going to be a problem and then rule it out.) I've driven in the north highlands and Skye and know you have to plan ahead but in the past week I've driven from the Scottish Borders to the south coast of England and around country areas down there too ... everywhere had charging of some description.
I have both a V8 ICE and an EV. Living in the USA in a congested city the EV is the perfect car. To go on longer road trips the ICE makes more sense. Over the next fifteen to twenty years I expect battery technology to be 5 to 10 fold more advanced, making the ICE pretty much obsolete.
Exactly! I get attacks by other EV owners saying I didn't plan enough....I don't eat? I don't stretch? I don't take bathroom breaks!.....ridiculous! lol......I don't need to spend 20-30 minutes charging or forced a stop. Peeing doesn't take that amount of time, I walk to the bathroom at the same time as stretching, return, then continue driving. I can eat one handed.....And, also, I don't need to gamble an unknown area if the chargers are always used, broken, or what......I don't understand some of EV owners think we're doing something wrong when we prefer ICE cars for long travel
Company cars are going EV in UK even for regular long distance travellers. the tech and infrastructure is just about ok and continuously improving. For bigger countries with longer road trips like USA you can see it will get there. My firm encouraged train and taxi for long business trips. It gave you time to catch up on emails and work planning while travelling. If it’s available it’s a great option.
I still have 2 ICE. An old small truck for hauling crap I don't want in my nice EV, and wife's SUV she drives to work only. Using the EV locally and on weekends will increase the life of the ICE cars, and keep them out of the shop longer. I have good range, so I could take 200+ mile trips with only 1 stop for the return, and it's FREE for two years, so I don't mind 15-20 mins of stretching my legs when I can save so much money. Jay Leno has one of the worlds most extensive collections of classic and unusual automobiles in the world. It goes all the way back to the steam age and all the way up to today. I saw one of his recent videos, where he was showing a famous Brit around who said he loved his two EVs, and Jay replied that he prefers driving around town on business in his 9 year old Tesla, because that's the best car for doing that. No maintenance, no gas. The gasoline cars are a hobby, and he wants to preserve them and drive them for fun, not for necessity, and driving them on the freeway would not be fun.
How long is a long road trip? We have the SECC ev race every year distance 10 252 miles. Drivers must follow speed limit and are monitored through GPS. Some live stream the entire race. 3 top cars and drivers did this rave under 18 hours and 30 minutes. 1 place 18:04 to be precise. Sure this is extreme driving and I would not even do it in a Ice car. But I think it goes to show EVs are already pretty darn good long trip vehicles.
6:23 I love EVs and I want to get one but i do think the industry missed a step. When making PHEV they made lots of 20-50 miles EV only and petrol engine. Why didn't they make more EV only drive with around 150-200 miles range but with a small 5-10L fuel range extender ICE. This might have helped people get over the range anxiety while battery technology further improved for later generations. Maybe I'm speaking hot air r but it's just an idea I've been wondering for a while
Because batteries take up a lot of room and add a lot of weight. Gasoline is lighter than water, so the room saved with a smaller tank would not make up for the extra cost, room and weight of batteries needed, and the added cost of the vehicles would have caused buyers to revert to ICE-only based on that. I personally think hybrids are not an answer. The oil companies like them because they continue the need for fuel, and saving 25% of what you normally buy just means they can extend the lifetime of dependency they currently have the world in. They HATE EVs and so sponsor much of the anti-EV media that is intended to misguide potential EV purchasers. To me, buying into the hybrid hype is like wearing half a condom. If you want the full benefit, go all EV.
BMW i3 is like that. I think we will see lots of these after 2030. Why would anyone buy a phev with 50 mile range if you can have one with 150 mile and almost never fill up. It will be a big selling point for the last phevs.
I hate the Japanese companies for their attitude on EVs, but at the same time it's 100 percent understandable. They don't want to take the risk being first, and they know the longer they wait the more money they can make once the market is already settled. They are just making a token effort but it will change in a few years. But they will have lost some buyers, I for one will never buy a Toyota.
@@timscott3027 It's also potentially not going to work out well as they hoped... because the first (and even second-gen) EVs are rarely very good... as we saw with the Toyota BZ4X (it's sole offering - so far - that it makes itself... it sells a number of EVs in China, but they're just rebadged EVs built by its Chinese partner :D) Early adopters were willing to accept those first/second gen issues previously because those were all that was available... but now that the 'leaders' are producing very polished, high-efficiency EVs at a better price-point, I think most buyers will be a lot less willing to buy a 'worse' first/second gen EV from a lagard...
An industry that did not even exist just over a decade ago has taken 20% of the market from an established industry that has had a strangle hold for over a century. This has happened with a handful of startups (how many startups have ever succeeded in the auto industry?) and a few legacy auto-makers barely dipping a toe in the market. Imagine the growth when the charging network is more fully established, the startups prioritize affordable EVs and the legacy auto makers start to take electrification seriously.
Legacy auto need to take evs seriously, Like tesla other start ups they need to update the software and firmware, the self driving and other hi-tech features need to work. The battery needs to be repairable. So far I don't believe legacy auto are keeping up. They need a hi-tech sub brand like Zeeker under the Geely brand.
@@flukeylukey7559 legacy auto actually likes EVs. Big oil has them over a barrel, and the EPA wants more and more miles per gallon, which legacy auto has run out of ideas on.
@Trashed20659 Is it big oil or making money on parts and repairs, maybe the dealers need to be able to fix the battery cells or do health checks on them, this will be regular requirement soon.
@@flukeylukey7559 and this comment shows that some people don't know what they're talking about. "dealers need to be able to fix the battery cells" first they would need to remove the battery pack from your car that'll only cost you a couple of thousands because of the specialised equipment involved, and the complexity of removing the battery pack. then they open up the battery pack and find one or more individual cells that failed. they replace them and put back the battery pack. would you buy a reconditioned battery pack for your EV? thinking that you have 10 brand new individual cells in it? but having 6500 more cells so old they could fail at any point now or tomorrow? I expect some people would. And that's why EVs will survive for a bit longer, until everybody would wake up to reality. If the batteries are not replaceable like in a Nio, then EVs are going to die out.
The problem is that how are people going to charge up their cars if they either live back to back or live high rise flats as nissan won't allow anyone who doesn't have a drive way or garage to test drive their car's
The technology doesn't exist to economically and practically replace ICE vehicles at the moment. Electric isn't a religion. We absolutely need tor evaluate mandates with concern to practicality and cost.
That is a fascinating comment. I don't have a response other than to say that I now have personal experience with electric vehicles going back 16 years and I would agree, 10 years ago the EV was a genuine compromise from ICE vehicles. Now, however, that is just not the case. They are actually, measurably better in all aspects, including the ridiculous myth/lie of 'range anxiety and 'there's nowhere to charge them.' I agree 100% electric isn't a religion, it's simply a better technology that has massive, well funded, determined resistance. From where? Who do you buy liquid fuel from? They are not happy and spend literally $ Billions spreading misinformation, which is very very easy.
If you want more people to buy electric cars, you have to first make sure that everyone has their own house with a garage. It's very convenient when you can just plug in your car at home and know that every time you take it out, it is at full charge. But when you live in a rented 5th floor apartment with 5 EV chargers in a 1 mile radius that are always taken by someone already, how do you make it work at all?
EV’s are great for highly urbanised countries. But the in countries like Australia and the US problems like range and charge times have not been addressed. Much of the worlds rural and remote areas will be practically inaccessible and towing caravans is impossible
Like you can’t plug an electric car on every socket that ever existed, charge with solar panels, or buy a 1000 miles Chinese electric car… because news flash, all of those things are possible. The real pickle here is the price, which VW, Toyota and others have been happy to delay doing something about it with misinformation and other negative tactics. Electric cars are coming, it’s an inevitability, just like Motorola and Nokia disappear from the face of the earth, gas guzzlers will also do, because it is simply an inferior product, and at a scale, more expensive to manufacture
Fact: EVs have sufficient range to cover a typical household’s daily travel, which is approximately 50 miles on average per day. The majority of households (roughly 85%) travel under 100 miles on a typical day. Most EV models go above 200 miles on a fully-charged battery, with nearly all new models traveling more than 250-300 miles on a single charge. And automakers have announced plans to release even more long-range models in the coming years. Kia EV3 will have over 450 mile range in extended range model. Tens of thousands of public chargers are available now, with tens of thousands more on the way. I can get 100 miles added in about 10 minutes. But most charging is done at home. Just think: once everyone who can has a home charger and they have them at work, it will become even less necessary to use fast chargers. When you make the long trip to Grandma at thanksgiving in an EV with good range, you will be able to charge at her house, and maybe NEVER stop along the way to charge!
@@Trashed20659 it is amusing that you talk about the average household. That leaves millions of households that are not average without a viable vehicle. Do you know that about 5% of the Australian mainland is accessible with an ev. What do farmers do. What do caravan owners do. We are talking about mandating EVs when for millions of people there is no viable alternative. It is so incredibly selfish and myopic
Your short sighted over CyberTruck comment, the wealthier buyer has once again enabled development of the new technology required to advance affordable BEVs. It has not delayed it, but advanced it. As did the original Roadster & Model S.
I agree! Very short sighted, they forget that Tesla still are selling the most BEVs and are selling more every year. The lower cost model is coming earlier than people think. Some think it's never coming, but it will! It's not because of the Cybertruck, like you say it could help bring out the lower cost model. Think about it, Fully Charged and theEverythingElectric show praise Lucid, when they are doing the same thing that they say Tesla is doing!! Bringing out a very expensive model that little people are going to be able to buy, + they are losing a tone of money doing so! Lucid don't even have a Tesla Model Y and 3 competitor. Tesla are wayyy ahead of everyone else and Fullychargedshow and EverythingElectricShow are focusing on everyone else 'catching up' to Tesla, I'm starting to think is them saying 'actually caught up' every going to happen? 😅 The Cybertruck and Tesla for making it doesn't get anough praise from this channel, instead they just take digs! It's very upsetting and makes me angry and I love this channel.
£20B subsidies to Fossil Fuel production and cleanup, not to mention the increasing healthcare and climate change cost, time that was reversed. EVs are not the complete solution, but the only sector where we have a hope of hitting emissions targets,
That is a really good point. FF subsidies worldwide were actually 7 trillion USD in 2022 alone. They are typically now in the 6 trillion dollar range on an annual basis. This includes implicit and explicit subsidies. Imagine all the renewables and grid upgrades that could be built for that.
@@Knott1701 Have you ever looked at the subsidies of all the green energy and ask what the ROI is on that? A windmill breaks even by the time its useful life is over and then, practically none of it can be recycled. There is practically no capacity to recycle these EV batteries. You would think companies would jump at the chance to grow and have a monopoly in this space since EVs are getting more popular, but they do not exist. Why does China have fields and fields of EVs just left to rot? Seems environmentally unfriendly.
There is a lack of verified data on the impact of ICE. 1/What is the occupant injury rate of BEVs v ICE? 2/number of bushfires or grass fires started by ICE caused by impact or via hot exhausts. 3/Use social return accounting to examine impact of ICE fires which result in closed highways freeways and arterial roads. Look beyond the headlines, for instance a section of the Bryce Highway in Queensland was obliterated recently by ammonia nitrate tanker explosion triggered by a fire in a pickup. 4/ So many people in USA have been accidentally asphyxiated by portable generators (often following natural disasters) that US govt passed a bill to improve their safety. Use of V2L feature on EVs instead of petrol generators will save lives. Plenty of data points to build a case. 4000 ice cars destroyed at Fort Meyer Airport due to a hot exhaust triggering a grass fire. Nine lives lost in South Australia bushfire which destroyed 90 homes. Disruption due to a Freeway closure caused by an ice fire is not unusual. The consequences of such events are far reaching.
@@LGB-FJB oh dear, here come the tired fossil-fuel talking points. The CO2 eqivalent emissions per kilowatt hour of a solar panel or wind turbine, that after installation just sits there intermittently produce electricity, are _vastly_ less than continually shoveling fossil fuel into a thermal plant, and none of that fuel is recycled. 94+% of the actually toxic lead-acid batteries in gassers are recycled, why on Earth won't bigger more valuable lithium ion batteries in EVs is be recycled at similar rates? A dozen startups (Brunp, Li-cycle, Redwood Materials, Umicore, ...) are waiting for enough EV batteries to actually fail so they can ramp up operations.
ah, the pollution and climate change argument balooney (as is not caused by humans in any significant way) in reality: Pollution in the UK In 2023 in the UK, cars accounted for 52% of all domestic vehicle emissions. The UK ranked 17th with 1.1% of global emissions 3% of Earth's pollution (not just the CO2) is done by Humans. So, all the UK domestic vehicles pollute the Planet at a rate of 52% out of 1.1% out of 3% 52% out of 1.1% = 0.572 0.572% out of 3% = 0.01716 result is: the UK cars Pollution = 0.01716% out of the Global Pollution Nice trying to enslave everybody's soul in the UK by forcing them to sell themselves to save 0.01716% Pollution And even if all humans will suddenly die today, and all our pollution machineries will stop working today, the fact is that the planet will still be polluted 97% by other things (mostly by volcanoes), and still getting a climate change, as the Sun is got a cycle and it seems that we are coming out of an Ice Age and getting back into a Hot Age, the same as when Dinosaurs roamed the Earth.
@@csuporj The government will recoup the fuel duty lost on petrol by replacing it with Road Tolls. They've said they won't do that for the time being, but it'll come....
I just bought a 9 month old fully loaded Mercedes EQB. It does 500km on a charge (400 if you have the a/c blasting which i do in this heat), it’s fabulous to drive, has 7 seats despite being mid sized and I absolutely love how it drives. The new price was ¥11M. I paid ¥5.5M 9 months later. It’s mind blowing! Yes, once a week - 10 days or so I charge it up to 95%, which takes 45 minutes. I have a coffee and do my emails. The Mercedes dealer said these weekly 45 minutes charge sessions is why people get rid of them. This is how stressed people are today? It’s mindblowing.
£2 a mile. That is the cost of running my EV using public chargers. I have owned my Mégane e-Tech for a year now. The Ohme home charger stopped working just over a week ago and I have been forced to use public chargers and it has shocked me how bad the experience would be. I have spent double my monthly electricity bill just to charge my car for one week! More than double what I would have spent on a tank of petrol this time last year! BP Pulse are the only chargers in my area and they are ten times the price of home charging, but the most incredulous thing to me is that while there are supposedly two chargers, if one in plugged in the other one cannot be used. So the reality is that there is just one charger. Another bad thing is that when I initially did not use the app so they charged me £50 for £20 worth of electricity! Surely that is illegal? I would recommend an EV to anyone with a home charger, but if not do not touch it with a barge pole. Hours spent sat in the co-op car park and the insane cost for the privilege is not justifyable.
Shhh.... Don't say anything bad about EVs here or you'll be branded a lunatic, Trump supporter, dinosaur juice lover by the mob that runs this channel.
I can't see how this works out either. If we take the 50 pounds charge and assume you get four miles per kWh in the Megane (this may be very good but it gives some nice round figures, it won't be far out). This would mean you have to be paying 8 pounds per kWh and you only put 6.25kW into the 'tank', around ten percent of the Meganes capacity. I think you are part of the misinformation.
@@ellisrochlin2267 I know. I noticed the autocorrect when someone liked the post but hoped it would fall under the radar. My bad, but i was sat in a Co-Op car park at the time. It is 20p a mile.
The smoking thing is a good way of saying why people will not have ICE cars in the future, the government will tax the petrol/road tax to such a high value it will force people to go to unwanted EVs just like they did with smoking. While Insurance companies will put EV insurance up to astronomical rates because of the small chance but high cost of EV fires and crashes. It takes a long time to get a crashed EV repaired so the cost of the higher car increases the cost to the insurer and the cost of collateral damage is much higher if in a fire. This will make more people leave the roads, which is what Oxford wants; less productivity time, more time sitting on bad public transport, less freedom (15 minute cities)
There will be countries in the world that will not follow this crazy trend of destroying their own citizens. And as we see today people leaving a bad country to move to a better one, so will be in the future people will get out of the dictatorialship of UK and move to freedom lands. If you don't believe me, just go to the south beach of the UK and ask the people jumping out of a dingy why they came here. I bet the answer would be like: "because our own government actively sought to destroy our lives"
A bit of Disraeli statistics going on in this video. If one looks at the distribution of EV sales in the uk you can see that it's the Fleet market that is accounting for a large chunk of sales. Private buyers are put off my steep depreciation and worries about battery technology development quickly making their purchase obsolete. BEV's are PART of the solution but they are not THE solution. I believe that haulage will have to stay with diesel and diesel hybrid for much much longer
Public charging is too expensive, not everyone has access to home charging. If you rely on public charging it will be just as expensive if not more that an ICE car to keep it running. They are also cost more to buy and depreciate faster and there is the issue of range anxiety and the fact that people do not trust governments.
They cost more to buy, do they? A new MG4 fully electric hatchback is £27k. A new petrol Ford Focus is £28k... And if you lease an EV, you don't need to worry about most of the depreciation.....
Throwing numbers when economics are at play is a strange way to validate something especially if you don't go into the details more granular, if we look at the UK, what percentage are being sold as business vs private, second hand mark is also so complex, the numbers on auto trader for second hand eV don't seem to make any sense vs the stock that should be coming into the market, also the discounts I have seen on various eve in the second hand market is also massive. I would love an eV but every person I speak that has one says its great as a second car, you still want an engine as your long trip solution. The biggest issue for me is not the fact that there is disinformation on both sides but the fact that government is lacking in delivering something that should work for more than one economic segment. Look at the markets that have done well, look at there charging network and incentives. Maybe there are lessons to be learned :) any how just my view and likely to change in the years to come
High percentage of PHEVs never get plugged-in. I don't remember the exact study, but there were several all said the same thing. Anecdotally- I have some friends with PHEVs, and they never plug them in either...
A rep visits my workplace in a phev. He never plugs it in, just bought it for the tax break. If I had one (or a REX EV). I would plug it in every chance I get.
I do 3k miles a year and fill up about every other month. VED is £20 and insurance is cheap. Have looked at new cars recently but can’t justify the cost whether it’s ICE or BEV or something in between. Hoping to get at least another 10 years out of my 9 year old golf
That statistic that 93% of BEV drivers will never go back to gas is the key telling point. Point of what? The point where the transition to all electric shifts into high gear. My prediction is that it will precede the dates where ICE are no longer sold and exceed the date where PHEV are phased out. In the end - sooner than the targets BEVs will sell massively more than ICE much as HiDef TVs did. No not quite as rapid as that but only because of the higher cost of motor vehicle purchases. The better product always wins out. It will be no different here.
I agree with you in principle, it's just that right now the product isn't better for most people. I don't doubt that it will be in the probably not too distant future, but we're not there yet.
The view of all EV by 2030 or even 2035 was a non road emissions utopian dream. 40 percent will not convert due to personal taste and limited home charging costs due to their type of residence. Public chargers are expensive, so it doesn't look like that will change. I charge @ home mostly. Peeps that want or have to drive a 400 or 500 mile round trip will want to do the trip without having to source a charging point somewhere ( adding extra hrs) to return home especially in driving rain or in freezing conditions. EV will not be for many folks.
@@ellisrochlin2267 Yep. I wished that some EV proponents stop bashing those who would like to get in an EV, but, didn't choose to because of the high convenience of over planning their route, having to stop multiple times.....alot of the stopping can be rectified and make migrating to an EV easier if charging was super fast and having a higher range BEV like in the 500 mile range....but, these EV proponents that bashes folks usually say, "you don't eat/stretch/pee/sightsee?".....who wants to pee for over 20 minutes....you can pee and stretch and takes just takes less than 5 minutes, you can eat with one hand, or you can alternate drivers, why do I want to sight see at rest stops?.....those are my answers to why I prefer ICE on long drives....yet these EV proponents bash you because you don't want to stop
@@ellisrochlin2267 Your describing a static world. EV charging systems are increasing daily. The govt is incentivizing them. Many many EV long trips are already possible with minimal to no issues with finding chargers. But the reality is that as the vehicles are adopted in ever greater numbers the money to be made off charging will drive the increase in charging options. It's not rocket science and it's not a hamstrung scenario.
@@cre8tvedge I’m not convinced that’s a very meaningful statistic though. People do a lot of research before buying a car. So most people who buy an EV are people who already know it’s likely a good choice for them.
Switched to a Kia EV6 15 months ago. Love it. Had a multitude of hot hatches before it, From the likes of Ford and Subaru. Don't miss them even slightly.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
We have had a battery electric vehicle for over two years now.
The experience of charging away from home is so depressing that we would consider going back to a petrol only car.
Uptake is very much dependent on the available infrastructure.
Infrastructure should be the highest priority in encouraging people to go electric.
I have a Skoda Enyaq with an 80kwh battery. That means I can go on pretty long road trips and either have no need to charge or only very rarely. Went on holiday to the Lake District. Getting there was about 340miles. Found a charger near the M6 on the way up and put in 50%. I had 36% left at my destination. A similar story on the way back. I also have a Nissan Leaf, which I still have, and with only 20kwh of usable battery capacity I could still do fairly long trips, albeit charging up after 60 miles or so. The Leaf did give me some range anxiety but I never ran out of charge and the charging provision has come on by leaps and bounds recently. Just stick with your EV. Your grandchildren will thank you for your altruism.
Yup, it’s now accepted (by data driven people, at least), that EVs will soon be the less expensive option. It’s now entirely about infrastructure.
Charging at home is a wonderful convenience compared with an ICE experience.
Charging away from home is a relative inconvenience.
@@SigFigNewton Less expensive?! Haha, depreciation is off the charts!
@@G-ra-ha-m Which is good for second-hand buyers, making EVs cheaper for them. All this will stabilise soon as EVs stop being a novelty. They are already cheaper for a lot of people - that number will grow over time.
@@xxwookey When will they stop being a novelty?
I think the people with driveways are the ones buying BEVS at present for cheap charging. There are a lot of people who live in terraced houses and flats that BEVS are impractical.
How do you refuel your ICE car at home?
@@paulc6766 You don't have to schedule out an hour of your day to refuel your ICE car at the station tho.
For people who rent/live in flats/roomshare EVs are basically impossible to own.
@@sudiptodas0001 If 10 million UK homes have off road parking how many more EVs to saturate that market? (8.5million more EV sales ? ) I have 2 on my drive and my son and daughter will make 4 when they get them.
PLEASE Don't confuse vehicle registration statistics with actual SALES. The SMMT figures do NOT relect the true position.Just look at the number of pre-registered new EVs on Autotrader. Not facing up to the facts will put many dealers and possibly a major car manufacturer out of business.
Probably happens more with ICE than with EVs
In the Tesla direct to consumers business model, what you are describing is not even possible
@@SigFigNewtonutter rubbish! Look at the number of delivery mileage Tesla models on Autotrader all manufacturers are forced into it because of Government meddling and it is
killing the motor industry. I worked in motor trade for 18 years. You clearly have no clue.
Many major car companies WILL be out of business in 5 yrs. No joke. Look at the debt situation over at Nissan or VW for references.
In Australia, GM and Ford withdrew from local manufacturing 10 years ago, so there is no home industry to protect with tariffs. We are currently enjoying the choice of cheap chinese EVs and a price war for market share. Australian buyers are very happy ! 😊
Agree Jonathan but we're not getting the truly affordable models, $25-30k, unfortunately. Hopefully in the near future 👍
@@ElectricCarAustralia I forgot to mention that ANY cars above the $76,950.00 luxury tax threshold still attract a 33% additional Government tax. (Alot of vehicles listed around the $70k mark).
On the other hand Every tradie here aspires to drive the likes of dodge rams etc and the government uses our taxpayer dollars to subsidies the fing things.
The only problem is that every tradie and his dog aspire to drive things like dodge rams etc and the government uses our tax dollars to subsidies the fing things.
@@jonathanfgh1 yes, protecting local car manufacturing which we don't have anymore 🤣
Only one in ten battery electric vehicles sold in the UK is to private buyers. The rest are business purchases because of tax incentives. EVs are currently too expensive for private buyers
So why wouldn't private buyers consider a decent used EV instead of a new one? I saw someone get a really nice 2016 Renault Zoe with 35k miles on it, for £4400 a while back. Why do you assume an new EV is the *only* option? Plenty of decent used EV's out there now.
@@Brian-om2hh I imagine the reason private buyers who buy new is the reassurance of a long warranty and the relative absence of risk. Buying a used EV is very high risk.
@@andyburns6496 i bought a 2 year old nissan leaf in 2016 , ran it for 7 years. No issues , very reliable. someone bought it off me at 9 yrs old . asked me if it had a new battery because it still had all its battery bars and range. I've been driving 40 + years. All cars have risk attached to failures. Battery and drive train warranties for current electric cars are longer than any vehicle i've owned in the past. Hence why i bought another EV with my own money brand new.
as were the first computers, flat screen TV's and digital cameras. Just wait a little bit longer.
@@andyburns6496 This is a fair point. Thankfully we now have a few years of EVs being around and are better able to gauge the risks. 5 years ago I would have been more wary but now I would be more than happy to buy an EV that's 3 or 4 years old ... and there are some bargains to be had! I would say the risks are now comparable with buying a used combustion car.
What this ban is going to do is stop people from throwing cars away and keep them running instead. First step is reduce, second is reuse. Everyone forgets those because they want to consume
Until parts will not be available anymore.
Keeping old cars running is 'good' in terms of getting the most out of the original production emissions... however, it's bad given that older ICE cars typically have higher emissions than (equivalent) newer ones, and they will still emit very mile they drive.
As such, personally I think older ICE vehicles should be replaced (e.g. with a *second hand* EV, not a new one) as soon as a reasonable (price, range, and features) EV is available. After all, if it's a second-hand EV, then it's already paid off it's 'production emissions' *and won't generate any more*, unlike the older ICE vehicle.
@@logicalChimp A person who continues to insist on driving petrol doesn't care about the used EV market, it's not about accessibility. There will be a bastion of resisters for as long as petrol cars remain available. This ban means that everyone recalcitrant to the new tech, who already wasn't going to switch, is now forced to maintain the carbon captured by reusing the old, rather than buying new and continually throwing away the older cars.
I am not talking about a cool hypothetical best case scenario, I am pointing out a silver lining in the inevitable. We can't take all gas cars off the road, but we can make them recycle
@@rozonoemi9374 I can still get parts on my 1987 jeep XJ, so at least 36 years I would say
@@gormauslander I can still easily get parts for my 68 Plymouth Satellite , my 73 Road Runner , etc.
This is a transition not a revolution. Keep doing the basics - better batteries, cheaper batteries, better charging infrastructure. It's not rocket science, how quickly it happens depends getting the basics right & stop being distracted by all these 'digital extra' features that EV manufacturers seem to be obsessed with.
Take the mandate away and make the new tech desirable so people choose to have them. And as you comment, by making them basic focusing on the main requirement for a car they become more affordable.
Dearer cars, 0-60 in 5 seconds, a geeky iPad, the light arrays, some built flimsy - but the green reg plate makes it all ok.
@@palemale2501 and also, cars that are quicker than an ICE sports car from 0-60, ripping up the road surface, how do insurance companies ever begin to provide affordable insurance for younger drivers, when every car made is a performance car, in my day you got into your 1.0L Austin Metro , or mini, and it did 0-60 eventually, everyone was happy
@@craigsketo- Nearly every EV involved in an Accident is currently written off too - higher insurance costs, more complex waste to be disposed of too ! The conundrum goes on ?
@@georgedaville4662What complex waste? And if you say the battery then I know you don’t have a clue?
"Sold" by which you mean registered so manufactures can hit their targets. Theyre not sold mererly just registered. Big difference!
As others have told you this has been car manufacturers practice for decades.
The majority of BEVs sold in UK are actually leased. Not a great many are owned outright.
Seem to be plenty on PCP looking at how much those deals are discussed online.
@@cad4246 Those will be the ones paying over the odds in PCP interest who can't get on the housing ladder! There will come a time when buying on-the-tick reverts back to save and buy outright ... that cycle has happened a few times since the 70's! I bought my last car on PCP and paid it off after a month. Got a great discount because of the finance deal and saved £4k in interest ... just because I saved up for the 3 years prior to that first. Had the car 8 years now. Couldn't do that with the starting price of a comparable EV workhorse!
Majority are company car leases. However, I have noticed some amazing deals in the public market recently - eg Lease Loco for Ora Funky Cat or VWID7. Being able to get a new high quality BEV for £200 a month is incredible. The used market is even better - Peugeot and Vauxhall have depreciated so much they're at bargain prices.
Although those leases EV's will end up in the private market once the leases end....
Because that's the best way of avoiding the worst depreciation.....
I live in Las Vegas and was living in LA last year. It seems that one in every five cars is an EV now. It's great. As charging infrastructure and battery tech continues to evolve, things will accelerate. People saying "EV sales are dropping" are also saying that in the context of very high interest rates with a slowing economy. At this point you couldn't pay me to go back to gas! I charge up at home for like $6, it's fantastic.
Where I live most of the EVs catch on fire and people are not buying them
@@Crusader1984 did you know that gas cars catch on fire 60x more often than EVs? It happens so often that the news doesn’t report it. Where do you live, Mad Max?
@@Crusader1984where?
@@Crusader1984😂 Of course most of them are. Mines caught fire most days in the last 5 years.
@@Crusader1984we have had multiple Battery storage fires here in SanDiego. Communities are getting wize to this and blocking them from ever coming in. Why is it Libs are pouring Billions of dollars into Conserative Republican States. For Votes literally buying votes! Why do EV need so much Govt money?
"It's not a ban" goes on to describe a ban. A superior technology should just take over naturally, and for some people it is superior, but not all.
It is superior period. I give you the caveat of towing with ICE vs towing with BEV but that will fall also. Remember when Leaf was the only BEV people could buy and the range was pathetic? Truth is electric will take over before the ban takes effect. Norway is your avatar. 90% of new sales are BEV.
Kevin, it's not about pushing a 'superior' technology, it's about stopping the pollution generated by burning gas.
@@robinbennett5994 I highly doubt we'll get anywhere close to the environmental goals, and passenger cars are only a small portion of those goals.
@@cre8tvedge beta max was superior to vhs . Vhs still won.
Lazerdiscs to dvds .
Hd dvds to bluray .
Vr will take over gaming
Just because rich business men want their tech to succeed doesnt mean the public has any interest in buying it .
The government trying to force people to buy this one true tech will make most people want to buy any other alternatives possible.
Of course there will always be the elites who will rush out to buy the latest gimmick.
@@kevenharvey9711 As a family who have ditched combustion cars it was 1, a big outgoing buying fuel 2, a lot of kwh equivalent 3, more than double our also gone gas boilers annual energy consumption. So if we as a family can ditch 12500 kwh of gas , 26000kwh equivalent in petrol/diesel. and replace that with an additional 7000kwh of electric minus 3300kwh we now generate from PV its looking achievable to me.
I'm hanging on to my Ford Fiesta for as long as possible. With no recognisable EV charging infrastructure outside of London the future looks dim for EVs here in the UK.
There is plenty of EV charging infrastructure outside London. There are ten level 3 chargers from various providers within 6 miles of home and I live in the sticks.
@@rogerphelps9939how many vehicles can each of these chargers accommodate simultaneously? How does that compare to the throughput achieved by all the filling stations within 6 miles of the same location? (I strongly suspect I already know the answer.)
@@lukedogwalker I strongly suspect you don't.
@@lukedogwalker There are 4600 cars per filling station on UK roads , we have seen what happens with panic buying. The number of filling stations has peaked and is falling.
You should not try to shut your eyes to some key factors on EV sales : 1. poorer countries will slow down sales earlier if EV prices Don’t lower down quickly 2. some countries have a huge percentage of people living on flats with no chance of charging at home 3. electricity price plays a big factor in EV sales 4. The lack of any kind of legislation regarding battery condition and range on used cars can have a big impact on used market and therefore on increasing the number of EVs on the road 5. The unknown world of battery replacement is still a big fear on second hand buyers . While EVs are the future of cars they have a huge number of game stoppers to a huge number of people . My parents for example, will not go for an EV : they don’t have money to buy a 15.000€ used car - they are the kind of people who have a 25 year old car and will use it until he doesn’t work anymore. I guess you can all imagine the millions of people in the world who are in the same situation. I’ve been in the UK some days ago and I can understand the hype there: you can buy a 10 years old car for 3.000 ou 4.000£, or even less. In Portugal the same car will cost you twice of even 3 times that value . That is the kind of numbers you have to understand when looking at EV future . A 2019 Tesla Model 3 here , with a respectable mileage costs between 20.000 and 25.000€ for you to know …
@joaoreis1079 You made some good points. In China next year there will regulations that evs will need to be checked every year and come up to a standard. This is where ev battery swapping will come into its own, every swap the battery gets checked, no need to charge at home, no need to get out of the car in the dark and rain to charge, don't have to worry about the battery, can upgrade in 3 minutes to a bigger battery for the holidays, civilised queueing on the app. Nio just introduced a cheaper brand Onvo, and a smaller cheaper brand coming next year, also Changan, Chery, Forseven and many other brands will be using Nios platform, they're trying to get swap stations into the UK soon.
What about all the 2022, 2023 and 2024 Bev sales that are actually pre-registered by the dealers and sat in fields just to try to fudge the numbers?
So where are these field? What location are they near?
Plenty around Bristol docks
@@CNCTOPYOKES So you have imported cars coming in with ships and they are unloaded at the docks ... strange.... :P
As Harry’s Garage stated, only 40% of homes have access to a garage/forecourt for home charging. Public charging is expensive and stressful. My partner and I were desperate to buy an EV, but when we did the maths, considered the problems of charging, we ended up buying an ICE Clio. For many people EVs just aren’t viable atm.
There's a big difference between not having access to a charger right now, and not having it in 10 or 20 years time. People like Harry confuse the two and assume that landlords and councils will never install chargers, and ignore evidence from places like Norway that have solved the problem fairly easily.
And if 60% of people do have a drive but only 10% of the cars on the road are EVs, there's plenty of time before this becomes a real issue.
You should write to your local councillor and ask what they plan to do about it.
Transitioning the cabling infrastructure to cope with the massively increased demand millions of evs would place on it will cost in the trillions, not billions. It simply isn't going to work when better alternatives already exist, doesn't make economic sense.
@@robinbennett5994 We will never have a charger where we live, the cost is prohibitive and we can't charge from home (we live in a flat). The owners of the property have said that it would literally cost millions to provide chargers. In our area public chargers are being removed and/or not being commissioned due to lack of demand....
@@salnaturile8653 No need for massive infrastructure upgrades... the grid already handled peak-time power demands, which are 3-5x higher than overnight demand... and most EVs charge overnight.
If anything, increasing the number of EVs will help *stabilise* the grid, and reduce electricity prices (and it's the national grid and power companies saying this - the National Grid posted a study about it a year or two ago, iirc).
I have looked at a few Harry’s garage videos and I’m afraid he’s a very biased petrol head. But you did the right thing and did what works for you in the end after some research. Based on your figures 40% of the UK may find an EV and much better choice for them.
As it stands the government has a 22% BEV sales target and fines for not meeting this. The current situation is BEV are struggling to make 16% so the supply of ICE cars are being restricted to avoid fines. But this situation is even worse as the sales figures for BEV are heavily manipulated by industrial scale pre-registering with the manufacturer taking massive loses. Sales to private individuals have collapsed in the UK with only company car sales and schemes like Motability propping up sales. But the smoke and mirrors are coming to an end and with the mandate increasing to 28% next year it will be carnage in the car market. Already the waiting lists for ICE cars is stretching out to 6 months and dealers are saying 1 year waiting list will be upon us soon.
Have you got any credible evidence for ANY of the claims you just made? Links would be good.
@@theelectricmonk3909 You cannot put links in RUclips, ALL are easy to verify. What is your first point you want clarified ?
@@OverlandExpedition Good point, I keep forgetting about the link ban :( F**king spammers. Anyway...
First one I'd like to see clarified: "the sales figures for BEV are heavily manipulated by industrial scale pre-registering with the manufacturer taking massive loses"
Second one: "the waiting lists for ICE cars is stretching out to 6 months" (and what's the comparable waiting list for a BEV? It was 3 months when I got mine, 18 months ago)
@@theelectricmonk3909Look on autotrader at the number of two year old EVs with delivery milage.
Imagine *wanting* an ICE car😂
I want a noisier drive for a worse music listening experience.
Slower acceleration is really my cup of tea.
Most importantly, I love going to petrol stations. Filling up at home sounds like a nightmare.
Don’t forget that the EU has proposed a ban on repairs for cars older than 15 years. If that gets passed, then they are coming for your ICE cars.
there are 15+ years old EVs. this would be a very wasteful decision. essentially a CAR would become a consumable product.
@@elononoras1902 Yes, and that is precisely the point.
Didn't know about that proposal ban...Wow..that is how you save the planet and its resources. Make everything non-reparable and make people buy new stuff every year. What a hypocrisy...
No it hasn't. This is disinformation. Go and read a fact-check site. They have proposed better tracking of scrapped cars so make use they are disposed of properly. People still get to decide for themselves when to scrap a car, just like now.
You claim that 93% of BEV owners will never go back to petrol cars. That doesn't hold water against the +50% increase of the used BEV sales.
The increase in used bev will be due to huge surge of end of company car lease agreements as well as some selling to buy another new but I agree the 93% seems a tad optimistic and goes against my experience with friends and colleagues
People don't like being TOLD what to buy, as soon as anyone does that it makes most people say fuck off and do the opposite..
You are right.
And most of the time good on them
You are right because I just walked past a Tesla dealership and was dragged in and the thumb screws were put on and I was beaten mercilessly until I bought an electric car. True story.
@ouethojlkjn some dealers have already stopped selling ice cars this year because they are nowhere near the EV sales targets, when people go in to buy a new ICE car the dealers are trying to force them into buying an EV.
If EV's were so good they would sell on their own merit without all this bullshit.
To put into perspective when pro EV people bang on about how sales are going up last year ICE fiestas alone outsold all the EV's combined.
I am an electrician and have been fitting domestic chargers since 2012 and the majority of our customers have got fucked off with them and gone back to ICE cars. We did an NICEIC update training course last year and the bloke running the course said make as much as you can as quick as you can because the arse is going to fall out of the market.
Ev sales across the board are nowhere near hitting their targets and used ones prices are going through the floor.
@@ADYDRURY1234 Interesting what you say and of course, you will not be surprised that I disagree with you. I was in a car dealership myself last weekend and there was no pressure at all for me to go one way or the other. So it's isn't the recent experience I have had. Incidentally, I went to look at a Dacia Spring - an EV for less than £15k on the road. Note that in America, there are at present 3.5 millions unsold new cars sat on dealer forecourts going all the way back to 2022 models. So someone in their millions isn't buying ICE either. Finally, don't be confused about all the subsidies and tax breaks the petro chemical industry receives globally - if these were not in place, UK diesel per litre fuel costs would be around 60p per litre more than it is now. Nice to know EVs owners are forced to give tax breaks to fossil fuel drivers eh? Oh, and a sub £20k Fiesta is not a £90k Mercedes so a rather pointless comparison. What sort of Fiesta can you get for £15k I wonder - that Dacia Spring will be in direct competition with them.
There was no need to mandate a stop of sale of vinyl records or cameras with film, it just happened anyway apart from some small number of enthusiasts. It will be the same for cars regardless of mandates.
That already happened when people transitioned from EVs to IC over 100 years ago. 100s of EV makers who could not make this advancement went bust.
Forcing a return to EVs is like forcing a return to film cameras. Very few people want to do it. But if you created enough incentives and penalties, and claimed it would 'save the planet'
you could probably hit similar re-adoption levels.
And no doubt enthusiasts would sing it's praises- "I don't mind waiting an extra hour for my photos to get developed, I like taking breaks anyway" :)
@@SteveLomas-k6k The switch to ICE was greatly helped by the convenience of the electric starter, few enjoyed the manual crank to start the car. Now the starter can run the whole car...
@@zapfanzapfanI take your point! But it wasn't the last IC improvement. My local golf course switched from electric to gas carts a few years ago. Electronic ignition and fuel injection removed the easy-start advantage electric carts used to have. Now you have the same convenience without the charging and degradation issues that killed EVs the first time around.
If they can't compete on a golf course, that doesn't say much for real world use.
@@zapfanzapfan Fair enough! But that wasn't the last advancement: My local golf course switched from EV to gas carts years ago. Electronic ignition and fuel injection took away the easy-start advantage the electric carts used to have for many decades.
If they can't compete on a golf course, that doesn't say much for real world use.
@@SteveLomas-k6k I've never seen a gas powered golf cart, not even back in the days when they ran on lead acid. These days ATVs are going electric, you don't want to scare away the deer with some noisy engine... 😉
Are the sales statistics real sales or registrations? Dealers will register cars to meet sales targets (to get their bonus), then sell the cars as second hand but with only delivery mileage. There are lies, damn lies, and statistics.
One reason BEVs are useful here in the Netherlands is the infrastructure. Just look at the number of charging stations we have! It makes destination charging really quite simple and we generally don't have the complex set of different cards required for different stations. Plus the local authorities are installing charging stations at the road side so that most people can have access to a charge point near home. I've had a PHEV for 10 years and if that is replaced it will absolutely be with either a new or used BEV.
We have quite a few Fastned chargers here in North east England - the ferry from ijmuiden lands here and they are great.
We have quite a few Fastned chargers here in North east England - the ferry from ijmuiden lands here and they are great.
When visited the Netherlands, I've seen the chargers adjacent to residential buildings, and I think that's the really obvious answer to "but what if I live in an apartment and don't have a driveway?" - bear in mind that the solution is provided by the government installing the chargers, so you can't really blame people in this case. It can be done
We have charge points everywhere in Denmark as well. So you can drive an EV even if you live in an apartment.
@@JDESP We're about the size of Wales but with 18 million people, why has Wales not done it? Norway is massive compared to a lot of countries and they are invested in EVs. This is not about size, it's about having the foresight, the same with our cycling infrastructure, we didn't just wait for some company to come up with a plan, we got together and pushed. Now that could have gone wrong, I mean if we have to change the socket on all those existing chargers, we are facing a problem. Personally I think this should be encouraged at EU level with an EU standard. Then half a billion people would pretty much be setting the standard.
Ev manufactures should stop putting so much unnecessary so called "High Tech" BS in their cars.
Hey, if you want to punish yourself every time you drive somewhere, that new (and very cheap) Dacia has almost no mod cons worth speaking of. Buy one, and wear your hair shirt with pride.
@@theelectricmonk3909 The Darcia. Finally, someone got it right. This is a brave EV that’s taking on the big guys just like the Dacians who took on the Roman Empire in 27BCE.
@@theelectricmonk3909 All that shoftware crap they are puting in EVs is a P.I.A.
I don't need it.
@@Bluetop-ez8ic Which software are you referring to? There's a huge amount of software in most modern ICE cars too (as I mentioned in another reply, check out that new Dacia electric car if you want bare bones, and cheap).
@@theelectricmonk3909 Yes, electric cars generally have more software compared to internal combustion engine (ICE) cars. Here are a few reasons why:
Battery Management Systems (BMS): Electric vehicles (EVs) require sophisticated software to manage the battery pack, ensuring optimal performance, longevity, and safety.
Motor Control: EVs use software to control the electric motor, which is crucial for efficient power delivery and regenerative braking.
Charging Systems: Software is needed to manage the charging process, including communication with charging stations and handling different charging speeds.
Advanced Driver Assistance Systems (ADAS): Many EVs come equipped with advanced driver assistance features, which rely heavily on software for functions like adaptive cruise control, lane-keeping assist, and automated parking.
Infotainment and Connectivity: EVs often have advanced infotainment systems with features like over-the-air updates, smartphone integration, and real-time navigation.
In contrast, while ICE cars also have software for engine control, infotainment, and some driver assistance features, they generally do not require the same level of software complexity as EVs.
I find all the fake news so tiresome, it used to anger me but I’m just tired of it now. Thank you for putting this out there.
The internet is the equivalent of a men's room wall. Anybody can write any garbage they want there, so why do we trust so much of it without checking the source?
That's their goal. Gish gallop until you give up. Don't give up! Keep fighting the BS.
I went through a period of feeling that I had to try and correct everyone taken in by the anti-hype too. Now I just chill in the sure knowledge that it has too much momentum to stall now. We are on our way to a sustainable future despite the vested interests, the wibbly wobbly government, the bleating few car makers who can't keep up with the majority and the Chinese/Koreans/Tesla, the lack of commitment to getting the infrastructure where it needs to be and of course the 'petrol heads' who's only argument for their ICE cars seems to be that they make a noise!!!
The only fake news is the sales figures for BEV cars. They are pre-registering cars on an industrial scale to manipulate the new BEV sales figures. These cars are then sitting in fields in some cases for years before they sell them on as secondhand with the manufacturer taking the loss. Even with this manipulation they cannot make 16% therfore setting a limit on how many ICE cars can be sold. Already the waiting list for a new ICE car is over 6 months and some dealers are saying 1 year for popular models. When the mandates increase to 28% next year this situation will get worse. We will end up like Cuba running old ICE cars for years.
You do realise most of this channel is fake news don’t you? Those SMMT figures are fudged for a start. Manufacturers are pre registering cars to meet figures. You can buy 1 year old EV’s with delivery miles, what does that tell you.
I would like to know where the EV charging infrastructure is going to come from - and how it will be funded - to serve the millions of households, like mine, that don't have off-street vehicle parking?
It will be installed according to market demand, like most things. There is already a lot of on-street charging, and more will appear as demand makes it viable. It will be funded largely by commercial debt, like most businesses.
Private enterprise is funding most EV charger installations. They recoup the cost by charging people to use it....
@@xxwookeyoh no, you seriously don't expect the "market will provide"? Good god, where you living under a rock when Truss was PM? Get your coat. You do not live in the real world.
@@lukedogwalker That makes no sense. Truss put out an idiotic budget and markets reacted, so that example is hardly proof that markets don't work. Chargers are installed as demand appears, in just the same way that petrol stations were. The basic demand incentive is modified by grants, first-mover advantage of acquiring good sites, desire to provide customer amenity, and so on. It seems to be broadly working so far, and I don't see any reason why that should change.
@xxwookey you're just quoting a GCSE business studies textbook. None of this is happening at the necessary scale or pace nationwide. We have no time. The 2030's may as well be tomorrow. Rolling out this new infrastructure in time would require a war time economy. And you'd still have to rehouse everyone living in dense inner city housing so there would be sufficient space to provide at home charging options without compromising on basic health and safety. And there's much more but it just passed midnight so I'm done.
How about people are running out of money?
EV are cheaper. Save money.
That affects all sales.
@@Toqtamish129 hell no they are not cheaper. They’re way more expensive and the insurance cost more.
@@Toqtamish129 if you can barely afford the car loan, you are more likely to stick to what you know is good and meets your needs than buy the ‘hype’ with EVs
Buy second hand. The cognitive dissonance of all the people complaining about EV prices while also complaining how second-hand EV values are crashing... 😂
Dealers pre registering EVs to fiddle the sales figures, they aren't selling anything like you might be led to believe here.
Are you sufficiently stupid that you can't see the glaring logic flaw in this blather?
Well the SMMT (who compile the figures for the *whole* car industry - both manufacturing and sales - say that sales of both new and used EV's are up on the same period last year. Still, what do they know, eh?
They do the same with ICE cars. Always have. 😉
EV sales are increasing.
ICE sales are decreasing.
Look at actual data.
Hint: legacy auto makes more money from ICE sales.
Which is to say… the narrative spinning isn’t being pushed only by oil companies
Manufacturers and infrastructure suppliers have been profiteering and it’s backfired. The charging price hikes have destroyed one of the ‘pull’ factors.
95% of charging is done at home, so I don't think it's a factor. If you need that much DC fast charging, which is not as good for your battery pack, BTW, you can get on a subscription plan that can save you a bundle.
In the UK, with our infrastructure (lack-of), perhaps the year 2030 mandate should be changed to 2300.
I'm occasionally intrigued when I see comments like this. If I had read this in 2012, I would have to shrug and agree, although it was possible to drive anywhere in an EV back then, it was a massive pain, and a huge compromise from driving a fossil burning car.
There was probably 150 places you could find a rapid charger and they often didn't work.
Now, in 2024, there are 70,000 publicly available rapid chargers at 32,000 locations across the UK.
The chargers are easy to use (tap to pay) much faster and much, much more reliable.
By the end of this year, at the current installation rate, we will reach 100,000.
All of these rapid chargers have fairly low utilisation rates, meaning that although there are now 1.1 million EVs on the road in the UK, people use these chargers way, way less than people who have only ever driven a fuel burning car can understand.
We have infrastructure, you don't see it because you don't use it. This channel is here to counter the casually held misinformation that so manny people are so willing to spread on behalf of the fossil fuel industry.
@@fullychargedshow We have infrastructure, you don't see it because you don't use it.
Wrong. We don't have infrastructure.
I am working on electrical industry.
Stop lying.
@@RumburakRumbu I doubt that you work IN the electrical industry. You think you know more than industry experts including the National Grid.
This increased number of second hand EV sales in the UK - have you done a research why? If people are selling the car they have bought after 3-4 months - there you get your number. Why would you sell a car after a few months owning it - is the question. If there is such a huge natural demand for second hand EVs - the prices will go up. And it is the total opposite.
I love ICE cars, I will keep driving and owning ICE cars for as long as my can. But I would love to have an EV daily driver for the work commute. Unfortunately, no automaker is producing a small, simple, cheap and repairable EV option. I want a basic, no-frills car with physical buttons and knobs for every single control, no giant touchscreen. I want to be able to perform work on my car without jumping through modern car hoops like parts pairing. I don't want my car sending my data to everyone every single second of the day. New ICE cars suffer from the same issue, but in the ICE world I can take my pick from any number of older used cars which just provide the basics I want, I can perform basic maintenance and drive an old car just as well as the day it rolled off the line. As it stands there are simply no good options in the EV world. Old used more basic EV options all have tired batteries which cost 3x the price of the car to replace and modern ones are all expensive computers on wheels. I honestly don't think automakers will ever produce what I'm looking for so I may end up looking at an EV conversion of an older car. I am ready to daily drive electric as soon as an option that meets my criteria exists.
You can buy a two-year-old Tesla for less than a new Honda Civic. It would help if you were a genius to be able to work on new ICE vehicles. But then I have both an EV and an ICE. I can't fix much, if anything on either
Jay Leno has one of the worlds most extensive collections of classic and unusual automobiles in the world. It goes all the way back to the steam age and all the way up to today. I saw one of his recent videos, where he was showing a famous Brit around who said he loved his two EVs, and Jay replied that he prefers driving around town on business in his 9 year old Tesla, because that's the best car for doing that. No maintenance, no gas. The gasoline cars are a hobby, and he wants to preserve them and drive them for fun, not for necessity, and driving them on the freeway would not be fun.
@@Trashed20659 I don't actually disagree, part of why I'd love an EV daily is the reliability and lack of maintenance. However, when something *does* go wrong, which will absolutely happen, I want the ability to repair it myself or at least get a trusted local garage to perform the work. The only current option for a lot of EV issues is being forced to ship it off to some service centre and wait for them to charge me for a whole new battery pack when the only actual issue a small plastic part has worn out or just one cell is bad or something.
All that you mentioned can be done on an EV. There's just less basic maintenance to do on them. Also, you can get a VAG derivative of the eUP. No touch screen and plenty of buttons for you to fondle. Why do naysayers talk such rubbish?
If you want an EV that is like an ICE without a mega touch screen and lack of conventional controls go for a Nissan Leaf, it has all the buttons IRL. They are also incredibly good value second hand/used and so long as you don't believe the conspiracy theory lies about battery life there is no reason not to get one.
The car companies are forced to sell their EV cars as a percentage of the total that they sell. This percentage of EV sales is going up as a percentage year on year to 2030 as forced by governments. Therefore there will be fewer ICE cars sold as heavy penalties will need to be paid if they sell too many ICE vehicles. Also that means there will either be a shortage of ICE vehicles that dealers will be willing to sell, or that the price of these cars will become much more expensive to compensate the dealers for the penalties charged. So in reality drivers who want to continue to buy a new ICE vehicles will be shafted, either through initial cost or availability. A disgrace in my opinion.
There will be al lot of 20+ year old cars like in Cuba.
I would love to own a BEV. But 1) I can’t afford one and 2) the battery dies too quickly in our frigid winters.
An older BEV like a LEAF or a Zoe is not that expensive ( a few thousand). OK, there aren't any EVs that only cost hundreds yet (and still work), but there aren't many ICE cars in that category these days either.
I would have gone bev by now, had I not had the feeling that car makers have cynically used the transition to hike prices of all cars, wether bev or not.
While you are not going EV you are missing out on all the savings. There is no servicing a Tesla and even at the most expensive public supercharging rates a diesel in the uk would have to do 60 miles per gallon to be competitive.
2nd hand EV prices are dropping like a stone.
@@rhysbevan429 an even better reason to go buy one. You will save a fortune.
after COVID inflation + every car having to come with extra bells and whistles (Hyundai started that) means all cars cost more than ever today. Used cars are even higher as they become scarce.
@@rhysbevan429 some more than others. As better models come out, few people want a less capable one, but if you don't need gobs of range, great deals abound! Give the teenager a car with a short leash, and he will stay in the neighborhood, but thank you for the free "gas".
I believe that there will be a tipping point where areas of the country (probably big towns and cities initially) we'll see the closing of filling stations simply due to lack of use.
The lack of pumps will cause the remaining fossil drivers to think about a switch. The ripple effect will spread out and, while petrol forecourts will still exist, the cost and complexity of getting the stuff will cause the demise of the internal combustion engine could be faster than you might think.
yes, and glowing reviews from EV owners to ICE owners fretting over repair and gasoline bills.
I was thinking the same thing myself.
but big oil are out in front again, the shell garage, and mobile hqve added on what used to called supermarkets in the uk, now do tea time shopping and fill up your gaz car, they adopting.
and they even under cuttting supermarket petrol prices,,,,,
Yep. The availability of fuel as their numbers dwindle is what'll kill off the last ICE cars.
Petrol stations have been closing down for the last 30 years. So it's nothing new. I expect we will lose more standalone stations but the supermarkets will keep fuel for a long long time. People still visit the supermarket to buy food, so they will keep fuel as long as they can or they lose that ICE customer.
But whatever happens it's a long way off yet.
@@gavjlewis It would make more sense for them to put in chargers. If you need to stay for half an hour to recharge, you have more time to spend buying other things.
I would have thought the reason for any plateau is obvious. We are just buying our first EV (we are very excited!), a model noted for a low price AND we got a substantial discount. But it is still by far and away the most expensive car we have ever bought - and we are in our 60s! Until EVs can break into the budget market, they will always remain niche.
China can help in the UK.
I dont want screens and apps and gimmick's and beeps and pings and stuf you immediately turn of when you really dont want to use it .
I just want an car that drives me from a to b
and back again
VW e-up 👍
Unfortunately, bings, pings, pops and dings apply to all cars these days (ICE or BEV).
that's why my very first EV will be a . . . milk float
Three questions regarding the proposed switch to EV's.
1. Where will all the electricity come from to power EV's?
2. How much copper will be required to upgrade the electricity grid to deliver the electricity to the consumer?
3. Can HGV's be powered by electricity?
1 Electricity generators (we only need about 12% more peak generation to power all the cars)
2 Some. We have enough.
3 Yes - some already are.
None of these things are particularly hard to deal with, given the 15 year timescale for most of the switchover, and 25 years for the tricky cases. That's time for plenty of change.
You'd better direct your last question to Volvo, M.A.N. , Mercedes, Scania and the others, who already have fully electric HGV trucks on sale.... Auto Express had an overview of the latest M.A.N. fully electric articulated HGV a few weeks back. It has a 500 mile range, and can pull the same trailer as the diesel powered version. The drivers who tried it, commented on the fact it had massively more torque over the ICE version... It seems you had no idea these even existed...
EVs are still primarily purchased as company cars or leased. When these uses cars hit the second hand market they depreciate heavily because when the battery is out of warranty it is very expensive if a cell fails. Tesla is the best EV in the market and only 2.5% of the batteries fail.However if you are the poor sod whose battery fails a refurbished battery at best is £5000. For this reason alone less well off people can not afford to buy one.
... and the reason why so many dealer don't want to handle 2nd hand EV's, because the cost of a warranty claim (even if they just give you 6 months) on a battery pack failure totally writes off any profit they can get for the sale! The risk is potential commercial suicide for smaller independent dealers.
The manufacturers warranty is portable, so if it was a seven year one then four years likely to remain at the end of the lease. An EV's price, like an ICE car, at the end of warranty (8th/9th year) will be a small percentage of it's original price - good running cost savings will still be available though. So you either run in into the ground as many do at the car age, or pocket the savings to spend on parts if needed; there are shops now who can replace cells/modules, and more will appear over time as EV numbers increase.
@@GruffSillyGoat so who takes the hit when the battery fails when out of warranty....bin the car on year 8? What is needed is the option to buy insurance to cover the 2.5% of the batteries that fail. If this insurance was affordable I'm sure the cars would sell.
@@madmcadder4536 - the same person as now who takes the hit when a timing belt goes on a used ICE car. Timing belts have a higher incident rate than a bettery repair at that age of car. Note I said repair, as more shops are opening up offering the ability to swap the damaged battery cell/module, at a similar cost to a timing belt fix.
Most leases last 3 to 4 years. An EV has an 8 year battery warranty...... Why might it be "very expensive" if a cell fails? I watched a RUclips video of an EV having a battery pack refurb (with some cells being replaced) The work took 4 hours, and the cost was £500. A new engine in an ICE car could typically cost anything from £4k up to almost £10k....
You said it; the luxury end of the BEV market is saturated. More smaller, cheaper versions are needed. Maybe if vapes were banned those resources would help bring BEV prices down too!
America has this issue, which will change. In the EU they have many cheaper EVs to chose from now. Kia is bringing their $35K EV3 to America soon, and it's gonna kill a lot of competition, even in the ICE space.
@@Trashed20659GM stupidly canceled the affordable Bolt/Bolt EUV, causing its sales to crash. It "replaced" the Bolt with a bunch of the same overpriced mid-size EV crossovers that every other car company is trying to flog. Supposedly a cheaper Chevy Equinox EV trim is coming, and a new Bolt. Meanwhile Ford in the USA seems to have no plans for a cheap EV, but it has a skunkworks project that's going to do something really amazing, honest!
With steep tariffs neutralizing the threat of cheap Chinese EVs, it's obvious Western car makers want to keep selling expensive EVs, and they'll push governments to relax emissions targets and EV mandates because "our customers just aren't ready."
@@skierpage It's wild. Everyone was promosing a cheap new EV by 2025 a few years ago. Heck, they were all promising like 20 new EVs. It's very interesting that after the US introduced tariffs on Chinese-made EVs suddenly they all backed out and got very quiet. Which is incredibly stupid because the Chinese are already building factories in Mexico that will defeat the tariffs. So when the Chinese enter the market, the US companies will all be even further behind. Heck, they've all had 20 years to figure it out. And when the Chinese come, who will they have to blame?
@@patreekotime4578 yup, Western manufacturers have always promised more EVs than they actually deliver, starting a decade ago with Nissan and Renault both promising a range of BEVs and only delivering one. Ford still only sells three beevs in the USA (yet another midsize crossover, a big truck, and a commercial van), Stellantis nothing, and VW only the ID.4. GM will be selling about nine bevs by 2025, but it's a big truck, a Hummer and seven ^$#@&! midsize crossovers.
@@skierpage Meanwhile the Koreans seem to be able to make plenty of them and more all the time, sell them at somewhat reasonable prices, achieve class-leading efficiency, offer class-leading warrantees, with class-leading beautiful designs, class-leading charging rates, and seem to have few major issues. If you told me 30 years ago that Korean car companies would be kicking American car companies behinds I am 100% positive I would not have belived it. And yet here we are.
But it is a ban. A ban on new sales. I'm a three time BEV owner, and I appreciate the need to decarbonize, but banning petrol vehicle sales just makes people resist the change.
If they really want to promote it, remove new EV sales tax and give apartment complex operators an incentive to install EV charging.
I'm old enough to remember similar arguments when leaded petrol was banned. "'Forcing' expensive catalysts on people." "Engines need lead to last more than 50,000 miles", "pushing owners out of cars they love". Some people are just scared of something new.
Incentives worked to kick start sales of BEVs, reintroducing them will just add ammo to those who like to complain even more. They already claim BiK means they are paying more tax, which isn't the case means EVs company car drivers are taxed but to a lower degree.
There is already regulation around landlord and flat lease owners increasing deployment of charging. We'll have to see what happens in the budget to beef this up.
EV owners only pay 5% vat on the electricity they purchase to charge their cars at home, or no tax if they charge from their solar panels. ICE car driver's pay out hundreds £££ every year in fuel duty that is hidden in the cost of every litre. ICE car drivers already pay per mile as soon as they start their engines and more so if their car isn't very economical.
It's called doublespeak. Leftists love it, because it allows them to distort reality, while at the same time accusing you of spreading misinformation.
Well I am old enough to know that replacing one gadget for another every few years is never a good solution. EV are getting dumped, written off by Ins Co's by people who do not hold on to these cars ...why ? The next better model comes out, the next better gadget, the next better iPad etc. Technology is disposable. So are EVs stop acting like these people buy their toys and hold on to them forever. @@TheGramophoneGirl
HOLY FRUNK! Great surprise seeing my EV sales report here. Took me weeks to put together. Thanks for the great stuff as always! ⚡ -- Jaan, the guy behind EV Universe.
Why are loads of EV factories shutting down and their is loads of money going into investing in economical petrol and diesel engines ?
please provide documentation...
"Loads" of EV factories shutting down, are they? Name 4..... And nobody is investing big money into ICE engines anymore. You obviously haven't heard about Euro 7, due next year.....
I cant afford to buy even a 2nd hand BEV now , so when they ban sales of new ICE cars - the 2nd hand prices will rise dramatically , and I have no doubt that BEV prices will rise as well to take advantage of us not being able to buy a cheaper ICE car new anymore. in 30yrs time, the UK will be like Cuba , everyone will be driving 40yr old cars apart from the rich.
Neither the ICE or EV manufactures care about the poor.
I doubt you'll see too many 40 year old cars around. ULEZ schemes and various other emissions laws will see to that...
"Less people chose to smoke". They were priced away from smoking. The same will happen with combustion vehicles through aggressive fuel tariffs, forcing car manufacturers to sell a constantly reducing proportion of ICE vehicles or be subject to fines. Remember when Unleaded was introduced? The moment a good proportion of vehicles were using it, the price went up. Diesel? We were encouraged to switch because of greater economy and lower CO2 emissions, then the price went up. This country is not prepared financially or in its infrasture to convert to a mainly electric fleet. And when it does? The price will go up!
So don't hate the game, hate the player?
The grid will be fine. The grid is increasing by 6% capacity per year in the US.
EVs are not the reason the grid needs investment. There's plenty of spare capacity during off-peak hours, when most charging occurs. The grid needs investment because we're switching from burning stuff right next to cities to renewable power hundreds of miles away.
And if you're sure the price of electricity is going to go up, get some solar panels.
@@robinbennett5994 Well yes, however due to EV they need to increase the grid. If EV manufacturer would enable vehicle to grid charging\discharge, the grid would improve greatly as EV could be the surge protection of the grid.
@@robinbennett5994 ... or invest in a sustainable energy generator.
You forgot to mention that fixing battery vehicle 🚗 is a challenge in UK at this point and higher insurance costs contribute to lower sales
Repairing a battery is a rare occurrence. People don't buy ICE cars based on the cost of a new transmission, because they don't expect to ever need one. Insurance companies are still trying to figure out their actuarial tables for EVs, which are still so new. But competition will force them to compete on price just like with ICE cars. Most experts agree there is no good reason they should continue to be expensive indefinitely.
Not for me it isn't, because both the guys in my local (village) garage are HEVRA certified to work on electric vehicles..... Higher insurance costs? I paid £82 more for insurance cover, over the last petrol car I had...
Government forcing companies not to sell new ICE cars in 2034 is still a ban.
Should be 2030, but compromise is arguably needed
I recently switched to electric and can't see ever going back to an ICE. We used to have a small 'fuel efficient' car but running an electric car is 10x cheaper on fuel costs. We are lucky that we can charge at home on a cheap tariff most of the time. Hopefully the price of charging away from home will drop to be more inline with the price of petrol / diesel. Saying that it wouldn't need to drop by much and it would then be equal.
News from Norway would be really interesting because they are approaching EV/ i c e parity and in some specific locations it will be much higher than that so we'll get to see what the the changeover scenario will actually be like
You didn’t even mention the MASSIVE DEPRECIATION that new ev’s suffer from- after 2 years they can lose 50% of their value- who wants to waste their money this fast?!
People buying 2nd hand cars. They benefit from fast depreciation.
@@xxwookey but it’s not sustainable for most car makers if hardly anyone (apart from fleet buyers) buys them new. Car companies will be forced to leave uk market and crap chinese makers will dominate. And currently only BYD is a profitable Chinese ev maker- the rest are struggling to make profit
@@trev1978 Obviously if no-one buys new cars, then the supply of 2nd-hand cars will be reduced and prices will rise. My point was simply that higher depreciation benefits 2nd-hand buyers. 2nd-hand prices are quite sensitive to supply, as we discovered during covid.
These effects work exactly the same for all manufacturers, whichever country they are based in - this isn't a Chinese vs other countries issue.
Ultimately car companies have to compete on the quality of their offerings.
Given carbon border adjustments and WTO-regulated adjustments to counter unfair subsidy, then we have a healthy market.
Personally I'd be very keen to see car sales halve worldwide as we have way too many of the damn things, and car-centric transport systems just produces inefficient, expensive, unreliable, transport, with high death rates, high energy use and high resource use, and a lot of social exclusion. They have their uses, but places like the US and the UK have gone way too far in that direction. Decarbonisation is a good time to make some adjustments in favour of active travel, public transport and just less travel, as well as getting rid of (almost) all the ICE cars and associated pollution.
And you didn't mention the fact that most who choose a new EV will *lease* it rather than buying it, which means they side-step the worst of the depreciation. Why the concern about depreciation on a car you don't wish to own?
@@Brian-om2hh the lease companys will stop buying them too when they are almost worthless at end of lease and rapid depreciation has made them unsellable
It is different in Norway and Denmark :D But politicians must give people a financial incentive to buy an EV. Norway and Denmark have done this with good results.
Norway have a big advantage with huge access to wind and hydro power and so much money made from oil and gas they can afford the subsidies.
@@RamsayandClements Denmark has the same advantages, perhaps on a smaller scale, but still a lot of wind energy and more and more solar energy - and is self-sufficient in the oil and gas that is still needed + exports.
Instead of discounting EVs why not tax ICE cars more, both purchase and yearly running costs. You can ramp it up more and more as time goes on.
@@john681611 this would disproportionately affect people on lower incomes more, they can’t afford the expensive EVs. So this wouldn’t be a fair policy.
@@john681611 Why, when it comes to making the "alternative" more attractive, do you insist on making ICE cars worse rather than "improving" EVs? The same "tactic" has been used for public transit and hasn't worked, ever. All it does it syphon more money out of normal people's pockets.
It's important that people test drive any EV before they reject the idea. People are being "forced" into something that is cheaper to run, more reliable, faster, smoother, lower NVH. When I went to Shanghai, half the cars are EV's and the air in the city is clean. As a UK oil refinery is planning to close, maybe the market is deciding. It's difficult to hold back progress but if you think that the best way to spend time, have at it.
A UK oil refinery is closing because the government decided and not the market.
Perhaps its being phased out in favour of the lithium refinery in the NE, that's received planning permission to go ahead. After all, the focus is on creating a green industry base to grow the economy and jobs.
Making a law that you can't sell the type of cars people actually want isn't the market deciding, its communism.
@@kristopherharvey3499
It was a decision made by the private company itself, the Chinese and Mr Brexit no less, owns a substantial proportion of Grangemouth.
To be honest, it was noticeable when I visited London earlier this year (lived/worked there for 15 yrs, before leaving a decade ago) - the difference those 10 years have made was significant, in terms of background noise, air quality, and so on (as an asthmatic, it was a very pleasant surprise :D)
If governments would stop subsidizing big oil (trillions of dollars) gas (petrol) prices would explode and you'll then see people stop driving their guzzlers. But you don't hear people complainig about those subsidies, only about for EVs.
I guess in America........ Look from a diffrent point of view, in the Uk £58p of every liter of fuel is tax and then 20% of the pre tax cost is vat. Thats a lot of money, we are already seeing the roads decline at an alarming rate because the income of road tax is not covering the amount of money needed to maintain the raods. So if the cost of Electric doesn't get taxed to death i guess EV's will have to start paying some form of raod tax in the very near future.
@@K2edg The state of the UK roads is nothing to do with EVs, and everything to do with a Government who failed to pay for their upkeep. For sure, I would eventually (sooner rather than later) expect to see some form of per-mile road pricing, at least for trunk roads, to make up for the reducing income from petrol/diesel sales. I've no problem with that per se, as long as it applies to all road users & isn't exclusive to EVs.
$7 trillion and counting to big oil.
Big oil subsidies, your living in fairy world, the ev industry runs on subsidies, without corporate car tax on ev ownership no one would be daft enough to touch one of these things.
@@K2edg I have driven a Ford Fiesta since 2013 and never paid a penny in VED ("road tax") on it. It's not just an EV thing. It's linked to level of emissions. If you have been following the UK news you will know that electric vehicles will be subject to annual VED from 1st April next year. However, you also need to know that VED is not responsible for the level of road repairs in this country ... Vehicle Excise Duty was introduced in 1937 and the revenue goes into the treasury for anything that the government chooses to spend money on. There is no "ring fenced" money for roads that is associated with this tax.
Bravo, as ever Fully Charged bringing clarity, numbers, charts and context.
Give it another 50 years. At least.
Really? There won't be any petrol in 25+ years....
@@Brian-om2hh global consumption of crude oil left very rough guess, 50 yrs at least, I'd say
We already are covered in green algae, fifty years ??
Been driving a BEV for 5 years now, and Im never going back to ICE. If you just focus on the driving experience its way more pleasant than an ICE car.Yes there are some charging headaches, but if you can charge at home, a BEV is hard to beat in terms of convenience.
The rising popularity of electric vehicles (EVs) could trigger a domino effect, ultimately leading to the demise of traditional petrol stations. As more people switch to EVs, the demand for petrol will dwindle, forcing many petrol stations to close due to lack of profitability. The remaining stations may then increase their prices to compensate for the reduced customer base, creating a vicious cycle that further accelerates the shift towards EVs. Additionally, the closure of petrol stations will create inconvenience for those who still rely on petrol-powered vehicles, as they will have to travel longer distances to refuel. This inconvenience, coupled with rising fuel prices, could be the final nail in the coffin for the petrol industry.
You're talking years and years and years into the future, I think. ICE cars are going to be around for a while yet.
@@cal_lywalICE cars will be around forever - parked in the yard with weeds growing around it or gathering dust in a barn while an EV displaced it as the daily driver.
@@cal_lywal 6 or 10 but When it happens it will happen fast
It's already happening. I've been involved in a few projects that include proposed new petrol stations. During the planning stage or during design development these petrol stations have been omitted and charging bays added.
It would be an absolutely bizarre decision to build a new petrol station now.....
BEV's will dominate by 2027. There are thousands of used EV's coming onto the used market all the time ready to be hoovered up by people who don't buy new.
I don't go into London much now but if you walk through central it's often really quiet compared to when all the dirty ICE vehicles were rumbling past. You just hear the soft whoosh of tyre noise and the odd beep....
@@adus123 I don't think they make much money from fuel. It's all about getting people to stop for coffee and food.
Sales of many goods are down as cost of items keeping going up whilst salaries are stagnant or going down.
Of course they don't make what most people want. They need to reinvent the vehicle kinda like when the little truck 1st came out. It was no frills, cost effective, durable and hit all the marks. So much so it created a new class of vehicle. The electric vehicles are not no frills,cost effective or durable. This is the real reason they are struggling they miss read the market
Whilst you are correct, it is not only EV that suffer this pricing up high end malaise. Last time I checked the average price of a new car in the UK was a whopping £34,000 EV or no EV…
If they don't profit, they won't make it. The lead cars for the new technology are always going to be expensive, just like the first cell phones and computers. They were too rich for my blood! Now powerful phones and computers are cheap. Give it time, they know that they haven't met the sweet spot yet.
Unfortunately, in my opinion, it's about finance and commercial advantage. We used to buy our own cars as a personal purchase. We were careful in our choices and obviously tried to avoid paying any more than we had to ... because it was obvious when the costs were high or low because that money came out of our account in a lump! For many years now we have been tempted and manipulated by the possibility of owning a vehicle that would normally have been out of reach. The calculations are rolled into a monthly "affordable" payment which may not even result in you ever actually paying for the car ... or never owning the car if it's a lease ... for just a few extra $ or £ you can have this bigger fancier etc etc. The EV thing is just part of the same story. Now people have acquired higher expectations ... check out the upholstery on cars we were happy with 25 years ago ... so though you would think people are ready to buy a cheap small cost-effective vehicle I suspect that the marketing departments have "done their job" and customers are still going to be more attracted to those higher margin vehicles ... I wish it wasn't the case ...
Sales of cars of all kinds fell in Ireland, ICE more than EV. So I assume there is just a global manufacturing slowdown across the board. But let's focus on EVs because that makes the news.
The lack of off-street parking can make electric vehicles impractical for many households. According to Lloyds Bank, only 56% of British homes can currently support electric charging points. This means that many people will remain unable to charge an EV at their home.
This is a big problem. I'm still stuck in a filthy old diesel for this reason. Fitting street-side charging is great where possible, but I'd take some slow chargers in my local supermarket car park.
In some cities, they have put level 2 chargers on the power poles right on the street. If that can be done, why not run power straight from the street (where it comes into the house) down the pole to a charging unit on a stand or on the pole directly if it is in front of your house?
So you opportunistically charge your car when you park at the shops, or at work, while you're doing something else. Absolute worst case you drive to a fast charging station and spend 20 minutes scrolling through your phone.
Burning fossil fuel is causing massive harms to the only planet known to Harbor life, and people are whining about having to change their habits.
People remain unable to get petrol from their house too.
Sort of like gas cars now, I've yet to meet someone who has their own oil well and oil processing plant at home but I know people with solar and a plug
Okay, cigarettes weren't band, but smoking them in public places was. It was a forced choice: stop smoking and meet your friends at the pub, or smoke at home alone.
Perhaps governments shouldn't ban anything, just the places where users use.
when enough EVs are marketed at the right price, the transition will occur naturally. As more folks come into contact with EV owners who have nothing bad and plenty of good things to say about their cars when they have their ICE car in the shop again, or are worried about making it to one of the remaining gas stations on a low tank, or are given the evil eye because of the sound and smoke emanating from their cars, they will only see buying their first EV (new or used) as a positive possibility. I remember in the US, when smokers were given their own area of the restaurant, most thought "well maybe this will make the non-smokers happy now", but it didn't because smoke drifts. So then restaurants put in partitions of glass or plastic to contain the smoke, and smokers though "I don't care for the segregation, but it does make sense I guess". But smoke still got out of those areas, and non-smokers were getting used to not having to smell it any more, because businesses had banished smoking inside the office by then, so restaurants banned it altogether, and office buildings moved the smoking areas to 20 plus feet from the building, which meant smokers had to stand in the rain and smoke, and everyone could watch them through the windows. That, and a lot of public service campaigning, combined with huge tax increases imposed on tobacco made smokers a smaller and smaller minority, to the point that they have no say in anything based on that habit anymore. Just like smokers, ICE drivers will not in the end make a compelling case for why their preference should continue to be supported.
So along the lines of your smokers bann, you do realize EVs will all get banned eventually due to the fire and toxic Smoke EVs emit when they catch on fire via thermal runaway. As I my self dont want an EV anywhere near me, my family, my home, my place of business, my airport, my local resturant or Costco @Trashed20659
No one wants battery cars! That's the reason they aren't selling its that simple.
The reason electric cars don't do well is people are without true concern for their role in curating the world given to us.
I cant care less about the battery. People like me just want to go from A to B as cheap as possible, and comfort is a welcoming bonus. In fact where I live, electric car is the norm now. You go to car dealership, and you will be hard pressed to find ICE car. They are just so much cheaper to run.
@adamanthony7465 that's exactly why they arnt doing well because people are exactly aware, hence they arnt buying them haha.
@notme943 you obviously do care about the battery or you wouldn't of bought a car powered by one haha and isn't it cheaper just to keep your old petrol car on the road than pay max dollar for a new car?
@@tincambo I don't pay in dollars, and from where I live, the gas price is very very expensive. As my old car becomes too risky to maintain, it just makes a lot of sense to make the shift. Electric car are even very competitive in term of price, so I can't understand your point of "max dollar".
I don't understand your argument about the battery. Had petrol car been cheaper, I would've bought it. Your obviously have something against electric car, I don't.
I have an ev and love it. But I wouldn’t have purchased if I couldn’t charge from home. I think we need to accept that there will be this mix of ev and ice cars because of charging capabilities.
Planet earth disagrees. The damage done to our environment is just starting to be felt. The issue is that just like with COVID deniers, proclaiming how wrong we were on our death beds will be too late, so saying we will end up with a mix doesn't address the environmental problem.
If only there wasn't the urgency of the climate to worry about.
Luckily, there isn't. At our current rate we have literal millennia before it becomes a meaningful issue.
In the USA there isn't climate change according to most people I talk with. ICE cars will be fueled forever by unlimited oil and EVs can't be charged in a apartment, so they don't work for anyone. Don't pop the bubble of their reality.
@@ChaosSwissroIl It is already a meaning issue and getting worse. It is really noticable up North in North America. Draughts, floods, forest fires, permafrost melting, the foundation of buildings and roads are getting destroyed, pine beetles are destroying forests, glaziers disappearing or massively shrinking, diminishing farm yields, rising ocean levels etc. It is hitting the economy really hard.
@@ChaosSwissroIl Oh! a scientist. It's so nice to hear from you. I really does piss me off when Know-it-alls make comments with absolutely no facts behind them. You've got to wonder how they manage to get out of bed in the morning - come to think of it, maybe they don't. Anyway, thanks again.
@@yodaiam1000 Beleive it or not, we've had all those things since antiquity and even since before homosapiens even stepped foot onto the stage.
I can't imagine a trillion dollar industry having any influence on this.
The ZEV mandate is stopping the supply of ICE vehicles. Rationing ICE cars…?
Don't worry, you can still buy a loaf of bread, you'll just need to stand in line for a while- it's all for your own good :The Kremlin
@@SteveLomas-k6k well it’s definitely communism when you rig a market by rationing…
The market is now rigged and not a true reflection on the Sales of BEV’s and disingenuous Dan knows that full well…
What have you been unable to get? Or is this made up?
@@gerryparker7699 It seems like a natural result if the car manufacturers are unable to supply electric cars in large enough numbers or if consumer interest is not high enough. Or the price of ICE cars will skyrocket to allow the manufacturer to swallow the cost of the fee.
My only counter question is infrastructure. More EV chargers are being installed which is great. This enables more "on the go" or mid level trips. But one area ICE cars have the advantage still is the pure quantity of stations. They are everywhere. And yes it's true home charging eliminates a lot of need for that level of volume when it comes to EV chargers. But Home chargers is another "added tax" to buying an EV to first time buyer. That installation cost. A large bunch of home owners and renters it's just not an option. Again yes this is improving. The shear scall of infrastructor in a fully EV auto world, imho, isn't keeping up.
Where the financial incentives need to be is for those gas stations to afford conversions to chargers. A gas fill up is 5 to 10 min ish. An average charge stop can be 10 to 30 min, depending on lots of factors. So a matter of simple space to allow the same time turn over of customers for a station/shop. It's my observation stations don't have to room to support EV stations plus keep gas pumps. There is likely safety rules about how far apart those services need to be.
We can't just think of the cars. The whole ecco system has to evolve in a way that is financially viable for station owners to succeed. More coverage of that please.
you should think of the cost of a charger as part of the first purchase. It will pay for itself quickly in reduced fuel costs, as well as time and mileage spent on out of the way trips to get gas. Gas stations are not free infrastructure, you pay for those locations with the price of your gas. Part of the reason home charging is cheaper than gas, and cheaper than fast charging is that you already have paid for 95% of the infrastructure. You already pay rent or a mortgage...check. You already pay for electricity, which is already connected to your house....check. You just need to hookup a charger ...done. Many dealers will even help you with that and roll the cost into your car payment. I took the cheapest route, and had an electrician install a 40 amp service box outside my home months before I bought the car, then after purchasing said car, went next day to Home Depot and picked up a level 2 charger, which comes with a bracket I hung on the wall, then slid the charger into the bracket and plugged in the power cord. Done.
Every time you park a plug-in car is an opportunity to charge it. Unless they're in the middle of a long trip, people would rather charge while they're doing other things. We need much more moderately fast charging at parking spaces.
Every building that has power is a charging station. Get PV solar on your roof and not only is your house a charging station, but also the generator as well.
Why would you incentivise fuel stations to install chargers? Do you want to keep paying over inflated prices for something you have at home for half the price? Screw station owners, they've been ripping us off for decades and the sooner they're out of business the better.
This varies by country, some are way behind in their EV infrastructure roll-out' typically those who have problems with funding infrastructure in general.
In terms of the UK, there are about 8k petrol service stations in the UK (est. 64k pumps @ average 8 pumps per station), down from about 13k stations in 2000 and have been decreasing every year due to competition (supermarket in partiicular) and shrinking margins. Whilst there are 38k charging locations with 68k devices (i.e. pumps) growing 1.5k per month with over 100k individual car charging connectors. So it seem the crossing point between quantity of fuel stations vs pblic electric recharging locations has been crossed already.
Given 70% of the UK are able to home charge, this means there is a sufficient supply of EV charges to support charging on the go, although there are particular places in the country that need foccussed improvements in the availability of charger. However, the numbers of chargers still needs to go up generally, increasing the ability to both destination charge and perform transit charging en-route for longer distance journeys. It is the destination charging that is key for the 30% without home charging, particularly if chargers are sited at retail parks, town car parks, entertainment locations and supermarkets as this enables similar background charging to be performed.
Electricity is about halve the cost of petrol. The charger pays for itself. Even charging from a regular plug works: a typical car would charge about 125 miles in 10 hours. Should be enough to barely need a visit to a fast charger.
In summary, outside China and a few small markets, BEV market expansion is in a pause. My prediction is BEVs will go mass market when they hit normal ranges of 600km+, while long range variants are 700km+ and purchase price hits parity with ICE across a wide choice of models. Early adopters have to realise that even if they don't suffer from range anxiety, most people do. Manufacturers have to realise there's a range threshold they must meet for mass adoption to take place. Higher charging speeds and charging infrastructure build outs will help normalise EVs too. When non-enthusiasts see EVs as affordable and practical it's game over.
KIA EV3
@@diegomatter69and others
You will note that cars are only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to global emissions. Targets & incentives are therefore not tackling the problem. Public transport & freight are the biggest vehicle related problems & this is where we should be starting.
Additional cheap EVs from China have resulted in the increase of fossil fuel power generation, causing their emissions to grow. Targets need to be set for global power generation & manufacturing.
Emissions reductions are being targeted at the wrong end because they are easier to sell.
Keep trying, sales are poor compared to ICE.
I would not be surprised if this channel is being funded by China... They live in a parallel universe.
I just feel really sorry for the people who won’t be able to charge their car using their domestic energy supply.
I completely support a transition to EVs (just to be clear), I want to see it happen, but I am not in the least surprised that numbers aren't looking great (massage the figures all you like). Speaking to friends who have no bias one way or another, the overwhelming consensus is that people feel EVs simply aren't good enough - the battery technology isn't there yet - and they're far too expensive. The charging infrastructure is insufficient, becoming ever-more expensive, and if you live in a town or city and park on the street, the cheaper option of home charging generally doesn't work. These are all totally legitimate concerns. I use my car mostly for shorter journeys that could be done with an EV, but probably 25% of my driving is to remote parts of Scotland with minimal charging infrastructure and requiring long journeys. Until EVs can do everything an ICE vehicle can, and for the same, or less money; they will struggle with sales. So far they have sold to the people who can work with the tech we have and to companies/organisations replacing fleet vehicles, I would suggest the sales are slowing because for most people they don't make sense. As an example, I drove over 350 mile round trip last weekend to drop off a heavy item and pick up another one, I took my Ford Focus estate - it did the trip on less than 3/4 tank of fuel, I had no range anxiety, and because the car is worth about £5000, I didn't have to worry too much about marks to the boot carpet etc. Most people don't have £30k+ to spend on a car and they probably don't want to be stuck on a lease deal that requires large monthly payments - until you can buy an EV equivalent to my Focus that can do the sort of trip I've just described, EVs will struggle to break through.
Exactly! The charging infrastructure is slow, Tesla massive network only does a max of 250kw charging. And, they haven't upgraded alot of their older 150kw charging stations. Imagine when more people buy Tesla and going long distances. They will need to spend atleast 20 minutes at a site with queue. I think EV will probably be a no discussion just like ICE probably like the next 10 years or so. Tesla been over a decade and their charging stations have yet to reach 400kw. Battery charging tech needs to be innovate. Otherwise, I'm sticking with ICE for long distance travels. Not worth the headache.
Very similar here, I am running around in a similar value petrol vehicle that will last years if looked after and not a worry about how/where to fuel up. An ev makes no sense for many people so they wont do it and the government cant afford the gargantuan subsidies that will be required - right now - to get people to shift en-masse. And if you have no facility to charge at home overnight its pointless even thinking about it, unless perhaps you do very limited trips I suppose.
We did a trip through the Scottish borders in a Tesla and it was effortless. There were chargers absolutely everywhere. I don’t know what part of Scotland you’re talking about. You can buy a dacha spring EV for less than £15,000 on the road how many petrol cars come that cheap? And if you want range a Tesla model three long range will do 420 WLTP miles on a charge. Just do a bit of research you might be pleasantly surprised.
@@ouethojlkjn I think you've just illustrated my point! A Dacia Spring has a real world range of 100 miles (probably less in winter on longer runs) and still costs more than three times the value of my Focus, not even taking into account its depreciation. A Tesla Model 3 long range is £15k minimum for a used car with over 100k miles. If I was to put a heavy load in it and drive it to the Highlands - I was in Glen Urquhart last weekend and charging options are slim to none - how well would that range hold up on a used car like that? I suspect not very well. So I could maybe get away with replacing my Focus with a Model 3 long range, but it would cost me £10k at least and I'd have less practicality and more range anxiety. This is why it isn't a realistic option for most people.
@@tobee1k Good grief Glen Urquhart is less than 20 miles from Inverness, capital of the highlands ... hardly remote and distant from charging opportunities! (I'm not suggesting that EV is ideal for every person's use case but I suspect some people start off thinking it's going to be a problem and then rule it out.) I've driven in the north highlands and Skye and know you have to plan ahead but in the past week I've driven from the Scottish Borders to the south coast of England and around country areas down there too ... everywhere had charging of some description.
I just suggest people educate themselves from credible sources on options then buy what suits their circumstances......no forcing anything 👍
I have both a V8 ICE and an EV. Living in the USA in a congested city the EV is the perfect car. To go on longer road trips the ICE makes more sense. Over the next fifteen to twenty years I expect battery technology to be 5 to 10 fold more advanced, making the ICE pretty much obsolete.
Exactly! I get attacks by other EV owners saying I didn't plan enough....I don't eat? I don't stretch? I don't take bathroom breaks!.....ridiculous! lol......I don't need to spend 20-30 minutes charging or forced a stop. Peeing doesn't take that amount of time, I walk to the bathroom at the same time as stretching, return, then continue driving. I can eat one handed.....And, also, I don't need to gamble an unknown area if the chargers are always used, broken, or what......I don't understand some of EV owners think we're doing something wrong when we prefer ICE cars for long travel
Company cars are going EV in UK even for regular long distance travellers. the tech and infrastructure is just about ok and continuously improving. For bigger countries with longer road trips like USA you can see it will get there.
My firm encouraged train and taxi for long business trips. It gave you time to catch up on emails and work planning while travelling. If it’s available it’s a great option.
I still have 2 ICE. An old small truck for hauling crap I don't want in my nice EV, and wife's SUV she drives to work only. Using the EV locally and on weekends will increase the life of the ICE cars, and keep them out of the shop longer. I have good range, so I could take 200+ mile trips with only 1 stop for the return, and it's FREE for two years, so I don't mind 15-20 mins of stretching my legs when I can save so much money.
Jay Leno has one of the worlds most extensive collections of classic and unusual automobiles in the world. It goes all the way back to the steam age and all the way up to today. I saw one of his recent videos, where he was showing a famous Brit around who said he loved his two EVs, and Jay replied that he prefers driving around town on business in his 9 year old Tesla, because that's the best car for doing that. No maintenance, no gas. The gasoline cars are a hobby, and he wants to preserve them and drive them for fun, not for necessity, and driving them on the freeway would not be fun.
How long is a long road trip?
We have the SECC ev race every year distance 10 252 miles. Drivers must follow speed limit and are monitored through GPS. Some live stream the entire race. 3 top cars and drivers did this rave under 18 hours and 30 minutes. 1 place 18:04 to be precise. Sure this is extreme driving and I would not even do it in a Ice car. But I think it goes to show EVs are already pretty darn good long trip vehicles.
6:23 I love EVs and I want to get one but i do think the industry missed a step. When making PHEV they made lots of 20-50 miles EV only and petrol engine.
Why didn't they make more EV only drive with around 150-200 miles range but with a small 5-10L fuel range extender ICE. This might have helped people get over the range anxiety while battery technology further improved for later generations.
Maybe I'm speaking hot air r but it's just an idea I've been wondering for a while
Because batteries take up a lot of room and add a lot of weight. Gasoline is lighter than water, so the room saved with a smaller tank would not make up for the extra cost, room and weight of batteries needed, and the added cost of the vehicles would have caused buyers to revert to ICE-only based on that. I personally think hybrids are not an answer. The oil companies like them because they continue the need for fuel, and saving 25% of what you normally buy just means they can extend the lifetime of dependency they currently have the world in. They HATE EVs and so sponsor much of the anti-EV media that is intended to misguide potential EV purchasers. To me, buying into the hybrid hype is like wearing half a condom. If you want the full benefit, go all EV.
BMW i3 is like that. I think we will see lots of these after 2030.
Why would anyone buy a phev with 50 mile range if you can have one with 150 mile and almost never fill up. It will be a big selling point for the last phevs.
@5:55 that bar graph is brilliant - shame on Suzuki, Seat, Land Rover, Dacia, Honda, Toyota, Ford, Mazda, Lexus and Jeep!
I hate the Japanese companies for their attitude on EVs, but at the same time it's 100 percent understandable. They don't want to take the risk being first, and they know the longer they wait the more money they can make once the market is already settled. They are just making a token effort but it will change in a few years. But they will have lost some buyers, I for one will never buy a Toyota.
@@timscott3027 It's also potentially not going to work out well as they hoped... because the first (and even second-gen) EVs are rarely very good... as we saw with the Toyota BZ4X (it's sole offering - so far - that it makes itself... it sells a number of EVs in China, but they're just rebadged EVs built by its Chinese partner :D)
Early adopters were willing to accept those first/second gen issues previously because those were all that was available... but now that the 'leaders' are producing very polished, high-efficiency EVs at a better price-point, I think most buyers will be a lot less willing to buy a 'worse' first/second gen EV from a lagard...
Thank you for sharing. The true issue is not the type of ENGINE, but the EFFICIENCY OF THE USE
Straight from the WEF playbook
An industry that did not even exist just over a decade ago has taken 20% of the market from an established industry that has had a strangle hold for over a century.
This has happened with a handful of startups (how many startups have ever succeeded in the auto industry?) and a few legacy auto-makers barely dipping a toe in the market.
Imagine the growth when the charging network is more fully established, the startups prioritize affordable EVs and the legacy auto makers start to take electrification seriously.
or when more people are incentivized, as they are in my home state, to install a charger at home, with tax rebates? No place better to charge up!
Legacy auto need to take evs seriously, Like tesla other start ups they need to update the software and firmware, the self driving and other hi-tech features need to work. The battery needs to be repairable. So far I don't believe legacy auto are keeping up. They need a hi-tech sub brand like Zeeker under the Geely brand.
@@flukeylukey7559 legacy auto actually likes EVs. Big oil has them over a barrel, and the EPA wants more and more miles per gallon, which legacy auto has run out of ideas on.
@Trashed20659 Is it big oil or making money on parts and repairs, maybe the dealers need to be able to fix the battery cells or do health checks on them, this will be regular requirement soon.
@@flukeylukey7559 and this comment shows that some people don't know what they're talking about.
"dealers need to be able to fix the battery cells"
first they would need to remove the battery pack from your car
that'll only cost you a couple of thousands because of the specialised equipment involved, and the complexity of removing the battery pack.
then they open up the battery pack and find one or more individual cells that failed.
they replace them and put back the battery pack.
would you buy a reconditioned battery pack for your EV?
thinking that you have 10 brand new individual cells in it?
but having 6500 more cells so old they could fail at any point now or tomorrow?
I expect some people would.
And that's why EVs will survive for a bit longer, until everybody would wake up to reality.
If the batteries are not replaceable like in a Nio, then EVs are going to die out.
The problem is that how are people going to charge up their cars if they either live back to back or live high rise flats as nissan won't allow anyone who doesn't have a drive way or garage to test drive their car's
How do you fill up with petrol if you live in a high rise flat? Are there petrol pumps right outside? Here's a solution. Drive to a charging hub....
@@Brian-om2hh what if there charging hub is to far away or isn't working
The technology doesn't exist to economically and practically replace ICE vehicles at the moment.
Electric isn't a religion. We absolutely need tor evaluate mandates with concern to practicality and cost.
That is a fascinating comment. I don't have a response other than to say that I now have personal experience with electric vehicles going back 16 years and I would agree, 10 years ago the EV was a genuine compromise from ICE vehicles. Now, however, that is just not the case. They are actually, measurably better in all aspects, including the ridiculous myth/lie of 'range anxiety and 'there's nowhere to charge them.'
I agree 100% electric isn't a religion, it's simply a better technology that has massive, well funded, determined resistance.
From where?
Who do you buy liquid fuel from? They are not happy and spend literally $ Billions spreading misinformation, which is very very easy.
@@fullychargedshow Misinformation + very stupid people hence Trump.
If you want more people to buy electric cars, you have to first make sure that everyone has their own house with a garage. It's very convenient when you can just plug in your car at home and know that every time you take it out, it is at full charge. But when you live in a rented 5th floor apartment with 5 EV chargers in a 1 mile radius that are always taken by someone already, how do you make it work at all?
Why do you need a garage? My charger is outside, bolted to the side of my house.....
@@Brian-om2hh Yeah, YOUR house. Garage or no garage doesn't change literally anything about what I said.
EV’s are great for highly urbanised countries. But the in countries like Australia and the US problems like range and charge times have not been addressed. Much of the worlds rural and remote areas will be practically inaccessible and towing caravans is impossible
Like you can’t plug an electric car on every socket that ever existed, charge with solar panels, or buy a 1000 miles Chinese electric car… because news flash, all of those things are possible. The real pickle here is the price, which VW, Toyota and others have been happy to delay doing something about it with misinformation and other negative tactics. Electric cars are coming, it’s an inevitability, just like Motorola and Nokia disappear from the face of the earth, gas guzzlers will also do, because it is simply an inferior product, and at a scale, more expensive to manufacture
Fact: EVs have sufficient range to cover a typical household’s daily travel, which is approximately 50 miles on average per day. The majority of households (roughly 85%) travel under 100 miles on a typical day. Most EV models go above 200 miles on a fully-charged battery, with nearly all new models traveling more than 250-300 miles on a single charge. And automakers have announced plans to release even more long-range models in the coming years. Kia EV3 will have over 450 mile range in extended range model. Tens of thousands of public chargers are available now, with tens of thousands more on the way. I can get 100 miles added in about 10 minutes. But most charging is done at home. Just think: once everyone who can has a home charger and they have them at work, it will become even less necessary to use fast chargers. When you make the long trip to Grandma at thanksgiving in an EV with good range, you will be able to charge at her house, and maybe NEVER stop along the way to charge!
@@Trashed20659 it is amusing that you talk about the average household. That leaves millions of households that are not average without a viable vehicle. Do you know that about 5% of the Australian mainland is accessible with an ev. What do farmers do. What do caravan owners do. We are talking about mandating EVs when for millions of people there is no viable alternative. It is so incredibly selfish and myopic
@alanbyrne2297 Keep your Landcruiser for the moment. There will be solutions soon.
EV’s are great for WHOEVER WANTS THEM
Leave the rest of us alone!
Dearer cars, 0-60 under 5 seconds, a geeky iPad, the light arrays, some built flimsy - but the green reg plate makes it all ok.
(Don't worry, green plate not compulsory!)
@@MrAdopado I might put a green sticker on the reg plate of my diesel burner just to confuse folk lol
@@palemale2501 Ha ha but you won't be the first to do that!!
Price is what’s slowing ev sales. Nothing else. Price.
Your short sighted over CyberTruck comment, the wealthier buyer has once again enabled development of the new technology required to advance affordable BEVs. It has not delayed it, but advanced it. As did the original Roadster & Model S.
I agree! Very short sighted, they forget that Tesla still are selling the most BEVs and are selling more every year. The lower cost model is coming earlier than people think. Some think it's never coming, but it will! It's not because of the Cybertruck, like you say it could help bring out the lower cost model.
Think about it, Fully Charged and theEverythingElectric show praise Lucid, when they are doing the same thing that they say Tesla is doing!! Bringing out a very expensive model that little people are going to be able to buy, + they are losing a tone of money doing so! Lucid don't even have a Tesla Model Y and 3 competitor. Tesla are wayyy ahead of everyone else and Fullychargedshow and EverythingElectricShow are focusing on everyone else 'catching up' to Tesla, I'm starting to think is them saying 'actually caught up' every going to happen? 😅 The Cybertruck and Tesla for making it doesn't get anough praise from this channel, instead they just take digs! It's very upsetting and makes me angry and I love this channel.
£20B subsidies to Fossil Fuel production and cleanup, not to mention the increasing healthcare and climate change cost, time that was reversed. EVs are not the complete solution, but the only sector where we have a hope of hitting emissions targets,
That is a really good point. FF subsidies worldwide were actually 7 trillion USD in 2022 alone. They are typically now in the 6 trillion dollar range on an annual basis. This includes implicit and explicit subsidies. Imagine all the renewables and grid upgrades that could be built for that.
@@Knott1701 Have you ever looked at the subsidies of all the green energy and ask what the ROI is on that? A windmill breaks even by the time its useful life is over and then, practically none of it can be recycled. There is practically no capacity to recycle these EV batteries. You would think companies would jump at the chance to grow and have a monopoly in this space since EVs are getting more popular, but they do not exist. Why does China have fields and fields of EVs just left to rot? Seems environmentally unfriendly.
There is a lack of verified data on the impact of ICE.
1/What is the occupant injury rate of BEVs v ICE?
2/number of bushfires or grass fires started by ICE caused by impact or via hot exhausts.
3/Use social return accounting to examine impact of ICE fires which result in closed highways freeways and arterial roads. Look beyond the headlines, for instance a section of the Bryce Highway in Queensland was obliterated recently by ammonia nitrate tanker explosion triggered by a fire in a pickup.
4/ So many people in USA have been accidentally asphyxiated by portable generators (often following natural disasters) that US govt passed a bill to improve their safety. Use of V2L feature on EVs instead of petrol generators will save lives.
Plenty of data points to build a case. 4000 ice cars destroyed at Fort Meyer Airport due to a hot exhaust triggering a grass fire. Nine lives lost in South Australia bushfire which destroyed 90 homes.
Disruption due to a Freeway closure caused by an ice fire is not unusual. The consequences of such events are far reaching.
@@LGB-FJB oh dear, here come the tired fossil-fuel talking points. The CO2 eqivalent emissions per kilowatt hour of a solar panel or wind turbine, that after installation just sits there intermittently produce electricity, are _vastly_ less than continually shoveling fossil fuel into a thermal plant, and none of that fuel is recycled. 94+% of the actually toxic lead-acid batteries in gassers are recycled, why on Earth won't bigger more valuable lithium ion batteries in EVs is be recycled at similar rates? A dozen startups (Brunp, Li-cycle, Redwood Materials, Umicore, ...) are waiting for enough EV batteries to actually fail so they can ramp up operations.
ah, the pollution and climate change argument
balooney (as is not caused by humans in any significant way)
in reality:
Pollution in the UK
In 2023 in the UK, cars accounted for 52% of all domestic vehicle emissions.
The UK ranked 17th with 1.1% of global emissions
3% of Earth's pollution (not just the CO2) is done by Humans.
So, all the UK domestic vehicles pollute the Planet at a rate of 52% out of 1.1% out of 3%
52% out of 1.1% = 0.572
0.572% out of 3% = 0.01716
result is: the UK cars Pollution = 0.01716% out of the Global Pollution
Nice trying to enslave everybody's soul in the UK by forcing them to sell themselves to save 0.01716% Pollution
And even if all humans will suddenly die today, and all our pollution machineries will stop working today, the fact is that the planet will still be polluted 97% by other things (mostly by volcanoes), and still getting a climate change, as the Sun is got a cycle and it seems that we are coming out of an Ice Age and getting back into a Hot Age, the same as when Dinosaurs roamed the Earth.
I'm just waiting to see how much the price of electricity's going to increase when this all comes to pass...because it will...
And the cost of petrol hasn't increased at all over the years then?
It will double. As they need to replace the income from the 100% tax on petrol.
@@csuporj The government will recoup the fuel duty lost on petrol by replacing it with Road Tolls. They've said they won't do that for the time being, but it'll come....
I just bought a 9 month old fully loaded Mercedes EQB. It does 500km on a charge (400 if you have the a/c blasting which i do in this heat), it’s fabulous to drive, has 7 seats despite being mid sized and I absolutely love how it drives.
The new price was ¥11M. I paid ¥5.5M 9 months later. It’s mind blowing! Yes, once a week - 10 days or so I charge it up to 95%, which takes 45 minutes. I have a coffee and do my emails.
The Mercedes dealer said these weekly 45 minutes charge sessions is why people get rid of them.
This is how stressed people are today? It’s mindblowing.
Thank you for this interesting format! Every Video that goes in this direction can help fight missinformation!
The irony is, that this video itself uses fudged figures to displace the EV “misinformation “
£2 a mile. That is the cost of running my EV using public chargers. I have owned my Mégane e-Tech for a year now. The Ohme home charger stopped working just over a week ago and I have been forced to use public chargers and it has shocked me how bad the experience would be. I have spent double my monthly electricity bill just to charge my car for one week! More than double what I would have spent on a tank of petrol this time last year! BP Pulse are the only chargers in my area and they are ten times the price of home charging, but the most incredulous thing to me is that while there are supposedly two chargers, if one in plugged in the other one cannot be used. So the reality is that there is just one charger. Another bad thing is that when I initially did not use the app so they charged me £50 for £20 worth of electricity! Surely that is illegal? I would recommend an EV to anyone with a home charger, but if not do not touch it with a barge pole. Hours spent sat in the co-op car park and the insane cost for the privilege is not justifyable.
Shhh.... Don't say anything bad about EVs here or you'll be branded a lunatic, Trump supporter, dinosaur juice lover by the mob that runs this channel.
£2 a mile! I'd like to see the maths behind that.
I can't see how this works out either. If we take the 50 pounds charge and assume you get four miles per kWh in the Megane (this may be very good but it gives some nice round figures, it won't be far out). This would mean you have to be paying 8 pounds per kWh and you only put 6.25kW into the 'tank', around ten percent of the Meganes capacity. I think you are part of the misinformation.
2 quid a mile , stop it , lol
@@ellisrochlin2267 I know. I noticed the autocorrect when someone liked the post but hoped it would fall under the radar. My bad, but i was sat in a Co-Op car park at the time. It is 20p a mile.
The smoking thing is a good way of saying why people will not have ICE cars in the future, the government will tax the petrol/road tax to such a high value it will force people to go to unwanted EVs just like they did with smoking.
While Insurance companies will put EV insurance up to astronomical rates because of the small chance but high cost of EV fires and crashes. It takes a long time to get a crashed EV repaired so the cost of the higher car increases the cost to the insurer and the cost of collateral damage is much higher if in a fire.
This will make more people leave the roads, which is what Oxford wants; less productivity time, more time sitting on bad public transport, less freedom (15 minute cities)
There will be countries in the world that will not follow this crazy trend of destroying their own citizens.
And as we see today people leaving a bad country to move to a better one, so will be in the future people will get out of the dictatorialship of UK and move to freedom lands.
If you don't believe me, just go to the south beach of the UK and ask the people jumping out of a dingy why they came here.
I bet the answer would be like: "because our own government actively sought to destroy our lives"
A bit of Disraeli statistics going on in this video. If one looks at the distribution of EV sales in the uk you can see that it's the Fleet market that is accounting for a large chunk of sales. Private buyers are put off my steep depreciation and worries about battery technology development quickly making their purchase obsolete. BEV's are PART of the solution but they are not THE solution. I believe that haulage will have to stay with diesel and diesel hybrid for much much longer
Amen 🎉! Fully charged nonsense show😂!
Great video, thanks. 👍
Public charging is too expensive, not everyone has access to home charging. If you rely on public charging it will be just as expensive if not more that an ICE car to keep it running. They are also cost more to buy and depreciate faster and there is the issue of range anxiety and the fact that people do not trust governments.
They cost more to buy, do they? A new MG4 fully electric hatchback is £27k. A new petrol Ford Focus is £28k... And if you lease an EV, you don't need to worry about most of the depreciation.....
@@Brian-om2hh Of course you have to worry about depreciation. Your lease costs are paying for it, and the higher the depreciation the more you pay.
Throwing numbers when economics are at play is a strange way to validate something especially if you don't go into the details more granular, if we look at the UK, what percentage are being sold as business vs private, second hand mark is also so complex, the numbers on auto trader for second hand eV don't seem to make any sense vs the stock that should be coming into the market, also the discounts I have seen on various eve in the second hand market is also massive. I would love an eV but every person I speak that has one says its great as a second car, you still want an engine as your long trip solution. The biggest issue for me is not the fact that there is disinformation on both sides but the fact that government is lacking in delivering something that should work for more than one economic segment. Look at the markets that have done well, look at there charging network and incentives. Maybe there are lessons to be learned :) any how just my view and likely to change in the years to come
I own & drive 2 PHEVs. They actually pollute almost as much as pure ICW vehicles
Not if you plug them in!
Not if you plug them in!
High percentage of PHEVs never get plugged-in. I don't remember the exact study, but there were several all said the same thing. Anecdotally- I have some friends with PHEVs, and they never plug them in either...
A rep visits my workplace in a phev. He never plugs it in, just bought it for the tax break. If I had one (or a REX EV). I would plug it in every chance I get.
I do 3k miles a year and fill up about every other month. VED is £20 and insurance is cheap. Have looked at new cars recently but can’t justify the cost whether it’s ICE or BEV or something in between. Hoping to get at least another 10 years out of my 9 year old golf
I think that was the point made in this video ... there is no compulsion to do what is sensible for your own use case. Carry on!
That statistic that 93% of BEV drivers will never go back to gas is the key telling point. Point of what? The point where the transition to all electric shifts into high gear.
My prediction is that it will precede the dates where ICE are no longer sold and exceed the date where PHEV are phased out. In the end - sooner than the targets BEVs will sell massively more than ICE much as HiDef TVs did.
No not quite as rapid as that but only because of the higher cost of motor vehicle purchases. The better product always wins out. It will be no different here.
I agree with you in principle, it's just that right now the product isn't better for most people. I don't doubt that it will be in the probably not too distant future, but we're not there yet.
The view of all EV by 2030 or even 2035 was a non road emissions utopian dream. 40 percent will not convert due to personal taste and limited home charging costs due to their type of residence. Public chargers are expensive, so it doesn't look like that will change. I charge @ home mostly.
Peeps that want or have to drive a 400 or 500 mile round trip will want to do the trip without having to source a charging point somewhere ( adding extra hrs) to return home especially in driving rain or in freezing conditions.
EV will not be for many folks.
@@ellisrochlin2267 Yep. I wished that some EV proponents stop bashing those who would like to get in an EV, but, didn't choose to because of the high convenience of over planning their route, having to stop multiple times.....alot of the stopping can be rectified and make migrating to an EV easier if charging was super fast and having a higher range BEV like in the 500 mile range....but, these EV proponents that bashes folks usually say, "you don't eat/stretch/pee/sightsee?".....who wants to pee for over 20 minutes....you can pee and stretch and takes just takes less than 5 minutes, you can eat with one hand, or you can alternate drivers, why do I want to sight see at rest stops?.....those are my answers to why I prefer ICE on long drives....yet these EV proponents bash you because you don't want to stop
@@ellisrochlin2267 Your describing a static world. EV charging systems are increasing daily. The govt is incentivizing them. Many many EV long trips are already possible with minimal to no issues with finding chargers. But the reality is that as the vehicles are adopted in ever greater numbers the money to be made off charging will drive the increase in charging options. It's not rocket science and it's not a hamstrung scenario.
@@cre8tvedge I’m not convinced that’s a very meaningful statistic though. People do a lot of research before buying a car. So most people who buy an EV are people who already know it’s likely a good choice for them.
Switched to a Kia EV6 15 months ago. Love it. Had a multitude of hot hatches before it, From the likes of Ford and Subaru. Don't miss them even slightly.