@dolofonos I mean, it doesn't seem like there's much dynamic control, so what can you use them for except for this kind of stuff? They're kind of limited. I mean, I enjoy it, and it's a shame they're not really used in recordings of this kind of thing, but I can see why they're not that popular.
@@klop4228 There is actually a lot of dynamic control, the reason why it is not very used anymore is because modern piano is less susceptible to break and is louder
@@klop4228 Ah. Well, indeed there is no control on that A lot of musical pieces use this, more than you would think I don't know why modern piano lost this, but it is like all the other stops and pedals: like bassoon, swell, buff, lute, cembalo, moderator, double moderator, etc Modern piano lost those
Why do there not seem to be any commercial recordings of the Rondo Alla Turca on janissary pianos? Why don't the craziest purists make pilgrimages to such pianos the way they do to other fortepianos?
Stuart Simon People hear Alla Turca and just have Mozart in mind. But there are so many other treasures in the Alla Turca style. We have a lot of them in our program. In fact it is our ensembles job to discover them. If we would have a company interested in that, we could give you Janissary Job around the clock! Best regards from Istanbul, the Alla Turca Kollektif
Many ornaments seem forced and artificial rather than a spontaneous flash of creativity... Even the ingenious idea of playing it on a fortepiano with janissary stop can't make up for it.
I am inclined to agree somewhat. While the presence of them is nice in the first place, they don't say very much in themselves. And the ones which are complete paraphrases over the same harmony were, as far as I'm aware, not standard practice. Don't quote me on that, because I honestly don't know for sure. I should say, a good number of them are rather nice and fitting.
This piece is a favorite of mine and Manuela Giardana's version here on the Janissary is my favorite version of all. I love the thoughtful pauses she adds and do not find them forced at all.
Maybe you just don't get that was the intention. It's like when someone says they didn't think the acting was good in a movie, but then I look around and see that real people are all acting, in real life, in a way that would be considered "bad acting," because honestly, figuring out how "to be" in a socially acceptable way is pretty hard for a kid to do... so there is "no one way" to act human. Same idea here. I agree that a touch of more fluidity in spots would be an opportunity for improvement to this performance, but I also interpreted the forced sound in places as quite intentional. After all, this is supposed to be a song about the Turkish Marching Band craze that kinda led to our modern marching bands. It's supposed to be marchy, showy, disciplined, but then a and a bit absurd and silly.... as one would expect of a Mozart commenting on those zany humans with his own zaniness. When I closed my eyes and imagined the Turkish military marching band members performing (look them up), I imagined them having fun and being like the jazz musicians of their time: inventing new and fun ways to express music.... or at least, I imagine the typical European fan of Turkish music and fashion at least imagine them this way. Turkish music was exciting, exotic, and engaging. It was a fun music, absurdly set in the context of a disciplinarian militaristic culture. I think Mozart was trying to capture that, with this piece. I also think most performances of the piece lose that sense.
Eh, no, not misinformed. While 1810 to 1826 was they hayday for janissary pedals, janissary effects were made well before. And there was a surge of popularity in janissary style music (Turkish marching music) in the mid to late 18th century, which Mozart was very much a part of when he composed this piece in 1778. Early version of the janissary effects were done with knee boards, however, not pedals. In fact, Mozart never owned a piano with pedals. He did, however, have one with two knee boards, but no janissary effects.
+Anonymous User I have never seen a Janissary on pedal or kneepedal before 1800. The kneepedals in Mozart his time where for forte, una corda and moderator in a button also central in the keyboard. But I can always learn something, maybe you could share a photo or where I can find information of a Mozart time Janissary effect.
but it's still historically informed though like the ornaments and the use of fortepiano. Maybe not in Mozart's time but this performance may be closer to what Beethoven would have played it
" "virtually all the fortepianos of the last three decades of the eighteenth century were equipped with a knee lever to raise and lower the dampers ... " -Crombie, D. (1995). Piano: A Photographic History of the World's Most Celebrated Instrument, San Francisco: Miller Freeman Books, 19.
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Very interesting! There is room enough in the world for lots of different interpretations of great music. Thank you!
The Janissary Stop really adds to the music! Gosh why did these pianos stop being made?? They are brilliant!
Because they're silly and very much just a novelty
@dolofonos I mean, it doesn't seem like there's much dynamic control, so what can you use them for except for this kind of stuff? They're kind of limited.
I mean, I enjoy it, and it's a shame they're not really used in recordings of this kind of thing, but I can see why they're not that popular.
@@klop4228 There is actually a lot of dynamic control, the reason why it is not very used anymore is because modern piano is less susceptible to break and is louder
@@syxalite I mean the Janissary pedal specifically (I think).
@@klop4228 Ah. Well, indeed there is no control on that
A lot of musical pieces use this, more than you would think
I don't know why modern piano lost this, but it is like all the other stops and pedals: like bassoon, swell, buff, lute, cembalo, moderator, double moderator, etc
Modern piano lost those
Formidable. ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Why do there not seem to be any commercial recordings of the Rondo Alla Turca on janissary pianos? Why don't the craziest purists make pilgrimages to such pianos the way they do to other fortepianos?
Stuart Simon People hear Alla Turca and just have Mozart in mind. But there are so many other treasures in the Alla Turca style. We have a lot of them in our program. In fact it is our ensembles job to discover them. If we would have a company interested in that, we could give you Janissary Job around the clock! Best regards from Istanbul, the Alla Turca Kollektif
Why do I imagine Mozart having improvised like that?
Wonderful !
Wonderful!!!
Que bello
Nice improvisations
the dubstep wub-wub of the era
*DA DA DING DA DA DING DA DA DA*
👏👏👏👏👏❤😊
0:11 to 4:31
1:06
This piano is evidence that the Ottoman world state was once imitated in every field.
Its an Italian piano.
Many ornaments seem forced and artificial rather than a spontaneous flash of creativity...
Even the ingenious idea of playing it on a fortepiano with janissary stop can't make up for it.
I am inclined to agree somewhat. While the presence of them is nice in the first place, they don't say very much in themselves. And the ones which are complete paraphrases over the same harmony were, as far as I'm aware, not standard practice. Don't quote me on that, because I honestly don't know for sure.
I should say, a good number of them are rather nice and fitting.
I agree...the playing is very jagged amost like shes having lapse in her.....um what was i saying...oh yeah...concentration hehe!
This piece is a favorite of mine and Manuela Giardana's version here on the Janissary is my favorite version of all. I love the thoughtful pauses she adds and do not find them forced at all.
Maybe you just don't get that was the intention. It's like when someone says they didn't think the acting was good in a movie, but then I look around and see that real people are all acting, in real life, in a way that would be considered "bad acting," because honestly, figuring out how "to be" in a socially acceptable way is pretty hard for a kid to do... so there is "no one way" to act human.
Same idea here. I agree that a touch of more fluidity in spots would be an opportunity for improvement to this performance, but I also interpreted the forced sound in places as quite intentional. After all, this is supposed to be a song about the Turkish Marching Band craze that kinda led to our modern marching bands. It's supposed to be marchy, showy, disciplined, but then a and a bit absurd and silly.... as one would expect of a Mozart commenting on those zany humans with his own zaniness.
When I closed my eyes and imagined the Turkish military marching band members performing (look them up), I imagined them having fun and being like the jazz musicians of their time: inventing new and fun ways to express music.... or at least, I imagine the typical European fan of Turkish music and fashion at least imagine them this way.
Turkish music was exciting, exotic, and engaging. It was a fun music, absurdly set in the context of a disciplinarian militaristic culture.
I think Mozart was trying to capture that, with this piece. I also think most performances of the piece lose that sense.
sorry, but this is a misinformed execution, since this piano is from circa 1810 and in Mozart's time there was no Janissary pedal or bells.
Eh, no, not misinformed. While 1810 to 1826 was they hayday for janissary pedals, janissary effects were made well before. And there was a surge of popularity in janissary style music (Turkish marching music) in the mid to late 18th century, which Mozart was very much a part of when he composed this piece in 1778. Early version of the janissary effects were done with knee boards, however, not pedals. In fact, Mozart never owned a piano with pedals. He did, however, have one with two knee boards, but no janissary effects.
+Anonymous User I have never seen a Janissary on pedal or kneepedal before 1800. The kneepedals in Mozart his time where for forte, una corda and moderator in a button also central in the keyboard. But I can always learn something, maybe you could share a photo or where I can find information of a Mozart time Janissary effect.
but it's still historically informed though like the ornaments and the use of fortepiano. Maybe not in Mozart's time but this performance may be closer to what Beethoven would have played it
" "virtually all the fortepianos of the last three decades of the eighteenth century were equipped with a knee lever to raise and lower the dampers ... " -Crombie, D. (1995). Piano: A Photographic History of the World's Most Celebrated Instrument, San Francisco: Miller Freeman Books, 19.