FIGHTER Pilot Review - This is CRAZY!
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- Опубликовано: 10 янв 2024
- I was a Standards Officer in the Royal Air Force and flew fighter jets for 20 years and I have NEVER heard anything like this!
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I'm straight up not flying anywhere until this DEI business is shut down.
*This is nothing to do with DEI, ATC is heavily dominated by women historically, without problems*
The pilot should have adopted the 'yes dear' approach (no pun intended).
I’d be pretty pissed off if I was in the circuit and these two were blocking the net.
It must be a quiet day in the Tower for her to have time to have a discussion like that. You're right of course. If a pilot of controller has a matter to discuss, do it on the ground during a free moment. Even I know that.
Aviate, navigate, communicate. Flying the aircraft safely, without distractions, is always the priority. Choosing to argue on air, over semantics, is unprofessional by both parties. Fly the aircraft, call for a full stop, land it, park it, and then hash out your differences either in person or over the phone. This pilot, choosing to fuel the disagreement whilst flying, makes him no better than the controller, regardless as to who was correct.
Who says having an argument over the radio is distracting him from flying and navigating his airplane?
Bang On👍
Wise words, WgCdr Spry!
Is Air Clues still a thing?
That Air Traffic has what my lovely WW2 instructor told were “delusions of authority”. He always reminded me THEY…..were there for ME. No pilots/flights then no need for ATC.
I don't think that helps tbh . It's all about power & hubris . I can't see how it can contribute to flight safety - ' I am the pilot & you work for ME ' . Those kind of power dynamics don't belong in in the cockpit/ATC . Just my humble opinion , I'm not an expert .
Lots of similar examples of this on RUclips. Recurrent theme being American ATC. There’s a great video of BA Captain playing by the books and not reacting, which is improved by the best British accent you’ve ever heard.
Yes and I think Tim played it about six or more months ago.
If ATC didn’t waffle on with a debate on frequency a much better service can be provided.
Tim on top form here 😂
I was angry LIKE TIGER! :)
Absolutely spot on, superb video. Thank you for posting this.
Interesting views Timbo. Love your passion mate!
Brilliant video Tim, loving your ‘down with the homies’ patois.
What a fantastic video Tim. I am a Student Civilian Instructor. Every Pilot is always a Student no Pilot knows everything. As the Pilot I would choose to be the bigger person, if I get distracted I am in the ground and it's all over possibly with other lives in the Aircraft who have no say in the matter. The Controller will just have to write an Incident Report probably. Negate the argument while flying the Aircraft. Aviate, Navigate, Communicate.
My take on this is that you r one of the coolest Gs on YT right now bruv😎
The key point Tim - go see them during a (lunch) break. Got to be well worth the discussion (argument!) to them XD
PMSL at your ending! Great video and absolutely right!🤣
Well that was a good laugh Tim. Hurtling along at god knows what altitude probably not very high and, probably not going very fast either and our responsible persons (pilot and ATC) are having a spat and googling how to complete the aircrafts next manoeuvre. Have we learned nothing from the fate of Icarus!😇
This was immensely entertaining- cheers, Tim 😂😂
The worst I heard was at East Mids.
West Atlantic: “QNH 998 millibars”
Lady ATC: “readback hectopaccals”
WA: “roger 998 millibars”
Lady ATC: “if you don’t say ‘hectopascals’, I will not let you take off’ “.
R
Top quality fam....Rodgers hat.....best answer there is for flight safety
This was brilliant 👏 👌
Loved that little cut 10:40 to "I do miss being a standards officer actually...". LOL. Good vid: I enjoy pilot commentary on real world pilot/ATC interactions, 74 Gear does this well, albeit with less RAF swagger.
Ha..Brilliant Tim !!
Hope you’re year started off on a good foot Tim .
Gday from convict colony of Australia Tim…..lol…….This video had me in stitches. Your frustration is palpable, however you are always spot on when it comes to common sense.
FYI - I watched a video from Matt Walsh the other day which you might also find interesting and/or provide your own RUclips response to. In this video he talks about United Airlines push for a 50% quota of female pilots, and in particular their penchant to have female ‘pilots of colour’ because they are unrepresented in the pool of pilots across the US. The overall concerned expressed by Matt is quite legitimate in that quality of pilot candidates is at risk when companies starting banging on about quotas. In this case United are selecting candidates from areas of the US where the average SAT scores are the lowest in the country. I’d be interested in your take on his video and what he has to say about it. Keep up the good work. Cheers
Good video as always!
Idiocracy (2006 movie) in progress...
Buzzing the tower in reheat is acceptable after a VHF domestic.
Clearly 65C is missing a detent or two.
The phrase 65C was looking for was "Roger" or "65C"
Hey brother. HAPPY NEW YEAR
Again great one Tim! I could not agree more! Aviate, Navigate, Communicate - that is the last one and definitely not argue like little prick while in the air.
In an airliner a short approach to me was rolling out at on finals at 500’. Short approaches are now not possible at most UK airports. They want a minimum of seven mile finals. Then they witter on in their PR blurb about how green they are… Scandinavia is a breath of fresh air.
Jeeez, Tim, I thought I was highly strung. But you have a point, just Roger it, and take it off line on the ground.
Aviate
Navigate
Communicate
Simple - military or commercial
Also CRM broken here by building tension in an argumentative atmosphere
Nice to get your ‘take on it’ Tim 😂😂😂😂 I remember when ‘life hacks’ used to be called common sense as well!! 👍
Yes, 'common sense'!
I remember an F3 pilot called emergency state 2 on a dark night. ATC told the pilot the approach RHAG cable was rigged in the down position and the overrun cable rigged in the raised position. The pilot had recently returned from either the USA or Canada where the terminology was slightly different. Along with all his jet problems he was confused with UK terminology and elected to take the approach cable which was laying on the ground and not supported. His arrestor hook hit the cable, broke the outer windings and snapped the cable. The jet landed safely with some damage when the broken cable flipped up.
The investigation report concluded the pilot should not have taken the approach cable. However, that cable had been in position or a number of years but with few if any full arrests. What was found was the cable itself was significantly weakened towards either end near the end connector (nowhere near the break). This cable, due to the normal take off direction was usually on the ground and every time it was trampled the cable rotated weakening the tensile strength . Post incident the cable was changed after every arrest and eventually a larger diameter cable used. The old adage of if can go wrong it normally will holds true to this day and if you’re lucky you will walk away.
At least it didn’t descend into an emotional argument.. Anyhow, my 10 cents worth.. In the U S of A most “short approaches are indeed commenced from abeam the numbers, but the landing is on em not mid field. I recently did an hour of refresh with an instructor in a Pitts at Longbeach LA. We went power off abeam the numbers ( really close in too! ) and rolled out at 5 foot over the numbers. Reason 1. In case the donkey stopped. Reason 2. Because it keeps the runway in sight until the last seconds. As Tim said “roger”, carry on, chat over a cuppa afterwards.
*High key approach is my favourite, ATC has the final word whilst aircraft are airborne, the pilot can argue about it or file a report afterwards*
That interaction is bizarre, seems confrontation is the go to default now, maybe we're all guilty at times but I agree you give the controller the deference and argue afterwards!
These videos make my day. Liz would be delighted to hear your comments. I’ll let her know. She’s old school. Last of a dying breed unfortunately.
She is old school, probably why we all got on with her so well - thank you for passing on my message, very kind of you.
Differing understanding. ATC thinks it should be power back and a 90degree base turn at the numbers which would lead to another 90 deg turn to final, landing midfield. Pilot understands as power off at numbers and circling approach (180 as he says) to land on the numbers, which means he will extend a bit further than where ATC want him for spacing
As you say incorrect interaction as between pilot & atc. Fully support your observations
FJP, the best vids on the tube, FAM.
Wouldnt a turn abeam the numbers still be a power-off (idle) 180 anyway?
Turning base abeam the numbers results in an unstable approach, turning final under 500’ above ground. Start your turn to the numbers at 45 deg. to extended runway centreline.
The magic words might have been "c/s GO AROUND and report downwind with intentions".. Or, grant landing clearance with a hint of surprised sarcasm!
Had a guy ask me to move my car as I had parked close up to him and he came back (wife being longer than anticipated) Hi mate- what up? - yep sure. no problem. Thats feking it. no drama. ! no one died or got cross or angry or gave gang signs.
Select 30 mike mike. Put the tower on the pipper and let nature take its course.
I miss being a standards officer Tim (Coastguard).
What’s that ? Checking a lighthouse is properly erect 😂
Yes, it's quite a unique role - you are probably missed more than you realise.
That had me chuckling Tim oh infact guffawing, shut it now lmfao, genuinely laughing. BTW, Valhalla Charity is still being built, wait out.
Controller was completely wrong - (a) her lack of understanding between a short approach and a power off 180 tells me she has likely never flown a plane, particularly to commercial standards, (b) did she actually admit to searching on Google while, you know, controlling the airspace, and (c) waaaaay too much talking to a pilot in a critical phase of flight - although that applies to the pilot too to be fair.
Really did laugh out loud at trying it with wife ie finish arguing and move on 😂...some even by underlying it with imaginary pen with full stop doesn't seem to work 😅
🤔 I think she used to be my Air Traffic Manager! 😲 She's not the brightest light in the house...🙄
Mate I can not agree more and I've been annoyed so many times when I hear these arguments between pilots on long / short final or are somewhere else in the pattern. My take on this particular one, apologies if I missed some piece of info here, is that it was an instructor pilot taking issue with being schooled by ATC in front of his student. I as a student would have had more respect for my instructor if he'd just acknowledged and done EXACTLY as you suggested, "yes apologies, will chat once on the ground"... THE END...
To argue back and forth like that doesn't show maturity or humility... it shows juvenile chips on both parties' shoulders, AND takes valuable time away from that instructor teaching his student, (if im reading the scenario correctly)... bottom line is, bullshit emotional insecurities and pettyness has no place in the cockpit, NOR in the tower. Professionalism people...come on!!!
Bravo Tim... another good, no nonsense piece!
'bullshit emotional insecurities and pettyness has no place in the cockpit' spot on, Rob!
LoL.. Good Take Sir. 🤘🏻🤘🏻👍🏻😂
GRRRRRRRR,l lol :)
She was obviously multitasking which my wife is an expert,and she still had time for an argument . Pilot should of realised this and just flown his aircraft and if brave enough take it back up on the ground at his own peril 😂👍
Funny as f*ck. she obviously had time to argue , it sounds quiet. Tim you need to add “ plane can’t land “ or maybe “ fighter pilot responds to plane not landing “ to your title for maximum halfwits click value , they’d be flooding in
I used to man the runway caravan at Coltishall. One night a C130 at four miles to land on ILS, and a Canberra on the ORP started to move. I fired a red very to overshoot the C130 who said, ‘my gear is down, I’m landing’. Upon me firing another red he begrudgingly said he was overshooting and going round. I called local and explained why. But, as a fast jet jockey, if you get a red very flare, do you continue your approach, or overshoot because someone knows something or has seen something that you haven’t?
Red flare and I'm going around even if my gear is down, no question. I trust the caravan controllers and ATC 💯👍
@Fastjet Performance,
Carefully Tim!
You start doing more of these types of passive aggressive vids; you’ll end up hitting the bottle
Hilarious vid but very brilliant
Go STANDARDS!!🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🙏
Ace video! 100% agree.
Very sad that the world is descending into immature communication, debate and treatment of each other. Largely catalysed, imho, by people who are [equally sadly] mentally affected, yet have global platforms to dish out their immature ways of human interaction. It's like the village idiots are running riot and being listened to and copied. WTF!!
Recipe for disaster that I'd think.
Not a pilot myself, have done air experience in my time with the cadets like though I will agree that this isn't something a pilot and the tower should be doing whilst on final approach.
I have epilepsy and other issues and find it’s gone a bit mad I find it a bit patronising DEI should have limits
Stress a pilot right before a landing, what could go wrong?
What airport was this?
What about the other aircraft on frequency? Too much chit chat.
Unfortunate conversation for the ATC frequency...🤦🏿♂️
Vis circuit in a nut shell, well in a Boeing777 actually: take off, turn downwind for a 1500ft pattern and stay Flap 5, abeam landing threshold start timing, 3'secs per 100ft, (so 45 secs) after 20 sec gear down Flap 20, after 45sec (about 45deg to the numbers) start your turn on to finals, rate of descent about 300/400fpm Flap 30 landing checks, roll out on finals 3nm/900/1000ft two reds two whites and land, easy, must have been because I could do it😀. Not a box with square sides, crosswind and base just two turns and fly a CDA from the start of the final turn.👍Try it in DCs it works well.
While at Akrotiri I was doing my PPL. While on final with clearance to land I noticed a vehicle on the runway so I questioned ATC. Their answer was to berate me for questioning ATC & they know what they’re doing. I was a junior rank so there was nothing I could do & no point going to ARC afterwards because I’d have been bollocked for questioning an officer but to tell a trainee pilot to not question ATC when they see a clear issue is horrendous procedure. What if I took that into my flying career & never questioned any ATC regardless of what I could see from the air. How did I know they were in contact? Why were you clearing me to land with a vehicle still on the runway knowing I was a student? What if he broke down or his radio failed? And why would you possibly berate a trainee pilot for asking about the condition of the runway he’s landing on? I think the Japan runway incursion proves what happens if you blindly follow ATC. They don’t know everything & sometimes make mistakes or the person on the runway doesn’t know everything or makes mistakes. RAF ATC went down a huge amount in my estimations after that situation.
Well, who hasn't been a dick at least once in their lives. Sometimes you get two together at the same time in the same place.
should have stuck to landing the plane, and then brought it up on the ground. with flying i dont think its a place for pride to get in the way or the correct way of doing something.
Listening to this just makes me cringe, as a newly valid controller in the uk, I couldn’t imagine engaging in a tit for tat discussion like that. Reminds me of the British airways pilot vs the Dublin controller a few years back, if you haven’t seen it, I’d recommend giving it a watch on RUclips.
Meanwhile, the rest of the aviation community is in orbit waiting for attention...
That ending was fantastic 😅😅😅😅😅😅
As a former military ATCO standards officer (we would've communicated on the R/T while you were flying the mighty fin) I couldn't agree more with what you said in this video, don't argue and sort it out later. Unfortunately in the civilian world this tends not to happen as the aircraft operating at the airfield are just customers (think of it like the airfield is a Bus Station and aircraft are just buses). Notwithstanding that, this is unprofessional from both parties, she's using up air time and capacity for other aircraft and he just needs to say 'Roger' get it on the deck and sort it out later. Thanks for the video, your reactions made me PMSL and brightened up my January. I too miss being a standards officer and If i'd heard the ATCO saying that they'd Googled something whilst controlling they wouldn't have been very comfortable during the debrief! Per Ardua.
Thanks for your comment and your bus station analogy, I wasn't aware that it is seen like this in the US so that makes more sense now - much appreciated. It seems that we lived through maybe the best of times in the RAF, we are lucky guys!
He should've landed then asked her to get a pen and paper to take a number down.
Innit blud
How long have air traffickers been in charge of a flying aircraft? Pilots are in charge. End of discussion. Can’t believe these idiots are having this discussion whilst the aircraft is in flight!!
Absolutely correct there.
Pilot asked for something and then did something unexpected. They’re not the only ones up there, it gets complicated very quickly trust me. It was obviously a quiet day fortunately.
I’d administratively ground him a month for poor judgement and suspend her a month for the same reason.
@@HercNav obv we don’t know the whole background. Could well have been that they were the only ones on frequency. We have plenty of ‘conversations’ sometimes when that’s the case - but if either party’s workload dictates otherwise, the chat stops.
There’s a difference between harmless banter and a pissing contest.
Mate, nothing to do with diversity. I've been given crappy ATC services from male and female controllers - probably as a direct realationship as the numbers of controllers. Probably here, perhaps, is that American Controllers forget that they're meant to PROVIDE A SERVICE (to airborne pilots)!
Agree. I call it WhatsApp syndrome (insert social media of your choice). Feels like everybody has to have the last word and nobody willing to listen.
blocking frequency affects safety for all, fortunately nobody with a crippled aircraft wanting to make a mayday while this was going on……
Based on what you provided here (and 33+ years on the job, though it was a while ago)...
1) If what you've approved does NOT have specific procedures laid out then you must have a "plan B" in mind . Sounds like (again, don't have all the info) the controllers' plan was based on the pilot doing X when X isn't specifically defined - there is some 'fudge factor' there on what the pilot can do. Understandable here. Sure, you don't expect them to extend 10 MILES! on downwind but, hey, your job is to handle it - situational awareness in the ATC context.
If it doesn't work out like you expected then recover and move on...
2) Arguing about it is un-professional and non-productive to the job, both jobs. And very likely that time you take to get pizzie with them about it takes away for the dozens of OTHER things you have to do in the next 60 seconds. A distraction. In MY DAY (yeah, I'm going there) my instructors would have smacked me on the back of head for continuing to beat that dead horse (you were 'taught' better) - the ol' clipboard to the back of the head thing.
3) Sometimes there are arse-holes on both ends of the radio.
Now, being the internet, this could very well have been a one-off instance, captured for eternity to the chagrin of both parties; and now blown up for the sole purpose of 'hits' or 'clicks'. So un-regard all the above :)
ruclips.net/video/wHfj3DGrE3Y/видео.htmlsi=DABf431-KAQ7M7KS
Hope you don’t mind me putting the link to this video. Great example of a professional British Pilot interacting with a petty ATC.
These two are acting in a very childish fashion, the only time for any sort of lengthy conversation between pilot and ATC should be in the event of an emergency. When I was learning to fly, had gone solo, but not as yet earned my licence I used to dread hearing the request from Air Traffic after clearing the runway to “come and speak to us once you’ve completed your shut down” Not always due to an indiscretion, but in one case I remember, time for a sensible conversation!
Thanks for the detailed explanation Tim. Ps how come you are not a "Living Legend of Aviation" like the Prince of woke, Harry. Just taking the p***!
I will put in a formal complaint lol
Switched off as soon as I heard the accents. Not a fan of US ATC.
Nonsense.
Yup, too much talking, wait till you land and pick up the phone or go to the tower and have a chat!
1😂😂😂🇬🇧
Calm down Tim, get yerself a G&T and calm the hell down lol
Stopped drinking a year ago.
@@FastJetPerformanceStopped drinking myself, good on you. Life’s much better 👌
I know buddy, you done well, I was jesting :-)@@FastJetPerformance
Yanks like the sound of their own voice. There’s a lot of needless chit chat with American ATC.
Well said, you beat me to it.😅
Why have you brought a diversity argument into this? Literally nothing to do with this scenario.
The guy on twitter who sent it thought it was, I agree - it wasn't anything to do with diversity.