I can't draw any definitive conclusion with such a small sample size but it might be true that QDOLEDs Gen1 have better screen uniformity. My S90C Gen1 has almost perfect uniformity. The first S95C (Gen2) I got was terrible, showing 2 clear vertical bands way over 25% gray scale. The 2nd S95C was not bad but not close to the S90C. Now, this S90D has 3 clear vertical lines of pixels that are almost stuck until it gets bright. Panel lottery shouldn't depend on the model, but there might be a general difference between generations. Maybe a problem with the higher volume and Samsung ramping up production after Gen1
I can confirm this. I had 2 A95Ks (First Gen QD-OLED) and they had literally perfect panels. Never saw a panel as clean as those. My S95C now is okayish but also has grey bars visible with a 5% grey screen. Its not horrible but the A95K had a far better one.
Assume you sure it’s a qd oled? Most places just the 65” outside US the S90D is woled on rest of panels. No problems on mine and first tv with minor adjustments since smart TVs came out without “need” of calibration, easy to recommend for all ages and people from me which was harder on the other ones. Still ootb no update Samsung done quite a good job. Sorry to hear about panel but sounds almost like woled, I seen so many qd oleds and uniformity not been an issue.
Damn it's sad. QD-OLEDs from Samsung are popular for their screen uniformity. Now it looks like Samsung is cheaping out... Props to them for lowering their prices and offering good deals but I really hope the screen uniformity gets better.
The first versions were good because it was new and the reviewers needed to hype it up. Then Samsung can mass produce at a lower quality because the advertising is done. It’s like a tv show they capture the audience with big budget pilots and then pump out filler bullshit
No doubt about it, that 50$ membership fee was the best ever insurance type coverage you've paid for in your life!! Such a shame about all these problems.
@plasmatvforgaming9648 I'm haven't tried the service menu yet, so I don't know. My panel info on the back says made in July 2024, and the version number starts with FB01. Rest of the info is same as yours (model number, made in Mexico, etc.)
Hey Ariel, not sure how you didn't know this, but OLEDs need to run for a while before their uniformity can be judged. You need to use it for at least 100 hours to see the final uniformity result. After a few pixel cleaning cycles they resolve the majority of the bands, and of course, improve near-black performance, like you mentioned already.
Exactly, gets much better with heavy use as the areas with lower brightness will wear slower than the brighter areas so the whole uniformity gets better as the screen gets worse.
I'm aware of that. However, I've manually run 3 pixel cleaning and stressed it like I did with the previous ones. In my short experience with these QDOLEDs, they don't change that much after that. So basically, after the blacks are no longer crushing, I didn't notice any improvements in uniformity regardless
An OLED TV without dark vertical banding at 5% gray is worth its weight in gold. They are unicorns. Go read rtings OLED TV reviews. You will not find a single model where they didn't mention vertical lines in dark scenes. You should put as many hours as possible on your S90C before your return window expires because some QD-OLEDs that look near-perfect out-of-the-box can end up looking as bad as your S90D after 300-400 hours use. Hope you have better luck with the next one.
My LG C4 is phenomenal at uniformity. Was terrible out of box. I ran pixel refresher once and I cant see any banding! Also no pixel defects. I'm OCD for such. The only issue is slight green tint on white background.
It's quite strange. By how the dark lines are aligned it looks like the screen is split into different sections. And the width of each section also seems to be the same! I really can't guess why but maybe there's a reason for it being like that..
I know nothing is perfect, but when it comes to paying more for a better set it should be a given that the next iteration is better in many or at least some ways. This is what -the 3rd round of qd oleds Samsung has released? And yet alot of issues still persist and whats crazy get worse. What I love about your channel is the journey you take us to from the wow impressions to calling out the bs and learning in the moment.
@@tbecket4890 90C and 90D are priced as competitors to the LG C series which also have uniformity issues, even the G series too. So it's not premium, but I don't think premium exists anyway, these are mass produced consumer grade items with only 12 months warranty. Samsung and LG aren't confident they will last more than 12 months. This is why I keep getting drawn to "cheap and cheerful" TVs and seeing what levers I can pull to make the picture acceptable. Most of the time the picture is unacceptable, but occasionally I found ones that were just above the threshold. I'm thinking of downsizing too, the flaws are less noticeable. TV started out as a small screen experience in the 90s and 00s for me , so maybe I'll revert back to that and just get a small 48" C4 or something. At least then the faults won't bother me cause it's cheap and small. And if it dies prematurely I can just buy another one cause it only cost half as much.
A crooked and sad development for modern display technology. After returning two Panny OLED’s because of heavy horizontal banding and uniformity issues + one just dying on me, I don’t bother with oled anymore. I’d rather keep my KURO’s and pick up a 60-series Panny for chump change, that are somehow still more reliable a decade later.
In general, uniformity has gone down compared to Gen 1 unfortunately. A pixel refresh may help somewhat. _(short, or long. Force a short refresh message by unplugging/replugging power)_
People are praising LG oleds in the comment section but even LG oleds are not flawless. I have a 27GR95QE, which also does awfully on lower percentage gray scales. It also has a built in vignetting, so it is only bright in the middle, which I have to disable in the service menu EVERY DAY, because it forgets the setting. Maybe their TVs are better but this monitor is FAR from being the best.
The conclusion I draw from all this is that if you spend little money on the TV you are going to find a few faults, but at least you have spent relatively little. If you buy an LG G4 you probably won't have many problems with it but the price is absolutely exorbitant. It seems that the best option is to buy cheap and settle or buy a model that is more guaranteed but waiting for it to be at a decent price. Thanks for the analysis, Ariel.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 So you have two options, either you keep it, showing some tolerance for manufacturing deficiencies, or you request changes until you are happy. I had to accept a dead pixel in the upper left corner of my LG C1 (not EVO), but the uniformity is excellent for what is usually seen in this type of panels. In fact, I had another C1 before this one with an EVO panel and in the center there was a pink tint that I was not willing to tolerate, since I use it as a Windows desktop and many of my daily applications are in grayscale, I could see the change in tone throughout the panel constantly. I bought another one and it came with a non-EVO panel and I'm actually happy with it. After all that dizziness, one has little desire to buy a new model again. Let's hope things improve in general.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I have to clarify that when I bought the C1 in 2022 they were reconditioned on sale (the 55" cost me €800), so I didn't have much room to make changes, but if I were in your situation, paying for a new television, I would ask for changes until I was happy, without a doubt, I would not be willing to pay for something and be left without being convinced.
What you say should be true and is very, very reasonable! But the notion is not implemented as such unfortunately. For instance Fomo strongly recommended againt the 65 g4 just because of worse screen uniformity this year. Perhaps Samsung preceives better then woled is good enough. Regardless its exactly the point you brought up that the reviewers take issue: at that price point it should not be an issue and they did not bother to resolve it well before competition did. Like how lg should not have simply sat on mla until a far superior color brightness tech came out. Or wait to loose a big shootout to rush out an update for other ones. Hence the talked about existential crises for LG being a large and slow reacting woled panel maker and suplier with no visible technology pivot.
This isn’t the first time I’ve heard that the Gen 1 QD OLEDs have better uniformity overall from panel to panel. If only the S90C UK models were QD OLED, then I’d look out for a cheap deal.
Looks shitty. I ended up returning my first OLED because one of those vertical bands became so visible in regular content. It was a 2017 LG W-OLED. I forgave the visibility of the bands in grey screens after reading it was common, but once it became prevalent I used my best buy warranty. The 2018 LG OLED lasted me until now. The S90D Samsung is the cleanest panel I can remember seeing. Not sure which gen of QDOLED it is. If those lines are completely dead pixels I would definately get rid of it. Bands are bad enough. The uniformity bullshit was one of the things that made me reluctant to upgrade to another OLED, but luckily it seems I got a clean panel and its a big upgrade all around.
oh shit this is how kind a my s90c 2nd gen looks like! see the line in the middle to the right? see how its darker color from that line all the way to the right and is lighter color to the left of that line? thats exactly how mine looks like!
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 after seen this video i wont be selling my s90c, i was ready to sell it and get a s90d but ill just do the 2000 nits mod and ill try to get used to the uniformity, ill wait for lg g5 which will be 165hz and supposedly is going to be an rgb oled, but i am not buying another samsung for sure
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 honestly a black line like that is reason to exchange the tv by itself.. if the pixel refresher didnt help, i doubt it will disppear
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 i got a s95d recently and it has amazing uniformity.. not sure if i got lucky, but maybe the gen 3 3000 nit panels are better for uniformity If you use the s95d in a dark room there is nothing like it. 3000 nits with the service menu mods is unreal, but obviously in a bright room the matte finish is visible and it is more expensive. Would be nice to see the test videos tho 😅
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I saw that on a thread on Reddit and it said FB02 or FB03 could be Gen 2 panels but I'm not sure if it's reliable. It could also be FA01 or FA02, those seem more likely to be earlier Gen panel varieties.
Have you given it enough time though? Can take a while to break in these tvs, i think you need at least 50 hours or so to first assess and finally finishes after a couple hundred hours before settling in.
I have just bought a s90d and the uniformity of the panel is good, I don’t know what gen panel I have yet and haven’t yet done the service menu mods, but there gain I mainly watch movies and stream tv. Can I ask do the service menu mods make a big difference to movie watching and streaming other than gaming??
For movies, the Service Menu mod might have no impact whatsoever, based on reports from the community. I haven't tested anything outside gaming. The S90D is amazing for HDR Movies. I'll share movie settings, too, when I finish Gaming
@plasmatvforgaming9648 there's still some vertical unevenness but I can't see it at all unless I pull up a greyscale. Still tho is unfortunate on such a high end expensive product
Bro maybe you need to get an LG as youre never gonna be happy with small defetects which youre obviously getting from Samsung. I know I wouldnt have the stamina to go through all these returns . But I guess it is content for your channel haha
conclusion = Your never going to get a better tv than the C1. your climbing the wrong tree with those. lol . maybe 2025 mite bring something. i don't care for any brad of tv for 2024.
Proper colour gradeing just looks dull. The real world is dull. My cousin said the same thing when we "calabrated" his lg oled and is just like it looks dull why do people calabrate. Apperentaly our eyes deritoratie throughout our lives essentially turning the saturation down. But to me the proper rendering of things I can notice well out values the saturation and pop overall.
@@Solus793 I mean matching against a actually calabrsted screen with test patterns is calabration. I shouldn't really entertain this though. Yes it's not perfect but is it pritty dam close, yes.
Samsung are big liars. They have two companies that make panels and they also take a cheap panel from LG WOLED NO} QD-OLED. You have several levels of panels. America A is the cheapest. Europe E is the middle B. Britain is the best and most expensive. Sold only in Korea. K panel.
I can't draw any definitive conclusion with such a small sample size but it might be true that QDOLEDs Gen1 have better screen uniformity.
My S90C Gen1 has almost perfect uniformity. The first S95C (Gen2) I got was terrible, showing 2 clear vertical bands way over 25% gray scale. The 2nd S95C was not bad but not close to the S90C. Now, this S90D has 3 clear vertical lines of pixels that are almost stuck until it gets bright.
Panel lottery shouldn't depend on the model, but there might be a general difference between generations. Maybe a problem with the higher volume and Samsung ramping up production after Gen1
I can confirm this. I had 2 A95Ks (First Gen QD-OLED) and they had literally perfect panels. Never saw a panel as clean as those. My S95C now is okayish but also has grey bars visible with a 5% grey screen. Its not horrible but the A95K had a far better one.
Assume you sure it’s a qd oled? Most places just the 65” outside US the S90D is woled on rest of panels.
No problems on mine and first tv with minor adjustments since smart TVs came out without “need” of calibration, easy to recommend for all ages and people from me which was harder on the other ones.
Still ootb no update Samsung done quite a good job.
Sorry to hear about panel but sounds almost like woled, I seen so many qd oleds and uniformity not been an issue.
Damn it's sad. QD-OLEDs from Samsung are popular for their screen uniformity. Now it looks like Samsung is cheaping out...
Props to them for lowering their prices and offering good deals but I really hope the screen uniformity gets better.
Maybe producing more volume reduces the quality
The first versions were good because it was new and the reviewers needed to hype it up. Then Samsung can mass produce at a lower quality because the advertising is done. It’s like a tv show they capture the audience with big budget pilots and then pump out filler bullshit
That's seems to be the case
No doubt about it, that 50$ membership fee was the best ever insurance type coverage you've paid for in your life!! Such a shame about all these problems.
Absolutely!
I knew I had to get it
I got an s90d 65 inch 3 weeks ago. Screen uniformity is really good on mine.
What's the ANAPEAK?
@plasmatvforgaming9648
I'm haven't tried the service menu yet, so I don't know.
My panel info on the back says made in July 2024, and the version number starts with FB01. Rest of the info is same as yours (model number, made in Mexico, etc.)
Hey Ariel, not sure how you didn't know this, but OLEDs need to run for a while before their uniformity can be judged. You need to use it for at least 100 hours to see the final uniformity result. After a few pixel cleaning cycles they resolve the majority of the bands, and of course, improve near-black performance, like you mentioned already.
Exactly, gets much better with heavy use as the areas with lower brightness will wear slower than the brighter areas so the whole uniformity gets better as the screen gets worse.
I'm aware of that. However, I've manually run 3 pixel cleaning and stressed it like I did with the previous ones. In my short experience with these QDOLEDs, they don't change that much after that. So basically, after the blacks are no longer crushing, I didn't notice any improvements in uniformity regardless
Brutal screen uniformity. I would return 100%
Yeah, and I don't believe it would get fixed, I've run 3 manual cleanings and display a lot of HDR
An OLED TV without dark vertical banding at 5% gray is worth its weight in gold. They are unicorns. Go read rtings OLED TV reviews. You will not find a single model where they didn't mention vertical lines in dark scenes. You should put as many hours as possible on your S90C before your return window expires because some QD-OLEDs that look near-perfect out-of-the-box can end up looking as bad as your S90D after 300-400 hours use. Hope you have better luck with the next one.
Hopefully, my S90C stays perfect
My LG C4 is phenomenal at uniformity. Was terrible out of box. I ran pixel refresher once and I cant see any banding! Also no pixel defects. I'm OCD for such. The only issue is slight green tint on white background.
It's quite strange. By how the dark lines are aligned it looks like the screen is split into different sections. And the width of each section also seems to be the same!
I really can't guess why but maybe there's a reason for it being like that..
Maybe they put together the OLEDs in the back in sections like that, and it shows when it's not well done
Well ….that staple of “perfect screen uniformity” that everyone claims when it comes to qd oled is now busted.
The only one perfect was the S90C, the other 3 QDOLEDs I tested had issues, 2 of them very bad
I know nothing is perfect, but when it comes to paying more for a better set it should be a given that the next iteration is better in many or at least some ways.
This is what -the 3rd round of qd oleds Samsung has released? And yet alot of issues still persist and whats crazy get worse.
What I love about your channel is the journey you take us to from the wow impressions to calling out the bs and learning in the moment.
Totally agree. Thanks
It's ridiculous that this is considered a WOLED issue by many people.
@@tbecket4890
90C and 90D are priced as competitors to the LG C series which also have uniformity issues, even the G series too. So it's not premium, but I don't think premium exists anyway, these are mass produced consumer grade items with only 12 months warranty. Samsung and LG aren't confident they will last more than 12 months. This is why I keep getting drawn to "cheap and cheerful" TVs and seeing what levers I can pull to make the picture acceptable. Most of the time the picture is unacceptable, but occasionally I found ones that were just above the threshold.
I'm thinking of downsizing too, the flaws are less noticeable. TV started out as a small screen experience in the 90s and 00s for me , so maybe I'll revert back to that and just get a small 48" C4 or something. At least then the faults won't bother me cause it's cheap and small. And if it dies prematurely I can just buy another one cause it only cost half as much.
A crooked and sad development for modern display technology. After returning two Panny OLED’s because of heavy horizontal banding and uniformity issues + one just dying on me, I don’t bother with oled anymore. I’d rather keep my KURO’s and pick up a 60-series Panny for chump change, that are somehow still more reliable a decade later.
Both my s95b that i had and s90d have perfect uniformity interesting
Which sizes?
@plasmatvforgaming9648 65 both
In general, uniformity has gone down compared to Gen 1 unfortunately.
A pixel refresh may help somewhat.
_(short, or long. Force a short refresh message by unplugging/replugging power)_
The panel uniformity of my S90C gives me a premium feel, everything looks amazing
People are praising LG oleds in the comment section but even LG oleds are not flawless. I have a 27GR95QE, which also does awfully on lower percentage gray scales. It also has a built in vignetting, so it is only bright in the middle, which I have to disable in the service menu EVERY DAY, because it forgets the setting.
Maybe their TVs are better but this monitor is FAR from being the best.
LG OLEDS are WRGB, which is more likely to have uniformity issues near black, and with brighter full screen colors, it won't be even close to QDOLED
The conclusion I draw from all this is that if you spend little money on the TV you are going to find a few faults, but at least you have spent relatively little. If you buy an LG G4 you probably won't have many problems with it but the price is absolutely exorbitant.
It seems that the best option is to buy cheap and settle or buy a model that is more guaranteed but waiting for it to be at a decent price.
Thanks for the analysis, Ariel.
Gaming Tech got the G4 and the screen uniformity is very bad
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 So you have two options, either you keep it, showing some tolerance for manufacturing deficiencies, or you request changes until you are happy. I had to accept a dead pixel in the upper left corner of my LG C1 (not EVO), but the uniformity is excellent for what is usually seen in this type of panels.
In fact, I had another C1 before this one with an EVO panel and in the center there was a pink tint that I was not willing to tolerate, since I use it as a Windows desktop and many of my daily applications are in grayscale, I could see the change in tone throughout the panel constantly. I bought another one and it came with a non-EVO panel and I'm actually happy with it.
After all that dizziness, one has little desire to buy a new model again. Let's hope things improve in general.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I have to clarify that when I bought the C1 in 2022 they were reconditioned on sale (the 55" cost me €800), so I didn't have much room to make changes, but if I were in your situation, paying for a new television, I would ask for changes until I was happy, without a doubt, I would not be willing to pay for something and be left without being convinced.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 Unfortunately, it seems to be a lottery for QD-OLED and WOLED. My LG C3 is alright, but it's far from perfect.
What you say should be true and is very, very reasonable! But the notion is not implemented as such unfortunately. For instance Fomo strongly recommended againt the 65 g4 just because of worse screen uniformity this year. Perhaps Samsung preceives better then woled is good enough. Regardless its exactly the point you brought up that the reviewers take issue: at that price point it should not be an issue and they did not bother to resolve it well before competition did. Like how lg should not have simply sat on mla until a far superior color brightness tech came out. Or wait to loose a big shootout to rush out an update for other ones. Hence the talked about existential crises for LG being a large and slow reacting woled panel maker and suplier with no visible technology pivot.
This isn’t the first time I’ve heard that the Gen 1 QD OLEDs have better uniformity overall from panel to panel. If only the S90C UK models were QD OLED, then I’d look out for a cheap deal.
?? 55-77" S90C are _all_ QD-OLED, in the UK and everywhere else. (S90CA *T* )
65" S90D is QD-OLED in UK (S90DA *T* )
@ ah I thought some S90C’s had the ‘E’ suffix… just some sizes of the S90D’s then.
Looks shitty. I ended up returning my first OLED because one of those vertical bands became so visible in regular content. It was a 2017 LG W-OLED. I forgave the visibility of the bands in grey screens after reading it was common, but once it became prevalent I used my best buy warranty. The 2018 LG OLED lasted me until now. The S90D Samsung is the cleanest panel I can remember seeing. Not sure which gen of QDOLED it is. If those lines are completely dead pixels I would definately get rid of it. Bands are bad enough. The uniformity bullshit was one of the things that made me reluctant to upgrade to another OLED, but luckily it seems I got a clean panel and its a big upgrade all around.
QDOLEDS are supposed to have stellar uniformity
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 Its good to see they fixed that issue, most of the time.
oh shit this is how kind a my s90c 2nd gen looks like! see the line in the middle to the right? see how its darker color from that line all the way to the right and is lighter color to the left of that line? thats exactly how mine looks like!
If you have a Gen2 S90C 2000 nits you got lucky
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 after seen this video i wont be selling my s90c, i was ready to sell it and get a s90d but ill just do the 2000 nits mod and ill try to get used to the uniformity, ill wait for lg g5 which will be 165hz and supposedly is going to be an rgb oled, but i am not buying another samsung for sure
@@johnm4397why you wanna sell your s90c for?
the black vertical line might get fixed if you run the pixel refresher once.. i've had that before and it worked.. so might be an idea to try
I've run it 3 times already
I believe it might go away, too, but I wouldn't bet on it.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 honestly a black line like that is reason to exchange the tv by itself.. if the pixel refresher didnt help, i doubt it will disppear
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 i got a s95d recently and it has amazing uniformity.. not sure if i got lucky, but maybe the gen 3 3000 nit panels are better for uniformity
If you use the s95d in a dark room there is nothing like it. 3000 nits with the service menu mods is unreal, but obviously in a bright room the matte finish is visible and it is more expensive.
Would be nice to see the test videos tho 😅
My 65" s90d with a 08/2024 manufactured date says FB01 right below the version number, can that be a way to tell which Gen panel the TV has?
Not that I know of. I'll post the back of mine
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I saw that on a thread on Reddit and it said FB02 or FB03 could be Gen 2 panels but I'm not sure if it's reliable. It could also be FA01 or FA02, those seem more likely to be earlier Gen panel varieties.
Mine is FA02
Have you given it enough time though? Can take a while to break in these tvs, i think you need at least 50 hours or so to first assess and finally finishes after a couple hundred hours before settling in.
As much as I can and also 3 manual cleaning
Sending this one back too? Kekw
Getting the replacement this Wednesday
I have just bought a s90d and the uniformity of the panel is good, I don’t know what gen panel I have yet and haven’t yet done the service menu mods, but there gain I mainly watch movies and stream tv. Can I ask do the service menu mods make a big difference to movie watching and streaming other than gaming??
For movies, the Service Menu mod might have no impact whatsoever, based on reports from the community. I haven't tested anything outside gaming. The S90D is amazing for HDR Movies. I'll share movie settings, too, when I finish Gaming
Mine had horrible uniformity and looked like it had spots similar to burn in out of the box i ran a pixel refresh and it was fine after
Those large darken uneven sections get fixed. These vertical bands are more permanent. That's what I experienced with the previous 2 S95Cs
@plasmatvforgaming9648 there's still some vertical unevenness but I can't see it at all unless I pull up a greyscale. Still tho is unfortunate on such a high end expensive product
LG oled till I die
I would bye whatever is the best regardless of the brand
It’s still new. Give it some time.
I've run 3 manual cleanings to accelerate wear
mine doesn't look anywhere near like that..mine is damn near perfect
You got lucky. That's great!
Bro maybe you need to get an LG as youre never gonna be happy with small defetects which youre obviously getting from Samsung. I know I wouldnt have the stamina to go through all these returns . But I guess it is content for your channel haha
WRGB OLEDs are more likely to have uniformity issues
I already have a C1 so I wanted to try QDOLED
conclusion = Your never going to get a better tv than the C1. your climbing the wrong tree with those. lol . maybe 2025 mite bring something. i don't care for any brad of tv for 2024.
I'm calling out the flaws as I did with the C1. No TV is perfect
Proper colour gradeing just looks dull. The real world is dull.
My cousin said the same thing when we "calabrated" his lg oled and is just like it looks dull why do people calabrate.
Apperentaly our eyes deritoratie throughout our lives essentially turning the saturation down.
But to me the proper rendering of things I can notice well out values the saturation and pop overall.
I'm not sure about that. I don't believe so.
You did not "calibrate" anything.
@@Solus793 I mean matching against a actually calabrsted screen with test patterns is calabration. I shouldn't really entertain this though. Yes it's not perfect but is it pritty dam close, yes.
Samsung are big liars. They have two companies that make panels and they also take a cheap panel from LG WOLED NO} QD-OLED. You have several levels of panels. America A is the cheapest. Europe E is the middle B. Britain is the best and most expensive. Sold only in Korea. K panel.
Interesting
samsung is a joke, get lg C5
Time to get LG G3.... 🫡🫡🫡