The most difficult part of baking sourdough bread has to be getting the proofing just right. Temperature, time and inoculation all have to be in perfect balance to achieve good oven spring and crumb. And it is not easy to find comparisons for different proofing times anywhere on the internet. So please do this experiment. Show us the difference between a bread that has risen 25%, 50%, 75% and 100%. And if you can find the time, include underproofed and overproofed breads as well. This would be so helpful. Thank you.
such comparison would be probably useful for those that can have complete control over those conditions, but in the real life and in a kitchen, not in an industrial complex, our sourdough starter has not the same strength every time, particularly if we store in the fridge and we use and refresh it some times often and other less often, also our kitchen's and the water temperature are not constant trough the year, it is almost impossible to create the conditions for a perfect repeatability like it can happen in a factory that produces bread, where such tests are very important. to get the proofing just right at home is more something related to develop a feeling for it, related to our experience, not thermometers and precise scales and timers, scales are important for the percentage of the ingredients and to get the wanted hydration, but experience is what gives us good results and let us not have under or over proofed loafs. the other geek tests, at least most of them are very useful for us, like the one that compared different ways to do the folds, that gave results that surprised both the author and myself, but it is impossible to get always the same proofing conditions, and any way half an hour earlier or later makes not that big difference, so for it a test imho is not so useful, as gives results that in practice can not be replicated exactly, so utilized. and there is no need of a test to know what happens if a dough is under or over proofed, we already know it.
I have been baking damn good organic sourdough for 20 years. Foodgeek helped me get better. The two things that helped me from his videos: 1. This pre-shape recommendation. I always ignored (just lazy I guess) this common step, but FG’s video inspired me to try. It really helped with my oven spring. 2. I now bulk ferment for less time. FG’s 25-30% volume increase rule of thumb was a game changer. Previously, I was going for 2x volume increase before shaping. By the time I got the bread in the oven there was not much gas left in the tank. I really appreciate the concise, clear instructions and especially the experiments. FG is my fave bread nerd RUclipsr, and I’ve watched ALL of them.
I have been making your bread recipe since Covid started and It's been an incredible journey.. We don't have a bakery in town that makes anything more interesting than bland crappy white bread and my husband LOVES bread. But last night I made your pizza and pizza sauce and oh man, It was soooo delicious I was speechless. I've made homemade pizza for years but it was never sourdough good. Thanks for all you do.
Wow, quite a big difference, was hoping the difference between the pre-shaping and final-shaping wouldn't be so obvious. I am definitely still struggling with the pre-shaping without flour and just using my hands and a scraper. Thanks again for all your experimenting, learning heaps! Guess I have to keep practising with that wet dough!
If you think about it, sourdough bread was originally the regular everyday bread that regular people made. So it makes sense that it should be pretty fool-proof.
Love these experiments. If you're looking for ideas, I'd personally love to see testing proofing for various amounts of time before and after retarding in the fridge; baking cold vs letting come to room temperature out of fridge, etc.
Sune, I had never, ever in my life baked sourdough but recently built a commercial kombucha kitchen on my farm and wanted to try. I tried several times, with various tutorials with no luck. After stumbling on your videos and following you to the letter I now bake incredibly delicious and beautiful looking loaves. Thank you for your awesome work! Love your great experiments, your style and your Tele’s!!
This video TOTALLY took my baking to the next level. I have been struggling getting a good oven spring. I did exactly what you showed and, wait for it, got the same result. Thanks So Much for sharing the knowledge and wisdom.
Thanks, good video. I use a Clay Cooker now, not soaked in water, but preheated to 430 F, then I throw the shaped bread in and put the lid on, this gives amazing results. Keep it up!
Sune, I just started making sourdough bread b/c of Covid & not working. Thank you for all of your videos! I always learn something new from each and everyone of them. The production of your videos are excellent! LOVE your backdrop with guitars! My loafs have been turning out beautiful in just a few short weeks of learning from your many videos! THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH!
Fascinating! The difference in oven spring really is remarkable. I’ve wondered whether the double shaping is really necessary, especially when I’ve timed my baking poorly and I’m shaping late at night and would like to go to bed.
I’ve been following your methods always with great success...IMO you have one of the most interesting and explanatory channels I’ve found...I appreciate your use of experimentation with a control. This particular experiment answered a nagging question for me though I reasoned why before your explanation. Thanks for taking the time to do these videos. It’s always better to understand WHY a certain procedure or technique is used rather than just blindly following instructions. First rate!
Wow - seriously useful video. I've only been doing a final shape and have always been frustrated with my oven spring. I'm definitely going to try pre-shaping...
I really like your experiments with the sourdough. So educational, thanks to you I get to understand this dough much better. Thank you for putting so much time and effort in it.
So great to have these comparisons. Thanks for your excellent videos....they've been a huge game changer to improve my sourdough bread outcomes...all delicious
Literally just did this experiment myself and saw the same behavior. Thanks for sharing these experiments. It puts to rest so many questions. Great work!
Sune, really good experimentation video today. It was especially helpful to see the time-lapse oven spring while baking, as you can see the effects of the shaping as the bread expanded up rather than out. I'd like to see you do an experiment showing the effects of higher and lower gluten levels ranging from 10% to 15% protein flours or with vital wheat gluten supplements.
Thanks for all the information you have been distilling in a very clear way! May I suggest some experiment on inclusions? Different grains? Toppings? Often the conclusions are the breads end up tasting quite similar while the aesthetic is different. Variation on the ingredients is an endless field to geek out :) Long live your channel!
Would love to see you experiment with different amounts of sugar added to your dough. I hypothesize a variation in bulk timing, carmelization, and taste.
Fascinating! I would love to see an experiment regarding baking in a preheated dutch oven and oven, a cold dutch oven but preheated oven, and a cold dutch oven and oven!
I forgot to pull my starter out of the fridge and feed it in advance, so now I'm watching people make bread because I can't 🤣 I always love these experimental videos!!!
I’m so happy I stumbled upon your channel! I started my sourdough journey in March (thank you Covid-19) and I did a whole lot of failed experiments after watching so many different videos and techniques. But your videos do it for me! 😂
Zune, every time you lift a piece of bread to do the smell & taste test, I breathe in as it goes off screen and my taste buds tingle as they get ready to taste it! Every single time, like a Pavlov’s dogs experiment 😋 Then I get so disappointed when there is no smell or taste. 😢
hey sune, thanks for all your content. would you consider making a sourdough rolls recipe!? my bread baking is fine, but i struggle with rolls... anyway, learned already so much from you, big thanks!!!
I'm a lazy sourdough baker, so I skip all but the roughest shaping and bake directly after fermentation. I would expect that my bread would be a bit prettier after more shaping, but I'm OK with chonky bread. :)
My friend, what you do is absolutely stunning. An art form, really. I've learned a lot from your experiments! Thank you so much!!! One doubt that I still have though: do the dimensions of the proofing basket affect oven spring or overall final result in the oven? I live in Brazil and it's god damn hard to find a banneton here, so I use a basket that looks a little too much larger than the bannetons I see in your videos. I'm trying to cut off variables to my failed oven spring attempts and that one is, unfortunately, impossible for me to check. But I feel if the proofing basket gives me a wider, more spread dough than one that keeps it "taller", more "oval" shape, it kind of messed with surface tension a bit. Anyway, thanks for what you're doing! Amazing!
You should use a proofing basket that has about the shape you'd like your final bread to be in, so if you proof a small dough in a huge proofing basket, it'll probably be pretty flat :)
If you don't bake too much, I'd suggest trying to find a multi-purpose bowl that has about the same shape that you want. That way you won't have a kitchen utensil that will most of the time only be occupying space :P Mas eu sinto sua dor, também gostaria que fosse mais fácil achar essas coisas aqui!
Hello @Foodgeek from Sydney, Australia. I've watched countless clips on baking sourdough bread since beginning my own journey around a year ago. But I keep coming back to yours. Very impressive. Thank you. I'm curious about the bench top surface you work on when you're doing your pre-shape and shaping. What is the surface please?
I found that the scoring showed up better with a pre-shape and shaping! Of course, it was by accident- oops, I forgot to do a final shaping. But, yes, better oven spring with the pre and final shaping. Also, I experimented with the stitching and no stiching- slight difference. Thank you for taking the time to do this video- very appreciative of it.
Yes I saw you said slight difference, but how were they different? Did stitching result in a more open crumb or did it just introduce large air pockets?
@@mct92 I tried it again this morning, the stitching one had a lower profile than the non-stiched one. I weighed them both to be exactly the same weight. The stiched one was flatter- go figure!
I notice sometimes you let the bulk fermentation of the dough let the dough grow by up to 50%, yet in this video you do a mere 25% growth. Is this due to the hydration of this dough being slightly higher than the usual 70% mark? Or is there some other baker’s secret?
Final shaping is where I run into trouble sometimes. I've had bread with a seam in the middle and breads where parts were denser than others. I've yet to have every bread come out the same. It's exciting, fortunatly.
Thank you for another great video.. Thanks to you I recently tried bread flour, and I can appreciate why it's recommended.. Until recently I used normal multigrain flour or all purpose flour and could never get the window pane level of gluten development.thank you for that.. Next in line buying a Dutch oven 😀
I recently made dough, after autolyse I did stretch and folds over 6 hours, put it in the fridge after ~8h (dough did not show any significant rise during this time) and took it out 12h later. Dough rose quite a bit but, not only was the gluten structure completely destroyed (dough ripped apart), also it was like impossible to move it to the dutch oven without having it totally collapse thus baking into a brick. Fortunately I let it rise for some hours more (which it did) and it became a good bread then.
Can you please do an experiment with varying amounts of spelt including 100%? I've been struggling getting good oven spring with 100 % spelt, would be interesting to see you do a video about it.
Sune thanks for the videos. They are everything about sourdough a beginner needs. I have one problem, i still dont have a basket for proofing and i had a few failed attempts where the dough (77% hydration) got stuck in the glass bowl. The other time i put a cotton towel in it with flour it didnt work either. I again did it with lining the glass bowl with olive oil. Worked better. Yesterday i tried Plastic colander with (linen+viscose cloth) sprayed with water and sprinkled with my homemade rice flour. This last attempt was the best to take the dough out of the second fermentation bowl. I have three questions because i am a bit of a Foodgeek and want to know why things happen!! 1) All the above attempts resulted in almost pancakes (still ate the bread!). Is it because the dough got stuck and when pouring it in my tray the structure was already gone? 2) Can I at that stage reshape it and put it in the oven? 3) How problematic is cooking a 77% dough on a flat tray? Thank you and I look forward to your inputs. Keep it up!
Please explain why you dust flour before baking? I do the exact opposite by brushing off excess flour since I don't want to eat flour. What am I missing ?
Thank you for your videos! I bake for a community of Buddhist monks and yesterday followed your basic sourdough recipe. For reasons of economy I had to put 16 loaves in one of our commercial ovens at the same time. Obviously they didn't spring as high as they might have done, and they did take over an hour with the gas on full, but they were pretty good! I wonder what the relationship between the weight of cold dough and maximum oven temperature is? Ie; how many loaves can you bake at a time before the baking time slows down and results start tailing off? Perhaps it would be more economical to bake 8 at a time?
Hi Sune, I was hoping in this experiment to see an unshaped loaf, which is proofed at room temperature instead of the fridge. Whenever I proof at room temperature, my dough spreads flat quickly after it comes out of the banneton. Fridge-proofed dough seems to be firmer and holds shape a bit better. I can't tell if my issue is the banneton is too big or my shaping is not good enough.
Love the experiments! The issue that drives me crazy is the type of water. I use tap just fine and others demand bottled, leave it on the counter overnite, only bottled spring water, etc etc etc. How about an experiment about type of water?
Yup - I'd gladly eat any of those loaves. It appears that given 0, 1 and 2 shapings each loaf rose a bit more with the increased number. As the shaping steps require minimum time I'll continue with the 2 shaping process. Thanks.
honestly I get amazing crust and oven spring by skipping just about every step. 20min autolyse, knead, one round of stretch & fold, bulk rise at room temp for 10 hours. slap the blob of dough in the oven, done. no shaping, no fridge proofing, I'm sure I can skip the autolyse and the difference between 1 and 0 rounds of stretch & fold is probably next to none. the real key is to have a good starter.
I love watching your channel! Can we do a water test? What is it like to make sourdough with water in the oven with no dutch oven, using a dutch oven with no water in the oven, then no dutch oven and no water? Thanks!
MY MAN! I love your channel, long time subscriber here BUT I have something you need to hear. I read your video titles and skip to the end for the answer and then rewind to grab the info if I feel I need it. This is NOT meant to be an insult in any way. Just popping in to say it might be worth a look into doing the design of the videos a little differently? Like the reveal of the info in steps maybe, I'm not sure. As a newbie to sourdough still it would be cool to see some flavor profiles into the breads. I know this content is so overplayed now but maybe expand into different genres of food? You are the FOODGEEK! Not the Sourdough Geek! This is just my opinion and not trying to be a pooper but the channel, as informative as it is could be killer. Just wanna see you succeed man. All the best. Cheers!
Brilliant test! Nothing super surprising in here, but very clear results, which is nice to know. Side note, what is that Tele with the dark pickguard? Got a mad looking neck on it!
I’ve been trying to be more gentle in the shaping by doing simple stretch and fold fro pre and final shape. Guess I should stretch out and roll for final and not be so concerned with keeping the gas intact.
Food geek yes it is important to shape the sourdough bread or bread in general for the gluten in the flour to relaxe the dough and top crust all of the steps that you have done in this video is all important but the number one important thing I think is the flour it self what do you think
Interesting,in the end it is better to shape, but the unshaped bread still looks really good so in my opinion not shaping is also fine. Especially if you have a troublesome dough that's giving you an extra hard time shaping it
Hi Sune, thank you for the video. As always, that was a great experiment! I wanted to ask you something that is not very clear to me. I have seen that sometimes you add the starter immediately with the other ingredients ajd sometimes you wait after the autolyse. Why is that? What kind of difference does it make to the bread? I usually follow your recipe for wholewheat bread and I remember you add the starter after. Is it just because its wholewheat flour? I was thinking maybe it needsorwntime to autolyse without the starter? Or maybe you have another reason 🤔 thank you if you can answer!
Hi Sune, I have a question. What was the third loaf doing while the other two were baking? Was it in the fridge waiting or did it come to room temperature on the counter?
@@ronbar9793 I think keeping them in the fridge longer would have a negligible effect, but taking them all out at the same time would mean the last one had been warming up for an hour and a half before going in the oven. That would cause more fermentation and more proofing, which would contribute to a better oven spring. So I hope they've been staying in the fridge until ready to bake.
Hey Sune, I saw a couple bakers on Instagram final-shape batards by just taking the rested pre-shape boule, turning it sticky-side up and folding it in half, then putting it into the banneton and stitching. Would you be interested in testing this method?
Thank you so much for all your videos and for sharing your experiences, Sune. I have a question about the clear bulk containers used for the ferment. It sounds/looks like you snap them fully closed, and I did not see them included in your links for equipment. Are they airtight? I thought the dough needed to be lightly covered during fermentation, but appreciate your advice! Whatever those containers are, they look convenient. Thanks again.
Quick question, I know you cold proof - I do as well. Does the shaped and proofed bread sit at room temperature before being baked, and if so, how long, or does it go directly from the fridge to the hot oven? Thanks.
I always appreciate your experiment videos! did you take into account the extra time each subsequent loaf would have proved? potentially 45 mins to an hour each? might also affect the outcomes? pre-shaping and shaping does make sense though.
The most difficult part of baking sourdough bread has to be getting the proofing just right. Temperature, time and inoculation all have to be in perfect balance to achieve good oven spring and crumb. And it is not easy to find comparisons for different proofing times anywhere on the internet. So please do this experiment. Show us the difference between a bread that has risen 25%, 50%, 75% and 100%. And if you can find the time, include underproofed and overproofed breads as well. This would be so helpful. Thank you.
I would like to see that too I usually overproof the bread since I'm not doing it in the fridge and then there's almost no oven spring at all.
would assume something as complex as you request would be at one of the patreon levels
yes please :)
such comparison would be probably useful for those that can have complete control over those conditions, but in the real life and in a kitchen, not in an industrial complex, our sourdough starter has not the same strength every time, particularly if we store in the fridge and we use and refresh it some times often and other less often, also our kitchen's and the water temperature are not constant trough the year, it is almost impossible to create the conditions for a perfect repeatability like it can happen in a factory that produces bread, where such tests are very important.
to get the proofing just right at home is more something related to develop a feeling for it, related to our experience, not thermometers and precise scales and timers, scales are important for the percentage of the ingredients and to get the wanted hydration, but experience is what gives us good results and let us not have under or over proofed loafs.
the other geek tests, at least most of them are very useful for us, like the one that compared different ways to do the folds, that gave results that surprised both the author and myself, but it is impossible to get always the same proofing conditions, and any way half an hour earlier or later makes not that big difference, so for it a test imho is not so useful, as gives results that in practice can not be replicated exactly, so utilized.
and there is no need of a test to know what happens if a dough is under or over proofed, we already know it.
@@toodie535 Maybe think of it more like an idea for video not a request.
BROVN vs Dutch oven vs water in bottom sheet vs no vapor at all would be an interesting comparison 😉
And a watersyringe
@foodgeek I second this experiment! Thanks sune! Love your stuff man, keep it up
What is a BROVN?
@@mascarponezitrone fdgk.net/buy-brovn
Foodgeek Thanks a lot!! But it seems a little expensive, don’t you think?
I have been baking damn good organic sourdough for 20 years. Foodgeek helped me get better. The two things that helped me from his videos:
1. This pre-shape recommendation. I always ignored (just lazy I guess) this common step, but FG’s video inspired me to try. It really helped with my oven spring.
2. I now bulk ferment for less time. FG’s 25-30% volume increase rule of thumb was a game changer. Previously, I was going for 2x volume increase before shaping. By the time I got the bread in the oven there was not much gas left in the tank.
I really appreciate the concise, clear instructions and especially the experiments. FG is my fave bread nerd RUclipsr, and I’ve watched ALL of them.
Could you do an episode where you summarize your findings, what factor is important and which is not?
Literally just watch this video from 10:40, results are all there
I have been making your bread recipe since Covid started and It's been an incredible journey.. We don't have a bakery in town that makes anything more interesting than bland crappy white bread and my husband LOVES bread. But last night I made your pizza and pizza sauce and oh man, It was soooo delicious I was speechless. I've made homemade pizza for years but it was never sourdough good. Thanks for all you do.
hear, hear. I'm happy to see he's opened a Patreon account--so we can, if modestly, support his efforts
Wow, quite a big difference, was hoping the difference between the pre-shaping and final-shaping wouldn't be so obvious. I am definitely still struggling with the pre-shaping without flour and just using my hands and a scraper.
Thanks again for all your experimenting, learning heaps!
Guess I have to keep practising with that wet dough!
Sune, you are such great asset to novices in breadmaking, like me! Thanks a lot! And your unassuming manner of presentation is very appealing.
I’m beginning to believe that you could just shovel your unmixed ingredients into a cold oven and out would spring a beautiful loaf!
Sune hasn't made a single beautiful loaf. If you want loaves like he generally makes then you can do almost anything you fancy.
@@maxbooth179, thanks for sharing your opinion. It will now be disregard.
@@maxbooth179 How is it possible to be so confidently incorrect
If you think about it, sourdough bread was originally the regular everyday bread that regular people made. So it makes sense that it should be pretty fool-proof.
I love your experiment vids. Can you do one about the difference between making a levain and just using the same amount of starter?
Love these experiments. If you're looking for ideas, I'd personally love to see testing proofing for various amounts of time before and after retarding in the fridge; baking cold vs letting come to room temperature out of fridge, etc.
Sune, I had never, ever in my life baked sourdough but recently built a commercial kombucha kitchen on my farm and wanted to try. I tried several times, with various tutorials with no luck. After stumbling on your videos and following you to the letter I now bake incredibly delicious and beautiful looking loaves. Thank you for your awesome work! Love your great experiments, your style and your Tele’s!!
This video TOTALLY took my baking to the next level. I have been struggling getting a good oven spring. I did exactly what you showed and, wait for it, got the same result. Thanks So Much for sharing the knowledge and wisdom.
Thanks, good video. I use a Clay Cooker now, not soaked in water, but preheated to 430 F, then I throw the shaped bread in and put the lid on, this gives amazing results. Keep it up!
Sune, I just started making sourdough bread b/c of Covid & not working. Thank you for all of your videos! I always learn something new from each and everyone of them. The production of your videos are excellent! LOVE your backdrop with guitars! My loafs have been turning out beautiful in just a few short weeks of learning from your many videos! THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH!
Brilliant experiment. Definitely learned why two shapings is better than one. Thanks!
Fascinating! The difference in oven spring really is remarkable. I’ve wondered whether the double shaping is really necessary, especially when I’ve timed my baking poorly and I’m shaping late at night and would like to go to bed.
I’ve been following your methods always with great success...IMO you have one of the most interesting and explanatory channels I’ve found...I appreciate your use of experimentation with a control. This particular experiment answered a nagging question for me though I reasoned why before your explanation. Thanks for taking the time to do these videos. It’s always better to understand WHY a certain procedure or technique is used rather than just blindly following instructions. First rate!
Wow - seriously useful video. I've only been doing a final shape and have always been frustrated with my oven spring. I'm definitely going to try pre-shaping...
The principles of experiment design... Nice!
I really like your experiments with the sourdough. So educational, thanks to you I get to understand this dough much better. Thank you for putting so much time and effort in it.
So great to have these comparisons. Thanks for your excellent videos....they've been a huge game changer to improve my sourdough bread outcomes...all delicious
Great video! Always informative.
Literally just did this experiment myself and saw the same behavior. Thanks for sharing these experiments. It puts to rest so many questions. Great work!
Sune, really good experimentation video today. It was especially helpful to see the time-lapse oven spring while baking, as you can see the effects of the shaping as the bread expanded up rather than out. I'd like to see you do an experiment showing the effects of higher and lower gluten levels ranging from 10% to 15% protein flours or with vital wheat gluten supplements.
Thanks for all the information you have been distilling in a very clear way! May I suggest some experiment on inclusions? Different grains? Toppings? Often the conclusions are the breads end up tasting quite similar while the aesthetic is different. Variation on the ingredients is an endless field to geek out :) Long live your channel!
Would love to see you experiment with different amounts of sugar added to your dough. I hypothesize a variation in bulk timing, carmelization, and taste.
I love it when I already know the answers before watching the video.
Who could imagine!! Thank you!!
Fascinating! I would love to see an experiment regarding baking in a preheated dutch oven and oven, a cold dutch oven but preheated oven, and a cold dutch oven and oven!
He did that already.
@@plowe7981 Ah thanks! I didn't find that but I'll go look again!
I forgot to pull my starter out of the fridge and feed it in advance, so now I'm watching people make bread because I can't 🤣 I always love these experimental videos!!!
Or bake? ruclips.net/video/yJGMdXLn3fc/видео.html 😁
I'll be doing the two step preshaping and shaping process from now on. Thanks Sune! Great video, as usual. Cheers from Canada!
So exciting to watch - better than a thriller on TV. Am I a geek also??
Love the guitar wall!
I’m so happy I stumbled upon your channel! I started my sourdough journey in March (thank you Covid-19) and I did a whole lot of failed experiments after watching so many different videos and techniques. But your videos do it for me! 😂
I am learning so much from seeing your experiments with sour dough -- tusind tak!
Zune, every time you lift a piece of bread to do the smell & taste test, I breathe in as it goes off screen and my taste buds tingle as they get ready to taste it! Every single time, like a Pavlov’s dogs experiment 😋 Then I get so disappointed when there is no smell or taste. 😢
Excellent video. You exactly answered a question I had this week. Thank you.
hey sune, thanks for all your content.
would you consider making a sourdough rolls recipe!? my bread baking is fine, but i struggle with rolls... anyway, learned already so much from you, big thanks!!!
I'm a lazy sourdough baker, so I skip all but the roughest shaping and bake directly after fermentation. I would expect that my bread would be a bit prettier after more shaping, but I'm OK with chonky bread. :)
HOLY SMOKES. That's what's been wrong with my bread. The stupid shaping.
Thank you for this video!
Sune you are so generous with your information, we're truly lucky 🍀
I learn so much from you like every time! A lot of thanks and a big kiss from Belgium.
not surprised by the results
Awesome video! Thank you!
this was mind blowing. i learned alot
I think this is a very useful experiment. Thank you Sune.
Very useful, thanks!
My friend, what you do is absolutely stunning. An art form, really. I've learned a lot from your experiments! Thank you so much!!!
One doubt that I still have though: do the dimensions of the proofing basket affect oven spring or overall final result in the oven?
I live in Brazil and it's god damn hard to find a banneton here, so I use a basket that looks a little too much larger than the bannetons I see in your videos. I'm trying to cut off variables to my failed oven spring attempts and that one is, unfortunately, impossible for me to check. But I feel if the proofing basket gives me a wider, more spread dough than one that keeps it "taller", more "oval" shape, it kind of messed with surface tension a bit.
Anyway, thanks for what you're doing! Amazing!
You should use a proofing basket that has about the shape you'd like your final bread to be in, so if you proof a small dough in a huge proofing basket, it'll probably be pretty flat :)
If you don't bake too much, I'd suggest trying to find a multi-purpose bowl that has about the same shape that you want. That way you won't have a kitchen utensil that will most of the time only be occupying space :P
Mas eu sinto sua dor, também gostaria que fosse mais fácil achar essas coisas aqui!
Hello @Foodgeek from Sydney, Australia. I've watched countless clips on baking sourdough bread since beginning my own journey around a year ago. But I keep coming back to yours. Very impressive. Thank you. I'm curious about the bench top surface you work on when you're doing your pre-shape and shaping. What is the surface please?
I so appreciate you doing these tests!
I found that the scoring showed up better with a pre-shape and shaping! Of course, it was by accident- oops, I forgot to do a final shaping. But, yes, better oven spring with the pre and final shaping. Also, I experimented with the stitching and no stiching- slight difference. Thank you for taking the time to do this video- very appreciative of it.
What did you find in your stitching experiment?
Slight difference!
Yes I saw you said slight difference, but how were they different? Did stitching result in a more open crumb or did it just introduce large air pockets?
@@mct92 I tried it again this morning, the stitching one had a lower profile than the non-stiched one. I weighed them both to be exactly the same weight. The stiched one was flatter- go figure!
Do a video where you use a standard dough and see how it changes over periods of ferment time!
I notice sometimes you let the bulk fermentation of the dough let the dough grow by up to 50%, yet in this video you do a mere 25% growth. Is this due to the hydration of this dough being slightly higher than the usual 70% mark? Or is there some other baker’s secret?
It's amazing how bread is literally flower and water, but it's still such a complex process to get it right.
Final shaping is where I run into trouble sometimes. I've had bread with a seam in the middle and breads where parts were denser than others. I've yet to have every bread come out the same. It's exciting, fortunatly.
Good learning session
Interesting experiment. Very inspiring channel. I'm going to make a starter.
Fantastic experiment! You are the best!
Thank you for another great video.. Thanks to you I recently tried bread flour, and I can appreciate why it's recommended.. Until recently I used normal multigrain flour or all purpose flour and could never get the window pane level of gluten development.thank you for that.. Next in line buying a Dutch oven 😀
I recently made dough, after autolyse I did stretch and folds over 6 hours, put it in the fridge after ~8h (dough did not show any significant rise during this time) and took it out 12h later. Dough rose quite a bit but, not only was the gluten structure completely destroyed (dough ripped apart), also it was like impossible to move it to the dutch oven without having it totally collapse thus baking into a brick.
Fortunately I let it rise for some hours more (which it did) and it became a good bread then.
Can you please do an experiment with varying amounts of spelt including 100%? I've been struggling getting good oven spring with 100 % spelt, would be interesting to see you do a video about it.
I definitely learned something today. 😁
Sune thanks for the videos. They are everything about sourdough a beginner needs.
I have one problem, i still dont have a basket for proofing and i had a few failed attempts where the dough (77% hydration) got stuck in the glass bowl. The other time i put a cotton towel in it with flour it didnt work either. I again did it with lining the glass bowl with olive oil. Worked better.
Yesterday i tried Plastic colander with (linen+viscose cloth) sprayed with water and sprinkled with my homemade rice flour. This last attempt was the best to take the dough out of the second fermentation bowl. I have three questions because i am a bit of a Foodgeek and want to know why things happen!!
1) All the above attempts resulted in almost pancakes (still ate the bread!). Is it because the dough got stuck and when pouring it in my tray the structure was already gone?
2) Can I at that stage reshape it and put it in the oven?
3) How problematic is cooking a 77% dough on a flat tray?
Thank you and I look forward to your inputs.
Keep it up!
Hi Sune did you have the chance to see my comment above? Any guidance will be appreciated.
Different autolyse times would be good to compare, like 2 - 4 - 12 - 24h autolyse. Keep up the unique work!
Please explain why you dust flour before baking? I do the exact opposite by brushing off excess flour since I don't want to eat flour. What am I missing ?
Thank you for your videos! I bake for a community of Buddhist monks and yesterday followed your basic sourdough recipe. For reasons of economy I had to put 16 loaves in one of our commercial ovens at the same time. Obviously they didn't spring as high as they might have done, and they did take over an hour with the gas on full, but they were pretty good! I wonder what the relationship between the weight of cold dough and maximum oven temperature is? Ie; how many loaves can you bake at a time before the baking time slows down and results start tailing off? Perhaps it would be more economical to bake 8 at a time?
Could you compare the glass dome to a dutch oven? Which one makes better bread? Thank you so much. I love your experiments.
I have an experiment coming 😊
Thank you! 🤗
Hi Sune, I was hoping in this experiment to see an unshaped loaf, which is proofed at room temperature instead of the fridge. Whenever I proof at room temperature, my dough spreads flat quickly after it comes out of the banneton. Fridge-proofed dough seems to be firmer and holds shape a bit better. I can't tell if my issue is the banneton is too big or my shaping is not good enough.
Thank you 🥖👍
Can you play us your guitar one day? :) thank you for teaching us how to bake delicious breads.
Love the experiments! The issue that drives me crazy is the type of water. I use tap just fine and others demand bottled, leave it on the counter overnite, only bottled spring water, etc etc etc. How about an experiment about type of water?
Yup - I'd gladly eat any of those loaves. It appears that given 0, 1 and 2 shapings each loaf rose a bit more with the increased number. As the shaping steps require minimum time I'll continue with the 2 shaping process. Thanks.
Thanks Sune. You should offer flour for sale on your store.
honestly I get amazing crust and oven spring by skipping just about every step. 20min autolyse, knead, one round of stretch & fold, bulk rise at room temp for 10 hours. slap the blob of dough in the oven, done. no shaping, no fridge proofing, I'm sure I can skip the autolyse and the difference between 1 and 0 rounds of stretch & fold is probably next to none. the real key is to have a good starter.
I love watching your channel! Can we do a water test? What is it like to make sourdough with water in the oven with no dutch oven, using a dutch oven with no water in the oven, then no dutch oven and no water?
Thanks!
Well done Sir!
This video answered my ultimate question. I never understand why I have to shape it twice when I am making a boule.
Glad to know that it doesn't affect flavor at all.
What about a 2nd or 3rd pre-shape? Would it have been even a greater oven spring?
MY MAN! I love your channel, long time subscriber here BUT I have something you need to hear. I read your video titles and skip to the end for the answer and then rewind to grab the info if I feel I need it. This is NOT meant to be an insult in any way. Just popping in to say it might be worth a look into doing the design of the videos a little differently? Like the reveal of the info in steps maybe, I'm not sure.
As a newbie to sourdough still it would be cool to see some flavor profiles into the breads. I know this content is so overplayed now but maybe expand into different genres of food? You are the FOODGEEK! Not the Sourdough Geek! This is just my opinion and not trying to be a pooper but the channel, as informative as it is could be killer. Just wanna see you succeed man. All the best. Cheers!
Brilliant test! Nothing super surprising in here, but very clear results, which is nice to know.
Side note, what is that Tele with the dark pickguard? Got a mad looking neck on it!
I’ve been trying to be more gentle in the shaping by doing simple stretch and fold fro pre and final shape. Guess I should stretch out and roll for final and not be so concerned with keeping the gas intact.
Food geek yes it is important to shape the sourdough bread or bread in general for the gluten in the flour to relaxe the dough and top crust all of the steps that you have done in this video is all important but the number one important thing I think is the flour it self what do you think
Great video! Also the best background ever!!!
Welp, now I know what's keeping my loaves less than round. Thanks Sune!
Hi Sune! Great channel.
I have a question: What temperature is your fridge? The loafs seems to have fermented a significant amount in those 8 hours.
Interesting,in the end it is better to shape, but the unshaped bread still looks really good so in my opinion not shaping is also fine. Especially if you have a troublesome dough that's giving you an extra hard time shaping it
Hi Sune, thank you for the video. As always, that was a great experiment! I wanted to ask you something that is not very clear to me. I have seen that sometimes you add the starter immediately with the other ingredients ajd sometimes you wait after the autolyse. Why is that? What kind of difference does it make to the bread? I usually follow your recipe for wholewheat bread and I remember you add the starter after. Is it just because its wholewheat flour? I was thinking maybe it needsorwntime to autolyse without the starter? Or maybe you have another reason 🤔 thank you if you can answer!
+1 for an experiment that compares typical autolyse (1+ hours?) with no autolyse as you did in this experiment.
Hi Sune, I have a question. What was the third loaf doing while the other two were baking? Was it in the fridge waiting or did it come to room temperature on the counter?
I think they've been put in the oven right after getting them out of the fridge one by one
Very good question. Maybe the difference is because the bread was in the fridge for a while longer than the other two ... It's worth testing.
@@ronbar9793 I think keeping them in the fridge longer would have a negligible effect, but taking them all out at the same time would mean the last one had been warming up for an hour and a half before going in the oven. That would cause more fermentation and more proofing, which would contribute to a better oven spring. So I hope they've been staying in the fridge until ready to bake.
@@lukerichards22 "which would contribute to a better oven spring" that's debatable to say the least
@@sereya666 not really.
Hey Sune, I saw a couple bakers on Instagram final-shape batards by just taking the rested pre-shape boule, turning it sticky-side up and folding it in half, then putting it into the banneton and stitching. Would you be interested in testing this method?
I do only something like preshaping :)
I had a horror movie on when I made my bread. Not good. I'm sure the nice music is the magic. Nice video.
So basically I can just toss it in the banetton and it'll still be bread, or perhaps do a final shaping just for the heck of it, right?
Absolutely 😊
Do different Times of using the starter after feeding
Tank’s for videos. What kind of floor do you use for the shaping process? Is it rice floor ? Tank’s
Would the fact that the last dough (twice shaped) fermented for two more hours interfered in the growth too?
Interesting video, as usual, but isn’t it time to clean the glass pane in the oven’s door?
Thank you so much for all your videos and for sharing your experiences, Sune. I have a question about the clear bulk containers used for the ferment. It sounds/looks like you snap them fully closed, and I did not see them included in your links for equipment. Are they airtight? I thought the dough needed to be lightly covered during fermentation, but appreciate your advice! Whatever those containers are, they look convenient. Thanks again.
Quick question, I know you cold proof - I do as well. Does the shaped and proofed bread sit at room temperature before being baked, and if so, how long, or does it go directly from the fridge to the hot oven? Thanks.
the dough goes straight from the fridge into a hot(550 degree if you can) oven
I always appreciate your experiment videos! did you take into account the extra time each subsequent loaf would have proved? potentially 45 mins to an hour each? might also affect the outcomes? pre-shaping and shaping does make sense though.
So you made high hidration dough, can you now make like low hidration, stiff dough and compare those?