Opening Closed Guard, the History of BJJ with World Champion Robert Drysdale
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- Опубликовано: 14 окт 2024
- Multiple time world champion Robert Drysdale came onto my podcast (The Strenuous Life Podcast) to share the discoveries he's made about the history of BJJ. Here's just some of what we talked about...
00:52 - Opening Closed Guard, the Book
06:16 - The first japanese martial artists in Brazil
16:51 - Who was Mitsyuo Maeda?
19:27 - The role of the circus in the development of BJJ
23:20 - Early lineages of jiu-jitsu in Brazil
31:02 - The development and role of Vale Tudo fighting
33:08 - Why jiu-jitsu became so ground oriented
43:41 - George Gracie
45:47 - Helio's early fights
47:58 - The period of decline in jiu-jitsu
52:36 - BJJ andmarks between the 1950's and 1990's
1:02:26 - The role of jiu-jitsu federations
1:09:07 - Effects of legalizing heel hooks
1:15:16 - BJJ in the Olympics
You can find this interview in audio-only format by looking for episode 296 of The Strenuous Life Podcast on any of the podcasting platforms, including the ones below...
The Strenuous Life on Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple...
The Strenuous Life on Google Podcasts: podcasts.googl...
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The Strenuous Life on Stitcher: www.stitcher.c...
Cheers,
Stephan Kesting 
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Also, the fact that you guys mentioned Howard Zinn within the first five minutes makes me like both of you so much
That's why I called the audio-only version of this episode "A People's History of BJJ" on The Strenuous Life Podcast!!
They've seen Good Will Hunting. lol.
just ordered the book CANT WAIT!
After samurai collapsed, ju jtsu went underground. It was eventually labelled as low class thing etc. Kano was smart and a lover of the art. He knew he had to adapt it and turn it into a upper class thing again. That's exactly what he did modified structured it and the rest is history.
A little history from Brazil. There were many Japanese teaching ju jitsu in Brazil and all over the world at the time. Some raising the flag of ju jitsu, some straight from kodokan dojo. The Gracies didn’t want to fall under kodokan umbrella and their structure. The Gracies had their own vision and needed the freedom to do whatever they wanted. Also, they were using and training Ju Jitsu preserving the martial art aspect of it and not as much as a sport. Just like many other Japanese teaching in Brazil at the time, the Gracies were teaching ju jitsu and marketing themselves as a jiu jitsu, fighters and teachers just like all the others Japanese fighter that were in Brazil promoting and marketing themselves as ju jitsu fighters and teachers as well and not promoting the kodokan from Japan. Of course some Japanese were promoting the kodokan as well. It’s very simple.
Ju Jitsu became Kano ju jitsu that became kodokan judo. This linage is the most important. All the modern sports like BJJ, sambo, Olympic judo, submission wrestling are all amazing branches from the same tree. Again they are all different sports from the same art.
When gracies took it to US they patented Gracie jiu jitsu. In Brazil it was always called Jiu-Jitsu only. With the growth of Jiu jitud a competition scene of the sport jiu jitsu started growing in Brazil. Because of the refinement of the techniques and growth of the new sport, many gyms were opening everywhere. People were getting promoted and opening new gyms or “business” all over the world. In the US the same thing started to happen. People were migrating to teach the art after the boom from the UFC. So with the money opportunities in the US many people wanted to teach jiu jitsu but didn’t want to pay to use the Gracie name. As the American scene evolved and grew there was a need to create a federation and for marketing purposes, the “ Brazilian “ jiu jitsu federation was created. The Brazilian was to show that it was the same art from the Gracies without any legal trademark problems.
Peace ✌🏻 and please go train both modern BJJ + modern judo = real ju jitsu
Best of both worlds. Respect both sports because it is the same art. Respect all the pioneers that paved the way on both sides. Because of each person involved we today have all these greatness of grappling around. Osu !
this is a great interview and cant wait for the movie
the real history will be great for people to learn
Stoked to get Drysdale's book...great episode!
Regarding a point you make at around 1:05, the multiplicity of rule sets jiu-jitsu athletes can compete in may actually be one of its strengths. Obviously, there are negatives in terms of market share, but it means that the sport has space for everyone from hobbyists to the more hardcore. It also means that athletes have to learn a kind of bigger idea of what grappling is, and then focus that for each rule set, rather than potentially just learning a strategy for winning in one format that may not help elsewhere. Arguably, one of the worst things to happen to Judo has been the status of the IJF as the one true Olympic federation, meaning that a progressively altered sport can't be countered as well by others who wish to go off and do whatever they see as 'real judo'. Something similar can be seen in fencing, where HEMA, classical fencing or whatever doesn't have quite the ubiquity, because the Olympic governing body is 'the' governing body, in spite of many fencers I've met thinking that the current rule set is quite flawed.
1:06:35
Do an audible version of the book please and thank you.
Yes please!
Is there any more information out there about Sada Miyako? I am intrigued by the story of him being possibly one of the first Japanese jujutsu people to come to Brazil. I would also love to learn more about this Mario Alexis character?
These viewership numbers don’t add up. Stephan has 320,000 subscribers but only 3500 people watched this? 1% of his subscribers? I’m a big fan of this channel because I love Jiu Jitsu/grappling as I imagine the vast majority of that 320k are. For everyone who has heard the BJJ origin story as told by the Gracies, this is a MUST WATCH.
Waldemar Santana and Ivan Gomes Two True Great Fighters
Is drysdale film ever going to come out,its been well over a year late now.
I'm Brazilian 🇧🇷 and somehow had not heard of Drysdale, and took me some time to realize he's Brazilian and american. I noticed he's Portuguese was way too good for a second language.
On the japanese - Brazil issue. I would just like to add that Brazil has the largest japanese population outside of Japan!
Just bought his book, cheers!
Where can I watch the doc? I can’t find it anywhere
Great interview but Jesus why so many ads?!!
I guess it's youtube's fault. I just watched a recorded live stream in other channel and it was full of ads as well.
No disrespect but if you are listening to this on your computer (not on your phone), you should use an adblocker for your browser. They are available for both Firefox and Chrome. I haven't seen/heard an ad on youtube in almost 10 years.
This video literally has more ads then there are Gracies. Keep up the "great" work RUclips.
Oooooh, this is going to be good.
One does not simply open the closed guard,
Nobody should ever open your closed guard....you open your guard and ONLY YOU
Did the movie ever come out?
I can't wait until this movie finally comes out. Really shows that reality of BJJ and it's not a Gracie invention, it's a baby of Judo and the Gracies are hiding from it.
I love BJJ🥰🥰
Drysdsle’s hypothesis about the Gracies trying to find a rule set they can win is more complicated than what Helio Gracie actually said, which is that rules and throws don’t end fights. Submissions do. That hypothesis also explains why they would stick with it through the decades when it felt like a lost cause. They didn’t care about points or throws, but winning fights. I totally agree with Drysdale that there was plenty of exaggeration and lying AKA marketing in Carlos and Helio’s game, but this part I think he’s too cynical on. The Gracie account actually explains the evidence better.
Finishing a fight is a justification but what was the underlying motivation? They wanted to spread jiu jitsu and if you are losing on points to throws etc then people will find your art as less effective and it won't become popular. Jiu Jitsu spread around the world post 1993 because we saw how effective it is. The early Japanese judokas discovered this themselves which is probably why judo/jiu jitsu failed in the US in the early 1900s. The judokas found throwing bigger stronger wrestlers to be difficult. These are people trying to make a living with challe ge matches and you can't make money when you are losing. The logical result was the fight must take place on the ground where the judokas are at an advantage, preferably in a gi, and likely from the bottom position. By the time Carlos is taught the art in the late 1910s and later Helio, this style and underlying philosophy has already been developed but I believe the underlying reason was the early judokas were losing to bigger stronger wrestlers and the interest/money quickly fades.
He treats newspapers with too much respect. They are no more accurate than any other contemporary written record, and oral history can’t be discounted but should be cross referenced with other oral traditions
After samurai collapsed, ju jtsu went underground. It was eventually labelled as low class thing etc. Kano was smart and a lover of the art. He knew he had to adapt it and turn it into a upper class thing again. That's exactly what he did modified structured it and the rest is history.
A little history from Brazil. There were many Japanese teaching ju jitsu in Brazil and all over the world at the time. Some raising the flag of ju jitsu, some straight from kodokan dojo. The Gracies didn’t want to fall under kodokan umbrella and their structure. The Gracies had their own vision and needed the freedom to do whatever they wanted. Also, they were using and training Ju Jitsu preserving the martial art aspect of it and not as much as a sport. Just like many other Japanese teaching in Brazil at the time, the Gracies were teaching ju jitsu and marketing themselves as a jiu jitsu, fighters and teachers just like all the others Japanese fighter that were in Brazil promoting and marketing themselves as ju jitsu fighters and teachers as well and not promoting the kodokan from Japan. Of course some Japanese were promoting the kodokan as well. It’s very simple.
Ju Jitsu became Kano ju jitsu that became kodokan judo. This linage is the most important. All the modern sports like BJJ, sambo, Olympic judo, submission wrestling are all amazing branches from the same tree. Again they are all different sports from the same art.
When gracies took it to US they patented Gracie jiu jitsu. In Brazil it was always called Jiu-Jitsu only. With the growth of Jiu jitud a competition scene of the sport jiu jitsu started growing in Brazil. Because of the refinement of the techniques and growth of the new sport, many gyms were opening everywhere. People were getting promoted and opening new gyms or “business” all over the world. In the US the same thing started to happen. People were migrating to teach the art after the boom from the UFC. So with the money opportunities in the US many people wanted to teach jiu jitsu but didn’t want to pay to use the Gracie name. As the American scene evolved and grew there was a need to create a federation and for marketing purposes, the “ Brazilian “ jiu jitsu federation was created. The Brazilian was to show that it was the same art from the Gracies without any legal trademark problems.
Peace ✌🏻 and please go train both modern BJJ + modern judo = real ju jitsu
Best of both worlds. Respect both sports because it is the same art. Respect all the pioneers that paved the way on both sides. Because of each person involved we today have all these greatness of grappling around. Osu !