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The coma thing isn't so sinister. In neruomedicine IRL an induced coma can be a way to protect the brain from damage, allow it to heal. It could be simple as that.
@@HontasFarmer80I beg to differ do to the information that extracted from V. Be sure to click on the blue dialogue and reload so you can hear all dialogue options...yes the NUSA is that sinister..
If Songbird uses the neural matrix, she recovers a few days later. Her body is also almost fully chromed to the point that she couldn't live if it became unusable. If V uses it, he wakes up two years later and can no longer use cyberware. Thats what I find most suspicious.
@@graphenaishata7960 She sends you the message to return to the place that reminds her of home. She leaves both Cyberware and a souvenir from the Lunar city she now lives on. For obvious reasons she can't return to earth.
@@Eco-pu2zs She had a deal with Mr Blue Eyes, whom is expected to be an AI from the Blackwall. It is not far fetched that she is not really alive after that. We just get a massage, could be from anyone. We don't see her physicaly anymore.
@@graphenaishata7960 When she writes the place that reminds me of home, she is referring to the deep conversation she and V had about how Myers, Reed and the FIA stole her life and identity and are responsible for her infection from the Blackwall. Also, why would we see her physically, she's not even on the planet anymore and she needs to go into hiding.
@@Eco-pu2zsi think she’s still alive and i think the NUSA definitely did something to V to make them chromless not to mention i think time moves so fast in NC for all we know fam was gone for maybe 6 months max so everyone probably felt like he/she was gone for so long
Its also possible that the NUSA used V as a testing bed for blackwall implants utilizing the neural matrix. Its more than possible these implants are still in V and the NUSA has made them a sleeper agent with the cover story that their neurons are fried and brain is unable to use combat implants since they would interfere with these blackwall implants. The two year coma was the stage at which they could develop stable enough implants and put them in V as a testbed of sorts. The NUSA knows that for V this is just a job and they'd have no loyalties to them which is probably an additional reason they're offered the job at Langley so that these implants can be directly monitored rather than covertly. Just a bit of a crackpot theory though I could be missing some factors that disprove this.
What if the next Cyberpunk game is V being booted back up by NUSA for a critical mission? Of course, that only works if everyone opted for siding with NUSA...so probably not. First play through of Phantom Liberty I sided with NUSA and there was something really disquieting for me about it I couldn't place my finger on it. LayedBackGamers theory feels like a peak behind the curtain but not the full picture. The second play through I sided with So Mi and even though she lied to me it just felt like a better ending (plus Alex didn't die).
That theory, while fun, has some major holes. >They would have had to make implants that are so well hidden in V's body that not even an experienced ripper like Vik could tell they were in there, even when using his equipment. If they DID have these kinds of high quality implants, why in any world would they slap them in some merc with no official ties to them rather then a high quality experienced agent, like reed. >If these implants were being used to make V a sleeper agent, why wouldnt they then use their resources to put him in a position where he would be of use. We get our asses slapped around by common street thugs in the NUSA ending. We are meant to believe one of the most valuable assets the NUSA would have on their roster is just being thrown to the wind to wander around and see what happens? Seems like a real useful way to use a sleeper agent. >If these implants were around and installed in V as a "sleeper agent", why would they even leave the opening for V to turn down the job offer and wander around the world? If they had the kind of tech and knowhow to make him a sleeper agent, your telling me they had no way of implanting a subconscious desire to work for the NUSA after waking up? The kind of tech your describing is cutting edge, and your telling me they just let some random merc walk out with it? Again, its a "fun" theory, but put against basic scrutiny it makes the NUSA look like some saturday morning cartoons level supervillians who do more to hurt their own plans then help them.
This makes lots of since if you go the route with Reed, where if you end up getting the blackwall chip from that ai, you can craft the blackwall smg or have the blackwall quickhacks
Your theory has no much sense. Why did they let go Vi with such important implants to Night City where he can be killed be a random bullet any day or from a knife from a weakest thug? It would be a total project failure and has no sense.
The fact that V has no memories of the two years doesn't prove that they were in a coma. For all they know, they could have been cured by the NUSA, sent back out into the field to do all manner of shenanigans, and then had their brain wiped for security reasons. Similar to how Bucky was an agent during the Winter Soldier, kept on ice for years until he was needed, his memories erased each time.
In this case why they didn't erase the all memories about Phantom liberty events for NUSA security? They could make up any story to explain Vi his/her current conditions and concealing all touchy info about the president and Songbird.
@@spirsom8750 maybe V has become an unreliable narrator themselves, just like Silverhand. The life V lived during these two years could have been altered any number of ways. Maybe there never was a Songbird or Reed. Implanting V with the memories of a super spy just like Total Recall.
@@spirsom8750 V knows way to many talented people. If he just wakes up in a hospital without knowing why he is there he is gonna get suspicious. He would be friends with most of the fixers in night city and be well known among the mercs. Why have someone snoop when the information probably isn't important enough to go completely dark and cover everything up, I'm sure the US could have nuked dogtown if they were that worried about info getting out.
@@spirsom8750 Perhaps the memory editor they used was installed after the fact, and rather than rummage around for old ones, they just put it to filtering out new ones.
@@spirsom8750 messing with the brain and memory can lead to a whole sleu of issues. If they wiped V's memory of phantom liberty then he is asking questions as to how he neded up in the coma, why was he with the NUSA, why would the goverment even bothered with a Night city merc to begin with. then he gets out and see's people he talked to. people who knew he saved the president and started working for the NUSA. it really muddies up the time line that would be in V's head leaving his memories in tact allows the lies to sit pretty with credibility. so to the NUSA V, saved the president, brought in Songbird, brought into custody, sent out into the field for more work for 2 years and had his memory wiped. to V its, Save the president, Brought in songbird, went into NUSA custody to get help with the relic, was in a comma for 2 years. mentally the timeline makes sense and allows the mind to kind of accept how everything played out, less questions to be asked nothing is really missing and what ever they had V doing during those 2 years none of V's friends would be aware so there is no conflicing information to come up.
Damn, can you imagine if the NUSA straight up created their own engram of V while in that "coma"? They'd literally have something to upload into people to turn then into an incredible military asset before shutting them off.
@@gustavosanches3454 Soulkiller tech is old as shit by this point, and you can see the other corps were clearly playing with alternatives (and were aware of Soulkiller) for many years as well. It's stuff I wouldn't put it past these unscrupulous organizations.
@@gustavosanches3454 No it doesn't, the latest iterations from Arasaka did make engrams of people that are still alive, it's explained in a shard somewhere and it's the entire selling point of the Secure your soul program.
Yeah... the thing works by first copying an engram and THEN Soulkiller flatlines you right after, meaning, you could just, like, skip the whole death part. Hell, Saburo existing as an engram already shows that that must be the case - the engram logically can only exist if it was made before he got murdered... yes, Jacky is a thing, but, Jackie's engram is obviously faulty, unlike Saburo's, so, it is relatively safe to assume that an engram can only ever be as good as the brain it was created with... which would mean, the longer the person is dead, the less viable an engram becomes... Which makes sense, same thing applies in reality: the longer a brain is without oxygen before a person gets resuscitated, the higher the chance of serious brain damage, up to the person being practically just... gone. And we aren't even talking hours here, we are talking mere *minutes*.
Reed is the same type of person as Takemura, false loyalty, duty and gratitude feelings got them attached to their masters, Trying to give some deep and unique meaning to their own empty lives, that they both fear they won't get if they broke their chains and try to live for real by themselves.
@@supakungfumastah7789goro has a more eastern attitude too. Hes not deluded that arasaka are good guys, he just values honor above everything else and the fact that arasaka took him from a low position and put him higher makes him value his honor towards arasaka. Reed is a knight that commits atrocites on a daily basis to justify himself
@@marcraider The difference is that Takemura is that he doesn't lie to himself, and has made it known where his loyalties lie, even if he wishes otherwise
It is something beyond disabling implants. Victor would have seen that they were off in some fashion but he can see that V's nerves are fried. V was in a coma as a lab rat. They tested and re-tested something on him/her. Perhaps another blackwall program, several blackwall programs that after 2 years left V with a damaged motor cortex.
That ending was one of the most depressing thing I experienced into a game. You become V and feel the emptiness of becoming so ordinary and vulnerable, blending into the crowd. Betraying Johnny. Killing him. Losing so many close friends and finally ... ones self.
Exactly. It's such a sad ending. I'm unable to play it myself right now. I just watched the ending I was interested in (yeah, I know, lame..), and I'm shocked that things could unfold this way. If I follow the same path, I'll probably be devastated afterward. ;_; ...and I feel your pain
You speak of being ordinary as if it’s a bad thing, or that you got rid of Johnny as if that were a bad thing too. Well I disagree it’s the best ending in my opinion. Considering how much eddies you stacked up before those 2 years it’s not so bad being an ordinary person with that level of wealth. (My V’s reasoning) but I hear what you are saying
@@takumu781 well being ordinary is technically a bad thing for V bc his canonical personality trait was that he at one point wanted to be the best in night city so him being ordinary is a hit in the ego for him at the least
Hmm, maybe this is just me. But, I think the job being offered by the NUSA would restore him to full strength. They want a new Morgan backhand. But one they can control, so they offer V the job and maybe down the line once they're sure he's become a loyal man. They offer him a way to be a solo again.
This was exactly as I saw it. If you turn them down they have neutralised a potential threat and if you take their offer they now posses control over one of if not the most dangerous being in the world. V is only 25 in that ending as well so there is so much room for them to figure out how to get everything working if they didn’t just intentionally disable all the implants and just lie to you.
I would have loved an option to accept Reed's offer. Could have been a final decision before the ending. Even if V would not turn back into a god tier solo, it would have been an interesting choice to make.
@@vault-tecrep8565 A sequel is being worked on, now the question is; how is it a sequel to CP77? Does it only follow the universe, or is there direct ties between the main characters (Silverhand and V) in the games.
Yep blue eyes is definitely a sign of canon events peralez becomes mayor though extremely paranoid and since he supports nusa that’s a plus for blue eyes since he wants arasaka gone from NC, sending so mi to the moon he appears which him having blackwall knowledge and access who knows what he’ll do, and V soloing saka tower to become legend to do one final heist that blue eyes could possibly save V
The Sun (including don't fear the reaper) and the Star are the best and most hopeful endings because they're left opened. When you think about it they're very similar too - in both V is still alive at that time, changes to status quo are minor enough and there's hope to help them (also all have romance fanservice too). Their openness and similarities always felt to me like they're set up as canon endings, it's as close to happy ending as it gets and it leaves door open for CDPR if they decide to bring back V as a protagonist.
@@papkinn If you really think about it, all the endings except the "toss the pills" ending could be left open for the story to continue in a DLC/Pt 2...If you send So Mi to the moon, she or someone from the moon could reach out to you and help you, if you send her with Reed she could somehow free herself or get released with the help of Blue eyes...the Aldacados could find a cure for V while they're out....nomad...ing...lol. And even the one where V becomes a construct, Arasaka could find a body for V and the story could be V trying to escape from Arasaka's grasp. So many different ways to go
@@supersaiyanbino Yep, sadly, due to that reason, CDPR doesn't want to continue V's story in Cyberpunk Orion because the ending is too broad, and I believe CDPR doesn't want to make one ending to be a canon (and I hope they don't)
For me its also Dont Fear the Reaper but only ended with Temperance. Tower, Star, Sun or Devil perfectly fit with the usual Night City struggle for survival or to became a legend but i like to think that V is truly special, just like David. Both protags who werent fit for Night City and payed the highest price. David wanted to make other people's dreams come true, V wanted to give others second chances, even if they didnt deserve it. We meet several people like these during sidequests and gigs, with SoMi and Johny being the prime examples. V him/herself gets a second chance from Jackie after prologue so i like to think that his death potivated V to do the same for others. For me its the only actually beautiful ending, SoMi after being thrown into the den of snakes finally finding someone who was willing to help her with no ulterior motives, and Johny having a change of heart, abandoning his vendetta agaist Arasaka to make the best out of Vs sacrifice and living his life to the fullest. Also, i like that no one except Johny knows about Vs sickest actions, snatching a cyborg out of NUSA hands and launching her into space, solo'ing the entire Arasaka with Smasher as a cheery on top, this is how you become an ACTUAL legend
My theory is that the NUSA used V as a Commando without their permission, and probably instanlled Blackwall implants and/or highly experimental combat implants. For being used as a Commando, the easiest thing to back this up would be the obvious fact that they planned for V's "awaking", yet couldnt do it any sooner? Not to mention that lorewise, V is the single most terrifying person to ever live. In the timeline, V is killed and resurrected, completes 100+ gigs, saves the NUSA president, does an entire black-op while being termaily ill and being the frontman of the unit (Reed and Alex basically just act as support for 90% of the time), nearly rids NC of crime, defeats dozen of cyberphycos, survies getting hit by the blackwall directly 5-6 times, breachs the blackwall themself with the aid of Alt, kill hundreds of wraiths in both attacks and defenses, Kidnap the heir of Arasaka, and (though you dont do this in the tower ending) storm Arasaka and kill Adam Smasher, of which, V can do solo. Renember all of this is ment to take place in about 4-7 weeks, a large chunk of which V is uncouncious in Vic's clinic. Before all this, V was practically a nobody. It would make sense that they kept V as their personal attack dog that they could drop anywhere on the planet and have their problem delt with in a month tops. Not to evn get started with the fact that Johnny's engram was obviously removed from the Relic, but there's no saying that it wasnt possible for the NUSA to figure out a way for new engrams to be placed on, so there is potential that a even greater soldier could have been put on the biochip (if they could figure out a way to swich which person was in controll remotely). My seconed thought is V was most likely used to test all sorts of Cyberware. V's resistance to cyberware is probably the highest of any person to live, with the only argument being Smasher himself. In game, V can use their cyberware without much care. Hell, V can yse David's exact sandavistan every few seconeds with no consequences, while David was in danger if he used it more then once a day. V not only has such a high tolerance, but V could have used a Cyberware with a direct connection to the Blackwall (the Blackwall cyberdeck) without much side affect. Also, the Biochip allowes for tolerances that are completely beyond what was thought to be possible beforehand.
I have a similar theory the only difference really thinking back to AI weapons is instead of a greater soldier i thought it could of been an experimental combat AI. It wouldn't be hard to hide Vs physical appearance an AI bread for combat would draw out Vs full potential even over clock them burning V out eventually, fire it up drop them where ever they are needed and know that problem will be resolved.
Regarding the cyberware testing, if I remember correctly, Mike Pondsmith has stated that V doesn't go psycho because the Relic Chip shared the load, and negated the effect of most cyberware. If V still has the relic chip, they would 100% have the highest tolerance out of anyone alive. Smasher doesn't count. He was already a psycho before the implants.
Idk about y'all chooms, but the only person i trust and allow to cut me open and not fry my synapses is Vik. Choom since day one has never lied to me, never withheld any information from me, tells me to put matters in my own hands if I'm gonna party in saka tower with Johnny like it's 2023. Even when i enter the Major leagues after all is said and done Vik still checks in on you and asks you to drop by when you have time to see if your major league ripper has done anything gonk with you .. Everybody in NUSA, Myers, Reed, Songbird (maybe 'cept Alex) has either not told you the full story or has outright lied to you at one point or another, And now I'm supposed to trust them after everything that's transpired in Dogtown? I guess I'm good, if Vik says a couple weeks at most, guess I'll just grab the hottest iron and storm saka tower, jack my ass into Mikoshi and we'll see how it goes, at least my life's on my terms.
Vik even sacks up and tells you to stop being a bitch and either solve your problem or eat a bullet There's a reason he and Misty are the only ones that still care about you years later
I've also read the theory that Mr. Blue Eyes basically uses and discards Songbird if you send her to the moon (we never see or hear from her again other than a message that could have been left by anyone) so its just another lose / lose situation in CP
Yeah, the most likely scenario. No way a corp which brainwashes people seen in game (Peralez questline) will just help So Mi with no strings attached. Truly the best ending for her is to simply be killed by V.
@Dankmemeslover69 What about the theory that he's not even human, but an AI controlled entity (hence the glowing blue eyes)? The speculation is that there's an AI (or a group of them) that's out there pulling strings to change society to their liking - which may, or may not include coexistence with humans. If that's the case, he may have cured songbird to eliminate a potential threat to that plan.
@@scyfon Yes Mr Blue Eyes definitely a thrall run by the AIs to impact the physical world; the AIs also seem to be stoking hatred of pro-Arasaka politicians like Holt and favoring pro NUSA/Militech puppets like Peralez though too. Is this the work of Myers/Songbird using blackwall tech, or are the AIs already in control of the NUSA itself and using it to expand?
All Mr. Blue Eyes cared about was the AI. So Mi was just an expendable asset. So maybe the Songbird body survived but was probably too badly damaged and discarded. Heck Mr. Blue Eyes is an AI himself that just uses a human body as a vessel. Just look at his eyes and then look what happens with Songbird whenever you didn't go along with her and the AI activated. Her eyes turned red.
You guys are all wrong. Song sends you a Pin from the moon as a souvenir and she sends you a cyberware that she drops to her favorite location she shows you. I’d say she’s Fine
It's really fitting that this ending and the Arasaka ending are by far the worst endings for V, in both cases you sell your soul to "The Man" so to speak be it a corpo or the NUSA itself. It just goes to show you are nothing but meat for the machine in their eyes especially when you take this theory into account
It's funny because those are the only two endings where V can actually keep their soul, in all others it's killed by SOULkiller. It's either sell yourself to a corp, or a rogue ai, maybe the true good ending is the shortest one...
It is of course it's left to interpretation what exactly happened in mikoshi. If V's brain was scraped blank to create an engram that is then uploaded onto relic, original V is definitely dead, but if somehow v's engram was written back on their brain, or the brain was just copied without full scraping, then changes applied, one could argue it's akin to momentary loss of consciousness as the brain state was shortly restored, with a few changes. Alt certainly doesn't think it's the latter though.
@@romanr1592Thompson has something to say regarding soulkiller: ”It's no legend. Soulkiller's real. And your choombas at Arasaka just "hired" the 'runner who wrote it. Take that in - 'Saka with Soulkiller to do with as it pleases. Grim, my man. You even imagine that, rocker? Arasaka'll be unstoppable. Soulkiller'll flatline any 'runner who comes close to even tryin' to scratch its ICE. Seen it happen. Not an iota of physical damage - nervous system or anywhere else. No sound, no fury, no stench. Just all of a sudden, brain waves cut out. As if someone pulled the plug.” Taking what Thompson said into consideration, if you manage to restore brain wave activity - you wake up with the same consciousness as before. That is if Soulkiller did anything with it, which it doesn't. Alt merely created an engram of V, aka memories and personality (no consciousness because that's tied to the physical human brain), so that she can replace it with Johnny's engram inside the Relic so that the nanites can start rebuilding V's neural network with the data (memories and personality) stored in the engram. The end result is that V - the original, biological V - wakes up outside of Mikoshi with their original memories and personality intact as if nothing changed.
I think The Tower ending is even worse than The Devil ending, because at least in the latter you have the option to return home in full strength and with all your relationships still intact. By contrast, the Tower ending is by far the most depressing ending of all. After completing Things Gone Changed I went with the suicide ending, and I felt much less depressed with that one.
The Tower is a direct line to a sequel if they wanted to keep popular characters like Johnny. Finding out later that Johnny is being held by the NUSA (why wouldn't they lie and say the Relic was gone)..would be a great start to a new game. V starts out weak and depowered until a job where he makes it to the rebuilt Relic.. And slots it just as a heavily armed security team reaches him.. 😮
That didn't sit right with me in game. The Arasaka Relic Tech didn't just "Disappear". It wasn't just "Gone". They managed to take it for themselves using Blackwall tech to do it.
@@SternLX Indeed. It's too good of story thread.. And Keanu is far too popular to allow the Johnny to die. Even the Street Cred being rolled back to zero for V could be justified.. As people would see him as a broken down has-been. I just don't see starting over completely as people love the characters.. They just hated the game coming out unfinished. Hell.. You could even threaten people with a rebuilt Adam Smasher who'd hate V for dropping him, and being a host for Silverhand.
What if Reed just kept his end of the bargain? Look how much he blamed himself for what happened to SoMi. Why wouldn't he make sure V was taken care of? Also, during the inciting incident, the refrigerated case the relic was in was damaged, and the integrity of the relic was dropping quickly. Causing Jackie to install the relic to keep it structurally secure, and when injured, giving it to V. When Dexter killed V, the relic restarted V. However, when V went to Vic to remove the relic, we discover that the relic cannot be removed and that although the relic saved V's life it is also taking V's life because it's slowly overwriting him with Johnny Silverhand. So, what if, upon trying to remove the relic they discovered it was stuck and overwriting V and the only way to save V is to make his brain deaf to cyber implants and when they removed the relic they were unaware of the impending degradation. Thus, what Reed meant when he said the relic is gone. But hey, that's just a theory a game theory
@@re2gie Nice post.. Where I would disagree is Reed knowing. He outright admits he is out of the loop where So Mi is concerned.. She is considered a weapon.. Something of vital importance. They don't care about her freedom.. Nor would they have an issue with lying to Reed about what happened with the Relic. For what reason would the President care to include him if she felt the Relic was another weapon they could use? To me Reed would be telling the truth as he knew it. It would make even more sense.. Because there would be NO deception in him when he spoke of the Relic. The President knows how loyal Reed is to the people he feels responsible for.
@@harnaskrogor2577 Disagree with that take. V is a common criminal who ended up in deep water in the pursuit of fame and glory. Songbird is an internet addict who was gaslighted into joining the government and made to do horrible things that she never wanted to take part in, but was under constant pressure to comply with orders. Songbird is the victim in this story. She deserves to live her own life. V is lucky to have a second chance at redemption but a shortened life is better than none at all. V living a normal life is the worst choice, because it means doing something so morally deplorable, everyone you met in the game abandons you and moves on. Why chose that when you can save the life of another more deserving and spend the rest of your shorter life surrounded by those who accept you as family and love you til the end. Aldecaldos for life!
@@bekkison it actually depends on the player sure you can be like a common cruminal but keep in mind most contracts and kills V performs on gangsters or corporational thugs also depending on your choice V can keep his morality by showing mercy/saving others. Other than that I feel like Cdred "forced" this endimg to be negative its just stupid that you loose all your weapons skills body strenght intellect etc, Somi character is tragic but its not like she wasnt in the same situation as V both fought for their lives one of each could be morally superior and sacrifice themselves for the other so there should be no hard feelings for Somi she would give away V to be cured without a doubt.
@@harnaskrogor2577 Come on man, all Song did was trying breach Blackwall then NUSA learned about it and forced her to join them by blackmailing to report Netwatch. While we are blasting everybody on our path, stealing whatever we can get our hands on, making shady deals, also breaching Blackwall depending on our choices. We wouldn't be so far behind Hansen in the most dangerous criminals list! How people could believe we are more deserving to live than So Mi i have no idea really, she was used and turned into a cybermonster, at least we were always free to choose as we wish. Also we have more options to find a cure..
I have a feeling those questions Lisa Smith referenced are like the Voight-Kampff test questions in Blade Runner used to tell human from replicant. It's possible they were using those questions to see if an AI had invaded and overwritten the consciousness of the original person, like Mr. Blue Eyes. AIs would have trouble answering those questions as they are made specifically to test for the odd reactions only a human would make at such nonsensical propositions.
It makes more sense for V to have been tampered with tbh. Especially when you line up everything we know about how organisations within CP77 works. It would also nicely set up the next game either for players to play an older V, work with V or hear stories/have plots within the game about V and what happens post PL ending
Two things: Relic is extremely valuable to corps (like you said) and they already have likely tortured or 'reimagined' Songbird into some Anti-AI super power or whatever, since they now don't give Reed the clearance to know. Plus, Myers demonstrates no remorse in utilizing Songbird like they have. Its a HIGH chance that they, if not made some sleeper agent in V, TOOK his personality through the Neural Matrix/Soulkiller/Relic and are now hoping to use 'him' as an operative for NUSA, which could even be to help fight rogue AI maybe if you are a netrunner. Myers literally sees you gun down hordes of Barghest + A FUCKING SPIDER TANK, without barely blinking an eye. She probably noticed, just saying. Also, they probably took the 'original' V's implants away to keep from making anymore trouble or interacting with his doubles.
Explains why our dupes get patched. The greepy corpo govt "erases the memory" of the dupe so its not doable. Am i the only one who looks for in game explanations for how updates change the game. And how in some cases. What do npcs says or think. 😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😊😂 this game is set for that type of content lol
Mayer's is probably the most evil person in Cyberpunk 2077 which is saying a lot, she has no remorse after Songbird dies and gives you lip for allowing her to have peace and instead of being a slave for the NUSA.
Every character we meet in the Phantom Liberty DLC that has been involved with the NUSA (Reed/Alex/Songbird) has been screwed over in one way or another. It is therefore logical to suggest that V would be screwed over by the NUSA in some way too. Johnny Silverhaand constantly warns against trusting corporations or the promises of government, as he was previously a soldier and felt forgotten and taken advantage of. This is why he discourages V from taking the pledge of allegiance to the NUSA. Reed's description of the problem is different to Vik Vectors, so I do find it plausible that Reed is lying to V. The V we wake up as might even be a clone, a version of V intended to live as a harless civilian, while the original is a midless soldier working for the NUSA as a puppet, chromed out more than Songbird and Adam Smasher combined.
We know from Alt in other endings that V's body is already past the point of "ownership" being transfered to Johnny, V was asking Alt for a way to continue living, and Alt seems to conclude that only a couple months was the best she could do. So maybe, Alt could have done what the NUS AI did but knew the damage would happen, so V couldn't make it out of Arasaka like that and would die. Alternatively, the NUS AI was just given the command to save V's life and it had to follow it, even if it caused permanent damage. I think the damage is real, because Alt confirms that V's body will reject them so the NUS AI basically forced a solution that probably broke some things in the process, like putting a present in a bag too small and ripping it in the process. The coma however I think isn't part of that same damage. Most of V's value to the NUS is as a field agent, while Reed says the opposite I think everyone can safely say that V canonically has the potential to have surpassed Blackhand and can beat Smasher in the other endings. I bet that Meyers wanted a new toy, and when the cure damaged V she threw a fit. The coma was probably medically induced until they could find a fix for V's new problem, and another positive for Meyers would be destroying all of V's connections in the process leaving them as just another Reed or So Mi if they could fix them. After 2 years of no returns on investment maybe it wasn't worth it to keep V under, and the damage to V's old life had been done so there was no real harm in waking them and possibly bringing V into the FIA under a different position until a fix could be found at a later time as technology advances. And if V doesn't join the FIA after all of that, then it's still an incredibly dangerous pawn most likely permanently off the board, so this ending is really the worst one where Meyers wins completely with no consequences or losses for her actions.
No it has nothing to do with the body V's neural matrix is mostly rewritten like Alt said making his body think him a virus The body is still breaking him down regardless which is why Alt can only give you a few extra months Honestly the smartest thing to do would be for V to allow Alt to make him be an engram like Johnny and allow that Engram to take over V's body. Yeah it's going to kill V but it will also create a new one in the process who can still live on
V's case is a special one. V died and got revived by the relic (twice if you didn't side with the netwatch operative), Johnny can take over V's body with or without V's permission, and I think the most interesting part of it all, is the medication that was given to him to stop Johnny from taking over his body. The neural matrix didn't remove Johnny, it intertwined them as one person, but probably made it so that only V's memories are present so it doesn't feel like V is a different person. The NUSA does have reasons to take the relic and V for studying, but I don't think their interest was any further than that. They just studied V for two years, because V situation could more or less be the same for So Mi situation, since Johnny is technically an Ai. They would also take great interest in the medication given to V, as it would be probably their only hope to stop So Mi from turning into a rogue Ai out of their control. They could make a stronger version of the medication. I think regardless of V situation primarily if you do the Arasaka ending or the NUSA ending, the chip has more than likely already progressed too far, even Alt couldn't even save V from that, nor Arasaka. It's more likely that Johhny took over V's body, but still retained all of V's memories, but NUSA just suppressed Johnny's memories and had V's memories be the dominant memories. So Johnny thinks he's V. I also want to add, that the reason why V can't use implants anymore, is probably because the neural matrix Ai, actually went inside of V, and there were two Ai's in V. One that is incredibly way stronger, and is too much for V's body to handle. We hear how humans who try to take blackwall Ai in, die right away due to technology being to rudimentary and the Ai being in a frenzy. Also, in the devil ending, when V asks Takemura why they can't find him a suitable body for him to take over, but Saburu can take over his son without any issues, Takemura says it's because of them being related, and that V is basically a blank slate, due to the damage to V body by the relic. NUSA sees V is the trial run for So Mi, so they probably studied V more than the time that was needed to be there, since Arasaka was able to remove the relic from V, in a shorter period of time, as when V calls his friends, it seems like V hasn't been gone that long at all, maybe like a couple of weeks to a month at most.
I think you're giving Alt too much credit here, if the chip has progressed too far for her to reverse the effects with the actual software, then what else could she do? It's not like Alt had the ability to perform neurosurgery.
They're just blockers for your immune system, which is the thing rewriting V's synapses into Johnny's because it sees V as the virus. It stops the blackouts and such because it turns off your immune system basically. They aren't anything special
You mention this helping YOU through rough times? Bro, it's weird how much reprieve from stress I get from diving my mind into this world and you helping us make sense of it. Literally just the other day I finished Phantom Liberty and have been binging your videos, actually personally noticed the discrepancy between what Viktor and Reed said was the issue. That had me standing up. Thanks for your videos cuz.
Well I'm glad my videos can help so many. This content is somewhat my get away from work, school, etc. I have a lot of fun delving into this world with you all, there's no better rush! Hope you had an amazing Christmas choom
Just for clarification's sake, you can still get the Tower ending if you side with Songbird. Instead of sending her to the moon you have the choice of handing her off to Reed after she admits the Neural Matrix can only cure one of them and that she played you all that time.
Yes, I chose that option when she confessed the truth. I have been betrayed by many people. Even from those closest to me. So I chose this option on instinct.
@@FTBASTARfor real, I kept on believing and believing in what she was telling me even though reed told me not to, but when she finally told me that had been lying about nearly everything, I knew what had to be done
@@cartierclips1126 So Mi betrayed you, you took it personally, but she didn't kill V or was even planning to do that, but kind of used V. Yes, that is betrayal, and absolutely detestable behavior. But you end up choosing V to hand So Mi to Reed, and hence to Myers. This is fate worse than death to Songbird, just because she happened to betray you. Now Myers gets her tool back and can abuse her until the day she dies for good. You basically dump your lying friend to hands of a rapist and sadist, after they finally trust you enough to say the truth, and the friend is on the brink of death. Reed also goes back to being NUSA lapdog and do their vile bidding for crappy organization. Myers can continue her actions against international law. I just can't understand this kind of emotional response over basic logic. Well, it's a roleplaying game, but hopefully no one would do such choices in real life. Morally unacceptable, logically unsound.
@@jarivuorinen3878 songbird was never V’s friend if we’re being honest, only contacted us to trick and use us as a way to help her kill the president, then proceeded to lie to us for the rest of the time, even about the so called thing that would save us both so she practically did plan to kill us by leaving us with one less option to save ourselves, she knew the risks of the game she was playing and paid the consequences for losing. Plus the V that I made that decision on is very cold hearted but was slowly warming up to songbird just to be repeatedly stabbed in the back by her, reversing any progress made to V’s cold demeanor
The glaring issue with this theory is one simple question... Why would they just let V go? Even if he's depowered, it's still really dumb to let an asset like that back in to the world simply because he's seen way too many things to not be considered a liability. Why not just kill him if he's no longer useful?
I mean that's less about the theory and more about the writing and choices of the NUSA. My personal perspective is they do have a use for him in the future, they muted his implants to be reactivated anytime they wish. There's always the idea too, that Myers despite her betrayals and manipulation has an ounce of respect to V and Reed to allow him to live. In said case, V can always be dealt with and couldn't do any damage they're afraid of. Or else when V fails to hand over Songbird and essentially says fuck you to Myers, she could've just killed him right there for the failure and disrespect.
@@LayedBackGamers if they wanted V to work for them and if the implants don't work, they could have instead spun some story about how "ah the surgery didn't go so well, but listen friend... come work for us, we have some exciting future prospects for you, we'll get you up and running again. We got the relic out of you, didn't we?" And yeah sure, Meyers could have had V killed for disobedience but at that point he at least still had some sort of value as a research subject. After the 2 years, I get the impression they really might have extracted all they really could from him.
@@odontoxins3223 but then why let him go? just string him along, maybe gradually unmute basic augmetics like the Kiroshis as proof of concept. If he has value still, there's no reason to wait and hope he comes back because he might just end up getting his head caved in by gangoons in NC or OD-ing in some dingy apartment. as much as we all love a good conspiracy, I don't think this ending is supposed to be the canon one or serve as a sequel hook.
@@DioBrandoWRYYYYYY I think I'm on the same page as you here, I feel like people are stretching quite a bit to see something that isn't there. I like fan theories and this is nothing but an interesting "what if?" in my opinion. The foundation is built on the "unreliable narrator" trope, which would basically put everything into question and destract from the actual narrative beats the writers were aiming for. But that's just my thoughts.
That message that mentions Lisa Smith going through a test is the same kinda test Officer K goes through in Blade Runner 2049... Coincidence? I think not🫢
I knew that Reed lied to us at the ending. He was told in the very start of the mission what they were going to do to V. That is why he always acted so somber, guilty and emotionally hurt inside. Reed was a coward for letting them doing this to the MC. But he was just following orders......
Having a top-level merc that can no longer be touched by tech would be a great asset if an AI invasion is imminent. With V being busted back down to a Level 1 character, I think this ending might suggest V will again be the protagonist in Orion.
A few other things, is one Reed looks upset and away from you when he says the coma stuff. Notice whenever he lies or speaks about something he regrets he does that too. Second, if they were able to wake V up, why not do it sooner? Third, Songbird is arguably in worse shape then V near the end of PL. The Matrix does not put her into a coma and it does not take away her ability to use cyberware. Fourth, V seems to now suffer from memory issues. When Misty asks where the pendant is, V can no longer remember and V in general seems mentally slower.
Never got why that ending was a death sentence. Sure you can't use implants anymore, but it's not like there aren't plenty of weapons capable of being used that don't require dampeners, reinforced skeletons, or combat implant pairings. Yeah Militech definitely messed you up, but it's not like you couldn't undo it with the right ripper anyway.
Also, V had a significant impact to the Night City, they just don't know it. We faced the Tyger Claws, arasaka, MILITECH, Trauma Team, and Night Corp. When we went back to Viktor from a coma, MILITECH took over Night City. We could've prevented it if we were present before it all began.
While this theory can work, i believe this is the other side of the coin. "Would you rather die young as a legend or die old as a nobody?" This is the other side of that coin you get to live to live on as a nobody
I think V was used as some kind of server like how So MI was used for black wall stuff, except they figured out they needed him knocked out and cyber wear off so he wouldn't be conscious of it, and his consciousness wouldn't interfere with what they wanted. They only let him go because his usefulness ended or because their goals were accomplished and maybe Reed fought to have them let him go or something.
Considering the nature of the Relic itself and how it unexpectedly opened the door to engrams taking over bodies to be "reborn", it was the perfect opportunity for NUSA to try out bringing in AI to a body and trapping them inside a physical body to better tame or interrogate. Once V was burnt out as a conduit, they probably granted the bonus of releasing them on the belief of "Oh hey we saved you, but you can't use combat chrome anymore"
The base game and DLC never takes into account the amount of cyberware you have installed (only the ones that are forced on you). The DLC ending where they remove/disable your cyberware doesn't effect players who didn't use any cyberware. Good news: Were removed Johnny from your head. Bad news: No cyberware. Me: What cyberware?
The theory is good, but we are forgetting a quite important fact which pretty much demolishes the whole theory. Remember that alt explain to us that she didnt consider the "body factor" when using the soulkiller to separate V from Johnny, since the relic was not only rewritting V's consciousness, but also rewritting his/her DNA to match Johnny's, which is why V isn't able to live more than 6 months if he/she decides to stay in his/her body. So we could simply assume that the neural matrix was able to "rewrite" only essential parts of V's DNA to be able to survive, and isolated/disabled parts that were already too compromised to go back safely. Or simply could be a miss-input command for the neural matrix, remember that the NM is an AI, so if the medics literally wrote "save this person's life" and didnt went fully specific, the AI could simply do the job half way through it and delta like an absolute unit of trolling
And also the ending is represented by The Tower, which is the worst tarot card you can be dealt. Thematically it makes more sense for the ending to be exactly what it presents itself to be. To get the ending, you have to side with feds, betray Songbird and then run away like a coward instead of getting things settled with Johnny and finishing the fight with Arasaka. I think the ending is karmic punishment for V the same way that the Devil ending is. V stoops low to survive at any cost and thinks he's taking the easy way out while never considering the cost of it to himself and everyone around him, and now he's forced to face everything going wrong all at once, and it's irreversible.
BUT....this makes no sense. If the Relic (which V has the schematics for) was used to put Vs engram onto the same software and Alt installed that program with V's engram instead of Johnny's, then the nanites would conform Vs body to allow his engram to take over, just like it was doing for Johnny, so... either the Relic reconfigures the body to accept the new engram or IT DOES'NT, which is it? ITs just the nonlogic of the game that takes Vs life away from him.
@@gamersanonymous4me131 the relic is damaged, perhaps the nanites couldnt be reprogrammed to handle another engram... Or perhaps a body can't handle two rewrites without killing it in the process. Remember that its a super aggressive tech, it literally makes you cough blood, pass out, and lose control of the body
@@gamersanonymous4me131 I have thought the same thing myself, the response I came up with is that a Fully fuctional Relic could do that but the one V has is damaged during the short time he was 'dead' after he was dumped into the trashheap. Otherwise there is no real reason Alt coun't just dump a copy of Vs engram into the relic after she pulls Johnny from it. There is a lot of 'This has to happen this way cause the story needs it do even if it doesnt make much sense after the fact' to force it to fit the nobody gets a happy ending idea
from what I understand from the game, the relic nanites has converted too much of V's brain and her own immune system is attacking her own brain@@gamersanonymous4me131
What if V was cured but woke up after a coma to realize that Johnny is gone but now with blackhand in his place by Bartmoss’s doing in order to be secretly immortalized by arasaka. I say this because Johnny silverhand has his memories mixed up with Morgan Blackhand. The way he tells his stories don’t make any sense when stacked against other source material.
When I first got this ending and atarted to think about it I didn't even think about them indusing a coma I just thought about the fact that reed could have easily contacted V's friends and told them about her state but it made sense to me that V is valuable and skilled and without friends she might go back and work for the FIA like reed suggested and the more I thought about the more I think the FIA had to do with the coma
The NUSA definitely took every advantage over V while out. V was not only top Merc but near legendary status AND had the relic inside their head. If we remember. V was inside the blackwall. Met Alt. Seen the other side. When you let So Mi go to the moon, she is basically healed in days. V is out for 2 years. Yeah. Its all more than sus. They used V up like a test toy and then threw em out to the wolves.
It’s crazy how V basically gets declawed. V got what they wanted but at the cost of basically having their life stripped down to just the bone. I like to think NUSA did it as an extra precaution too just due to everything V witnessed along with how much of a dangerous variable they could become, especially with all the dirt they could possibly have too. No one is going to believe a nobody, and that nobody has no way of causing much damage. The Night City legend V is long gone. My speculation of course! Love your videos! Love these deep dives. I really wonder how the next game will be. What part will V play. Will they be the playable character again? Or someone like Johnny is in 2077, who plays a secondary main character, maybe a mentor of sort for you the player? Will they even be around or will they go the way of Blackhand. Just a legend and story
The declawing makes sense when you compare to the ending of sending somi to the moon, you straight up decimate the presidents elite black ops, squad after squad, all on your own, and that’s not including being a proxy for Somis blackwall attacks
The discrepancy between what Reed tells you vs what Viktor tells you goes even further. Reed never tells you that you can't use combat implants as in you're physically unable to, he tells you that using them could kill you. According to what Viktor tells you though installing combat implants wouldn't have adverse effects on you or your health, they simply wouldn't work as they can't communicate with your nervous system. That's two very different stories and you can't tell me that the NUS just "got it wrong" considering some of their best doctors worked on V and a Zetatech ripper found out within seconds of a scan. So honestly the only plausible reason I can see for Reed telling his version is because they simply want to scare V away from even trying (V clearly went through hell and back just to survive so the threat of potential death obviously hits hard for V). And now the only plausible reason I can see for trying to scare V away from looking into this matter further is to cover something up. The only thing that opposes these thoughts is the fact that even if you tell Reed you gonna leave and have a ripper check it out no attempts to stop you are being made. They still provide you with an AV to NC the second you ask.
Dude I need that blackwall hand mod shits fire I hate how short our use of it was I get it but imagine we just started abusing our relic as it will protect us via the ai and nanotech to zero everyone we want. We could have used it to kill the bot in the Reed ending or to beat multiple Maxtac av's and trucks at once.
A lot of people in this comment section seem to be under the impression that Blackhand didn’t use or had minimal implants, when Blackhand was chromed out according to the Cyberpunk lore😂 -Neural processor -Sandevistan -Smart-gun and vehicle links -Interface plugs -Chip-ware sockets -Nasal filters -Two cyberoptics (targeting scope, low-lite, infrared, anti-dazzle) -Right cyberarm (Rippers, heavy SMG, microwave/EMP shielding, hydraulic rams) -Muscle & bone lace -Nano-surgeons Meanwhile V only has two canon lore implants, the Kiroshi eyes, and the Ballistic Coprocessor on the palm. Also if anyone wants to argue that V gets chromed out, no, lore wise and canonically V only has two implants. So until we get a second game and they cement the lore around V, there’s only two implants.
Anybody notice Reed was doing weird things with his hands when V woke up? Like he specifically had one hand behind his back almost the entire time until I said a piece of dialogue which made him act differently
Yep he definitely had a lot of queues giving away just how guilty and unsure he was feeling. He knew it wasn't right what the NUSA did to V, but is too brainwashed to break his loyalty so he struggles as he lies / omits necessary details.
My biggest disappointment with all the endings is the fact that they see the behavioral imprint as the biggest threat, while realistically nothing would be easier than to reset relic's nanites to undo the damage. V's problem isn't all things to do with relic, it's the thing to which V owes her/his life, imagine if the intensive healing capabailities were to be controlled instead of getting stripped away of, together with Johnny. Even with these thoughts, i get why it's so in base game, it's the easiest way to get relic to stop killing V, and is beneficial to Alt as she get's another ai to be a part of her.
The Tower ending was my first ending, and... I was left with so many questions. There were a lot of cyberware implants I had that obviously I had no access to afterward. However, to get those Cyberware implants I had replaced my arms (with blades) and replaced my eyes (obviously). However, in the ending... you don't have the eyes or the cyberware arms anymore. But... how is that possible? Originally I dismissed it as it just being a game. But what I don't get is how V now has organic arms and eyes again, when they'd had them replaced during the game. Did the NUSA grow new arms and eyes? How did they replace them? Also, as V asks during the questioning with Reed, why didn't they use nano-tech to repair the damage if there was damage from removing the implant? We know, from the other endings, that part of V (at least part of their brain) has begun to be rewritten to support Johnny instead of V, because the tech was originally designed to rewrite Yorinobu to support Saburo. But in order to "cure" you, does this mean that the NUSA cut out those parts of your brain? How did they fix THAT problem, but they couldn't fix the issues with the cyberware? The explanation you're given makes very, very little sense. While I have no proof of it, I think it's more likely the NUSA did it all for a reason. They most likely wanted the Relic for themselves (I say this with no evidence other than the fact that it's incredible tech that nobody but Arasaka has), so they kept it in one piece rather than risking destroying it. Does that mean that they'd kill V in order to get their hands on the Relic? Is the reason you wake up with no Cyberware and organics again the fact that V was their test subject on their OWN version of the Relic? Is V actually now a clone, explaining why they'd have their organic body somehow magically restored? If that's the case, and V is a clone with their memories transferred via Militech / NUSA Relic tech, why are they unable to support Cyberware? Is that a side effect they haven't gotten fixed yet, since V was likely the first test subject? Or was it done on purpose to stop V from causing more problems? There is the argument of "well why not kill them?", which is valid, but maybe they didn't want to risk it. I mean, Reed was DEFINITELY asking questions. Others likely might have been as well. V made a big impact in their short time, people DEFINITELY noticed they were missing... so the best way to stop those people asking questions is to have V show up again. There's way, way more questions with that ending than any other ending because there's just so many parts of it that don't seem to make sense (to me at least).
I was confused by this also. By the end of the game, V has mechanical arms, legs, eyes, brain parts, spine and all sorts of other body parts. Surely by this point, turning all that off leaves V a braindead, blind quadriplegic. While I'm not familiar with the setting outside the game I don't recall it being mentioned that technology that can create/grow perfectly genetically compatible replacements of any natural body part exists. No one explains how they can 'turn off' armour either, so V would still be borderline bulletproof. I also have trouble understanding how the cure was supposed to work in conjunction with 'cutting out' the engram surgically.
The only thing that leads me to question your theory is in the Song Bird ending, she states that the neural matrix is a one time use tool. Rogue AI’s are kinda like tuna. Tuna have to keep swimming, or they die, rogue AI’s, as she explains them, are ever evolving programs, evolution, adaptation, and change, progression, are integral to their continued existence. She then says that once you program one of these AI like the one in the neural matrix to perform a specific task, it will execute that command and then essentially collapse, because it was given a determined task or function to complete, and then it executes that task, like any program. Upon completion of the task, the program as it is essentially self terminates, either resetting to whatever its original state was, or complete self erasure.
Coma or not, there are story setups that could involve this ending. If V believes that they were in a coma then there's no way for them to let any counter story slip. A more useful NUSA action is to make a sleeper with two compartmentalized personalities. One with no access to the cyber-ware or the other personalities memories. The other personality having access to all of it. To be useful the now famous V needs to be needs to appear to be a non-player in their field. How better to do this than a trip back to Night City to show everyone that they are now a nobody. A new game could start with getting a new face and name to avoid attacks by former enemies. Then have a mission that tears down the conditioning.
I personally don't like the new ending, V survives yes but she/he loses her/his friends, it's too sad and I can't handle it. I prefer to send Somi to the moon to save her and either leave with the Aldecaldos (I hate nc) or use the gun on the roof.. I hoped my V could stay with her/his partner.
Nah not like V to use the gun on the roof the aldecaldo mission feels too hopeful cause the inevitable is around the corner, but for me the only option that’s rational and makes most sense story wise and what lore V would actually do is become a legend and raid saka tower solo and do the final heist going out with a bang or if blue eyes could possibly save V…
You know the most amazing thing about your stories not only is your voice absolutely perfect but you said the back tone down with the music you selected each story you should compiled these together in one huge collection myths of night City in cyberpunk 2077
Reasons to side with Songbird: - Songbird warns us from the start to not belive myers (myers=nusa). - In Panam's questline she says that corps equals government which is totally true and as a corpo V, arasaka tried to kill us. - I started a new game and pay attention to her every words and so far she never said she WILL cure V just that she COULD and there is a LOT OF DIFFERENCE between straight up lying or don't tell something due to her understandable trust issues. - If we side with her, at the end when she have no power left and can't even stand up by herself she tell the truth to V which the nusa would never done. - After all that nusa did, her (betraying, backstabbing, forcing her to eliminate reed, making her terminally ill) trust is almost non existing but V gain's her trust and she entrust her life to V. - Even if we side with Reed she still protect V with all her power till her last breath. - Nusa stopped V forever by turning it's cortex deaf to implants (which i didn't know before but just confirms what i think).
Reasons to side with Reed: -songbird betrays v keeping cure for herself while v is dying. -two iconic Boss fights maxtac and with Hansen -Horror minigame -better loot iconic revolver, lmg, knife, and most importantly erabus or militech canto Songbird ending is happier but boring asf. While Reed Path is way Cooler and fun.
@@SPINEBUSTER2023 I understand you, mostly. The boss fights are really cool and i wanted to kill Hansen since the moment he touched Songbird's looower back. I loved the horror game with the Cerberus. The loot is the cherry on the cake with the Blackwall gateway but it's not nearly as powerful and spectacular as it is in the other ending. But the most important thing is that she didn't kept the cure for herself, she give you the choice. You just have to call Reed if you want the cure.
"- I started a new game and pay attention to her every words and so far she never said she WILL cure V just that she COULD and there is a LOT OF DIFFERENCE between straight up lying or don't tell something due to her understandable trust issues." I really hate this bullet point. A lie by omission is still a lie, bro. There's no difference. I'd still side with Song because NUSA will lie to us six ways to Sunday, but Song really isn't that much better. She strung along a dying man with the cure for their terminal illness and only came to terms with it when they felt they were on the verge of death and needed to confess.
@@SPINEBUSTER2023you can get the same amount of iconics if you play songbird ending correctly (lmg, revolver, reeds revolver, iconic cyberware) and those boss fights are more annoying than fun to play. + songbird lied but she lied a hell of a lot less than nusa. Never side with reed
i just thought they never actually used the neural matrix on V - they kept it for their own purposes, experimented on the relic chip while keeping V under, and eventually burned out V's motor cortex and dumped them.
Though it could be like the Devil ending where Arasaka likely plans on keeping V around to put into a corposoldier body at some point with some sort of control apparatus - if the motor cortex isn't permanently deaf, just dormant, waiting for a wake signal from Militech when they re-activate V.
So, why did they say the matrix failed when they tried to use it on Songbird? It's one-time use, so why even try to use it on her? The only reason V gets the "cure" is because it didn't work. What would they have offered V if the matrix worked on song like they planned?
this ending was genuinely the worst, the saddest, the most soul crashing one. i've never cried THAT HARD playing this game before. i like to replay the endings after a while but this one... never again! ❤️
I still say this whole ending is out of Neuromancer. V’s after effects = Case’s cyber burn and Mr. Blue Eyes being Morgan Blackhand = Armitage being Colonel Corto. It all matches up too well.
The funny thing about this whole thing is I've been saying it for quite awhile. I'm glad I'm not the only one, because if you start picking apart history in the real world, which this is kind of based on you see that this concept is not far fetched. At. All. The origins of the genre, there was a toxin(in neuromancer) which did something similar, do a job for them, get the cure. But the fact the cortex "was made deaf" means something was done, so they basically either shut V down from being a risk. Or give him time to settle in, and use Reed to contact him going "V, we have a job. We might be able to reverse the damage. It's hard, but, you in?" Of course to regain former self, you also now realize, they did him dirty.
My feeling is the ending is both a ref to neuromancer and a way to bring V back in the next game without his implants. I think its gonna come out that Myers ordered V killed but Reed gave the slightly more friendly idea of letting him live but taking away all the chrome so he is powerless. I then think the next game will open with V in a bad place and being saved by Mr Blue Eyes but with the cost being that if he doesnt do as they say he goes back to being powerless. It really does look like instead of a corpo war its soon to be an ai vs human war and V is gonna be right in the middle of it.
@@killwill5965 as much as I agree as it is the only ending where V really becomes what they set out to do I really dont think u pretty much perfectly set up V coming back in the next game and not use it. Like my 1 complant about tower is that it is a bit too close to the start of neuromancer (something I critised mass effect 2 for as well) as I am convinced that myers tried to make damn sure V couldnt be a solo again but I also think mr blue eyes has tech from beyond the blackwall that could save V and put him on a leash just like we see in neuromancer (not really spoilers for that book as this is pretty much all in any symnopsys u will read)
@@le3299ify the next game will involve Mr Blue Eyes for sure. i just don’t like the notion that V sold out to the NUSA/Militech or that Johnny’s engram wasn't given to Alt, which also meant V killing Johnny. Then again, CDPR wouldn’t have to deal with tying up V’s 6 month mortality problem. A third option is for the player to decide, like the Nomad/Streetkid/Corpo options, and the ending you choose is V’s backstory that only concretely affects the first ~half-hour of the game
@killwill5965 I think we could see V return as the main character for CP Orion. Seeing as the game is said to be a direct sequel to CP2077, they will have to include V or at least their legacy in Orion anyway. Be it as part of the main story or in background events. With the exception of Temperance and Least Resistance, all endings leave enough room for a continuation of V's story. Maybe each ending could lead to a different prologue as part of an expanded life path system with all of them culminating into being cured and 'employed' by Mr Blue Eyes. Since the great AI conspiracy is likely to be a major part of the next game, MBE will play an essential role either way and he has already shown great interest in V. I'm sure a lot of us would like to see V's story continue and it would still allow new players to customize their character and life path. In this way, cdpr could cater to both sides. We also wouldn't have the lore problem of a second new god-tier solo being introduced within the span of like 2 or 3 years in world.
Say what you will but i cant for the life of me trust Solomon Reed and Rosalind Meyers any more than i can trust Takemura and Hanako Arasaka!! Your theory is 100% valid!
Nah it’s the fact so mi rather die than be myers Guinea pig I was like uh oh this a really bad bad ending myers with blackwall tech nope she was already breaking international rules and laws so yep myers is evil
Stands to reason, especially due to the fact that Millitech clearly took over Night City by 2079. There are heavy patrols throughout the streets and recruitment billboards everywhere. The question then becomes why did NUSA "wake up" V at all? Why not just keep him/her under control? And also, why wouldn't they have just wiped the memories of all interactions with Songbird, Myers, and Reid?
While I'd like this theory to be true, I think the much more likely option is that the ending is just plain poorly written. Also, the whole "no combat implants" discussion is very stupid considering you can kill Adam Smasher without ever getting anything besides the Kiroshi eyes forced onto you in the prologue. (yes, you are also forced to get hand implants, but you can just take these off later by pressing middle mouse on them)
This is why the panam Nomad ending will always be my favorite🙏 we still go out. But it’s around people who love us, a partner who absolutely loves us for us. And if only for however long we have left to live, we have a new chance at life. Even if only for a bit.
If you consider the Relic's job according to the first 1/2 of the game, and the Relics own 'read me' file. The Relic was to tear out part of the brain that govern personality and memory, and replace it with a genetic neutral artificial brain cells to make the new host. But there is a problem the Relic lost integrity when its case was destroyed. By the time V got the thing in her head it would be around 70% integrity. How many chips you know would work at 99%?? none. So it could be possible the situation caused the coma, due to unknown damage. V was choking out blood.... uhmm why? When the chip was to work on memory and personality, completely different part of the brain. Therefore all this; maybe over thinking the story. Reed may of felt bad because things went south, and feels responsible, for her being in a coma, even though it was not his fault Remember how he felt about Songbird even though she helped in his assassination.
Let’s not forget that with Johnny’s engram being purged from V, there’s suddenly nothing stopping V from going cyberpsycho. The only reason V couldn’t go over was because they had Johnny in their head to split the load and to keep them sane……ish. With Johnny gone, plus all the cyberware, V would have to take on all of that alone which would likely cause em to snap. Your theory has a very high probability of being true, definitely sounds like something the NUSA would do, that and I really doubt they’d want their patient to wake up and instantly turn into a killing machine.🤷🏻♂️
Intresting theory NUSA scared of random merch who strong enough to kill Chimera, Dogtown alpha hound, MaxTac operator in 1v4, Adam Smasher and probably all their top rank officer, V is a treath for them he/she doesnt bound to the country only himself
Wait, did anyone actually trust the NUSA at all after everything that happened in the expansion storyline? Everyone was just lying and manipulating you every step of the way.
I didn't trust them from the start and still found myself a little taken aback by just how callous Myers truly is. Her attitude in the Songbird ending when you eavesdrop on her and Reed at the airport should tell everyone all they need to know about that woman, I think.
i feel like the memory wipping part might be not well interpreted. It feels more like removing your concept than removing a memory. A mice in a maze, sends huge puppet vibes for example. If you haven't got the concept for manipulation or free will, you become manageable, easy to control. Calling V a sleeper agent isn't so far fetched then.
Solid Theory and one I actually have thought about myself. The other thing I have been pondering is why they purposely separated you from everyone in your life. They had all the opportunity to say something to your friends and family. Also, This is HEAVY SPOILER..you have been warned I think Panam is dead. Either she took the Long Nap or something else took her life and thats why Mitch asks you to never contact them again.
Im also 100% sure Panam is dead, there is no way she would listen to V's voice message then asks Mitch to call. She would call herself even if it was for cursing and death threats! Also Mitch's face covered with wounds in the call + looks nervous, pretty sure they ran into a big trouble and got slaughtered. He doesn't tell V as there is nothing he can do especially right after he woke up from coma..
I remember something that I’ve seen somewhere that all the major ending are canon and all happened in a way like the Devil ending happens with takemura and Hanako and she end up dead if V doesn’t intervene and the aldecaldos actually raid arasaka to get themselves back up on their feet but of course they only did that for V but who knows they seemed desperate for good jobs and contracts they might’ve thought hitting them would’ve got them back on their feet and not do the deal with biotechica, aswell since V wasn’t involved they got hit hard and Panam maybe even Saul lost their life….
@@AveChristusRex789 Mitch is a technician he can run her holo but why would he use her holo for a long time, right? Perhaps it happened recently then they ran into some hole without connection to hide. It also explains why Mitch's face covered with wounds.
Imagine if the next game is someone from V's past discovers what was done and somehow uses said AI to restart V's ability to use implants. It would allow you to once again start from level one and would give returning players a reason to be imvested in the story from the start.
The beginning of the book Neuromancer has someone akin to a net runner that finds himself in a similar position trying to get back his ability to interface with the net again…. They could be setting up a similar story for a continuation of V’s story
@@LPeck1985 In the cyberpunk universe, even if you are a Corpo, you can't trust the Corps. They will twist everything and anything for their benefit without caring about long term repercussions. Nusa is just a branch of Militech at this point and if Arasaka had access to So Mi, they would be doing the same thing as Meyers. Worse part with the Arasaka deal is even if they put V in a new body, they will alter V's relic conscious to suit their needs before reinstalling. Can't have somebody like V remain a possible menace if they ever decide to do missions against Arasaka in the future.
@@LPeck1985 They arguably are. Arasaka wants to be a corporate superpower, a leader in that area, where as what NUSA is doing would bring a complete and utter annihilation of the entire human race...and the world itself. As bad as corporations are, the NUSA is beyond monstrous.
Victor seemed troubled as he had seen this kind before, that cyberware was beeing turned off. Like being instructed, if this sort ever shows up, ignore it as it belongs to the agency. And if he might lay his hands on it, he could loose everything. Like his whole life and Mistys safety and being tossed to the streets with nothing left. Vic was scared and stepped back to not intervene whatever V came accross. Vic was like: "Whatever crossed your way V, you live, but I don't know what kind of deal you made and I don't want to know and I certainly don't want to be involved"
Fun video, though respectfully, my thoughts: V's story is done and sometimes in fiction the most mundane, bittersweet outcomes just happen, and that's that - there isn't always a gotcha attached in the hopes of getting something more. Don't think a needless over-complication of already pulpy circumstances really makes the ending better. It was good on its own as a sobering goodbye.
Here's a little theory I have. The King of Swords Ending (where V strikes a deal with NUSA and becomes unable to use cyberware) is the canon ending. But it's not really the end for V. Cyberpunk: Orion will follow V or a new protagonist trying to find out what happened to V during those two years, and with V possibly regaining cyberware usage through a risky procedure. V might be forced to choose between the "quiet life" and the "blaze of glory" once more. Possible revenge story.
I actually expected the PL ending to make V either a winter soldier type character, or something like a robocop. Something like they overwrite V with a diffraction person instead of Johnny, and the final mission is just V going robocop on some 3rd world country. So honestly im quite glad the ending turned out as it did😅 it was way worse in my head
Given the inspirations 2077 pulls from, this wouldn't surprise me. In Neuromancer, Case had his brains and nerves fried by a corp to the point where he could no longer hack. Could see CDPR taking a page out of Gibson's book here
Unlikely. V has shown to be both reliable as an FIA agent (by completing their mission to rescue the president behind enemy lines and capture Songbird) and with great potential in ability in relation to everything else they've done. There's no need to handicap a potential future field agent recruit (Reed even asked if he wanted to teach).
To be honest this ties up the biggest loose end this ending presented: Why the NUSA would ‘waste’ the valuable neural matrix on a mere agent when they’ve shown how they can treat Agents, with V willingly putting themselves in a precarious position by trusting the NUSA with a known “Coma”. And while the video didn’t touch on it the reasoning for another loose end is Also simple, V could Still be useful as a test subject / ‘winter-soldier’ in the future, all the NUSA and Militech would have to do to reactivate an extremely deadly and important agent was to ‘nab a defenseless, implantless man who they let go once because Militech no longer needed him and they didn’t want to waste resources keeping ‘im on ice when they can just release him temporarily without risk
These are all solid points, but the crazy thing is, a theory like this doesnt even need justification, it already sounds EXACTLY like what corpos would do, and is something they'd have incentive to do. I can just imagine myers standing over the operation as she asks the sugeons "what if we...DONT "fix" his brain completely though...he's a loose end that keeps asking about so mi, he'll come looking, make sure he's powerless." Johnny is always sussing out all the people that clearly end up not meaning us well, and he has been warning us about her the ENTIRE way throughout the expansion. I mean seriously, this ending basically boils down to "going under the knife at the hands of corpo controled factions whove made a promise to help you that they have no incentive to honor, and no need to, and nothing stopping them from breaking that promise, infact, there is incentive in them doing that." What part of that summary sounds like a good idea. "but v gets to live." "He gets to live a lie* " Isnt it ironic? you keep so mi alive and see the fate you're condemning her to, for a "cure", wouldn't it be a bitch of an irony, that in a different way, you end up sharing that fate, and at the hands of the same people both she and johnny has been warning you about? Its exactly like this with arasaka. I feel like alot of people misunderstand the poetry of that writing. You sell out, you betray not just your friends but yourself, everything you stand for and your reasons for fighting against corpos. You give up all of that and submit to your helplessness in the face of what seems to be inevitable, despite the story showing you constantly that V has a reputation for cheating death, you give up on everything that is set up to not just make you a legend, but everything your friends respect you for, the things jackie had faith in you for, and all the hard work vik has put in to help get you where you are when you were still a nobody rookie who couldnt afford his services, and yet, despite langley's best doctors "saving" you, You call vik to tell him the news about your implants and what does he say? He tells you thats bullshit, and remarks "first time i've seen anything like this." It all sounds painfully specific to V despite all the impossible feats the 2077 universe has displayed, and yet, they cant fix you and get you back to normal? I dont buy it, Victor even goes through 2 or 3 ideas on what he could do and is stumped, meaning, he's probably dealt with similar cases to what was described over the holo, and was able to find a solution, but this ONE time..... he cant? All signs both figurative and practical, point to "They fucked u, they saw an opportunity to silence a potential threat and took it as they no longer had use for you." In betraying so mi, just like in any other ending where you betray your friends, you betray yourself, and end up SHARING her fate. now thats real karma, and not the "eye for an eye" type of shit, no, Thats the universe calling you a fucking gonk, you had it all, and gave it up in a moment of weakness because the people you normally despise said "we can fix you" and you think you have nowhere else to turn, but in reality all you had to do, was keep doing what you always do, "Never stop fighting, V" Even So mi echoes that line to you, "you'll keep fighting", these are all the signs that scream "you dont need their cure". And the mr blue eyes ending i'd say is proof of this, because of his vague, cryptic line, funny however it is that the one ending where you and johnny as brothers in arms go to war and fight through arasaka, without bringing anyone else down with you, is the one ending where there is a hint at "gaining more than you could have ever possibly imagined", nevermind a cure, whose to say whats waiting on the other side of that deal isnt the outright perfect W you've been looking for, in whatever shape that may take, figurative or literal, and it wouldnt be a stretch to believe that ther really is a cure AND more waiting on the other side, we've already watched saburo come back to life, hearing you fixed your brain and became the next 1% of powerful people on the planet sounds like chump change in words by comparison, but you dnt ever find out, and cant ever find out, if you give up, and sell out, and i think that is one of, if not the single most important message from cyberpunk's ending, and that message can be soummed up as, in a fun way to word it, "Just fuckin rambo it mate."
@@LayedBackGamers Hell yea Choomba I'm doing great I feel old because I'm trying to make my great grandmother's 100 year old homemade pickle recipe no one in my family has had them in about twenty years
I love this ending. Change can be good or bad but it’s okay because it’s inevitable. “Let go and begin again.” Is my favorite quote from Fallout: New Vegas.
I was ready to discredit this whole theory UNTIL you brought up the novel. If the novel No Coincidence, has ANYTHING to do with the game (current and sequel) then you could be right about and possibly they have V being like Zor in the novel. Only problem is, he has his memories and they give him the option of a job at Langley... unless while they "operated" on him they had him complete a mission, and then wiped his memory. Idk
If the Neuromatrix stopped V from using her cybernetics, then what would happen to Songbird if they sent her to the moon to use it? Songbird's body is pretty much cyborg.
Hey chooms! I hope you all enjoyed and let me know all your thoughts down below. I hope to have another video out on New Years for you all!
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Just proves why I hate this ending even more....should've touched on who was winning the corpo war when you're awaken....seems awfully fishy chooms!
The coma thing isn't so sinister. In neruomedicine IRL an induced coma can be a way to protect the brain from damage, allow it to heal. It could be simple as that.
@@HontasFarmer80I beg to differ do to the information that extracted from V. Be sure to click on the blue dialogue and reload so you can hear all dialogue options...yes the NUSA is that sinister..
Dont shill raid bro just post a huahua address
@@squigglesmcjr199 ?
If Songbird uses the neural matrix, she recovers a few days later. Her body is also almost fully chromed to the point that she couldn't live if it became unusable. If V uses it, he wakes up two years later and can no longer use cyberware. Thats what I find most suspicious.
But we don't know if she survived, never saw her again after helping her
@@graphenaishata7960 She sends you the message to return to the place that reminds her of home. She leaves both Cyberware and a souvenir from the Lunar city she now lives on. For obvious reasons she can't return to earth.
@@Eco-pu2zs She had a deal with Mr Blue Eyes, whom is expected to be an AI from the Blackwall. It is not far fetched that she is not really alive after that. We just get a massage, could be from anyone. We don't see her physicaly anymore.
@@graphenaishata7960 When she writes the place that reminds me of home, she is referring to the deep conversation she and V had about how Myers, Reed and the FIA stole her life and identity and are responsible for her infection from the Blackwall. Also, why would we see her physically, she's not even on the planet anymore and she needs to go into hiding.
@@Eco-pu2zsi think she’s still alive and i think the NUSA definitely did something to V to make them chromless not to mention i think time moves so fast in NC for all we know fam was gone for maybe 6 months max so everyone probably felt like he/she was gone for so long
Its also possible that the NUSA used V as a testing bed for blackwall implants utilizing the neural matrix. Its more than possible these implants are still in V and the NUSA has made them a sleeper agent with the cover story that their neurons are fried and brain is unable to use combat implants since they would interfere with these blackwall implants. The two year coma was the stage at which they could develop stable enough implants and put them in V as a testbed of sorts. The NUSA knows that for V this is just a job and they'd have no loyalties to them which is probably an additional reason they're offered the job at Langley so that these implants can be directly monitored rather than covertly.
Just a bit of a crackpot theory though I could be missing some factors that disprove this.
Lemme guess before I finish watching. So no wonder Myers was so sure she'd see V again. Lost Somi as a proxy and gained V instead.
What if the next Cyberpunk game is V being booted back up by NUSA for a critical mission? Of course, that only works if everyone opted for siding with NUSA...so probably not. First play through of Phantom Liberty I sided with NUSA and there was something really disquieting for me about it I couldn't place my finger on it. LayedBackGamers theory feels like a peak behind the curtain but not the full picture. The second play through I sided with So Mi and even though she lied to me it just felt like a better ending (plus Alex didn't die).
That theory, while fun, has some major holes.
>They would have had to make implants that are so well hidden in V's body that not even an experienced ripper like Vik could tell they were in there, even when using his equipment. If they DID have these kinds of high quality implants, why in any world would they slap them in some merc with no official ties to them rather then a high quality experienced agent, like reed.
>If these implants were being used to make V a sleeper agent, why wouldnt they then use their resources to put him in a position where he would be of use. We get our asses slapped around by common street thugs in the NUSA ending. We are meant to believe one of the most valuable assets the NUSA would have on their roster is just being thrown to the wind to wander around and see what happens? Seems like a real useful way to use a sleeper agent.
>If these implants were around and installed in V as a "sleeper agent", why would they even leave the opening for V to turn down the job offer and wander around the world? If they had the kind of tech and knowhow to make him a sleeper agent, your telling me they had no way of implanting a subconscious desire to work for the NUSA after waking up? The kind of tech your describing is cutting edge, and your telling me they just let some random merc walk out with it?
Again, its a "fun" theory, but put against basic scrutiny it makes the NUSA look like some saturday morning cartoons level supervillians who do more to hurt their own plans then help them.
This makes lots of since if you go the route with Reed, where if you end up getting the blackwall chip from that ai, you can craft the blackwall smg or have the blackwall quickhacks
Your theory has no much sense. Why did they let go Vi with such important implants to Night City where he can be killed be a random bullet any day or from a knife from a weakest thug? It would be a total project failure and has no sense.
The fact that V has no memories of the two years doesn't prove that they were in a coma. For all they know, they could have been cured by the NUSA, sent back out into the field to do all manner of shenanigans, and then had their brain wiped for security reasons. Similar to how Bucky was an agent during the Winter Soldier, kept on ice for years until he was needed, his memories erased each time.
In this case why they didn't erase the all memories about Phantom liberty events for NUSA security? They could make up any story to explain Vi his/her current conditions and concealing all touchy info about the president and Songbird.
@@spirsom8750 maybe V has become an unreliable narrator themselves, just like Silverhand. The life V lived during these two years could have been altered any number of ways. Maybe there never was a Songbird or Reed. Implanting V with the memories of a super spy just like Total Recall.
@@spirsom8750 V knows way to many talented people. If he just wakes up in a hospital without knowing why he is there he is gonna get suspicious. He would be friends with most of the fixers in night city and be well known among the mercs. Why have someone snoop when the information probably isn't important enough to go completely dark and cover everything up, I'm sure the US could have nuked dogtown if they were that worried about info getting out.
@@spirsom8750 Perhaps the memory editor they used was installed after the fact, and rather than rummage around for old ones, they just put it to filtering out new ones.
@@spirsom8750 messing with the brain and memory can lead to a whole sleu of issues. If they wiped V's memory of phantom liberty then he is asking questions as to how he neded up in the coma, why was he with the NUSA, why would the goverment even bothered with a Night city merc to begin with. then he gets out and see's people he talked to. people who knew he saved the president and started working for the NUSA. it really muddies up the time line that would be in V's head
leaving his memories in tact allows the lies to sit pretty with credibility.
so to the NUSA V, saved the president, brought in Songbird, brought into custody, sent out into the field for more work for 2 years and had his memory wiped.
to V its, Save the president, Brought in songbird, went into NUSA custody to get help with the relic, was in a comma for 2 years.
mentally the timeline makes sense and allows the mind to kind of accept how everything played out, less questions to be asked nothing is really missing and what ever they had V doing during those 2 years none of V's friends would be aware so there is no conflicing information to come up.
Damn, can you imagine if the NUSA straight up created their own engram of V while in that "coma"?
They'd literally have something to upload into people to turn then into an incredible military asset before shutting them off.
🤔
creating the engrams kill the person unless they created it and slotted V right back at his body which doesnt make much sense
@@gustavosanches3454 Soulkiller tech is old as shit by this point, and you can see the other corps were clearly playing with alternatives (and were aware of Soulkiller) for many years as well.
It's stuff I wouldn't put it past these unscrupulous organizations.
@@gustavosanches3454 No it doesn't, the latest iterations from Arasaka did make engrams of people that are still alive, it's explained in a shard somewhere and it's the entire selling point of the Secure your soul program.
Yeah... the thing works by first copying an engram and THEN Soulkiller flatlines you right after, meaning, you could just, like, skip the whole death part.
Hell, Saburo existing as an engram already shows that that must be the case - the engram logically can only exist if it was made before he got murdered... yes, Jacky is a thing, but, Jackie's engram is obviously faulty, unlike Saburo's, so, it is relatively safe to assume that an engram can only ever be as good as the brain it was created with... which would mean, the longer the person is dead, the less viable an engram becomes...
Which makes sense, same thing applies in reality: the longer a brain is without oxygen before a person gets resuscitated, the higher the chance of serious brain damage, up to the person being practically just... gone. And we aren't even talking hours here, we are talking mere *minutes*.
"Heh, c'mon now. You think you're that important? You ain't no Morgan Blackhand."
- Guy who's every statement is a lie.
Reed is such an NUSA pushover just to get betrayed repeatedly. That guy has zero self respect
Reed is the same type of person as Takemura, false loyalty, duty and gratitude feelings got them attached to their masters, Trying to give some deep and unique meaning to their own empty lives, that they both fear they won't get if they broke their chains and try to live for real by themselves.
at least goro was somewhat honest about it and we can even tease him a lot unlike random fun-police bouncer
@@supakungfumastah7789goro has a more eastern attitude too. Hes not deluded that arasaka are good guys, he just values honor above everything else and the fact that arasaka took him from a low position and put him higher makes him value his honor towards arasaka. Reed is a knight that commits atrocites on a daily basis to justify himself
@@marcraider The difference is that Takemura is that he doesn't lie to himself, and has made it known where his loyalties lie, even if he wishes otherwise
It is something beyond disabling implants. Victor would have seen that they were off in some fashion but he can see that V's nerves are fried. V was in a coma as a lab rat. They tested and re-tested something on him/her. Perhaps another blackwall program, several blackwall programs that after 2 years left V with a damaged motor cortex.
That ending was one of the most depressing thing I experienced into a game. You become V and feel the emptiness of becoming so ordinary and vulnerable, blending into the crowd. Betraying Johnny. Killing him. Losing so many close friends and finally ... ones self.
Exactly. It's such a sad ending. I'm unable to play it myself right now. I just watched the ending I was interested in (yeah, I know, lame..), and I'm shocked that things could unfold this way. If I follow the same path, I'll probably be devastated afterward. ;_; ...and I feel your pain
You speak of being ordinary as if it’s a bad thing, or that you got rid of Johnny as if that were a bad thing too. Well I disagree it’s the best ending in my opinion. Considering how much eddies you stacked up before those 2 years it’s not so bad being an ordinary person with that level of wealth. (My V’s reasoning) but I hear what you are saying
@@takumu781 well being ordinary is technically a bad thing for V bc his canonical personality trait was that he at one point wanted to be the best in night city so him being ordinary is a hit in the ego for him at the least
@@mithvibes4727 it’s not your v so your opinion does not matter.
Yea. I thought the ending was good but I didn’t like it. It kind of destroyed me on the inside a little.
Hmm, maybe this is just me. But, I think the job being offered by the NUSA would restore him to full strength. They want a new Morgan backhand. But one they can control, so they offer V the job and maybe down the line once they're sure he's become a loyal man. They offer him a way to be a solo again.
This was exactly as I saw it. If you turn them down they have neutralised a potential threat and if you take their offer they now posses control over one of if not the most dangerous being in the world. V is only 25 in that ending as well so there is so much room for them to figure out how to get everything working if they didn’t just intentionally disable all the implants and just lie to you.
So Cyberpunk Cerberus?
I would have loved an option to accept Reed's offer. Could have been a final decision before the ending. Even if V would not turn back into a god tier solo, it would have been an interesting choice to make.
If they did a sequel, imagine V taking this offer, and inevitably turning against Militech/NUSA
@@vault-tecrep8565 A sequel is being worked on, now the question is; how is it a sequel to CP77? Does it only follow the universe, or is there direct ties between the main characters (Silverhand and V) in the games.
I knew the visit to VIK's office meant much more. He recognized something that wasn't told to V.
Canon ending is Don't fear the reaper for me. Mr blue eyes seems to imply he has the means to help him
Yep blue eyes is definitely a sign of canon events peralez becomes mayor though extremely paranoid and since he supports nusa that’s a plus for blue eyes since he wants arasaka gone from NC, sending so mi to the moon he appears which him having blackwall knowledge and access who knows what he’ll do, and V soloing saka tower to become legend to do one final heist that blue eyes could possibly save V
The Sun (including don't fear the reaper) and the Star are the best and most hopeful endings because they're left opened. When you think about it they're very similar too - in both V is still alive at that time, changes to status quo are minor enough and there's hope to help them (also all have romance fanservice too).
Their openness and similarities always felt to me like they're set up as canon endings, it's as close to happy ending as it gets and it leaves door open for CDPR if they decide to bring back V as a protagonist.
@@papkinn If you really think about it, all the endings except the "toss the pills" ending could be left open for the story to continue in a DLC/Pt 2...If you send So Mi to the moon, she or someone from the moon could reach out to you and help you, if you send her with Reed she could somehow free herself or get released with the help of Blue eyes...the Aldacados could find a cure for V while they're out....nomad...ing...lol. And even the one where V becomes a construct, Arasaka could find a body for V and the story could be V trying to escape from Arasaka's grasp. So many different ways to go
@@supersaiyanbino Yep, sadly, due to that reason, CDPR doesn't want to continue V's story in Cyberpunk Orion because the ending is too broad, and I believe CDPR doesn't want to make one ending to be a canon (and I hope they don't)
For me its also Dont Fear the Reaper but only ended with Temperance. Tower, Star, Sun or Devil perfectly fit with the usual Night City struggle for survival or to became a legend but i like to think that V is truly special, just like David. Both protags who werent fit for Night City and payed the highest price. David wanted to make other people's dreams come true, V wanted to give others second chances, even if they didnt deserve it. We meet several people like these during sidequests and gigs, with SoMi and Johny being the prime examples. V him/herself gets a second chance from Jackie after prologue so i like to think that his death potivated V to do the same for others. For me its the only actually beautiful ending, SoMi after being thrown into the den of snakes finally finding someone who was willing to help her with no ulterior motives, and Johny having a change of heart, abandoning his vendetta agaist Arasaka to make the best out of Vs sacrifice and living his life to the fullest. Also, i like that no one except Johny knows about Vs sickest actions, snatching a cyborg out of NUSA hands and launching her into space, solo'ing the entire Arasaka with Smasher as a cheery on top, this is how you become an ACTUAL legend
My theory is that the NUSA used V as a Commando without their permission, and probably instanlled Blackwall implants and/or highly experimental combat implants.
For being used as a Commando, the easiest thing to back this up would be the obvious fact that they planned for V's "awaking", yet couldnt do it any sooner? Not to mention that lorewise, V is the single most terrifying person to ever live. In the timeline, V is killed and resurrected, completes 100+ gigs, saves the NUSA president, does an entire black-op while being termaily ill and being the frontman of the unit (Reed and Alex basically just act as support for 90% of the time), nearly rids NC of crime, defeats dozen of cyberphycos, survies getting hit by the blackwall directly 5-6 times, breachs the blackwall themself with the aid of Alt, kill hundreds of wraiths in both attacks and defenses, Kidnap the heir of Arasaka, and (though you dont do this in the tower ending) storm Arasaka and kill Adam Smasher, of which, V can do solo. Renember all of this is ment to take place in about 4-7 weeks, a large chunk of which V is uncouncious in Vic's clinic. Before all this, V was practically a nobody. It would make sense that they kept V as their personal attack dog that they could drop anywhere on the planet and have their problem delt with in a month tops. Not to evn get started with the fact that Johnny's engram was obviously removed from the Relic, but there's no saying that it wasnt possible for the NUSA to figure out a way for new engrams to be placed on, so there is potential that a even greater soldier could have been put on the biochip (if they could figure out a way to swich which person was in controll remotely).
My seconed thought is V was most likely used to test all sorts of Cyberware. V's resistance to cyberware is probably the highest of any person to live, with the only argument being Smasher himself. In game, V can use their cyberware without much care. Hell, V can yse David's exact sandavistan every few seconeds with no consequences, while David was in danger if he used it more then once a day. V not only has such a high tolerance, but V could have used a Cyberware with a direct connection to the Blackwall (the Blackwall cyberdeck) without much side affect. Also, the Biochip allowes for tolerances that are completely beyond what was thought to be possible beforehand.
I have a similar theory the only difference really thinking back to AI weapons is instead of a greater soldier i thought it could of been an experimental combat AI. It wouldn't be hard to hide Vs physical appearance an AI bread for combat would draw out Vs full potential even over clock them burning V out eventually, fire it up drop them where ever they are needed and know that problem will be resolved.
Regarding the cyberware testing, if I remember correctly, Mike Pondsmith has stated that V doesn't go psycho because the Relic Chip shared the load, and negated the effect of most cyberware. If V still has the relic chip, they would 100% have the highest tolerance out of anyone alive.
Smasher doesn't count. He was already a psycho before the implants.
Idk about y'all chooms, but the only person i trust and allow to cut me open and not fry my synapses is Vik. Choom since day one has never lied to me, never withheld any information from me, tells me to put matters in my own hands if I'm gonna party in saka tower with Johnny like it's 2023.
Even when i enter the Major leagues after all is said and done Vik still checks in on you and asks you to drop by when you have time to see if your major league ripper has done anything gonk with you ..
Everybody in NUSA, Myers, Reed, Songbird (maybe 'cept Alex) has either not told you the full story or has outright lied to you at one point or another, And now I'm supposed to trust them after everything that's transpired in Dogtown?
I guess I'm good, if Vik says a couple weeks at most, guess I'll just grab the hottest iron and storm saka tower, jack my ass into Mikoshi and we'll see how it goes, at least my life's on my terms.
Vik is a true bro. I loved when he was in V's corner for the Razor Hugh fight. He's like a caring older uncle.
He's the only ripper I use, Vik is great.
Vik even sacks up and tells you to stop being a bitch and either solve your problem or eat a bullet
There's a reason he and Misty are the only ones that still care about you years later
🤓
I've also read the theory that Mr. Blue Eyes basically uses and discards Songbird if you send her to the moon (we never see or hear from her again other than a message that could have been left by anyone) so its just another lose / lose situation in CP
Yeah, the most likely scenario. No way a corp which brainwashes people seen in game (Peralez questline) will just help So Mi with no strings attached. Truly the best ending for her is to simply be killed by V.
@Dankmemeslover69 What about the theory that he's not even human, but an AI controlled entity (hence the glowing blue eyes)? The speculation is that there's an AI (or a group of them) that's out there pulling strings to change society to their liking - which may, or may not include coexistence with humans. If that's the case, he may have cured songbird to eliminate a potential threat to that plan.
@@scyfon Yes Mr Blue Eyes definitely a thrall run by the AIs to impact the physical world; the AIs also seem to be stoking hatred of pro-Arasaka politicians like Holt and favoring pro NUSA/Militech puppets like Peralez though too. Is this the work of Myers/Songbird using blackwall tech, or are the AIs already in control of the NUSA itself and using it to expand?
All Mr. Blue Eyes cared about was the AI. So Mi was just an expendable asset. So maybe the Songbird body survived but was probably too badly damaged and discarded.
Heck Mr. Blue Eyes is an AI himself that just uses a human body as a vessel. Just look at his eyes and then look what happens with Songbird whenever you didn't go along with her and the AI activated. Her eyes turned red.
You guys are all wrong. Song sends you a Pin from the moon as a souvenir and she sends you a cyberware that she drops to her favorite location she shows you. I’d say she’s Fine
It's really fitting that this ending and the Arasaka ending are by far the worst endings for V, in both cases you sell your soul to "The Man" so to speak be it a corpo or the NUSA itself. It just goes to show you are nothing but meat for the machine in their eyes especially when you take this theory into account
It's funny because those are the only two endings where V can actually keep their soul, in all others it's killed by SOULkiller. It's either sell yourself to a corp, or a rogue ai, maybe the true good ending is the shortest one...
It is of course it's left to interpretation what exactly happened in mikoshi. If V's brain was scraped blank to create an engram that is then uploaded onto relic, original V is definitely dead, but if somehow v's engram was written back on their brain, or the brain was just copied without full scraping, then changes applied, one could argue it's akin to momentary loss of consciousness as the brain state was shortly restored, with a few changes.
Alt certainly doesn't think it's the latter though.
@@romanr1592Thompson has something to say regarding soulkiller:
”It's no legend. Soulkiller's real. And your choombas at Arasaka just "hired" the 'runner who wrote it. Take that in - 'Saka with Soulkiller to do with as it pleases. Grim, my man. You even imagine that, rocker? Arasaka'll be unstoppable. Soulkiller'll flatline any 'runner who comes close to even tryin' to scratch its ICE. Seen it happen. Not an iota of physical damage - nervous system or anywhere else. No sound, no fury, no stench. Just all of a sudden, brain waves cut out. As if someone pulled the plug.”
Taking what Thompson said into consideration, if you manage to restore brain wave activity - you wake up with the same consciousness as before. That is if Soulkiller did anything with it, which it doesn't.
Alt merely created an engram of V, aka memories and personality (no consciousness because that's tied to the physical human brain), so that she can replace it with Johnny's engram inside the Relic so that the nanites can start rebuilding V's neural network with the data (memories and personality) stored in the engram.
The end result is that V - the original, biological V - wakes up outside of Mikoshi with their original memories and personality intact as if nothing changed.
@@romanr1592I’m pretty sure you get turned into and Engram for The Devil Ending as well.
I think The Tower ending is even worse than The Devil ending, because at least in the latter you have the option to return home in full strength and with all your relationships still intact. By contrast, the Tower ending is by far the most depressing ending of all. After completing Things Gone Changed I went with the suicide ending, and I felt much less depressed with that one.
The Tower is a direct line to a sequel if they wanted to keep popular characters like Johnny. Finding out later that Johnny is being held by the NUSA (why wouldn't they lie and say the Relic was gone)..would be a great start to a new game. V starts out weak and depowered until a job where he makes it to the rebuilt Relic.. And slots it just as a heavily armed security team reaches him.. 😮
That didn't sit right with me in game. The Arasaka Relic Tech didn't just "Disappear". It wasn't just "Gone". They managed to take it for themselves using Blackwall tech to do it.
@@SternLX Indeed. It's too good of story thread.. And Keanu is far too popular to allow the Johnny to die. Even the Street Cred being rolled back to zero for V could be justified.. As people would see him as a broken down has-been.
I just don't see starting over completely as people love the characters.. They just hated the game coming out unfinished. Hell.. You could even threaten people with a rebuilt Adam Smasher who'd hate V for dropping him, and being a host for Silverhand.
What if Reed just kept his end of the bargain? Look how much he blamed himself for what happened to SoMi. Why wouldn't he make sure V was taken care of? Also, during the inciting incident, the refrigerated case the relic was in was damaged, and the integrity of the relic was dropping quickly. Causing Jackie to install the relic to keep it structurally secure, and when injured, giving it to V. When Dexter killed V, the relic restarted V. However, when V went to Vic to remove the relic, we discover that the relic cannot be removed and that although the relic saved V's life it is also taking V's life because it's slowly overwriting him with Johnny Silverhand. So, what if, upon trying to remove the relic they discovered it was stuck and overwriting V and the only way to save V is to make his brain deaf to cyber implants and when they removed the relic they were unaware of the impending degradation. Thus, what Reed meant when he said the relic is gone. But hey, that's just a theory a game theory
@@re2gie Nice post.. Where I would disagree is Reed knowing. He outright admits he is out of the loop where So Mi is concerned.. She is considered a weapon.. Something of vital importance. They don't care about her freedom.. Nor would they have an issue with lying to Reed about what happened with the Relic. For what reason would the President care to include him if she felt the Relic was another weapon they could use?
To me Reed would be telling the truth as he knew it. It would make even more sense.. Because there would be NO deception in him when he spoke of the Relic. The President knows how loyal Reed is to the people he feels responsible for.
Nice one. And it's a perfectly suitable narrative reset for genre storytelling as well.
Another reason to not pick that ending
Agreed! This ending is the absolute worst....
@@JohnnySilverwrenchno its not, V starts a normal life just like us its basically new beginning (even tho its pretty illogical 😒)
@@harnaskrogor2577 Disagree with that take. V is a common criminal who ended up in deep water in the pursuit of fame and glory. Songbird is an internet addict who was gaslighted into joining the government and made to do horrible things that she never wanted to take part in, but was under constant pressure to comply with orders. Songbird is the victim in this story. She deserves to live her own life. V is lucky to have a second chance at redemption but a shortened life is better than none at all. V living a normal life is the worst choice, because it means doing something so morally deplorable, everyone you met in the game abandons you and moves on. Why chose that when you can save the life of another more deserving and spend the rest of your shorter life surrounded by those who accept you as family and love you til the end. Aldecaldos for life!
@@bekkison it actually depends on the player sure you can be like a common cruminal but keep in mind most contracts and kills V performs on gangsters or corporational thugs also depending on your choice V can keep his morality by showing mercy/saving others. Other than that I feel like Cdred "forced" this endimg to be negative its just stupid that you loose all your weapons skills body strenght intellect etc, Somi character is tragic but its not like she wasnt in the same situation as V both fought for their lives one of each could be morally superior and sacrifice themselves for the other so there should be no hard feelings for Somi she would give away V to be cured without a doubt.
@@harnaskrogor2577 Come on man, all Song did was trying breach Blackwall then NUSA learned about it and forced her to join them by blackmailing to report Netwatch. While we are blasting everybody on our path, stealing whatever we can get our hands on, making shady deals, also breaching Blackwall depending on our choices. We wouldn't be so far behind Hansen in the most dangerous criminals list! How people could believe we are more deserving to live than So Mi i have no idea really, she was used and turned into a cybermonster, at least we were always free to choose as we wish. Also we have more options to find a cure..
I have a feeling those questions Lisa Smith referenced are like the Voight-Kampff test questions in Blade Runner used to tell human from replicant. It's possible they were using those questions to see if an AI had invaded and overwritten the consciousness of the original person, like Mr. Blue Eyes. AIs would have trouble answering those questions as they are made specifically to test for the odd reactions only a human would make at such nonsensical propositions.
Thought that exact thing.
Was just thinking this
It's a reference to it yes, but it clearly also found a hole in her memory which means it was wiped or tampered with
13:35 that sudden stare; it’s almost like Viktor saw something else entirely in that scan.
It makes more sense for V to have been tampered with tbh. Especially when you line up everything we know about how organisations within CP77 works.
It would also nicely set up the next game either for players to play an older V, work with V or hear stories/have plots within the game about V and what happens post PL ending
Two things: Relic is extremely valuable to corps (like you said) and they already have likely tortured or 'reimagined' Songbird into some Anti-AI super power or whatever, since they now don't give Reed the clearance to know. Plus, Myers demonstrates no remorse in utilizing Songbird like they have. Its a HIGH chance that they, if not made some sleeper agent in V, TOOK his personality through the Neural Matrix/Soulkiller/Relic and are now hoping to use 'him' as an operative for NUSA, which could even be to help fight rogue AI maybe if you are a netrunner.
Myers literally sees you gun down hordes of Barghest + A FUCKING SPIDER TANK, without barely blinking an eye. She probably noticed, just saying. Also, they probably took the 'original' V's implants away to keep from making anymore trouble or interacting with his doubles.
Explains why our dupes get patched. The greepy corpo govt "erases the memory" of the dupe so its not doable.
Am i the only one who looks for in game explanations for how updates change the game. And how in some cases. What do npcs says or think. 😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😊😂 this game is set for that type of content lol
Mayer's is probably the most evil person in Cyberpunk 2077 which is saying a lot, she has no remorse after Songbird dies and gives you lip for allowing her to have peace and instead of being a slave for the NUSA.
Every character we meet in the Phantom Liberty DLC that has been involved with the NUSA (Reed/Alex/Songbird) has been screwed over in one way or another. It is therefore logical to suggest that V would be screwed over by the NUSA in some way too. Johnny Silverhaand constantly warns against trusting corporations or the promises of government, as he was previously a soldier and felt forgotten and taken advantage of. This is why he discourages V from taking the pledge of allegiance to the NUSA. Reed's description of the problem is different to Vik Vectors, so I do find it plausible that Reed is lying to V. The V we wake up as might even be a clone, a version of V intended to live as a harless civilian, while the original is a midless soldier working for the NUSA as a puppet, chromed out more than Songbird and Adam Smasher combined.
We know from Alt in other endings that V's body is already past the point of "ownership" being transfered to Johnny, V was asking Alt for a way to continue living, and Alt seems to conclude that only a couple months was the best she could do. So maybe, Alt could have done what the NUS AI did but knew the damage would happen, so V couldn't make it out of Arasaka like that and would die. Alternatively, the NUS AI was just given the command to save V's life and it had to follow it, even if it caused permanent damage. I think the damage is real, because Alt confirms that V's body will reject them so the NUS AI basically forced a solution that probably broke some things in the process, like putting a present in a bag too small and ripping it in the process. The coma however I think isn't part of that same damage. Most of V's value to the NUS is as a field agent, while Reed says the opposite I think everyone can safely say that V canonically has the potential to have surpassed Blackhand and can beat Smasher in the other endings. I bet that Meyers wanted a new toy, and when the cure damaged V she threw a fit. The coma was probably medically induced until they could find a fix for V's new problem, and another positive for Meyers would be destroying all of V's connections in the process leaving them as just another Reed or So Mi if they could fix them. After 2 years of no returns on investment maybe it wasn't worth it to keep V under, and the damage to V's old life had been done so there was no real harm in waking them and possibly bringing V into the FIA under a different position until a fix could be found at a later time as technology advances. And if V doesn't join the FIA after all of that, then it's still an incredibly dangerous pawn most likely permanently off the board, so this ending is really the worst one where Meyers wins completely with no consequences or losses for her actions.
No it has nothing to do with the body
V's neural matrix is mostly rewritten like Alt said making his body think him a virus
The body is still breaking him down regardless which is why Alt can only give you a few extra months
Honestly the smartest thing to do would be for V to allow Alt to make him be an engram like Johnny and allow that Engram to take over V's body.
Yeah it's going to kill V but it will also create a new one in the process who can still live on
V's case is a special one. V died and got revived by the relic (twice if you didn't side with the netwatch operative), Johnny can take over V's body with or without V's permission, and I think the most interesting part of it all, is the medication that was given to him to stop Johnny from taking over his body. The neural matrix didn't remove Johnny, it intertwined them as one person, but probably made it so that only V's memories are present so it doesn't feel like V is a different person.
The NUSA does have reasons to take the relic and V for studying, but I don't think their interest was any further than that. They just studied V for two years, because V situation could more or less be the same for So Mi situation, since Johnny is technically an Ai. They would also take great interest in the medication given to V, as it would be probably their only hope to stop So Mi from turning into a rogue Ai out of their control. They could make a stronger version of the medication.
I think regardless of V situation primarily if you do the Arasaka ending or the NUSA ending, the chip has more than likely already progressed too far, even Alt couldn't even save V from that, nor Arasaka. It's more likely that Johhny took over V's body, but still retained all of V's memories, but NUSA just suppressed Johnny's memories and had V's memories be the dominant memories. So Johnny thinks he's V.
I also want to add, that the reason why V can't use implants anymore, is probably because the neural matrix Ai, actually went inside of V, and there were two Ai's in V. One that is incredibly way stronger, and is too much for V's body to handle. We hear how humans who try to take blackwall Ai in, die right away due to technology being to rudimentary and the Ai being in a frenzy.
Also, in the devil ending, when V asks Takemura why they can't find him a suitable body for him to take over, but Saburu can take over his son without any issues, Takemura says it's because of them being related, and that V is basically a blank slate, due to the damage to V body by the relic. NUSA sees V is the trial run for So Mi, so they probably studied V more than the time that was needed to be there, since Arasaka was able to remove the relic from V, in a shorter period of time, as when V calls his friends, it seems like V hasn't been gone that long at all, maybe like a couple of weeks to a month at most.
I think you're giving Alt too much credit here, if the chip has progressed too far for her to reverse the effects with the actual software, then what else could she do? It's not like Alt had the ability to perform neurosurgery.
They're just blockers for your immune system, which is the thing rewriting V's synapses into Johnny's because it sees V as the virus. It stops the blackouts and such because it turns off your immune system basically. They aren't anything special
You mention this helping YOU through rough times? Bro, it's weird how much reprieve from stress I get from diving my mind into this world and you helping us make sense of it. Literally just the other day I finished Phantom Liberty and have been binging your videos, actually personally noticed the discrepancy between what Viktor and Reed said was the issue. That had me standing up. Thanks for your videos cuz.
Well I'm glad my videos can help so many. This content is somewhat my get away from work, school, etc. I have a lot of fun delving into this world with you all, there's no better rush! Hope you had an amazing Christmas choom
@LayedBackGamers it was preem. Ate some honey smoked scop.
Just for clarification's sake, you can still get the Tower ending if you side with Songbird. Instead of sending her to the moon you have the choice of handing her off to Reed after she admits the Neural Matrix can only cure one of them and that she played you all that time.
Yes, I chose that option when she confessed the truth.
I have been betrayed by many people.
Even from those closest to me.
So I chose this option on instinct.
@apsurden I did the same. No remorse for giving song to Reed.
@@FTBASTARfor real, I kept on believing and believing in what she was telling me even though reed told me not to, but when she finally told me that had been lying about nearly everything, I knew what had to be done
@@cartierclips1126 So Mi betrayed you, you took it personally, but she didn't kill V or was even planning to do that, but kind of used V. Yes, that is betrayal, and absolutely detestable behavior. But you end up choosing V to hand So Mi to Reed, and hence to Myers. This is fate worse than death to Songbird, just because she happened to betray you. Now Myers gets her tool back and can abuse her until the day she dies for good. You basically dump your lying friend to hands of a rapist and sadist, after they finally trust you enough to say the truth, and the friend is on the brink of death. Reed also goes back to being NUSA lapdog and do their vile bidding for crappy organization. Myers can continue her actions against international law. I just can't understand this kind of emotional response over basic logic. Well, it's a roleplaying game, but hopefully no one would do such choices in real life. Morally unacceptable, logically unsound.
@@jarivuorinen3878 songbird was never V’s friend if we’re being honest, only contacted us to trick and use us as a way to help her kill the president, then proceeded to lie to us for the rest of the time, even about the so called thing that would save us both so she practically did plan to kill us by leaving us with one less option to save ourselves, she knew the risks of the game she was playing and paid the consequences for losing. Plus the V that I made that decision on is very cold hearted but was slowly warming up to songbird just to be repeatedly stabbed in the back by her, reversing any progress made to V’s cold demeanor
The glaring issue with this theory is one simple question... Why would they just let V go? Even if he's depowered, it's still really dumb to let an asset like that back in to the world simply because he's seen way too many things to not be considered a liability. Why not just kill him if he's no longer useful?
I mean that's less about the theory and more about the writing and choices of the NUSA. My personal perspective is they do have a use for him in the future, they muted his implants to be reactivated anytime they wish. There's always the idea too, that Myers despite her betrayals and manipulation has an ounce of respect to V and Reed to allow him to live. In said case, V can always be dealt with and couldn't do any damage they're afraid of.
Or else when V fails to hand over Songbird and essentially says fuck you to Myers, she could've just killed him right there for the failure and disrespect.
@@LayedBackGamers if they wanted V to work for them and if the implants don't work, they could have instead spun some story about how "ah the surgery didn't go so well, but listen friend... come work for us, we have some exciting future prospects for you, we'll get you up and running again. We got the relic out of you, didn't we?"
And yeah sure, Meyers could have had V killed for disobedience but at that point he at least still had some sort of value as a research subject. After the 2 years, I get the impression they really might have extracted all they really could from him.
@@DioBrandoWRYYYYYYi definitely agree that the NUSA could force V to work for them again at any point by offering To Unmute his Cyberware.
@@odontoxins3223 but then why let him go? just string him along, maybe gradually unmute basic augmetics like the Kiroshis as proof of concept. If he has value still, there's no reason to wait and hope he comes back because he might just end up getting his head caved in by gangoons in NC or OD-ing in some dingy apartment.
as much as we all love a good conspiracy, I don't think this ending is supposed to be the canon one or serve as a sequel hook.
@@DioBrandoWRYYYYYY I think I'm on the same page as you here, I feel like people are stretching quite a bit to see something that isn't there. I like fan theories and this is nothing but an interesting "what if?" in my opinion. The foundation is built on the "unreliable narrator" trope, which would basically put everything into question and destract from the actual narrative beats the writers were aiming for. But that's just my thoughts.
That message that mentions Lisa Smith going through a test is the same kinda test Officer K goes through in Blade Runner 2049... Coincidence? I think not🫢
Blade Runner was literally Pondsmith's second biggest inspiration for Cyberpunk, the real one not the fake 2049 one
I knew that Reed lied to us at the ending. He was told in the very start of the mission what they were going to do to V. That is why he always acted so somber, guilty and emotionally hurt inside. Reed was a coward for letting them doing this to the MC. But he was just following orders......
Having a top-level merc that can no longer be touched by tech would be a great asset if an AI invasion is imminent. With V being busted back down to a Level 1 character, I think this ending might suggest V will again be the protagonist in Orion.
i think CDPR’s implied they don’t want V to be Orion’s protagonist especially if it’s implied that V dies in most of the endings anyway
A few other things, is one Reed looks upset and away from you when he says the coma stuff. Notice whenever he lies or speaks about something he regrets he does that too. Second, if they were able to wake V up, why not do it sooner? Third, Songbird is arguably in worse shape then V near the end of PL. The Matrix does not put her into a coma and it does not take away her ability to use cyberware. Fourth, V seems to now suffer from memory issues. When Misty asks where the pendant is, V can no longer remember and V in general seems mentally slower.
Never got why that ending was a death sentence. Sure you can't use implants anymore, but it's not like there aren't plenty of weapons capable of being used that don't require dampeners, reinforced skeletons, or combat implant pairings. Yeah Militech definitely messed you up, but it's not like you couldn't undo it with the right ripper anyway.
Also, V had a significant impact to the Night City, they just don't know it.
We faced the Tyger Claws, arasaka, MILITECH, Trauma Team, and Night Corp.
When we went back to Viktor from a coma, MILITECH took over Night City. We could've prevented it if we were present before it all began.
While this theory can work, i believe this is the other side of the coin. "Would you rather die young as a legend or die old as a nobody?" This is the other side of that coin you get to live to live on as a nobody
I think V was used as some kind of server like how So MI was used for black wall stuff, except they figured out they needed him knocked out and cyber wear off so he wouldn't be conscious of it, and his consciousness wouldn't interfere with what they wanted.
They only let him go because his usefulness ended or because their goals were accomplished and maybe Reed fought to have them let him go or something.
Considering the nature of the Relic itself and how it unexpectedly opened the door to engrams taking over bodies to be "reborn", it was the perfect opportunity for NUSA to try out bringing in AI to a body and trapping them inside a physical body to better tame or interrogate. Once V was burnt out as a conduit, they probably granted the bonus of releasing them on the belief of "Oh hey we saved you, but you can't use combat chrome anymore"
The base game and DLC never takes into account the amount of cyberware you have installed (only the ones that are forced on you).
The DLC ending where they remove/disable your cyberware doesn't effect players who didn't use any cyberware.
Good news: Were removed Johnny from your head.
Bad news: No cyberware.
Me: What cyberware?
The theory is good, but we are forgetting a quite important fact which pretty much demolishes the whole theory. Remember that alt explain to us that she didnt consider the "body factor" when using the soulkiller to separate V from Johnny, since the relic was not only rewritting V's consciousness, but also rewritting his/her DNA to match Johnny's, which is why V isn't able to live more than 6 months if he/she decides to stay in his/her body. So we could simply assume that the neural matrix was able to "rewrite" only essential parts of V's DNA to be able to survive, and isolated/disabled parts that were already too compromised to go back safely. Or simply could be a miss-input command for the neural matrix, remember that the NM is an AI, so if the medics literally wrote "save this person's life" and didnt went fully specific, the AI could simply do the job half way through it and delta like an absolute unit of trolling
And also the ending is represented by The Tower, which is the worst tarot card you can be dealt. Thematically it makes more sense for the ending to be exactly what it presents itself to be.
To get the ending, you have to side with feds, betray Songbird and then run away like a coward instead of getting things settled with Johnny and finishing the fight with Arasaka. I think the ending is karmic punishment for V the same way that the Devil ending is. V stoops low to survive at any cost and thinks he's taking the easy way out while never considering the cost of it to himself and everyone around him, and now he's forced to face everything going wrong all at once, and it's irreversible.
BUT....this makes no sense. If the Relic (which V has the schematics for) was used to put Vs engram onto the same software and Alt installed that program with V's engram instead of Johnny's, then the nanites would conform Vs body to allow his engram to take over, just like it was doing for Johnny, so... either the Relic reconfigures the body to accept the new engram or IT DOES'NT, which is it? ITs just the nonlogic of the game that takes Vs life away from him.
@@gamersanonymous4me131 the relic is damaged, perhaps the nanites couldnt be reprogrammed to handle another engram... Or perhaps a body can't handle two rewrites without killing it in the process. Remember that its a super aggressive tech, it literally makes you cough blood, pass out, and lose control of the body
@@gamersanonymous4me131 I have thought the same thing myself, the response I came up with is that a Fully fuctional Relic could do that but the one V has is damaged during the short time he was 'dead' after he was dumped into the trashheap.
Otherwise there is no real reason Alt coun't just dump a copy of Vs engram into the relic after she pulls Johnny from it.
There is a lot of 'This has to happen this way cause the story needs it do even if it doesnt make much sense after the fact' to force it to fit the nobody gets a happy ending idea
from what I understand from the game, the relic nanites has converted too much of V's brain and her own immune system is attacking her own brain@@gamersanonymous4me131
What if V was cured but woke up after a coma to realize that Johnny is gone but now with blackhand in his place by Bartmoss’s doing in order to be secretly immortalized by arasaka. I say this because Johnny silverhand has his memories mixed up with Morgan Blackhand. The way he tells his stories don’t make any sense when stacked against other source material.
I wish there was a super secret happiest ending. is where Alex lives, you get cured , and your partner, reed, and alex are chilling on the beach.
When I first got this ending and atarted to think about it I didn't even think about them indusing a coma I just thought about the fact that reed could have easily contacted V's friends and told them about her state but it made sense to me that V is valuable and skilled and without friends she might go back and work for the FIA like reed suggested and the more I thought about the more I think the FIA had to do with the coma
The NUSA definitely took every advantage over V while out. V was not only top Merc but near legendary status AND had the relic inside their head.
If we remember. V was inside the blackwall. Met Alt. Seen the other side.
When you let So Mi go to the moon, she is basically healed in days. V is out for 2 years.
Yeah. Its all more than sus.
They used V up like a test toy and then threw em out to the wolves.
It’s crazy how V basically gets declawed. V got what they wanted but at the cost of basically having their life stripped down to just the bone.
I like to think NUSA did it as an extra precaution too just due to everything V witnessed along with how much of a dangerous variable they could become, especially with all the dirt they could possibly have too.
No one is going to believe a nobody, and that nobody has no way of causing much damage. The Night City legend V is long gone.
My speculation of course!
Love your videos! Love these deep dives.
I really wonder how the next game will be.
What part will V play.
Will they be the playable character again? Or someone like Johnny is in 2077, who plays a secondary main character, maybe a mentor of sort for you the player?
Will they even be around or will they go the way of Blackhand. Just a legend and story
I wouldn’t mind playing as V again honestly
The declawing makes sense when you compare to the ending of sending somi to the moon, you straight up decimate the presidents elite black ops, squad after squad, all on your own, and that’s not including being a proxy for Somis blackwall attacks
@figuures6098 if you have 20 strength you can break the president's wrist lol.
When hoping for a miracle, always be careful what you wish for
The discrepancy between what Reed tells you vs what Viktor tells you goes even further. Reed never tells you that you can't use combat implants as in you're physically unable to, he tells you that using them could kill you.
According to what Viktor tells you though installing combat implants wouldn't have adverse effects on you or your health, they simply wouldn't work as they can't communicate with your nervous system.
That's two very different stories and you can't tell me that the NUS just "got it wrong" considering some of their best doctors worked on V and a Zetatech ripper found out within seconds of a scan.
So honestly the only plausible reason I can see for Reed telling his version is because they simply want to scare V away from even trying (V clearly went through hell and back just to survive so the threat of potential death obviously hits hard for V).
And now the only plausible reason I can see for trying to scare V away from looking into this matter further is to cover something up.
The only thing that opposes these thoughts is the fact that even if you tell Reed you gonna leave and have a ripper check it out no attempts to stop you are being made.
They still provide you with an AV to NC the second you ask.
Dude I need that blackwall hand mod shits fire I hate how short our use of it was I get it but imagine we just started abusing our relic as it will protect us via the ai and nanotech to zero everyone we want. We could have used it to kill the bot in the Reed ending or to beat multiple Maxtac av's and trucks at once.
Wait till Next Expansion, I know a Choom with no bottom Jar and flamethrower elbows that will have all that and more on hand.
The doctors would have been there when V was woken up, if it was on the up and up. V is being played in that scenario.
i gave up so mi as my corpo/merc instincts don't tolerate being screwed over.V must have vindication
I love your videos. But this one is my favourite. I absolutely despise the tower ending. NUSA did this to V on purpose.
A lot of people in this comment section seem to be under the impression that Blackhand didn’t use or had minimal implants, when Blackhand was chromed out according to the Cyberpunk lore😂
-Neural processor
-Sandevistan
-Smart-gun and vehicle links
-Interface plugs
-Chip-ware sockets
-Nasal filters
-Two cyberoptics (targeting scope, low-lite, infrared, anti-dazzle)
-Right cyberarm (Rippers, heavy SMG, microwave/EMP shielding, hydraulic rams)
-Muscle & bone lace
-Nano-surgeons
Meanwhile V only has two canon lore implants, the Kiroshi eyes, and the
Ballistic Coprocessor on the palm.
Also if anyone wants to argue that V gets chromed out, no, lore wise and canonically V only has two implants. So until we get a second game and they cement the lore around V, there’s only two implants.
Anybody notice Reed was doing weird things with his hands when V woke up? Like he specifically had one hand behind his back almost the entire time until I said a piece of dialogue which made him act differently
Yep he definitely had a lot of queues giving away just how guilty and unsure he was feeling. He knew it wasn't right what the NUSA did to V, but is too brainwashed to break his loyalty so he struggles as he lies / omits necessary details.
My biggest disappointment with all the endings is the fact that they see the behavioral imprint as the biggest threat, while realistically nothing would be easier than to reset relic's nanites to undo the damage. V's problem isn't all things to do with relic, it's the thing to which V owes her/his life, imagine if the intensive healing capabailities were to be controlled instead of getting stripped away of, together with Johnny.
Even with these thoughts, i get why it's so in base game, it's the easiest way to get relic to stop killing V, and is beneficial to Alt as she get's another ai to be a part of her.
The Tower ending was my first ending, and... I was left with so many questions.
There were a lot of cyberware implants I had that obviously I had no access to afterward. However, to get those Cyberware implants I had replaced my arms (with blades) and replaced my eyes (obviously). However, in the ending... you don't have the eyes or the cyberware arms anymore. But... how is that possible?
Originally I dismissed it as it just being a game. But what I don't get is how V now has organic arms and eyes again, when they'd had them replaced during the game. Did the NUSA grow new arms and eyes? How did they replace them? Also, as V asks during the questioning with Reed, why didn't they use nano-tech to repair the damage if there was damage from removing the implant?
We know, from the other endings, that part of V (at least part of their brain) has begun to be rewritten to support Johnny instead of V, because the tech was originally designed to rewrite Yorinobu to support Saburo. But in order to "cure" you, does this mean that the NUSA cut out those parts of your brain? How did they fix THAT problem, but they couldn't fix the issues with the cyberware?
The explanation you're given makes very, very little sense. While I have no proof of it, I think it's more likely the NUSA did it all for a reason. They most likely wanted the Relic for themselves (I say this with no evidence other than the fact that it's incredible tech that nobody but Arasaka has), so they kept it in one piece rather than risking destroying it. Does that mean that they'd kill V in order to get their hands on the Relic? Is the reason you wake up with no Cyberware and organics again the fact that V was their test subject on their OWN version of the Relic? Is V actually now a clone, explaining why they'd have their organic body somehow magically restored?
If that's the case, and V is a clone with their memories transferred via Militech / NUSA Relic tech, why are they unable to support Cyberware? Is that a side effect they haven't gotten fixed yet, since V was likely the first test subject? Or was it done on purpose to stop V from causing more problems? There is the argument of "well why not kill them?", which is valid, but maybe they didn't want to risk it. I mean, Reed was DEFINITELY asking questions. Others likely might have been as well. V made a big impact in their short time, people DEFINITELY noticed they were missing... so the best way to stop those people asking questions is to have V show up again.
There's way, way more questions with that ending than any other ending because there's just so many parts of it that don't seem to make sense (to me at least).
I was confused by this also. By the end of the game, V has mechanical arms, legs, eyes, brain parts, spine and all sorts of other body parts. Surely by this point, turning all that off leaves V a braindead, blind quadriplegic. While I'm not familiar with the setting outside the game I don't recall it being mentioned that technology that can create/grow perfectly genetically compatible replacements of any natural body part exists. No one explains how they can 'turn off' armour either, so V would still be borderline bulletproof.
I also have trouble understanding how the cure was supposed to work in conjunction with 'cutting out' the engram surgically.
The only thing that leads me to question your theory is in the Song Bird ending, she states that the neural matrix is a one time use tool. Rogue AI’s are kinda like tuna. Tuna have to keep swimming, or they die, rogue AI’s, as she explains them, are ever evolving programs, evolution, adaptation, and change, progression, are integral to their continued existence. She then says that once you program one of these AI like the one in the neural matrix to perform a specific task, it will execute that command and then essentially collapse, because it was given a determined task or function to complete, and then it executes that task, like any program. Upon completion of the task, the program as it is essentially self terminates, either resetting to whatever its original state was, or complete self erasure.
Sounds like Myers or Mr Blue Eyes got their hands all over V's Tower ending
Coma or not, there are story setups that could involve this ending. If V believes that they were in a coma then there's no way for them to let any counter story slip. A more useful NUSA action is to make a sleeper with two compartmentalized personalities. One with no access to the cyber-ware or the other personalities memories. The other personality having access to all of it. To be useful the now famous V needs to be needs to appear to be a non-player in their field. How better to do this than a trip back to Night City to show everyone that they are now a nobody. A new game could start with getting a new face and name to avoid attacks by former enemies. Then have a mission that tears down the conditioning.
I personally don't like the new ending, V survives yes but she/he loses her/his friends, it's too sad and I can't handle it. I prefer to send Somi to the moon to save her and either leave with the Aldecaldos (I hate nc) or use the gun on the roof..
I hoped my V could stay with her/his partner.
V ending here is like Johnny perspective waking 50 years later and can't be the old person he was
Nah not like V to use the gun on the roof the aldecaldo mission feels too hopeful cause the inevitable is around the corner, but for me the only option that’s rational and makes most sense story wise and what lore V would actually do is become a legend and raid saka tower solo and do the final heist going out with a bang or if blue eyes could possibly save V…
You know the most amazing thing about your stories not only is your voice absolutely perfect but you said the back tone down with the music you selected each story you should compiled these together in one huge collection myths of night City in cyberpunk 2077
Reasons to side with Songbird:
- Songbird warns us from the start to not belive myers (myers=nusa).
- In Panam's questline she says that corps equals government which is totally true and as a corpo V, arasaka tried to kill us.
- I started a new game and pay attention to her every words and so far she never said she WILL cure V just that she COULD and there is a LOT OF DIFFERENCE between straight up lying or don't tell something due to her understandable trust issues.
- If we side with her, at the end when she have no power left and can't even stand up by herself she tell the truth to V which the nusa would never done.
- After all that nusa did, her (betraying, backstabbing, forcing her to eliminate reed, making her terminally ill) trust is almost non existing but V gain's her trust and she entrust her life to V.
- Even if we side with Reed she still protect V with all her power till her last breath.
- Nusa stopped V forever by turning it's cortex deaf to implants (which i didn't know before but just confirms what i think).
Reasons to side with Reed:
-songbird betrays v keeping cure for herself while v is dying.
-two iconic Boss fights maxtac and with Hansen
-Horror minigame
-better loot iconic revolver, lmg, knife, and most importantly erabus or militech canto
Songbird ending is happier but boring asf. While Reed Path is way Cooler and fun.
@@SPINEBUSTER2023 I understand you, mostly. The boss fights are really cool and i wanted to kill Hansen since the moment he touched Songbird's looower back. I loved the horror game with the Cerberus. The loot is the cherry on the cake with the Blackwall gateway but it's not nearly as powerful and spectacular as it is in the other ending. But the most important thing is that she didn't kept the cure for herself, she give you the choice. You just have to call Reed if you want the cure.
"- I started a new game and pay attention to her every words and so far she never said she WILL cure V just that she COULD and there is a LOT OF DIFFERENCE between straight up lying or don't tell something due to her understandable trust issues."
I really hate this bullet point. A lie by omission is still a lie, bro. There's no difference.
I'd still side with Song because NUSA will lie to us six ways to Sunday, but Song really isn't that much better. She strung along a dying man with the cure for their terminal illness and only came to terms with it when they felt they were on the verge of death and needed to confess.
@@SPINEBUSTER2023you can get the same amount of iconics if you play songbird ending correctly (lmg, revolver, reeds revolver, iconic cyberware) and those boss fights are more annoying than fun to play. + songbird lied but she lied a hell of a lot less than nusa. Never side with reed
i just thought they never actually used the neural matrix on V - they kept it for their own purposes, experimented on the relic chip while keeping V under, and eventually burned out V's motor cortex and dumped them.
Though it could be like the Devil ending where Arasaka likely plans on keeping V around to put into a corposoldier body at some point with some sort of control apparatus - if the motor cortex isn't permanently deaf, just dormant, waiting for a wake signal from Militech when they re-activate V.
So, why did they say the matrix failed when they tried to use it on Songbird? It's one-time use, so why even try to use it on her? The only reason V gets the "cure" is because it didn't work. What would they have offered V if the matrix worked on song like they planned?
this ending was genuinely the worst, the saddest, the most soul crashing one. i've never cried THAT HARD playing this game before. i like to replay the endings after a while but this one... never again! ❤️
I still say this whole ending is out of Neuromancer. V’s after effects = Case’s cyber burn and Mr. Blue Eyes being Morgan Blackhand = Armitage being Colonel Corto. It all matches up too well.
The funny thing about this whole thing is I've been saying it for quite awhile. I'm glad I'm not the only one, because if you start picking apart history in the real world, which this is kind of based on you see that this concept is not far fetched. At. All. The origins of the genre, there was a toxin(in neuromancer) which did something similar, do a job for them, get the cure. But the fact the cortex "was made deaf" means something was done, so they basically either shut V down from being a risk. Or give him time to settle in, and use Reed to contact him going "V, we have a job. We might be able to reverse the damage. It's hard, but, you in?" Of course to regain former self, you also now realize, they did him dirty.
My feeling is the ending is both a ref to neuromancer and a way to bring V back in the next game without his implants.
I think its gonna come out that Myers ordered V killed but Reed gave the slightly more friendly idea of letting him live but taking away all the chrome so he is powerless. I then think the next game will open with V in a bad place and being saved by Mr Blue Eyes but with the cost being that if he doesnt do as they say he goes back to being powerless. It really does look like instead of a corpo war its soon to be an ai vs human war and V is gonna be right in the middle of it.
i hope "don't fear the reaper" is the canon ending
@@killwill5965 as much as I agree as it is the only ending where V really becomes what they set out to do I really dont think u pretty much perfectly set up V coming back in the next game and not use it.
Like my 1 complant about tower is that it is a bit too close to the start of neuromancer (something I critised mass effect 2 for as well) as I am convinced that myers tried to make damn sure V couldnt be a solo again but I also think mr blue eyes has tech from beyond the blackwall that could save V and put him on a leash just like we see in neuromancer (not really spoilers for that book as this is pretty much all in any symnopsys u will read)
@@le3299ify the next game will involve Mr Blue Eyes for sure. i just don’t like the notion that V sold out to the NUSA/Militech or that Johnny’s engram wasn't given to Alt, which also meant V killing Johnny.
Then again, CDPR wouldn’t have to deal with tying up V’s 6 month mortality problem.
A third option is for the player to decide, like the Nomad/Streetkid/Corpo options, and the ending you choose is V’s backstory that only concretely affects the first ~half-hour of the game
@killwill5965 I think we could see V return as the main character for CP Orion. Seeing as the game is said to be a direct sequel to CP2077, they will have to include V or at least their legacy in Orion anyway. Be it as part of the main story or in background events.
With the exception of Temperance and Least Resistance, all endings leave enough room for a continuation of V's story. Maybe each ending could lead to a different prologue as part of an expanded life path system with all of them culminating into being cured and 'employed' by Mr Blue Eyes.
Since the great AI conspiracy is likely to be a major part of the next game, MBE will play an essential role either way and he has already shown great interest in V.
I'm sure a lot of us would like to see V's story continue and
it would still allow new players to customize their character and life path. In this way, cdpr could cater to both sides.
We also wouldn't have the lore problem of a second new god-tier solo being introduced within the span of like 2 or 3 years in world.
@@JarlRagnaar i also really wanna see V come back. V should be the next Geralt
Freeing Song Bird was my objective.
Say what you will but i cant for the life of me trust Solomon Reed and Rosalind Meyers any more than i can trust Takemura and Hanako Arasaka!! Your theory is 100% valid!
Nah it’s the fact so mi rather die than be myers Guinea pig I was like uh oh this a really bad bad ending myers with blackwall tech nope she was already breaking international rules and laws so yep myers is evil
Stands to reason, especially due to the fact that Millitech clearly took over Night City by 2079. There are heavy patrols throughout the streets and recruitment billboards everywhere. The question then becomes why did NUSA "wake up" V at all? Why not just keep him/her under control? And also, why wouldn't they have just wiped the memories of all interactions with Songbird, Myers, and Reid?
I think there is a a lot more that happened to V while at the FIA. Much more. I hope we find it one day what really happened.
While I'd like this theory to be true, I think the much more likely option is that the ending is just plain poorly written.
Also, the whole "no combat implants" discussion is very stupid considering you can kill Adam Smasher without ever getting anything besides the Kiroshi eyes forced onto you in the prologue. (yes, you are also forced to get hand implants, but you can just take these off later by pressing middle mouse on them)
Finally did phantom liberty last week so now I can watch more videos containing spoilers!
This is why the panam Nomad ending will always be my favorite🙏 we still go out. But it’s around people who love us, a partner who absolutely loves us for us. And if only for however long we have left to live, we have a new chance at life. Even if only for a bit.
If you consider the Relic's job according to the first 1/2 of the game, and the Relics own 'read me' file. The Relic was to tear out part of the brain that govern personality and memory, and replace it with a genetic neutral artificial brain cells to make the new host. But there is a problem the Relic lost integrity when its case was destroyed. By the time V got the thing in her head it would be around 70% integrity. How many chips you know would work at 99%?? none.
So it could be possible the situation caused the coma, due to unknown damage. V was choking out blood.... uhmm why? When the chip was to work on memory and personality, completely different part of the brain. Therefore all this; maybe over thinking the story. Reed may of felt bad because things went south, and feels responsible, for her being in a coma, even though it was not his fault Remember how he felt about Songbird even though she helped in his assassination.
Let’s not forget that with Johnny’s engram being purged from V, there’s suddenly nothing stopping V from going cyberpsycho. The only reason V couldn’t go over was because they had Johnny in their head to split the load and to keep them sane……ish.
With Johnny gone, plus all the cyberware, V would have to take on all of that alone which would likely cause em to snap.
Your theory has a very high probability of being true, definitely sounds like something the NUSA would do, that and I really doubt they’d want their patient to wake up and instantly turn into a killing machine.🤷🏻♂️
Intresting theory NUSA scared of random merch who strong enough to kill Chimera, Dogtown alpha hound, MaxTac operator in 1v4, Adam Smasher and probably all their top rank officer, V is a treath for them he/she doesnt bound to the country only himself
Wait, did anyone actually trust the NUSA at all after everything that happened in the expansion storyline? Everyone was just lying and manipulating you every step of the way.
Taking the oath in that dystopian world is a mistake, no matter the corporation
I didn't trust them from the start and still found myself a little taken aback by just how callous Myers truly is. Her attitude in the Songbird ending when you eavesdrop on her and Reed at the airport should tell everyone all they need to know about that woman, I think.
i feel like the memory wipping part might be not well interpreted. It feels more like removing your concept than removing a memory.
A mice in a maze, sends huge puppet vibes for example. If you haven't got the concept for manipulation or free will, you become manageable, easy to control.
Calling V a sleeper agent isn't so far fetched then.
Solid Theory and one I actually have thought about myself. The other thing I have been pondering is why they purposely separated you from everyone in your life. They had all the opportunity to say something to your friends and family.
Also, This is HEAVY SPOILER..you have been warned
I think Panam is dead. Either she took the Long Nap or something else took her life and thats why Mitch asks you to never contact them again.
But then how did Mitch get V’s message if Panam is dead? When you get a call on the holo, only you are capable of hearing it
Im also 100% sure Panam is dead, there is no way she would listen to V's voice message then asks Mitch to call. She would call herself even if it was for cursing and death threats! Also Mitch's face covered with wounds in the call + looks nervous, pretty sure they ran into a big trouble and got slaughtered. He doesn't tell V as there is nothing he can do especially right after he woke up from coma..
I remember something that I’ve seen somewhere that all the major ending are canon and all happened in a way like the Devil ending happens with takemura and Hanako and she end up dead if V doesn’t intervene and the aldecaldos actually raid arasaka to get themselves back up on their feet but of course they only did that for V but who knows they seemed desperate for good jobs and contracts they might’ve thought hitting them would’ve got them back on their feet and not do the deal with biotechica, aswell since V wasn’t involved they got hit hard and Panam maybe even Saul lost their life….
@@AveChristusRex789 Mitch is a technician he can run her holo but why would he use her holo for a long time, right? Perhaps it happened recently then they ran into some hole without connection to hide. It also explains why Mitch's face covered with wounds.
Imagine if the next game is someone from V's past discovers what was done and somehow uses said AI to restart V's ability to use implants. It would allow you to once again start from level one and would give returning players a reason to be imvested in the story from the start.
The beginning of the book Neuromancer has someone akin to a net runner that finds himself in a similar position trying to get back his ability to interface with the net again…. They could be setting up a similar story for a continuation of V’s story
0:18 Oof, that airship flypast reminded me of an old game called 'Syndicate' from Bullfrog.
maybe better off trusting arasaka to put you in a dead/clone body than trusting nusa haha
Are they worse than Arasaka, really?
@@LPeck1985 In the cyberpunk universe, even if you are a Corpo, you can't trust the Corps. They will twist everything and anything for their benefit without caring about long term repercussions. Nusa is just a branch of Militech at this point and if Arasaka had access to So Mi, they would be doing the same thing as Meyers.
Worse part with the Arasaka deal is even if they put V in a new body, they will alter V's relic conscious to suit their needs before reinstalling. Can't have somebody like V remain a possible menace if they ever decide to do missions against Arasaka in the future.
@@LPeck1985 They arguably are. Arasaka wants to be a corporate superpower, a leader in that area, where as what NUSA is doing would bring a complete and utter annihilation of the entire human race...and the world itself. As bad as corporations are, the NUSA is beyond monstrous.
@@Kristers_K A very apt point. Thanks.
@@Kristers_K they both want world domination and they both breach the blackwall and try to weaponize AI. it's pretty much 50/50 between them
I bet CPR is gonna do a "simulate a save game" to get a ending to better fit the narrative just like they did with the witcher 3 for the CP sequel
Victor seemed troubled as he had seen this kind before, that cyberware was beeing turned off.
Like being instructed, if this sort ever shows up, ignore it as it belongs to the agency.
And if he might lay his hands on it, he could loose everything. Like his whole life and Mistys safety and being tossed to the streets with nothing left.
Vic was scared and stepped back to not intervene whatever V came accross.
Vic was like:
"Whatever crossed your way V, you live, but I don't know what kind of deal you made and I don't want to know and I certainly don't want to be involved"
Fun video, though respectfully, my thoughts: V's story is done and sometimes in fiction the most mundane, bittersweet outcomes just happen, and that's that - there isn't always a gotcha attached in the hopes of getting something more. Don't think a needless over-complication of already pulpy circumstances really makes the ending better. It was good on its own as a sobering goodbye.
Here's a little theory I have. The King of Swords Ending (where V strikes a deal with NUSA and becomes unable to use cyberware) is the canon ending. But it's not really the end for V.
Cyberpunk: Orion will follow V or a new protagonist trying to find out what happened to V during those two years, and with V possibly regaining cyberware usage through a risky procedure. V might be forced to choose between the "quiet life" and the "blaze of glory" once more. Possible revenge story.
I actually expected the PL ending to make V either a winter soldier type character, or something like a robocop. Something like they overwrite V with a diffraction person instead of Johnny, and the final mission is just V going robocop on some 3rd world country. So honestly im quite glad the ending turned out as it did😅 it was way worse in my head
Given the inspirations 2077 pulls from, this wouldn't surprise me. In Neuromancer, Case had his brains and nerves fried by a corp to the point where he could no longer hack. Could see CDPR taking a page out of Gibson's book here
Unlikely. V has shown to be both reliable as an FIA agent (by completing their mission to rescue the president behind enemy lines and capture Songbird) and with great potential in ability in relation to everything else they've done. There's no need to handicap a potential future field agent recruit (Reed even asked if he wanted to teach).
First rule of Night City: Don't trust anyone.
To be honest this ties up the biggest loose end this ending presented: Why the NUSA would ‘waste’ the valuable neural matrix on a mere agent when they’ve shown how they can treat Agents, with V willingly putting themselves in a precarious position by trusting the NUSA with a known “Coma”.
And while the video didn’t touch on it the reasoning for another loose end is Also simple, V could Still be useful as a test subject / ‘winter-soldier’ in the future, all the NUSA and Militech would have to do to reactivate an extremely deadly and important agent was to ‘nab a defenseless, implantless man who they let go once because Militech no longer needed him and they didn’t want to waste resources keeping ‘im on ice when they can just release him temporarily without risk
Damn, this is a very nice video ! And all these stories could make a perfect following for the main story
These are all solid points, but the crazy thing is, a theory like this doesnt even need justification, it already sounds EXACTLY like what corpos would do, and is something they'd have incentive to do. I can just imagine myers standing over the operation as she asks the sugeons "what if we...DONT "fix" his brain completely though...he's a loose end that keeps asking about so mi, he'll come looking, make sure he's powerless."
Johnny is always sussing out all the people that clearly end up not meaning us well, and he has been warning us about her the ENTIRE way throughout the expansion.
I mean seriously, this ending basically boils down to "going under the knife at the hands of corpo controled factions whove made a promise to help you that they have no incentive to honor, and no need to, and nothing stopping them from breaking that promise, infact, there is incentive in them doing that."
What part of that summary sounds like a good idea.
"but v gets to live."
"He gets to live a lie* "
Isnt it ironic? you keep so mi alive and see the fate you're condemning her to, for a "cure", wouldn't it be a bitch of an irony, that in a different way, you end up sharing that fate, and at the hands of the same people both she and johnny has been warning you about? Its exactly like this with arasaka.
I feel like alot of people misunderstand the poetry of that writing. You sell out, you betray not just your friends but yourself, everything you stand for and your reasons for fighting against corpos. You give up all of that and submit to your helplessness in the face of what seems to be inevitable, despite the story showing you constantly that V has a reputation for cheating death, you give up on everything that is set up to not just make you a legend, but everything your friends respect you for, the things jackie had faith in you for, and all the hard work vik has put in to help get you where you are when you were still a nobody rookie who couldnt afford his services, and yet, despite langley's best doctors "saving" you, You call vik to tell him the news about your implants and what does he say? He tells you thats bullshit, and remarks "first time i've seen anything like this." It all sounds painfully specific to V despite all the impossible feats the 2077 universe has displayed, and yet, they cant fix you and get you back to normal? I dont buy it, Victor even goes through 2 or 3 ideas on what he could do and is stumped, meaning, he's probably dealt with similar cases to what was described over the holo, and was able to find a solution, but this ONE time..... he cant?
All signs both figurative and practical, point to "They fucked u, they saw an opportunity to silence a potential threat and took it as they no longer had use for you."
In betraying so mi, just like in any other ending where you betray your friends, you betray yourself, and end up SHARING her fate. now thats real karma, and not the "eye for an eye" type of shit, no, Thats the universe calling you a fucking gonk, you had it all, and gave it up in a moment of weakness because the people you normally despise said "we can fix you" and you think you have nowhere else to turn, but in reality all you had to do, was keep doing what you always do, "Never stop fighting, V" Even So mi echoes that line to you, "you'll keep fighting", these are all the signs that scream "you dont need their cure". And the mr blue eyes ending i'd say is proof of this, because of his vague, cryptic line, funny however it is that the one ending where you and johnny as brothers in arms go to war and fight through arasaka, without bringing anyone else down with you, is the one ending where there is a hint at "gaining more than you could have ever possibly imagined", nevermind a cure, whose to say whats waiting on the other side of that deal isnt the outright perfect W you've been looking for, in whatever shape that may take, figurative or literal, and it wouldnt be a stretch to believe that ther really is a cure AND more waiting on the other side, we've already watched saburo come back to life, hearing you fixed your brain and became the next 1% of powerful people on the planet sounds like chump change in words by comparison, but you dnt ever find out, and cant ever find out, if you give up, and sell out, and i think that is one of, if not the single most important message from cyberpunk's ending, and that message can be soummed up as, in a fun way to word it, "Just fuckin rambo it mate."
Yooooooooooooooo first lol love u Chooms
Hope you're doing amazing choom!
Lmfao how yah chooms doing?
@@LayedBackGamers Hell yea Choomba I'm doing great I feel old because I'm trying to make my great grandmother's 100 year old homemade pickle recipe no one in my family has had them in about twenty years
@@RagingRobotzhell yeah sounds banging choom!
@@JohnnySilverwrench lol I miss my grandmas homemade pickles I've actually never had any pickle as good as hers
I love this ending. Change can be good or bad but it’s okay because it’s inevitable. “Let go and begin again.” Is my favorite quote from Fallout: New Vegas.
Reid gives me Stringer Bell vibes with the way he lies with truths
I was ready to discredit this whole theory UNTIL you brought up the novel. If the novel No Coincidence, has ANYTHING to do with the game (current and sequel) then you could be right about and possibly they have V being like Zor in the novel. Only problem is, he has his memories and they give him the option of a job at Langley... unless while they "operated" on him they had him complete a mission, and then wiped his memory. Idk
Remember, the nuke was not triggered by blackhand himself.
Yep and Blackhand took that personally!
time for V to start taking Animal Juice
thats why my perfect ending is. helping song bird than shooting reed on bridge so he cant be sent after or or manipulate V or her anymore
Makes me think they tortured Johnny before deleting him.
If the Neuromatrix stopped V from using her cybernetics, then what would happen to Songbird if they sent her to the moon to use it? Songbird's body is pretty much cyborg.