Chapters - 0:00 - Introduction 1:50 - Honda and the City 8:55 - Missing trends 11:20 - Honda's engineering 12:07 - Diesel dilemma 13:35 - Brio platform was sub-par 14:45 - Why Honda engineers don't like SUVs 16:19 - Chasing volume 21:30 - Leadership churn 23:35 - India-specific models 24:25 - CKD and premium models 26:50 - Honda is more complex than Toyota 27:23 - Honda Elevate 32:07 - Exports is big business 34:43 - EVs and new PF2 platform 37:50 - Keeping the fanbase happy 40:45 - Shrinking portfolio 41:42 - India as a base for PF2
This podcast is a benchmark in the auto related podcast in India. These guys are not just sitting there spilling out bro science but are the OG auto journalists of the Indian car market. I love to hear them and know so much about the indian car market.
Hormazd has entire autocar editions in his head. Thanks for taking me down the memory lane. I felt like I opened the old autocar magazines from 2000s and read it now. Since 6th grade I used to buy autocar every month riding on my bike for almost 3kms. I went on to later become an automotive engineer, worked in Germany but the aspiration started from there I think.
Wow! I wish Honda were watching this discussion. Eight years back I chose Brio over Alto and I never regretted the decision. A gap of 50k between the two proved worth bet on Brio (base variant). The paint quality of Honda cars I've found best compared to the competition. The chassis of Brio stays planted and the drive inspires confidence. Despite all its cons: its shape, being bootless, dull dashboard, featureless, but the moment you push the pedal, you forget all the cons...mine has clocked 61k with no complaint at all, only a brake switch went caput which I replaced for 1k and a left door switch which I replaced for 600 rs in open market...the car is as it was the day it was brought eight years back...no lag in gears, no lag in steering which is a delight and light clutch adds to the charm...it's a driving pleasure....I have the 4th generation city in my garage as well...but Brio is the rabbit 🐇 of my garage which I don't want to part with...going to change its stock tires this fall...honda customers want to drive honda alone...it's difficult for us to migrate to Hyundai, Suzuki or Toyota's...we want to remain honda because our cars hold us tight ....what shall we do?
16:11 "Indian Honda owners love honda more sometimes than the company does because they haven't put their whole heart into it" Absolutely true💯 Honda owners still love their cars still the company isn't putting their 100% efforts on taking indian market seriously..
Sir it was 98 that I first met you at the autoexpo. The Autoindia stall was in the open & a Ford GT was on display. I shook hands with you & noticed you were such a humble & sweet person. Seeing you today in the podcast, you look the same as 26 years before...
Honda City always is the best Car in the segment which is best in safety and reliability and styling . My 2013 honda city has covered over 4.2 lakhs of kilometres and still no issues with the engine, the most reliable car in the segment
We have owned 3 Hondas in our household, a Honda City 1st Generation Facelift (2002 model), a Honda Civic (2006) and a Honda City Diesel (2014), they were highly desirable cars which were also very reliable and we had great service experience with them as well, on par with Maruti and Hyundai, but off late the company is on extreme downward trajectory, the latest City was boring inside out, quality levels are still at 2008 levels when the City used to sell for 8 Lakhs, there is no Turbo Petrol and NA engine from 20 years ago just doesn't cut it anymore, the Elevate is even more dull and boring. The company needs enthusiasm and great products, Hyundai was a joke in front of them 20 years ago and the new Verna we purchased recently makes the City look like a joke when it comes to Performance of the Turbo, excellent design and quality of the interiors and outstanding NVH of both the engine and otherwise the car as well. Honda can do way better than this.
We have had 4 Hondas, 2nd Gen Facelift i-DSI, Honda Jazz, Honda City 4th Gen i-DTEC and Honda AMAZE CVT. I agree the interiors are no longer up to date with current standards. New City and Elevate are pretty simplistic no-nonsense but it doesn’t feel justified much for premium. KIA and Hyundai are doing it for premium for better by delivering a Experience something which Honda doesn’t
The Honda City eHEV is such a good car with great performance in the city. Honda should've worked on reducing the cost by localising and implementing it en masse. Again a missed bus?
Honda and Nissan are very stubborn companies. They only make products that they like, not what the customers like and want. Few years ago when Honda was selling CRV, my uncle was deciding between CRV and Tucson. Back then CRV only came with CVT gearbox which he didn't like. So he went with Tucson with torque converter gearbox. Tucson back then came with Manual as well as automatic gearbox. Hyundai gives options to its customers. Just look at Creta. NA engine, Turbo engine, Diesel engine. On top of that you can choose Manual gearbox, DCT, Torque converter.
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As a proud owner of a 2010 Accord V6 3.5 & a past proud owner of the 2008 , 2011 , 2018 Honda City 1.5 (all 1.5 L) , I can only say I am deeply saddened by what's happened to Honda . My accord V6 is now 14 years old with 120,000 kms on the odometer and I swear it's still stunning & shits on shitbox 4 pot diesels or petrols from Mercedes or bmw. Honda should have never discontinued the 3.5. It's not just Honda , Japan on the whole has lost the plot since 2010-2012. Will the real JAPAN please stand up. You have more friends and fans in india than probably JAPAN itself. What the elevate needs is a 1.5 turbo or a 1.8 NA engine with a manual or 6 Spd TC transmission. The current transmission is a joke with its rubber bandy nonsense. Congratulations HONDA and the rest for going backwards .
Barring Suzuki, other Japanese brands (Mitsubishi, Nissan, Honda, Toyota) are not serious about India. All of them have a very rich product line abroad and they dont seem to be expanding their portfolio sufficiently in India. Toyota is simply piggybacking Maruti and rebadging its products. Such a shame!
@autocarindia1, I'm owner of Honda city fifth gen, and I purchased it only for rear seat comfort which is unmatched in SUV. But after driving for close to two years, on bumpy roads, I feel uncomfortable and can't drive it fearlessly. The tyres are so thin that while driving on bumpy road, I got both right side tyers punctured at same time. City is only for plush roads and not for Indian roads. Also the cabin makes lot of rattling noise inside and not much to say about NVH levels which are on higher side. Appreciate if we can have similar podcast on Tata .
I have the same experience. The fact is we are new couple and wanted a reliable car without much knowledge in cars and we went for city as my elder brother suggested it but now i feel we made a mistake. Its a good car but its boring and the suspension is bad and cabin noise is too much. But somehow we are stuck with it now😢
I have a 3rd Gen City at home, test drove the Elevate CVT and hated it. No a single decibel reduced in road and cabin noise, insulation has become poorer in new Honda's
I think they can comeback in the game by launching a 1] Sub4m SUV,New Gen Amaze with 1.0 Turbo engine and features that Indians want. 2] Adding hybrid engine,features to the Elevate making it compatible in the segment 3] The new gen City with increased Ground Clearance,multiple engine options 4] 7 seater MUV with 1.5 ivtec engine 5] The last..By bringing Civic,CRV by CBU/CKD route making the portfolio look big so that if a customer enters the showroom won't leave it without booking any car..
Its a simple point honda has to bring more engines and more options for indian customers , but to get volumes they need their diesel engine back , because currently the manufacturers without diesel are the only ones stuggling because above 9-10 lakhs cars diesel still commands 45-50% of the sales.
What has happened to japanese brands in India? Honda had brio, brv, crv, wrv, civic, city... Had a wide variety for everyones need... Plus the reliability that japanese brands offer was was top notch... Now it just has city, amaze and elevate... Toyota: had a variety of liva, etios, qualis, innova, fortuner. Superb build quality, unmatched reliability and brilliant service network... Now it has only three original cars: innova, fortuner and camry... Rest it is just another suzuki... Maruti Suzuki: Had cars with brilliant build quality and fun to drive element: S cross, Kizashi, grand vitara, gypsy.... Now its build quality is questionable, plus the 3 cylinder introduced in the new swift is the dead end... Nissan: don't even get me started🙃 No wonder people are shifting to koreans and germans for reliability and fun to drive element... Recently one of my relatives sold their Civic... (It was a gem ffs❤) and bought a Slavia. If this happens at this rate, then we might not see japanese brands in India anymore😕
Honda hybrids were one of the 1st. However, my friend who’s driving enthusiast informed me that Maruti is coming with very high efficiency SUV with hybrid engine. I replied him that the technology is from Toyota and secondly, Honda is having way back with City hybrid. This is what the publicity Maruti has. Elevate would have been launched with Hybrid tech. Very good discussion. Thanks 👍
We have owned honda cars since 2000s, We still have honda jazz, honda CRV, hond acc😊rd V6 and 2 amaze’s. Still a big fan and eagerly awaiting new launches.
Eagerly Waiting for this epiode! Wanted to buy Honda City, was very sus about Honda also leaving India. Thanks for this podcast. Please bring Raman Sir to this podcast.
Honda City with tyre upsize and change to Michelin feels like a car from a segment above. Don't buy Virtus Slavia bullshit cars. Get the City and upgrade the tyres.
Was a 15 year old kid when I read the first 1999 sep release of autocar India … Mr. Sorabjee you arnt alone in feeling “old”… those were the days where one would read through the magazine in a days time , gawk at the pics for the next ten days & anxiously await the next issue for the next 20 days 😃
I grew up in the 90s fantasizing about the City. I still vividly remember when they launched the refreshed City in 2000 with VTEC and I read all articles about it in the Autocar magazines. Once a fanboy always a Honda fanboy and currently have an FL5 CTR.
Just look at the trivial features missing from Elevate that is hampering its sales: 1. Bland interiors - Honda can easily make the interiors look as premium like Creta/Seltos. This is a design issue. 2. Missing obvious features like ventilated seats, 360 cameras, electrically adjustable seats, etc. All these things don't require massive engineering investments. In fact VW/Skoda has later added several such features in their cars like electrical seats, subwoofer, etc. Also, I don't think that lack of turbo engines are a huge factor as majority of people buy NA engines (for Creta/Seltos). But it does impact brand image.
Issue with Honda is that they try and if model don’t do well they will discontinue product and not interest in delivering new models they need to learn from Tata. At one time even good car like Hexa no one was buying it was not because car was bad it was Tatas brand issues. If Honda is not committed to market how customer will commit to brand
I loved this episode. Owner of a 3rd /3.5 gen Honda City, and love the vehicle. Still drives beautifully after all these years. Thank you, Hormazd for this episode, it was a pleasure listening to it. Brought back motoring memories on my Honda!
It's not a deep drive.... It's a deep dive discussion...... They gave us history, engineering, thought process, market interaction and the future of Honda.... Kudos to the entire team...
Honda owner from last 11 years Have bought 4 Honda’s and never missed a beat. Engines are a masterpiece and love the power and high revving nature. I think elevate is a good product and people should defiantly show their interest and try it. Good podcast👍
Can you make pod cast on fuel’s⛽️ like HP, BP & Shell what’s different with this brands & why Shell fuels are expensive?and is it worth it to spend extra? What’s the content in fuel that makes it special?
As a owner of elevate since 6 months there are few things which makes daily driving not easy - 1. Lack of under tigh support in the front seats and lack of foot area this cause pain in the tigh and ankle after long drive 2. please dont take the dual tone as during hot summer - the area around the sun roof area gets super hot in summer even with the sun roof cover you will feel the heat on top of your head while driving and after few hrs both the front passengers will feel the heat and you will be exhuasted after driving. I am not able to find the solution to this and i am disappointed with the lack of engineering skills being executed in this car
Recently, I have gone through elevate profile, and taken test drive, my review is as follows: 1. Driving pleasure was unmatched. 2. Cabin is superb However, it missed these main features: cooled glove box, and cruse control in Elevate V model.
i own honda brio....1.65 lakh km done and till date i havent changed the clutch yet and its now going to be over 13 years!!!! i am so much in love wid honda that i am not buying any seltos or creta!!! i am waiting for honda city hatchback hrv god knows when honda will bring it in india
We have a 2015 Honda City and in absolute love with the car. It's been 9 years and we are thinking of a new car only because of the 15 year re- registration hassle. We may keep it for few more years and if Honda brings a compact suv by then, we are going to take it as their service and the vehicles are top notch. Never in the past 9 years we had a service related issue. It's the case in multiple states not just from where we bought the car from
I still fondly remember the old Autocar India magazines- the first test drive of Mitsubishi Lancer you did in 1999 is still fresh in my mind somehow- ( probably it was autoindia then ) where it was test driven somewhere in Scandinavia… the way the content was articulated was unprecedented and way ahead of its times.. I am a City owner and totally agree with the statement “India Honda car owners love their Hondas more than the company does”.
lot of people had misconceptions about Honda and your podcast just cleared the air, on the other hand i would like to know the apprehension of Honda not bringing turbo petrol in India is it because of their oil dilution problem that's stopping them? or is it that financially not viable ?
Wow… Amazing insight into the Honda journey.. Sheer nostalgia… Being an Honda car owner myself in the past, it truly truly saddens to see this state of theirs in India. Come on Honda give us more…
What a podcast. Loved it. Honda has to blame themselves for their own debacles in India. We all love Honda but Honda does not love India & that's the reason why except City they are offering Stepmotherly treatments to other models. JAZZ was a very good Car but they did not offer what customers wanted or the competition was offering. Same is the case with ELEVATE, a half hearted approach which is easily felt when compared to City - Poor Cabin insulations, No Ventilated Seats, No TPM, No engine Options,..... etc. Again Stepmotherly treatment to Elevate as its not offered with the same feature list as City. Than Why expect A Customer to buy ELEVATE against City. Unless Honda India are in sync with times & competitions their sales nos. will suffer & always keep on declining. Have very high Respect for their Slogan *Man Maximum Machine Minimum.* And it does make sense in Cabinspace comfort & Difference is felt when you compare City with Verna, Slavia-Virtus. They need to improve in Suspensions, Ground Clearance & Tyre size of City to be in competition for a long time.
Every Saturday I watch this discussion video.... It's like a must watch for me ❤ Many other youtube channels like motorinc copied this trend and make no sense talks which doesn't help anyone.
Got my first Honda -- a city -- in 2009 and that car converted me into a Honda Fanboy. When I was in the market for a new compact SUV, everybody advised me to get a Creta or a Seltos BUT I bought an Elevate. It's been one month and I am in love with the car. So happy with my decision
Absolutely fantastic piece of content! Had my attention throughout the episode. Could be because I’m a Honda loyalist like many others. The breakdown of the different generations and analysis was most intriguing.
6 years ago replaced my aging octavia tdi with 3rd gen second hand city, now in dillema what to replace it with because , what’s available isn’t appealing to drive , and whats appealing has inflated price tag.
driving accord since 2015 , 200,000km crossed . still drives like a Tesla . so comfortable and absolutely no problem . may be because Honda gives so much importance to quality than the price itself .
Our Local Honda straight up denied selling the elevate to us for the ex showroom price on the day of booking the car an insisted the we'd be charged according to the ex-showroom price on the day of delivery. It is a similar case with others as well?
I had a Honda City. And I was very happy with the car. And i couldn't think of anything else other than Honda Cars. And i kept waiting for a suv from Honda. I was waiting for HRV but they brought brv and I was disappointed. So I had to move to Tata Harrier
The insights, details about the platform etc are amazing. This is so different from the wanna be RUclipsrs reviewing cars. This was a brilliant idea. Love this format. Can you do something similar on Force motors? The shares have sky rocketed, want to know their export game and Gurkha fame. I own a Gurkha myself.
I purchased Elevate cvt top model on 01-Jan-2024 n have driven 15k till now 😊. This is my 1st Honda car n I love this vehicle. Maybe by year end I should cross 20k km driving.
I am a Honda Jazz CVT owner. I just swear by and love my car. A very beautiful discussion. My two cents are that you should have discussed why Honda discontinued their Civic(you discissed that very substantially... should have been discussed in greater details)?What was the big idea. It was such a beast of a car... and also why Honda never introduced the Japanese Kei cars(those two seater convertibles). Real bummer
I was in the market for a SUV and considered Elevate too, but was disappointed by the lack of engine choice and the NVH. Finally I i settled for top spec Creta turbo petrol. I have not driven much but an quite happy with my choice.
Honda is by far the best 2wheeler & 4wheeler manufacturer out there in the market. Reliable, refined engine, low maintenance cost... Japanese engineering at its very best!
Excellent...I have had the Brio, a great fun car, even if it had simple interiors...now with a WRV Diesel and City CVT...sturdy, reliable and fun to drive also....hope they sort out their priorities..
I have driven Honda for over 3 years and the only thing I miss are the features. The management seems to be disconnected from the ground level expectations from the customers. Elevate is a good option but it does misses on key features, which if offered, customers will pay for it. Elevate must be launched in hybrid as well.
Was so looking forward for this podcast. As a first time Honda (elevate) owner, this podcast just settled any remaining doubts of my choice regarding the company. Reliability, great engineering and fun just describes the value proposition of the company. As said in the podcast Honda consumers (emotion) market the products more than the company itself :).
I bought the 2nd Gen Amaze on the 1st weekend of it's launch... Waiting eagerly how the 3rd Gen Amaze will look and buy... Sad to know the 3 month Delay...
Just like the Autocar India magazine, this podcast series is really very interesting and informative. A humble request.. Could you please consider making podcasts on iconic Indian cars.
Elevate 2025, should be with 1. TC transmission (maybe use Aisin-sourced torque converters) option along with existing Manual and CVT. The TC will help in reducing the whine from engine, which is typical of CVT as well as also make it more fun to drive due to faster response than CVT (closer to manual) 2. Petrol Turbo Engine option 3. Improve the NVH and the road noise. Honda does have issue with road noise even in their USA models (Civic, Accord, CRV). I have driven both Honda and Toyota in USA and found Toyota controls the road nice really well.
They should bring turbo petrols. The city comes with an 2cyl turbo petrol in Thailand. If they put the same engine in amaze and city as an option it would compete against 1tr vws. Their diesel was noisy but the mileage was great if they can meet the emission standards. And the 1.5 city really need to up it's game to compete with vw and hyundai
@Autocar India : I too, have two Hondas currently. Also had the City Diesel as well.. Really enjoyable, stable and heavy vehicles. But I feel the engine selection for Jazz is very poor. The 1.2L NA engine is not good enough to pull the car. I am a fan of Honda. Also, could you do a video on Isuzu and their plans for India? Is it a good choice to buy the VCross, which is currently cheaper than the more expensive Hilux?
I drive a Honda CRV in United states. It's a great car. Even in states, Honda doesn't tops the aesthetics and features chart yet with decent features and great reliability it's popular especially among the family people. India is on cusp or shifting to more luxury demands. Honda should offer more option including something like CRV.
Brought Honda City 2024 v-mt this summer . Stretched my budget as I was eyeing for it for more than 4 years . And I was certain , if am going for new car , it is going to be city. And I wanted to be a clever Bharatiya 🇮🇳 who hate raised hatch called SUV. It was about comfort and Legacy (as said in the pod cast) It’s a great pod cast Ppl love ❤️ Honda More than the company itself 🎉
Proud owner of 2 Hondas: 2023 Civic Type R, and 2002 CR-V (both in the US). I really wish Honda was more aggressive when it came to the Indian market, especially now when the market is moving upwards. More localisation would definitely help bring global products like the CR-V, Civic, and Accord back to India. These products are up there with Toyota when it comes to reliability while being fun to drive. As you rightly said, Honda should avoid the red ocean, which is going against Suzuki. 10+ lakh segment is where Honda should bet its money on, with the Elevate and the City serving as the bread winners. The Amaze wouldn't sustain sales based on India's love for SUVs, and unless Honda manages to cut costs where the customer cant see, but then that wouldn't be a true Honda then, would it?
Very good content. If possible could you a similar podcast on Toyota like Honda. Why do they ditch previous generations when they came out with a new one. For Eg qualis was popular but they phased it out for Innova. Similarly Innova was popular but they phase out for crysta. For the first time they are now having both Crysta and hycross. Also their sedan strategy for India and global portfolio. New efficient and compaq 1.5 engine and when can it come in India. And lastly their products are popular in the tourist segment, it is good or bad for the brand in the long term. Thanks
Being a first timw car buyer, i couldnt think of buying any cars other than Honda considering the reliability and low maintenance. Hope they would bring more products just like before!!
Chapters -
0:00 - Introduction
1:50 - Honda and the City
8:55 - Missing trends
11:20 - Honda's engineering
12:07 - Diesel dilemma
13:35 - Brio platform was sub-par
14:45 - Why Honda engineers don't like SUVs
16:19 - Chasing volume
21:30 - Leadership churn
23:35 - India-specific models
24:25 - CKD and premium models
26:50 - Honda is more complex than Toyota
27:23 - Honda Elevate
32:07 - Exports is big business
34:43 - EVs and new PF2 platform
37:50 - Keeping the fanbase happy
40:45 - Shrinking portfolio
41:42 - India as a base for PF2
This podcast is a benchmark in the auto related podcast in India. These guys are not just sitting there spilling out bro science but are the OG auto journalists of the Indian car market. I love to hear them and know so much about the indian car market.
True
Thank you very much 🙏 Glad you enjoyed it 😊
Vtec in NA engines is Autocar in auto channles
Indian Honda customers love Honda more than the company itself does. A truer statement has never been spoken. - A loyal Honda customer
Hormazd has entire autocar editions in his head. Thanks for taking me down the memory lane. I felt like I opened the old autocar magazines from 2000s and read it now.
Since 6th grade I used to buy autocar every month riding on my bike for almost 3kms. I went on to later become an automotive engineer, worked in Germany but the aspiration started from there I think.
Woah!
Wow! I wish Honda were watching this discussion. Eight years back I chose Brio over Alto and I never regretted the decision. A gap of 50k between the two proved worth bet on Brio (base variant). The paint quality of Honda cars I've found best compared to the competition. The chassis of Brio stays planted and the drive inspires confidence. Despite all its cons: its shape, being bootless, dull dashboard, featureless, but the moment you push the pedal, you forget all the cons...mine has clocked 61k with no complaint at all, only a brake switch went caput which I replaced for 1k and a left door switch which I replaced for 600 rs in open market...the car is as it was the day it was brought eight years back...no lag in gears, no lag in steering which is a delight and light clutch adds to the charm...it's a driving pleasure....I have the 4th generation city in my garage as well...but Brio is the rabbit 🐇 of my garage which I don't want to part with...going to change its stock tires this fall...honda customers want to drive honda alone...it's difficult for us to migrate to Hyundai, Suzuki or Toyota's...we want to remain honda because our cars hold us tight ....what shall we do?
16:11 "Indian Honda owners love honda more sometimes than the company does because they haven't put their whole heart into it" Absolutely true💯
Honda owners still love their cars still the company isn't putting their 100% efforts on taking indian market seriously..
Sir it was 98 that I first met you at the autoexpo. The Autoindia stall was in the open & a Ford GT was on display. I shook hands with you & noticed you were such a humble & sweet person. Seeing you today in the podcast, you look the same as 26 years before...
Happy to reconnect after a quarter century!
That's because usually Parsees r very kind and sweet people.....eg. ....Ratan Tata....also the same...and very humble 🙏🙏🙏😊
So true. That customer loves Honda more than the company itself. I've been owning Honda cars past 15yrs. It's sad seeing the Honda portfolio slunk.
Honda City always is the best Car in the segment which is best in safety and reliability and styling . My 2013 honda city has covered over 4.2 lakhs of kilometres and still no issues with the engine, the most reliable car in the segment
One thing we missed to discuss is about the underrated and most practical hatchback, the 2 generations of Honda Jazz we got here in India
We have owned 3 Hondas in our household, a Honda City 1st Generation Facelift (2002 model), a Honda Civic (2006) and a Honda City Diesel (2014), they were highly desirable cars which were also very reliable and we had great service experience with them as well, on par with Maruti and Hyundai, but off late the company is on extreme downward trajectory, the latest City was boring inside out, quality levels are still at 2008 levels when the City used to sell for 8 Lakhs, there is no Turbo Petrol and NA engine from 20 years ago just doesn't cut it anymore, the Elevate is even more dull and boring. The company needs enthusiasm and great products, Hyundai was a joke in front of them 20 years ago and the new Verna we purchased recently makes the City look like a joke when it comes to Performance of the Turbo, excellent design and quality of the interiors and outstanding NVH of both the engine and otherwise the car as well. Honda can do way better than this.
True it's going down but to some extent along with Honda not doing what needs to be done it's also the people choosing features over great engineering
We have had 4 Hondas, 2nd Gen Facelift i-DSI, Honda Jazz, Honda City 4th Gen i-DTEC and Honda AMAZE CVT. I agree the interiors are no longer up to date with current standards. New City and Elevate are pretty simplistic no-nonsense but it doesn’t feel justified much for premium. KIA and Hyundai are doing it for premium for better by delivering a Experience something which Honda doesn’t
The Honda City eHEV is such a good car with great performance in the city. Honda should've worked on reducing the cost by localising and implementing it en masse. Again a missed bus?
Honda and Nissan are very stubborn companies. They only make products that they like, not what the customers like and want. Few years ago when Honda was selling CRV, my uncle was deciding between CRV and Tucson. Back then CRV only came with CVT gearbox which he didn't like. So he went with Tucson with torque converter gearbox. Tucson back then came with Manual as well as automatic gearbox.
Hyundai gives options to its customers. Just look at Creta. NA engine, Turbo engine, Diesel engine. On top of that you can choose Manual gearbox, DCT, Torque converter.
totally agree. Not just Honda , Japan itself is on the downswing.
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As a proud owner of a 2010 Accord V6 3.5 & a past proud owner of the 2008 , 2011 , 2018 Honda City 1.5 (all 1.5 L) , I can only say I am deeply saddened by what's happened to Honda . My accord V6 is now 14 years old with 120,000 kms on the odometer and I swear it's still stunning & shits on shitbox 4 pot diesels or petrols from Mercedes or bmw. Honda should have never discontinued the 3.5. It's not just Honda , Japan on the whole has lost the plot since 2010-2012. Will the real JAPAN please stand up. You have more friends and fans in india than probably JAPAN itself. What the elevate needs is a 1.5 turbo or a 1.8 NA engine with a manual or 6 Spd TC transmission. The current transmission is a joke with its rubber bandy nonsense. Congratulations HONDA and the rest for going backwards .
Spoke from the heart
Barring Suzuki, other Japanese brands (Mitsubishi, Nissan, Honda, Toyota) are not serious about India. All of them have a very rich product line abroad and they dont seem to be expanding their portfolio sufficiently in India. Toyota is simply piggybacking Maruti and rebadging its products. Such a shame!
Agreed
U r right.....but the last line is not true..... actually Toyota is smart....saving on extra investment.
@autocarindia1, I'm owner of Honda city fifth gen, and I purchased it only for rear seat comfort which is unmatched in SUV. But after driving for close to two years, on bumpy roads, I feel uncomfortable and can't drive it fearlessly. The tyres are so thin that while driving on bumpy road, I got both right side tyers punctured at same time. City is only for plush roads and not for Indian roads. Also the cabin makes lot of rattling noise inside and not much to say about NVH levels which are on higher side.
Appreciate if we can have similar podcast on Tata
.
I have the same experience. The fact is we are new couple and wanted a reliable car without much knowledge in cars and we went for city as my elder brother suggested it but now i feel we made a mistake. Its a good car but its boring and the suspension is bad and cabin noise is too much. But somehow we are stuck with it now😢
I have a 3rd Gen City at home, test drove the Elevate CVT and hated it. No a single decibel reduced in road and cabin noise, insulation has become poorer in new Honda's
Nailed it..Elevate isn't the replacement for the city. More of downgrade
I put my trust in “Honda”, went ahead and bought an Elevate.😊. Hope my decision proves to be right.
I think they can comeback in the game by launching a
1] Sub4m SUV,New Gen Amaze with 1.0 Turbo engine and features that Indians want.
2] Adding hybrid engine,features to the Elevate making it compatible in the segment
3] The new gen City with increased Ground Clearance,multiple engine options
4] 7 seater MUV with 1.5 ivtec engine
5] The last..By bringing Civic,CRV by CBU/CKD route making the portfolio look big so that if a customer enters the showroom won't leave it without booking any car..
Initial 2 points are soulless
Pls send this to their ceo 😊👍
Why would they want to? Total India addressable car market - $30B
Honda’s US current mkt - $130B
Its a simple point honda has to bring more engines and more options for indian customers , but to get volumes they need their diesel engine back , because currently the manufacturers without diesel are the only ones stuggling because above 9-10 lakhs cars diesel still commands 45-50% of the sales.
Real Honda bloods👏🏽👏🏽
What has happened to japanese brands in India? Honda had brio, brv, crv, wrv, civic, city... Had a wide variety for everyones need... Plus the reliability that japanese brands offer was was top notch... Now it just has city, amaze and elevate...
Toyota: had a variety of liva, etios, qualis, innova, fortuner. Superb build quality, unmatched reliability and brilliant service network... Now it has only three original cars: innova, fortuner and camry... Rest it is just another suzuki...
Maruti Suzuki: Had cars with brilliant build quality and fun to drive element: S cross, Kizashi, grand vitara, gypsy.... Now its build quality is questionable, plus the 3 cylinder introduced in the new swift is the dead end...
Nissan: don't even get me started🙃
No wonder people are shifting to koreans and germans for reliability and fun to drive element...
Recently one of my relatives sold their Civic... (It was a gem ffs❤) and bought a Slavia.
If this happens at this rate, then we might not see japanese brands in India anymore😕
Honda hybrids were one of the 1st. However, my friend who’s driving enthusiast informed me that Maruti is coming with very high efficiency SUV with hybrid engine.
I replied him that the technology is from Toyota and secondly, Honda is having way back with City hybrid.
This is what the publicity Maruti has.
Elevate would have been launched with Hybrid tech.
Very good discussion. Thanks 👍
Almost all Parsi Bawaji's favorite car is a Honda , we Bawa's will love Honda being once again on Top. Great Talk once again by Autocar India.
😂
We have owned honda cars since 2000s,
We still have honda jazz, honda CRV, hond acc😊rd V6 and 2 amaze’s. Still a big fan and eagerly awaiting new launches.
Eagerly Waiting for this epiode! Wanted to buy Honda City, was very sus about Honda also leaving India. Thanks for this podcast. Please bring Raman Sir to this podcast.
Honda is not leaving India anytime soo. At least they're here to stay for 5-6 years.
Honda City with tyre upsize and change to Michelin feels like a car from a segment above. Don't buy Virtus Slavia bullshit cars. Get the City and upgrade the tyres.
Hi, I drive a Civic (lovely car)-bought in 2019. How long should I hold on to it? I love Honda as a brand.... Is an eHEV a good alternative?
Nice choice. Never let it go.
Was a 15 year old kid when I read the first 1999 sep release of autocar India … Mr. Sorabjee you arnt alone in feeling “old”… those were the days where one would read through the magazine in a days time , gawk at the pics for the next ten days & anxiously await the next issue for the next 20 days 😃
Complete analysis of the brand Honda , wish Honda takes the feedback and act fast
Should I go for Elevate or not? Confused
I grew up in the 90s fantasizing about the City. I still vividly remember when they launched the refreshed City in 2000 with VTEC and I read all articles about it in the Autocar magazines. Once a fanboy always a Honda fanboy and currently have an FL5 CTR.
Just look at the trivial features missing from Elevate that is hampering its sales:
1. Bland interiors - Honda can easily make the interiors look as premium like Creta/Seltos. This is a design issue.
2. Missing obvious features like ventilated seats, 360 cameras, electrically adjustable seats, etc.
All these things don't require massive engineering investments. In fact VW/Skoda has later added several such features in their cars like electrical seats, subwoofer, etc. Also, I don't think that lack of turbo engines are a huge factor as majority of people buy NA engines (for Creta/Seltos). But it does impact brand image.
Sir one question- why old honda model spare parts not available in the market????
Love watching this video again and again as honda car owner from last 11 years.Trying to upgrade from Amaze S Manual to Honda city CVT V version.
These two guys are essentialy indian auto historians at this point. The only two we know ot so far. Probably the older gentleman is the og.
Thank you for listening to our request and giving us insights about Honda's journey and future in India ❤
Issue with Honda is that they try and if model don’t do well they will discontinue product and not interest in delivering new models they need to learn from Tata. At one time even good car like Hexa no one was buying it was not because car was bad it was Tatas brand issues. If Honda is not committed to market how customer will commit to brand
I loved this episode. Owner of a 3rd /3.5 gen Honda City, and love the vehicle. Still drives beautifully after all these years. Thank you, Hormazd for this episode, it was a pleasure listening to it. Brought back motoring memories on my Honda!
It's not a deep drive.... It's a deep dive discussion...... They gave us history, engineering, thought process, market interaction and the future of Honda.... Kudos to the entire team...
Honda owner from last 11 years
Have bought 4 Honda’s and never missed a beat. Engines are a masterpiece and love the power and high revving nature. I think elevate is a good product and people should defiantly show their interest and try it.
Good podcast👍
Can you make pod cast on fuel’s⛽️ like HP, BP & Shell what’s different with this brands & why Shell fuels are expensive?and is it worth it to spend extra? What’s the content in fuel that makes it special?
As a owner of elevate since 6 months there are few things which makes daily driving not easy - 1. Lack of under tigh support in the front seats and lack of foot area this cause pain in the tigh and ankle after long drive 2. please dont take the dual tone as during hot summer - the area around the sun roof area gets super hot in summer even with the sun roof cover you will feel the heat on top of your head while driving and after few hrs both the front passengers will feel the heat and you will be exhuasted after driving. I am not able to find the solution to this and i am disappointed with the lack of engineering skills being executed in this car
Recently, I have gone through elevate profile, and taken test drive, my review is as follows:
1. Driving pleasure was unmatched.
2. Cabin is superb
However, it missed these main features: cooled glove box, and cruse control in Elevate V model.
Honda india is the highly rated management case study on mismanagement. All mba classes have them, loved by professors. I meant the case study
Great stuff Hormazd ji, the details shared in this video makes the podcast and time spent watching them worth it. Such great insights. Love this.
i own honda brio....1.65 lakh km done and till date i havent changed the clutch yet and its now going to be over 13 years!!!! i am so much in love wid honda that i am not buying any seltos or creta!!! i am waiting for honda city hatchback hrv god knows when honda will bring it in india
We have a 2015 Honda City and in absolute love with the car. It's been 9 years and we are thinking of a new car only because of the 15 year re- registration hassle. We may keep it for few more years and if Honda brings a compact suv by then, we are going to take it as their service and the vehicles are top notch. Never in the past 9 years we had a service related issue. It's the case in multiple states not just from where we bought the car from
It is very different & trustable when it comes from people who has been there in field since decades! Thank you for the podcast!
I have my 2007 Honda Civic, in year 2024 I dont know what to do with it.
Min or zero maint, keeps running, no issues.
This is one podcast where I don't find anything missing. There is no replacement for experience.
Brilliant.
I still fondly remember the old Autocar India magazines- the first test drive of Mitsubishi Lancer you did in 1999 is still fresh in my mind somehow- ( probably it was autoindia then ) where it was test driven somewhere in Scandinavia… the way the content was articulated was unprecedented and way ahead of its times..
I am a City owner and totally agree with the statement “India Honda car owners love their Hondas more than the company does”.
Amidst all the noise, this podcast is all you want as an auto lover. Hormadz and Ketan are absolute intelligence throughout! Brilliant!
lot of people had misconceptions about Honda and your podcast just cleared the air, on the other hand i would like to know the apprehension of Honda not bringing turbo petrol in India is it because of their oil dilution problem that's stopping them? or is it that financially not viable ?
Can't wait for Saturday to come!
Wow… Amazing insight into the Honda journey.. Sheer nostalgia… Being an Honda car owner myself in the past, it truly truly saddens to see this state of theirs in India. Come on Honda give us more…
The gold standard of auto journalism.
What a podcast. Loved it.
Honda has to blame themselves for their own debacles in India.
We all love Honda but Honda does not love India & that's the reason why except City they are offering Stepmotherly treatments to other models.
JAZZ was a very good Car but they did not offer what customers wanted or the competition was offering.
Same is the case with ELEVATE, a half hearted approach which is easily felt when compared to City - Poor Cabin insulations, No Ventilated Seats, No TPM, No engine Options,..... etc.
Again Stepmotherly treatment to Elevate as its not offered with the same feature list as City.
Than Why expect A Customer to buy ELEVATE against City.
Unless Honda India are in sync with times & competitions their sales nos. will suffer & always keep on declining.
Have very high Respect for their Slogan *Man Maximum Machine Minimum.*
And it does make sense in Cabinspace comfort & Difference is felt when you compare City with Verna, Slavia-Virtus. They need to improve in Suspensions, Ground Clearance & Tyre size of City to be in competition for a long time.
Every Saturday I watch this discussion video.... It's like a must watch for me ❤
Many other youtube channels like motorinc copied this trend and make no sense talks which doesn't help anyone.
I had missed to read Autocar magazine from 3-4 years, but now I’m adjusted to this podcasts ♥️
Got my first Honda -- a city -- in 2009 and that car converted me into a Honda Fanboy. When I was in the market for a new compact SUV, everybody advised me to get a Creta or a Seltos BUT I bought an Elevate. It's been one month and I am in love with the car. So happy with my decision
Absolutely fantastic piece of content!
Had my attention throughout the episode. Could be because I’m a Honda loyalist like many others. The breakdown of the different generations and analysis was most intriguing.
I know this is really not an interesting topic for all, but a podcast about the Tata nano and Tata's evolution would be great!
6 years ago replaced my aging octavia tdi with 3rd gen second hand city, now in dillema what to replace it with because , what’s available isn’t appealing to drive , and whats appealing has inflated price tag.
driving accord since 2015 , 200,000km crossed . still drives like a Tesla . so comfortable and absolutely no problem . may be because Honda gives so much importance to quality than the price itself .
What about the Honda Odyssey? Why is this not being tried in India? Seems like it would be a slam dunk.
Our Local Honda straight up denied selling the elevate to us for the ex showroom price on the day of booking the car an insisted the we'd be charged according to the ex-showroom price on the day of delivery. It is a similar case with others as well?
I had a Honda City. And I was very happy with the car. And i couldn't think of anything else other than Honda Cars. And i kept waiting for a suv from Honda. I was waiting for HRV but they brought brv and I was disappointed. So I had to move to Tata Harrier
If Honda can bring a car similar to Harrier on a hybrid platform, not an ev, i will definitely consider it when I decide to upgrade my harrier.
The insights, details about the platform etc are amazing. This is so different from the wanna be RUclipsrs reviewing cars. This was a brilliant idea. Love this format.
Can you do something similar on Force motors? The shares have sky rocketed, want to know their export game and Gurkha fame. I own a Gurkha myself.
I purchased Elevate cvt top model on 01-Jan-2024 n have driven 15k till now 😊. This is my 1st Honda car n I love this vehicle. Maybe by year end I should cross 20k km driving.
I am a Honda Jazz CVT owner. I just swear by and love my car. A very beautiful discussion. My two cents are that you should have discussed why Honda discontinued their Civic(you discissed that very substantially... should have been discussed in greater details)?What was the big idea. It was such a beast of a car... and also why Honda never introduced the Japanese Kei cars(those two seater convertibles). Real bummer
I was in the market for a SUV and considered Elevate too, but was disappointed by the lack of engine choice and the NVH. Finally I i settled for top spec Creta turbo petrol. I have not driven much but an quite happy with my choice.
Honda is by far the best 2wheeler & 4wheeler manufacturer out there in the market. Reliable, refined engine, low maintenance cost...
Japanese engineering at its very best!
Didn’t expect the public demand so soon 👍🏼👍🏼 I enjoy the conversation
Excellent...I have had the Brio, a great fun car, even if it had simple interiors...now with a WRV Diesel and City CVT...sturdy, reliable and fun to drive also....hope they sort out their priorities..
As always, nice series and valuable. Hormaz speaks more but not boring anyways ..😊. Good job.
I have driven Honda for over 3 years and the only thing I miss are the features. The management seems to be disconnected from the ground level expectations from the customers. Elevate is a good option but it does misses on key features, which if offered, customers will pay for it. Elevate must be launched in hybrid as well.
Was so looking forward for this podcast. As a first time Honda (elevate) owner, this podcast just settled any remaining doubts of my choice regarding the company. Reliability, great engineering and fun just describes the value proposition of the company. As said in the podcast Honda consumers (emotion) market the products more than the company itself :).
I bought the 2nd Gen Amaze on the 1st weekend of it's launch... Waiting eagerly how the 3rd Gen Amaze will look and buy... Sad to know the 3 month Delay...
I remember very well the add of the facelifted 1st gen city which had slogan " A Gem of a Car a Jewel of an Engine "
Please make a video on best automatic cars under 10L, 15L, 20L.
I know the answer would be know, still kind of eager to know if civic will be launched again here?
great podcast.
Honda diesel is love in manual❤❤❤❤❤❤❤🎉
Just like the Autocar India magazine, this podcast series is really very interesting and informative.
A humble request.. Could you please consider making podcasts on iconic Indian cars.
Elevate 2025, should be with
1. TC transmission (maybe use Aisin-sourced torque converters) option along with existing Manual and CVT. The TC will help in reducing the whine from engine, which is typical of CVT as well as also make it more fun to drive due to faster response than CVT (closer to manual)
2. Petrol Turbo Engine option
3. Improve the NVH and the road noise. Honda does have issue with road noise even in their USA models (Civic, Accord, CRV). I have driven both Honda and Toyota in USA and found Toyota controls the road nice really well.
They should bring turbo petrols. The city comes with an 2cyl turbo petrol in Thailand. If they put the same engine in amaze and city as an option it would compete against 1tr vws. Their diesel was noisy but the mileage was great if they can meet the emission standards. And the 1.5 city really need to up it's game to compete with vw and hyundai
Great podcast by two experts! But almost no mention on Jazz and Wrv???
This was a business case study, learnt a lot❤
@Autocar India : I too, have two Hondas currently. Also had the City Diesel as well.. Really enjoyable, stable and heavy vehicles. But I feel the engine selection for Jazz is very poor. The 1.2L NA engine is not good enough to pull the car. I am a fan of Honda.
Also, could you do a video on Isuzu and their plans for India? Is it a good choice to buy the VCross, which is currently cheaper than the more expensive Hilux?
Start of the weekend with your podcast is just Supreme ❤😊😊
I drive a Honda CRV in United states. It's a great car. Even in states, Honda doesn't tops the aesthetics and features chart yet with decent features and great reliability it's popular especially among the family people. India is on cusp or shifting to more luxury demands. Honda should offer more option including something like CRV.
Brought Honda City 2024 v-mt this summer .
Stretched my budget as I was eyeing for it for more than 4 years .
And I was certain , if am going for new car , it is going to be city.
And I wanted to be a clever Bharatiya 🇮🇳 who hate raised hatch called SUV.
It was about comfort and Legacy (as said in the pod cast)
It’s a great pod cast
Ppl love ❤️ Honda More than the company itself 🎉
18:45 - in 3rd gear goes upto 150 kmph gives me the gooosebumps 💥💥💥💥
Proud owner of 2 Hondas: 2023 Civic Type R, and 2002 CR-V (both in the US). I really wish Honda was more aggressive when it came to the Indian market, especially now when the market is moving upwards. More localisation would definitely help bring global products like the CR-V, Civic, and Accord back to India. These products are up there with Toyota when it comes to reliability while being fun to drive. As you rightly said, Honda should avoid the red ocean, which is going against Suzuki. 10+ lakh segment is where Honda should bet its money on, with the Elevate and the City serving as the bread winners. The Amaze wouldn't sustain sales based on India's love for SUVs, and unless Honda manages to cut costs where the customer cant see, but then that wouldn't be a true Honda then, would it?
Very good content. If possible could you a similar podcast on Toyota like Honda. Why do they ditch previous generations when they came out with a new one. For Eg qualis was popular but they phased it out for Innova. Similarly Innova was popular but they phase out for crysta. For the first time they are now having both Crysta and hycross. Also their sedan strategy for India and global portfolio. New efficient and compaq 1.5 engine and when can it come in India. And lastly their products are popular in the tourist segment, it is good or bad for the brand in the long term. Thanks
Great video. I have become a fan of honda post owning elevate . Hopefully they continue to thrive in India going forward
You both make a great team and I love listening to your podcast every weekend with some very insightful points 😃
What a lovely informational podcast. Need more of these kind. Auto journalism at its best
i own a elevate now and super happy with it..really nice
Can we buy used HONDA JAZZ now
Was waiting for a podcast on Honda! Great work Team Autocar!
Love this podcast....
• Next why small car segment is so tough to crack... what is going wrong & how Suzuki done that !!!
40 mins of pure knowledge ❤OG horrmazd sir
Being a first timw car buyer, i couldnt think of buying any cars other than Honda considering the reliability and low maintenance. Hope they would bring more products just like before!!