BMW M4 CSL Lap Record: ruclips.net/video/rM-CpzWA1qU/видео.html BMW M4 Competition Sport Auto Lap: ruclips.net/video/jt3MDVBOiUM/видео.html BMW M4 Competition xDrive Sport Auto Lap: ruclips.net/video/l4i1tv9kIUw/видео.html
And I still think it looks like the car equavilent of Rennschwein Rudi Rüssel! Sorry, the Headlights and Taillights look amazing but the Kidneys/Pignose is still hideous...🤷🏼♂️🤣
Misha, I totally agree with your review. I'm also considering buying a CSL and I'm also an M4 Competition Xdrive owner. With regard to the CSL lap time, I also share your opinion that the Xdrive with 510 hp on Cup 2 R can do it as well, if you use the Sport Auto time as a reference.
I think the comparison with the M4 Comp xDrive is not as easy as you pointed it out. I don't think it can go as fast with just another driver and Cup2R. Why? 1. Then BMW would have done and shown it directly :D 2. The 10s difference between Gebhardt and a "professionell" driver really depends on so many aspects, it could be also just 5. I think he's also quite familiar with BMWs having raced in them many times as well. xDrive is easier to drive (more confidence) 3. The CSL was developed with Cup2R ground up, Comp not, so (maybe) the jump time wise might not be as much either? 4. As after Pareto principle the last 20% are so much harder to achieve that I think to cut off another 15sec of a G82 Comp lap time isn't just like that Those are just some additional comments/thoughts from my side. I would love to see a 1:1 comparison of the two cars to see what's the actual difference with same driver, tires etc.
@@einautofan6685 ok, try to get one for "nearly the same". Those price comparison makes no sense at all... I can buy an F8x M2/3/4, modify it and be faster as both of them.
yea these cars make no sense unless your fk u rich and just want it for the clout. Anyone who actualy wants to go fast and is normal will just mod theres to be as fast or faster with WAY less money. Anyone would take a 992 gt3 over this lol
Hahaha your affect at the beginning was awesome. I love the break downs of laps in general, especially with so much knowledge of the track. Good stuff as usual.
I don't think saying it's not worth it would be being harsh on it. Because take a look at it. For 65k extra over the xDrive version, you are modding the xDrive version to the point where the CSL has no shot at catching up with it, better tires, light power mods and some suspension mods should do the trick. If you are a BMW lover and want it as a part of the collection, sure, get it. As a "worth it" option when getting an M4? I don't think it is. In fact i think the GTS, CS and CSLs were never for those who wanted the faster option. It's for those who wanted the halo version of a certain BMW chassis, perhaps in hopes it will be a collectable one day. Which I guess makes sense. Look at the M4 GTS. If you wanted the fastest M4 140k Eur would get you, you didn't buy the GTS, you got the usual model and modded it. But if you did get the GTS, you drove it about 10k km and it is still worth around that. Which is something you can't say about a heavily modded F82 that you put 140k into.
Another good video that covered all points that need to be raised. What's better is that you are in front of the camera and looking really good. There is a big difference in your face again in that a lot more swelling has gone down. Keep up the good recovery.
Brilliant vid as always Misha, I did my first track day in my xdrive M4 the other day I’m so happy with it but you can definitely feel the weight. And I know what tyres I’ll be getting for it next.👌🏻
I did a few laps in my Astra twintop 150hp diesel on new Uniroyal Rainsport 5's. The Chevrons took chunks out of the sidewalls on the front hehehe. Great memories from May the 19th. Well done for your laps.
The beginning sounded pretty sus... But 65k for few carbon, suspension parts and a tune. Worth? No. Buy base model, buy carbon hood and trunk and tune it. Top it off with best KW suspension you can buy, and you have fastest bmw for 100k.
I just put a £1000 down on a deposit for a chance to be in the drawer for the new CSL. If I’m lucky I’ll promise I’ll bring it over so you can have a go. Your face it’s really looking a lot better mate. Keep up the good work and see you next month.
It's not only a facelift of the M4. The CSL is 100KG lighter and a lot stiffer than the normal M4 comp. There is actually a new piece to the chassis. The rear seat comp that is gone, was replaced by a reinforced structure, which greatly improved rear end stiffness. Reiforcement work was also done on the front u engine compartment. With the higher power output and semi slicks added up, all these mods brought this car to a higher level
Honestly when I saw cup 2R I was expecting time in 7:05-7:10 range.. Camaro ZL1 did 7:16 on cup 2 tires 7 years ago with half price! Honestly I’m not impressed
Fanboy much? The zl1 had more downforce, more hp, and more torque not to mention the zl1 is a ground up sports car where as the m4 csl is based off the 4 series sedan compare the zl1 to the cayman gt4 rs which obliterates a zl1
I'm really glad that you brought Christian Gebhardt's laps into this analysis, with due respect to him, Sport Auto laps are slower by 8-10s compared to factory laps for a particular car.
8-10 second make sense beacuse factory driver spend days upon days driving the same car over and over again sticthing up mistake here and there and roll out all the mistakes a perfect laap.
The problem with the 4 series line up is not the grill, its the proportions. The rear hips are too high and the car visually weights a lot. Thanks for the analysis! As you said, the csl is just cool
There are many Design flaws on the regular M4 Design! The ugly big Kidneys, the position of the front numberplate, the lines on the side... going to nowhere... And like you said, looking visually too big! Too edgy on the front, while the rest of the car looks too softly designed... The old M4 looked soo much better! Especially the M4 CS! My favourite for all times!😍
@@einautofan6685 the previous m4 and 4 series are VERY beautiful. The gran coupe was for me the best desing with the m4 having an unmatched road presence for the segment.
@@comeberza Yes, the 4 and 8 Series Gran Coupe's look very elegant too! The total opposite of the ugly 3 and 5 Series GT, 6 Series GT... Never knew why BMW did this kind of cars...
@@einautofan6685 I adore the 8 series but I must tell you that while the 3,5 and 6 gt aren't good looking they are AMAZING cars. Top notch motoring, very fast, spectacular family cars that destroy any sort of SUV and they aren't desirable so they are cheap. They all came with amazing interiors compared to the same engine sedan variant, the rear room is limousine like. If I had to go with 4 friends or my wife and kids across europe and still have a rear wheel driven fast car, I would chose them
@@comeberza From this point of view, sure!👍 But from from pure eastetics I prefer a elegant low roofline... 8 Series is very expensive, but it looks soo good... All versions! Coupe and Gran Coupe! Besides that, I hope they will give us a limited 3.0 CSL hommage car, based on the M4, run too! Heard some rumours, they will build some 50 cars for about 600-700k...
Misha is spot on with the analysis per usual. What I don't get is with all of BMW's racing experience worldwide and at the Ring etc. why haven't they built a sub 7 car? They are leaving themselves out of the big ballgame. Because they surely can do it anytime they want. What is keeping them from building that car?
I guess, just guess, their purpose is/was always to make the best compromise between road and track use. And they nailed this in every generation and basically every segment. Ok, this one is one to argue with it being only a 2-seater. But, which other base shall they use? Z4? Too small I think. They might be able to pull off a sub 7 M2 GTS? Then again, why would they wanna do that? Cars are already selling as crazy and like I said, the purpose was the best compromise and not a pure race track car. Porsches base is just already a sports car which makes it much easier to build on. For BMW we are talking about family cars at the end. Audi and Merc are out already as their "standard" cars are not even anywhere close to M and Porsche.
@@mkm6073 M2 or M4 platform would work if they wanted to. Why? because they are a brand that is heavily invested in racing and if they clawed back 5% of the Nurburg crowd from Porsche it's an increase in sales. But I guess they don't see the ROI at this point..
Because, if they build one, people are gonna say, "why buy a BMW supercar when you can buy a Porsche?", which is a problem Mercedes has with the AMG GT.
@@emerckx53 I think it's much deeper than that. if we look at regular 3 series or x series cars, they sell more. BMW is more of a luxury car than a M performance car. There is no ROI when looking at it like that. In the future though, they most likely will begin trying.
Having previously watched the BMW YT video of the lap (and not being anything like an expert on these things), the three things that struck me at the time was a)the suspension was obviously quite compliant ("comfy?") for a track; b) that car attains speed effortlessly and immediately, and c) it retains speed just as easily. I'm no fanboy (and I sure dislike that nose design), but I was properly impressed nonetheless. - Ed on the Ridge
Thanks again for the video. I traded in my G80 M3 Xdrive for a 2023 CSL. The Xdrive is amazing. The best AWD system I've driven. However the M3 was too tame for me. Soft suspension, quiet, soft transmission. I came into this BMW model line from a 720s. I missed the raw experience of the 720s - the CSL is the most Raw stock BMW I've ever driven. Loud, harsh shifts, lowered stiffer suspension, and very sharp turn in, among other things. While the times are similar, most likely, the CSL offers a driving experience that is more of an experience than the exceptional, do it all G80 M3 Xdrive.
I am exactly in the same case as you, coming from a 720s with trofeo R, I had to modify my M3 xdrive. Best saloon car ever, what a machine! I just ordered an M4 csl because in uk you can get one almost brand new for 100k. But i dont think that I will get the speed of the 720s...
I don't think the CSL is too overpriced compared to the standard edition; a fully loaded M4 will get into the 130k range and 20% on-top for a limited edition race model doesn't seem completely out of this world. That being said, the Cayman GT4 RS starts at 140k€ and if an unpractical two door fits your bill, why not go with that?
@@byliu7650 Of course, you still need to speck it out and you'll probably land at 170k-180k, vs 170k for the CSL. But the CSL is limited to 150 in Germany, too. To get either, you'll need really good dealer connections. And if you have those, why not go for the Porsche?
@@Sebb747 Because BMW is better. At speed that car has no chance against BMW even GT3 Touring and GT3 992 on autobahn. I believe in test if they will drive harder that BMW could do better time than a Porsche
Love your detailed explaining ❣️ My English isn't the best, but i love your videos so much, that i learning English to understand all what you say 😂 Lieben Gruß aus Berlin Mikhail, Ramsi 😘
Hey Misha, I don't know if you remember me but I was the guy that knocked on your window the other day and took a picture by the Focus RS at Apex. It was awesome and thank you for your kindness even know I know it can get annoying to get recognized all the time. Many thanks and keep the good work!
Het is voor iedereen natuurlijk een persoonlijke afweging hoeveel geld je wilt besteden aan een TrackTool en dan welk merk en type het wordt. Sommige hebben veel plezier met een shitbox van 1000 euro, een ander moet en zal deze nieuwe CSL hebben voor hij of zij tevreden is.
If the extra money needed for the CSL would have put track before road, it would make sense. But that’s only my personal opinion. Feel free to order and enjoy it: on the road, on the track and why not … in your collection.
It appears BMW did not learn a lesson from the F30 3 series STREET CAR, where they were forced to add protection to the lower parts of the radiators after 3 years of production and many destroyed radiators. They could have at least been nice enough to offer it as a retrofit kit for the older cars, but no.
You have a point that these kind of cars really shouldn't be used for heavy tracking . It just doesn't make too much sense regardless of how much money someone has. Good analysis 👍
Misha is SPOT ON. Tires, driver, conditions, number of laps all affect the lap time. 7:28 from a regular M3 X-drive from a magazine driver, one maybe a couple laps. With factory driver, cup2R tires, and bunch of more laps, the car really could match 7:15.
I have a question. Why not buy a GT4RS insted? Is sligthly cheap, same ideology, both have 2 seats, both are collectible but, GT4 is fast, agile and mid engine. If they dont remove the back seats i cant compare this 2 but in this case i can.
Great analysis! I am lucky enough to have an allocation for one, Just built it this morning at the dealership that being said....i am selling it...i am in the USA.
Want to go fast and have more fun, with much less consumables. Buy or build yourself e36 track car. One just did 7:00 BTG time, it's not far of M4 CSL in terms of pace.
@@dsd6538 more crazy is that e36 used direzza dz03g street legal semi slick tires - in 235/45/17 size, maybe 2 times cheaper tire compared to the 275/xx/xx cup2R, and lasts 3x longer probably.
@@r129r16pfl and with that this ringtooled but older and weaker E36 would then be at about 7:20 full lap. Somewhere I learned that you would add 15-20 secs to the BTG for 20.6km lap 🤔
Honestly I think the E92 M3 GTS is the last one that could be said to be ok "bang for the buck" when it comes to pure speed, if one cares about such things. Maybe. After that, the special M3/M4s seem more like collector cars for sure. At least to me.
absolutely. the M4 csl was only built 1265 times, it's way too rare and expensive to be driven hard, which is an absolute shame. I hate that car manufacturers actively increase the chances of their cars ending up as garage queens
@@HCoreSoldierKili well the csl brand has always been a collectors items. E46 m3 csls have appreciated in price for example, being worth almost as much as one of these new m4s. These by far will age (price wise) much better than most other cars sub 7
If you compare how the 992 GT3, 718 GT4 RS and M4 CSL are driven when setting lap record, you see GT3 is driven with the most heavy brake during cornering, while M4 CSL is the easiest one (mostly less than 60% of full brake distance). I think it can beat 07’05” record if it’s driven really hard
The BMW grilles have become somewhat of a meme in the last couple of years. BMWs answer to that: Double down on it. Go even wilder with the grille-game.
Misha you need to do a lot more videos like this comparing cars, pros and cons etc… real car guys value your opinion much more than the typical journalist these days that do those fake laughs “wahahahaha!” when they accelerate WOT and say “omg this is so fast!”
great analysis I think when you look at what Mercedes has achieved in the ring with the GTs you would think with BMWs reputation as one of the best handling sedans it would put a time of sub 7:10 I mean by now BMW should have had a car setting that time look at the Nissan GT-R Nismo it set 7:08 7 years ago i think this presents a challenge for BMW and the missed opportunities to create a truly halo performance car like Audi Mercedes with the GT which they have proved they can creat serious handling performance cars
Mercedes does not have a faster car around the Nurburgring, except a black series which is literally a track car, and a GTR which is a track focussed version of the AMG GT supercar. Apart from Nismo GTR, everything quicker than a M4 CSL is either a super/hupercar or a track car. M4 CSL is a road car first, track car second. Its not a GTS. Its a CSL.
@@ertugrulbae46 Says Mercedes doesn't have a faster car at the Nürburgring and then says the names of the Mercedes cars that are faster at the Nürburgring...SMH...You want to glorify this Bimmer then do it without hating on its rivals. FYI, the AMG GT is a sportscar and not a supercar much in line with the M4, which certainly is no family car.
People need to understand that the m4 csl isn’t a ground up sports car like the 911 the fact that this is 3 secs slower than a 991.2 gt3 is incredible and that car is a class above the m4 csl just wait for the new m4 gtr
I still think that it looks awefull, but to be honest even the most loved e46 m3 csl didn't try to break lap times or be the fastest so no harm's done, i just wish bmw m division would actually listen to it's fan-base and go back to building the best sports cars in the market, it doesn't have to be the fastest, just driver oriented, simple rear wheel drive fun mixed with a balanced chassis and classic understated sporty bmw looks.
In my eyes the CSL is far too heavy. Also I am amazed that the Topspeed is just 1 kmh higher than my 996.2 GT3 from 2004. Keeping in mind that my car has about 150 PS less, that must be all about Cw x A. What brings me to the next point. Todays cars are too big. Still…the car looks awesome and sure is an absolut blast.
Didn´t watch the onboard but hear that gentle voice an see helmet colour of Jörg Weidinger, this guy is nuts, see him years ago at hillclimbs, he drove the BMW of Georg Plasa at Goodwood and was fastet ICE Car in i guess 2020 ?
It really is a good looking car now...very impressive all the way. But if I wanted a CSL I'd buy a 2nd hand E46 CSL instead! And hey...I'd still have change for a manual conversion and a 997 GT3 as well...sure they're definitely not like-for-like and incomparable with a new car, but I'd just have more fun with those two than a new CSL.
i think the lap time is deffinitly legit since the car is 100kg lighter more power more aero stiffer setup and semi slick tire 15 seconds faster then the standard m4 cmop is not unrealistic with this setup driven by sports auto and sport auto was only 2 seconds slower with the same m4 csl which was a customer car driven by independent driver so that 2 seconds could be due to ideal temp condition and driver familiarity and practice.
To be fair the lights and the seats are probably 50k+ altogether, no joke. You could have a faster M4 for the same budget no doubt, but with all the kit that car has, it's proper special. It's a shame the lap time isn't better
Fellas I think you are forgetting the fact that it lapped on a very wet surface leading to a couple of condition-forced errors (no disrespect to the driver, he has balls of steel), and also the E Performance being almost 200 PS more powerful (yeah yeah I know it's also a lot heavier than the normal GT63S which is a fat elephant but I think the 200 PS E-boost will pay dividend). And Misha himself said in his analysis video that the car could go at least 5s faster on a dry surface, maybe not ten but I'd expect it to shave at least 7-8 secs off (E Performance, might be less for the "regular" GT63S)
For those who have followed BMW M 3/4, at least for the last two decades, the lesson is clear: instead of buying a CSL/GTS, just wait a couple of years for the next generation. Invariably the successor Competition-version will have at least the same power, sometimes even more - up to 17% extra -, than the preceding CSL/GTS while costing much less, somewhere between 20-41% less. When comparing the F87 M2 CS with the presumed figures for the G87 M2 Competition, this absurd - at least for the proud owners of the outgoing Überflieger - pattern seems to be standard in Garching.
I totaly agree with Misha if you buy m4 with xdrive a put the cup r tyres and suspension like your apex m3 i think it would be a lot faster with professional driver then m4 csl. And for less money.
I agree with all you points, I'm just really disappointed, that BMW, who likes to present itself as the brand that makes drivers cars, made the ultimate drivers car of its lineup unavailable to the public. Its like Omega x Swatch who were presenting a great watch but almost nobody can get it. Whats wrong with building an non-limited CSL? Now its going to rot away in garages instead of being driven like BMW said it was made to.
Hace casi 20 años un M3 E46 CSL hizo un crono de 7:50min en el nordchsleife , en sport auto. Es curioso que apenas lo separen 30s , siendo un coche bastante más potente y sofisticado comparado con un E46 . El 7:50 lo registro con los Michelin sport cup 1 ,neumático de serie en el CSL E46.
The M4 CSL lap is definitely impressive given the lack of downforce, which all the other cars around this laptime has plenty of. In terms of value of money, it'd be down to the depreciation of the car, which CSL would be largely immune to, especially in the long term.
Right? This car will appreciate instead of deappreciate. It's definitely not a track car no matter what BMW is saying. Just look at all the e46 m3s that doubled in value and are sitting in garages. Or the m3 gts's that are doing the same.
Misha you did one more to the point opinion for the new csl... With all that it is more than a collectors car than a track fast car etc... I will say again that the e46 csl and e92 gts was Truly a step above the normal m cars....
![KSI - Thick Of It (feat. Trippie Redd) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/At8v_Yc044Y/mqdefault.jpg)
BMW M4 CSL Lap Record: ruclips.net/video/rM-CpzWA1qU/видео.html
BMW M4 Competition Sport Auto Lap: ruclips.net/video/jt3MDVBOiUM/видео.html
BMW M4 Competition xDrive Sport Auto Lap: ruclips.net/video/l4i1tv9kIUw/видео.html
And I still think it looks like the car equavilent of Rennschwein Rudi Rüssel! Sorry, the Headlights and Taillights look amazing but the Kidneys/Pignose is still hideous...🤷🏼♂️🤣
A 992 GT3 is much faster and costs nearly the same...Sorry again...🤷🏼♂️
Misha, I totally agree with your review. I'm also considering buying a CSL and I'm also an M4 Competition Xdrive owner. With regard to the CSL lap time, I also share your opinion that the Xdrive with 510 hp on Cup 2 R can do it as well, if you use the Sport Auto time as a reference.
I think the comparison with the M4 Comp xDrive is not as easy as you pointed it out. I don't think it can go as fast with just another driver and Cup2R.
Why?
1. Then BMW would have done and shown it directly :D
2. The 10s difference between Gebhardt and a "professionell" driver really depends on so many aspects, it could be also just 5. I think he's also quite familiar with BMWs having raced in them many times as well. xDrive is easier to drive (more confidence)
3. The CSL was developed with Cup2R ground up, Comp not, so (maybe) the jump time wise might not be as much either?
4. As after Pareto principle the last 20% are so much harder to achieve that I think to cut off another 15sec of a G82 Comp lap time isn't just like that
Those are just some additional comments/thoughts from my side. I would love to see a 1:1 comparison of the two cars to see what's the actual difference with same driver, tires etc.
@@einautofan6685 ok, try to get one for "nearly the same". Those price comparison makes no sense at all...
I can buy an F8x M2/3/4, modify it and be faster as both of them.
It does look cool, I’d be trying to get my hands on a 992 GT3 if I was in a position to be considering a m4 CSl 😄
yea these cars make no sense unless your fk u rich and just want it for the clout. Anyone who actualy wants to go fast and is normal will just mod theres to be as fast or faster with WAY less money. Anyone would take a 992 gt3 over this lol
@@captainminecraftist yes but they are currently silly money
Keep saying this and BMW will never build these cars ever again.
@@nightdriver7216 If they sell them all and make a lump of cash I'm sure they will.
Good choise !
Hahaha your affect at the beginning was awesome. I love the break downs of laps in general, especially with so much knowledge of the track. Good stuff as usual.
Your*
@@AdminAbuse cringe
@@AdminAbuse werds
I don't think saying it's not worth it would be being harsh on it. Because take a look at it. For 65k extra over the xDrive version, you are modding the xDrive version to the point where the CSL has no shot at catching up with it, better tires, light power mods and some suspension mods should do the trick. If you are a BMW lover and want it as a part of the collection, sure, get it. As a "worth it" option when getting an M4? I don't think it is. In fact i think the GTS, CS and CSLs were never for those who wanted the faster option. It's for those who wanted the halo version of a certain BMW chassis, perhaps in hopes it will be a collectable one day. Which I guess makes sense. Look at the M4 GTS. If you wanted the fastest M4 140k Eur would get you, you didn't buy the GTS, you got the usual model and modded it. But if you did get the GTS, you drove it about 10k km and it is still worth around that. Which is something you can't say about a heavily modded F82 that you put 140k into.
Agree
only problem with such a modern car is they are all scrap after 10 to 20 yrs as they are so electronically dependant. old school.
You can put a CSL bootlid on an e46 but it would never make it a csl.
Some people don’t want to modify a car from standard form though. Plenty of customers like that.
@@loickl you can put a CSL badge on a g80 M4 but it doesn't make it a CSL.
Another good video that covered all points that need to be raised.
What's better is that you are in front of the camera and looking really good. There is a big difference in your face again in that a lot more swelling has gone down. Keep up the good recovery.
Brilliant vid as always Misha, I did my first track day in my xdrive M4 the other day I’m so happy with it but you can definitely feel the weight. And I know what tyres I’ll be getting for it next.👌🏻
I did a few laps in my Astra twintop 150hp diesel on new Uniroyal Rainsport 5's. The Chevrons took chunks out of the sidewalls on the front hehehe. Great memories from May the 19th. Well done for your laps.
How did you put the M and track into the comments?
enjoyed this Misha!!!!!🔥🔥🔥🔥
Misha, my man!
It's good to see you looking good and no more wires. 🤜🤛. You're a bad man, brother.
I like when you do these analyses.
Really interesting mate, awesome seeing you recovering so quickly too... 👌
Ur Manny Koshbin Impersonation at the beginning was spot on 😎😎
Excellent video!!! You speak what we all think on this platform and we thank you for that Misha.
Great to see you well, Misha! Much love from Brazil!
The beginning sounded pretty sus... But 65k for few carbon, suspension parts and a tune. Worth? No.
Buy base model, buy carbon hood and trunk and tune it.
Top it off with best KW suspension you can buy, and you have fastest bmw for 100k.
Absolutely on point Misha! Thank you for your analysis.
I just put a £1000 down on a deposit for a chance to be in the drawer for the new CSL. If I’m lucky I’ll promise I’ll bring it over so you can have a go. Your face it’s really looking a lot better mate. Keep up the good work and see you next month.
Thank you! Hope you'll get it!
It's not only a facelift of the M4. The CSL is 100KG lighter and a lot stiffer than the normal M4 comp. There is actually a new piece to the chassis. The rear seat comp that is gone, was replaced by a reinforced structure, which greatly improved rear end stiffness. Reiforcement work was also done on the front u engine compartment. With the higher power output and semi slicks added up, all these mods brought this car to a higher level
Honestly when I saw cup 2R I was expecting time in 7:05-7:10 range.. Camaro ZL1 did 7:16 on cup 2 tires 7 years ago with half price! Honestly I’m not impressed
You're not wrong
Fanboy much? The zl1 had more downforce, more hp, and more torque not to mention the zl1 is a ground up sports car where as the m4 csl is based off the 4 series sedan compare the zl1 to the cayman gt4 rs which obliterates a zl1
I just watched that lap last night too, what a lap, guy pushed the zl1 to its absolute limit.
Misha, its about downforce. M4 csl is as fast as 992 turbo s, 992 gts and alot of other normal sportscars without insane downforce!
@@ericship8383 you have made a valid point but let’s not forget the price difference between those cars. Anyways both are sick
Awesome to see you again sir! Glad the recovery is going so well for you. Regards from NY USA
Ich schaue die Videos auf deinem Kanal sehr gerne. Gute Einwände die du genannt hast. Alles Gute.
Really happy to see you recover !
Very interesting video Misha. 👍
A CSL, first for the street, then the track... Err... OK BMW... 🤔 🤪
Would be fun to know if atleast csl has a warranty if you track it.
Unlike other M cars. Even Hyundai N30 has warranty also if it's tracked
Very valid points Misha and agree with all as well 👌🏿
Interesting! Saw a red m3 comp lately, Jesus, what a beauty. Even looks good with the new grill 😍
Man that e36 lap was amazing to watch!
great analysis!
I'm really glad that you brought Christian Gebhardt's laps into this analysis, with due respect to him, Sport Auto laps are slower by 8-10s compared to factory laps for a particular car.
8-10 second make sense beacuse factory driver spend days upon days driving the same car over and over again sticthing up mistake here and there and roll out all the mistakes a perfect laap.
The problem with the 4 series line up is not the grill, its the proportions. The rear hips are too high and the car visually weights a lot. Thanks for the analysis! As you said, the csl is just cool
There are many Design flaws on the regular M4 Design! The ugly big Kidneys, the position of the front numberplate, the lines on the side... going to nowhere... And like you said, looking visually too big! Too edgy on the front, while the rest of the car looks too softly designed... The old M4 looked soo much better! Especially the M4 CS! My favourite for all times!😍
@@einautofan6685 the previous m4 and 4 series are VERY beautiful. The gran coupe was for me the best desing with the m4 having an unmatched road presence for the segment.
@@comeberza Yes, the 4 and 8 Series Gran Coupe's look very elegant too! The total opposite of the ugly 3 and 5 Series GT, 6 Series GT... Never knew why BMW did this kind of cars...
@@einautofan6685 I adore the 8 series but I must tell you that while the 3,5 and 6 gt aren't good looking they are AMAZING cars. Top notch motoring, very fast, spectacular family cars that destroy any sort of SUV and they aren't desirable so they are cheap. They all came with amazing interiors compared to the same engine sedan variant, the rear room is limousine like. If I had to go with 4 friends or my wife and kids across europe and still have a rear wheel driven fast car, I would chose them
@@comeberza From this point of view, sure!👍 But from from pure eastetics I prefer a elegant low roofline... 8 Series is very expensive, but it looks soo good... All versions! Coupe and Gran Coupe! Besides that, I hope they will give us a limited 3.0 CSL hommage car, based on the M4, run too! Heard some rumours, they will build some 50 cars for about 600-700k...
Misha is spot on with the analysis per usual. What I don't get is with all of BMW's racing experience worldwide and at the Ring etc. why haven't they built a sub 7 car? They are leaving themselves out of the big ballgame. Because they surely can do it anytime they want. What is keeping them from building that car?
Probably not their direction atm
I guess, just guess, their purpose is/was always to make the best compromise between road and track use. And they nailed this in every generation and basically every segment.
Ok, this one is one to argue with it being only a 2-seater. But, which other base shall they use? Z4? Too small I think. They might be able to pull off a sub 7 M2 GTS? Then again, why would they wanna do that? Cars are already selling as crazy and like I said, the purpose was the best compromise and not a pure race track car.
Porsches base is just already a sports car which makes it much easier to build on. For BMW we are talking about family cars at the end. Audi and Merc are out already as their "standard" cars are not even anywhere close to M and Porsche.
@@mkm6073 M2 or M4 platform would work if they wanted to. Why? because they are a brand that is heavily invested in racing and if they clawed back 5% of the Nurburg crowd from Porsche it's an increase in sales. But I guess they don't see the ROI at this point..
Because, if they build one, people are gonna say, "why buy a BMW supercar when you can buy a Porsche?", which is a problem Mercedes has with the AMG GT.
@@emerckx53 I think it's much deeper than that. if we look at regular 3 series or x series cars, they sell more. BMW is more of a luxury car than a M performance car. There is no ROI when looking at it like that. In the future though, they most likely will begin trying.
the asking prices for these cars is complete madness!
The csl Looks amazing
It's the first time I've seen you since the surgery. You look so different but so good. Wow you look amazing!
So the car is 15 seconds faster then the Plaid with way less HP. Nice
I just bought one and love it. Definitely will get driven and won't just be kept in the garage...!
Having previously watched the BMW YT video of the lap (and not being anything like an expert on these things),
the three things that struck me at the time was a)the suspension was obviously quite compliant ("comfy?") for
a track; b) that car attains speed effortlessly and immediately, and c) it retains speed just as easily.
I'm no fanboy (and I sure dislike that nose design), but I was properly impressed nonetheless.
- Ed on the Ridge
class intro misha xD
Thanks again for the video. I traded in my G80 M3 Xdrive for a 2023 CSL. The Xdrive is amazing. The best AWD system I've driven. However the M3 was too tame for me. Soft suspension, quiet, soft transmission. I came into this BMW model line from a 720s. I missed the raw experience of the 720s - the CSL is the most Raw stock BMW I've ever driven. Loud, harsh shifts, lowered stiffer suspension, and very sharp turn in, among other things. While the times are similar, most likely, the CSL offers a driving experience that is more of an experience than the exceptional, do it all G80 M3 Xdrive.
I am exactly in the same case as you, coming from a 720s with trofeo R, I had to modify my M3 xdrive. Best saloon car ever, what a machine! I just ordered an M4 csl because in uk you can get one almost brand new for 100k.
But i dont think that I will get the speed of the 720s...
I don't think the CSL is too overpriced compared to the standard edition; a fully loaded M4 will get into the 130k range and 20% on-top for a limited edition race model doesn't seem completely out of this world. That being said, the Cayman GT4 RS starts at 140k€ and if an unpractical two door fits your bill, why not go with that?
I don't believe anyone who can get the GT4 RS cheaper than M4 csl.Enless their father are the onwer of the dealer lol
@@byliu7650 Of course, you still need to speck it out and you'll probably land at 170k-180k, vs 170k for the CSL.
But the CSL is limited to 150 in Germany, too. To get either, you'll need really good dealer connections. And if you have those, why not go for the Porsche?
@@Sebb747 Because BMW is better. At speed that car has no chance against BMW even GT3 Touring and GT3 992 on autobahn. I believe in test if they will drive harder that BMW could do better time than a Porsche
@@Sebb747 because the csl is limited edition and will appreciate. It's not only going to be fun, but it will also go up in value.
Love your detailed explaining ❣️
My English isn't the best, but i love your videos so much, that i learning English to understand all what you say 😂
Lieben Gruß aus Berlin Mikhail,
Ramsi 😘
luv the opening satire Misha.
In Netherlands (1,5 hour drive from the Ring) it starts at €215.243 😂
Thanks Misha!
Hey Misha, I don't know if you remember me but I was the guy that knocked on your window the other day and took a picture by the Focus RS at Apex. It was awesome and thank you for your kindness even know I know it can get annoying to get recognized all the time. Many thanks and keep the good work!
Do you think the track renovations over the years can affect lap times?
100%
Het is voor iedereen natuurlijk een persoonlijke afweging hoeveel geld je wilt besteden aan een TrackTool en dan welk merk en type het wordt. Sommige hebben veel plezier met een shitbox van 1000 euro, een ander moet en zal deze nieuwe CSL hebben voor hij of zij tevreden is.
Yes, that was my first thought also about the grill. This design is an improvement. I saw Tim's video. 😎👍
If the extra money needed for the CSL would have put track before road, it would make sense.
But that’s only my personal opinion. Feel free to order and enjoy it: on the road, on the track and why not … in your collection.
It appears BMW did not learn a lesson from the F30 3 series STREET CAR, where they were forced to add protection to the lower parts of the radiators after 3 years of production and many destroyed radiators. They could have at least been nice enough to offer it as a retrofit kit for the older cars, but no.
Same with M140i’s. Loads of owners had pierced radiators and BMW refused to pay. Then fitted stone guards to new cars.
Looking good Misha, Rj in Oz
You have a point that these kind of cars really shouldn't be used for heavy tracking . It just doesn't make too much sense regardless of how much money someone has. Good analysis 👍
@@Cloxxki couldn't agree more
Misha is SPOT ON. Tires, driver, conditions, number of laps all affect the lap time. 7:28 from a regular M3 X-drive from a magazine driver, one maybe a couple laps. With factory driver, cup2R tires, and bunch of more laps, the car really could match 7:15.
I have a question.
Why not buy a GT4RS insted?
Is sligthly cheap, same ideology, both have 2 seats, both are collectible but, GT4 is fast, agile and mid engine.
If they dont remove the back seats i cant compare this 2 but in this case i can.
Cool video 👍🏻
Great analysis! I am lucky enough to have an allocation for one, Just built it this morning at the dealership that being said....i am selling it...i am in the USA.
Want to go fast and have more fun, with much less consumables.
Buy or build yourself e36 track car.
One just did 7:00 BTG time, it's not far of M4 CSL in terms of pace.
Saying exactly that at the end of the vid ;)
That's actually crazy, if you think about it 😄
@@dsd6538 more crazy is that e36 used direzza dz03g street legal semi slick tires - in 235/45/17 size, maybe 2 times cheaper tire compared to the 275/xx/xx cup2R, and lasts 3x longer probably.
@@r129r16pfl and with that this ringtooled but older and weaker E36 would then be at about 7:20 full lap. Somewhere I learned that you would add 15-20 secs to the BTG for 20.6km lap 🤔
Good analytics 👍🏻
Ah the analysis I've been waiting for.
Honestly I think the E92 M3 GTS is the last one that could be said to be ok "bang for the buck" when it comes to pure speed, if one cares about such things. Maybe. After that, the special M3/M4s seem more like collector cars for sure. At least to me.
absolutely. the M4 csl was only built 1265 times, it's way too rare and expensive to be driven hard, which is an absolute shame. I hate that car manufacturers actively increase the chances of their cars ending up as garage queens
@@HCoreSoldierKili well the csl brand has always been a collectors items. E46 m3 csls have appreciated in price for example, being worth almost as much as one of these new m4s. These by far will age (price wise) much better than most other cars sub 7
I absolutely love the new M4 CSL! It's beautiful! Thanks Misha.
You analysis is absolutely correct. The base M4 is more than enough, the CSL is more an investment.
Who is this guy that took over Misha's channel? He knows his stuff and sounds just like him.
Nice seeing you using the s22 ultra 😍
Wow, that S22 Ultra 5G looks so good!!!
Nice phone man!!!
Looking into a lot of these manufacturers lap times, you see many cars using non OEM tyres, tyres that the manufacture won’t sell you.
Aventador SV : 7:15
992 Turbo S : 7:17
M4 csl: 7:15,67
For bmw coupe pretty solid
If you compare how the 992 GT3, 718 GT4 RS and M4 CSL are driven when setting lap record, you see GT3 is driven with the most heavy brake during cornering, while M4 CSL is the easiest one (mostly less than 60% of full brake distance). I think it can beat 07’05” record if it’s driven really hard
Yeah on every view test I see that. They driving slow this car to not crash it probably
The BMW grilles have become somewhat of a meme in the last couple of years. BMWs answer to that: Double down on it. Go even wilder with the grille-game.
Misha you need to do a lot more videos like this comparing cars, pros and cons etc… real car guys value your opinion much more than the typical journalist these days that do those fake laughs “wahahahaha!” when they accelerate WOT and say “omg this is so fast!”
great analysis I think when you look at what Mercedes has achieved in the ring with the GTs you would think with BMWs reputation as one of the best handling sedans it would put a time of sub 7:10 I mean by now BMW should have had a car setting that time look at the Nissan GT-R Nismo it set 7:08 7 years ago i think this presents a challenge for BMW and the missed opportunities to create a truly halo performance car like Audi Mercedes with the GT which they have proved they can creat serious handling performance cars
Nismo time is very skeptical tbh. It was before big scruteneerings.
Mercedes does not have a faster car around the Nurburgring, except a black series which is literally a track car, and a GTR which is a track focussed version of the AMG GT supercar. Apart from Nismo GTR, everything quicker than a M4 CSL is either a super/hupercar or a track car.
M4 CSL is a road car first, track car second. Its not a GTS. Its a CSL.
@@ertugrulbae46 Says Mercedes doesn't have a faster car at the Nürburgring and then says the names of the Mercedes cars that are faster at the Nürburgring...SMH...You want to glorify this Bimmer then do it without hating on its rivals.
FYI, the AMG GT is a sportscar and not a supercar much in line with the M4, which certainly is no family car.
That nismo wasn’t stock
@@mgcharoudin ya just read about it interesting though
People need to understand that the m4 csl isn’t a ground up sports car like the 911 the fact that this is 3 secs slower than a 991.2 gt3 is incredible and that car is a class above the m4 csl just wait for the new m4 gtr
Zl1 camaro running 7:16... idk if id want to be compared to a boat like that.
People should buy these g80’s in black
So the grille blends in better
In other words u don’t see the grille as much
I still think that it looks awefull, but to be honest even the most loved e46 m3 csl didn't try to break lap times or be the fastest so no harm's done, i just wish bmw m division would actually listen to it's fan-base and go back to building the best sports cars in the market, it doesn't have to be the fastest, just driver oriented, simple rear wheel drive fun mixed with a balanced chassis and classic understated sporty bmw looks.
Ngl i think it looks good only as a full blown GT3 race car.
Nice. Cool video.
You should do a Test lap with your g80 M3 on Cup 2 R that should answer all questions.
your face is looking very much better than before your surgery , almost like a new man ..... bravo
In my eyes the CSL is far too heavy. Also I am amazed that the Topspeed is just 1 kmh higher than my 996.2 GT3 from 2004. Keeping in mind that my car has about 150 PS less, that must be all about Cw x A. What brings me to the next point. Todays cars are too big.
Still…the car looks awesome and sure is an absolut blast.
Dont Forget that the top speed of the CSL is limited…
thanking todays sponser was the best part of the video 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Good video
well done!
The stone chips will only kill the ac, because the ac condensor is infront. Who needs AC anyways?
Didn´t watch the onboard but hear that gentle voice an see helmet colour of Jörg Weidinger, this guy is nuts, see him years ago at hillclimbs, he drove the BMW of Georg Plasa at Goodwood and was fastet ICE Car in i guess 2020 ?
It really is a good looking car now...very impressive all the way.
But if I wanted a CSL I'd buy a 2nd hand E46 CSL instead! And hey...I'd still have change for a manual conversion and a 997 GT3 as well...sure they're definitely not like-for-like and incomparable with a new car, but I'd just have more fun with those two than a new CSL.
i think the lap time is deffinitly legit since the car is 100kg lighter more power more aero stiffer setup and semi slick tire 15 seconds faster then the standard m4 cmop is not unrealistic with this setup driven by sports auto and sport auto was only 2 seconds slower with the same m4 csl which was a customer car driven by independent driver so that 2 seconds could be due to ideal temp condition and driver familiarity and practice.
that thing looks like a capybara...
To be fair the lights and the seats are probably 50k+ altogether, no joke. You could have a faster M4 for the same budget no doubt, but with all the kit that car has, it's proper special. It's a shame the lap time isn't better
Yep but it can be
That shot at 2:30 is so sick😅
So sick that they made a CSL version of the M4 🔥🔥
I'm still waiting for Merc to lap the GT63S (or the GT63S E Performance) on a dry Nordschleife and shave off roughly 10 secs.
I doubt it will shave off 10.
@ Salih Erkan
Will never happen that car is pig 🐷
10s is quite a big difference and that's like the difference between the GT2 RS (Weissach Pack) and GT2 RS with MR kit laps, maybe 5s.
Fellas I think you are forgetting the fact that it lapped on a very wet surface leading to a couple of condition-forced errors (no disrespect to the driver, he has balls of steel), and also the E Performance being almost 200 PS more powerful (yeah yeah I know it's also a lot heavier than the normal GT63S which is a fat elephant but I think the 200 PS E-boost will pay dividend). And Misha himself said in his analysis video that the car could go at least 5s faster on a dry surface, maybe not ten but I'd expect it to shave at least 7-8 secs off (E Performance, might be less for the "regular" GT63S)
@@saliherkan1 It was damp with quite a few water patches on the track but it wasn't wet like it was pouring down heavily.
For those who have followed BMW M 3/4, at least for the last two decades, the lesson is clear: instead of buying a CSL/GTS, just wait a couple of years for the next generation. Invariably the successor Competition-version will have at least the same power, sometimes even more - up to 17% extra -, than the preceding CSL/GTS while costing much less, somewhere between 20-41% less. When comparing the F87 M2 CS with the presumed figures for the G87 M2 Competition, this absurd - at least for the proud owners of the outgoing Überflieger - pattern seems to be standard in Garching.
Love how you break down the cars. Fan boys beware 😎
I totaly agree with Misha if you buy m4 with xdrive a put the cup r tyres and suspension like your apex m3 i think it would be a lot faster with professional driver then m4 csl. And for less money.
Hi misha, great analysis as usual, btw is this the most hardcore M4 or BMW will make the "GTS" Version of it?
I agree with all you points, I'm just really disappointed, that BMW, who likes to present itself as the brand that makes drivers cars, made the ultimate drivers car of its lineup unavailable to the public. Its like Omega x Swatch who were presenting a great watch but almost nobody can get it. Whats wrong with building an non-limited CSL? Now its going to rot away in garages instead of being driven like BMW said it was made to.
10 points for the first bad joke :D
I‘m dying :D
Thanks to the sponsor :D:D
Misha after surgery you’re looking better 👍😆
Hace casi 20 años un M3 E46 CSL hizo un crono de 7:50min en el nordchsleife , en sport auto.
Es curioso que apenas lo separen 30s , siendo un coche bastante más potente y sofisticado comparado con un E46 . El 7:50 lo registro con los Michelin sport cup 1 ,neumático de serie en el CSL E46.
MISSHAAA PORSCHE JUST TOOK IT 929 HYPERCAR 5.19 TIME
The M4 CSL lap is definitely impressive given the lack of downforce, which all the other cars around this laptime has plenty of. In terms of value of money, it'd be down to the depreciation of the car, which CSL would be largely immune to, especially in the long term.
What's the downforce figures for the M4 CSL?
@@Amarjit_Singh No figures at all, so hardly any downforce for sure
@@CarToneHK That can't be true, hardly any downforce.
Right? This car will appreciate instead of deappreciate. It's definitely not a track car no matter what BMW is saying. Just look at all the e46 m3s that doubled in value and are sitting in garages. Or the m3 gts's that are doing the same.
It's hard to make a case for this car when the Camaro ZL1-1LE runs practically the same time for half the cost.
I just enter your vids to see how you recover ;) For me, after surgery you look like a different person. Anyway, good luck !
Misha you did one more to the point opinion for the new csl...
With all that it is more than a collectors car than a track fast car etc...
I will say again that the e46 csl and e92 gts was Truly a step above the normal m cars....