Problem solved: The Waldorf Quantum II with poly-aftertouch PLUS the 3rd Wave 'module' (plus the Oberheim OB-X8 'module') working harmoniously. Cheers!
Thanks TJ - very helpful. 3W sounds so so much better and more usable to my ears. That analogue filter omg. I’d rather have Pigments / Serum / Diva than the Waldorf
I love the “I could use a VST for X synth” argument. The same synths you listed could be 3W replacements too. In fact, if you use a PPG VST, Serum and Diva that would cover everything a 3W could do. It’s funny because I do and say the same thing when I’m not really feeling a synth is worth it or it doesn’t speak to me. It’s really all about preference and your tastes. Glad the 3W exists and that it speaks to you!
The Waldorf's have a certain sound. I think they are good for certain things but fail as a general use synth. I have not had enough time with the 3rd Wave to have a strong opinion. I need to spend some time with mine but have been on other things. Big reason I bought it is because a PPG is too pricey and I love the PPG sound. I probably wouldn't go for a quantum even if I had the free cash. I'm good with the 3rd wave and XTk.
I love my mark 1 quantum. Took quite a while to get to grips with it, but now I find it very easy to program and most importantly I find the sounds sit really well in a mix (I have a lovely, wonky vintage analog poly which is great to play on its own, but really hard to use in a track). Wish it had a poly after touch keybed, but otherwise it’s almost perfect (which wasn’t quite my first impression!).
Interesting that people hear things so differently. Several people seem to hate the sounds the Quantum makes. Apparently 2 small time synth users, Hans Zimmer and Junkie XL, seem to love the Quantum as maybe their favorite synth. And the guys who built the 3rd Wave are not novice tinkerers. They worked for Avid and Sequential on design and audio DSP. My guess is that the Groove guys know about synths and are trying their best to make the best. As I believe TJ said, the correct answer is both. My compromise was the Iridium keyboard and 3rd Wave desktop module. Smaller and I am cheap.
Quantum has its haters from the analog synth purest crowd. It'll never complete in that arena and it doesn't have to. It's at a whole other level of synth abilities. Cheers, TJ
LoL i think that if you cant hear the difference is because you never own one, or your ears are not technically trained to listened to transient character bass power and presence in the mix. Iridium is really a beast in synthesis power but in the end the sound is poor in everything..i always said is a vst in the box..nothing more. The Quantum is a quite better on filters analog but nothing compared to 3rd wave…no character no sit in the mix.. The 3rd wave is incredible in everything, now can also sampling…a d thevbest part is the sound…deep basses, character, presence in the mix… I had the iridium for 3 months and sell it immediately, tested the quantum for 2 weeks and send it back..own the 3rd wave and ill never ever sell it..a masterpiece.
I find I don't have a preference sound wise between them. They are complimentary to each other. The multi-track section of the video I believe demo's that very well. Cheers, TJ
@tjontheroad Perhaps I feel this way because prefer the more vintage sound or character the 3rd Wave brings as opposed to the more modern contemporary sound of the Quantum. Thank you for demoing and comparing these two synths for us. I really appreciate it. BTW, One your old videos from a couple of years ago influenced me to buy the Matrixbrute/Polybrute combo. I'm glad I did. They're such a nice blend between modern and vintage sound as far as analog synths go. There are so many sound design possibilities with them as well.
If I'm to do it over again, it would be 3rdwave desktop, Quantum 2 keyboard and Moog Matriach for bass. Of course my EMU sampler called the E6400 stays.
@audiolego That sounds like a sweet setup there, especially with the Matriarch and the E-MU sampler. I have an E4XT Ultra myself. Although I hardly use it, I'm never getting rid of it simply because it sounds so good. I have future plans to reintegrate it into my setup. Well, it's already a part of my setup. I just have to hook it up. The next time I play the 3rd Wave, I might bring a pair of headphones to get another perspective on how it sounds. I've never tried it with headphones. I've played the Iridium as well, and I hate to say it, but the Waldorf sounds more like a plugin to me, and the interface feels more to me like a computer than a standalone synth to be honest. Well, it basically is a computer, but with dedicated buttons knobs, and a keyboard. I think it's the touchscreen that makes it feel like a computer. However, my Fantom-06 and MPC have touchscreens as well, and yes, they feel somewhat like computers, too. However, they still feel like standalone hardware. In regards to the Iridium, the interface is still nice and very intuitive eventhough it has the feel of a computer. It's the sound of the Iridium that doesn't really inspire me more so than the interface.
More recently since my last previous posts above, I finally had a chance to get my hands on a Quantum Mk2 to see, play, and hear for myself. It is very, very, impressive, I must say. The interface is really nice and it feels great. I also like the poly aftertouch keyboard. In terms of sound, it is very versatile and flexible. However, it definitely has a darker tone in comparison to the 3rd Wave. Sometimes, things can get a little muddy in the midrange on the Quantum if you don't tweak it right or put some eq on it, depending on the patch. To be honest, they both sound very good. However, I still prefer the sound of the 3rd Wave over that of the Quantum.
Two great synths to compare. I have a few things in common. I am mainly a guitar player. Lately I have taken the plunge into synthesizers. I found your channel because of the 3rd Wave. I just ordered a 3rd Wave desktop version. I also have: Pro 3, OB-6, OB-X8, Trigon 6 desktop, Iridium Keyboard, M, Summit, System 8,, Prologue, JP-8000, Erica Syntrx II, Subsequent 37, Matriarch, Prophet X, other ... And a lot of effects. Recently got LVX, Mercury X, OTO BIM BAM BOUM, Meraki, and have many more. I have been hiding out but plan to share sounds and experiences in 2024. I watch GEOSyths and Pro Synth Network on RUclips. I see that you have a lot of information and sounds on a lot. Cheers.
I own the Waldorf iridium keyboard and it produces some truly “alien band” sounds. I have never been a fan of FM (DX-7)or Wavetable (PPG) sounds but the iridium does SO MUCH MORE. the 3rd wave truly sounds SO SWEET! for movie soundtrack synth effects I’d say iridium hands down. The 3rd wave sounds more inviting. It’s a strong contender for GEAR LUST SYNDROME.
Nah.. i have the Prophet 12 for year and had the 3rd Wave for 30 Days (didnt bought at the end). BUT the P12 dont cover the 3rd Wave territory! P12 has no real wavetables / scan and the 3rdWave sounds way more analog! BUT the P12 has SO MUCH MORE CHARACTER!
@@Tom_Synergy it just doesn't sound good for that price range. I had it for a year and couldn't stand. Filters are garbage (Dune3 VST synth filters are far superior, for instance). Wave tables traveling sounds harsh. Voice count isn't really 16, it frequently overloads and starts to cut them off very early, like at 5-6. Display is not very responsive. And many many more, as always with Waldorf products.
I’ve not have a chance to program the 3rd Wave. Although, I do plan on parking one to my synth garage. I do have a Quantum. First, it’s one of the prettiest synths out there. Second, it is a pad power house. I’m talking Digital LSD. The Quantum is a very deep synth. I’m anxious to see how deep down the 3rd Wave dives.
I’ve had a Quantum mk 1 from when it was first released and despite it taking a while to get to really know, it’s now one of, if not my favourite all round synth, it really can do nearly anything and I have a prophet 10, obx 8, Moog One, polybrute, OB 6, Hydra delux and more. I think many people don’t give the Quantum enough time to learn. It’s so deep that it’s easy to accidentally make it sound harsh via the filters being overloaded or too much compression. I’m a huge fan of Waldorf for good reason. However the 3rd wave does sound incredibly good, so in your opinion, would you recommend I splash out on a 3rd wave next or would you get the new Moog Muse which also sounds incredibly good ? I’m torn between the two and because it’ll take a lifetime to get to the bottom of the Quantum I suspect I’d be covering the same or very similar ground with the 3rd wave. What do you think ?
First, thanks for watching. I've not yet tried the Muse myself. So, I can't really talk from personal experience. That said, it looks awesome. Comparing Muse to 3rd Wave is very much apples to oranges. Muse being an 8 voice analog and 3rd Wave being a 24 voice digital synth. 3rd Wave is much more capable. But if that all analog poly sound is calling you, go for it. Cheers TJ
@@tjontheroadthanks for the reply 🙏🏻 and I know what you mean but I was thinking more in terms of, do I need two awesome wave table synths ? The four part multi timber function on the 3rd wave is a really big deal for me together with the resonance compensation and the fact it’s been designed by some of the greatest minds in the synth world. I think I may have talked myself into choosing the 3rd wave. It’s just a case of either the desktop or keyboard.
I wouldn't sell either my PolyBrute or MatrixBrute. They are special to me. 3rd Wave is a whole other animal. Save for them all :) Thanks for watching, TJ
To me these are quite different synths for quite different wants. Quantum filters to my ears are "smooth/tame" which is a subjective pro or con. To the point that were it my checkbook it would be Iridium KB; especially as one can be had new for $2500. I do not know where all production costs are in 3rd Wave so what I would want from them may not be possible. However, if they could do a 2 part 8 (maybe 10 or 12) voice desktop for around $2k that might get this skinflint to crack open his wallet. With the "full size" desktop announced at $3500 I figure maybe it could happen?
Yes, The Quantum analog filters are less aggressive. The digital filters can be more grinding. The 61 keys and extra memory is a plus vs the Iridium keys. Groove says they're working now on something very different then 3rd Wave. We'll see what they come up with Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroad I find myself among those believing how "analog" a synth/patch sounds has a lot less to do with having an analog vs. digital filter than one might think. Those with a 3rd Wave can try this for themselves by setting the low pass such that it has no effect. Then dial in or load a "classic analog" type patch and sweep circuit drift between 30 and 100. At the upper end "analog" awesomeness.
3rd Wave is more of a live player's synth, more immediate, more agile to program, although there are a few features I wish it had like gated sequencing, etc.. I really love its keybed now, it's mushy, almost waterfall-like --- can easily do accurate and ripping swipes and slides on it. It screams 80s retro in soooo many ways. It does big fat OB/Prophet-like sounds very very well, but can accomodate more inherent & interesting motion. Nothing against the Quantum, it is friggin amazing - that screen is glorious, but I don't have time for its depth, or another synth with that kind of price tag. :) Maybe someday!
Quantum is also very capable in a live setting. Things like the front panel knobs and the available performance X/Y pad on the touch screen are awesome. That said, it's more of a sound designer's dream synth. There's so much depth to explore. Thanks for watching. Cheers TJ
Totally agree - especially the depth of Quantum. I can much better get around in a DAW with 27” monitor, keyboard and mouse. Infinite possibilities and layers, easy to edit and mix. There is something to be said about having it all in a self contained unit, but meh, not as important to me as flexibility and options. A synth, in my opinion, should feel like an instrument. Didn’t get that vibe when playing a quantum.
There is so much to the Quantum - It is really an amazing synth. But in the end, despite the deep capabilities, it leaves me uninspired. I can't understand why, and even though I love everything about its design and architecture, its still the one I have to work to love. One thing to mention - the compressor knob on the outputs - what an AMAZING innovation: I would LOVE to see that on more synths.
Quantum is ever more inspiring the more you dig deeper into creating new sounds and presets. I can easily get lost and happy for hours tweaking just one new preset. There's so many many ways to make it even more come alive. Filling up all those mod slots with little details is where the magic happens. Thanks for watching, TJ
Hard choice. Quantum is very futuristic, sounds great for obscure techno sounds , fiction movie, very cinematographic will been have be better played with a drum bit to me. Beautiful design! Thanks for this beautiful demo.3 rd wave is more retro. More expensive too. With money will take both. Well I thinking about the Quantum.
I had an iridium and found that while it could do endless sounds, very few of them really inspired because of the basic tone of the thing - it just sounded like a VST, lifeless. I'm curious if the 3rd wave would sound similar, as I'm drawn to the unique sound/timbre qualities. Any thoughts about how inspirational/raw tone is on the 3rd wave v. the Waldorf?
I always find it difficult to respond to questions like this. I get inspiration from plugins, Quantum, and 3rd Wave alike. Not that all work for every situation. You need to experiment and good music will happen. Thanks for watching, TJ
Thank you for this very good video .With the Quantum can the LFO speed be progresively changed over it's duration ? It was really good that you built a preset .That is very helpful with understanding the instrument .
Listening again the next day... the 3rd Wave definitely has a more vibey and present sound... it does seem able to sound like old PPG Wave synths and an old analogue synth which is no surprise given that it uses SSM analogue filters... The Quantum however is like having 6 different synths.... wavetable, regular sampling, granular, VA, FM, resonator... having each of those on different oscillators at once in addition to the bi-timbrality makes for some amazing possibilities... The only drawback I have seen with the Waldorf range is that they seem to be a bit buggy... but hopefully software updates will fix that...
Quantum and Iridium are incredibly complex machines. The level of coding involved to make them tick is at a genius level. Bugs are inevitable because testing real world situations for the all variety of users is impossible. The solution is to save your patches and save often. Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad yeah I'm a coder in real life since 1980 so know the struggle. Waldorf are a small outfit and it's an amazing feat for them. There is seemingly a horrible glitchy bug in the granular engine which I've been getting recently (Iridium Keyboard).... not entirely sure why but it results in digital noise at full volume and it'll give me a heart attack one of these days ;)
The Quantum/Iridium was extremely buggy a few years ago but it’s becoming much more stable. One bug I reported has been fixed in version 3 of firmware . And it’s been worked on all the time. Having said that the 3rd Wave sounds better in most demos I’ve heard. Those analog filters sound brilliant. Does seem to capture the PPG vibe. But on my Iridium put some comb filter etc on it and it can sound very dirty or warm. You have to work to get it though. Not sure the Quantums analog filters are worth the extra. Fairly characterless compared to 3RD Wave. I’d definitely buy Mk2 compared to MK1. I returned the MK1 Quantum because I wasn’t happy with the quality.
Nice video! How different is the Quantum Mk2 compared to the Iridium in actual real use? I have the Iridium keyboard which I often play from a Prophet 5 Rev4. I know the Mk2 has 8 analogue filters but apart from that are there really any differences?
I have Iridium desktop. Never tried the Iridium keyboard. That said, more keys and internal memory are available on Quantum MKII. Panel layout on Quantum MKII has more controls vs Iridium keys. Quantum MKII has additional outputs but does not have the CV inputs or macro buttons like on Iridium keys. Quantum's analog filter is very nice too. Thanks for watching, TJ
The Iridium keyboard is good enough imo. Unless you have to have the extra octave. The analog filters are fairly tame. I’ve heard both and kept Iridium keyboard.👍
The Quantum (MK1) was the only synth out of about 20 I sold within the last 15 years. I simply hated it, and I also hate to say that because I would wish a good synth coming from my home country.. But, there are so many VSTi's out there that do a similar job at least, and many of them won't sound that sterile, thin, heartless. Even my old Poly800 (DCO, VCF) outperformed the Quantum with ease. I mean: Sound wise. You get a plethora of technical stuff from the Quantum, but what do I need it when it doesn't sound right? The 3rd Wave is a completely other beast. I would call it the best poly synth after 1990 together with the Moog One.
Personally, I feel that if I can't make a synth sound good, it isn't the synth's fault. Quantum isn't an all sweet spot type synth. It takes careful programming skill and determined experimentation of its deep worm hole to bring out the magic. And beautiful magic can be found in there. A whole lot of it too. Thanks for watching, TJ
That’s my thought exactly. Full of features but the sound is not musical. Hans using it for scoring. Good at designing effects and noise. Not music imo. 3rd Wave sounds very pleasing. I own one, so I know it can get wild and produce noise/effects too. But music is its forte, it’s evident. I use mine among the side of OB-X8 and Prophet 10. I swear I have no need/wants for any other hardware synths. Good job Groove Synthesis!
@2ammusik The thing is, Quantum has so much sound design capabilities that you can get wonderfully lost in it. Much of what you hear in demos is there to show that off. Yet, it also does very nice and simple wavetable, FM, and VA stuff that is very musical. As I said in the video, it's a chameleon synth. Thanks for watching, TJ
3rd Wave just killing Quantum. Day and night in terms of sound. Wavetables sound harsh on Waldorf. Analog filter doesn't help it. I'm hearing the same digital stuff which I didn't like on Iridium when I had it. Otoh, 3rd Wave w/o poly aftertouch doesn't make sense too for the price. Unless you don't care about it.
I got the WSOD after the first original 2 hours of first turning it on. But not since I updated the firmware. No other issues I've noticed after 9 month and lots of sessions. Cheers, TJ
I got burned pretty hard on the iridium. Not once, but twice I received faulty machines without any effective response from waldorf. Without going into the full story, I'll say I can't see myself even putting up significant money for one of their synths, and I would warn anyone else.
It just sucks because I learned the iridium inside and out and when it was working it was the most comprehensive and beautiful experience. Thanks for what you do tj, keep the videos rolling!
@matthewkinne7662 i'm wondering if Waldorf addressed these issues since you bought yours. i would understand if the first batch, or even the second batch of Iridiums were buggy. however, they are still making them now currently. i'm sure there are lots of owners that haven't encountered problems with their units. i guess it's a 50/50 chance you purchase a decent one.
@@tjontheroadThank you. I'm trying to buy one MK2 but almost no one stock in USA. Where did you buy yours? I put an Preorder on Sweetwater where I like the service. Thanks my friend. Wow. I also sold my 3rd wave keyboard and ordered a Module. I prefer Keys, but with Osmose and other PolyAT, was not using the keyboard from 3rd wave.
Question,i have the Quantum 1,and im definetly getting the MK 2,but my workflow with it is i sequence my mpc x with it and i couldnt figure out how to sequence on it.Could you explain how to sequence different patches at the same time with it?I had to create a patch and then record the audio and repeat like that,i was trying to see if i could make patch and go to next patch and etc…
Quantum's two layers can pattern sequence monophonicly each within a preset. While it can sample, it doesn't track live audio like a MPC. There isn't a way to sequence presets internally. You can program change via MIDI externally different presets that are saved into the favorites of Quantum. Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad Do you still have your Polybrute mate? I'll always remember that self generative patch you did on it a while back. That sounded incredible, just constantly moving and evolving. I'd love to hear you recreate that patch on the Quantum mk11, that would be quite something.
An expensive Waldorf has crappy op-amps and a bad DAC for its price. 3rd wave also has significant disadvantages, so I don’t need either synthesizer for their prices. A modular for this money is a blessing, but all these expensive boxes with their prices are a disappointment.
A modular rig that could do the same as Quantum or 3rd Wave with the same amount of polyphony would cost exponentially more money and would be very impractical to use. A spaghetti nightmare for just a few voices for sure. Plus, your average eurorack VCA or DAC isn't much better and may likely comes from the same parts bin supplier. Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad You are wrong my friend about my Eurorack, I am not a mere mortal! I am a professional electronics engineer and I assembled my modular myself, and I modified all ready-made commercial modules. My modular is not made of shit like NJM4580, TL074 abd Co. All my synthesizers sound better than all others and they have the best 1 bit delta sigma DACs when it comes to digital. So I know everything about all manufacturers better than anyone else! I repair a lot and help people solve problems with synthesizers and I know all the hardware of any manufacturer.
@@tjontheroad Unfortunately, when the entire global music industry comes to a standstill and saves every cent, even the RME Fireface UFX 2 interface (I also have the best ones in it and it sounds like RME for 8000 euros) and other more expensive music boxes do not have the best examples of the electrical industry. And often all manufacturers choose the worst of all that can be chosen. And today there is definitely a choice of the best of the best operational amplifiers for audio or DAC. When I don’t see the point in developing my own modules, since there are DIY Kits on DIP packages, then sometimes I buy DIY Kits. And in order to replace DIP14 TL074 with 2xSO8 best OPVs, I made an such adapter (I ordered 500 pieces at once). Using this adapter, I can install the best operational amplifiers in any block of any VСA, VСF, VСO modular. The problem with some synthesizers is the choice of DACs or op-amp packages for which there is no better alternative. These are the ones that become uninteresting to me. :-) Yes, synthesis is a great thing, and yes, Quantum and 3rd wave are good, but sound is more important to me. I would rather pay extra money for quality than get a lot in a box but no good sound for less money.
OTOH, some of the greatest music ever recorded was created with some pretty shitty gear that no one wanted at the time. It's all relative. Use your ears and you'll go farther ;) Cheers, TJ
Thanks TJ for the comparison. But honestly? I think you knew the outcome... In my life of 40 years of buying, collecting and using synths, the Iridium desktop (which is a Quantum in desktop version) only lasted 1 day in my studio before I brought it back where it came from. Why? The latest Waldorf range are nice looking synths with a zillion possibilities, but hell, they sound like 'bad' VST's. And I'm not the only one saying this... (I own a vintage Q and XTK, both 30+ voice versions) My god, what have those guys in Germany been doing ?? Even Omnisphere sounds 100x better than a Quantum. Quantum owners, DO not fool yourself. Let's cut the crap. You own an expensive, bad sounding VST hardware synth. End of story. The 3rd Wave in contrary, a different league, is a top notch machine that sounds almost better than the original 2.3 All said. Case closed. With the Quantum / Iridium, the real Waldorf artisanal synth making seems to be over for ever ?
Thanks for watching the video. Sadly, I couldn't disagree with you more however regarding the Waldorf line. I also owned and extensively demo'd the Iridium here on this channel with over 20 videos. (mine was one of the first available in the US). I only sold the Iridium to upgrade to the Quantum MKII. Honestly, it was a major investment for me and I'm thrilled with it. There is no single plug-in that can do everything Quantum or Iridium can do. With respect, if you've only spent one day with Quantum or Iridium, you denied yourself years of joyful and endless exploration. It is a monster synth. It has subtle sound qualities that no plug in can match. It also has an engaging presence with sitting in front of it. It inspires me to play and to create new sounds every time I turn it on. That intangible in and of itself cannot be reproduced in a plug in. We do agree on some things. 3rd Wave is also in a monster synth category. It amazing what Groove has done with their first offering. So in closing, yes I already knew the outcome. They are both awesome. But more importantly, it isn't a competition. Creating music is about using your tools to the fullest. Both these synth allow me to wield a very strong hand. Cheers, TJ
OMG, I’ve watched 15 minutes already and beyond that intro (in which we have no Idea what instrument is creating what sound) there hasn’t been a single sound example yet. Just a ton of waffle about the number of oscillators and filters and mod sources, etc. Pretty much every high end synth (and quite a few lower end synths, e.g. Hydra) have that stuff too.
This guy that tries to argue they are "equal", I'll put to rest right now. Don't know why he defends the quantum. Why I hate the Quantum MKII and why YOU shouldnt buy one from a statistical and logical perspective coming from an obsessed nerd: 1: Quantum MKII is extremely expensive, doesnt come in a desktop format which would reduce its price even though the iridium does 2: Nobody raves about a quantum because for its price, size, and analog voice count of only 8, for its price, you can just get an iridium and a 3rd wave both in desktop modules for the same price! And was even rated most over priced synth in the most detailed synth list video for 2024. 3: People complain the waldorf iridium/quantum overloads even at 5-6 voices its possible, which I didnt even know about till recently. 4: The 3rd wave has sampling, WAY better wavetable synthesis, and better VA synthesis with the same "drift" mode as sequential and oberheim which is the best EVER made and 1 to 1 clones the original old models. It even has basic FM. But if you want better FM, physical modeling, and sampling, just get a Korg Kronos 2 61 key (or nautilus if you dont care about ribbon control), Yamaha Montage 6 (not the new M model), and control it all from an Osmose expressive e using MIDI thru (Kronos actually has polyphonic aftertouch), while using their live set features (3rd wave will eventually have live set mode), and you have a significantly better sound for barely more money than the Waldorf Quantum MKII. For a live setting just audio in the 3rd wave to the Kronos, youll be missing a little sparkle that the Montage gives you from FM but everything else is there and WAY better. And Objectively sounds and performs WAY better for live! 5: Waldorf like the Moog One has tons of issues cause its such a complex new instrument at such an expensive price point, UNLIKE the Korg Kronos and nautilus and montage that have been out for awhile and are STILL the best in their class (New montage M isnt worth it if you have other gear, doesnt add more FMx voices, "New" Korg nautilus is just a Kronos with no hardware controls) 6: The 3rd wave has REAL prophet SSI2140 filters and insanely accurate oberheim SEM filters which are better than any non sequential or oberheim instrument ON THE MARKET. Find me a synth without a sequential or oberheim logo that replicates their filters anywhere near as well, the Behringer and UDO disappoint me with their garbage "drift" emulation, lower voice count and timbre count and quality FX, and most importantly how they FAIL to reach the highest range of the frequencies of their filters in comparison to REAL SSM2044 filters and the behringers failed SEM and CURTIS filter replications, that while sound close ENOUGH to the original, arent as close as the 3rd wave. What UDO did with the SSI2144 filters DO NOT SOUND anything like Korgs old SSM2044 filter synths or the PPG wave 2.2 SSM2044 filter sound, and almost sounds like software level glassiness (excluding the super high resolution that software cant replicate), which completely defeats the purpose of buying an analog/analog hybrid instrument. DO NOT buy this instrument, I cannot recommend this to ANYONE, even at a 25% discount. Buy a 3rd wave desktop $3150 NEW (use any 10% discount code perfect circut has for ALL products, and force any other retailer to price match) And a Korg Nautilus 61 for $1600-1700 or a Kronos 2 88 for just $2000 used! If you prefer FM over extra analog and better sampling with 240 voices "HD-1 engine", get a montage 6 or 7 for just over $2000 used. And GUESS WHAT, because the Quantum is so BAD at keeping value (nobody SERIOUS owns one), you can get a QUANTUM MK1 FOR JUST $2300!!! And their price is STILL DROPPING! JUST LIKE THAT, you can get a 3rd wave desktop, PLUS a Korg, Yamaha, or Waldorf last generation flagship, AND STILL be cheaper than a Quantum MKII And have a 10x better result. I personally recommend a 3rd wave desktop and Korg Kronos 2 88, if you want montage M reverb and delay, get Meris Mercury X and LVX pedals. For Quantum Granular, Empress FX Zoia. You are welcome.
A few counterpoints; 1) I never said they are equal. In fact the whole video draws contrast between the two synths. 2) This video was produced before the large across the board Waldorf price increase in the US and elsewhere. At the current price of Quantum MKII, I too think it is overly expensive. 3) Reduced voice counts with Quantum can happen if you overtask the CPU. This being rare and only likely if you try using several Kernel engines as oscillators. Doing that is kinda overkill anyway. 4) 3rd Wave only has a small amount of memory for sampling that isn’t expandable. It is also only in mono. Quantum has has multiple times the amount of stereo sampling memory on board and is expandable with external drives. Note, 3rd Wave did not have sampling at the time this video was made. 5) Quantum has the capability to do drift via the mod matrix and/or within each of the oscillator menus. 6) The Quantum Kernel engine is more than just FM. It is a modular building block for many types of synthesis. 7) Quantum has analog filters along with multiple digital filters. 8) Stating “nobody SERIOUS owns one” about Quantum is pretty ridiculous if you’re at all paying attention. Look, I also love 3rd Wave. But diss’ing Quantum on my channel without really knowing the facts says more about the user and not the synth. You are welcome Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroad name one reputable synth player or talented keyboardist that has a quantum, and if you can, look at the amount of iridium vs quantums out in the wild, hmmmm I wonder why. As I said iridium + 3rd wave desktop is the same or cheaper price especially if you get your iridium from thomann. The quantums filters are trash, especially in comparison to the 3rd wave. This is an objective fact not an opinion. For the price it's underwhelming. For a little more than a quantum mk2 you can get a Melbourne Nina synth desktop or Arturia polybrute 12 and 3rd wave desktop still under $7000, you're wrong. As I said get a korg Kronos 2 88 for sampling with 240 voices with significantly nastier leads and more aggressive and bigger sounds that doesn't get overwhelmed as easily like the quantum or iridium and extra analog goodness it gives you over any yamaha or Waldorf. Looks like you ignored the fact we are talking about $6000 and there's still over $2500 to be played with when comparing the 3rd wave to the quantum, getting a full size Kronos for only $2000 with a 3rd wave desktop for $3150 is still over $500 cheaper than the quantum mk2 excluding tax and shipping. So you're also wrong on that. Quantums drift is just as trash as behringers and udos, obviously you don't know or acknowledge that. Go research who invented the proper technique for drift mode, the only 4 companies that have it are sequential, Oberheim, Arturia, and now groove synthesis, because the guy who made that proper drift mode worked with all 4 of them for that result, there's even a video on RUclips of it. The kronos and montage do not get as overwhelmed so easily. Kernel engine whoohoo modular get an iridium core or Empress fx zoia and save your money. And for the fact you just admitted it's what causes the cpu to s**t itself probably shows an underpowered cpu for $6000. If the kernel engine is so good maybe that's why people find out it makes the Quantums voices cry, so I guess it's not so rare after all. So that point is also stupid. You admit the price is disgusting. They aren't equal, that's right, ones a scam literally, and the other is probably the best desktop form factor synth other than the Nina synth EVER made. Thank you very much, your counter points are all false. Have a nice day sir. Trying to counter my comment on your channel without really knowing the facts says more about the user and not the objective truth of you trying to commend a snake oil piece of gear that is over twice the price of the 1st Gen product used with nothing more obvious from the outside other than poly after touch. Which both the 3rd wave and Kronos have. And have had since the 2010s.
@@alainthiry3965 so you say that your criteria about what is great is so superlative that it is an absolute truth?. If I find to be good the sounds the friend here create, am I wrong?, how do you prove your taste and criteria is superior than mine?. What sounds good or not for you is a subjective topic.
![KSI - Thick Of It (feat. Trippie Redd) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/At8v_Yc044Y/mqdefault.jpg)
Your channel is highly underrated, thank you for all you are doing in regard to inform us about these amazing synths. You are an unsung hero.
Thanks for the kind words. Cheers, TJ
The video I’ve been waiting for
Thanks for watching. I hope it was worth the wait. Cheers TJ
1:09:36 Appreciate the detail in showing creating a new patch on each synth step by step. Very helpful to see the workflow laid out.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Problem solved: The Waldorf Quantum II with poly-aftertouch PLUS the 3rd Wave 'module' (plus the Oberheim OB-X8 'module') working harmoniously. Cheers!
I feel your pain. I'm a synthaholic. I buy, collect, play till I'm drunk. No problem lol.
Thanks for watching.
You must do a new review. 😀🥰@@tjontheroad
A 3rd Wave desktop review is possibly in the works. Stay tuned.
Thanks TJ - very helpful.
3W sounds so so much better and more usable to my ears. That analogue filter omg.
I’d rather have Pigments / Serum / Diva than the Waldorf
Thanks for watching. I think they both sound "better" ;)
I love the “I could use a VST for X synth” argument. The same synths you listed could be 3W replacements too. In fact, if you use a PPG VST, Serum and Diva that would cover everything a 3W could do.
It’s funny because I do and say the same thing when I’m not really feeling a synth is worth it or it doesn’t speak to me.
It’s really all about preference and your tastes. Glad the 3W exists and that it speaks to you!
Maybe first get Ur ears checked 😊
The Waldorf's have a certain sound. I think they are good for certain things but fail as a general use synth. I have not had enough time with the 3rd Wave to have a strong opinion. I need to spend some time with mine but have been on other things. Big reason I bought it is because a PPG is too pricey and I love the PPG sound. I probably wouldn't go for a quantum even if I had the free cash. I'm good with the 3rd wave and XTk.
I love my mark 1 quantum. Took quite a while to get to grips with it, but now I find it very easy to program and most importantly I find the sounds sit really well in a mix (I have a lovely, wonky vintage analog poly which is great to play on its own, but really hard to use in a track).
Wish it had a poly after touch keybed, but otherwise it’s almost perfect (which wasn’t quite my first impression!).
Quantum is a beast of a synth with a near endless rabbit hole to explore.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Wow, I think I would get Quantum. Great futuristic vibes.
Yeah, Quantum is futuristic and 3rd Wave is kinda retro.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Nice sounds.The core and the desktop 3rd wave are coming.
An excellent combination. Enjoy.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Could not decide so I purchased both
You have made only the correct choice. Well done :)
Thanks again watching, TJ
Waldorf every day.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Interesting that people hear things so differently. Several people seem to hate the sounds the Quantum makes. Apparently 2 small time synth users, Hans Zimmer and Junkie XL, seem to love the Quantum as maybe their favorite synth. And the guys who built the 3rd Wave are not novice tinkerers. They worked for Avid and Sequential on design and audio DSP. My guess is that the Groove guys know about synths and are trying their best to make the best.
As I believe TJ said, the correct answer is both. My compromise was the Iridium keyboard and 3rd Wave desktop module. Smaller and I am cheap.
Quantum has its haters from the analog synth purest crowd. It'll never complete in that arena and it doesn't have to. It's at a whole other level of synth abilities.
Cheers, TJ
LoL i think that if you cant hear the difference is because you never own one, or your ears are not technically trained to listened to transient character bass power and presence in the mix. Iridium is really a beast in synthesis power but in the end the sound is poor in everything..i always said is a vst in the box..nothing more. The Quantum is a quite better on filters analog but nothing compared to 3rd wave…no character no sit in the mix..
The 3rd wave is incredible in everything, now can also sampling…a d thevbest part is the sound…deep basses, character, presence in the mix…
I had the iridium for 3 months and sell it immediately, tested the quantum for 2 weeks and send it back..own the 3rd wave and ill never ever sell it..a masterpiece.
The interface and featureset of the Quantum is nice. However, the 3rd Wave sounds so much better to me.
I find I don't have a preference sound wise between them. They are complimentary to each other. The multi-track section of the video I believe demo's that very well.
Cheers, TJ
@tjontheroad Perhaps I feel this way because prefer the more vintage sound or character the 3rd Wave brings as opposed to the more modern contemporary sound of the Quantum. Thank you for demoing and comparing these two synths for us. I really appreciate it.
BTW, One your old videos from a couple of years ago influenced me to buy the Matrixbrute/Polybrute combo. I'm glad I did. They're such a nice blend between modern and vintage sound as far as analog synths go. There are so many sound design possibilities with them as well.
If I'm to do it over again, it would be 3rdwave desktop, Quantum 2 keyboard and Moog Matriach for bass. Of course my EMU sampler called the E6400 stays.
@audiolego That sounds like a sweet setup there, especially with the Matriarch and the E-MU sampler. I have an E4XT Ultra myself. Although I hardly use it, I'm never getting rid of it simply because it sounds so good. I have future plans to reintegrate it into my setup. Well, it's already a part of my setup. I just have to hook it up.
The next time I play the 3rd Wave, I might bring a pair of headphones to get another perspective on how it sounds. I've never tried it with headphones. I've played the Iridium as well, and I hate to say it, but the Waldorf sounds more like a plugin to me, and the interface feels more to me like a computer than a standalone synth to be honest. Well, it basically is a computer, but with dedicated buttons knobs, and a keyboard. I think it's the touchscreen that makes it feel like a computer. However, my Fantom-06 and MPC have touchscreens as well, and yes, they feel somewhat like computers, too. However, they still feel like standalone hardware. In regards to the Iridium, the interface is still nice and very intuitive eventhough it has the feel of a computer. It's the sound of the Iridium that doesn't really inspire me more so than the interface.
More recently since my last previous posts above, I finally had a chance to get my hands on a Quantum Mk2 to see, play, and hear for myself. It is very, very, impressive, I must say. The interface is really nice and it feels great. I also like the poly aftertouch keyboard. In terms of sound, it is very versatile and flexible. However, it definitely has a darker tone in comparison to the 3rd Wave. Sometimes, things can get a little muddy in the midrange on the Quantum if you don't tweak it right or put some eq on it, depending on the patch. To be honest, they both sound very good. However, I still prefer the sound of the 3rd Wave over that of the Quantum.
Two great synths to compare. I have a few things in common. I am mainly a guitar player. Lately I have taken the plunge into synthesizers. I found your channel because of the 3rd Wave. I just ordered a 3rd Wave desktop version. I also have: Pro 3, OB-6, OB-X8, Trigon 6 desktop, Iridium Keyboard, M, Summit, System 8,, Prologue, JP-8000, Erica Syntrx II, Subsequent 37, Matriarch, Prophet X, other ... And a lot of effects. Recently got LVX, Mercury X, OTO BIM BAM BOUM, Meraki, and have many more. I have been hiding out but plan to share sounds and experiences in 2024. I watch GEOSyths and Pro Synth Network on RUclips. I see that you have a lot of information and sounds on a lot. Cheers.
No need to hide. Let it all hang out my friend :)
Thanks for watching, TJ
I own the Waldorf iridium keyboard and it produces some truly “alien band” sounds. I have never been a fan of FM (DX-7)or Wavetable (PPG) sounds but the iridium does SO MUCH MORE.
the 3rd wave truly sounds SO SWEET! for movie soundtrack synth effects I’d say iridium hands down. The 3rd wave sounds more inviting. It’s a strong contender for GEAR LUST SYNDROME.
Lust is a strong word. I like it lol.
Thanks for watching, TJ
I'm for the Quantum. I have a P12 which covers the 3rd Wave territory pretty well, and with a similar workflow.
I sold to my P12 module to help finance the 3rd Wave. No regrets. Thanks for watching, TJ
Nah.. i have the Prophet 12 for year and had the 3rd Wave for 30 Days (didnt bought at the end). BUT the P12 dont cover the 3rd Wave territory! P12 has no real wavetables / scan and the 3rdWave sounds way more analog! BUT the P12 has SO MUCH MORE CHARACTER!
@@maycusskywalker3643 One up for the P12 character!
I'm long time interested in the Quantum and about to purchase an Iridium.
This is very helpful!
Glad you found it helpful. Thanks for watching. Cheers, TJ
Don't waste your money, Sir.
One man's trash is another man's treasure.
@@Tvaroh What makes it a waste?
@@Tom_Synergy it just doesn't sound good for that price range. I had it for a year and couldn't stand. Filters are garbage (Dune3 VST synth filters are far superior, for instance). Wave tables traveling sounds harsh. Voice count isn't really 16, it frequently overloads and starts to cut them off very early, like at 5-6. Display is not very responsive. And many many more, as always with Waldorf products.
The answer is both..... well iridium keys in my case not Quantum - though I will swap at some point in the future.
Absolutely yes both is the answer.
Thanks for watching. TJ
I’ve not have a chance to program the 3rd Wave. Although, I do plan on parking one to my synth garage. I do have a Quantum. First, it’s one of the prettiest synths out there. Second, it is a pad power house. I’m talking Digital LSD. The Quantum is a very deep synth. I’m anxious to see how deep down the 3rd Wave dives.
3rd Wave isn't as deep but no less the experience.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Cool video. It is possible to split with different sounds the keyboard on the Waldorf MK2 like a Workstation?
Yes, Quantum has 2 available layers.
Thanks for watching, TJ
I’ve had a Quantum mk 1 from when it was first released and despite it taking a while to get to really know, it’s now one of, if not my favourite all round synth, it really can do nearly anything and I have a prophet 10, obx 8, Moog One, polybrute, OB 6, Hydra delux and more. I think many people don’t give the Quantum enough time to learn. It’s so deep that it’s easy to accidentally make it sound harsh via the filters being overloaded or too much compression. I’m a huge fan of Waldorf for good reason. However the 3rd wave does sound incredibly good, so in your opinion, would you recommend I splash out on a 3rd wave next or would you get the new Moog Muse which also sounds incredibly good ? I’m torn between the two and because it’ll take a lifetime to get to the bottom of the Quantum I suspect I’d be covering the same or very similar ground with the 3rd wave. What do you think ?
First, thanks for watching. I've not yet tried the Muse myself. So, I can't really talk from personal experience. That said, it looks awesome. Comparing Muse to 3rd Wave is very much apples to oranges. Muse being an 8 voice analog and 3rd Wave being a 24 voice digital synth. 3rd Wave is much more capable. But if that all analog poly sound is calling you, go for it.
Cheers TJ
@@tjontheroadthanks for the reply 🙏🏻 and I know what you mean but I was thinking more in terms of, do I need two awesome wave table synths ?
The four part multi timber function on the 3rd wave is a really big deal for me together with the resonance compensation and the fact it’s been designed by some of the greatest minds in the synth world. I think I may have talked myself into choosing the 3rd wave. It’s just a case of either the desktop or keyboard.
Worth selling the Polybrute to get 3rd Wave?
Have a Matrixbrute as well.
Thanks again for an invaluable comparison.👍
I wouldn't sell either my PolyBrute or MatrixBrute. They are special to me. 3rd Wave is a whole other animal. Save for them all :)
Thanks for watching, TJ
To me these are quite different synths for quite different wants. Quantum filters to my ears are "smooth/tame" which is a subjective pro or con. To the point that were it my checkbook it would be Iridium KB; especially as one can be had new for $2500. I do not know where all production costs are in 3rd Wave so what I would want from them may not be possible. However, if they could do a 2 part 8 (maybe 10 or 12) voice desktop for around $2k that might get this skinflint to crack open his wallet. With the "full size" desktop announced at $3500 I figure maybe it could happen?
Yes, The Quantum analog filters are less aggressive. The digital filters can be more grinding. The 61 keys and extra memory is a plus vs the Iridium keys.
Groove says they're working now on something very different then 3rd Wave. We'll see what they come up with
Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroad I find myself among those believing how "analog" a synth/patch sounds has a lot less to do with having an analog vs. digital filter than one might think. Those with a 3rd Wave can try this for themselves by setting the low pass such that it has no effect. Then dial in or load a "classic analog" type patch and sweep circuit drift between 30 and 100. At the upper end "analog" awesomeness.
Yes, terms like "analog" and "digital" become mute when careful programming sound design is applied to the synth as a whole.
3rd Wave is more of a live player's synth, more immediate, more agile to program, although there are a few features I wish it had like gated sequencing, etc.. I really love its keybed now, it's mushy, almost waterfall-like --- can easily do accurate and ripping swipes and slides on it. It screams 80s retro in soooo many ways. It does big fat OB/Prophet-like sounds very very well, but can accomodate more inherent & interesting motion. Nothing against the Quantum, it is friggin amazing - that screen is glorious, but I don't have time for its depth, or another synth with that kind of price tag. :) Maybe someday!
Quantum is also very capable in a live setting. Things like the front panel knobs and the available performance X/Y pad on the touch screen are awesome. That said, it's more of a sound designer's dream synth. There's so much depth to explore.
Thanks for watching. Cheers TJ
Totally agree - especially the depth of Quantum. I can much better get around in a DAW with 27” monitor, keyboard and mouse. Infinite possibilities and layers, easy to edit and mix. There is something to be said about having it all in a self contained unit, but meh, not as important to me as flexibility and options. A synth, in my opinion, should feel like an instrument. Didn’t get that vibe when playing a quantum.
Just digging in to this, but where did you get those blue dust covers?! 😍💙
DigitalDeckCovers.com
Thanks for watching. TJ
There is so much to the Quantum - It is really an amazing synth. But in the end, despite the deep capabilities, it leaves me uninspired. I can't understand why, and even though I love everything about its design and architecture, its still the one I have to work to love. One thing to mention - the compressor knob on the outputs - what an AMAZING innovation: I would LOVE to see that on more synths.
Quantum is ever more inspiring the more you dig deeper into creating new sounds and presets. I can easily get lost and happy for hours tweaking just one new preset. There's so many many ways to make it even more come alive. Filling up all those mod slots with little details is where the magic happens.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Hard choice. Quantum is very futuristic, sounds great for obscure techno sounds , fiction movie, very cinematographic will been have be better played with a drum bit to me. Beautiful design! Thanks for this beautiful demo.3 rd wave is more retro. More expensive too. With money will take both. Well I thinking about the Quantum.
@@kamelhamlaoui9983 Thanks for watching, TJ
You nailed it. That Quantum is nothing more than a bad VST in hardware form. But I understand owners who've spend 4k will never admit their fault.
@@sK3LeTvM1 Obviously you are just bitter not affording a synth from the Quantum league...
"Vs", my ass. These two together would be my dream setup!
True. Both is the only logical solution.
Thanks for watching, TJ
I had an iridium and found that while it could do endless sounds, very few of them really inspired because of the basic tone of the thing - it just sounded like a VST, lifeless. I'm curious if the 3rd wave would sound similar, as I'm drawn to the unique sound/timbre qualities. Any thoughts about how inspirational/raw tone is on the 3rd wave v. the Waldorf?
I always find it difficult to respond to questions like this. I get inspiration from plugins, Quantum, and 3rd Wave alike. Not that all work for every situation. You need to experiment and good music will happen.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Thank you for this very good video .With the Quantum can the LFO speed be progresively changed over it's duration ? It was really good that you built a preset .That is very helpful with understanding the instrument .
Yes, LFO speed is an available destination in the mod matrix.
Thanks for watching, TJ
3rd wave groove module rewiew in plans maybe?
Yes, a comparison of the 3rd Wave desktop vs keyboard is hopefully happening very soon.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Thx th great channel.@@tjontheroad
Listening again the next day... the 3rd Wave definitely has a more vibey and present sound... it does seem able to sound like old PPG Wave synths and an old analogue synth which is no surprise given that it uses SSM analogue filters...
The Quantum however is like having 6 different synths.... wavetable, regular sampling, granular, VA, FM, resonator... having each of those on different oscillators at once in addition to the bi-timbrality makes for some amazing possibilities...
The only drawback I have seen with the Waldorf range is that they seem to be a bit buggy... but hopefully software updates will fix that...
Quantum and Iridium are incredibly complex machines. The level of coding involved to make them tick is at a genius level. Bugs are inevitable because testing real world situations for the all variety of users is impossible. The solution is to save your patches and save often.
Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad yeah I'm a coder in real life since 1980 so know the struggle. Waldorf are a small outfit and it's an amazing feat for them. There is seemingly a horrible glitchy bug in the granular engine which I've been getting recently (Iridium Keyboard).... not entirely sure why but it results in digital noise at full volume and it'll give me a heart attack one of these days ;)
@@neilloughran4437 If it's repeatable, you may want to report the bug to Waldorf support. FWIW, I've never come across that.
@@tjontheroad yeah only started recently... will try and record it at some point....
The Quantum/Iridium was extremely buggy a few years ago but it’s becoming much more stable. One bug I reported has been fixed in version 3 of firmware .
And it’s been worked on all the time.
Having said that the 3rd Wave sounds better in most demos I’ve heard. Those analog filters sound brilliant. Does seem to capture the PPG vibe.
But on my Iridium put some comb filter etc on it and it can sound very dirty or warm.
You have to work to get it though.
Not sure the Quantums analog filters are worth the extra. Fairly characterless compared to 3RD Wave.
I’d definitely buy Mk2 compared to MK1. I returned the MK1 Quantum because I wasn’t happy with the quality.
Nice video! How different is the Quantum Mk2 compared to the Iridium in actual real use? I have the Iridium keyboard which I often play from a Prophet 5 Rev4. I know the Mk2 has 8 analogue filters but apart from that are there really any differences?
I have Iridium desktop. Never tried the Iridium keyboard. That said, more keys and internal memory are available on Quantum MKII. Panel layout on Quantum MKII has more controls vs Iridium keys. Quantum MKII has additional outputs but does not have the CV inputs or macro buttons like on Iridium keys. Quantum's analog filter is very nice too.
Thanks for watching, TJ
The Iridium keyboard is good enough imo.
Unless you have to have the extra octave.
The analog filters are fairly tame.
I’ve heard both and kept Iridium keyboard.👍
The Quantum (MK1) was the only synth out of about 20 I sold within the last 15 years. I simply hated it, and I also hate to say that because I would wish a good synth coming from my home country.. But, there are so many VSTi's out there that do a similar job at least, and many of them won't sound that sterile, thin, heartless. Even my old Poly800 (DCO, VCF) outperformed the Quantum with ease. I mean: Sound wise. You get a plethora of technical stuff from the Quantum, but what do I need it when it doesn't sound right?
The 3rd Wave is a completely other beast. I would call it the best poly synth after 1990 together with the Moog One.
Personally, I feel that if I can't make a synth sound good, it isn't the synth's fault. Quantum isn't an all sweet spot type synth. It takes careful programming skill and determined experimentation of its deep worm hole to bring out the magic. And beautiful magic can be found in there. A whole lot of it too.
Thanks for watching, TJ
Why does Hans Zimmer like the Quantum so much? It must sound good on certain days. I don't think Hans needs a bribe to say he likes it.
@@mrfuzztone I think it is because matches all the sound design needs for HZ and that it's German designed.
That’s my thought exactly. Full of features but the sound is not musical. Hans using it for scoring. Good at designing effects and noise. Not music imo. 3rd Wave sounds very pleasing. I own one, so I know it can get wild and produce noise/effects too. But music is its forte, it’s evident. I use mine among the side of OB-X8 and Prophet 10. I swear I have no need/wants for any other hardware synths. Good job Groove Synthesis!
@2ammusik The thing is, Quantum has so much sound design capabilities that you can get wonderfully lost in it. Much of what you hear in demos is there to show that off. Yet, it also does very nice and simple wavetable, FM, and VA stuff that is very musical. As I said in the video, it's a chameleon synth.
Thanks for watching, TJ
3rd Wave just killing Quantum. Day and night in terms of sound. Wavetables sound harsh on Waldorf. Analog filter doesn't help it. I'm hearing the same digital stuff which I didn't like on Iridium when I had it. Otoh, 3rd Wave w/o poly aftertouch doesn't make sense too for the price. Unless you don't care about it.
Note, I set the Quantum wavetables to the "Legacy" mode in the video. They sound very clean in "Smooth" mode.
Thanks, for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad they sound not too good in any mode, from my experience with Iridium.
you've had the Quantum MKII for several months now. any bugs, glitches, or quirks yet? no "white screen of death" or related issues?
I got the WSOD after the first original 2 hours of first turning it on. But not since I updated the firmware. No other issues I've noticed after 9 month and lots of sessions.
Cheers, TJ
I got burned pretty hard on the iridium. Not once, but twice I received faulty machines without any effective response from waldorf. Without going into the full story, I'll say I can't see myself even putting up significant money for one of their synths, and I would warn anyone else.
same for quantum too, ill wait for mk3
Sorry to hear about that. I guess 3rd Wave is much more for you.
Thanks for watching, TJ
It just sucks because I learned the iridium inside and out and when it was working it was the most comprehensive and beautiful experience. Thanks for what you do tj, keep the videos rolling!
@@matthewkinne7662 Thanks for watching. Cheers TJ
@matthewkinne7662 i'm wondering if Waldorf addressed these issues since you bought yours. i would understand if the first batch, or even the second batch of Iridiums were buggy. however, they are still making them now currently. i'm sure there are lots of owners that haven't encountered problems with their units. i guess it's a 50/50 chance you purchase a decent one.
Hi. The screen from MK2 is exactly the same as the Iridium Module? Thanks.
No, the Quantum MKII has a slightly larger screen with a faster response time.
Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroadThank you. I'm trying to buy one MK2 but almost no one stock in USA. Where did you buy yours? I put an Preorder on Sweetwater where I like the service. Thanks my friend. Wow. I also sold my 3rd wave keyboard and ordered a Module. I prefer Keys, but with Osmose and other PolyAT, was not using the keyboard from 3rd wave.
I bought from Musiciansfriend.com
Thanks for watching, TJ
Question,i have the Quantum 1,and im definetly getting the MK 2,but my workflow with it is i sequence my mpc x with it and i couldnt figure out how to sequence on it.Could you explain how to sequence different patches at the same time with it?I had to create a patch and then record the audio and repeat like that,i was trying to see if i could make patch and go to
next patch and etc…
Quantum's two layers can pattern sequence monophonicly each within a preset. While it can sample, it doesn't track live audio like a MPC. There isn't a way to sequence presets internally. You can program change via MIDI externally different presets that are saved into the favorites of Quantum.
Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad Thank my man…🫡🫡🫡
Ddyyaamm son, you win the lottery or something?:).
I think you should try out the UDO Super Gemini....its quite simply a master piece.
I have a UDO Super6 desktop. I get the vibe with that.
Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad Do you still have your Polybrute mate?
I'll always remember that self generative patch you did on it a while back.
That sounded incredible, just constantly moving and evolving.
I'd love to hear you recreate that patch on the Quantum mk11, that would be quite something.
Yep, still have and love PolyBrute. I've built some generative patches on Quantum too.
@@tjontheroad did you show them on a video my mate, I must have missed it.
No, not created enough of those type of patches for a video. I'm currently working on other things.
For me, the Sonics on 3d wave are more brilliant and glorious.
Both are glorious. 3rd Wave is more distinctive in character. Quantum is the do all master.
Thanks for watching, TJ
those cheesedk 70s pitch/mod wheels tho
Yeah, the wheels are strange on Quantum. Very narrow and difficult to get a grip onto.
Thanks for watching. TJ
3rd wave sounds so big
Thanks for watching. Cheers TJ
Quantum Wins
Everybody wins here ;)
@@tjontheroad Now that i think about it,i agree…🫡🫡🫡
Neither seem to have the magic and ability to inspire awe that I hear in the SUPER GEMINI.
Well, at least they both have a screen (says a Super 6 owner) ;)
Thanks for watching, TJ
"Mk" is just short for "Mark" so it is the Quantum Mark 2
I'm aware of that. "MK" just sounds better to me lol.
Thanks for watching, TJ
I'm waiting for Quantum MK Ultra, where the kernels go rogue...
An expensive Waldorf has crappy op-amps and a bad DAC for its price. 3rd wave also has significant disadvantages, so I don’t need either synthesizer for their prices. A modular for this money is a blessing, but all these expensive boxes with their prices are a disappointment.
A modular rig that could do the same as Quantum or 3rd Wave with the same amount of polyphony would cost exponentially more money and would be very impractical to use. A spaghetti nightmare for just a few voices for sure. Plus, your average eurorack VCA or DAC isn't much better and may likely comes from the same parts bin supplier.
Thanks for watching, TJ
@@tjontheroad You are wrong my friend about my Eurorack, I am not a mere mortal! I am a professional electronics engineer and I assembled my modular myself, and I modified all ready-made commercial modules. My modular is not made of shit like NJM4580, TL074 abd Co. All my synthesizers sound better than all others and they have the best 1 bit delta sigma DACs when it comes to digital. So I know everything about all manufacturers better than anyone else! I repair a lot and help people solve problems with synthesizers and I know all the hardware of any manufacturer.
Most mere mortals aren't doing high level DIY. I'm glad to know there are folks out there like yourself.
Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroad Unfortunately, when the entire global music industry comes to a standstill and saves every cent, even the RME Fireface UFX 2 interface (I also have the best ones in it and it sounds like RME for 8000 euros) and other more expensive music boxes do not have the best examples of the electrical industry. And often all manufacturers choose the worst of all that can be chosen. And today there is definitely a choice of the best of the best operational amplifiers for audio or DAC. When I don’t see the point in developing my own modules, since there are DIY Kits on DIP packages, then sometimes I buy DIY Kits. And in order to replace DIP14 TL074 with 2xSO8 best OPVs, I made an such adapter (I ordered 500 pieces at once). Using this adapter, I can install the best operational amplifiers in any block of any VСA, VСF, VСO modular.
The problem with some synthesizers is the choice of DACs or op-amp packages for which there is no better alternative. These are the ones that become uninteresting to me. :-) Yes, synthesis is a great thing, and yes, Quantum and 3rd wave are good, but sound is more important to me. I would rather pay extra money for quality than get a lot in a box but no good sound for less money.
OTOH, some of the greatest music ever recorded was created with some pretty shitty gear that no one wanted at the time. It's all relative. Use your ears and you'll go farther ;)
Cheers, TJ
Thanks TJ for the comparison. But honestly? I think you knew the outcome... In my life of 40 years of buying, collecting and using synths, the Iridium desktop (which is a Quantum in desktop version) only lasted 1 day in my studio before I brought it back where it came from. Why? The latest Waldorf range are nice looking synths with a zillion possibilities, but hell, they sound like 'bad' VST's. And I'm not the only one saying this... (I own a vintage Q and XTK, both 30+ voice versions) My god, what have those guys in Germany been doing ?? Even Omnisphere sounds 100x better than a Quantum. Quantum owners, DO not fool yourself. Let's cut the crap. You own an expensive, bad sounding VST hardware synth. End of story. The 3rd Wave in contrary, a different league, is a top notch machine that sounds almost better than the original 2.3 All said. Case closed. With the Quantum / Iridium, the real Waldorf artisanal synth making seems to be over for ever ?
Thanks for watching the video. Sadly, I couldn't disagree with you more however regarding the Waldorf line. I also owned and extensively demo'd the Iridium here on this channel with over 20 videos. (mine was one of the first available in the US). I only sold the Iridium to upgrade to the Quantum MKII. Honestly, it was a major investment for me and I'm thrilled with it. There is no single plug-in that can do everything Quantum or Iridium can do. With respect, if you've only spent one day with Quantum or Iridium, you denied yourself years of joyful and endless exploration. It is a monster synth. It has subtle sound qualities that no plug in can match. It also has an engaging presence with sitting in front of it. It inspires me to play and to create new sounds every time I turn it on. That intangible in and of itself cannot be reproduced in a plug in.
We do agree on some things. 3rd Wave is also in a monster synth category. It amazing what Groove has done with their first offering. So in closing, yes I already knew the outcome. They are both awesome. But more importantly, it isn't a competition. Creating music is about using your tools to the fullest. Both these synth allow me to wield a very strong hand.
Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroadFacts
OMG, I’ve watched 15 minutes already and beyond that intro (in which we have no Idea what instrument is creating what sound) there hasn’t been a single sound example yet. Just a ton of waffle about the number of oscillators and filters and mod sources, etc. Pretty much every high end synth (and quite a few lower end synths, e.g. Hydra) have that stuff too.
Hi, the video includes 12 sound samples of both synths. See the chapters to advance to that section.
Cheers, TJ
This guy that tries to argue they are "equal", I'll put to rest right now. Don't know why he defends the quantum.
Why I hate the Quantum MKII and why YOU shouldnt buy one from a statistical and logical perspective coming from an obsessed nerd:
1: Quantum MKII is extremely expensive, doesnt come in a desktop format which would reduce its price even though the iridium does
2: Nobody raves about a quantum because for its price, size, and analog voice count of only 8, for its price, you can just get an iridium and a 3rd wave both in desktop modules for the same price! And was even rated most over priced synth in the most detailed synth list video for 2024.
3: People complain the waldorf iridium/quantum overloads even at 5-6 voices its possible, which I didnt even know about till recently.
4: The 3rd wave has sampling, WAY better wavetable synthesis, and better VA synthesis with the same "drift" mode as sequential and oberheim which is the best EVER made and 1 to 1 clones the original old models. It even has basic FM.
But if you want better FM, physical modeling, and sampling, just get a Korg Kronos 2 61 key (or nautilus if you dont care about ribbon control), Yamaha Montage 6 (not the new M model), and control it all from an Osmose expressive e using MIDI thru (Kronos actually has polyphonic aftertouch), while using their live set features (3rd wave will eventually have live set mode), and you have a significantly better sound for barely more money than the Waldorf Quantum MKII.
For a live setting just audio in the 3rd wave to the Kronos, youll be missing a little sparkle that the Montage gives you from FM but everything else is there and WAY better. And Objectively sounds and performs WAY better for live!
5: Waldorf like the Moog One has tons of issues cause its such a complex new instrument at such an expensive price point, UNLIKE the Korg Kronos and nautilus and montage that have been out for awhile and are STILL the best in their class (New montage M isnt worth it if you have other gear, doesnt add more FMx voices, "New" Korg nautilus is just a Kronos with no hardware controls)
6: The 3rd wave has REAL prophet SSI2140 filters and insanely accurate oberheim SEM filters which are better than any non sequential or oberheim instrument ON THE MARKET. Find me a synth without a sequential or oberheim logo that replicates their filters anywhere near as well, the Behringer and UDO disappoint me with their garbage "drift" emulation, lower voice count and timbre count and quality FX, and most importantly how they FAIL to reach the highest range of the frequencies of their filters in comparison to REAL SSM2044 filters and the behringers failed SEM and CURTIS filter replications, that while sound close ENOUGH to the original, arent as close as the 3rd wave. What UDO did with the SSI2144 filters DO NOT SOUND anything like Korgs old SSM2044 filter synths or the PPG wave 2.2 SSM2044 filter sound, and almost sounds like software level glassiness (excluding the super high resolution that software cant replicate), which completely defeats the purpose of buying an analog/analog hybrid instrument.
DO NOT buy this instrument, I cannot recommend this to ANYONE, even at a 25% discount.
Buy a 3rd wave desktop $3150 NEW (use any 10% discount code perfect circut has for ALL products, and force any other retailer to price match)
And a Korg Nautilus 61 for $1600-1700 or a Kronos 2 88 for just $2000 used!
If you prefer FM over extra analog and better sampling with 240 voices "HD-1 engine", get a montage 6 or 7 for just over $2000 used.
And GUESS WHAT, because the Quantum is so BAD at keeping value (nobody SERIOUS owns one), you can get a QUANTUM MK1 FOR JUST $2300!!! And their price is STILL DROPPING!
JUST LIKE THAT, you can get a 3rd wave desktop, PLUS a Korg, Yamaha, or Waldorf last generation flagship, AND STILL be cheaper than a Quantum MKII And have a 10x better result.
I personally recommend a 3rd wave desktop and Korg Kronos 2 88, if you want montage M reverb and delay, get Meris Mercury X and LVX pedals. For Quantum Granular, Empress FX Zoia.
You are welcome.
A few counterpoints;
1) I never said they are equal. In fact the whole video draws contrast between the two synths.
2) This video was produced before the large across the board Waldorf price increase in the US and elsewhere. At the current price of Quantum MKII, I too think it is overly expensive.
3) Reduced voice counts with Quantum can happen if you overtask the CPU. This being rare and only likely if you try using several Kernel engines as oscillators. Doing that is kinda overkill anyway.
4) 3rd Wave only has a small amount of memory for sampling that isn’t expandable. It is also only in mono. Quantum has has multiple times the amount of stereo sampling memory on board and is expandable with external drives. Note, 3rd Wave did not have sampling at the time this video was made.
5) Quantum has the capability to do drift via the mod matrix and/or within each of the oscillator menus.
6) The Quantum Kernel engine is more than just FM. It is a modular building block for many types of synthesis.
7) Quantum has analog filters along with multiple digital filters.
8) Stating “nobody SERIOUS owns one” about Quantum is pretty ridiculous if you’re at all paying attention.
Look, I also love 3rd Wave. But diss’ing Quantum on my channel without really knowing the facts says more about the user and not the synth.
You are welcome
Cheers, TJ
@@tjontheroad name one reputable synth player or talented keyboardist that has a quantum, and if you can, look at the amount of iridium vs quantums out in the wild, hmmmm I wonder why. As I said iridium + 3rd wave desktop is the same or cheaper price especially if you get your iridium from thomann.
The quantums filters are trash, especially in comparison to the 3rd wave. This is an objective fact not an opinion. For the price it's underwhelming. For a little more than a quantum mk2 you can get a Melbourne Nina synth desktop or Arturia polybrute 12 and 3rd wave desktop still under $7000, you're wrong.
As I said get a korg Kronos 2 88 for sampling with 240 voices with significantly nastier leads and more aggressive and bigger sounds that doesn't get overwhelmed as easily like the quantum or iridium and extra analog goodness it gives you over any yamaha or Waldorf. Looks like you ignored the fact we are talking about $6000 and there's still over $2500 to be played with when comparing the 3rd wave to the quantum, getting a full size Kronos for only $2000 with a 3rd wave desktop for $3150 is still over $500 cheaper than the quantum mk2 excluding tax and shipping. So you're also wrong on that.
Quantums drift is just as trash as behringers and udos, obviously you don't know or acknowledge that. Go research who invented the proper technique for drift mode, the only 4 companies that have it are sequential, Oberheim, Arturia, and now groove synthesis, because the guy who made that proper drift mode worked with all 4 of them for that result, there's even a video on RUclips of it.
The kronos and montage do not get as overwhelmed so easily.
Kernel engine whoohoo modular get an iridium core or Empress fx zoia and save your money. And for the fact you just admitted it's what causes the cpu to s**t itself probably shows an underpowered cpu for $6000. If the kernel engine is so good maybe that's why people find out it makes the Quantums voices cry, so I guess it's not so rare after all. So that point is also stupid.
You admit the price is disgusting. They aren't equal, that's right, ones a scam literally, and the other is probably the best desktop form factor synth other than the Nina synth EVER made.
Thank you very much, your counter points are all false. Have a nice day sir. Trying to counter my comment on your channel without really knowing the facts says more about the user and not the objective truth of you trying to commend a snake oil piece of gear that is over twice the price of the 1st Gen product used with nothing more obvious from the outside other than poly after touch. Which both the 3rd wave and Kronos have. And have had since the 2010s.
Hans Zimmer is a good starting point. I could go on but I'm to busy using my synths instead of looking for faults within them.
you succeed to make very horrible sounds with quantum. why trying that?
Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. And, Mamma said if you don't have something nice to say... well you know (I hope).
so take for yourself
@@tjontheroad
Where can I find some of your beautiful sounds?. I think you talk too much.
i just know well quantum, it can sound really great. @@Donetur
@@alainthiry3965 so you say that your criteria about what is great is so superlative that it is an absolute truth?. If I find to be good the sounds the friend here create, am I wrong?, how do you prove your taste and criteria is superior than mine?. What sounds good or not for you is a subjective topic.