Why This Car Obsessed LA Suburb is FINALLY Using Trains
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 1 дек 2023
- Ever wonder why no one seems to take transit in the far-flung suburban areas of LA like Santa Clarita or Simi Valley? Or why places like that remain such a car-centric mess?
The solution's been under their feet all along, and it's called Metrolink.
Music Credits: Blank Banshee (Purchased) + HOME (Purchased)
When "upgrading" to one train per hour is seen as a major improvement, you know your transit system is poorly designed. I wish the Antelope Valley Line and all of Metrolink the best of luck in one day being a truly good regional rail system. In the meantime I'm watching my local S.F. Bay Area's CalTrain.....slowly.............s...l...o...w.......l..y ....................................improve.
It should hopefully get better.
Currently metro/metrolink have several projects in the works that will help the AV line and Ventura County Line obtain 30 min frequencies before the end of the decade.
It's electrification is almost finished. Iirc it'll fully open as such sometime next year
@@Yvonne-Bella If you're referring to CalTrain, yes, next year is the planned transition to almost full electric (25 miles ending in Gilroy will remain diesel). However, it's a single line compared to Metrolink's eight! It doesn't go to Santa Cruz, it doesn't go to Sacramento, it doesn't go anywhere in the East Bay or North Bay. It's very much a "rump" system. There are plans for expansion but we're looking at completion dates in the 2050s and beyond.
While it’s easy to criticize, transit planners are regularly needing to balance budget considerations versus ridership and commuter interest on their way to achieving the system at scale that everyone knows needs to be there. The planners aren’t ignorant of the value of frequency of trains. They are also very aware of the damage that could permanently impact efforts toward the “right system” from bad press around running empty trains.
They’re tackling a tall task of helping convert a car centric culture, at least in part, to a train commuting culture. It’s kind of a tricky path to navigate, but it seems like they might be finding it.
@@mendopolis I'm not blaming the "down-in-the-trenches" administrators and planners that are doing the best with what they have. I'm blaming the poor/weak political leadership (at all levels up to the governor) that often guarantees "bad planning." Too little in means too little out.
I’ll never complain about British trains again having experienced the Orange County Line. My wife and I were staying in Newport Beach last year, and thought nothing more of taking a train from Irvine to downtown LA. The train frequency was awkward and the ticket price was ridiculous. In the UK, I live about the same distance from Edinburgh as Irvine is from downtown LA, and I can hop on a train from my nearby station every 30 minutes for a fraction of the cost of Metrolink.
As someone that lives in London (with the nearest Tube station 20 mins walk away), it's truly bizarre to realise somewhere like LA has such awful public transport system when even Edinburgh can beat it easily.
I visit the UK every year. The trains and underground are a miracle to me, I never stop marveling at any of it. Not only is LA public transport almost useless, the second they built it all the homeless drug addicts made it their home. You just dont see any of this in Europe.
@@bombaybeach208 The problem is that between when it was laid out and designed in the 1970s and 1980s and today, NIMBY set in. That caused most of the routes to simply get cancelled, and now end in the middle of nowhere.
For example, the Wilshire Line was supposed to go all the way to the Federal Building - VA Hospital, but people along the route complained so it was forced to stop in a horrible location. The same with the San Fernando Valley line. That was to go all the way across to the West side of the valley. But people protesting forced it to stop on the East side, and that was cancelled.
Another was supposed to go all the way to the airport, but the taxi drivers protested, so there was a stub built for the future expansion about 30 years ago that was never used.
It would have been a good system, if not for people complaining when they actually started to build it.
I'm not an urban planner or transit engineer, but I've always felt that, given that LA is so spread out, commuter rail should be the backbone of our transit infrastructure. All our light rail and heavy rail infrastructure should be the spokes to each Metrolink hub. For example, people bring up the idea of expanding the sepulveda pass subway down to LAX or even further down to Long Beach. But in an ideal world, there would be commuter rail running from Santa Clarita, generally following the 405, with stops in each major city, where you get off, and then take light rail to your final destination from there. I think this would allow for way faster travel times for people going from one region to another so they wouldn't have to stop at all the intervening stops that a subway would have.
But I don't know, maybe I'm overlooking something.
Love YOUR videos that view transit through a physician’s unique perspective.
Agree. The fact that the A line is a light rail that stretches 40 miles from DTLA to APU just seems dumb when it could have been built as a much faster RER style commuter rail.
@@kidtrunks2568 Totally! The A line is a testament to short sighted transit policy.
Ironically, as many people may already know, that's why LA housing was so spread out. The tram system allowed real estate to be sold further away from the urban centers, and was gutted once highways dominated the landscape.
Light rail and heavy rail works best at medium distance of 2-10 miles. Van Nuys to Burbank or West Hollywood to West LA type distances. And a high percentage of people's travel will be those sorts of distances, like for eating out, shopping, etc. People who work in less specialized low wage jobs (ie higher likelihood of being transit users) are also likely to commute to jobs closer to home at those sorts of distances.
The longer distances will be more for visiting family and old friends, or commutes to more specialized jobs, as well as special events (sports games, concerts, conventions), going to the airport, and post secondary schooling commutes.
They definitely need to be more express service with limited stops, and with good connections to the more local major bus routes, light rail and heavy rail, since in order for transit to be remotely competitive at long distances, it needs to be fast, but even then, it'll probably be >1hr from door to door to travel 25+ miles when you account the time to get from your home to the express rail, and from the express rail to your destination... at least if we're talking about typical residential areas. High density development around train stations can obviously cut down on those times somewhat, but it'll still be at least 5 min walk + 5 min wait for train + ~30 min train ride + 5 min walk at the low end.
Here in Canada, there's a Toronto suburb (Brampton) which has high transit ridership. The town is basically 100% dense sprawl, like a slightly denser version of Irvine, with snout houses, shopping malls and industrial parks, and none of the transit routes go to Downtown Toronto. The network mostly serves to get people from one part of Brampton to the other, with a few routes to major destinations in adjacent suburbs (a big mall, the airport, a large university, and large community college). With a population of just under 700,000, it gets over 200,000 daily users, which is 24% of what LA Metro gets (across both rail and bus), despite serving only 7% of the population, and unlike LA county, it does it with just buses and no rail.
Brampton is denser than typical outlying LA suburbs, but it's not crazy dense, similar to parts of LA 10-15 miles from downtown like the Gateway Cities, El Monte, Venice, Gardena, etc. It's easy to say make service more frequent and more people will use it, but there is still an equilibrium. If your buses are crowded, and adding 2x more service results in 1.8x more ridership, most agencies would be down with that. But if the buses aren't that full, and 2x more service only results in 1.2x more ridership, it's more questionable. Having higher densities means you can add more service/higher frequency without having to run half empty buses all the time. Compared to Omnitrans (San Bernardino County), Brampton Transit gets 5x more riders per bus and 5x more per route. Compared to Orange County Bus, Brampton Transit gets about 2x more riders per bus and per route.
There is still a large area of LA that has the densities to achieve frequent bus service and high mode share like Brampton does, from inner San Fernando Valley, to Santa Monica, to Long Beach, through the Gateway Cities to East LA, inner San Gabriel Valley and Pasadena, that area is home to about 5-6 million people and should be able to achieve 2 million daily riders imo. Once you have that ridership base, I think you can build up a stronger rapid transit system through it.
This plan does not seem ambitious enough to me. When Brightline and eventually CAHSR finally reach LA, Metrolink should be massively upgraded.
Agreed but it’s a 10x improvement to what we have now. Gotta take the W’s we can in SoCal.
Are there plans to use EMUs in the shared (Burbank)-Union Station-Anaheim section for network-wide electrification in the future?
This is the US, we just don't like doing too many good things all at once.
Progress comes in a series of baby steps... and these changes are huge compared to what exists. And the next steps will be huge compared to these. And on and on.
@@lecho0175Unfortunately no
i dont live in the us but there seems to be a lot of public transport development in LA, hopefully they can get to the level some other countries are at, it will be amazing
LA was originally built around trams. It wasn't always a car centric hellhole
@M-ck7el and it's been rebuilding a lot of this infrastructure.
The Olympics will be held in 2028 in LA. The city knew they'd need better public transportation when the games begin. The city already has the sporting venues, so they can spend more money on improving infrastructure.
@@titanbronco1627 Public transit here is a punishment for being disabled or elderly, and an overpriced tourist trap for everybody else. It's so far behind that, even with recent investment, it feels like a token effort to pacify progressives in the California government. Literally the least they can do while still claiming credit.
This is BIG 1 problem.
The bigger problem with Metrolink is that they don't offer 1 day passes and the monthly passes should be $100 a month, not $422
That's why the parking lots are 1/4 full. The inconvenience of riding Metrolink is not worth it. At $100 a month, some might even buy passes for infrequent use and weekend uses. They are living in the fallacy that the prices should reflect gas prices for the same commute. In reality it needs to be a smarter option than using a car, in SoCal that's a really hard sell because once you get to your destination you don't have many transit options.
In short, you sadly just drive anyway because the train is not worth it.
The prices are a massive issue too, let’s hope Metrolink reduces fares in the future… it’s currently 20$ for a round trip from union station to vista canyon! No doubt this is limiting demand also.
(Had a brief segment on this in my initial draft but had to cut unfortunately :/)
This was always why I opted not to take the train. The tickets are way too expensive to be feasible for most people
Back in the day during the 1990's, when I was a Metrolink rider they had a pre-paid 10-trip ticket. All you had to do was, just scan it prior to boarding the train and it would read "paid" when the conductor came by to check your fare (smile...smile).
Transit options have been there, but the issue is LA is massively spread out, so even though transit lines are extensive it still leaves out some areas.
@@lej_explains I think the $20 at Vista Canyon is an issue within their internal computers. It costs $19.50 for a round trip between Acton and LA, even though it covers 30 more miles distance. Via Princessa to LA is $14 round trip and only 3 miles away from Vista Canyon. So I believe their system has made a price calculation error that is costing customers from Vista Canyon an extra few bucks. Nobody has probably brought it to their attention yet.
Great video, I live in Santa Clarita and love transit projects. I take the train at least twice a week from Vista Canyon. But I'd like to point out at 1:50 that there is only one regularly scheduled freight train on the AV and that comes around noon. That single freight train does not have priority as Metrolink owns the tracks and it waits in sidings. 70% of the time, the single freight does not make Metrolink trains delayed if the dispatcher is good. 2:00, Via Princessa station is supposed to close in about a years time, with the ultimate goal being to make the riders from there to board at Vista Canyon. Super annoying how Metrolink didn't extend the services all the way to Vista Canyon, but like you said this will change in the future. Thanks for using my clip at 6:33, there are some folks who don't like Darren, but as a Metrolink rider for the last decade he is making the most changes I've ever seen. With regional AV service, weekend VC service, Arrow, possible extensions to Santa Barbara, and small talks of service to Long Beach via the San Pedro sub, he is one of the best and I have yet to find any videos criticizing him that have valid criticisms that can't be debunked in seconds. Thanks for such a great video, love to see another transit fan in my city!
One train per hour is the bare minimum! I hope they bring it up to half hourly which I find is the point which makes transit more effective
Hello people, this is not a transit service. This is an intercity commuter train system (just like Amtrak service). It is designed to carry you, in the morning from a suburbia community to a major downtown center for daily employment or shopping, and in the afternoon to return you safely home (smile...smile).
the line was shared so there is only so much more frequency they can add before running into issues with UP operations. And im postive the money Union Pacific pays to use that track significantly subsidizes the line, otherwise they wouldnt be giving freight trains right of way on publicly owned track.
@@matthewlara2100 You have it backwards, the railways are private land rented out.
@@haydentravis3348 " In 1990 the Los Angeles County Transportation Commission, predecessor of Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority, purchased the right of way from Southern Pacific. Control of the line was then transferred to the newly-formed Southern California Regional Rail Authority" the SCRRA is Metrolink . en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antelope_Valley_Line.... edit : i read your comment wrong and i appoligize, also i also assumed inccorectly that owning the rightofway meant they own the land, but the caltrans report from 1990 seems very confusing to me, maybe i just dont get it? But it says that SP ( now UP) sold them the right away but also allowed them to use the track rent free ???? idk, maybe rent free on the condition they give priority to frieght or maybe UP reviesed the deal when they bought out SP. Theres nothing too concrete about it, i suppose one could email UP and ask lol.
The amount of parking this development has is still insane. It’s not pleasant to get off the train and walk along the mixed use street when 2/3 or 3/4 of that road is still dedicated to the transport or storage of cars that you didn’t take
Unfortunately until socal gets better local transit, these lots truly are necessary. Socal is not a place you can easily get by without a car, especially if you don't live in the metro part of LA.
I grew up poor as hell in a hilly town in Orange County. Getting a car changed my miserable life. Some parts of socal are so hilly, stroad-infested, and have basically 0 bus lines aside from maybe lines that run along the most busy road
It's fine.
@@Trenz0 Zero transit except for bus lines that run along the most busy stroad is typical for US cities.
@@Trenz0 yeah but I don’t want to pay for others “free” parking which is just going to be included in the price of goods purchased. Also, there’s a massive parking structure, idk how necessary on street parking is, and, at least it was more frequent, one could park at a metrolink station and take the train tho that’s kind of not practical even w/ this “upgrade”
Having just visited LA from London, the terrible planning of LA was shocking
I mean, London wasnt planned at all - it just turns out that thats actually better than planning *badly*
That's the American way. Planning is against my freedom and communist.
LA public transport is lame, nearly useless and filled with criminals and homeless.
hey! santa clarita native here :) loved this video, always loved watching the metrolink go by. i was actually going to make a video on how bad the via princessa station is and this is everything i wouldve ever wanted my video to be. thank you!
Great video! I’ve been an Antelope Valley line rider from Palmdale for about 10 years. I will admit that the system needs many more improvements to fully achieve its potential but I enjoy the ride and that’s not just because I love trains. I recently visited the station you mentioned here (Vista Canyon) to film a video showing it off. I used Metrolink, on the way back I was tired having worked on filming all day, and I grabbed a seat with a table, put my jacket over the table, and set my head down for a nap as the train took me back through the canyon. You can’t do that while driving obviously. It’s nice to just be able to take a quick nap, or just stick some headphones in and relax while the train does the driving. I find the complaints about fare prices from other commenters to not be an issue either. I can go from Palmdale to LA and back for $21.50, on a weekday it would already run me a little over $20 to drive there plus the costs of parking which can be another $20 if not more. The weekend day pass on the system is also an excellent deal that I use fairly regularly.
The current Metrolink CEO really has done a great job I feel and has a bright vision for the agencies future. The previous CEOs from my experience have used their position more as a stepping stone to taking a position at LACMTA, but Mr. Kettle seems to truly desire to improve the system and the equipment as he actually uses the system. Some of the older train cars are being totally refurbished, signal system upgrades are occurring in LA, the agency is currently in the process of getting grants approved for 8 new locomotives to replace some the older MP36 locomotives. The AV line service expansion was a great addition for Santa Clarita and San Fernando valley users and even though most of it didn’t come to the Antelope Valley where i’m from, they did add train 217 which fills in a huge 4 hour gap in service up here and seems to be a hit with riders. Under Kettle, they also added some new Ventura County line weekend trains and worked out an agreement with Amtrak to allow Metrolink ticket holders between LA and Ventura to use Pacific Surfliner trains at no additional charge. I’ve never been more hopeful and excited about the future of this system than I am now.
Antelope Valley facts: The Antelope Valley gets its name from its history of pronghorn grazing in large numbers. From 1882 to 1885, the valley lost about 30,000 pronghorn, almost half of the species for which it was named. Unusually heavy snows in both the mountains and the valley floor drove the pronghorn toward their normal feeding grounds in the eastern part of the valley. Since they would not cross the railroad tracks, many of them starved to death. The remainder of these pronghorns were hunted for their hides by settlers. Today, the majority of California’s pronghorn populations occupy northeastern California.
However, while pronghorn may look antelope, they actually aren't! The pronghorn's closest living relatives are the giraffe and okapi. They are the only living members of the Antilocapridae family. Antelope on the other hand, are in the subfamily Antilopinae of the family Bovidae. The pronghorn is the fastest land mammal in the Western Hemisphere, with running speeds of up to 88.5 km/h (55 mph).
RIP native american wildlife, both animals and plants. people like to say la doesnt have fall colors but thats because all of the nonnative plants are evergreens. if you can find pockets of native plants, lots of them turn beautiful colors during fall. europeans ruin everything
This long-distance commuter rail reminds me of the Montauk Branch on the LIRR. The line runs the length of Long Island, nearly 116 miles from Long Island City to Montauk, however some Montauk Branch trains serve Penn Station. It's only electrified up to Babylon, as after Babylon, it becomes diesel territory while only double-tracking up to Sayville, meaning it's single-track for the rest of the way to Montauk. Double-tracking all the way to Montauk may not be realistic, but there is no excuse not to electrify and double-track at least up to Speonk where regular commuter service ends. Electrifying, let alone double-tracking, would make a huge difference for those who live on the South Shore of Long Island.
Not only do the tourists going to the South Fork rely on the service, but also those who live on the South Shore year-round, as well as those who live on Fire Island as the branch serves stations with ferry services to the isolated Fire Island communities. And change is happening to the areas surrounding the stations themselves. Transit-oriented developments are being built around LIRR stations in Suffolk! Patchogue for example is part of a bikeshare program, Patchogue station is a bus hub, there is plenty of new housing by Patchogue station, and Main Street is close by with lots of local food spots! In 2019, the downtown area was recognized by the American Planning Association as one of America's four Great Neighborhoods.
I cant believe such a huge city like LA thats pretty flat in most parts doesnt have an electric railway system Ive never lived in a city without electric trains running every 10 mins at least Great Video mate
We as a society collectively pay for having trash infrastructure. We either need better infrastructure or subsidized ride sharing. Rider pays a % the govt pays a %. The amount of single riders taking up the roads is insane. 💀
And it can get even worse depending on where you live.
I did take MetroLink for years, typically to go from the Antelope Valley to Union Station. And it was both great, and horrible.
For example, in Lancaster, the local bus service did not even start in the morning until the last train had already left. And in returning home, the bust service ended before all but one of the rush hour trains had arrived. And at least at that time, the only station was in Lancaster, there was none in Palmdale.
But most of us who live in those areas are aware of the system. It is sadly that most times it is not at all a realistic way to commute.
I catch this line for my commute in Burbank and I would love to see the downtown Burbank station change to be more transit oriented.
Honestly, the massive parking lot is only 25-50% used almost every day so let’s give up on the parking and build a multi-use building instead!
same for downtown San Bernardino, they have a decent transit center but no places to eat nearby 😢
I started using metrolink this year. I had no idea it existed til like last year.
Because of the frequency and park & ride I wasn't too interested. Upon finally trying it, my life was changed.
its $10 on the weekends, and you can ride metrolink to your destination, then take LA Metro on the return.
There's this perception in the US (and North America in general) that just because it's called 'commuter rail', it should only have a few trains per direction every day. Where I live, we also call a similar network 'commuter', but it operates all day every day, with peak frequencies under 5 minutes, and it's an extensive system, more like a regional train network - it just happens to be heavily utilized by commuters, among others.
City?
Americans like to use word games to trick people. So much of our culture here is tricking or lying without legally being called a liar. It's so dishonest and wasteful. I long for a culture that values good, and not just bigger numbers on paper, while everything else goes to shit in reality.
The Antelope Valley Line will need to be the first commuter rail line north of L.A. Union Station that will be electrified, at the same time that the stretch east to Rancho Cucamonga needs to be electrified for Brightline and CAHSR trains. Hopefully Metrolink is on it!
You must know that for decades LA County had a massive rail trolley system that reached all corners of LA County, stretching from downtown LA out to the San Fernando Valley, San Gabriel Valley, Long Beach, Santa Monica etc. It was called the red car trolley system and it had tracks going underground, overhead, dedicated track along the side of the road and even tracks that ran in the middle section of the Hollywood Freeway. The entire system was dismantled by the early 1960's as freeways and cars seemed to be the preferred mode of travel. There are still many remnants of the old red car rail system still in existence. For example, there was an underground rail tunnel which the trolley took to get into downtown LA allowing it to bypass the local traffic into downtown LA. That underground tunnel still exists and was recently rediscovered by construction workers who were renovated a building in downtown LA. Right of way abandoned dedicated trackage for those trolleys still exist in some parts of LA. These rail trolleys ran on almost every major street and even ran through small back alleys into neighborhoods to reach the population. There was a commuter train that ran from downtown LA to Long Beach on an express track. LA had tracks and overhead electrical wire to support all of these trolleys all over Los Angeles County. Because the people of LA allowed their rail transit system to be dismantled they deserve the traffic that they have to sit through. It would cost billions to recreate what was once a very efficient commuter trolley system and commuter rail. You can certainly find films of these trolleys here on RUclips.
An additional issue I have with Metrolink is the lack of Wi-Fi on the trains as well as the lack of accessibility of schedules. While it’s more expensive I prefer Amtrak for this reason as I can easily book a ticket through the Amtrak app as it shows me a list of available train times in a user friendly manner and know I can work on the train without worry of a hot spot failing or destroying my phone bill.
Overall though as an OC resident I love these videos man. Your work is so greatly appreciated from transit-starved Southern Californians and keeps us optimistic!!
More SCORE, please. And not only in southern California. I hope more projects like this can come to the East Bay and its sprawling exurbs, as well as to other metro areas. Is there a good list anywhere of ongoing transit-oriented development projects?
Hearing Blank Banshee was not expected. But very welcomed, great video!
This has become my daily commuter station. Love this and can’t wait to see everything get better!
I finally took Metrolink for the first time and absolutely loved it. Yes, it should be more frequent and cheaper, but having this as an option to travel has opened up a new world to me. And I only took it five stops, from Union Station to San Fernando/Sylmar on the Antelope Valley Line.
I live down in the san fernando valley, the suburbs of la in between santa clarita and the city and I'm so hyped for this new development. it's impossible to go anywhere in this city without a drivers license so anything to improve commuter rail frequency is pure hype
Let's get weekend service to Ventura
Would love to travel by train to the Ventura County Fairgrounds Metrolink station when attending events. This would save me from having to make a two (2)-hour each way freeway ride. But, to make this an option, there would need to be a service frequency of about every 60 minutes (smile...smile).
I think Metrolink has a bright future in front of it. They have the hard part done already; they have trains, RoWs, stations, and visibility. They just need to keep improving their brand, encouraging TOD, improving frequencies, and building trust in their system's reliability and frequency. SoCal's future is in trains, not in cars.
I lived in LA for a full 10 years before I knew that Metrolink existed. It brings me IMMENSE joy to see people finally starting to take trains and non-car transit options more seriously. Decades of failed government leadership has given us a tremendous amount of damage to undo, but I have faith that we will get there.
Thanks for this great video. One change everyone can make to help enaure our train service improves is to stop calling it Commuter Rail, and start calling it Regional Rail. Commuter focus is why Metrolink failed for so long.
Great video. The recent zoning changes will help too.
This is definitely a great first step into making Metrolink a much better rail operator. I really hope that we also see eventual infrastructure upgrades to the route to allow more consistent high line speeds (especially through the Soledad canyon) to make Metrolink almost as fast as driving with no traffic. I also really hope Santa Clarita will invest in more transit oriented development for the 3 other stations in Santa Clarita, especially Via Princessa and Santa Clarita. There’s almost no housing around either station, so hopefully we see something similar as what we saw with Vista Canyon. I also really hope the city reconsiders overhauling its bus system. Right now it is really inconvenient to get to the train stations in a timely manner. From my apartment, it would take me 40 minutes just to get to Santa Clarita station while it only takes 8 minutes to drive. They should really build another bus transit center at one of the stations where most lines go. The one by the Valencia mall is basically pointless especially since the mall is going to be removed soon. But if we had a bus terminal at one of the 3 other stations, that could substantially help. Hopefully it also means that Santa Clarita finally ditches building traditional suburban homes for proper apartment buildings and walkable areas like we are seeing in Vista Canyon. I’m also really hopeful we are able to see these kinds of improvements on all of the other Metrolink lines to make it a much more attractive way of getting around. Very well done video!
I wish we had what metrolink is planning in the Atlanta area
Atlanta Georgia, what is it you need there, trains that go into Georgia ?
You need more public lines in the City ?
Atlanta is a hot mess
@@lucasrem more expansion further in the suburbs and more lines would be nice
Ha that first bit of drone footage is my neighborhood!
For those who don’t know. Metro link score program. Will have trains go every 15 minutes on certain lines such as Moorpark - LA, San Clarita - LA, LA - Irvine. So they’ll have trains go every 1 hour for now.
I take this train weeks days to school from Newhall to LA and the increased times have really had a positive impact on my schedule (I don't have to just sit around on campus for hours anymore). Some other things that are cool is that they made the trains free to all students. You can purchase a free student ticket at any ticket machine. Something not great going on right now though is there is no other transit to connect you in Santa Clarita at the moment as the bus drivers have been on strike many months now. My commute would only be $2.75 each way (for the buses on either end) but now I have to factor in $15-30 a day on Ubers in SC because of the strike. Also freight trains are actually rarely an issue in two years of near daily riding it's only been delayed twice for a few minutes for freight trains. One time a longer delay due to an accident on the track and a 10 minute delay once from flooding at union station. Over all it's an extremely punctual/predictable train which I appreciate. Also really nice views once you get to the mountains.
This is similar to what they did in Dublin and Pleasanton California when they expanded the BART line.
BartE,
Diesel extension to LA ?
@@lucasremThe bat área rapid transit
Kind of makes me wonder what's in the future, when eventually HSR connects SF to LA, will LA rise to the challenge of being able to ferry people where they need to go in the near infinite suburban sprawl? I know SF will be able to, hell SF is already there really. But when I'm old and grey and can finally take a train worth taking to LA, am I going to be stuck at a station with a huge parking lot and then needing to take a taxi where I need to go? If so I might as well fly.
No, LA already has a pretty extensive metro rail system, what is missing is the HSR.
Once the CAHSR does connect to Union Station in downtown LA however you'll be able to take virtually any light rail or subway line in the region as well as Metrolink commuter lines.
The problem remains in underserved areas, which typically are either the wealthy coastal areas (like Venice Beach, Redondo Beach, Manhattan Beach, etc.) and Westside, or the more remote regions away from LA such as those areas bordering Orange County.
The generally affluent Westside and coastal areas lacks public transit for the same reason they lack major highways--NIMBYism. The wealthy fought back freeways and public rail for decades.
HOWEVER, Santa Monica now has light rail from Union Station. And the subway extension from Hollywood through West Hollywood is under construction to reach UCLA and Beverly Hills.
If you are headed to the San Fernando Valley, San Gabriel Valley, and parts of the South Bay, though, there are more options.
love trains but coming from Sydney, you are just as likely to fight someone on the train as you are in traffic
I am in Northern California and I am in Bay Area and I always love Caltrain Electrifications and California High-Speed Rail.😮
Growing up with the LIRR, then using the METRA (as well as the EL), I've really missed trains in Southern Califronia. The one time I tried to commute to a conference in SD from Orange County, the Surfliner broke down in San Juan about one or two stops after I got on. I then had to connect via Metrolink to the Coaster for the rest of the trip down. I really want to love the trains here, there are no better views on trainlines I've taken, but they're so unreliable.
I watched an old video of the Antelope valley like and Via princesss wasn’t a station as well as the Palmdale station so it’s interesting to see they’re still adding new station on their old lines I also rode that line when I was young jn 2007
as a commuter from san diego, metrolink not only misses so many opportunities there to compete with amtrak but looses so much because its services from oceanside/san diego to LA and san bernadino are horrendously bad. like 4 a day bad
I tried taking the line from Moorpark to my job in Burbank and even then the travel times were slow. I'd love to see some electrification to the lines and make these commute times faster than just taking the freeways
I like how the top 3 systems for ridership are all just slightly different divisions of NYC commuter rail, and all 3 of them serve twice as many people as the next runner up.
Living in Santa Clarita, I hope this works. Soledad is always backed up almost a mile on weekdays and the two Metrolink stations I have knowledge of are always empty.
I'm a Santa Clarita resident in outer banks of Canyon Country. Despite the fact that it's fairly close to my house, driving to the via princessa stop is...not the most ideal experience. Vista Canyon is in the middle between main canyon country and the outer bands of canyon country, making it a lot more feasible for residents who live down Sand Canyon/Shadow Pines to use.
I personally have to commute to West Hollywood for work. If they were to increase frequencies and clean up the LA subway lines (particularly the red line), then I'd be more willing to use the system. Nonetheless, for personal trips down to LA, this is absolutely a welcomed change, and I'm excited for the progression of transit for the entirety of Los Angeles. We deserve it. ALSO, they're thinking about adding congestion-based pricing, and I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not paying more money to drive if that's the case lol
I am blessed to experience NJT frequency, I can't imagine facing Metrolink's current train frequency 🙏🙏🙏🙏
As a german, I am right now spending 3 months in LA due to work. I am used to having all the public transportation at frequencies of 5-15 minutes. Coming to LA, I kind of knew what I was getting into. I mean, being almost 40 I don't even have a drivers license, as I don't need one in Berlin (Germany). But I kind of underestimated it... Going a bit outside, seeing the suburbs, well may be possible on my days off... But otherwise due to the schedules, I usually just stay in Hollywood anyways... Yeah, so the good thing is, I am living close to Hollywood Blvd. - so having trips inside downtown, are honestly not a huge problem... But, the connections are still not great either... In Germany you are usually almost as fast with public transportation, as with the car. Here it's... Well a 25 minute drive can escalate into 1 1/2 hours of public transport... That's a joke. BUT, Seeing this video, I think it's a step into the right direction. Especially that mixed planing is kind of... Well, yeah, that's exactly what makes Europe great. Here in LA I have to walk 30 minutes to Ralphs... In Hollywood... I thought that was a joke. The only other thing closer by is a 7/11... And some weird Asian shop that sells mostly expired groceries. In Berlin, even in the suburb 30 minutes outside of the city-center - Within 10 minutes of walking I have 3 big grocery-stores, hairdressers, restaurants... Like everything I need for my daily life. Here it's a hit or miss, if you live close by to some center, where you have all that stuff available, good for you... Otherwise, please use the car.
Ah well, anyhow: I like the US in general, but public transport, urban planing are not exactly great over here.. There it's really great to see that improvements are being made, especially as I plan to come back for another visit in the future 🙂. And well, there I can only offer my word for it... But from experience: While tourism profits from good public transport and urban planning, citizens do even more.
You are correct on that it's also applicable to the eastern part of the United States something like Boston Massachusetts area Philadelphia Pennsylvania New York City Long Island North Jersey New Haven and Norwalk Connecticut Where the German style commuter rails do exist. There is a solution to the issue run them like the East Coast electric commuter rail
now if only Santa Clarita had it's own light rail system...
they never will, the bus driver strike lasted 55 days because the city did not intervene, what makes you think they would willingly build a light-rail line? 😭
I had to commute a few stops on metrolink to turn a 1.5 hour commute into a 45 minute one. I really felt the stress difference compared to other transit I could take, it was just so much more relaxed. The most stressful thing was just making sure I found a train car that had a slot available for my bike, which I think says a lot.
Also people are always like "Let me just go to work alone! I don't have to have to talk to anyone!!!!" I don't think those people have actually experienced how chill everyone is on metrolink. Plenty of people you don't talk to. Others you just quickly coordinate (like figuring out which of us is getting off the train first so I won't block someone in with my bike on accident) or just whatever. I've basically never been forced into a bad convo on the train even though I'm nervous and not particularly charismatic.
People who live 2+ hours of every workday in traffic are literally destroying themselves. They could have the freedom of a car, less traffic and the option to ride instead of drive. But that's "anti freedom" or whatever. Imagine falling for that as you literally get suckered into ruining your super expensive car faster just so you can suffer in stop and go traffic.
I love the begging, "Just let me drive my 5 passenger vehicle alone." they don't even use cars right. Imagine reducing traffic by 80%, but these people are so selfish, they can only see their personal experience being ideal as worthy.
The path forward is to privatize the Metrolink tracks and give the private transit operator the right to eminent domain land near the present/future ROW. They can generate revenue from land values improved by effective transit service, similar to how JR operates in the Tokyo metro. This gives them both the financial incentive to improve service, and the financial incentive to develop the corridor along the tracks.
Man, and here I am living in Berlin screaming bloody murder when my train switches to a 20 minute frequency from a 10 minute one after 8:30pm, during the week 😅
I always want California High-Speed Rail in California and I always love California High-Speed Rail in California.😮
This much increased frequency on the Antelope Valley line could also make places like Glendale and Burbank more accessible from Los Angeles. I'm glad to see it.
Once u experience commuting life in Singapore and Japan, its perspective changing experience.
Metrolink can cost $10 each way. This is astronomical compared to Metro at $1.75 each trip.
Yes, but Metrolink goes much farther away to the exurbs that Metro does not reach.
It's a commuter line akin to Amtrak. If you compare Amtrak prices to Metrolink prices, you'll see Metrolink prices are generally more reasonable and competitive.
@@danmur2797 it’s an unreasonable price for daily commuting.
@@finned958 Probably, don't completely disagree, but am pointing out Metrolink is a service more like Amtrak than Metro.
Metrolink is a regional commuter system, which ferries passengers away to the exurbs and bedroom communities while Metro is a dedicated urban passenger rail network.
If prices came down to $10 round-trip, that would probably be more ideal.
The Long Island Railroad (LIRR) in NYC metro is very similar to Metrolink and their prices also are around $10 one way.
$10 gets you from oceanside to ventura on the weekend... done it and it was great getaway trip
I would absolutely listen to podcasts and read books on a trains and buses instead of driving lol. The line near me WOULD get me basically to my job on average in half as much time as driving, but they do not run when I need to be there. So if I wanted to switch I would be at work 2 hours early or 50 minutes late. Factor in kids and 🤷
I remember waiting over an hour to get from the LA Union station back to The Master’s University. So I appreciate the greater frequency.
But I primarily use public transportation for sports games. It looks like Metrolink could actually be feasible now to watch a Giants @ Dodgers game. BART is still so much better for going to games, but Metrolink is improving.
Side note: I’m from the Bay Area.
Here in Toronto, as of the 2016 census, the Lakeshore line had trains every 30 min all day. Transit commute mode share for block groups within walking distance of the stations was around 30% on average, compared to 15% for surrounding suburban areas >1 mile from the stations. So although this sort of service and development should be able to boost transit mode share to respectable levels, it's not night and day.
i live north of town on the 101 and its a ways to the nearest train. I'd have to drive all the way to Moorpark or into the Valley omg fer sure which means id hit two of the worst traffic zones before i got to the warner center parknride. I'd kill for a lightrail or metrolink line that paralleled the 101 from the vaLLEY to at least thousand oaks. Will never happen though- land use near the freeway makes it impossible unless they put the entire system over the center of the freeway
I live in Santa Clarita between the 2 stations mentioned, the new vista canyon station is located where upper middle class residents live. The typical mentality of upper middle class people in the area is to have a nice car & drive around.
We've been enjoying the train in New Jersey for years. Hopefully we get more service. We need it.
About ready to retire. Live on an infrequent Amtrak line into LA. Plan on traveling to LA on train ever so often and touring LA County on Metrolink as a pensioner.
Many regions around the US are still trying to get a version of MetroLink up and running. They are experiencing issues of expansion of service in geography and frequency (as well as timeliness and speed) that these new lines will experience as they get going.
Having just done a “transit tourism” trip to SoCal, flying into Ontario so I could experience the eastern lines, including the Arrow, I saw and experienced the limitations that lines that share tracks with freight have, the limitations of putting stations in the middle of nowhere (requiring acres of parking for people to access the trains and no services to use while waiting or between transfers). I don’t think enough of these other regions, including the Front Range of Colorado (my home territory) are heeding the lessons learned and challenges experienced by MetroLink, CalTrain or Amtrak.
Sometimes we just insist on being naive juveniles with taxpayer funds & experience the same problems of systems older than us!
Germany knows a mix-system, where trams serves the city-center for going then over train-routes in the outland-region....
Supply increases demand and it takes courage, money and patience!!! And as long as trains creep with diesel engines through the neighbourhood without any significant acceleration, customers will behave in the same way!
I live in (South) London - we don't have many Underground lines but we have a giant suburban rail network. 1tph sounds tough, but when people know reliably a train will be at x time each hour, it's still good. We've been put off visiting LA simply because we'd have to drive a lot, but as it changes, we will get there!
The plans in the LA area for transport really does look promising (although I'd aruge there's a bit too much light rail over heavy) - but I hope they all happen and more gets proposed. And that electrification follows - high powered EMUs can really bring down those journey times. But even without electrification, it can work pretty well if they must (see Birmingham, England - Snow Hill Lines)
If you want to ride on a toilet on rails, by all means, visit the biggest homeless city in America.
If we build it, people will use it.
I used to live in OC and I'd take the Metro green line from Norwalk to El Segundo to avoid traffic on the 105. If you don't get there by, say, 6:30am, the massive parking lot would be full and you'd be SOL.
One of the scenarios for an interim CHSR link to LA that some are suggesting is to spend $2B fully duplicating & electrifying the AV line to Palmdale. This could provide a good interim connection for HSR to LA while the more time consuming (tunnels) & expensive Palmdale to LA dedicated HSR section is built completed later. Its a win win. AV gets a major upgrade for future higher frequency services with reduced trip times & CHSR gets an interim LA connection yrs before the dedicated line is completed.
Great idea but not doable for $2 billion. CalTrain us spending over $2 billion on electrification alone. Adding track means more environmental impact reports, land acquisitions. Is he surprised if that gets done for under $10 billion and 10 years.
Oh cute, they use the same rail cars as we use here around the Greater Toronto Area. That said, during rush hour we currently only average maybe 1 train every 10-15 minutes during rush hour on the line I use to get to work. Hopeful that will increase to 1 train every 5 minutes even during regular daytime service to really make the entire region feel much more connected.
But still, really hopeful for improved transit options across North America. It’s frustrating when a large region like LA and the surrounding suburbs don’t make a better effort to ensure people can get from A to B across regions.
Bully for Santa Clarita: pity they nixed high speed rail going through, which would make much more sense than the planned alignment through Palmdale. Another issue with Metrolink is the stop timings: I'd like to go to the downtownish area for cultural event fairly frequently, but the last train back is far too early to do that. Even Amtrak stops too early to count on catching it back after a show. So I drive, or more often, just don't go.
And where are the plans for a train lines down and up the 5 and 405 to get Castaic, Valencia, Stevenson Ranch, and New Hall areas?
4:54 bike lockers?!?! FINALLY some inspo from the Nordics!
I’m a refugee from SoCal. This sounds amazing.
Did I hear you say: some time in the 2030s?
Yes💀
Ok, well, that will give me plenty of time to plan my move back. 🙂@@yoyup6976
Japan and Taiwan have great train infrastructure and it’s extremely convenient. I really wish LA would embrace this and tear out lanes of freeways and put train tracks in place of them instead.
Santa Clarita and AV is so lucky! I take the OC line to work in DTLA. It sucks because that line gets no night train.
When I go to Los Angeles from Chula Vista,CA, I ride the MTS San Diego UC San Diego Blue line trolley to the San Diego Amtrak Santa Fe Depot, I ride on the Pacific Surfliner to Los Angeles Union Station and then I ride on the Metrolink Antelope Valley Line to Sylmar. Riding on Amtrak, Metrolink commuter trains and the San Diego trolley is better than driving. Washington,DC traffic is far worse than Los Angeles and Philadelphia is also worse with their traffic. The very worst commuter train services are in metro areas that have no commuter train service of any kind.
Yes and yeah of course California High-Speed Rail in California.😮
.You have an interesting hypothesis. Perhaps there is another variable that might explain your question? I have lived in areas with a high frequency of light rail stops and found other reasons for this "non-rider" behavior and also have examples. In your analysis, you are considering travel between suburban areas and city or industrial areas. The variables that I submit are 1) "population density" and 2) "cultural acceptance of criminal activites". My observations include two areas: 1) The B.A.R.T. of the San Fancisco surrounding areas and 2) Sacramento Regional Transit Light Rail. The variables of population density and crime are related. BART can be a valuable mode of transportation for inner city use in San Francisco. BART is one of resources of public transportation "in the city". If you actually ride the BART from outlying areas you will quickly learn that many stops are too dangerous for commuters to use. The auto theft, robbery, homicide and rape crimes are so high that riders soon learn to avoid certain stops. One stop not far from "the city" has acres of free parking for the BART station but it is dangerous to park an automobile because of the high crime. Criminals will actually use the schedules to plot their crimes. One result is that armed police working for BART are actually present at these stops. Do you want to make yourself a target for a mugging, grape or a homicide knowing that eventually the perpetrator might face justice ( with a quick no bail release)? I won't post the stops here but you can easily use a Google search to identify them. The Sacramento RT light rail has a similar reputation with fewer grapes and homicides. From the mind of a criminal they must have a target. Why should I volunteer to be a potential victim by using light rail? California law restricts police arrests for robbery and burglary to under $1,000 of the haul. In California, violent offenses such as robbery and homicide are treated with "no bail" or minimum sentences. On a recent business visit to Manhattan I was mugged on the MTA subway and suffered a broken wrist. The MTA "solves" this issue by paying millions in lawsuits for lack of security. The response of many potential riders is to avoid public transportation and high population density areas. I solved these problems by moving to a ranch and owning my private street. There are no crimes in my area and each of us uses S&W type security. I prefer private jet charter for long distances and require others to visit me for shorter distances. Residing in the new Ex urban areas ( Exurbia ) there is also the advantage of no traffic confusion and unruly "homeless" or other crowds. If I need to order something, I use Amazon. I am a short distance from numerous resorts. These resorts are also not frequented by the "Motor Home or RV" crowd. Most of my neighbors share a similar philosophy. I found it is much cheaper over a long time interval to live in a non city, non suburban area. The only requirement is that you must have more responsibiity for your daily life. If you like to ride horses or grow your own produce and enjoy a non smoggy, uncrowded, non crime environment, this is an option. No more long lines, crowds, criminals and smug and snarky travel employees. The TSA "security theater" can add more aggravation and wasted time. Why have thousands of TSA employees been arrested for theft crimes? How many have not yet been appehended? It is always up to a persons choice. I choose safety, speed and lower cost and No long extended excuses for failure.
The Santa Clarita CAR Diet? lol
The important point to make about why commuter rail is bad is that the service is only in one direction so despite the network of lines suburb to suburb travel is impossible still amazing video liked😊
Finally trains are in this area!
This is hopeful (emphasis on hope ;) ). Presupposing a skew to younger, not set in ways demographic that would prefer apartments to suburban sprawl. Even though the suburbs are cheek by jowl , apartments are even more so. Btw, as to transit rail frequencies, it has been worse than 1-2 hours. I can recall going out to Montclair from Union station only to have to catch the afternoon train back within 5 minutes bc there wasn’t going to be another train that night after that. Pathetic. But, as always, here’s hoping and maybe within a few more decades ppl will be pried out of their cars putting accident attorneys out of business. Thanks for the informative video. Better to be an optimist, less stress. ;)
Lots of ifs and promises. If Metrolink wants to make an immediate impact, it should focus on the San Bernardino line that serves the entire San Gabriel Valley.
I'll believe it when it all works as advertised.
You don't have to have a massive development near the tracks, but it doesn't hurt. What you do have to do is have a fleet of shuttle busses that work circular routes take people to and from the tracks. That what they were doing in Mexico City when I went there in the 90's, and that place is MASSIVE.
The shuttle bus/long haul train is a good combo. It's a shame people in the USA are not will to do that.
Southern California is car brained as hell and it really hurts metrolink ridership but hopefully with high gas prices and improvement to the trains we can see an increase in use
I've taken a trip on metrolink and you pretty much have to plan it like a short-haul flight.
cool stuff, hopefully one day those trains will go somewhere I actually want to go.
I agree that Metrolink has horrible frequencies. It’s not always a reliable source of public transit. One example is when I wanted to take a train to Mission Inn Fesitval of Lights in Riverside from OC, there's a train that goes to Riverside however, there's no return train back and I would have to either wait overnight for a morning train that returns to OC or use Uber.
I would not want to sit in a metal box much of the day either-do not have a car but do live in a walkable neighborhood near Johns Hopkins University but do have a 3-story row house with yard, much better than living in one of the four-story apartment boxes shown in your video.
I wish metrolink would just electrify already. I don't know why do many transit agencies in the US are afraid of that concept.
Also, while I appreciate the benefits of transit oriented development, I'm really not a fan of these monolithic developments that happen by one big developer just building a ton of stuff at once. It makes the neighborhood feel very artificial and soulless. I'd rather see this being sold out in parcels, with housing going up in rowhomes like we used to do back in the day. I'm not sure what needs to change to allow that to happen, but I think it would lead to better, more organic development, rather than these monolithic structures that don't feel right.
When I lived in Hemet and wanted to transit to LA for healthcare I was confronted with two commuter trains, into LA at 5:30 am and out of LA at 5:30 pm, with an expected bus commute of three hours each way from Hemet to the Riverside MetroLink station. Obviously NOT doable in anyone’s world. A joke, a waste, a fallacy
The problem with this whole plan ( before the costs ) is ; who wants to go to Fresno FAST ?
Fun to watch and interesting. I used to ride the Metrolink from Antelope Valley to LA. One time it got stuck in Newhall - I recognize the station in your video! 😲😀 In general, though, it was a great resource. I could visit my family in Orange County and they would visit me too, but you are right about frequency. That's great Santa Clarita trying to do something about this. Thanks for this cool video!
The "My taxes are too high crowd" in the US stop any decent rail system.
Well that’s probably because taxes in California are too high.
Metrolink needs to seriously pursue electrification, at least on their busiest lines and the ones they own the tracks. The San Bernardino Line probably makes the most sense as the first to go electric, but I’d make an argument for the Antelope Valley Line.
The entire AV Line is owned by SCRRA (as is the SB Line, OC Line sans LA to Fullerton, and VC Line to Moorpark), who owns Metrolink, and unlike all their other lines is entirely within LA County. That to me says they only need one county’s approval to electrify, which should make it an easier process. Electrification would allow Metrolink to run the frequencies they want with zero emissions, just as it’s doing for Caltrain, and they could use those same trainsets.
An added bonus is California High Speed Rail. By electrifying the AV Line to Palmdale, once CAHSR reaches there (ideally in the 2030s) they could theoretically share those tracks to provide direct service to LA, allowing a sub-4 hour nonstop trip between LA and SF. This would be an interim solution while CAHSR completes its own dedicated route to LA. Having the backing of the CAHSR project, just as Caltrain did, could help incentivize electrification of the AV Line. Plus if that line can find success going electric, then so too could the rest of the Metrolink system.
CAHSR plans to electrify LA to Anaheim (Burbank to LA will be their own tracks within the existing rail corridor), but to my knowledge Metrolink is not planning on electric trains.
I live in Italy, in the last 7 years we replapace all the train whit brand new one, only few and short line are not elettrified but still use dual mode
Train (pantograph +disel) whe also created tri modal train (elettric, disel, and battery whit degenerative brakes), just recently they upgrande the 16miles single disel line whit a bran new elettric line
The thought seems to be 'build it and they'll come'. But I have my doubts as ridership in LA metro ridership is still bad. This won't change until we build vertical living spaces (like they do in Asian countries)