@@kpen451 it's a fr question though. Society views sociopaths and psychopaths as these monstrous human beings...I don't, I see logical untainted humans with a super power.that super power is the ability to not feel emotions. Their decisions are entirely based off logic and practicality...where as the rest of society bases decisions off of the way we FEEL about something. So say I 'wanted' to destroy the 5, leave the one. But because I'm "afraid" of being 'shamed' or shunned for doing something that society has concreted in our minds as a "morally right or wrong" decision, I make the choice that is pleasing to society... ultimately succumbing to others desires and trashing who I am because my morals, perspectives, and logic aren't what society wants or can handle.... Btw who also was even ever put in charge of deciding what morals are? What right and wrong is? And which one as a collective we should step in line and march to? Nobody can BE themselves EVER, without judgments being cast, without knowing or seeing or listening to the WHOLE story with minds OPEN...
I would not flick the switch. It’s not my place to decide who lives or dies. Obviously I would do all I could to stop the train. But the score in lives is not my decision. I know this dilemma thought experiment, in many versions; including the one where you can take 5 different organs from one patient, leaving them dead, but saving five other patients. Without that patient’s consent, that’s obviously murder. I only know one person who was new to this thought experiment, faced with that first dilemma of the train tracks, but who quickly answered, “No, I would not flip the switch.” I’m delighted to say that was my youngest daughter, who’s interest in philosophy reassures me that she’ll make a great physicist. She’s studying for her doctorate in physics. As Josh says, “This guy is smart.” These videos are awesome. ✌️
+hampus nilson im diagnosed as a Psychopath, but i dont believe i am one can someone please give me a reason why this is, like i have everything that is diagnosed for a psychopath and only care about my self... any comments about this is good thanks
walrus funkerton Well, no one cares what you think. And since you disagree on something as obvious as that (they're supposed to test your neural reactions, not acquire from you wether stopping the train with a person is possible(hint hint: it's not)). So, it is basically what you feel when you're faced with a choice of tossing someone on the tracks or doing nothing at all. I have every reason to believe that is indeed YOU who is a dummy, because I have to be the captain obvious. And only stupid people fail to see the obvious.
A reasonable person would understand that the fat stranger is facing the exact same dilemma. And he's fat, so it's much easier for him to push you onto the tracks than for you to push him. *And* he might be a psychopath, so he would do so immediately, while you were still contemplating. In short: a reasonable person would run the hell away. With the added benefit that the fat stranger can now figure out all for himself if he wants to sacrifice his life to save five others. If you pushed him, that'd make you a hero and a murderer. If he pushes you, that makes him a hero and a murderer. But if he jumps, that makes him a hero and no murderer. So really, where's the dilemma if it's such an obvious win-win to just *RUN AWAY* before the fat stranger can. And he's fat, so you *will* run away before he can.
And this,why not ask this bulky stranger to help those 5 people? If theoretically he can stop the train with his physique,then he's capable of helping them.
Eazy J I've met three psychologists that I can recall, and all were cold people with very little apparent empathy, who seemed to view their patients as merely objects - specimens to be studied, and not as full human beings. All three psychologists (two of whom were women, who supposedly have more empathy than men) must have been on the psychopathic spectrum.
They are just as screwed up as we are. For some it's a life purpose to go through the fire and learn how to help people in similar situations and for others it's a way to feel powerful by fucking with the person seeking help. It's no coincidence the word psycho is in psychologist and the word therapist can be broken down to 2 words, the rapist. Weird... I know but I guess it explains why I have never trusted them.
I wouldn't push the fat guy because of self preservation if you push the fat guy you will be charged with murder. If you let the train hit the 5 people it's a accident because you didn't place the people on the track.
hot cheetos The tests are made by youtubers to make you feel edgy and a psychopath so 12 hit like as they are happy they now have a new edgy label to put down on their CV, along with professional fidget spinner and mine craft connoisseur
Haha a short hypothetical question in a 5 minute youtube video is all you need to diagnose anything. Some doctors even exclusively use videos like this for all of their diagnoses! Honestly though the majority of people who would try to diagnose themselves as psychopaths probably aren't psychopaths. One of the big things separating personality disorders from other mental disorders is that people with personality disorders generally don't actually think their symptoms are a negative thing. I'm sure many psychopaths out there don't even realize that they're psychopaths because their symptoms aren't very obvious and don't have a noticeable effect on their life. I think most psychopaths who do actually try to self diagnose probably stumbled onto something that makes them think they might be one and go on to take tests and do research so they can recognize when they're doing something that most people would consider cold and try to avoid being labeled as a psychopath by their peers. Unfortunately most people do occasionally show some level of reduced empathy in certain situations which leads them to poorly self diagnose themselves without realizing the depth of the disorder and just how many boxes have to be ticked for someone to really be considered a psychopath.
dancahill101 hahaha, the whole video requires a leap of imagination. If he is fat enough to stop a train how is it that I am able to push him over a railing? I weigh like 9 stone man! lol
Yes actually. it depends on what kind of train though. I lived on the Big Island of Hawaii. There was a train on a cattle ranch that got stuck because it ran over a 250 pound calf. It was an old steam train and was moving very slowly when it hit the calf.
Psychopathy is generally undesirable. In this hypothetical scenario, the psychopath would, all in all, have made the right decision. However, a psychopath is much more likely to do harm to society in cumulative measure due to his lack of empathy as he is a psychopath all day, every day. Also, a real psychopath may not be inclined to pull a lever or push anyone at all, as he is inherently self-serving and unconcerned with the welfare of others.
True. Unless the psychopath will somehow to disturbed or inconvenienced by the passing on a person in any of those 3 groups. For instance, if one of his parents are in one of those groups and that parents pays his bills or something like that.
+Kara Lindstrom Actually Psychopaths make excellent surgeons. Being divorced from emotional restraint. Allows them to make hard decisions faster and without restraint. All they need is a clear direction of the desired result from the patient or proxy.
you just need to push him, imagine him sitting on the ledge and dingeling his short fat legs with the text "push me to save the five people below" written on his back. with a timer on 30 seconds and you can start hear in the railtracks that the train is rolling closer by every second. You stare down at the 5 strangers, you read the text again, now then - what would you do ?
0:51 should you flick the switch? *Me : An intellectual* "flick the switch but once the front wheels of the wagon are on the other track flick it again, MULTI-TRACK DRIFTING"
@@panferfox9898 lmao like wtf is wrong with people man? I am seriously contiplating going off grid and living in the woods eating twigs and berries and helpless animals while whipping my ass with bark. Would almost rather forfeit all the benefits of civilization, to get away from all the morons haha.
Mainly because "psychopathy" is misunderstood and isn't necessarily the stalker killing the camp kids like Friday the 13th, or someone that just wants to watch the world burn. Yes, lacking empathy is a discerning characteristic, but it usually much more subtle than what most people think(which is usually along the lines of the the previously mentioned horror movie). Given a situation such as in the video, most people that are somewhere along the lines of psychopathy can and will easily make the logical choice and not even think twice about it, but they're also not looking to kill more people for a 'thrill', because part of that 'thrill' has roots in empathy that they lack.
because he's more rational than emotional. he wouldn't hesitate flicking the switch and being responsible for the death of the fat guy. it does not mean necessarily he's sadistic (that he'd want people dead). he simply lacks empathy for the fat guy
A prefectly rational answer (depending on the laws of the country that you reside in), but an answer that if actually so, shows that you care more about how you feel and the fact that you might go to prison than you care about helping 5 other people to not die (at the expense of one). Personally I can understand your reasoning (I mean, who'd want serious charges against them, and it is a difficult situation in any case, no?), but that to me it is rather obvious what the ethical and "right" choice would be, and I wonder (just out of interest, without any attempt at chastsizing you or anything) if you have actually thought this through, and if you are sure you could stick by your choice if this situation where to happen for real?
I think of it in terms of "who's left" after the ordeal and which set of people would be more socially acceptable. The ideal scenario would be the fat guy "accidentally" *cough*ttotally pushed*cough* falls and stops the train, and nobody dies on the rails. He'd die, but his family would be all "but he died for a good cause" or something. If I let anyone on the rails die, their families would blame it on me but an "accident" is less dramatic and less likely to be investigated.
A huge difference between the 2 scenarios which he didn’t mention, or at least didn’t fully articulate, was that in the second scenario you’re putting someone who is outside of the situation into the situation. The fat guy was just an observer, then because of your actions he becomes part of the death calculations. In the first one all the people are in the situation to start with. I think this difference is probably as important as the difference between being personal / impersonal.
That is a great explanation. I have had to deal with at least one psyopath in my life. He had no empathy at all. His boldness and desire to hurt people's feelings and positions eventually led to hos downfall.
Sounds more like a sociopath; the boldness being more along the lines or erratic behavior and the 'desire to hurt people' being of easily anger-induced traits. Psychopath would usually put more care/plan into every action to avoid such downfall; as their end goal in every way is self pleasure & success
I remember doing this test in school while learning about psychology. It was the "loved one vs a train car full of strangers" one though. And I remember the way our teacher did it, was keeping it anonymous. So that way only we saw the results that correlated to us, and she felt she could get a more honest answer. She actually coupled it with a lesson on social behaviors and how we will say one thing, and almost convince ourselves of one thing, while truly feeling another. She had noticed in past years, that when it was anonymous, far more people killed the strangers and saved the loved ones. Whilst far more people saved the strangers and killed the loved one when it was public knowledge. I really liked how she ended up using one lesson to teach an entirely other one.
Full stop, I’m saving the loved one over any number of strangers. To do otherwise, would be sort of like sacrificing a precious heirloom in return for a mystery box that’s probably, most likely, full of junk anyway.
@@WizardClipAudio The bonus being the loved one you saved now has to carry the burden of taking their lives, not you! Then again, you could have brought the loved one back, if you were a REAL wizard!
The main difference between a loved one and lots of strangers is that you will keep seeing talking and spending time with the loved one while strangers are strangers you may have done a better choice if you save the strangers but you won't (probably) do anything with them and you have killed a loved one which scars you longer than strangers
That question is also from a movie 😂😂 I forgot the movie but it’s about Psychology and the teacher put the students in different post-apocalyptic scenarios where the students have been giving an economic role for survival
I hate that term "normal people". What makes you normal? The fact that what you do and what you are accepted? The term should be "common". What's normal is what's innate, what's natural. We are all environmentally, socially, and habitat inclined to be exactly what we are. Born a giant or a midget, hetero or homo, pale or dark; these are all normal things to nature. Our ability to question and refuse nature's calls or instinct is what makes it so hard for us to see eye to eye. Common. Not, normal.
Luther S.P. I prefer the term neurotypical. Something I use if asked about my sister with autism. Don't know if it is an accepted term, or the correct term for that case, but I feel it better describes more common behaviour rather than classing as normal or abnormal.
Luther S.P. The two words are effectively synonyms. "Normal" is used in this video to refer to the majority. Unfortunately being a midget is not normal, it is rather rare to see one. That being said, saying someone isn't "normal" should not be taken as an insult.
I’m at the opposite end of the continuum from a psychopath. Life can be overwhelming for me; at times, barely livable. I have almost unrelenting anxiety and depression. But between my current state and psychopathy, I’d choose my current state. It’s because I get to feel love. Psychopaths may not feel emotional pain, but they don’t feel love either. Not that they mind. If I was a psychopath, I’d probably feel the same way I do now, but in reverse.
Oh you're so pathetically self righteous. Psychopaths are a matter of degrees. You're one, too. I can tell. You don't think your clingy, needy sloth (depression) that preys upon the indulgence of others isn't a form of psychopathy? Albeit a dishonest one. Spiritual vampirism mislabeled as "love"?
+Wataaa! No, the train would fare on the rail that the switch is switched to at the moment. But it could also cause the train to de-rail, killing you and everyone else on the train.
Exactly. Sure u think it wouldn’t give u as much guilt. But u would have killed someone either way. If you just divert your mind from the situation your in. It’s like your not even there.
EG Loveall because you do not value human life, flipping the switch would be hard and potentially very emotionally scaring but if you think not flipping the switch would bring you less guilt then you’re wrong, you had the opportunity and you let those people die. And if it truly would wound you less then... you need help
damn, im in that part of youtube where every single video in the recommendations looks super interesting, and i have to open another window so i can keep track.
And it always happens late late at night. Middle of the day bored scrolling through trash videos but if it’s 11pm that’s when the good videos start to hit. 😂
O damn. That’s why the teacher was totally focusing on me. He asked the exact same questions. It took me literally 1s to answer them all while my classmates were discussing each question for 10min. I got so annoyed by that, that I kept telling them, that is not hard to decide. From the logical perspective u saved lifes. Guess, I had no inner conflicts. I‘m not manipulating people or I‘m just not aware of.
gonna help ya, this quizz is bullshit The real question is : you can either save 4 60 years old people, or save 2 20 years old people. Now, if you have to think about it, it means you have to think about what would these people might say. Thus, you no psychopath. Ofc saving one = saving one, even more when the previous "dilemna" is mathematically the same. you kill one person you don't know and save five, vs you kill one person you don't know versus five both cases, if you have common sense, you do the math choices If there is other criterias involved "family member, friends, ect" then it becomes something else again, seems like something that is only visible in difference on the brain scans, 99% of 80% of the world will save the 5 people, the 20% others are woke, morons, or both
@@hugom6441 I think im avarage and i would do nothing as it doesnt involve me. Why should i flip the switch. I dont see the reasoning. Ur saying that mathematically u are saving more lives but if u think more about it u would notice that it isn't that simple. U could be killing one average person who could be considered innocent to save a murderer or rapist or what not.
@@Ibrahim-ld9vz It is being rational. You wanna decide on quality of people. But if information about quality isn't available, I think one should go for quantity. Because I think if you have a chance to save lives, you should use that chance. Being indifferent to that is very cowardly/evil...
Yeah this can happen in Marvel's movies. Fatguy suddenly turns into hulk and try to stop the train with his all power and somehow when the train is 2inch away from the people, it stops. Yo hulk is the hero.
I'm not a psychopath, I'm a sociopath. = ) Case 1: I don't give a shit about if 5 people dies or 1 person dies. Neither are important to me. Case 2: Again, don't give a shit if one or 5 dies. But I know for certain that people will look at me as a murderer if I pushed the guy over though.
Richard Alexander Psychopaths's way of thinking is somewhat justified (like in this video, where their personal and impersonal responses are the same). They will justify their actions by truly believing it to be right. A sociopath just don't give a shit about anyone else but themselves. A sociopath probably would feel no remorse over something that was wrong in other's eyes, whereas psychopaths would simply justify it in their erratic little mind.
DocsDota I think your descriptions are correct, but I don't believe they distinguish a psychopath from a sociopath. Neither does Wikipedia, which states that the terms are used interchangeably, though sociopath is preferred, to avoid confusing psychopath with psychosis. The term, "psychopath" emphasizes the condition arising in the mind, whereas the term "sociopath" emphasizes the social aspects, but both are considered the same disorder. So, what should be society's response to someone who is prone to justifying his own behavior, regardless of how unacceptable it might be? I ask, because senior executives are twice as likely to be psychopaths as compared to the general public.
Richard Alexander Society can only respond in what they believe is right and wrong, and that is the legal system. There are thousands of actions done each day that is considered immoral to some, okay to others. The key thing here is to not take matters into your own hands or chaos and conflicts arises. At the end of the day, just think about what is most important to you.
he's dumb; but classically, in one case you push a lever to change the rails' switch from a direction toward five people to a direction with only one person ( *tied,* traditionally) there; in the second case, you have to lift and push a human with your own hands, which apparently is supposed to make the choice harder (psychologically at least, maybe philosophically) for people. But "ethics" of emergencies are stupid. That's not what life is about. It's ethics for _normal_ daily life people really need. Using emergencies as a starting point is destroying humanity. (Ayn Rand described well why in her essay "The Ethics of Emergencies")
But you have to remember that in the first scenario , switching the lever will make you kill someone , but if you just left the train to kill the five persons then you've killed no one
But you could have save them by just moving a lever. You deliberatly decided to not give a fuzz about the dead of 5 people. And not because you wanted to save the other 1, but just because you didn't care. Maybe that's the half-way between normal and psycopath.
@@stanleystove You are selfish and lack empathy. When you do something true, you don't care about if the world is against you. In this case, if you saved lives, at least tried to do something good with your power, you don't care about illogical outside world (here being police who lacks logic and unable to judge a situation) because you know you didn't betray yourself/your morals. Idk how real laws would work (maybe I would still be charged even after analysis), but again I wouldn't care. Important thing for me is altering the course of action for good instead of being a careless evil with rotten morals!
@@jdperdomoThe assumption that saving five by killing one is questionable. It rests on a further assumption that the value of one life can be calculated. These moral experiments are not meant to derive truths about morality but to find out how people might react or how moral thinking might function. Ultimately they fail to answer the proposed test because people probably would act differently in real situations and other motivating factors would influence decisions the biggest flaw of the experiment is that it starts out with the assumption that it is better to save five than one. Once that expectation seizes the mind it will direct decisions. My personal guess would that normal people would by so emotional that the experimental thinking pattern would not emerge. They wont even think about killing the guy. Moral decisions are based on emotions and the idea of pitting one live against five is a formulation calling a logical function in the brain your brain will allow logical thinking because you understand it is a theoretical scenario. That is why you get people flipping switches. Also- the brainscans do not prove a thing because any of a number of alternative explanations for the data can be offered.
Well, the interesting thing is that if you understand psychopathy, you also understand that a true psychopath behaves in a very rational manner, and is hardly what most people would call "crazy." Your textbook psychopath lacks empathy or remorse, but that hardly makes them irrational. Rather, they are unable to see the benefit of group social dynamics, and completely (or almost completely) lack empathy. In any given scenario, they will serve only their own short-term needs and desires, and see no need either to care about others, or to worry about the long term effects of their actions on others or even themselves. Psychopaths are perfectly rational...but also very self-serving and short-sighted.
+Calcifer Granted. It is a gross oversimplification, but for the purposes of profiling, it is generally adequate. But you are correct. A psychopath is certainly capable of detailed, long-term planning. I didn't mean to say otherwise. What I meant was that basic individual wants, needs, and desires seem to dominate the thinking of the majority of people diagnosed as psychopaths, and generally speaking, focusing only on these goals is rather short-sighted in my view. That's not to say there aren't plenty of non-psychopaths that think similarly, and it also isn't to say that psychopaths can't enact elaborate, long-term plans.
You know, when he gave the second dilemma, I was thinking along the lines of "Will my physical strength be enough to heave the person onto the train tracks?"or "Will the person fight back?". I think I may be a psychopath.
I would push the stranger to save the other five people.......if there was absolutely no other way to save them. Five people are more than one, so in sheer numbers, I'd do as much good as possible in this situation. The reason why this doesn't make me a psychopath is that I would never forgive myself for having sacrificed that one person. I'd have to live with feelings of remorse and guilt that even the knowledge of having rescued five people couldn't alleviate. But at the same time, I'd know I did the right thing. Let's make the question a bit more interesting: If you could push a complete stranger in front of a moving train to save five convicted killers, would you do it? They may be killers, but they're also people. So what's morally right?
I immediately thought of throwing the guy off the bridge, and when he said that psychopaths have no trouble deciding to throw him off, I got freaked out, lol
I thought of that too, but then realized that there was no way I could throw the dude off and decided not to. Then again I also decided to kill the five people because it's no fun to die alone and somebody's gonna die anyway
If I push the fat guy I've legally committed murder, that might have something to do with why I don't want to push him, because I don't want to go to jail. Does psychopaths not mind going to jail? Also, how do I know pushing the fat guy would slow down the train so that it wouldn't kill the others? It seems impossible to arrive at such a conclusion with 100% certainty in the heat of the moment. I am not the master of practical physics and cannot possibly know if sacrificing the fat guy will save the others. There's also the problem of justice, the people who are on the track have obviously been behaving recklessly, otherwise they would not be on the track in the first place, while the fat guy has done nothing to deserve being pushed to his death. So they "deserve" it more than he does. There's a lot more going on here than Mr Dutton lets on.
***** regardless you will still be killing an innocent so both ways are incorrect...would you want someone to sacrifice you for five other people? Of course not...let it be the Queen or even the prime minister...you wouldn't dare...that's how much we value our lives... also if we wanted to be the 'hero' or savoir...why not sacrifice yourself or just seek help....things like that distinguishes between a emotionless human and a 'normal' human...one who knows justice and has sympathy...so no human being has the power to decide some ones fate...that is immoral. Imagine if that was you P.S- I know this is scenarios...this is to the slow minds out there :)...so you won't be in a state of confusion...generous lass, aren't I?
Justice? How do you know the reason those people are on the track? What if they've been tied up? What if they were engineers working? What if someone was trying to commit suicide and others jumped on the track to save the deranged person?
The correct answer: Turn a blind eye... If you risk sacrificing one to save 5 you’ll be judged for sacrificing 1... humans love to judge. If you attempt to push the stranger onto the tracks you might be over powered and have your life put at risk. Turn a blind eye, walk away and let the stranger deal with the situation. No one is the wiser and your life will have no repercussions and continue as normal.
L D to be honest in my line of work I make difficult decisions every day. This decision would be easy, it’s not my line of work and I definitely wouldn’t profit from it. In life we have to to move forward with decisions that suit our needs and that help us to benefit. This risk is not beneficial or rewarding. Just my point of view.
@@ld6056 If I were the person on the other tracks, I don't care if you're the type of person who makes difficult decisions, I would not appreciate you hitting the switch when you don't even know me and had no right to choose for me to die. You can call people "weak" if they stay back and refuse responsibility in this scenario, but at least they're not actively committing murder.
I wouldn't push the guy over the bridge, not out of emotions for the stranger, but because of him not having to do anything with the train. The people on the train chose to be in the train, and they chose to take the risks that come with travelling by train (Despite the extremely unlikely case, it's still a possibility). Hence I would not push the man over the bridge, because he has nothing to do with their choice; they should face the consequences of their choices themselves. Just a rational approach right? Don't think I'm a psychopath, but I ain't that emotional over throwing a stranger off a bridge.
@@mollyswain478 It depends. Think of Psychopaths as just like anyone else, but with a few very important exceptions, they only care about themselves (sometimes there are very rare exceptions for immediate family or close friends, but they are very rare and usually not that deep), they lack a conscience or remorse, and they have no moral limitations. That's it. They still have emotions (although almost completely centered around themselves). They can still feel fear (although reduced reaction to fear is common among Psychopaths). So a psychopath will do basically whatever they want as long as they can get away with it and sometimes even if they can't get away with it. Not all psychopaths are murders and many of them are not even violent. However, they are not violent because they get no pleasure out of violence and/or because violence is counter-productive to get what they want. To think like a Psychopath, just imagine if you only cared about yourself and you focused all your efforts into getting what you want regardless of the consequences to others. You might like power or money or sex or romance (purely to have someone pay attention to you, not any real type of bonding) or play mind games with other people or enjoy the suffering of others.
Either way you're killing someone. Flip a switch or push someone, to me neither choice is really impersonal. So I'd just let the train kill the five people, I didn't put them on the tracks so it's not my concern and i cant be blamed of be held responsible for anything.
You would do nothing and let five people die without feeling guilt or any kind of responsibility? In this case scenario doing nothing = killing five people, even though nobody is going to directly blame you for "doing nothing".
Like he said before, you are not the one who put 5 five people on the rail so you can't feel guilty for letting them die, if you decide to pull the switch you will be the one who killed that 1 guy
Physics student's take on the issue: If the fat guy is able to instantly stop the train, then the train and everyone inside it experience 200+ g's of acceleration, which would probably kill them instantly. I would rather not kill all passengers on board. If the fat guy is fat enough to stop the train, I probably can't throw him over the bridge. In any case, fat man lives.
I think you forget that humans are extremely squishy, and would stop the train over a period of time as the initial weight and then the destruction of the body would get into the wheels. Also you can't assume the train is going super fast.
By getting involved it makes you a murderer rather than a bystander. It comes down to whether you can live with yourself easier having not intervened at all 🤔
For me it's not about that but rather who are we to make this choice? We will never have to make any choice remotely like this because every aspect is nonsensical. They could have created a realistic scenario.
Burt Gummer, i just feel like id have more guilt if i flicked the switch to impact someone’s death than if i just let those people die because i can justify the decision in my head.
JWeavile feeling guilt. Is that something that you feel often? Especially from things that have nothing to do with you ? I personally feel guilt over just about everything and anything.
Burt Gummer it’s not that I wouldn’t feel guilt, its that id feel more of i flicked the switch to kill a guy than to do nothing and five guys die. Naturally id have guilt because I would have stood by while five guys die, but i feel like it would be less guilt than flicking the switch.
Burt Gummer i chose not to do anything at all. it's not a condition that i caused, and at the cost of another's life, i would just let it take its original course i mean what kind of question is this? you have no right to decide which one gets to live. though i see and understand the appeal of having such control over lives, in that scenario you dont have any right to decide which one gets to live and which one gets to die.
What's sick is that people think it's any different. That taking a life is less of a decision or less awful cuz ur just flicking a switch. People should be equally distraught (or not) over both scenarios. At least the psychopath is treating them equally.
I’ve trained myself through reflection to over-step that erroneous circuitry so that I am more prepared in the moment to do what needs to be done. I wonder how that effects the emotional functioning of the brain in other areas of life.
I have always disliked the train track analogy because it seems too simplistic to account for the differences between average people and psychopaths. I, personally, would find it no easier, on a logical OR emotional level, to kill one person than to kill five people. Even if only one person dies, and I am the one who causes that death, I will feel intense guilt and sadness and my conscience will be forever tarnished. I understand the concept that psychopaths don't process emotions the same way that a typical person does. What I don't understand is, how in the first version of the scenario (the one where you flick the switch to change the path of the train), not seeing the person/people you choose to kill makes it automatically easier to kill them. To me, it would be just as difficult to kill someone whether or not I saw them. I just find the whole exercise very troubling.
_"What I don't understand is, how in the first version of the scenario (the one where you flick the switch to change the path of the train), not seeing the person/people you choose to kill makes it automatically easier to kill them."_ Well, the point of the train track analogy is to demonstrate that there in fact is a qualitative difference in how humans process the scenarios, not necessarily produce a rational justification for the process, but it's likely related to either you initiating physical force against an uninvolved 3rd party or fear of punishment. _"To me, it would be just as difficult to kill someone whether or not I saw them. I just find the whole exercise very troubling."_ Well, to me, it wouldn't. I would maximize the number of people saved and consider it a moral duty to do so. I think you'll find that it's just a question of the number of people involved even for you. Would you kill one to save 1 billion? Is that even something you have to think about? Regardless of what my feelings would be with regards to killing the 1 guy, I'd be morally compelled to take the action. This isn't because I'm unable to feel empathy or have dysfunctional emotional processing either. This test doesn't really measure the absence of either. Rather, it measures where you lie on the ends-means axis of the moral spectrum. While it may be true that all psychopaths will end up pushing the fat guy, not everyone who will push the fat guy are psychopaths.
IrishEyes1989 I had an evil grin on my face thinking about those 5 people exploding into a cloud of blood. Then I read someone's comment on the second scenario where all 6 people died and was like "Holy fuck yes". It was basically wait till the train has passed, and then still push the fat guy.
The research on psychopathy is pretty static at the moment, there is much more to the mindset than what has been concluded already. I'd like to see psychologists delve further into it other than hide behind what's already been done.
I was the only person in my class who when asked about their answer to the trolley problem, answered with, “I would let the train kill 5 people because my action would likely be seen by law enforcement as causing death, and I don’t want to go to prison.” Yes, I have been diagnosed with sociopathic tendancies and NPD.
there will be no witnesses, what are cops doing randomly at the bridge? they aren't. and the 5 people aren't going to see they are tied down, and the fat guy is going to die.
CodeDarkBlue Your comment suggests that you are on Level 1.1 of Lawrence Kohlberg's stages of moral development, which would be typical for young children.
realy wow. i could never kill the guy in nr.2 i would try to trow a shoe or somthing at the train, but i would not be able to kill him, but in the first one i would change the track
Ultimately, that you either do not value human life, or are a coward. Refusing to make a decision can be viewed from the same lens are specifically deciding to let the five people die. On the other hand, hesitating too long is different. Someone can hesitate and not be a coward or a complete psychopath (as opposed to the partial psychopath who saves lives without hesitation). It's possible to refuse to make a decision as rationalize it as being "too difficult", but someone who simply cannot-as in lacks the training to-for themselves to make a decision is not doing that.
MrCharles7994 Or the third reason is that you are an existentialist and you value human life and are not a coward, but you know you did not cause the event to take place and it is not your place to flip the switch. What if you flipped the switch to save the five people, but the one guy who died instead was about to find the cure for cancer? Then you would have saved 5 lives at the price of millions...that is why I would have walked away anyway.
Hrollief1 Nonsensical reasoning is still nonsensical. Without knowing them, it is equally likely that any of those five would develop the cure to cancer. By choosing not to kill the one, you have not only killed a net of four, but decreased the chance of cancer being cured by an even larger number than if you had killed that man. That was a simple rationalization, a cute little reason you feel is justified by philosophy, but doesen't actually absolve you of any responsibility to make a decision. There is no logical reason to value this one mans life above the other five, so you should sacrifice him to save them. It could be the wrong decision for a variety of reasons, but there is no evidence that this is true. The fact that there are consequences-very real ones-does not change this. It merely raises the stakes to the point where your particular brand of *incredible, despicable cowardice* is *easy*. In fact, hiding behind a philosophy to justify your actions, to rationalize away the choice you have to make, is even more cowardly than simply walking away because you to scared to make the decision. Not only is that fear still there, but you cannot even admit that it is; you must run from that as well, hiding behind the name of your quasi-religious philosophy. There are, in fact, good reasons to choose to spare the man in this particular situation. But hiding behind anything that ignores the decision or rationalizes away the power you have to deal with it is not one of them.
MrCharles7994 The thing is the train is already headed in the direction of the 5 people and by pulling the switch you'd be killing someone. I wasn't responsible for this situation and by pulling the switch I'd be killing someone who wasn't supposed to die. Granted none of them deserve to die but it's not up to me to decide who does and doesn't die.
I said out loud when he said the 2nd scenario, "it's the same question. Push the guy over" then he proceeded to explain how that is the psychopath answer....
TheMagrhino you're an idiot it doesn't matter how "many" people you kill you intentionally diverted the train onto the one person to save 5 lives and thus that is called murder. If you just allow the train hurtle down the tracks onto the people who were dumb enough to be standing in the way in the first place. And as for the fat person dilemma I wouldn't want guts spraying into my face
So I'm a diagnosed psychopath and when I got diagnosed I bought Kevin Duttons book which really helped me! Now I'm obsessed w the topic and psychology in general and want to become a psychologist one day! Kevin Dutton is such an inspiration!!
I love how, instead of actually looking at the ethical and psychological issues of the problem, everyone here is criticising the mechanics of the situation.
I would potentially disagree with this analysis. It may simply be that psychopaths do not care at all unless it is in their interest. They may rationally calculate all decisions but it does not mean they would choose the option that saves the most lives in either case. You have provided no behavioural data that shows a prediliction for compassion at all. I think the framing of this is meaningless at best, and probably misleading, without data on what they would choose. I'm a neuroscientist.
He never said it was a test. He's just stating an example of action, so it's easier to visualize. Even if the example is not factual, the aim is to give you an idea of what he's saying.
Hahaha, I think itgives the more 'mad genius' look, or so they intended it to be lol =))) But the title really is misleading, they should've chosen a better one. The content is thankfully not so off the track.
The only thing I could think about scenario no. 2 is that I'm not physically strong enough to push a big fat guy over some railing and to his death, especially if they're resisting. What are my results?
Cadence X OF COURSE! How could not have already grasped this knowledge! He was blatantly telling it to our faces!...Come on mason, remember the numbers.
I would always let the individual live. In all cases I assume the group on the track is there because they aren't individuals and are just followers. Seriously, how the hell could five people get themselves in such a bad situation?
In most countries, they will prosecute you for killing someone - ignoring the benefits. Should you decide to call 911 and they arrive too late, you'll most likely be held responsible for failure to render assistance. I for one would just walk away - sorry.
+SpecialHandlingUnit here let me give u a example lets say the 3-5 on the tracks where ur family members and the 1 alone is a person that can cure aids will u flip the switch to kill 1 or the 3-5
jason forbes that's a different question, you can add and take away from the original question if you like but it doesn't answer the original question, in fact your scenario is a common add on to the original question but it wasn't posed this time. You didn't answer the question, I don't mind your add on, all is well. Bye.
+SpecialHandlingUnit if i dont know anyone on the track why should i even care i wont flick the switch and i wont push the person cause neither one will change my life
If you still monitor this, sir, I ask: what would your thoughts be if a person aware of the circumstances simply did nothing to interfere in these situations?
I wonder what it means if you experience an equal moral dilemma for both scenarios, but rather than the first being an easy choice and the second hard, you just find both choices equally hard?
That wasn't an option in the question; the reason the other person can stop the train is because they are very large, The question assume you wouldn't have the size to stop the train and therefore you throwing yourself in front of the train isn't even worth mentioning. When i first heard this situation a few years ago in an online lecture, my first question was "can i ask the other person to do it themselves so they have a choice in the matter?". I think that is the more appropriate response given the terms of the dilemma they laid out.
0:45 I'd leave the switch halfway through a "proper flick," thus derailing the train and killing everyone on it, then leave the six people trapped on the tracks to starve. *I think i made the right choice.*
I would not flick the first switch even though it would save 3 lives more because it means my action indirectly killed the person on the other line. I would do it only if he agrees. I would not flick the second switch too for the same reason. I want to be a hero but not at the expense of others
For case 2 I think "would I be charged with murder by physically pushing a man to his death to save 5 people? Is it worth being charged with murder, or should I just stay out of the way?".
The reason my reaction in the second situation is different is because there are different options. In the first it's either kill 1 or 5, in the second it's I kill no one or I kill 1 person to save many.
The difference for me is the 1 or 5 people were going to inevitably die. The guy on the cliff wasn't. But yes if I don't touch the lever I won't kill anyone technically but I would feel guilty if it hit the 5 because I could've caused a better outcome.
BuFufilms It seems the same to me, if you don't push the guy you could have had a better outcome by saving the 5 cause either 1 or 5 will die inevitable in both cases.
If you are bound to the rails your "fate" (for lack of a better term) is sealed. If you are chilling on a cliff your fate is not sealed. If I kill the guy on the cliff that blood is on my hands when I pull the lever to kill 1 person that blood is on the person that bound them there.
BuFufilms So if the scenario was say the railroad guys just got stuck in the mud while walking and its nobody's fault then it would be different? Cause the 5 guys on the road their fate is also sealed in a sense, unless you intervene to save them by killing the dude. The dude tied on the railroad would live just like the dude on the bridge if you refuse to pull the lever. Only difference to me is one feels more personal so your more likely to think carefully first, kinda like killing someone in combat vs getting a drone to do it.
No for both. I would not like blood on my hands. And for the people saying: Well you would have blood because you could have saved them! No. Why? I didn't tie them up there. I don't drive the train
+Thomaslawlet Becusee I that man doesn't have to die. He can live. With the other one its either or. With the second one I am killing a man, I am ending his life, I am pushing him to his death, he could have lived, I have robbed him of all of his potential just as I have robbed those five people of their potential and lives. Did you watch the video? The man describes it very well.
+Lunjoc +Lunjoc +Lunjoc WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU?? The world does not revolve around money!! I don't care if he owes me money!! I don't care if I get free stuff!! People are PEOPLE. They have souls, they have minds, they have potential. You must be some sort of physcopath.
pushing a fat guy to save more lives ? why? that's murder. those people shouldnt't be on the tracks and should assume their consequences. I am not doing anything and let the thing happening.
Well, to be honest, i would really push the fat dude (based upon that all 6 people involved are random people i've never met). It's plain simple thinking if you consider it worse just because you are the one initiating the action, doing nothing can be just as harmfull to others and you, if not more.
"Sad story today...seven people died on the railroad tracks this afternoon." "One was pushed over a cliff to his death, landing by the tracks, five people were ran over by the train, and the seventh was mysteriously suffocated while tied to a fork in the track." Did I pass.
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This guy is smart
What if someone where to answer the first question as killing the 5 and saving the one with the logic that there's too many people living on earth?
@@lizhaycook8219 😆good 1
@@kpen451 it's a fr question though. Society views sociopaths and psychopaths as these monstrous human beings...I don't, I see logical untainted humans with a super power.that super power is the ability to not feel emotions. Their decisions are entirely based off logic and practicality...where as the rest of society bases decisions off of the way we FEEL about something. So say I 'wanted' to destroy the 5, leave the one. But because I'm "afraid" of being 'shamed' or shunned for doing something that society has concreted in our minds as a "morally right or wrong" decision, I make the choice that is pleasing to society... ultimately succumbing to others desires and trashing who I am because my morals, perspectives, and logic aren't what society wants or can handle....
Btw who also was even ever put in charge of deciding what morals are? What right and wrong is? And which one as a collective we should step in line and march to?
Nobody can BE themselves EVER, without judgments being cast, without knowing or seeing or listening to the WHOLE story with minds OPEN...
I would not flick the switch. It’s not my place to decide who lives or dies. Obviously I would do all I could to stop the train. But the score in lives is not my decision. I know this dilemma thought experiment, in many versions; including the one where you can take 5 different organs from one patient, leaving them dead, but saving five other patients. Without that patient’s consent, that’s obviously murder. I only know one person who was new to this thought experiment, faced with that first dilemma of the train tracks, but who quickly answered, “No, I would not flip the switch.” I’m delighted to say that was my youngest daughter, who’s interest in philosophy reassures me that she’ll make a great physicist. She’s studying for her doctorate in physics. As Josh says, “This guy is smart.” These videos are awesome. ✌️
''Recommended for you'' - Thanks Google.
#darude
#sandstorm
haha
+hampus nilson im diagnosed as a Psychopath, but i dont believe i am one can someone please give me a reason why this is, like i have everything that is diagnosed for a psychopath and only care about my self... any comments about this is good thanks
Bye Guys and narcissistic
If he's fat enough to stop the train I doubt that I could push him
Usopp>Kaido
Skeletor>He-man
10/10 joke my friend
well done, sir/maam. well done
Yonko1986 Kaido XD
Would a reasonable person *really* believe that tossing a very large stranger onto the tracks would be able to stop a train?
+skudzer1985
A reasonable person would not ask unrelated quesitons and would just take the damn test.
walrus funkerton
Well, no one cares what you think. And since you disagree on something as obvious as that (they're supposed to test your neural reactions, not acquire from you wether stopping the train with a person is possible(hint hint: it's not)). So, it is basically what you feel when you're faced with a choice of tossing someone on the tracks or doing nothing at all.
I have every reason to believe that is indeed YOU who is a dummy, because I have to be the captain obvious. And only stupid people fail to see the obvious.
If the guy is fat enough to stop the train, then why not stop the train yourself?
A reasonable person would understand that the fat stranger is facing the exact same dilemma. And he's fat, so it's much easier for him to push you onto the tracks than for you to push him. *And* he might be a psychopath, so he would do so immediately, while you were still contemplating.
In short: a reasonable person would run the hell away.
With the added benefit that the fat stranger can now figure out all for himself if he wants to sacrifice his life to save five others.
If you pushed him, that'd make you a hero and a murderer. If he pushes you, that makes him a hero and a murderer. But if he jumps, that makes him a hero and no murderer.
So really, where's the dilemma if it's such an obvious win-win to just *RUN AWAY* before the fat stranger can. And he's fat, so you *will* run away before he can.
It's just a thought experiment.
If he's big enough to stop a train, then I'm not strong enough to push him onto the tracks.
I thought this same thing
@@amberenergyhealertarot6617 "great minds...." as they say
And this,why not ask this bulky stranger to help those 5 people? If theoretically he can stop the train with his physique,then he's capable of helping them.
@@claudius3359 yeah. Great point. That would probably be the best way to fix the situation
But if he is that big we can use him to stop the train , can't we?
Why do psychologists alway look like the biggest psychopaths themselves?
Eazy J I've met three psychologists that I can recall, and all were cold people with very little apparent empathy, who seemed to view their patients as merely objects - specimens to be studied, and not as full human beings. All three psychologists (two of whom were women, who supposedly have more empathy than men) must have been on the psychopathic spectrum.
Because they study feelings
They are just as screwed up as we are. For some it's a life purpose to go through the fire and learn how to help people in similar situations and for others it's a way to feel powerful by fucking with the person seeking help. It's no coincidence the word psycho is in psychologist and the word therapist can be broken down to 2 words, the rapist. Weird... I know but I guess it explains why I have never trusted them.
I think that in order to understand someone is to be them, but it's just a thought tho
BadgerBotherer1 Was it when they were doing their job? Because oftentimes psychologic treatment requires the psyhologist to show no emotion.
my reaction to those questions in my head: "i dont want to go to prison, i dont want to be in trouble, i rather do nothing and walk away slowly"
Spot on. Let life take its curse.
I basically wrote the same.
I wouldn't push the fat guy because of self preservation if you push the fat guy you will be charged with murder. If you let the train hit the 5 people it's a accident because you didn't place the people on the track.
That's why you are prey. Well, generally all people with no balls.
Exactly look out for yourself first
I remember the answer from school . The first train would arrive in Boston at exactly 4 O'clock.
haha
Dave xDDDDD
No! The fat guy would slow the train down by at least 30 minutes!
They forgot the part where the train driver committed suicide 5 Days Later lol.
What
I would not intervene at all. It's unfortunate, yes, but I will not take part in it.
i was gonna say
Same, I wouldn't care about those 5 people and at the same time I'll avoid the stress of colluting with the fat one
I am of the same mindset. By flicking the switch, I become a murderer regardless of the outcome.
@Crom Only if that 1 person was myself. I am a firm believer in an afterlife.
Thanks Tulsi
You Tube posted this video on my page saying, “Recommended for you.”
+1p6t1gms same
:'D same.
+1p6t1gms i looked it up...
+1p6t1gms well youtube is a specialist at recommend thing THAT'S GOOD FOR U lol
+1p6t1gms I laughed so fucking hard at this comment...
Do not use this video to self diagnose!
LOL!
deathshot638 I've done literally hundreds of these and they all say I'm a psychopath. Hmmm...
hot cheetos The tests are made by youtubers to make you feel edgy and a psychopath so 12 hit like as they are happy they now have a new edgy label to put down on their CV, along with professional fidget spinner and mine craft connoisseur
deathshot638 good advise
Haha a short hypothetical question in a 5 minute youtube video is all you need to diagnose anything. Some doctors even exclusively use videos like this for all of their diagnoses! Honestly though the majority of people who would try to diagnose themselves as psychopaths probably aren't psychopaths. One of the big things separating personality disorders from other mental disorders is that people with personality disorders generally don't actually think their symptoms are a negative thing. I'm sure many psychopaths out there don't even realize that they're psychopaths because their symptoms aren't very obvious and don't have a noticeable effect on their life. I think most psychopaths who do actually try to self diagnose probably stumbled onto something that makes them think they might be one and go on to take tests and do research so they can recognize when they're doing something that most people would consider cold and try to avoid being labeled as a psychopath by their peers. Unfortunately most people do occasionally show some level of reduced empathy in certain situations which leads them to poorly self diagnose themselves without realizing the depth of the disorder and just how many boxes have to be ticked for someone to really be considered a psychopath.
If I could sling a dude heavy enough to stop a train over a railing, I'm not a psychopath. I'm a super hero at that point.
lol yeah, he'd have to be heavier than a semi truck, because trains can rip through those like nothin'.
Kirby Everyman 😂😂😂
Just imagine him rolled up like a burrito and flipping a switch rolling him onto the tracks.
I guess you missed the point of the video
if you save everyone you're a superhero
the feeling of feeling what someone else is feeling
my brain cells died
was that too hard for you
I feel ya
They know the feelings, they just don’t feel them.
LOVE VIOLENT PSYCHOPATHS.
did you have any to begin with ?
no one on earth weighs enough to stop a train... a train has A LOT of momentum...
dancahill101 hahaha, the whole video requires a leap of imagination. If he is fat enough to stop a train how is it that I am able to push him over a railing? I weigh like 9 stone man! lol
Kasey Escape i know xD he must way like 89 tons then if i could throw that well... im better then superman
dancahill101 thanks for clearing that up.
Yes actually. it depends on what kind of train though. I lived on the Big Island of Hawaii. There was a train on a cattle ranch that got stuck because it ran over a 250 pound calf. It was an old steam train and was moving very slowly when it hit the calf.
Superman could...
Psychopathy is generally undesirable. In this hypothetical scenario, the psychopath would, all in all, have made the right decision. However, a psychopath is much more likely to do harm to society in cumulative measure due to his lack of empathy as he is a psychopath all day, every day. Also, a real psychopath may not be inclined to pull a lever or push anyone at all, as he is inherently self-serving and unconcerned with the welfare of others.
True. Unless the psychopath will somehow to disturbed or inconvenienced by the passing on a person in any of those 3 groups. For instance, if one of his parents are in one of those groups and that parents pays his bills or something like that.
+Kara Lindstrom Actually Psychopaths make excellent surgeons. Being divorced from emotional restraint. Allows them to make hard decisions faster and without restraint. All they need is a clear direction of the desired result from the patient or proxy.
exactly, he wouldn't care in this situation
@Kara : yes exactly !! i need my parents to help me financially
Miss Construde
lol good plot Miss Construde ^^
personally, i probably wouldn't care, or maybe i would push the fat guy, hard to tell from here
the real question is, if he is large enough to stop a train how could you lift him off the bridge
you just need to push him, imagine him sitting on the ledge and dingeling his short fat legs with the text "push me to save the five people below" written on his back. with a timer on 30 seconds and you can start hear in the railtracks that the train is rolling closer by every second. You stare down at the 5 strangers, you read the text again, now then - what would you do ?
that is the reason why i work out bro
+Kim Strandberg Pushing a fat guy isn't that easy
God I can barely pick up my 19 pound dog for more than a minute let alone push a 400+ pound person off a bridge.
+I Like Your preFace. give me a fulcrum and a lever and I can lift any man
0:51 should you flick the switch?
*Me : An intellectual*
"flick the switch but once the front wheels of the wagon are on the other track flick it again, MULTI-TRACK DRIFTING"
You're a dumbass.
@@adamkeylon2194 you just killed me with laughter
@@panferfox9898 lmao like wtf is wrong with people man? I am seriously contiplating going off grid and living in the woods eating twigs and berries and helpless animals while whipping my ass with bark. Would almost rather forfeit all the benefits of civilization, to get away from all the morons haha.
@@adamkeylon2194 I like your ability to just kind of throw stuff down and leave it. That's what made me laugh when I saw what you wrote.
@@panferfox9898 "Throw stuff down and leave it". -Panfer Fox for POTUS 2020
So what do you call a person that will just walk away from the situation and continue enjoying his day like nothing happened?
Idk he's fine
Human. We honestly do that more times than most of us care to admit.
To be honest I don't think I'd be arsed to do anything about it.
A killer, sadist, idk? Psychopaths dont have some serial killer blood in them, thats just how media presents them
but you're in the driver of the train , you can't just walk away.
I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high functioning sociopath.
locutus94 I do not understand the difference between the two, but I would watch all 6 of them die.
Arklight I was referencing a television show.
locutus94 Ah I see.
locutus94 What's his name again? Whippersnatch Cabbagepatch?
TheBloodOfGoodman Cucumberbatch
This is Charlie Sheen's best character.
I thought this was Gary Oldman
This is if Charlie Sheen got the part of Dwight from The Office.
LOVE VIOLENT PSYCHOPATHS.
No, I'm a high functioning sociopath. With your number.
haha. So when did you become Sherlock
Nerf CCC Gaming 27 years ago.
a sociopath would enjoy the 5 getting hit in both cases
Says every edgy teenager ever
+johnny llooddte no, a sociopath wouldn't give a fuck who got hit so they wouldn't do anything in either case unless they got something out of it.
If psychopaths lack empathy , why would they bother saving anyone in the first place ?
Pierse Moran exactly thank you
for the thrill of killing the fat guy, or for the praise and rewards from the survivors
Mainly because "psychopathy" is misunderstood and isn't necessarily the stalker killing the camp kids like Friday the 13th, or someone that just wants to watch the world burn. Yes, lacking empathy is a discerning characteristic, but it usually much more subtle than what most people think(which is usually along the lines of the the previously mentioned horror movie). Given a situation such as in the video, most people that are somewhere along the lines of psychopathy can and will easily make the logical choice and not even think twice about it, but they're also not looking to kill more people for a 'thrill', because part of that 'thrill' has roots in empathy that they lack.
He would get a bigger thrill from watching the 5 people get killed.
because he's more rational than emotional. he wouldn't hesitate flicking the switch and being responsible for the death of the fat guy. it does not mean necessarily he's sadistic (that he'd want people dead). he simply lacks empathy for the fat guy
I actually say do nothing with the fat dude. Because I don't want to be charged with murder.
A prefectly rational answer (depending on the laws of the country that you reside in), but an answer that if actually so, shows that you care more about how you feel and the fact that you might go to prison than you care about helping 5 other people to not die (at the expense of one).
Personally I can understand your reasoning (I mean, who'd want serious charges against them, and it is a difficult situation in any case, no?), but that to me it is rather obvious what the ethical and "right" choice would be, and I wonder (just out of interest, without any attempt at chastsizing you or anything) if you have actually thought this through, and if you are sure you could stick by your choice if this situation where to happen for real?
I think of it in terms of "who's left" after the ordeal and which set of people would be more socially acceptable. The ideal scenario would be the fat guy "accidentally" *cough*ttotally pushed*cough* falls and stops the train, and nobody dies on the rails. He'd die, but his family would be all "but he died for a good cause" or something. If I let anyone on the rails die, their families would blame it on me but an "accident" is less dramatic and less likely to be investigated.
A huge difference between the 2 scenarios which he didn’t mention, or at least didn’t fully articulate, was that in the second scenario you’re putting someone who is outside of the situation into the situation. The fat guy was just an observer, then because of your actions he becomes part of the death calculations. In the first one all the people are in the situation to start with. I think this difference is probably as important as the difference between being personal / impersonal.
He slipped.
Taken someone’s life without their permission is very wrong that’s what I would in that position
That is a great explanation. I have had to deal with at least one psyopath in my life. He had no empathy at all. His boldness and desire to hurt people's feelings and positions eventually led to hos downfall.
Sounds more like a sociopath; the boldness being more along the lines or erratic behavior and the 'desire to hurt people' being of easily anger-induced traits. Psychopath would usually put more care/plan into every action to avoid such downfall; as their end goal in every way is self pleasure & success
I remember doing this test in school while learning about psychology. It was the "loved one vs a train car full of strangers" one though. And I remember the way our teacher did it, was keeping it anonymous. So that way only we saw the results that correlated to us, and she felt she could get a more honest answer. She actually coupled it with a lesson on social behaviors and how we will say one thing, and almost convince ourselves of one thing, while truly feeling another. She had noticed in past years, that when it was anonymous, far more people killed the strangers and saved the loved ones. Whilst far more people saved the strangers and killed the loved one when it was public knowledge. I really liked how she ended up using one lesson to teach an entirely other one.
Full stop, I’m saving the loved one over any number of strangers. To do otherwise, would be sort of like sacrificing a precious heirloom in return for a mystery box that’s probably, most likely, full of junk anyway.
@@WizardClipAudio The bonus being the loved one you saved now has to carry the burden of taking their lives, not you!
Then again, you could have brought the loved one back, if you were a REAL wizard!
@@kenmiller2541 My username is a reference to a legend about a poltergeist, and has nothing to do with ‘wizards’, whatsoever, anyway. 😂 💀
The main difference between a loved one and lots of strangers is that you will keep seeing talking and spending time with the loved one while strangers are strangers you may have done a better choice if you save the strangers but you won't (probably) do anything with them and you have killed a loved one which scars you longer than strangers
That question is also from a movie 😂😂 I forgot the movie but it’s about
Psychology and the teacher put the students in different post-apocalyptic scenarios where the students have been giving an economic role for survival
I hate that term "normal people". What makes you normal? The fact that what you do and what you are accepted? The term should be "common". What's normal is what's innate, what's natural. We are all environmentally, socially, and habitat inclined to be exactly what we are.
Born a giant or a midget, hetero or homo, pale or dark; these are all normal things to nature. Our ability to question and refuse nature's calls or instinct is what makes it so hard for us to see eye to eye.
Common. Not, normal.
Normal is the setting on a washing machine.
Luther S.P. I prefer the term neurotypical. Something I use if asked about my sister with autism. Don't know if it is an accepted term, or the correct term for that case, but I feel it better describes more common behaviour rather than classing as normal or abnormal.
Rob Paten I'd say yes, that fit in reference to her. Respectful, which is great and sincere of you.
No one is normal, or perfect. I'm above-average tall, and I won't mind breaking someone's bone if I have to. Even yell in their ear.
Luther S.P. The two words are effectively synonyms. "Normal" is used in this video to refer to the majority. Unfortunately being a midget is not normal, it is rather rare to see one. That being said, saying someone isn't "normal" should not be taken as an insult.
Don't mind me I'm just here looking for edgelords.
fuck you
Ooh found one!
AAproductions and fuck you too!
AAproductions deez nutz
Shadow Realm Priest Oh shit two in one amirite.
but in all honesty I don't have anything against anyone in fuckin with you.
I’m at the opposite end of the continuum from a psychopath. Life can be overwhelming for me; at times, barely livable. I have almost unrelenting anxiety and depression.
But between my current state and psychopathy, I’d choose my current state. It’s because I get to feel love. Psychopaths may not feel emotional pain, but they don’t feel love either.
Not that they mind. If I was a psychopath, I’d probably feel the same way I do now, but in reverse.
Oh you're so pathetically self righteous. Psychopaths are a matter of degrees. You're one, too. I can tell. You don't think your clingy, needy sloth (depression) that preys upon the indulgence of others isn't a form of psychopathy? Albeit a dishonest one. Spiritual vampirism mislabeled as "love"?
I'd flick the switch back n forth. :3
Omfg you just made my day 😂😂😂😂😂
😂😂 LMFAOOO!
+Mack Vongsa then you would kill everyone
+Wataaa! No, the train would fare on the rail that the switch is switched to at the moment. But it could also cause the train to de-rail, killing you and everyone else on the train.
Wellstar that's why I said - kill everyone
Why should I flip the switch? What's in it for me? Do I get some kind of reward, like money?
Exactly.
Sure u think it wouldn’t give u as much guilt. But u would have killed someone either way. If you just divert your mind from the situation your in. It’s like your not even there.
You need help
Melanie Larkins why
EG Loveall because you do not value human life, flipping the switch would be hard and potentially very emotionally scaring but if you think not flipping the switch would bring you less guilt then you’re wrong, you had the opportunity and you let those people die. And if it truly would wound you less then... you need help
Ethan Shaw your right. I guess I would just try to ignore the guilt but it would of probably haunt me till I died. I would do anything to forget it.
damn, im in that part of youtube where every single video in the recommendations looks super interesting, and i have to open another window so i can keep track.
And it always happens late late at night. Middle of the day bored scrolling through trash videos but if it’s 11pm that’s when the good videos start to hit. 😂
O damn. That’s why the teacher was totally focusing on me. He asked the exact same questions. It took me literally 1s to answer them all while my classmates were discussing each question for 10min. I got so annoyed by that, that I kept telling them, that is not hard to decide. From the logical perspective u saved lifes. Guess, I had no inner conflicts.
I‘m not manipulating people or I‘m just not aware of.
gonna help ya, this quizz is bullshit
The real question is : you can either save 4 60 years old people, or save 2 20 years old people.
Now, if you have to think about it, it means you have to think about what would these people might say.
Thus, you no psychopath.
Ofc saving one = saving one, even more when the previous "dilemna" is mathematically the same.
you kill one person you don't know and save five, vs you kill one person you don't know versus five
both cases, if you have common sense, you do the math choices
If there is other criterias involved "family member, friends, ect" then it becomes something else
again, seems like something that is only visible in difference on the brain scans, 99% of 80% of the world will save the 5 people, the 20% others are woke, morons, or both
@@hugom6441 I think im avarage and i would do nothing as it doesnt involve me. Why should i flip the switch. I dont see the reasoning. Ur saying that mathematically u are saving more lives but if u think more about it u would notice that it isn't that simple. U could be killing one average person who could be considered innocent to save a murderer or rapist or what not.
@@Ibrahim-ld9vz It is being rational. You wanna decide on quality of people. But if information about quality isn't available, I think one should go for quantity. Because I think if you have a chance to save lives, you should use that chance. Being indifferent to that is very cowardly/evil...
Plot Twist: The fat guy stops the train with his bare hands.
Thanks to you throwing him over.
Yeah this can happen in Marvel's movies. Fatguy suddenly turns into hulk and try to stop the train with his all power and somehow when the train is 2inch away from the people, it stops. Yo hulk is the hero.
Bruce Wayne Loved this, haha 😄
boring, ....nobody dies.
Then he turns to your ass for throwing him in front of a train.
😂💕
1st Question: Flip the switch, obviously. Although, if you have enough time, move the other person with the group after doing so.
2nd Question: No.
harambe. jpg why not in question two? isn't it exactly the same?
I'm not a psychopath, I'm a sociopath. = )
Case 1: I don't give a shit about if 5 people dies or 1 person dies. Neither are important to me.
Case 2: Again, don't give a shit if one or 5 dies. But I know for certain that people will look at me as a murderer if I pushed the guy over though.
What do you think is the difference between psychopath and sociopath?
One of them likes to derp it to the face, while the other likes to derp it from afar.
Richard Alexander Psychopaths's way of thinking is somewhat justified (like in this video, where their personal and impersonal responses are the same). They will justify their actions by truly believing it to be right. A sociopath just don't give a shit about anyone else but themselves. A sociopath probably would feel no remorse over something that was wrong in other's eyes, whereas psychopaths would simply justify it in their erratic little mind.
DocsDota
I think your descriptions are correct, but I don't believe they distinguish a psychopath from a sociopath. Neither does Wikipedia, which states that the terms are used interchangeably, though sociopath is preferred, to avoid confusing psychopath with psychosis. The term, "psychopath" emphasizes the condition arising in the mind, whereas the term "sociopath" emphasizes the social aspects, but both are considered the same disorder.
So, what should be society's response to someone who is prone to justifying his own behavior, regardless of how unacceptable it might be? I ask, because senior executives are twice as likely to be psychopaths as compared to the general public.
Richard Alexander Society can only respond in what they believe is right and wrong, and that is the legal system. There are thousands of actions done each day that is considered immoral to some, okay to others. The key thing here is to not take matters into your own hands or chaos and conflicts arises. At the end of the day, just think about what is most important to you.
How are the two versions of the trolley problem ANY different?
It's the same result in both.
he's dumb;
but classically, in one case you push a lever to change the rails' switch from a direction toward five people to a direction with only one person ( *tied,* traditionally) there;
in the second case, you have to lift and push a human with your own hands, which apparently is supposed to make the choice harder (psychologically at least, maybe philosophically) for people.
But "ethics" of emergencies are stupid. That's not what life is about. It's ethics for _normal_ daily life people really need. Using emergencies as a starting point is destroying humanity. (Ayn Rand described well why in her essay "The Ethics of Emergencies")
But you have to remember that in the first scenario , switching the lever will make you kill someone , but if you just left the train to kill the five persons then you've killed no one
But you could have save them by just moving a lever. You deliberatly decided to not give a fuzz about the dead of 5 people. And not because you wanted to save the other 1, but just because you didn't care.
Maybe that's the half-way between normal and psycopath.
Kinda true, yourelike involved bc you have the power there.
@@jdperdomo "save them" yeah sure and then the police arrive and you get charged with murder.
@@stanleystove You are selfish and lack empathy. When you do something true, you don't care about if the world is against you. In this case, if you saved lives, at least tried to do something good with your power, you don't care about illogical outside world (here being police who lacks logic and unable to judge a situation) because you know you didn't betray yourself/your morals. Idk how real laws would work (maybe I would still be charged even after analysis), but again I wouldn't care. Important thing for me is altering the course of action for good instead of being a careless evil with rotten morals!
@@jdperdomoThe assumption that saving five by killing one is questionable. It rests on a further assumption that the value of one life can be calculated. These moral experiments are not meant to derive truths about morality but to find out how people might react or how moral thinking might function. Ultimately they fail to answer the proposed test because people probably would act differently in real situations and other motivating factors would influence decisions the biggest flaw of the experiment is that it starts out with the assumption that it is better to save five than one. Once that expectation seizes the mind it will direct decisions. My personal guess would that normal people would by so emotional that the experimental thinking pattern would not emerge. They wont even think about killing the guy. Moral decisions are based on emotions and the idea of pitting one live against five is a formulation calling a logical function in the brain your brain will allow logical thinking because you understand it is a theoretical scenario. That is why you get people flipping switches. Also- the brainscans do not prove a thing because any of a number of alternative explanations for the data can be offered.
OH I know I'm crazy.....
Well, the interesting thing is that if you understand psychopathy, you also understand that a true psychopath behaves in a very rational manner, and is hardly what most people would call "crazy." Your textbook psychopath lacks empathy or remorse, but that hardly makes them irrational. Rather, they are unable to see the benefit of group social dynamics, and completely (or almost completely) lack empathy. In any given scenario, they will serve only their own short-term needs and desires, and see no need either to care about others, or to worry about the long term effects of their actions on others or even themselves. Psychopaths are perfectly rational...but also very self-serving and short-sighted.
Mishalex me
Calcifer sure
+Calcifer Granted. It is a gross oversimplification, but for the purposes of profiling, it is generally adequate. But you are correct. A psychopath is certainly capable of detailed, long-term planning. I didn't mean to say otherwise. What I meant was that basic individual wants, needs, and desires seem to dominate the thinking of the majority of people diagnosed as psychopaths, and generally speaking, focusing only on these goals is rather short-sighted in my view. That's not to say there aren't plenty of non-psychopaths that think similarly, and it also isn't to say that psychopaths can't enact elaborate, long-term plans.
Mishalex ya
You know, when he gave the second dilemma, I was thinking along the lines of "Will my physical strength be enough to heave the person onto the train tracks?"or "Will the person fight back?". I think I may be a psychopath.
I would push the stranger to save the other five people.......if there was absolutely no other way to save them. Five people are more than one,
so in sheer numbers, I'd do as much good as possible in this situation.
The reason why this doesn't make me a psychopath is that I would never forgive myself for having sacrificed that one person.
I'd have to live with feelings of remorse and guilt that even the knowledge of having rescued five people couldn't alleviate.
But at the same time, I'd know I did the right thing.
Let's make the question a bit more interesting: If you could push a complete stranger in front of a moving train to save five convicted killers, would you do it?
They may be killers, but they're also people. So what's morally right?
Yes, video on the internet, please tell me my psychiatric health.
I immediately thought of throwing the guy off the bridge, and when he said that psychopaths have no trouble deciding to throw him off, I got freaked out, lol
I thought of that too, but then realized that there was no way I could throw the dude off and decided not to. Then again I also decided to kill the five people because it's no fun to die alone and somebody's gonna die anyway
If I push the fat guy I've legally committed murder, that might have something to do with why I don't want to push him, because I don't want to go to jail. Does psychopaths not mind going to jail? Also, how do I know pushing the fat guy would slow down the train so that it wouldn't kill the others? It seems impossible to arrive at such a conclusion with 100% certainty in the heat of the moment. I am not the master of practical physics and cannot possibly know if sacrificing the fat guy will save the others.
There's also the problem of justice, the people who are on the track have obviously been behaving recklessly, otherwise they would not be on the track in the first place, while the fat guy has done nothing to deserve being pushed to his death. So they "deserve" it more than he does. There's a lot more going on here than Mr Dutton lets on.
*****
No you are not. Those are two completely different scenarios to the law.
***** regardless you will still be killing an innocent so both ways are incorrect...would you want someone to sacrifice you for five other people? Of course not...let it be the Queen or even the prime minister...you wouldn't dare...that's how much we value our lives... also if we wanted to be the 'hero' or savoir...why not sacrifice yourself or just seek help....things like that distinguishes between a emotionless human and a 'normal' human...one who knows justice and has sympathy...so no human being has the power to decide some ones fate...that is immoral. Imagine if that was you
P.S- I know this is scenarios...this is to the slow minds out there :)...so you won't be in a state of confusion...generous lass, aren't I?
how does the fat guy stop the train? he eats it!
I agree 100%
Justice? How do you know the reason those people are on the track? What if they've been tied up? What if they were engineers working? What if someone was trying to commit suicide and others jumped on the track to save the deranged person?
flicking the switch and killing the guy on the safe track is murder, not doing anything is an accident.
Not flicking the switch when you could have easily done so is murder.
I just spent the entirety of this video screaming at my grandmother's ashes. Did I pass?
Never trust a man with a complicated hairstyle like this. The trendy eye ware makes me even more skeptical
Ha, ha. Oh, there's some empirical study behind this knowledge! :)
MULTI-TRACK DRIFTING!!
DEJA VU I HAVE BEEN IN THIS PLACE BEFORE!
The scenario changes but the goal stays the same
The correct answer:
Turn a blind eye...
If you risk sacrificing one to save 5 you’ll be judged for sacrificing 1...
humans love to judge.
If you attempt to push the stranger onto the tracks you might be over powered and have your life put at risk.
Turn a blind eye, walk away and let the stranger deal with the situation.
No one is the wiser and your life will have no repercussions and continue as normal.
Complete agree.... But I'd have to watch the carnage while walking away..... It's not every day u get to see that type of stuff.
L D to be honest in my line of work I make difficult decisions every day. This decision would be easy, it’s not my line of work and I definitely wouldn’t profit from it. In life we have to to move forward with decisions that suit our needs and that help us to benefit. This risk is not beneficial or rewarding. Just my point of view.
@@ld6056 If I were the person on the other tracks, I don't care if you're the type of person who makes difficult decisions, I would not appreciate you hitting the switch when you don't even know me and had no right to choose for me to die. You can call people "weak" if they stay back and refuse responsibility in this scenario, but at least they're not actively committing murder.
I wouldn't push the guy over the bridge, not out of emotions for the stranger, but because of him not having to do anything with the train. The people on the train chose to be in the train, and they chose to take the risks that come with travelling by train (Despite the extremely unlikely case, it's still a possibility). Hence I would not push the man over the bridge, because he has nothing to do with their choice; they should face the consequences of their choices themselves. Just a rational approach right? Don't think I'm a psychopath, but I ain't that emotional over throwing a stranger off a bridge.
Don't think you quite understand my comment.
Nevermind, I mishead the 'and it's gonna plow into 5 people', I'm not english and didn't hear the word 'plow' yet. Anyways... push the guy.
Apparently I'm a psychopath. Good to know, that explains my thoughts.
Surely a real psychopath would do nothing and watch all the people die for his entertainment
Quite possibly.Everything a psychopath does good or bad,is purely instrumental to their own aims.
No they’d want the recognition
Wouldn’t a psychopath want to kill someone? Like actually take part in killing the fat stranger?
@@mollyswain478
It depends.
Think of Psychopaths as just like anyone else, but with a few very important exceptions, they only care about themselves (sometimes there are very rare exceptions for immediate family or close friends, but they are very rare and usually not that deep), they lack a conscience or remorse, and they have no moral limitations.
That's it. They still have emotions (although almost completely centered around themselves). They can still feel fear (although reduced reaction to fear is common among Psychopaths).
So a psychopath will do basically whatever they want as long as they can get away with it and sometimes even if they can't get away with it. Not all psychopaths are murders and many of them are not even violent. However, they are not violent because they get no pleasure out of violence and/or because violence is counter-productive to get what they want.
To think like a Psychopath, just imagine if you only cared about yourself and you focused all your efforts into getting what you want regardless of the consequences to others. You might like power or money or sex or romance (purely to have someone pay attention to you, not any real type of bonding) or play mind games with other people or enjoy the suffering of others.
well if they die, it's not my problem
Apparently I'm a psychopath
+Gowri Rsp same here
+Gowri Rsp yea :l i dont think this is accurate
+vaLy H. Chill buddy I was kidding. What kind of a shit psychopath announces they are one?
The kind of psychopath that announces just to ask "What kind of a shit psychopath announces they are one?" and pretend he isn't one
+Sílvio Oliveira
Well then kudos to me, love.
Either way you're killing someone. Flip a switch or push someone, to me neither choice is really impersonal. So I'd just let the train kill the five people, I didn't put them on the tracks so it's not my concern and i cant be blamed of be held responsible for anything.
samw
yup exactly my thought, i wouldn't do anything in those situations
You would do nothing and let five people die without feeling guilt or any kind of responsibility? In this case scenario doing nothing = killing five people, even though nobody is going to directly blame you for "doing nothing".
Like he said before, you are not the one who put 5 five people on the rail so you can't feel guilty for letting them die, if you decide to pull the switch you will be the one who killed that 1 guy
don't spoil the video... would u pls...
Physics student's take on the issue:
If the fat guy is able to instantly stop the train, then the train and everyone inside it experience 200+ g's of acceleration, which would probably kill them instantly. I would rather not kill all passengers on board.
If the fat guy is fat enough to stop the train, I probably can't throw him over the bridge. In any case, fat man lives.
I think you forget that humans are extremely squishy, and would stop the train over a period of time as the initial weight and then the destruction of the body would get into the wheels. Also you can't assume the train is going super fast.
By getting involved it makes you a murderer rather than a bystander. It comes down to whether you can live with yourself easier having not intervened at all 🤔
Agreed 👍
For me it's not about that but rather who are we to make this choice? We will never have to make any choice remotely like this because every aspect is nonsensical. They could have created a realistic scenario.
I like donuts...
Pretty sure I'm a psychopath.
donupath
911 call the policeeeeeee
You make Homer Simpson look like a choir boy.
Eddie M liking food makes you a fat ass? Okay
But i thought the planet is a donut that means im a psychopath
If that large stranger can block the train's way and make it stop, how am i going to push him/ heave him in the first place
who's to say the pusher doesn't have a car jack and a wedge on him to angle fat stranger out the window?
If he were to edging off a platform, I am almost certain that such an imbalance in mass would make it rather simple to do so.
Lmao
Am i the only one who let the five die in both
JWeavile no. Why would you let them die? If you answer that it wouldn't benefit you in some way.. True psycho.
Burt Gummer, i just feel like id have more guilt if i flicked the switch to impact someone’s death than if i just let those people die because i can justify the decision in my head.
JWeavile feeling guilt. Is that something that you feel often? Especially from things that have nothing to do with you ?
I personally feel guilt over just about everything and anything.
Burt Gummer it’s not that I wouldn’t feel guilt, its that id feel more of i flicked the switch to kill a guy than to do nothing and five guys die. Naturally id have guilt because I would have stood by while five guys die, but i feel like it would be less guilt than flicking the switch.
Burt Gummer i chose not to do anything at all. it's not a condition that i caused, and at the cost of another's life, i would just let it take its original course
i mean what kind of question is this? you have no right to decide which one gets to live. though i see and understand the appeal of having such control over lives, in that scenario you dont have any right to decide which one gets to live and which one gets to die.
What's sick is that people think it's any different. That taking a life is less of a decision or less awful cuz ur just flicking a switch. People should be equally distraught (or not) over both scenarios. At least the psychopath is treating them equally.
I’ve trained myself through reflection to over-step that erroneous circuitry so that I am more prepared in the moment to do what needs to be done. I wonder how that effects the emotional functioning of the brain in other areas of life.
I have always disliked the train track analogy because it seems too simplistic to account for the differences between average people and psychopaths. I, personally, would find it no easier, on a logical OR emotional level, to kill one person than to kill five people. Even if only one person dies, and I am the one who causes that death, I will feel intense guilt and sadness and my conscience will be forever tarnished.
I understand the concept that psychopaths don't process emotions the same way that a typical person does. What I don't understand is, how in the first version of the scenario (the one where you flick the switch to change the path of the train), not seeing the person/people you choose to kill makes it automatically easier to kill them. To me, it would be just as difficult to kill someone whether or not I saw them. I just find the whole exercise very troubling.
_"What I don't understand is, how in the first version of the scenario (the one where you flick the switch to change the path of the train), not seeing the person/people you choose to kill makes it automatically easier to kill them."_
Well, the point of the train track analogy is to demonstrate that there in fact is a qualitative difference in how humans process the scenarios, not necessarily produce a rational justification for the process, but it's likely related to either you initiating physical force against an uninvolved 3rd party or fear of punishment.
_"To me, it would be just as difficult to kill someone whether or not I saw them. I just find the whole exercise very troubling."_
Well, to me, it wouldn't. I would maximize the number of people saved and consider it a moral duty to do so. I think you'll find that it's just a question of the number of people involved even for you. Would you kill one to save 1 billion? Is that even something you have to think about? Regardless of what my feelings would be with regards to killing the 1 guy, I'd be morally compelled to take the action.
This isn't because I'm unable to feel empathy or have dysfunctional emotional processing either. This test doesn't really measure the absence of either. Rather, it measures where you lie on the ends-means axis of the moral spectrum. While it may be true that all psychopaths will end up pushing the fat guy, not everyone who will push the fat guy are psychopaths.
IrishEyes1989 I had an evil grin on my face thinking about those 5 people exploding into a cloud of blood. Then I read someone's comment on the second scenario where all 6 people died and was like "Holy fuck yes". It was basically wait till the train has passed, and then still push the fat guy.
JaiFlame The people weren't just standing there. They were tied down to the tracks.
The research on psychopathy is pretty static at the moment, there is much more to the mindset than what has been concluded already. I'd like to see psychologists delve further into it other than hide behind what's already been done.
Not a psychologist. But I have experienced such things and "dug deeper".
Trust me, some stuff is better left unknown.
You don't wanna know.
@@specialtwice4975now I am more intrested in it. What is it? Could you just give me some hints or something to search for them on my one.
I was the only person in my class who when asked about their answer to the trolley problem, answered with, “I would let the train kill 5 people because my action would likely be seen by law enforcement as causing death, and I don’t want to go to prison.”
Yes, I have been diagnosed with sociopathic tendancies and NPD.
Are you fine now ?
Gay
@@dolphins_and_manatees5960 fax
@@Ghadi___99 Improved in my level of empathy yea
@@Robisquick glad to hear that ,take care
I wouldn't push him, but only because I wouldn't want to (potentially) go to prison for it.
You are selfish.
Ryan Clark Which is a good thing.
there will be no witnesses, what are cops doing randomly at the bridge? they aren't. and the 5 people aren't going to see they are tied down, and the fat guy is going to die.
CodeDarkBlue Your comment suggests that you are on Level 1.1 of Lawrence Kohlberg's stages of moral development, which would be typical for young children.
Pikaman finger prints and people you don't know were there
To me there is no difference between 1 and 2
Except you might be convicted for murder in the second one.
Or manslaughter in the first.
Lunjoc There's still always a risk if you push someone off a bridge and into a train
Both actions will kill people with our effort.. I would choose not to do anything
realy wow.
i could never kill the guy in nr.2
i would try to trow a shoe or somthing at the train, but i would not be able to kill him, but in the first one i would change the track
What does it mean for the person who decides to simply do nothing, and walk away from the situation?
Ultimately, that you either do not value human life, or are a coward. Refusing to make a decision can be viewed from the same lens are specifically deciding to let the five people die.
On the other hand, hesitating too long is different. Someone can hesitate and not be a coward or a complete psychopath (as opposed to the partial psychopath who saves lives without hesitation). It's possible to refuse to make a decision as rationalize it as being "too difficult", but someone who simply cannot-as in lacks the training to-for themselves to make a decision is not doing that.
MrCharles7994 Or the third reason is that you are an existentialist and you value human life and are not a coward, but you know you did not cause the event to take place and it is not your place to flip the switch. What if you flipped the switch to save the five people, but the one guy who died instead was about to find the cure for cancer? Then you would have saved 5 lives at the price of millions...that is why I would have walked away anyway.
Hrollief1 I like your reasoning.
Hrollief1 Nonsensical reasoning is still nonsensical. Without knowing them, it is equally likely that any of those five would develop the cure to cancer. By choosing not to kill the one, you have not only killed a net of four, but decreased the chance of cancer being cured by an even larger number than if you had killed that man.
That was a simple rationalization, a cute little reason you feel is justified by philosophy, but doesen't actually absolve you of any responsibility to make a decision. There is no logical reason to value this one mans life above the other five, so you should sacrifice him to save them.
It could be the wrong decision for a variety of reasons, but there is no evidence that this is true. The fact that there are consequences-very real ones-does not change this. It merely raises the stakes to the point where your particular brand of *incredible, despicable cowardice* is *easy*.
In fact, hiding behind a philosophy to justify your actions, to rationalize away the choice you have to make, is even more cowardly than simply walking away because you to scared to make the decision. Not only is that fear still there, but you cannot even admit that it is; you must run from that as well, hiding behind the name of your quasi-religious philosophy.
There are, in fact, good reasons to choose to spare the man in this particular situation. But hiding behind anything that ignores the decision or rationalizes away the power you have to deal with it is not one of them.
MrCharles7994
The thing is the train is already headed in the direction of the 5 people and by pulling the switch you'd be killing someone. I wasn't responsible for this situation and by pulling the switch I'd be killing someone who wasn't supposed to die. Granted none of them deserve to die but it's not up to me to decide who does and doesn't die.
I said out loud when he said the 2nd scenario, "it's the same question. Push the guy over" then he proceeded to explain how that is the psychopath answer....
too fucking high for this
lmfaooooo
exactly lol
haha
HAHAHAAHAHAHA
same lol
Pushing someone in front of a train is life in prison for murder, not worth it.
This is exactly what I was thinking lol
ur an idiot it saves 5 more lives
it wasn't even a hard decision
Even if you save all the world's lifes. It still a crime punished by life sentence in prison. I think we call that MORALITY and ETHICS
TheMagrhino you're an idiot it doesn't matter how "many" people you kill you intentionally diverted the train onto the one person to save 5 lives and thus that is called murder. If you just allow the train hurtle down the tracks onto the people who were dumb enough to be standing in the way in the first place.
And as for the fat person dilemma I wouldn't want guts spraying into my face
you are too emotional involve in the situation, you must just calculate the number saved vs the number loss
So I'm a diagnosed psychopath and when I got diagnosed I bought Kevin Duttons book which really helped me! Now I'm obsessed w the topic and psychology in general and want to become a psychologist one day! Kevin Dutton is such an inspiration!!
How did you get diagnosed? :)
@@berriepieql he self diagnosed lol
😬 please no 😵🤪
You cant be diagnosed as a psychopath lol
@@nawa2396 most likely.
If you're worried or nervous about being a psychopath then you're not a psychopath
I didn't hesitate on either answer so I'm either decisive under pressure or a psychopath? Hahaha
This guy kinda sounds like a psychopath
leftyfourguns looks*
+Kasey Escape Smells*
+Viktir Von Slapatroll *tastes?
+Liam Timbrell Feels????
Drako Spangler is?
I love how, instead of actually looking at the ethical and psychological issues of the problem, everyone here is criticising the mechanics of the situation.
I would potentially disagree with this analysis. It may simply be that psychopaths do not care at all unless it is in their interest. They may rationally calculate all decisions but it does not mean they would choose the option that saves the most lives in either case. You have provided no behavioural data that shows a prediliction for compassion at all. I think the framing of this is meaningless at best, and probably misleading, without data on what they would choose. I'm a neuroscientist.
Quentin Tarantino looks good in glasses!
No
😃
Don't use the lord's name in vain
Good eye, I thought it was Dr Phil.
Plot twist
The fat guy eats the train
Oh
Just like the gigantic worm from spomebob
pig god
Vincente Rey Alaskan bull worm
Plot twist you are the fat guy
step one: flick switch. step: push the one person off the track. step three: EVERYBODY WINS!
Seems Jethro Tull was right
“Don’t want to be a fat man”
i think you're mixing rational with phycopath. and this isnt a test
He never said it was a test. He's just stating an example of action, so it's easier to visualize. Even if the example is not factual, the aim is to give you an idea of what he's saying.
Hahaha, I think itgives the more 'mad genius' look, or so they intended it to be lol =))) But the title really is misleading, they should've chosen a better one. The content is thankfully not so off the track.
gotta admit that would be kind of funny to see a fat person stop a train
your a pyschopath
i know right
It would probably be interesting in any case....probably until gore happens and/or empathy kicks in anyway.
DoglinsShadow umm that wouldn't be funny at all
Awsome4649 *you're
The only thing I could think about scenario no. 2 is that I'm not physically strong enough to push a big fat guy over some railing and to his death, especially if they're resisting. What are my results?
+Cadence X (Silvan Leviath Psyche) The fat guy chucks you over instead. ?
The RPLoC
That wouldn't stop the train, tho... wait..., it's becoming so clear now... it's the fat guy that's the psychopath, of course! xD
Cadence X OF COURSE! How could not have already grasped this knowledge! He was blatantly telling it to our faces!...Come on mason, remember the numbers.
The RPLoC
How could we have been so blind...
Inquisitive Lady
Can you link me?
I would always let the individual live. In all cases I assume the group on the track is there because they aren't individuals and are just followers. Seriously, how the hell could five people get themselves in such a bad situation?
"Would you push him over?"
Yes- Without a second thought... Wait, what!
In most countries, they will prosecute you for killing someone - ignoring the benefits. Should you decide to call 911 and they arrive too late, you'll most likely be held responsible for failure to render assistance. I for one would just walk away - sorry.
I would of let the 5 people get ran over and then push the "big" guy over and watch his body get mangled by a 200mph train for pleasure
for me it all depends how important those peoples life are and whose more important
that's a cop out, all the people are of equal value.
+SpecialHandlingUnit no not everyone is important only a few are people that can change the future should be top priority especially the good ones
+SpecialHandlingUnit here let me give u a example lets say the 3-5 on the tracks where ur family members and the 1 alone is a person that can cure aids will u flip the switch to kill 1 or the 3-5
jason forbes that's a different question, you can add and take away from the original question if you like but it doesn't answer the original question, in fact your scenario is a common add on to the original question but it wasn't posed this time.
You didn't answer the question, I don't mind your add on, all is well. Bye.
+SpecialHandlingUnit if i dont know anyone on the track why should i even care i wont flick the switch and i wont push the person cause neither one will change my life
If you still monitor this, sir, I ask: what would your thoughts be if a person aware of the circumstances simply did nothing to interfere in these situations?
I wonder what it means if you experience an equal moral dilemma for both scenarios, but rather than the first being an easy choice and the second hard, you just find both choices equally hard?
I did too and was searching for this comment. Glad to know I'm not alone in it.
Same. It means you are the best kind of individual, an empathic philosopher ;)
@@CobraDove1111 Love that word!
My first answer to the 2nd question was: I'll throw myself over, it will save 6 people.
you are a very good human than
If you consider that as an option, then pushing the fat person would also save 6 people: the five people in the train, plus yourself.
it would save 5 people the stranger was never in danger.
Sounds like you need to lose weight.
That wasn't an option in the question; the reason the other person can stop the train is because they are very large, The question assume you wouldn't have the size to stop the train and therefore you throwing yourself in front of the train isn't even worth mentioning. When i first heard this situation a few years ago in an online lecture, my first question was "can i ask the other person to do it themselves so they have a choice in the matter?". I think that is the more appropriate response given the terms of the dilemma they laid out.
0:45
I'd leave the switch halfway through a "proper flick," thus derailing the train and killing everyone on it, then leave the six people trapped on the tracks to starve.
*I think i made the right choice.*
Genius
watch out everyone, we got a savage here.
Me too
I would not flick the first switch even though it would save 3 lives more because it means my action indirectly killed the person on the other line. I would do it only if he agrees.
I would not flick the second switch too for the same reason. I want to be a hero but not at the expense of others
I would do nothing in either case.
For case 2 I think "would I be charged with murder by physically pushing a man to his death to save 5 people? Is it worth being charged with murder, or should I just stay out of the way?".
The reason my reaction in the second situation is different is because there are different options. In the first it's either kill 1 or 5, in the second it's I kill no one or I kill 1 person to save many.
If you don't touch the lever your also killing no one.
The difference for me is the 1 or 5 people were going to inevitably die. The guy on the cliff wasn't.
But yes if I don't touch the lever I won't kill anyone technically but I would feel guilty if it hit the 5 because I could've caused a better outcome.
BuFufilms
It seems the same to me, if you don't push the guy you could have had a better outcome by saving the 5 cause either 1 or 5 will die inevitable in both cases.
If you are bound to the rails your "fate" (for lack of a better term) is sealed. If you are chilling on a cliff your fate is not sealed. If I kill the guy on the cliff that blood is on my hands when I pull the lever to kill 1 person that blood is on the person that bound them there.
BuFufilms
So if the scenario was say the railroad guys just got stuck in the mud while walking and its nobody's fault then it would be different? Cause the 5 guys on the road their fate is also sealed in a sense, unless you intervene to save them by killing the dude. The dude tied on the railroad would live just like the dude on the bridge if you refuse to pull the lever. Only difference to me is one feels more personal so your more likely to think carefully first, kinda like killing someone in combat vs getting a drone to do it.
No for both.
I would not like blood on my hands.
And for the people saying:
Well you would have blood because you could have saved them!
No.
Why?
I didn't tie them up there.
I don't drive the train
1. Yes. With slight hesitation.
2. No. I just can't kill a man like that. I would forever feel guilty but I couldn't do it.
Why yes and no they are both the same situation. Instead of pushing a man to his death you are pushing a lever to his death.
+Thomaslawlet Becusee I that man doesn't have to die. He can live. With the other one its either or. With the second one I am killing a man, I am ending his life, I am pushing him to his death, he could have lived, I have robbed him of all of his potential just as I have robbed those five people of their potential and lives. Did you watch the video? The man describes it very well.
+Lunjoc +Lunjoc +Lunjoc WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU?? The world does not revolve around money!! I don't care if he owes me money!! I don't care if I get free stuff!! People are PEOPLE. They have souls, they have minds, they have potential. You must be some sort of physcopath.
+Lunjoc I never said it was evil. It's just selfish.
Same answer different motives.
1. Yes, I'll pull the switch to save more lives.
2. No. Because I don't want to be convicted with murder.
pushing a fat guy to save more lives ? why? that's murder.
those people shouldnt't be on the tracks and should assume their consequences.
I am not doing anything and let the thing happening.
What if they were trapped on it like those old school villains did. Tie them up on a train track.
Pussy
+Silver Spoon Well then in that situation you should take no action. But in this situation it's people who aren't bad.
I haven't pushed people before
Well, to be honest, i would really push the fat dude (based upon that all 6 people involved are random people i've never met). It's plain simple thinking if you consider it worse just because you are the one initiating the action, doing nothing can be just as harmfull to others and you, if not more.
What the fuck is this where the train meme came from
Not this exact video but the concept in general yes.
psychology*
Canta Per Me I think its the one with the vegan and the feminist.
"Sad story today...seven people died on the railroad tracks this afternoon."
"One was pushed over a cliff to his death, landing by the tracks, five people were ran over by the train, and the seventh was mysteriously suffocated while tied to a fork in the track."
Did I pass.
No you didn't just pass you're the topper get your prize soon 👍